Navigating Career Transitions with Dyci Sfregola

This week, Nikki gets a one on one interview with Startup Mentor, Dyci Sfregola. Nikki and Dyci discuss mentorship, starting her own venture, supply chain management, and  her brand new book.

Transcript

[00:00:00] All right. Welcome to automation. Ladies. We have a short episode today with our friend DC. If you guys haven't seen her on LinkedIn, we've been connected there for what? Probably a couple of years now. I was on her very cool show that unfortunately is no longer running. Well, I'll ask her about this again later too, on the let's talk supply chain network, action items.

With DC's Frag Life. I got it right. Wow. You were really, really close. Okay. Very close. Well, welcome to Automation Ladies. Thank you for making the time, , to come on the show and for chatting with me for 30 minutes before we started recording. Today was one of those days where I needed it. Absolutely.

Not a problem. We all have those days. So, I'll let you introduce yourself to the audience, but I wanted to, I guess, complete my thought here. I think we got introduced through, Sam's group, if I remember correctly, that is my memory of it. [00:01:00] Yeah. So let's go with that.

Yeah. Sam Gupta, who, if you haven't heard of him and his podcast, WBS rocks, WBS rocks. Thank you. I'm really bad with acronyms. I tend to get them backwards. Um, yeah. He talks about business systems and ERPs and things like that and how they can help your business. Highly recommend his podcast, but yeah, he has a little Slack channel, which I unfortunately stopped being able to attend because they was happy hour on Fridays.

 And I started taking half days on Fridays, but we've, you know, I've seen a DC around on LinkedIn. She's a business owner. She's a mom. She, is an expert on supply chains, ERPs, and her content is just. And it's just chock full of great stuff. And especially the show that you did last year. I appreciate you having me on that.

And I really liked the format of that. No, you're losing track of time. It is 2022. Oh, it was. Okay. Yeah. All of the days and all of the months are starting to blend together. It was two years ago that you were [00:02:00] on. Two years ago. Yeah. And it was right before Christmas, if I remember correctly. And then I was going to have you on.

Automation ladies right before Christmas last year. So about a year later, and then I ended up having to reschedule. But anyway, here we are, February 21st, day after my birthday. And yeah, you've been doing big things since then. I think your company's grown a lot. You've moved. You're really doing a focus on, if I'm understanding this correctly, construction companies.

Um, prefab construction, stuff like that. So yeah, would you be willing to, I guess, just give everybody an introduction of yourself and, add on to that or tell me how horribly wrong I am? No, all of those things are correct. It's great to hear someone Accurately say what the focus is because you know, this , as a business owner and then also with the podcast with automation, ladies, am I communicating to the world the correct message?

Are they leaving that? [00:03:00] So I always love it when people. communicate effectively. And I'm like, okay, so that means that I'm communicating effectively if someone else can very accurately describe what it is that I do. So I will say action items on Let's Talk Supply Chain is hanging in limbo right now.

Um, so I do have a book that's coming out next year. My manuscript is due at the end of July and it's about seven months. They told me for print and production. So it'll be out in 2025. And as you mentioned, the business is growing. We've really niched down to figure out what our. Ideal customer is and what the value added in the service is.

So we've reached that hallelujah moment of product market fit. And things have been very busy. I also am taking some time off this year to deal with some health things. I'm completely healthy, but I want to stay that way. [00:04:00] So I need to have some preventive surgeries. And when it came down to sitting with the marketing team and sitting with the sales team, it.

It was really do we need to keep doing action items this year, at least through the first half of the year while I'm trying to get the book written, conferences, you know, February, March gets really busy with conferences and it was travel and with client travel and I just burned out last year. I burned out.

Q2 through, the better part of Q3. And I'm trying to be very conscientious about not doing that again. So a little bit about my background, professionally, I started my career in sales and marketing, and then I transitioned and I went back to school to study industrial engineering. And then I got my master's in engineering management and, 

quite literally, like, I think a lot of us fell into supply chain and, well, I didn't quite literally, I didn't fall physically. [00:05:00] Literally right now, it's like my six year old's favorite word and I have to keep telling her, okay, like, Hey. You don't need to keep saying literally when it's not literally when it is.

It's also very clear. You don't need to repeat it. So, so I, I fell into a supply chain and I was actually doing marketing for a company that was called archive management consultants, and they were a tool agnostic supply chain implementation, a software implementation firm. So a lot of nexus. and a plan.

Oh, and partners. , I think there was another like small tool we did once out of France, that the customer had selected, but there was also at the time, kind of this sort of incubator with sales. So it gave me the opportunity to really understand what business needs were from a manufacturing perspective, because it was a lot of, like multinational manufacturers, components, [00:06:00]semiconductor, uh, things like that.

So honestly, just like sitting and reading S. O. W. s and proposals, where it details, what is the business problem? How are we going to fix it? What are we going to fix it with? Like, that's how I learned about. The manufacturing problems that are needed to be solved by automation, improved processes, digital readiness assessments, things like that.

So when they were acquired, I didn't want to go work at a big company. So I went to go work at another boutique firm. And then I got to the point to where, honestly, after two years there, I would have loved to stay there. I was very happy there. But there was nowhere for me to go. And they were, you know, at a small company, there are only so many senior roles and there was nowhere for me to go.

So I went to another company, another boutique firm that was an acquired by Accenture. I don't want to work at Accenture either. Like I don't [00:07:00] want to work at this other big company. I don't want to work at this, this now big, huge company either. And that was in the fall of 2020. And I had to decide. Was I going to try to find another job or was I just going to go out on my own?

And my husband and my dad convinced me, our son was not even two at the time, but my dad said, you know, move to New Mexico. The cost of living is really cheap. So even if things don't work out, you don't have, you know, a lot of overhead. And my husband's sailing, you can do it. You can do it. He always says DC, DC.

