Food Network’s Winner Of Chopped - Chef Zakari Davila

Get ready for an exhilarating culinary adventure with us on the Walk Talk Podcast! We embark on a wild ride, starting with our shoutout to Pastry Chef Nickey Boyd and a thrilling tornado tour in Kansas and Oklahoma alongside top chefs like Richard Anderson, Billy Zeko, and Alex Hoax. Our special guest, Chef Zakari Davila, a French Culinary Institute graduate, shares his inventive approach from New York’s food scene to Tampa. 

Brace yourself for some unforgettable restaurant industry stories, including a wild night out in the 90s that led to an adventure at a coastal eatery. Tune in to hear about the exciting world of culinary competitions, including Rosanna's victory over Bobby Flay with her empanadas and an intense "Chopped" episode featuring surprise ingredients like vanilla milkshakes and spicy Cheeto mac and cheese. Discover the casting process that begins with an unexpected Instagram message and leads to thrilling moments on the Food Network stage, showcasing the immense talent and composure needed in the competitive culinary arena.

In our final segment, we explore the intricate world of restaurant and catering industries, where adaptability and strategic planning are key to success. Chef Zakari provides insights into the authenticity of culinary TV shows and movies, the influence of mentors, and the importance of leadership in the kitchen

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 1:04

Hello Food Fam. This is the Walk Talk Podcast where you will find the perfect blend of food fun and cooking knowledge. I'm your host, carl Fiorini. Welcome to the number one food podcast in the country. We're recording on site at Ibis Images Studios, where food photography comes alive and I get to eat it. There's a lot to get to today. First things first. If you missed the last episode with food networks spring baking championship finalist pastry chef nicky boyd, go back and listen, you won't be disappointed. Um, I've got to tell you, this whole podcasting thing is a labor of love.

Speaker 1: 1:38

I slept 0.0% this week and I still couldn't wait to jump into this production. Okay, so the reason is I was at a three-day tornado tour out in Kansas and Oklahoma. We visited our friends at Cattleman's Choice Feedyard and Creekstone Farms Processing Facility Pictures coming soon. Our group consisted of our crew over at the peninsula food service, that would be milan and veronica, plus the culinary team at oxford commons, a hospitality company with an amazing portfolio of restaurants here in tampa. Man, they're great. Check out oxcommonscom. A massive thank you to the team over at creek stone jim rogers, our main man, sully, and john and elzmo. You guys put on a terrific tour and are a wonderful host. Giant. Thanks to Dale Moore, owner of Cattlemen's Choice Feedlot. It's refreshing to meet people who actually treat animals with respect that they deserve. Chefs Richard Anderson, billy Zico, alex Hoax and the Myers boys, joe and Lewis unrelated these culinary professionals are amazing people and it was an honor to spend this unique and special moment in time with them. Also part of this esteemed group of chefs is Rachel Bennett, who will have to make it on the next trip.

Speaker 1: 2:52

Okay, so today's guest Can throw down in the kitchen. He's a French Culinary Institute grad who made his bones on the New York food scene, ie Tom Colicchio's, river Park and Tao Group's Cathedral. Zachary is now home in Tampa as the executive chef of Catering by the Family, which is if you're from the Tampa Bay area. You have heard of this company. They're a terrific outfit. Just a great, great story. We'll get into that one day. He's also the most recent winner of Food Network's Chopped Chef. Sakari is on deck Jefferson. I haven't seen you or John in a long time. It seems like a long time right.

Speaker 1: 3:32

Yeah Well, since Independence Day, like we were off, it's the first time we've taken off in. I don't know, it feels like a year.

Speaker 2: 3:37

It has been.

Speaker 1: 3:38

Yeah, I am so geeked up on the food today, baby, so why don't you just jump into pre-shift and let's go?

Speaker 2: 3:44

Well, I mean, we have conversations and what we're going to do as far as the food content and what you're going to eat, and I switched parameters. I went to John and said what's your favorite food? And one of them happens to be franchise. Well, it happened to. We got started by it. But he said in a different way, where it was like the next week. And he, I was said, give me a list. It was Ropa Vieja, the franchise and two other things. I'm like okay, we're going to do franchise. So I don't like doing things normal, as you know.

