253 | Auntie Anne's Journey from Amish Life to Successful Entrepreneur

Auntie Anne Beiler is best known as the founder of Auntie Anne’s®, the world’s largest pretzel franchise. Anne joins me today to talk about her evolution from a simple Amish-Mennonite life to the forefront of entrepreneurial success. 

Before rising to success though, Anne went through years of defeat, despair, and depression that kept her stuck in a place of darkness. It was through her pain, however, that she discovered a new purpose.

Anne's journey is a true testament to the power of strong leadership: forming connections, building stronger teams, and fostering leadership that thrives on genuineness and growth.  Join us for this episode, and it may empower you to navigate your own leadership journey with renewed clarity. 

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:01

The Art of Leadership Network. Hey leaders, welcome to the Lead Culture Podcast, part of the Art of Leadership Network. I'm your host, Jenni Catron. Each week, I'll be your guide as we explore powerful insights and practical strategies to equip you with the tools you need to lead with clarity and confidence and build a thriving team. My mission is to be your trusted coach, empowering you to master the art of self-leadership so you'll learn to lead yourself well, so you can lead others better. Each week, we'll take a deep dive on a leadership or a culture topic. You'll hear stories from amazing guests and leaders like you who are committed to leading well. So let's keep learning on this leadership journey together. All right, friends, today we are joined by Anne Beiler. Anne is best known as the founder of Auntie Anne's, the world's largest pretzel franchise, and if you've had an Auntie Anne's pretzel, you probably have not been able to walk into a mall without getting an Auntie Anne's pretzel because of the fabulous smell.

Speaker 1: 1:28

Anne was born and raised in the Amish Mennonite community of Lancaster County, Pennsylvania, where she grew up surrounded by faith and family. During these years, important life lessons were permanently weaved into the fabric of her life. She attended traditional Amish school until the eighth grade and eventually met and married her teenage crush- Jonas Beiler. But before rising to success, Anne went through years of defeat, despair, depression that kept her stuck in a place of darkness. It was through her pain, however, that she discovered a new purpose. Anne has continued to share her story wherever she can, whenever she can, and through that process discovered a new view of confession and a new passion to help other women and leaders experience the same freedom that she has. In 2005, Anne sold Auntie Anne's to speak to audiences on leadership, purpose, and the power of confession.

Speaker 1: 2:27

And you guys, we have such a fabulous conversation around leadership. There's so many different ways you could take Anne's story just because of how much she's overcome. And so if you're not familiar with Anne's story in more detail, first of all check out her book, but also go listen to some of the podcasts and different places where she's been interviewed, because there's just so many pieces of her story that are so powerful and so profound. But today we talk a lot about leadership. We talk about overcoming to lead. She talks about how leadership is really about a selfless life, just that sacredness, that responsibility of leadership. She speaks to that quite a bit. She talks about the importance of transparent leadership and how our internal and our external worlds need to be so aligned.

Speaker 1: 3:15

And she speaks to even a season you know number of years into Auntie Anne's story where she needed to step away. She had some deep work to do as a leader to lead herself well, and so I know you're going to enjoy this one. She just speaks to, I think, some of the truth we need to hear as leaders. She speaks to it so well. So here's my conversation with Anne Beiler. Anne, I have been so excited about this interview. I'm so grateful for you joining us on LeadC ulture. I have probably been a fan of your leadership and your influence for quite a number of years, probably even before I realized the story behind the founder of Auntie Anne's pretzels. I was just a fan of the pretzels, but then, as I learned a little bit more about your story, your journey, just how your faith has informed who you are as a leader, just so much admiration and really glad we get to connect today.

Speaker 2: 4:20

Well, I'm thrilled that you invited me on your podcast and I'm grateful always to share my story and pray that part of what we have to say today will encourage your audience.