Yeah. You've got your own kind of chance. Yes. So he convinced. me that they both convinced me to go out on my own and, I didn't realize I had an idea. And I said, okay, well, this might work. So flashback to when I was doing software implementations for these huge semiconductor manufacturers and component [00:08:00] manufacturers and OEMs.

Um, and I say it, well, we're turning away business. They got to the point to where, you know, the sales lead told me less than 500 million in revenue, like we don't even entertain it, which is fine. Everyone has their business model. Yeah. Even when I went to the boutique firm, it's like that number kept getting lower and lower and lower.

I'm like, okay, so who's serving the small business? You know, like who is serving? The manufacturer that is trying to grow that has no idea what they're doing from a supply chain perspective. Or the one person or handful of people who do know what they're doing are stretched so thin that there's no way that they are having the time to look at continuous improvement and innovation because they just have to get the day to day done.

So I'm going to create a company that supports Supply chain, innovation, automation and digitalization, advanced manufacturing, smart [00:09:00] factories for the small to medium business. So, I mean, like, startup, I've advised startup pre revenue companies. Up to, you know, 40, 50 million I've been brought on to like, as a subcontractor to 200, 300 million, but that startup pre rev to 40 or 50 million, where there is a clear strategic objective for growth is where I've really been focusing and, that manufacturing.

Focus then took me into what you mentioned, the prefab, the modular manufacturing, and that seeps into construction and I was doing a lot of construction, you know, stuff and people were like, no one is talking about supply chain here. And the more that I got into, I was like, well, people. Are talking about supply chain, but not in the way that we want them to.

People are saying, oh, my project was delayed or I'm going to lose this contract because of the supply chain. So [00:10:00] what does that mean? The supply chain doesn't just happen to you. Like. , there are ways to manage your supply chain. So that intersection of manufacturing and construction is where there's just a lot of innovation right now.

There's a lot of discussions around automation. There's a lot of discussions around how to improve the built environment using AI, using different technologies. There's a lot of innovation. So it's been a very fun place. to be. It's very purposeful. Like people have to live. We live not only like in our homes, but also in buildings like we spend time in buildings.

So it's not just building new things. It's also improving and retrofitting existing structures and improving air quality and improving energy efficiency and things like that. So it's really purposeful work and it's really fun. [00:11:00] Yeah, very cool. At what point, , did you see that that niche was for you?

Like, was it a conference where they're like reoccurring clients in an area that you started to see a pattern? It was, it was a perfect storm of a couple of different things. So there, there were the conferences, I think naturally as an entrepreneur, you also see things from a perspective. So where I really looked at it was Is there a gap in the market here?

Yeah. So I went to the conferences and I started to follow people on LinkedIn and I started to read the newsletters that were associated with the industry. And I saw that there was a lot of buzzword around supply chain. But nobody really got it, even from like a lean manufacturing perspective, like, you know, automation within the factory, I would go to factories and [00:12:00] automation for them was, Oh, we're going to put in robots, right?

And it's like, well, it's more than just the robots, but there wasn't anyone really talking about that. And of course, I don't know everyone in the entire industry in the entire world, but. If there is someone, there's enough to go around for there to be another voice. Yeah. So, so I really saw that there was an opportunity to take these core supply chain concepts from other industries and manufacturing principles and, you know, automation that goes beyond Hey, this is a robot.

And that's one of the first things that I start with when I'm at these conference when I'm doing sessions and workshops and trainings. And I'm saying, like, when I'm talking about automation, I'm not saying you guys should go buy robots and put it in your factory. I want you to understand that automation and digitalization and innovation is so much more than that.

[00:13:00] And this is what I'm talking about. I'm talking about all of these other things that also fall under the umbrella of technology. And you know, I think probably the culminating moment of it, if you ask, like, what was the moment when I realized this was a good industry, was when the publisher.

For the book reached out and say, Hey, have you considered making any of these sessions a full length book? And I said, well, I hadn't. Um, but it's interesting that you would ask because there were plenty of times where I thought to myself, I need to do a little bit more research. You know, you want to be the best, you want to be good, especially as a consultant, as an advisor, your value is that, you know, more than the customer.

So like I need to spend the time really. Improving and filling up my knowledge bank so that I can better help my customers. But there was no book for me to go read. There was nothing for me to like really do. So it was more of, okay. I know a lot [00:14:00] about pharmaceutical supply chain. I know a lot about contract manufacturing.

I know a lot about procurement. I know a lot about retail supply chain and grocery like what do I know And then what is potentially relevant to this industry and now, how do I package it for this industry? Because you can't go into construction talking about, you know. Retail, right? You also can, you know, perspective.

You also can. And I think that what happened, I do remember what happened for me to say, yes, I'm going to pursue it. And I think this is going to be okay. First of all, Daniel Stanton. Okay. Supply chain for dummies. We were texting about it and. And I was like, I don't know. And he was like, you can do it.

You can do [00:15:00] it. Like he really, really encouraged me every time that I looked for a reason to not do it. I was like, Oh, they're just blowing smoke. I'm not going to get excited. And then when the actual agreement hit my inbox and I had to E sign, I was like, no, I'm not going to do this, Daniel. Like, I can't do it.

I don't have time. I don't know what I'm talking about. Like, no, I'm not going to do it. He was like, yes, you can. Yes, you can. So he encouraged me a lot. But also, um, I'm a member of CSTNP here in Atlanta, and they do a lot of events here in Atlanta. And I went to Piedmont Healthcare. They did a warehouse tour at Piedmont Healthcare, and the supply chain folks over there were telling us about all of the supply chain innovations that they were doing.

for Piedmont Healthcare. And what really stood out to me is that no one on the supply chain team had a healthcare background because it was completely new. There was someone from grocery, there was someone from automotive, there was someone from distribution. And they said, we really sat down to try to [00:16:00] think about what are all of the innovations that are happening in these other industries that we can bring to healthcare and make them work in this industry.