Speaker 2: 4:10

So I was thinking about what we're going to do and I said, hey, you got some shrimp, that's golf shrimp, let's do something with this. And I made raviolis with it. I used uzu marmalade inside it, I did spinach, asparagus, blanched all that down, put it all together, had the binding of the shrimp because the way that you, if you chop shrimp the right way, you can actually bind together itself, you don't have to add egg to it Semolina dough, stretched that out and then made a frangie sauce. And then I took the shrimp shells because I don't like wasting anything, and I made a shrimp stock, brought that down into a shrimp risk and then it hit it with some sherry to give it some complexity to it.

Speaker 2: 4:49

And then I wanted to treat you guys to something different. That's why I didn't want to let the cat out of the bag, but a plant-based yodo meat that, uh, did sourdough, sourdough pita, and I wanted to go all out. So tzatziki was vegan, the cheese was vegan, the bread was vegan, everything on that plate was vegan, and I just wanted to have a good experience.

Speaker 1: 5:09

The only thing that wasn't vegan is you. That's me, right. So, real quick, you did really good. On the franchise, thank you. You know it was actually reminiscent. It reminded me of my dad's, so that was really cool. So we were talking off air and my dad passed last year, right, so I didn't touch any of the stuff until, you know, just about a week ago. So I'm going through all the boxes and things and I found recipes from my grandmother to my dad, like just really cool stuff, and I'm so happy you did that. So what we're going to do and because I think it was so close and I did find the franchise recipe, oh, john just actually spoke for a minute.

Speaker 2: 5:51

He was breathing hard. His mic is actually on, he didn't shut it down.

Speaker 1: 5:58

So it's not like you know how he did for you and you made like a cup and put you know right, it's, it's actually written out. So I want to compare and see we can do that off air. It's a, that's a whole nother. So what's?

Speaker 2: 6:10

funny is that recipe was actually from my mentor, Teddy Andreosi and Teddy Falco. It was an uncle and nephew that worked at Casa Bella, past the nosh that's where I learned and actually Dan, who is a chef over at Shenanigans. It was so similar when I worked over with Pat Utter in what is now closed, the West Hollywood, or, yeah, the West Hollywood one by the TY Park. Dan used to work for Martha's so I kind of emulated both the three of their recipes and just it's something I love to do, it's just one of those things that's for me, it's something I grew up with, it's um, you know, when you get sick, it's one of those comfort foods for me.

Speaker 1: 6:46

And that's what I wanted. That, for me, is one of those things I can eat, whenever it's made.

Speaker 2: 6:50

Marcella salt and bucco.

Speaker 1: 6:52

I mean all of those are all good, but the franchise for me is a little bit more you know, random you know and be at 1130 at night. Hey, I'm going to make good.

Speaker 3: 7:06

Okay, pops no problem.

Speaker 1: 7:07

Yeah, and you know that spice. That's the sauce that you did there. Which one With the scotch bonnet?

Speaker 2: 7:18

Oh, the foie gras.

Speaker 1: 7:19

Yeah yeah, the foie gras toculo Right. Yeah yeah, the foie gras de culo Right yeah.

Speaker 2: 7:22

Yeah, for you?

Speaker 1: 7:22

Yeah, it's a good sauce, so let's bottle it Okay.

Speaker 2: 7:27

What do you say? I'm down Seriously. I mean there's, there's no other sauce that's out there. That's like that and I wanted to have consistency. So that's when they go to a mash and I know that when. I talked to Steve. They did that, but it's something I definitely want to do. Yeah, it's one of my favorite ones.

Speaker 1: 8:01

Well, you know, walk Talk Media is slowly getting to a place where we're going to start, you know, getting into some branding and some behind-the-scenes sort of deals on food products, and it's very exciting what's going on.

Speaker 2: 8:16

Well, the jacket is one of my favorite ones. It's going to be one of the swags we're going to put out.

