83. Should You Sell Your Business?

"If you're a solopreneur, and you're experiencing burnout, you are going to make a mistake–and it's going to cost you dearly." Are you thinking of selling your business? Should you? Where do you start, what happens if you do? All these questions and more are answered on today's episode. 

How does the sale of your business help you accomplish your longterm vision? This is the question we dissect. We want you to ask the right questions when you're thinking of making this big decision. 

Key Takeaways:

• Lies you might be telling yourself when you wonder if you should sell
• How does the sale of my business help me accomplish my longterm vision? 
• Key questions to ask yourself when you're considering selling
• Next steps in selling your business

There are many reasons why you might want to sell your business. Kevin's personal journey of selling his business was long and arduous and full of experience that overflows in his advice today. We delve into the nuances of preparing for the future, emphasizing the power of a 'freedom fund' and the significance of your reason for selling.

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Connect with Big A and Wally:
View From The Top Website: https://www.viewfromthetop.com/
The Climb Newsletter: https://www.viewfromthetop.com/climb
Big A’s Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aaronwalkerviewfromthetop/
Wally’s Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kevinwallenbeck/

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:00

Hey everybody, welcome back to View From the Top podcast, where we help growth-minded men who desire momentum in their business, their family and their finance get through the valleys and up the mountain to their very own View From the Top.

Speaker 1: 0:13

Hey, we've got a really cool year and year to my heart, mostly because it's just been recent. In the last few years, the experience that I've been going through of selling my own business and big a landed on a top lands on a topic today that I think whether, no matter where you're at in business, if you're thinking of selling, uh, you know now you're like in this, starting this process, if you're in the middle of your of your business career and been a few years and you're building it and it's growing and there's still some nuggets in here, how you can prepare for the future appropriately and, man, if you're just starting out, there's some things you can do and how you think about your business going forward. You're going to learn today in this episode where we talk about, uh, selling a business and we're going to deep dive into that and so, with that, let's get the host with the most here, let's get big a in the studio with us. Big A, welcome.

Speaker 2: 1:03

Wally, this is my favorite time of the year. You know why I don't it's fishing time, man, this is my season. This is when I get to spend some time on the water. Get out there early. Somebody asked me the other day I've been on vacation, I got a little sun. I said no, I've been on the lake my favorite time of the year. I love to get out there. Yeah, I got to get you out there.

Speaker 1: 1:26

You keep saying that, but you don't like people coming fishing with you because you like to be on the phone. I don't say I don't like it, it's kind of my, I know I get on the phone and call everybody. I know you're just joking.

Speaker 2: 1:41

If I wanted to go, if I asked what? 10 minutes apart and you live closer to the water than I do.

Speaker 1: 1:45

The lake's closer to me than it is to you, I know.

Speaker 2: 1:47

I know I need to get over there with you, man. I'm just curious about something how far ahead do you plan?

Speaker 1: 1:57

Like for what?

Speaker 2: 1:58

Like in any area of your life. Let's just say personally how far in advance.

Speaker 1: 2:07

Do you plan? You got to give me more context, like because there's a lot of different things in my life.

Speaker 2: 2:13

Okay, so how far in advance? Like I started thinking about not making great strides, but I started thinking about even retirement at age 18 because I had a couple of guys in my life that said, hey, this is important and I haven't done a great job with it. I've done an okay job with it, but I did start planning for it. Then Some people that may be listening to us today are like 40 and they hadn't even thought about it. Like, where did you start thinking about, maybe, retirement? Let's just use that as an example.

Speaker 1: 2:47

How far in advance.

Speaker 2: 2:48

Do you plan?

Speaker 1: 2:49

I haven't honestly like I mean I shouldn't say honestly, Frankly I don't like the word retirement, like I just I think more like freedom funds. That's how I think about it. Right, because I just can't see not doing anything Like when you think about it. Right, because I just can't see not doing anything Like when you think about retirement.

Speaker 2: 3:09

I know every definition of retirement may be different, but yeah, let's don't go into the definition of it, all, right, well, that's important. It's important to know that. Right, because of the order, because what we just went through, right, okay, so did I plan when did I start planning for the future, like if I wanted to? Retire.

Speaker 1: 3:27

Right, there you go, man. Probably not until 2000. So I'm 51, probably about 14 years ago.

Speaker 2: 3:35

Okay, yeah, started being on your radar.

Speaker 1: 3:37

Yeah, Like before that all the money was going into building the business. So 35 years old.

Speaker 2: 3:43

Is that safe to say?

Speaker 1: 3:45

Yeah, where I actively started saving outside of building the business. So, 35 years old, is that safe to say yeah, when I actively started saving outside of building a business. So people, it's interesting People say they'll often say well, they'll say well, you know, my parents said this right, Like I love my parents. But the very, very blue collar jobs, very much like hey, you've got to save way ahead, right, Because it's going to come before you know. And all that For me, when I was building a business and putting money and equity and time back into the business, I was very intentional about building something that had value. So for me, I was thinking about the future in that way, but it wasn't for, like you know, typical 401k. I wasn't into real estate at that time, those kinds of things, but definitely younger, but definitely very specifically toward building business for value, not building up my 401k.