And that was really when I thought, you know what? This is why I started the company, the messaging for when I started the company that I started with for sales calls three and a half years ago was Mr. Customer, I might not have the, and just throwing the waste management experience, but I do have supply chain experience.

I know how to move stuff. I know how to automate stuff. I know how to get stuff where it needs to be leveraging data, leveraging tools and improving people along the way, you know, waste management together. I can bring you some ideas from other industries that you might not have considered. Like that was always the value prop.

And it really came down to, okay, these folks at Piedmont can all come from different industries and improve healthcare supply chain innovation and automation. And that's what I said I was going to do. This is my opportunity. [00:17:00] So it's either going to work out or it's not going to work out. And if it doesn't work out, I'm just going to try something else.

You know, it'll be my story of, I tried it and it didn't work out, but I would rather try it and it not work out than to have never tried because I was afraid and I didn't want to fail. That's really important. I think to be able to, I mean, obviously you have had the experience to already. Try something, start something, not having full 100%, you know, future looking, you know, it's going to succeed just with your starting the company in general.

And then having supporters, friends, family, your support as well as network, more than colleagues like you, you start to get a feel for, okay, well maybe like trying this and failing at it wouldn't be the worst thing. , and I think a lot of people. You know, they stopped themselves. Like you just said, you have a million reason not to, you told yourself that you couldn't do it.

 I do this a lot. I took me years to start a podcast, even though people [00:18:00] told me many, many times. And I always said, no, cause I sound like a 12 year old girl. Why would I put my, why would I do something where my voice was going to be heard? I don't have a radio voice. I hate my voice also. I've never seen an episode of action items.

Because I can't listen to my voice. I will not listen to this because I can't listen to my voice. Same. I actually was really happy to be able to listen to Automation Ladies on my drive up to Austin. I think it was for an industrial marketing summit a few weeks ago because there was a couple episodes that I wasn't on.

Like, yes, I'm gonna listen to my own podcast now. But the book thing is really cool. So I was gonna ask, but you already answered, how did you get A book deal. How do you get, you know, a book published? I know some people that have self published books, which I think sometimes serves another purpose, especially if you are a consultant, it can just help to, you know, underscore your expertise.

 You're not necessarily looking to sell the book, you know, bestseller [00:19:00] on Amazon or New York Times, but you bring it to a call and or you give it to clients. And it can have credibility, there's some credibility there, but you were actually contacted by an outside publisher saying, yes, like your work.

We've seen you, you know, your trainings or whatever, would you like to write a book about this? That, that is really, I have no tips. I have no tricks. It was one of those things. There's a book called the psychology of money that my step mom recommended to me that I read. Okay. Either last year or the year before, but one thing that stood out to me is how he talked about luck and people really, if you don't do the right thing or not, if something bad happens, it was bad luck.

If something good happens, you did a really good job, but people underestimate. The role that luck plays also in success. Yeah, so it like I literally, [00:20:00] and then the other people say luck is preparation meeting opportunity, you know, so I'm sure someone will argue, yes, but you were doing the trainings, you were really prepared, you identified the gap in the market and you started talking about something that caught the editor's eye and they reached out to you, etc, etc.

Yes, that is all true. But it wasn't that all lucky that at the end of the day, she happened to be looking at some website that I was on and saw the topic digital supply chain fundamentals for construction, and she thought that was interesting. What if some other publisher or some other editor had been on that same website and wasn't interested in it?

You know what I mean? Like. Yeah, there is nothing that I did to control that. That was one of those things that is pure, absolute luck. And I would love to be able to say, I did this and this and this, and you too can do that. But I literally, when it came through my email, I assumed it was spam. Yeah, but you [00:21:00] know, like it was one of those, it was completely out of the blue.

I honestly don't even know how she got my work email because you know how you get like the LinkedIn people and you know, they're using AI to scrape your email, my personal email. So I don't even know how she got my work email. And that's the only reason why I was like, Hey, maybe it's not spam. It came to my work email.

It says this, like, I recognize this publisher. But it was digital supply chain fundamentals. Are a need right now. And it's it was very much the right place. Timing is there so much of timing and not to take this too long because I know we said we were going to keep this short. And you know, we could go on forever and ever left me on fulfilling that promise.

But, but it did make me think about there is a guy that I met in Dubai and I was at a conference, back in December a couple months ago and. He was a great [00:22:00] guy and I don't remember his name, but hopefully he never listens to this and he doesn't think I'm talking bad about him, but it's one of those things to where he was at this like startup, you know, networking thing and they had him there to talk about what it's like to make a successful exit and how you grow your business.

But then he told the story, and it was his manufacturing business, but then he told the story about how he was making transparent face masks. Before Cove it. Mm. It's transparent. Face masks were under FDA like evaluation when Cove it hit. So March 2020 came and the FDA called him and say it. How quickly can you manufacture millions of units?

That is pure luck. You cannot give me business advice. That's why I feel like every guru that says business advice from you. I [00:23:00] did this and now I have a system and it works so well, I'm going to sell it to you. I'm always like, you know what, there's something in that system that is either luck or you personally, right?

There's, how many people that try to replicate that success can actually have this success? Yes, absolutely. Yeah. And I mean, of course you, if you really like create a good business system, it can very, very much benefit people. And, you know, people can teach other people how to do things better, like consulting.