Speaker 1: 4:33

Yeah, that's so good, I know it will. I know it will. I did my homework and was listening to some of the other interviews you've done and heard more of the bits and pieces of your story and I thought, how are we going to do this in 30 minutes? Just because there's so many unique, just parts of your story and the way God has worked through your life that are just pretty remarkable. But I guess what I'd love is I'd love for you to start. You grew up in an Amish home and I'm curious if the word leader or leadership was part of your discussions or values. You know where I'm a leadership junkie, so I love diving into leadership, but I'm kind of curious was that a part of like growing up? Did you talk about leadership?

Speaker 2: 5:14

Never. I grew up with, there were eight of us kids and sitting around the dinner. Three meals a day, no exception - breakfast, lunch and dinner. All 10 of us gathered together every single day for three times a day. And it's interesting to me that you would ask that question because during all of my years at home I got married when I was 19, but 19 years, every single day and the word career or leadership was never a part of our discussion. We were simply poor farmers and I didn't know I was poor. I was rich in family, faith, and community. We knew nothing, Jenni, about the corporate life. We barely knew that world existed, right? So no, it was never a part of our discussion. And as I went into Auntie Anne's the company that was a journey all by itself that I had to discover that I'm a leader and what does that mean for me? So yeah, it was quite a journey.

Speaker 1: 6:21

I was going to say I was curious about that because I thought you know what what I do love and maybe you can check the dots for us on this. But I've heard you say a number of times how you know the values were faith, family and community in the context that you grew up, and so I'm curious how that informed your leadership. So maybe talk us through that journey a little bit, about finding yourself in this corporate leadership seat and how you, how you found who you were in that process and showed up as as yourself in that journey.

Speaker 2: 6:53

I'd love for you to unpack that more. Well, you know that's a loaded question, Jenni, and I'll try to try to stay within the the guardrails right there. But, um, so what I believe that I learned as a kid on the farm. I learned it from mom and dad and I think that we underestimate the power of our family of origin and how we were actually taught and raised and prepared for life. And I feel very, very blessed in the fact that I was prepared for life. I didn't know that at the time but as I think about it now, Jenni, I'm so grateful that my mom and dad took time for me and all eight of us.

Speaker 2: 7:33

We were poor farmers and they sent us to a private school and went through eighth grade, which is what you do in the Amish and the Amish- Mennonite culture. And so I had very little knowledge about the real world, the business world and leadership. So I think that when I, when I got to Auntie Anne's at the age of 40, I didn't understand then, even at the beginning of that, I really had no clue that mom and dad set me up for success in life you know, whether that was be a mom and have a family, or whether that might have been being a farmer, whether that was I married an ex-Amish guy who ended up being an auto mechanic and car repairman, whether it meant being successful in my youth group as youth pastors, or whether we left the Amish and the Mennonite culture at some point after we got married. So it always felt like, whatever season I was in, I would go into these seasons not really understanding what that meant. You know, what does a youth pastor's wife do? Or what does a mom do? Or what's it like to be a wife? You know, but my parents modeled just family and faith and community.

Speaker 2: 8:54

And you know, I feel like that's the part of our world, that there's such a disconnect that we don't understand that we can actually be family, we can take our faith, we can take community into the workplace.

Speaker 2: 9:09

It's pretty basic, but it's for me that's really what I did.

Speaker 2: 9:15

So when we embarked on the journey of Auntie Anne's after we experienced, Jonas and I married at a very young age and ended up loving each other, enjoying family, just knew that we were blessed by God and loving our life. We really thought that life was we're on a very good path and God is blessing us, and we had no idea that there was trauma and tragedy that would occur in our lives. But going through all of that and then embarking on the Auntie Anne journey, wow, I realized through all of that that my parents really set me up for success and that what they taught me helped me to weather the storms of life and I feel like as Christian entrepreneurs whether it's a leadership in a business, or whether it's a pastor in a church or whether it's a teacher in a school room many very simple principles that we can carry into whatever season of life we find ourselves in or whatever vocation God has placed us in. And so when we embarked on Auntie Anne's being a leader was like I'm a doer, I'm a farm girl.