Speaker 2: 4:34

Yeah, I think it would be safe to say that you're a planner. Just by nature, just by your personality, you're a planner. It really heightened my awareness to this question. The reason I wanted to kind of start out today's episode even talking about this is because Robin and I are at an age now that's way different than anything that we've ever been exposed to in regards to planning for future funds or future freedom, whatever you called it a while ago. It's like for the first time it's dawned on me that my inner circle like a dozen couples all but one has retired and we're thinking through, like, what does that look like for us in the future? And we're kind of on the lower end of the age demographic for our friends. Like the majority of them are 64 to 67, right, robin and I are 63, 62. Those are young chickens. Yeah, we're young, we're young, but we are kind of there. It's the people we do life with. And so when I started thinking through some of our planning in regards to looking at our budget closer, looking at any expenses that we have, it heightened my thoughts to ask the question how far in advance should we start preparing for different areas of our life? And so, yeah, I was just curious, as we start this out, this episode out today, just asking the question like, are you a good planner? Because there's so many people that I'm around today they don't even have a thought of tomorrow, much less the future. You know, it's like they're not even thinking about some of those things.

Speaker 2: 6:11

And as we get into kind of today's episode, it's about selling our business and Robin and I have talked about that. You know a view from the top. What does that look like? What are we going to do? And I've been confronted with that topic numbers of times over the course of my career but yeah, I just wanted to talk about that today is like, should I sell my business? Because a lot of the people that were around in our community are really thinking through that. They're like, hey, is this something I should do? Should I keep it? You know what is the journey that I'm on. Should I keep it? You know what is the journey that I'm on?

Speaker 2: 6:45

And I always thought quite honestly at the very onset of my career that once I sold a business and I'm going to take you way back I thought when I sold that business, hey, I'm going to be a lot more relaxed, I'm going to be a lot happier, I'm going to be much more content than I currently am today, once I sell this business. This is the story I was telling myself and I'll be honest with you when I sold that first business, it was amazing for a little while. It really was. I was like man, this is so cool. I'm a young guy, I've sold a business and then I discovered that tomorrow just brought a whole new set of challenges. I'm like, hey, welcome back to reality, like you're back to earth now. And the new really kind of wore off quickly. I mean it did. It didn't really do for me what I thought it was going to do. It didn't scratch the itch like I thought it was going to do.

Speaker 2: 7:42

And then, as we've gone through this process, being around other entrepreneurs, what I've really discovered is the real question should be how does the sale of my business help me accomplish my long-term vision? And I was really exposed to this probably 20, 25 years ago, when guys around me were saying what is your vision? And I'm like what do you mean? I just want bigger and more and shinier. It's like what do you mean? They're like no, you've got to develop a strategy for your life. You've got to have kind of a written vision. And then in Iron Sharpens Iron, we've really focused on that right for the past decade.

Speaker 2: 8:21

Now, and when I started thinking through some of these questions that I get asked on a regular basis from a lot of my clients and a lot of people in ISI, I thought it would be kind of cool to do this episode and look at a few things. One is what are some of the reasons that we may want to sell our business? Like, let's kind of dive into that. Maybe we could uncover a few next steps that we need to do in order to sell our business. And then, finally, the most important question is is how is selling my business going to improve the quality of life? And so I thought it'd be fun to just kind of dive into that a little bit today. And, wally, I know you sold a business back in 2019. You did really well Kind of unpack that for us. What was your ultimate goal? Why did you sell it? Why didn't you just keep it and continue running it? What was the catalyst for?

Speaker 1: 9:16

you selling man? That's a loaded question, pegay. Yes, I did. Uh, the business that I had started in 2003 uh sold that in 2019. Um, for me, in my situation, I had a minority partner uh, slightly minority, uh, but I still had. He was 18 years my senior and at 47, and he was in his early 60s. I couldn't. I had a challenge getting him to look at what succession looked like.

Speaker 1: 9:55

Things were going really well in the business. We were very profitable. We were in an industry. We basically did marketing and websites for RV dealerships, which is pretty niche, but it was very lucrative and did a good job. You know, we built a great product in the industry and we had a lot of what you would call household names in the industry as clients, as clients and so. But we just kind of came to a point in our partnership where I was like man looking ahead. We were on the fourth version. In 2018, we launched the fourth version of our product. So, from 2003, we had four revisions of our product. 2013 was a complete rewrite, had four revisions of our product. 2013 was a complete rewrite. It cost me over a million dollars to do that over a few years, all said and done, but we had a great product.

Speaker 1: 10:55

But I also knew that there was some pretty big players in the industry that we weren't the largest, we were the second largest in the industry as far as, like, who we were serving. It was a competitor we had that was bigger by numbers and volume and customers and dollars. For sure they were bigger, but they had a lot of money behind them. They were in multiple industries and I was just like man we really need to be thinking about how we're reinvesting for the future in the business.

Speaker 1: 11:30

And my partner was at a place where he's like, no, no, no, I mean he hadn't had any, he hadn't planned for the future very well, actually, he tried. He had some mistakes and stuff that happened. Some of it was, you know, on him and some of it wasn't, and so this was his exit plan, right the business, on him and some of it wasn't, and so this was his exit plan right the business, and um, and we were making really good money, like I said. So, uh, he's like man, I could just kind of, you know, ride this out kind of a thing, and and he was still working. But uh and I don't mean this any disrespect at all um, but uh, and I expect this is going to change for me too, but things change. I've noticed that things seem to change when you hit your early 60s, like whether it's actual cognitive function or whether it's like desire, or just you're freaking tired Like I haven't been there yet. I think it's a combination of all three.