 But yeah, to say that like, Oh, you know, you can replicate all the things that I did to get successful. I usually take that with a big ass grain of salt because I'm like, I never tell people, I never tell people to take my advice. I always say this is what I did. This is my opinion. Yeah. You take that because I've never taken people's advice.

I've always listened to advice. Sometimes I'll call different people and then I kind of get their perspective. I [00:24:00] ultimately decide to do whatever I want to do. Yeah. If I had taken people's advice, I would literally never be here right now because I would have gone to a different university. I would have gone to work right after college.

I had a corporate job lined up and no one could understand why I would instead. Um, I've run off to Europe to a country. I've never been to with the language. I never spoke with people that I had no clue who they were. But I also said, well, you know, what's the cycle of life? You are born, you go to school, you go to work, you die like that.

That's the cycle. So if I prolong the going to work a little bit, actually going to change, um, so my career, my life has been. Decision after decision of not taking people's advice, and it's been. What was your experience? That's great. If I do [00:25:00] say, what should I do? Honestly, most people have told me. I think, you know what you should do based off of the conversation we just had.

I think, you know what you should do. That's probably true on so many levels for me as well. I would, if I had taken people's advice, geez, I probably would be a nomadic sales person on the road right now is 1 of the, for whatever reason, like the standout moments that where people thought I was crazy, , going into another industry and they're like, what are you doing?

All of us have been around here doing the same thing for, you know, 20 years and it's great. And I would have never imagined like, what. Was it ahead with these doors, these random doors I was walking through, they seemed random at the time and then all of a sudden, isn't that what they say? Whoever your divine is, you know, mine is God, but, you know, divine is the universe.

Whoever you're. You're speaking to, but that's what they say. Yeah. So I remember, I still remember this may not be an official slogan of [00:26:00] yours, but I still associate with you with the phrase, startup supply chain to grownup supply chain. Do you still say that? I do still say that, especially when I'm talking to startups.

People, I always say, you know, we're going to go on this journey from startups, supply chain to grownup supply chain. And then I also use, and I did not come up with this one. Um, but actually, if I think about it, I didn't come up with startup supply. Oh yes, I did. So someone said, we need a grownup supply chain.

And I say it, huh? Startup supply chain to grownup supply chain. But there's another guy that I worked with and he said, Hey, we need, um, And it was Glossier at the time he said, you know, Glossier is like they're going on baby's first supply chain and they need some support. And I say it, I'm going to use that baby's first supply chain.

So, yeah, startup supply chain and growing up supply chain. It used to be like my tagline on, you know, on, on LinkedIn. I don't use that anymore. But [00:27:00] in calls and when I'm talking about the journey of where we're going, I do use startup supply chain to grow up supply chain and baby's first supply chain.

That's funny. Um, supply chain is such a big, it's such a big umbrella, right? It's like everything that brings materials to production or what the raw materials to when something gets onto the shell. What's your definition? Yeah. What I, tell people, one of the first things that we do, I say, I want to level set.

When I say supply chain, this is what I'm talking about. Now that we know that we're talking about the same thing, which supply chain function would you like to focus on? But for me, supply chain is from the time you have an idea of a product until the time you are servicing, you are providing parts, or you are getting it back.

Yeah, okay. That is all of supply. So anything in the middle. So literally from the time you say, I have an idea that I want to do this. You've got to source R& [00:28:00] D. You probably have, like, if you're making chemicals, you have to source a chemist. You have to figure out who's going to be your contract manufacturer to do this, or are you going to do it in house if you are already a manufacturer, and maybe you're doing, you know, a new line or a new product.

How are you going to ship it? Who's going to ship it? How are you going to package it so that it can ship? properly. What is the customs look like? Are you going to import it? Where are you going to source it from? You know, especially from a manufacturing perspective, even when things say like made in China or made in Mexico, like there's, there's a rule that X percentage has, or like the assembly has to be, I mean, these things come from all over the world.

So literally from the time you have an idea, you have to be thinking about your supply chain. And how you're going to move it, how you're going to make it, where is it going to sit? How long is it going to sit? How's it getting to the end customer? The unboxing experience, the packaging experience, even as you're thinking about the user experience, like you want to make a [00:29:00] product.

That is intuitive to where, like, I don't read the instructions for a lot of things, but if I push a button or if I do this, then like this kind of happens. Like you're thinking about the design, like all of that is the supply chain. And when people say, Oh, our supply chain is procurement. Or our supply chain is manufacturing or our supply chain is transportation.

No, it's all those things, whether you want to roll it up to finance, or you want to roll it up, or it's an outsource agency. You can send it to wherever you want to send it, but the supply chain is all of those things and. You have to have them strategically involved talking to marketing and finance and sales and the demand side of the organization in order to make sure that operationally everything works.

And I will debate it until I'm blue in the face, which will not happen as you can see, I'm never going to get, I will just keep debating [00:30:00] forever that you have to invest. As much, if not more in your supply chain and product operations, as you do in sales. If you do, like, they have to be, they have to be partners and they have to be complementary.

Because if you invest too much in sales and not enough in operations, you have unhappy customers. Because you've got stock outs, you've got, you're trying to expedite things. You're trying to figure out who's actually going to get something. And if you invest too much in operations and not enough sales, then you've got too much inventory.

You've got too much stuff and not so they have to go hand in hand and so many people focus on like sales and marketing and I get on calls and I say, what's your S and O P process? You know, how I'm happy to help you with inventory management, but who's going to be my counterpart on the sales and marketing side, because if marketing runs a promotion.

Are you going to realize that that was an expected uptick in X number of [00:31:00] units when the orders come in, and hopefully that you can make it, or do you want to know that ahead of time so that you can even tell marketing that's not feasible? You should not do that. That's not going to work. Don't don't do that.