Speaker 2: 10:43

It was all about doing I don't know. I didn't know anything about leadership. And so there's a whole story about that, you know, and I want to take just a minute to tell you how I actually got to the knowledge of, Oh, I'm a leader? I'm not a doer, not a manager, no, and it all happened after we started Auntie Anne's and about five years into that, maybe four years into that, we had a conference that, the convention that we had for all of the Auntie Anne franchisees and employees, and we had a speaker there and he talked about the difference. There is a difference between management and leadership. And I mean, I sat there on the front of my like at the edge of my seat, like what is this? It was brand new information. Up until that time, I'm trying to manage our company. But when I understood the difference between management and leadership by the time he was done, reading that very short article and if I had time I would read that to you, I knew it was very clear with me that I am not a manager, I'm a leader. And I feel like it's so important for us to understand that there really is a difference. And I know, in your world and in the world of corporate America, and in you know, maybe, the world, some of your listeners and their world, you know it's kind of one in the same, you know.

Speaker 2: 12:11

But for me it became very clear I'm a leader, this is what God called me to be, and so if that's what I am, then I had to change, shift directions. I'm still Auntie Anne, I'm still a wife, I'm still a mom, but now I'm not focused so much on doing, but I'm focused on being and being for me. What began to happen then, Jenni, was that I began to focus on the internal person, the life, my heart of who I am on the inside, and to develop the internal life. Doing is all about the external life. We do, we do everything, and I feel like the external life that we live is somewhat crafted. We, we, we plan our external. What is it that we want people to see about us?

Speaker 2: 13:00

Right, but the internal life then, becomes a focus, and let me tell you, that has been my journey and it was one of the hardest changes that I made in my business life. But wow, let me tell you, it took me into a whole other world and I began to understand that leadership is really about being, it's about influence, and it's about being real, open, honest and transparent.

Speaker 1: 13:29

Wow. So can you give us some examples of what that looks like - that's so powerful! Because I think you're right, I think so many of us get to a place of leadership and we're doers, we're get it done, people, and we get put into a place where now we have this influence, and the word influence means the power to change or affect others, and I'm like there's a that's weighty, that's heavy. And so tell us more about that journey. For you, what did that look like? What did you change practically in how you spent your time and energy and what leadership looked like for you?

Speaker 2: 14:03

The impact of that article. For me again, it was very sobering and as I began to reflect on that, I began to feel the weight is what you mentioned, the responsibility of, oh now, being a doer and being a manager. It's not like I'm here and a manager's here. We're equal in value, but what's important is knowing which one you are. Now, I believe, as an entrepreneur, you know you got to be both at some point. You have to be both. You got to be willing to do. Clean the toilet, serve the coffee, love your people, serve your people all of that. But when I understood that God called me into leadership, it was a moment when the weight of that began to impact me and I began to really read books on leadership. I began to seek God about what does this mean? And as I grappled with that and began to try to understand what it means. But what I think that I got from that was that I began, instead of feeling like I have to do everything and be all things to all people, I began to feel the influence is all about leading people, guiding them. It's about serving them, and I think the greatest leader of all time was Jesus himself. And I began to read what he was like while he was here on planet Earth, and leadership is really about a selfless life. And did I? You would have to ask my employees, I don't know. But when I realized that, it put me on my knees and I began to try to find out. What does that mean for Anne Beiler? And there were

Speaker 2: 16:03

two occasions, I think, that really helped me understand what it was. Number one was when I understood that God's purpose for Auntie Anne's was to give and was to be light. I felt the call into the ministry of Auntie Anne's. I felt the ministry and that was confirmed to me as I went to a mission service at our church. I'm feeling conflicted. Auntie Anne's is consuming me. But, God, I want to be faithful to you. I know that you called me into ministry, but did I get distracted by the business?