Speaker 2: 12:19

I can attest to that, but it's a reality, right?

Speaker 1: 12:21

I mean it's a reality. It is reality and you can ignore it all you want Sure it is, and that's what my partner was doing. It doesn't change the reality, and so I knew that wasn't going to be a good long-term plan. So I had started to try to figure out how to buy him out or find a minority partner, and God clearly brought along an opportunity to sell into our industry.

Speaker 1: 12:42

I'd looked at other opportunities in the past that I wasn't interested in. I was interested in the product and the people that we had in previous sale opportunities were really about just the, the dollars, the business, and they were just kind of merging companies. So, anyway, having that opportunity to sell sitting here now today, some of the things we're going to get into some of this in a little bit, but some of the things that I believed to be true whether I convinced myself or whether I never didn't get enough information were untrue. Let me give you one example. I was pretty convinced in my own mind that our competition with their money and their size was going to be able to bring like the next stage of product into the marketplace that financially I could not compete with, and I believe that, and the reason I believe that was because I knew what it took to develop software and build these things and and I'm like man, if I have to buy my partner out and develop the next, be working on the next, you know, product.

Speaker 2: 14:02

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 14:03

Iteration of the product, like I don't know if I can weather that financially, like that would be. That'd create a lot of stress.

Speaker 2: 14:09

So that's a prudent business decision the way.

Speaker 2: 14:12

I see it, I thought so too I felt a little bit when you were describing it, as you were fear-based, but the reality is you didn't have the resources to compete with that person in the industry, and you had two sizable, you know possible expenditures related to the reiteration and buying out the partner, and I feel like, personally, you made the right choice, and, unless there is a third option I hate to bring this up, but there could have been, you know, a capital contribution made from a private equity, or there could have been other opportunities to get additional resources if you wanted to. Looking back now, though, are you convinced you made the right decision or do you wish that you still had it back?

Speaker 1: 15:00

I don't wish I had this vision back in, like 2015, where I had this vision where, because of how we were set up in the marketplace, we had the best. I'm not going to go into the whole thing of why this is this way, but we had the best set of what I call RV data, so information about all the RVs. The manufacturers in the RV space are very disjointed. They don't coordinate or collaborate a lot, so collecting all that data and putting it into one spot in a reliable format is very difficult. So we actually started doing that in 2006 and we had a whole catalog of all the stuff. Um, like, we sold data to RV sharecom anyway. So back in 2015, I had this vision of, like man, what if we could position ourselves to become RV one data where literally everyone in the industry was coming to us for this thing. Like, if we, if we, if we positioned ourselves in that way where we provided the data and the infrastructure for delivery in such a way that was seamless to them, Like there's that that takes a lot of boxes off, right For a lot of companies, and so, anyway, that was a vision. We worked towards some of that that that 2018 version of our product had the foundational components for all that. And then you know, we sold and all that.

Speaker 1: 16:28

So our the private equity company that bought us bought our other competitors all about the same time. Like I knew that was going on. Like they were, they were consolidating. That was part of the part of the reason for selling. And but I found out six months ago from some of the folks that still work there uh, the most of them do they're, they're good people, they uh that's exactly what happened. These other companies had not updated their systems at all, had not done iterations, and so they were so far in the rabbit hole on their technology. They had technology expiring from the manufacturer before they could update their products. So you know what happened, Guess what? There's some version of our product that we created. It's not called RV1 Data and it's called something else. It does exactly that, and so it's like.

Speaker 1: 17:31

It's like I had it I had it and it still did Right yeah.

Speaker 2: 17:34

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: 17:35

So that's kind of like fun on one side, but the other side of is like oh man, now I should have pitched that.

Speaker 2: 17:49

That would have been the pitch, but yeah, we'll talk about some other reasons why it was important for me to sell. As we talk about some of these other things. Well, you know some of the things that I think, and we'll kind of unpack this just a little bit. When I look back at the first business I sold, it wasn't even that much money, but to me at the time I was 27 years old, you know it was quite a bit of money and I felt like it gave me a sense of financial security. I was like this is going to give me. It's not going to set me up and it didn't, but it gave me a bump. It gave me a real good head start. I could go do some other things.

Speaker 2: 18:16

Did you feel as though that was one of the components, like this was giving you the sale of that business in 2019, some sense of financial security, yeah, so how much of that was a variable in your decision? As the audience is listening to us today, they're going through these things in their own mind. Yeah, right, and so for you, how much did that prove to be a variable in your decision?

Speaker 1: 18:41

Oh man, it absolutely influenced the decision. So by the time in 2019 that we were selling personally and as a business, we had no debt, zero on the books. I had no personal debt. We owned our home, our vehicles, all that stuff. We had saved for weddings. By that point, we had saved for college at that point, but I had very little.

Speaker 1: 19:10

I think I had, like I don't know, 200, 250 K and a 401k or something like that in 2019. But my business was valued at 8 million and so that was a whole different beast, right, a whole different animal. And so, like we can get in this whole story of like how it'll happen to some other episode, but when those numbers start coming in, like that, it's like that's a big deal and it's like you realize that, man, I could work at this for another five to 10 years and make this kind of money, or I could get it now, and what does that do for me and what does it do for my future? And so that played into a lot of it, but most of it, honestly, was I was frustrated with my partner and we're going to talk about this in a little bit Like I was bored.