Don't set us up for failure. I run into that too. Like when, so my experience with supply chain, I ended up going into it. I don't know, not really by choice either, but opportunity came along. And I was working with this startup called algo. And they do, they were building software for using more AI in the data analytics process, and they came from a retail supply background.

And, and in the majority of their customers were in the movie industry. So we were trying to predict demand for movies that hadn't been released yet. In addition to home entertainment for movies that have been out for years, right? So different kind of planning process because some you have historical data, you have POS, and then new things that are coming out, you don't.

 But it really taught me a whole lot about this like promotion cycle and how you have, you know, seasonality to [00:32:00] things. And I looked back and I was like, yeah, I remember that time where I. In a industrial side, like we would, I got this like product of the month in the newsletter, but it was out of stock and it was like, we're promoting it to everyone.

And then rolling in, it's like, oh, actually we don't have it. When is it going to come? Oh, we don't know. And most recently, I also saw a manufacturer in my space, Advertising a new product. And then we got a quote request for said product. And said product has not been released yet and is not therefore not stocked by any distributor.

And it's like, why are you creating demand for things that don't exist or you can't fill? And that's gotta be just like, like you said, like that sales and operations planning process is not cohesive. Somehow they're not talking to each other. And interestingly enough, Algo actually expanded a lot of their service around the inventory planning to SNOP planning as well, because you kind of can't do your part right.

Like you said, if the counterpart, you know, isn't either [00:33:00] communicating or that function just isn't there or they haven't invested in it. Absolutely. Do you see are there, like, some idiosyncrasies to the prefab building and construction industry that are like, markedly different from your experience and in the other verticals?

Yes, there, there is a large on site, off site collaboration component of it because whereas with, you know, most manufactured products, it's manufactured and like, that's the end of it. And then like you have service every once in a while with the prefab and the modular space, a lot of it happens in, inside, but then you have to actually, when you get to the construction site, do the setting.

So there's the whole other piece of, it's almost like yard management with trailers. If you're doing dredge or, you know, something like that, you have to make sure that the panels and the modules get to the site at the right time and that there's [00:34:00] enough like area and space. And, you know, especially imagine if you're setting.

16 floors of buildings like you're not just going to sit 16 floors of buildings like on the sidewalk, like there's the other piece of like the operations of the actual setting of getting the building in the off site location. That is unique to the modular space. So you do have to have systems that talk to each other to where the people in the factory consistently know what's happening at the site.

So that's when, like, you have to really think about mobile capabilities and you have to really think that these are most of the time, not employees. They are a lot of times general contracting partners, they don't have the same systems. So you, it's like, it's analogous to, you know, working consistently with your 3PL for order fulfillment.

And you have to always be talking to them, [00:35:00] but like, they're always in the same location. And you're like, this is always something different and, you know, some companies only work in certain metro areas. So you start to develop the relationship. But if you want to scale, you have to think about, okay, how do we get to the next step?

How do we get to the next state to the next metro area? And who are going to be our strategic partners in that place? And thinking about the systems and getting buy in from those partners. so much. Is something that I have found to be very unique to the industry. Do you think when the, when industries or verticals are unique like this, is there, and I'll, I saw, I think it was a post from you, uh, maybe today or yesterday or something talking about ERPs and how most people kind of use the financial module of the ERP and other functions kind of don't get built out necessarily.

 Is there an ERP? That is like the sweet spot for a certain industry. Once you figure it out, do you then like recommend all your clients in that industry to use a [00:36:00] particular product? I do. I do. , I've done enough research. And Sam Gupta, as you mentioned, will have strong opinions about this.

I've done research for my clients and, , have come to like, if you are in this type of business complexity. And this number of people, and this is your goal and this is your financial constraint and also considering your other systems and integration needs, I, for the most part, like my, and there are plenty, but I have, um, like I like pro shop for like, we don't have a lot of tough financial needs so we can still use QuickBooks, but it is made for like heavy.

You know, like big industrials like planes defense, and I looked at them for a modular company. I like Acumatica, which is normally, they have a great construction module. They have a great manufacturing module, which is great for our [00:37:00] piece. There is not an ERP that has tackled and created. A tool in my perspective.

That is a good out of the box feature for, modular construction manufacturing. I never know if I just say my mental manufacturer modular construction because it's both like you're combining a factory and a construction site into one. Right? Exactly. Um, but , I also. For not this space, but for other space, I do a lot of Microsoft dynamics.

Because of the cost and because it's like a lot of people already on Microsoft, if you have the idea of doing data visualization, Power BI, you know, obviously very nicely done. Um, connects and integrates and then, I have for my people who are committed to the innovation and committed to bringing the tech in house, or at least aligning a budget to continue to invest in this.

I like Odoo or ERP [00:38:00] next. I like Odoo more because it's open source. You're like, you're not starting from nothing. Yeah. I really don't like customize. I think that that is just, you are setting yourself up for failure. , and I'm sure that there is a place where customized systems, someone can debate and say that that is better for my size of client.

Like I mentioned, pre rev to 40, 50 million, there's no need for you to have a completely customized system that then just requires. Like people to know what that customization like, you have to always have those with the knowledge to say, oh, like, if the person who built out the system retires or is not doing this anymore, it's like, you're in a really tight position, at least with.

Open source, you can maybe try to find someone else who is also an ODU consultant and can at least reverse engineer some things for whatever, because you would like to say, yes, you have to like continue to maintain this [00:39:00] system and invest in this for the next, you know, 10 to 20 years, et cetera, et cetera.