Speaker 2: 16:48

And I'm in this church service on a mission Sunday, standing in the front row worshiping God, and I'm weeping because I'm like God, did I miss the call somehow? But as I prayed and as I worshiped, I just in my mind. I saw a picture of Jesus looking at me and he was smiling and it's my tears stopped and I'm like what is it? What is it, God? And he clearly interrupted my thoughts and he just

Speaker 2: 17:20

this is a thought that came to me I have created Auntie Anne's as a vehicle for missions to give. And in that moment, Jenni, I knew that Auntie Anne's was our ministry. It became very clear to me that's one example. And so then I knew that Auntie Anne's was our ministry, but I'm still clueless about that. I'm not a manager, I'm a leader. I can tell you one thing If you know which one you are, your employees will applaud you, like, and they'll be able to follow you. That's really good, because, okay, I was not a manager, I was just trying to be involved in everything. So we can actually frustrate our employees by just trying to be involved in it, that's so good, but a leader.

Speaker 2: 18:10

I feel like we sit back and we watch and we see and we notice and we're in tune and we're intuitive and I feel like in that position we have time to hear you, holy spirit, what he shows us. And my second revelation really came a couple of years after that, when I'm still thinking. I said to God one day I'm making my rounds in my office and saying hello to all my employees and, by the way, I think a leader stays connected with their people. Leaders stay connected. Think about Jesus. Yeah, like he stayed connected with his people.

Speaker 2: 18:49

And I feel like, as leaders in the business world or pastors, whatever your role is or wherever you are leading, it's important to stay connected. So I made my connections with the employees every Monday morning and I would talk to them and find out, oh wow, these people have problems. And I went back to my office that one particular morning. I said God, I just feel like I'm a pastor, but how can I be a pastor and a business woman in the market? I don't know how to connect the two.

Speaker 2: 19:17

And once again, I'm in my office as I made my rounds and God again clearly I said do you want me to be? All I knew was church life, right? Right. And I just said, God, do you want me to be an evangelist? And again he interrupted my thoughts and he said I want you to be salt and light. I'm like, wow, how do I do that? And the Holy Spirit clearly said I will show you. And I feel like that's the crux for me. That's where things began to shift, because I began to understand leadership. Being light doesn't say a word, but it makes everything visible. And salt doesn't speak, but it makes everything tasty. So I began to understand my role is to be salt and light. That means I had to live a life that was tastefully crafted and I had to live a life of light so that, whoever I am, that I shed light wherever I go. It's very difficult to be light if your inside is full of darkness, and that's where the challenge for me began.

Speaker 1: 20:33

Yeah, yeah, wow, okay. So much in there that I know everybody listening is just like just processing and really again just grateful for, I love your posture towards hearing what God was doing and saying to you in those leadership moments and just the wrestle even of where God had you and trying to understand that sense of purpose and ministry and really living into what a unique place of influence he gave you and starting to see the ministry of that. Um, I think that's just so inspiring, I think for a lot of people who kind of wonder how you got to the seat that you're in and you wonder am I doing what God told me to do? Am I living out the influence he's designed me for? And I love just your I hear dependence on Him. Anne, is that a fair like reflection of what your journey has looked like, that utter dependence on God?

Speaker 2: 21:35

Oh sure, you know, coming from the Amish background, where I had there are three things I didn't have when I started the company was a formal education. We had no money and we had no business plan. So that's a recipe, that's a strong,

Speaker 2: 21:52

"I've got to depend on God. If I want to do this. I need to depend on Him, and I believe in education. And there were days when I wished I would have known more. But you know, God is not a God of this world. We're in this world, but we are not of this world, and so He's able to break through this world and come to us and teach us His ways.