Speaker 2: 20:05

I was bored so here's the thing. So I don't want to pour salt in a wound, but I'm gonna do it. So you, you sold it in 2019. I sold my business back, the first one in 1987 or whatever it was. It was no, no, it wasn't. It was uh, let's see, it was uh, I was 27. So, yeah, yeah, it was about late 80s. So the multiple that I'm hearing today is far greater, far, far greater than when I sold and it's greater than when you sold. So what do you say to people listening out there today that, like, some of these private equity firms are coming in and they're paying seven to 15 times epitaph and you look back now and you're like, hey, there's more financial investable capital today than's ever been and they're looking to buy these businesses? Do you look back now and say, man, I could have probably doubled?

Speaker 1: 23:17

I don't know if I in our space I don't know if I would have doubled, but I definitely could have got three or four, three or four more points higher for sure, like waiting, holding out, yeah, yeah, for sure, and that was I mean we're talking. This October will be five years, which is crazy to think.

Speaker 2: 23:34

Wow, but here's the thing. Here's the thing. I remember going through that.

Speaker 1: 23:37

That's exactly why those private equity companies hire the people they do and put the energy and investment and time into what they're doing is because they see these things coming Like that's their bet. Their bet is to buy that before you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 1: 23:53

So yeah, even if they're buying at 10 and 12 and 15 X now like they're still banking on a return right. They're still banking on that somehow. And so like they're smart people for the most part Not that they don't make mistakes, we all do. Between the amount and between just some of my thoughts what I believe that were untrue, about what might be happening with our competitors that I talked about earlier, I've had moments of like, oh man, I shouldn't have done that. But I remember how bored I was. I remember how frustrated I was. I had built a great team. They were running the business. I remember how frustrated I was. I had built a great team. They were running the business. I thought that was one of the reasons that I thought I wanted to sell was because I just didn't want to do it any longer.

Speaker 2: 24:47

You know, when I start thinking about some other reasons, we both talk about this offline. We're going to talk about it online a little bit. I was in bricks and mortar, you know, for the majority of my career, and then this is now kind of a little bit. I was in bricks and mortar, you know, for the majority of my career, and then this is now kind of a lifestyle business.

Speaker 2: 25:04

I can run this business from anywhere, it doesn't matter where I'm at. That was very appealing to me after I sold you know, the last business and I was bored Right and I was with you. It's like man, I got to do something else. And then Dan Miller and some of those guys encouraged me to start coaching and I was like he goes, man, you can do that from anywhere. You and Robin can go to Florida, you can go to the Bahamas or wherever you can still internet access the phone. You can run your business online, Like there's a lot of freedom in having a lifestyle business, there can be a lot of freedom.

Speaker 2: 25:35

If yeah, Not that you've taken advantage of that like you wanted to.

Speaker 1: 25:38

No, I haven't taken advantage as much as I should. It sounds really good. Yeah, yeah, but you're calling me out here publicly, so it's good, I need that.

Speaker 2: 25:48

You kind of had a lifestyle business even with your previous company.

Speaker 1: 25:51

We traveled often in the RV for months at a time.

Speaker 2: 25:54

Yeah, let's go back to talking about a little bit of the boredom. No-transcript it and I said well I'm leaving in two weeks and you're like two weeks Are you serious?

Speaker 2: 26:31

And I'm like man, I got to have some time away and so I'd hit the wall. I did Because I'm very into what I do and I want to work hard, but I was having some health concerns. They weren't real serious, but they were going to be serious if I didn't pay attention. And so I took a couple of months off, unplugged, and I literally unplugged. I went dark, you know social media, no email, no phone, didn't do any business, went away on a number of trips, just stayed here at home. That was a difficult time, you know.

Speaker 2: 27:02

But if I didn't do that, I was going to have to make some other hard choices, like I couldn't keep going at the pace that I was going, and that's happened to me a couple of times in my career and I wished I had had somebody that had walked with me a little closer. That would encourage me not to get to that point. And a lot of you listening to me today, you're at burnout phase and you're going to make some really bad decisions if you don't sit up and pay attention to that. So, wally, have you come close to that? Have you been at a point in your career that you like. I really need to make some changes. You already shared a little bit about some of the misalignment with your partner and you were bored. But what about from a burnout standpoint for you?

Speaker 1: 27:48

I don't know if I've ever reached a real burnout I think we're going to talk about this in a few minutes but I had my experience with like burnout type emotions and feelings and physical fatigue and all that. That actually came after the sale, trying to stay working at the company that had bought us. Like that's a little different, but those feelings of like just the grind and like going after it, I not really I I was grateful to you know I didn't do it perfectly, but uh, hired people never early enough, but hired good people, put them in the right seat, um, in the right race car, not the bus, and you know we did fairly well, and so I've kind of gotten myself out of the things that would burn me out to not quickly enough, but it happened for sure. So you can work yourself around that. I think you know people want to sell. They think they want to sell because they feel burnout.