But realistically things happen, but it's changed. Leadership changes. People say, I don't want to do this anymore. And then you're stuck with a system that was. Configured, customized for you in 2024, and it's now 2034 and it's like no one's using it and it doesn't work. , so I do think that there is a place for open source specifically right now, because there is no one that has built a tool that is actually really good.

Everything else is you have to do this and this and this. And now you have this system that works good enough. But there was nothing that was like made for this industry. Um, a lot of financial, you know, ERP stuff, a lot of project management. And like, once we're on site, the setting, but not a lot of the full supply chain, the logistics, the transportation, like I said, the yard [00:40:00] management, because you also have the yard management, like when something is ready to be delivered to site.

Like it can't sit in the factory because you have to make other stuff, but it's not ready to go to site yet because the site prep isn't ready. So like that kind of, so there's no system for that right now. So I have, I look at tools and I say, well, this was made for this industry, but the functionality works.

Yeah. Yeah. So, so that's what we've been looking at. But, yeah, as a review, I always like to give at least an actionable takeaway. If you are pre rev to 40 to 50 million, depending on business complexity, I would look at dynamics. Um, Microsoft Dynamics, Business Central, Markov, if you are doing big, industrial, heavy machinery, , and then Acumatica, I have been told by some manufacturers that once they get to like a hundred million in revenue and it's like, Oh, we're growing out of this.

[00:41:00] And, I actually have a client that we're kicking off in March. They are startup, semiconductor, manufacturing company here in Atlanta. They have investors, they have like clear plans for very quick growth. Mm-Hmm. . And he came right off the bat. The CEOI was like, I need you to help me choose between SAP and Oracle.

And I was like, oh. Big money. Yeah. I just talked to a startup the other day too. They're like, Oh yeah, , we're implementing NetSuite. And I'm like, wow. Okay. Yeah. And they don't have projects yet, but they're, I even asked him, I was like, are you sure? And then when he went through like everything they needed to do once the factory was up and running, I was like, yeah.

You know, the complexity is there, the need is there. And there are things that when I talk to like Microsoft Dynamics system integrators, I remember a guy told me a couple of weeks ago, I was like, yeah, I need it to do, I need it to look at the market to [00:42:00] warehouse mapping. And I need it to roll up all of these markets to this warehouse, but also to this distributor.

And he said, this is an SAP. Yeah, it's not going to do all that. It's not going to do that, but you can do that in Excel. So, so there, there is a battle, never die. Yeah, no, absolutely not. It will keep being the side supporter of all the, hopefully if you're using the right systems, it shouldn't be your main thing running your business, but it will always be the thing that bolts on or off or whatever, right?

That everybody can see the original low coat, no coat tool. Yeah. I'm like, dude, like Excel, it is getting, there is more coding stuff that you can do, but it's the original low code, no codes, the original database. And it is the great for startup tools. If you're starting up there, like you start with Excel, you start with Google Sheets, there's no need to, I have a startup proposal that I just sent out last night and, I was like, part [00:43:00] of it is I can set you, like, we can build out an Excel inventory model for you.

Like, that's all you need right now. You don't have customer orders. You don't have customers. You just, you're just getting product. Get started with Excel. There's no reason for you to go buy automation and to buy tools right now. Right. And I guess it's very different if you're getting investors and building a whole factory yourself.

As the beginning of your business versus starting to make a product with the contract manufacturer and then kind of growing in stages after that. Right? Right. So for, um, we talk about automation, right? It's automation ladies. But when you say automation and I say automation, sometimes we mean the same thing.

Sometimes we don't. Just like supply chain, right? Automation is a big word. There's a lot more of it now in like software than, but we've, I traditionally come from this factory automation hardware. Let's, like you said, robots, but I've never really dealt with robots either. It's easier to say than, Oh, you know, custom Cartesian systems [00:44:00] that move things from point A to point B.

But automation in the manufacturing world has been around for a long time. There's still not enough of it. You're seeing, obviously, on the startup side, I'm assuming that companies are planning for more automation from the get go now than they were in the past, right? Yeah. Is that something that at least my customer base, but I am very specific in working with companies who have that as a North star.

Yeah. Okay. That makes, makes sense. That's probably so, so my, so my little world might not be representative of, you know, a larger industry, but I specifically work with, even at a startup, even if you're a small business, like ultimately, you know, that. Technology is going to take you there. And whether that's I.

O. T. Whether that's software, whether that's hardware, whether it's having things talk to each other, whether that's robotics, whatever it is, you know that [00:45:00] you might not need it now, but also to get there, you have to have the foundations. So people come to me specifically to saying. I'm still on 1. 0, but I would like to be ready for 2.

0. What do I need to get there? I had a client tell me last year, he was like, we're not there until I walk in, I flip a switch. And like the entire company runs, like the computers to the laptops, to the mobile phones, like to everything. So like they didn't have a lot of automation, but that was the North Star.

So I. I would like to think that maybe it's not just my world where people are thinking about what are all of the ways that we can leverage technology, whether it's hardware, software, but that is absolutely what my experience is. But we're also. specifically targeting people with that vision and with that desire.

Yeah. And I would think it's very smart of you because if people don't have that as a North star at [00:46:00] this point, I would be in business to pay you anything, after the few years. And then also who would be starting a business today or have an early stage business. That isn't focused on leveraging automation.

I would be very surprised if anybody out there is getting any kind of funding or, you know, being able to really start something now, which is a nice place to be sometimes with a blank slate. But speaking of automation, so another big part of automation and the scary part of the word that, you know, it's kind of been controversial is that it replaces people.

Uh, right. And I think in this case, when we're building and designing businesses from scratch to utilize automation, it's a very different story because we're not going to be hiring, you know, 20 operators that then we're going to fire and put in a robot where I would hope not. How are these companies looking at developing their workforce to be ready for automation?