Speaker 2: 22:14

But it is important which you just made, the statement. It's really important for us again, whether you're a minister, whether you're a businesswoman or whether you're a stay-at-home mom, it doesn't matter what you are it's important for us to be in tune and be open and listening for those moments when God wants to instruct us. There's a verse that God gave me very early on Psalm 32, verse 8. He said I'll instruct you. In one of my moments of great frustration, I'm comparing myself to everybody else, I'm thinking I am not capable, this task is too big for me. But that's when God interrupted me again and gave me the promise, "I'll instruct you, I will teach you in the way that you should go and I will counsel you with my eye. Okay, jenny, either we believe him or we don't. It's just for me, I had to depend on him. I wanted to depend on him because I knew that he called me. So if we call ourselves into something you know, that's, I guess, a different story. But I knew God called me to this, and so, whether you're educated or not, when God calls you, we have to be open and willing to listen to his counsel and his wisdom, no matter how much we know.

Speaker 2: 23:40

And as time went on for me I learned more about God, I learned more about myself, I learned more about the business world, and there were moments of comfort and there was times I knew, wow, I'm learning, I'm growing. And one day it's kind of like I crawled out of my cocoon and I began to fly and I began to soar like a butterfly. And I think that God delights in our growth. He wants us to soar in him, and it's a beautiful thing when you can feel confident in yourself and, at the same time, have faith in him to guide you and teach you and take you into more of what he has for you. It's never like, oh, I'm here, now, I'm good, I'm good. There's always stretching, isn't there? There's always stretching and we need to do that at every level.

Speaker 1: 24:35

Yeah, I love that I think you referenced this word earlier and it's the title of one of your books Overcome and Lead. Tell us why that word is so powerful to you. There's lots of parts of your story, I know, that have influenced that. But why do you think we have to overcome ourselves as leaders in order to lead well, and maybe give us a little more of your backstory in that?

Speaker 2: 25:01

Well, every time I talk about overcoming, I have to go back to the years, for me, the years of darkness. And as a leader, let me say there will always be those times that we have to overcome or things in our lives that we have to overcome. But for me, there was a period of time, Jonas and I being married a number of years seven years and living in this idyllic Amish Mennonite world, and eventually found ourselves in a charismatic world, and my theology was that life is good and God is harsh. Because life was good, God was blessing us and there was so many things in my life that were just amazing to me. You are so good to us and there was so many things in my life that were just amazing to me. Like God, you are so good to us. And then tragedy and trauma became part of our life instantly. Just in a second, our youngest daughter, 19 months old, was killed on our farm accidentally, and killed instantly as my sister accidentally drove over her with a front-end loader loading and unloading sand out on our farm. So tragic I remember like it was yesterday, but I can tell you, Jenni, I had no idea where that was taking me. Tragedy changes us.

Speaker 2: 26:17

And then, from there, Jonas and I's marriage began to fall apart. We never separated, but we existed in a very silent marriage, continue to go to church, continue to almost act like nothing is wrong. And I got really good at pretending and just a couple months after that, in deep despair and feeling defeated as a Christian, because I just wasn't able to get over. That's so bad to feel like we need to get over. No, we need to think more about how can I get through. You never get over some tragic things that happen to you, but you can get through.

Speaker 2: 26:58

And during that time I went to see my pastor. He invited me to his office and I went there because I was so hopeful that he would help me. But in my grief and my deep despair, he took advantage of me physically and that took me into the dark world of abuse for almost seven years on a regular basis. Wow, well, I found myself. I thought life is good, God is harsh and meaning if I do everything just right, then God will be pleased with me. But if I'm a little bad or something, do everything just right, well, then God will be just pleased with me.

Speaker 2: 27:32

Long story short, at the end of those seven years I was skin and bones. I was a shell, still trying to be a mom. We had another baby after that trying to be a wife, still attending church. But on the outside, the life that I crafted externally looked, you know, nobody ever asked me what's wrong because I got so good at pretending. But my internal life? I was dying every single day, a little bit, stuck in this dark world.

Speaker 2: 27:59

And let me tell you, when you find yourself in that world, the dark world of abuse, whether, and for me, it was the life of secrets that I, that I began to live. Because who am I going to tell? This is too bad. Now, you know, I knew my theology now was, you know, I'm a bad girl and so, um, life is hard and God is very pleased with me. Bad theology. What I know today, after over over, uh, seven decades of real life's experience, I know that life is hard. God is good and I'm not confused.