Speaker 1: 29:00

And and if you're a solopreneur and you're burnout, like that's a big challenge for you. And I want you to listen to what big guy said earlier If you're alone, like yeah, one or two people, you're a solopreneur, you know want yourself, or one or two people and you're experiencing burnout. You are going to make a mistake and it's going to cost you dearly. And that might be your physical health, that might be your mental capabilities, that might be your marriage, that might be your kids, that might be your relationships in your community.

Speaker 2: 29:33

But we see people making really, really bad choices because of the fatigue They'll go out, and there's moral failures. There's bad financial decisions because you've reached burnout. Please don't get to that state. The other thing that I've seen a little bit of is that they want to sell because they don't know the next right step.

Speaker 1: 29:56

They're like, golly, I've reached you know, I've outpunted my coverage, Like I don't really know right.

Speaker 2: 30:02

I don't really know the next right thing to do. So what they default to is to sell the business, and I want to encourage you to get around some other really good business people that can help walk you through that. And I don't mind admitting this at all, because it's kind of the position I'm currently in in running an online business. With the size that we've become now, it's like what got us here is not going to get us to the future, and I've recognized my inabilities and I'm like we've got to get other quality people in place to fill that gap. And so there's nothing shameful about that. There's no reason to be embarrassed about that. It's being self-aware. It's exposing yourself and subjecting yourself to scrutiny of other people that you trust, that have your well-being at heart, that can say, hey, you know you've done this up to this point and that served you well. That has worked so good up until this point.

Speaker 2: 31:01

But I want to encourage you to consider this different path or having a different person in that role, because oftentimes I've been the bottleneck. I've been the person that's crimped us to the point that we can't get to that next life spot that we want to go, the thing that we hear thrown around a lot is kind of a work-life balance. Sometimes I don't know that there's really a work-life balance. We have to do certain things at different times more than others, and it can feel like we're out of balance, if you will, but I think it's doing the right things for the right reason and letting everything else go. So I think it's identifying the things that are important in your life.

Speaker 2: 31:47

Wally, you've done a really, really good job and I've watched you up close and watched you from afar really kind of dial into that, because you know me, I'm a light switch, I'm on or off, and it's like I need people around me to go hey, light switch, I'm on or off, and it's like I need people around me to go, hey, you need to take some time off. You need to slow that down, kind of heighten everyone's awareness to some of the things that you've done in that space. That makes you pay attention to a little more balanced lifestyle rather than just being all in or all out.

Speaker 1: 32:19

I'm going to try to keep this to. You know, we're talking about around selling a business and that idea that people think they want to sell because they want, you know, more time, and I think that that I mean that for me that wasn't like one of my reasons. Like, ah, I'm going to have a bunch of time, I don't have to. You know, do this, I can. I talked with a guy uh it, it, uh the iron sharpens iron uh live event a few weeks ago and uh, he has a very interesting I love these little niche I shouldn't say little. I mean it's multimillion dollar business and these, these niche businesses that like just create cool value in the in the world and so his business actually like does staffing for, like robotics, testing facilities, like of all things. Like this little niche thing Right, thing Right.

Speaker 1: 33:20

But he's found himself in some of the positions you're talking about where he's come up against the ceiling of what he's able to do, you know, effectively in his business. So he's starting to look at new roles and he has a major conviction toward his family. He literally wants to, he wants to, he's doing this. So he is transitioning from being, you know, his role as founder CEO, everything right, getting new team members in place. He bought a farm because he wants to raise his kids on a farm and so he's making some very clear choices about should he sell, Should he not sell Right.

Speaker 1: 33:59

And I think what he's leaning to right now is we've been talking through it with him and a bunch of other in his, in his group, guys in his group that is there a way to staff that, to help that fund, that his lifestyle right, to get the balance, to get the things he wants to do. So people think that they sell, they take those resources and do that, which isn't necessarily a bad thing. But I will tell you from experience those resources that you get when you sell. This actually happened to me, so I sold in 2019. Well, what happened? Between the last three or four years, prices on everything have skyrocketed.

Speaker 1: 34:40

And so, like I sat on my money for you know a little about a year and then start investing it, and then, as I started investing it and buying some real estate and stuff, you know I'm buying at prices that are inflated higher than the money that I earned when I sold. And so you realize the buying power that you have of money. When you sell it can be good, but it's not the same and you lose that income in the same way. That's coming in in a healthy business, right, that's feeding the beast, and so it's a different mindset and it can create balance, if you will Like. It can create a little more harmony. We talked about harmony and hustle. It takes a little more harmony on the family side, but it can create a whole lot of chaos in your head too, to where it knocks you off balance. So I would say, like from a I think I want to sell because I want more work-life balance. I'd really dive into that Like there's something under the covers there, if you will that.

Speaker 1: 35:46

Yeah, yeah, exactly Like that's, I think, my my. For that specific reason, there's usually a solution. It's just that people don't want to hire other people for multiple reasons. Right, I don't want to spend the money. More people means more problems, All those things are. But if you really look at what you want to accomplish in the vision that you're going after, most people can make that work, look at the underlying currents that are there and try to resolve those.