So unfortunately, I don't think that people are [00:47:00] putting enough focus on developing the workforce. We actually specifically have a workforce development and training service offering to where we're trying to lead with that over consulting and advisory because in a perfect world, , in my perfect world, I would go into a consulting engagement and a company would sit their resources alongside me and I would teach them what I know and they would get it.

 But in the real world, what's happening is I need this done now. I need you to come and do it. So I started to lead with, we're going to do a training. And I'm going to teach you the principles. So data, you know, advanced manufacturing, like all of these, what are the different types of automation? What does IOT mean?

What is supply? When I say digital supply chain, what does that mean? Like, I'm only going to do that piece of it to [00:48:00] train your people. And there are tons of workforce development, grants out there right now, especially in the U. S. through the infrastructure bill, the chips act, et cetera, really building out us manufacturing the state of California.

I know for sure. And the state of Texas right now literally have, if you are a manufacturer and you have a workforce development plan, submit us that plan and we will reimburse you the money for the training cost, and it can be anything. under the sun that it takes to run and grow a manufacturing company.

So communication and leadership was on it. Um, sales strategy. So, you know, automation, digitalization, like it's anything they're really looking to develop out, us manufacturers and build that workforce development and training because like the statistics show people are entering the workforce.

At a lower rate than they are retiring from the workforce in both manufacturing and construction, so it's not even like it kind of [00:49:00] is a people replacement in that, like, people are leaving and we have to replace them. So, we need the automation to do it because there are not new people that are coming in houses to live in.

Please, like, we need all the things we need to make. We need to keep making. Yes, we need to keep making stuff. , so anyway, we've really been focusing, like I said, I'm going to vote like any inbound stuff. I get to for consulting. Yes, I take it as a lead, but the outbound is really been focusing on workforce development and training and there's so much need.

That there will never be enough state programs. There will never be enough resources at the MEPs. There will never be enough. I don't want to say never right now, like right now in like in 2024 2025 there is more need than people who. Effectively create trainings [00:50:00] and do what I do that is not like, hey, come take my on demand training course that is this general lean or six sigma and you get a certification like we need people who can go in and do workforce development and say, this is how you do the job today.

This is how you do the job tomorrow. This is not the best practices of Lean Six Sigma. Like, no, if I need you to know how to do this, if I need you to know how to move product and to use an ERP system, because ERPs are not, it's not like your email where you just kind of like go in and do it. Right, they're not a user friendly DIY.

Yes, and I'm like, what is this? Yeah, what do you mean? That's what this does. That's not what the title of this link is. So like you need people to know how to do it. And there aren't a lot of training programs that are like, okay, let me come in and show you how to do this job. Yeah. And like, that is that.

So, I have been trying to [00:51:00] focus more on that because I think if you give people the out to say, We can do it or you can do it, they're going to say you just do it because that solves their immediate pain, but it doesn't solve that. They don't have the people to do so. Like, yeah, I can do it now. But then when I go away, who's going to keep doing it.

So I, I started taking that off the table more and saying, I'm happy to come in and train your people. And then if at that point, you still want to do a long term consulting engagement, because maybe I've gotten someone really excited. Maybe someone wants. to sit alongside with me. And now they're like asking to do it as opposed to being told to do it.

And then leadership can kind of figure out how to really embed that knowledge. But I think that if we leave it up to them, then they're just gonna keep paying the consultants and it doesn't solve the long term problem. Yeah, I see a big parallel with that with Allie's work in controls. So her company Processing Controls Engineering offers SCADA support [00:52:00] services.

They design, do electrical panel design and all these different things. And sometimes they come in and work on existing systems. Sometimes they design and spec and install a new system. But one of Allie's sort of main things is always to make sure that the operators of whoever is going to be using this system, A, get input before it.

Becomes fully commissioned because they need to know how to use it and they're going to sabotage the success of this if they don't like it. Right? Whether they do it intentionally or not, if it's just, if it's not built for them to be able to use, they're not going to use it. Yeah, that was 1 of the 1st things that I learned 1 of my 1st industrial engineering.

 Professors told us a case study about how like, you know, the consultants built it out, but then the people didn't like it. So then they sabotaged it, whether consciously or, you know, unconsciously, but yeah, it has to be built for the people. It's better when it's built with them because they have buy in and they feel like they have ownership in it.

Uh, so yeah. And that's [00:53:00] something that whether it's processing controls or even an Excel model, People, people are people and they're going to want to do what they want to do and you have to communicate what's in it for me and they have to buy into that in order to actually do things, which is what, like the training, you can tell why.

Like why is this important and not why is it important for the business, but why is it also important for you as an individual in your career and what you want to do? No, that's so true. Uh, yeah. And so she makes places a big emphasis also on training so that when it times comes time to make some changes or do some updates or support or whatever maintenance, like hopefully the people there are trained well enough to do it themselves up to a certain point.

And then her company is available. If needed, but I feel like a lot of other people take the model of, well, I'm going to keep the knowledge to myself so that you will have to pay me to come back. Right? And I think that that's something that. You know, it's [00:54:00] very like scale straining. You think you want all the business, but then if you're really growing as a company, like you don't necessarily want, yeah, for me, I think my hypothesis is if I train enough people, because as we mentioned, there's so much opportunity, there's so much need.

If I train enough people the right way, they're going to tell all of their other manufacturing leaders and send me more business. So do my best. Interest to, , really set people up for success. So they will go see my phrases and send me more business. Right, right. So does that, like you said, the programs in there's California and Texas, as long as you have a workforce development plan for that particular area, you can apply.

Do you help companies develop the plan as well, or do you expect them to have the plan in place? And then I do not expect them to have no, it is, it is very much like for free as part of the sales process. Cause it doesn't take me a [00:55:00] long time. Like I've done this inside and out. I am a certified teacher.