Speaker 2: 28:32

I got through those seven years all by myself, alone, in my darkness, never told anyone, and that's why, at one point that after those seven years, I finally Holy Spirit compelled me to go tell Jonas my secret. Wow, that's in my book, but I can't go into that right now because it's a whole episode, but that began my journey then. That was the start of my journey into the world of light. So, fast forward, five years after my confession to Jonas, we started Auntie Anne's the company. I just feel like it's so important that we understand, as leaders, how the importance of being open, honest and transparent because I carried my guilt, my pain, my shame into the workplace, believing that it didn't matter to the rest of the world I still had to keep all of this to myself, even though Jonas and I had recommitted our lives and we were okay.

Speaker 2: 29:34

But I'm still carrying this ball and chain of pain, blame and change into the workplace, and so that just weighed me down and over time again I ended up in like I crashed and burned about seven years after the company started. That's when I began to deal with my internal life and that's when I began to do when I went for therapy, counseling, psychology. I went to psychiatrist, was a med school about two years, and so so to stay broken as a leader, eventually you will crash and burn, there's no doubt at some point, and that's why I love to talk about this subject of transparent leadership, because, as I began to be well as I as I made. It took me about six years to go from totally broken to where I finally felt like, oh, I'm okay now and at the same time, I'm leading the company of Auntie Anne's.

Speaker 2: 30:39

When you're whole, when you're not holding any secrets, when you're living an authentic life as Jesus wants us to walk in the light, to live in the light as he is in the light, and as we walk in the light as he is in the light, then we connect one with another and then we're continually cleansed. There's something powerful about just being open, real and honest, and it works in your business life, in your personal life and in your family life, with your relationships. It's a beautiful way to live and I believe that is, in fact, the overcoming life. Anne, that's so powerful and I think so many of us need to hear it.

Speaker 1: 31:24

I mean, I think of a lot of my peers in leadership and, as you were talking, that kind of the shell, the persona, the things we create to survive, all that's coming at us right and we're trying to navigate and how easy it is to have those dark places. You know, and thank you for just the vulnerability of your story and sharing that. I know you share that with a heart to help leaders overcome, transparent about to whatever degree that is, and just hearing your insights on the importance of that and what was that like? So you said you were seven years into the business when you had to really do some of this deep inner work. Did you take a pause from the business? Did you? Were you doing it? At the same time you were leading, because I'm guessing the business was probably growing like crazy at that stage as well. What were those dynamics like?

Speaker 2: 32:25

We were at the height, I would say struggled for many years to get the company stable and put systems in place, and we were expanding internationally as well during that time. And I took a sabbatical for about three months because, again now, thank God for the awareness that I had that I'm a leader, not a manager, and so as a leader, you bring a team around you and you train them and teach them and show them what it is that you what's really important in your company. So I had a fantastic team around me by that time and because of that then I was able to just announce to them you know, I have to take some time off and I believe, if I remember correctly, it was a three-month sabbatical. That didn't mean I was not in touch at all, because some of the bigger issues kept coming to me, but I was able to spend a lot of time alone and also with my therapist and Jonas and I spent a lot of time together, and so that was the initial taking a sabbatical. And you know, I was even embarrassed about that, like I didn't want anyone to know that I was so bad that I needed a sabbatical, you know. But that's the beauty of transparency we don't want anyone to know. But that's why I'm saying the external life. You know, we craft that carefully until we crash and burn. And then you got to do something to bring the external and the internal life together.

Speaker 2: 33:51

And during that time my therapist, Dr. Richard Dobbins, has passed on to be with the Lord but man, what a guy. And he said to me in one of my sessions. He said and if you can bring your external and your internal life together to the point that it's one in the same, there will no longer be the great conflicts that you're feeling right now. I'm like, wow, talk about an assignment, you know. So today I have that information and if my external and my internal feels conflict, maybe in a relationship or it can be a number of things, I know.