Speaker 2: 36:15

You know we hear every scenario because we're in the mastermind. You know we have, you know, 130 or 40 guys from all over the country and we're hearing all these stories all the time about and we're having these discussions just weekly, daily, with guys that are really thinking about selling their business or scaling, they're growing their business, and some of the guys have said some of the things like you did, like I'm bored, and it's like, well, that's a good thing. Sometimes it's like, hey, you've built great systems and processes. You're building is, you know, find something else that you can do, continue to use that revenue. When I look back on some of the businesses that I've had because I was bored, I was really desirous of a new challenge I look back now and go, that was stupid. I should have hired somebody and got the right person. I could have owned the business and not been hands-on, but I didn't think anybody could do it like big A, like I can get in there, and I look back and I go man, I worked hard to build this and I could have taken a few steps, hired somebody, a business coach, got in a mastermind figured out how to maintain that business without me actually doing the work.

Speaker 2: 37:21

So think about it when you go to sell your business. Am I running from something? Is it maybe the business is declining or the business performance is not really what I want it to be? And is this? Am I running from that? Or am I willing to face the music, maybe to continue a really good quality business? Get somebody else in that seat?

Speaker 2: 37:43

Financial hard times that is something that we all bump up against. You know we have challenges in our business. Many times people sell the business for quick cash. It's like man, I got to get out of this hole. And they go dump the business and then they go oh my gosh, I spent five or 10 years building that business. I got a little cash, I got to reprieve right now. But then reality sets in and you've got a long time to live ahead of you and you've got to build something else. And so, wally, you ever had that thought along the way. 18 years running this company oh, this is hard times. I could sell it, get a little cash and then I would be on the easy street.

Speaker 1: 38:21

I never thought that, but I hear it all the time. I was on a call about six months ago and is pretty common, where the guy owns a small manufacturing company and he's struggling, right, he just he just bought it out from like his dad, I think, and he's trying to figure it out, like there's a season of figuring it out. There's that little seed that's in the back of your mind. That's like, man, if I just sold it and got out from under the stress and pressure, it's affecting my marriage, it's affecting my time with my kids. I'm telling you right now, owning a business, being an entrepreneur, being a business leader in a space, I'm just telling you right now, I have not seen and you can shoot me on this, I know there's four-hour work weeks and all that crazy stuff.

Speaker 2: 39:10

It's not been my experience. I'm just saying it's not been my experience.

Speaker 1: 39:15

And it is. It's actually why we have Iron Sharpens, Iron it's a lot of it, right Is helping. Guys, look at the whole man, the five pillars of transformation, so that on this journey of entrepreneurship and business ownership, that we're not so focused on one thing that the other things fall to the wayside and we find ourself in a ditch that to dig out of would be super expensive, financially, emotionally, relationally, all that. But this guy that has a small manufacturing company, like literally his thought process. He kept going back to like well, I can just, you know, if I, if I could just sell it. I'm like do you have a buyer? It's like like, no, like, like that.

Speaker 1: 39:58

We start to trick ourselves and thinking like, well, somebody would want to buy it. Like, you know, it's gotta be worth something. I'll talk to another guy that owned a flooring company. Same thing he was getting burnt out, he's getting older, he's doing a lot of work himself, he's had some help, he's too benevolent, he's been too benevolent with his help, and so he's got himself in a bind financially and he's like, man, it's gotta be worth something, I can sell it for something. And then you start that's not a solution, honestly, like, first of all, no one's going to buy your solopreneur business that relies on you, unless they're going to do exactly what you're doing, and most people that buy businesses don't do that. Not that there aren't folks that you know buy something and go in and do the same thing you are, but reality is they could just start it and they wouldn't have all your problems that you've got Right.

Speaker 1: 40:49

Right, all the debt you've accumulated, yeah, right.

Speaker 2: 40:52

Yeah, I think the. I think the lesson here for all of us, including you and I, is don't lie to yourself. Yeah, like, be open, go go into your peers, your colleagues, people you trust you know, get, get, hey, come join us, get an iron sharpens iron Can we talk about?

Speaker 1: 41:09

yeah, can we talk real quick about, like, who that isn't? I see so many guys that, like I know this sounds really silly. It's probably a 45 year old taking business advice from his mom.

Speaker 2: 41:23

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 41:24

That hasn't done a lick of business in her life. She's a great person. Yeah, she's never, or your bowling buddy that works nine to five at the factory.

Speaker 2: 41:34

Right.

Speaker 1: 41:36

There's nothing wrong with him working nine to five at the factory, but his scope of experience and his ability to speak in your situation.

Speaker 2: 41:41

Can't do it.

Speaker 1: 41:41

Is not giving you. Actually, it's not even advice. You know the best people say all the time well, you know, give people a vote. It's not about advice. It's about someone actually knowing to ask you the questions that you need to be answering. That's the difference. The right questions, yes.

Speaker 2: 41:59

Yeah, you know. The other thing they don't have Wally as a rule, is they don't have context. They don't know anything about your background. They don't know anything about your background. They don't know anything about your vision, your goals. They don't have insight to your financial wherewithal. They don't know anything about your superpowers or your kryptonite or your blind spots. They don't know anything about that. And we go and ask them a question hey, should I sell my business? And it's like, well, yeah, if you can get this much money go sell.

Speaker 2: 42:26

Yeah, and it's like, and then we go do that and it doesn't work out and we're like, why didn't it? Well, because you ask advice to the wrong person, and so be mindful of the people that you ask these questions to. All right, let's just say, hypothetically, somebody's up against the clock and they're like facing some of these challenges, and they have made the decision that they want to sell their business, or they think they do. They think they do, wally. What do you think is one or two things would be the next right step if they're facing some of these challenges that we've just described?