I know how to do training and facility. I'm a certified and a plan trainer. Like I can train. So I know how many people you have. We do a quick like 30, 000 foot view. I know what the course modules are. It's literally a call. And then I think you have to do the actual application. But training model.

I mean, the courses are set up. In our increments, you can do it virtually. You can do it like it's really set up to where you pick the menu. And then that's what you tell the state. You're going to do very cool. I think we'll try to come up with some links for these programs to put on the automation.

Ladies resources page, or at least maybe something under your profile. Because I think that there might be people listening to this that don't know about these. And from what, at least from the state of California, what they said was. Once your plan is approved, like the money is [00:56:00] ready to deploy, it's two to four weeks to get the funding.

Wow, for any kind of government program, that sounds so So like this is ready, at least for the state of California, like it's ready to go. A couple of weeks ago was when they did the webinar to essentially say like, please submit your training plans. So that we can give you money for it. I have someone from my team looking to see what she can find with other states.

Like I said, I got an email that the University of Texas at El Paso, which I believe is where the Texas MEP sits. They are also doing like something similar. And I think that I briefly saw something from Florida. But I would imagine that if it's not like, , there is something for workforce development and within the manufacturing space.

Everywhere. It's just a matter of sitting down to, you know, really figure out where it is. But absolutely, I will share the links that I have. And, maybe it's something that we [00:57:00] continue to update. Yeah, we can continue to talk about it. Then we can continue to create, you know, a database for different states.

Yeah, because there is, I mean, I was just at a training class a couple weeks ago in Dallas for, OT networking. Um, we have a subject matter expert. His name is Josh Varghese. He's been, you know, doing that for about 15 years. , has his own consultant, consultancy now, but he's again, he's only, you know, it's a small company and yes, you can pay them by the hour.

But you can also, he does a lot better training people to then only call him when, they get past that level of knowledge. And I see that as a huge way to scale a small company, um, is by training your customers to be successful on their own. And then they're going to want to come to you and pay you even more because you've given them the tools to be successful up to a certain point.

Right. Um, but yeah, I would be really interested to see if we can. Talk about this more, I'm going to look into it more and I'm going to see, as we learn about more states, because I'm guessing [00:58:00]this is probably this is federal coming from the chips act. And then each state decides how they implement it.

 That's my understanding. Yeah. But some, some of it also comes from, like, the Department of energy. Okay, and it's focused on, manufacturers in, you know, the renewable energy space or, in solar panel manufacturing., but the EPA. Also, there is funding for, you know, supply chain and manufacturing through there for, reduced emissions for the building.

And if you have a sustainability focus there, , it's all federal, but it comes from different agencies and then the states apply for the funding or the state organizations apply for the funding and then they funnel it through their local manufacturers. That's the paper trail that I've understood.

Yeah, and it definitely takes people like you to kind of figure this out and come with an offering that says, Hey, you can do this. And this is how, because most people that are running a business, I mean, they don't have time to go looking at all these webinars from different government agencies and like, yes, promise of money, [00:59:00] but we're going to make it really hard and confusing to figure out how to get said money.

Exactly. And so, again, we don't have time for that, right? Well, speaking of time, looks like we're up on time. I'm trying to keep this time box a little bit here. So I'm going to ask our last question. Bye. What do you have coming up, if anything that you want to share in the next, you know, short term, and where can people follow you, connect with you, learn from you, contact you if they want to get involved with, LinkedIn.

I, I am a LinkedIn girly. So, um, this is regular CSP. Certified supply chain professional. I am on LinkedIn all the time. It's on my phone. It will come to me. I will say, Hey guys, I'm going on vacation. I'm not going to respond to messages, but that's a lie. I will respond to messages. So LinkedIn is definitely the best place to find me and what I have coming up just really focusing on getting [01:00:00] the book done, continuing to research.

I'm trying to talk to, as many construction modular and even. Even not even like prefab and modular construction companies, but building materials, flooring, windows, like people who supply for the construction industry, because they're part of the supply chain. And, you know, we're trying to figure out how to solve these communication gaps.

And movement of material and things like that. So really spending as much time as possible. Focusing on that. I've been trying to figure out and talking with our knowledge partner over at SCM Dojo to see if there's a way that they can pick up the. Operational aspect of the training because with the consulting clients that we have and the book, it's just, uh, there's only so many hours in the day.

So I don't because I recognize that there is the need for the workforce development, the training. I want to continue to do it. I don't [01:01:00] want to turn people away and say that I don't have bandwidth that the team doesn't have bandwidth. Yeah, but we don't. So I'm trying to find a knowledge partner that is still within the educational and, , the educational and training space that can really do the execution and then we can come in as needed to, like, come in and physically do the trainings or do the virtual trainings because none of it is, On demand, you can log in and do it like there are plenty of other solutions for that.

If you need to actually learn something and have live Q and A, that's when you come to us. So, just really focusing on how can we continue to touch as many factors, as many manufacturers as possible without turning people away. So. Yeah, very cool. Well, we'll make sure to put links to your current and future endeavors.

Hopefully we can keep your automation. Ladies guest profile kind of up to date. , I'll be continuing to follow you and your content on linkedin. I really appreciate you on my feed. So, [01:02:00] yeah, thank you so much for coming on the show. Thank you for sharing all this amazing information with us. I really look forward to.

Sharing that with some people that I know and if you're hearing this on the show, and you are able to Take advantage of any of this workforce development stuff. Please let us reach out happy to help To share whatever I have found sounds good. Well, thank you. I have a wonderful rest of your wednesday.

All righty. You too. Thanks Bye. Bye