Speaker 2: 34:28

I immediately go to what Doc said you got to bring the two together. How do I do that? Open my life to someone my husband or someone I may have hurt, or maybe I'm feeling embarrassed about something, but the way to keep it together is to use the James 5.16 model Confess your faults one to another, pray, and then you'll be healed. And I believe that model means that relationally, it's not about talking to Jesus about all my problems in that verse. But it's about being open, humble and willing to share your struggles, the things I've done wrong or the things I feel bad about one to another. And that's what I was able to do with Dr Richard Dobbins and that's what I was able to do then with Jonas. That's what I was able to do then, eventually, with my children.

Speaker 2: 35:18

And even today, you know, if I feel like I've hurt them by being snippy or just a little bit, my, my body language, oh man, let me tell you Holy Spirit, you can, you can count on Holy Spirit If you invite him in, ask him to help you, be transparent, let me tell you he'll be right there at your beckoning call to help you.

Speaker 2: 35:39

I call that the lifestyle, the overcoming lifestyle, and it's simply open up, make a confession, say I'm sorry, humble yourself, talk about your stuff. And you know, just over the weekend, as I was speaking at an event, and I was speaking to a pastor and his whole world is falling apart, and I said to him do you know what it's like to be transparent with somebody? He said you know, I have a really good friend, a Godly man that I go to. I said are you telling him everything about your life? And he looked at me just almost tears welling up in his eyes. He said 90% and I said well, the 10%, that's where you got to go. You got to go to the 10 percent. Be open and honest about everything in your life to someone. We do talk to God about things, we do talk to Jesus, right, but there's something powerful about the one to another and that's the relational healing that we all long for.

Speaker 1: 36:43

That's my opinion and my experience that's so powerful, well, and I think scripture supports it, right.

Speaker 1: 36:51

So it's throughout scripture, yes, yeah for sure, wow, and that's so powerful.

Speaker 1: 36:57

And I think I mean, I feel like we've all just been coached as leaders of just, you know they're my listeners will be familiar with this, because I say it all the time, although I feel like I say it all the time, to try to keep convincing myself of the importance of it, but that leadership is sacred work, that they're the weight, the responsibility, the influence that we have, and like just understanding that and stewarding that in a way that keeps us in that posture of just the humility, of recognizing the influence that we have.

Speaker 1: 37:30

And, um, I think sometimes leadership should almost scare us. I think, you know, culturally, you know, people want to aspire to leadership because it's almost perceived as power and I feel like it should be the other extreme of right, should almost scare us a little bit of the significance of it and what it requires of us. And what you've modeled and what you've talked about and you've experienced in your own story is the power and the beauty of that transparency and leadership and what it does for your own soul, but then, I'm sure, for the people that you've led and you've influenced through the years, so really powerful.

Speaker 2: 38:05

You've concluded there with a great summary of what I've been trying to say, and that is that leadership is truly, it's, a responsibility and it's not for me. I understand it, of course, much better now than I did 20 years ago, but I want to encourage the leadership, your audience, those who know that they're leaders, who know that they're called. If they're not sure, then I would encourage them to just you know, find out, what is what am I? Am I a manager or leader? It's important to know, because once you know who you are, which one you are, then you find that niche and that's where you are able to grow and it gives you wind beneath your wings when you know who you are and what your role is. And so I just want to encourage the managers and the leaders out there find out which one you are and put that into, put your heart and soul into developing that, and also to let you know that listen, man, I have stumbled and I've fallen and I have struggled and I have wrestled and I have labored and I have lost sleep, and I have all these things to come to the conclusion that you know, when God calls us, he will, in fact, equip us to do the task that he has called us to.