Speaker 1: 43:01

Yeah, I'd love to break this down in a future episode too, but we just talked about it a little bit like really evaluating what that looks like, right, evaluating your situation holistically, not just because one aspect of of your business, but looking at. We call them the five pillars. So looking at, look at everything in your, in your life, your personal wellness, like how's that going? Is it suffering, is it getting better? Your, you know your spiritual journey that you're on, your relationships, not just with your wife, obviously, and your kids, but in in with extended family and those in your community and the church that you attend, and your finances and the actual, you know, professional environment, the business that you're in. Like all those things there's not. There's not one. When you evaluate, there's not just everything.

Speaker 1: 43:50

Yeah, you have to. Yeah, otherwise you're just making your decision in a silo and then you wake up in the morning and you're like oh man, like.

Speaker 1: 43:57

I didn't even think about that, didn't realize that, and yeah, so I mean, overall, you just need to do an in-depth evaluation and be on. You mentioned the word be honest with yourself and yeah, I know we have some tools actually in our in our Iron Sharpens, iron app that help people look through, search through, think through partnerships and business opportunities and you know what the future looks like for them, and some of those tools are helpful and have proven out to be, you know, truly beneficial to guys that have used them.

Speaker 2: 44:36

You know, one of the things that we do in our Leadership Live every quarter we do a SWOT analysis, and I'm sure that most of you have heard of that analysis before, but it's really diving in. After you do the evaluation of your business, you're thinking what are my strengths, what are the weaknesses that we have, what are opportunities that could be out there that I could take advantage of? Are there threats out there? Like you mentioned earlier, the company that you were up against had great resources and they had the ability to market, maybe stronger than you did, had a larger team. That was a threat. That was like something that you needed to pay attention to, and if you weren't doing this SWOT analysis, you wouldn't have the ability to know to use that as one of the determining factors in you selling your company. And so I've got to say to you that you've got to take the time to work through evaluating your business at a real high level and then, granular, really work through what it is that you have. I think there's some things that we can do, and I'm like you, man. I think we need to carry this forward and even do another episode, kind of breaking this down even further, and we can give you some actionable steps that you can take.

Speaker 2: 45:48

But when you think about selling your business, getting it ready to sell, some of the questions that I had to ask myself is like, first of all, am I organized? Like, are all my financials in good order? Are my systems in process is great, and, wally, you've done an incredible job helping us get these things in view from the top in order, because you're such a systematized and processed guy and you're really good in the financials. But you start looking through. Some businesses are different. You have contracts that you've got to look at. Some of you have operational manuals, there's org charts. You can't just go in and sell a business without these things, because a company of any size or consequence whatsoever are going to want these things in order before you sell. And so other things, wally, what are some things you think about in business that they could do to kind of get ready to sell their business?

Speaker 1: 46:41

There's a book called Built to Sell John Warlow, I think is his name. I can't remember his name, warlow Warlow but Build to Sell is a good book. There's other resources online, too, that really help you. A lot of people think that building I think it was 2014 or 15 is when I read that book, based on someone's recommendation, and that helped me propel, not because I was actually planning to sell, but the idea is, if you build a business that's able to be sold, then you've actually built a business that's able to run well, and I think that's like whether you call it maximizing the value of the business or setting yourself up to sell the business of how someone else would view your business. I will tell you right now. You just experienced this recently. It's very humbling. It is when you have someone coming in and looking at your financials that you know I had six months of due diligence hell, honestly, like it was bad, even our I remember you going through that.

Speaker 1: 47:45

Even our M and a advisor was like dude, I've done $40 million deals that have not been this thorough and it was crazy. You know they I've got my hometown CPA right and my business and they show up with, like I think it was six or seven, delight and tush.

Speaker 2: 48:01

I'm like uh-oh.

Speaker 1: 48:04

But it's humbling because you have a perspective and what you think your business is worth the value of it. But the other person that's buying your business I'm just being straight up with you they don't care, they're buying it for their reasons.

Speaker 1: 48:21

If you want, to know how to structure your business to have the most value. Find out what someone else finds valuable in your business if they were going to buy it. But get off this train of you thinking that you know because you don't buy yourself and so what you're saying is it's really important that we think through selling the business very systematically.

Speaker 2: 48:44

Think about what is most important to them to maximize the value of your company and, quite honestly, that's just being a good steward. I mean, god really has entrusted us with a company to be a good steward over, so you've got to do that very systematically. You got to think through it, because when you do that, it minimizes your risk. You're like okay, I've thought through this, I've done this SWOT analysis, I've evaluated the business, I've been a good steward, I've really built the business in order to be sold At some point. Whether you do or not is irrelevant, but you've got that opportunity if you do do that.

Speaker 1: 49:22

Give me an example on that one right there.

Speaker 1: 49:23

I think this is important. Guy in this story came through an acquaintance of mine. He's an ISI brother and lives down South and he has a had a friend that was in a home inspection business and he's doing really well. It was him and I think he had another part-time person, but he was doing like, I think, like 200 K in revenue. I mean not revenue but like profit for himself. So he was making a decent income, 200,000 working for himself a year. A pretty good income, right.