Speaker 2: 39:26

But we all read the stories in the Bibles about great leaders, about great prophets, and they all had their own struggles. They all had struggles and I think my greatest example is in Jesus. I mean, he was tried in the wilderness for 40 days. What did he do with that? He came back and he told his disciples I mean, here's the son of God. But he humbled himself and he told them hey, listen, guys, I just came out of 40 days of the hardest time of my life. I was offered this and that and the three things that Satan offered. But he told his disciples, those closest to him, how hard this was and I think that, to me, is the example.

Speaker 2: 40:12

Tell your people, those closest to you, what you're struggling with, 100% of your struggle, and therein you will find freedom, you will find connection, you will find that living in the light is really a beautiful thing. It may be hard at first, but the overcoming lifestyle. I should begin to live this way. I'm telling you the sky is the limit and there's never an end to the freedom and to the light. I always tell my husband every time I share my story. Even after this podcast today. I will tell him hon, I just feel a little more free and a little more light. I don't understand it. So it's more than being saved and knowing I'm going to heaven. It's like God's light is huge, his freedom is huge and we can never exhaust it. Never exhaust it.

Speaker 1: 41:07

That's so powerful! Anne, you're a gift. Thank you so much for just investing in so many of us. You're a, you're at a stage and you're you know you've, you've sold the business. You're like that. You don't, you don't have to expend your time and energy, but it feels like it's still part of your calling to invest back in the rest of us who are, who are doing this or that. Yeah, you know, Jenni, once you've been in both worlds,

Speaker 2: 41:32

there's just something so powerful and so beautiful about it that you, you really want the whole world to know about this, and that's really my I guess I would say my, the love of my life is to be able to share my story and just pray, Holy Spirit take what we've talked about today and put it, plant it into the crevices of the souls that are listening, and we plant the seeds and the Holy Spirit comes along and, I believe, reveals what your listeners need to hear.

Speaker 1: 42:03

That's exactly right, so good. Thank you so much for your time and your investment in us today. If people want to connect more, find your books. Where's the best place for them to connect with you more? You

Speaker 2: 42:14

can go onto my website, auntieannbeiler. com, and, or you can pick up any of my books Secret Lies Within, Overcome and Lead Twist of Faith, and then recently I did a Come to the Table cookbook, so, and then there's other online. I have an online transparent leadership online and a few of those things. So if you go to my website, you can see what we're doing and you can order a book and I can actually sign them and send them to you if you want it that way. Or you can go to Amazon and pick up a book.

Speaker 1: 42:42

Perfect! Anne, again, thank you so much. You have led well and you have left a legacy that's impacting so many, so thanks for your faithfulness as a leader.

Speaker 2: 42:51

Well, thank God and thank you Jenni.

Speaker 1: 42:54

All right, friends, did you feel a little convicted? Did you feel like she was maybe just encouraging you, challenging you a bit as a leader on that transparency and the honesty and the vulnerability and the humility pieces, like guys? I think there's so much of that we need to hear. And here's a leader that is, you know, in my case, she's a couple decades ahead of me, maybe even three decades ahead of me in her journey as a leader, and I think the wisdom of hearing a leader speak candidly and openly and honestly about their journey and for us to get a chance to learn from that, I think is so incredibly powerful.

Speaker 1: 43:36

So I hope you took some things away from that today. I hope it sparked some helpful and healthy conversations for you as a leader. Maybe there's someone you want to go talk to and kind of unpack what you heard, or maybe there's a little bit you need to share or something that you haven't shared with somebody that you need to, something you need to confess or you need to even be vulnerable or transparent with your team about. So I challenge you whatever that looks like for you, take a step, tap into Anne's bravery a little bit and her courage and her going first as a leader, and do that for yourself as well. Well, I am thrilled that you joined us today. Thank you for just being a part of the Lead Culture community, being committed to healthy leaders and thriving teams. That's what it's all about for us.

Speaker 1: 44:21

If you liked this week's episode, let me know. You can reach out to us on all the social channels, at Get4S ight or at Jenni Catron, and leave us a review. Let us know how this episode helped you lead well and, until next time, keep leading well, thank you.