Speaker 1: 50:01

Family, uh, three, three kids wife, married, I think 10, 10, 12 years, something like that, something like that and uh, everything looks really good on the outside. I've got a business, blah, blah, his. He's got a real bad cold, having trouble breathing, his wife it's like 11 o'clock at night. His wife drives to like walgreens, picks up some medicine, comes home and he's dead. Oh my gosh, he did not structure his business to be sold. It was a mess when, when they started looking at like how it was just a bookkeeping and and um, the fact that so much relied on him he hadn't. And so when you start breaking that all down, his wife's thinking well, yeah, I'm going to be okay because we're going to sell the business. It's not worth anything because he didn't set it up to be worth something, right.

Speaker 2: 50:58

So it's really detrimental, not only to us, but possibly to our heirs, the people that we leave behind.

Speaker 1: 51:04

She's got to deal with not having something as well as this thing. That I mean just, it's just yeah.

Speaker 2: 51:11

She's had a false sense of security. Yeah, that's really not there. Speaking of, as we end up today, there's some things that really can impact the quality of your life if you do it right and when I start thinking about that, my responsibility is to be a better husband, first and foremost. Right, be a better dad, and if you manage your time properly, these things will take place. You will be a better. If you don't manage these things properly, you're going to be an absentee dad. You're not going to be there. You're not going to be home for your wife, you're not going to be there. You're not going to be home for your wife, you're not going to be there for your children. And so, if you do do these things correctly, that is one of the benefits. Another one is you really have more time to do things that matter to you. You know there's things that I enjoy. I know, wally, you enjoy traveling and riding your bike, and you know working in your garden and doing those kind of things I enjoy. You know fishing and hunting and getting out with Robin on some trips, and it really allows you to do those things If you do it right. If you don't do it right, then you're a slave to the business and you can't do those things at all.

Speaker 2: 52:21

The thing that's really cool and I've watched this unfold time in and time again in ISI is that when you do have a little bit of investable capital, there's other opportunities that present themselves. Right, success breeds opportunity, and then you have another opportunity to go into another business or invest, and you and I both have invested in other people's companies as a result of having a little bit of success. So there's great benefits financially plus charitable things that you can do. You did a really cool thing recently from a charitable standpoint that we won't go into today, but it was because you paid attention and you were able to go and do some of these things. So it's really cool to be able to do it right and then face these new opportunities.

Speaker 2: 53:08

But I want to give you a great word of caution. It can be miserable if you're not prepared for what's next, and what I mean by that is don't go sell your business without having thought through what you're going to do next. Right, you just think I get a little bit of money, and that happened to me and I know it's happened to you. It's like you get bored and some people listen and go yeah, I'd like to be bored. Well, that's true, but the reality is-.

Speaker 1: 53:34

Every situation has its own challenges.

Speaker 2: 53:36

yeah, it does, it does. But what I'm saying is, if you don't have a plan, a buddy of mine sold his business about five years ago and I warned him on that and he goes yeah, I'll worry about that then. Well, he didn't think about it and he found himself in a depression for about a two-year period because his identity was tied up into what he was doing. He sold his business and then he just sat at home and he didn't do anything and he became very depressed. So it's a real thing. We can slough it off, we can laugh about it, we can say, yeah, I'd like to have such a problem. But I want to tell you from experience and, wally, I know you've got experience with that as well Think through what you're going to do next if you do sell your business. So hey, let me just say I know we've gone a little bit long today, but I want to wrap up with just a couple of closing comments or thoughts related to selling your business.

Speaker 2: 54:27

I think when you sell your business, it should really be seen as a means to accomplish your long-term vision rather than just an end in itself. When you look at it that way, it helps you really get your arms around the reason that you're building the business to begin with. You really need to recognize that selling a business doesn't guarantee you the opportunity to relax, although you might be able to for a period of time. It doesn't necessarily make you happy either, because happiness is a choice, it's not a trait, and selling your business is not going to necessarily make you happy. It can, though it can help with those things. It can help you relax.

Speaker 2: 55:08

It can, though it can help with those things. It can help you relax. It can help you be happier to a degree, and when it works right and you've done it right, quite honestly, it is amazing. If you're a small business owner, I want to encourage you that selling your business could be one of the most rewarding things that you've ever accomplished, when it's done properly. You just need to follow the right steps systematically evaluating your business in every area, really preparing it for sale, whether you do or not, build it as though you could one day have that opportunity. And then I want to encourage you to seek wise counsel, not only just to maximize the value and minimize any of your risk, but also so that you understand that this could improve your overall quality of life, so that it would help you achieve your long-term visions, so that you, too, can experience what we always say on these episodes, so that you can have your very own view from the top.

Speaker 1: 56:12

Hey, I just want to let everybody know the best way to connect with us. People ask us hey, how can I connect with you guys? One of the easiest ways if you go to viewfromthetopcom slash group that's viewfromthetopcom slash group you'll be redirected over to a LinkedIn, a private LinkedIn group just for Christian business owners, entrepreneurs and professionals, and we love to connect with you there. We carry on some of the conversations we're having in here, dive a little deeper and also it's a great place. I think there's well over I don't know if we're pushing 300 or whatever but there's a number of guys in there that you would align with. So I'd encourage you to go over there, get connected. That's V from the topcom slash group and you can just apply to join in there and we'll let you in as long as you pass the sniff test and can carry on some of these conversations. So we hope to see you there and we'll see you next week.