Speaker 1: 8:21

Yeah, don't drop any names. I'm not dropping any names. We're putting a portfolio together as we speak and we're going to be going very soon on that.

Speaker 2: 8:30

I do want to say one thing that, Grouper Reuben, when I mentioned it today, that little kid smirk you had I've never seen you smirk like that that generally made me happy.

Speaker 1: 8:42

No, you smirk like that. That generally made me happy. No, I'm telling you, it definitely did like no, because, listen, I can appreciate all sorts of different food, all types of food. You know, even if it's not something I'm gonna, if it's not my go-to dish or whatever, or profile or whatever, I'm gonna still enjoy it. I'll find something and I'll be like you know what that was good about it? That grouper sandwich, that's just like one giant checkbox.

Speaker 1: 9:00

You know, and it's one big check because you know what it was it's fresh, it was not heavy, it had all sorts of layers in it on you know, on on the profile, and damn it, I'll eat that every day, like I literally eat that every single day I'd like I told you I'm gonna make the rye sourdough and now I'm gonna do it again.

Speaker 1: 9:18

By the way, speaking of eating every day, this, this, this trip, right it was. It was from monday, monday morning, early, super early, but crack it on early all the way to. You know, two in the morning when I got home, you know, last morning went wednesday, yeah, today, last night, right morning, whatever. And man, I gotta tell you I went there at 2 14, I'm 220, it hasn't. I came home at 220. I know my wife's not listening so I can tell you. But my goodness, but it was nothing but like dude.

Speaker 2: 9:49

Six pounds.

Speaker 1: 9:49

Let me tell you something, yes Of all, like prime meat?

Speaker 2: 9:54

You know, I smelled. I thought it was the lamb that smelled. It's actually you sweating. You have meat sweats. It's my new cologne.

Speaker 1: 10:00

It's awesome. No, listen, it was nothing but bourbon and beautiful meat. Oh my God, it was so amazing. The farm tour was fantastic, like just that whole processing facility by Creekstone amazing. Equally as cool was the feedlot, like the ranch which I had never been to, one of those. I grew up in South Florida. Lot like the ranch which I'd never been to one of those. You know, we, I grew up in South Florida. Behind me was land you know, similar to where you know we were in Oklahoma, like it's just there's open land, acres over acres over acres and cattle on it, but I never been to it. You know that wasn't my property and, granted, we used to sneak in there, but I never got to see anything. Long story short, what a great, what a great experience.

Speaker 1: 10:42

I'd like to put a trip together for our team here, walk and talk and and make it happen. I think that we were not fighting you. No, I don't think you would. No, and I already, kind of like, seeded this, dropped it. You have to, of course, come on, you know I get down all right, right enough about that. We're going to make that happen. Let's talk, I'm available tomorrow no I.

Speaker 3: 11:05

You're not, I'm not, I can't.

Speaker 1: 11:08

I shouldn't take any blood work right now. No no, no, they would ban me from coming to the show. Doctors say no more, walk and talk. I said okay, let's talk. Food Network what do you say?

Speaker 2: 11:20

I think so the guy that, down to my left, definitely would probably want to talk about it. Right, all right, let's, let's. Isn't that why he's here?

Speaker 1: 11:28

exactly one of the reasons. Chef, welcome to the program. Thank you for having me. No man, our pleasure. You know I've been. I've been telling people about this episode. You know friends and you know acquaintances without the people know acquaintances and whatnot the people we talk to.

Speaker 1: 12:23

Strangers Like, hey, by the way, you have an interesting personality, man. I know you're about 30 or so, 31, 32., 32., 32. And man, you're just like one ball of energy and a big smile, and I think when it comes to the industry, it's needed Because you still have to command, you still have to lead your team, you still have to, you know all the, you know procurement, the whole nine yards, and then execute what you're, what you're trying to do. But you've got such a great personality. So, first of all, thank you for that Cause. You're a good dude. Yeah, thank you. Why don't you, why don't you take, take a minute and give the airplane view of who you are and where you came from and how you landed here?

Speaker 3: 13:08

You know, not born in Tampa, born in Seattle, mainly raised in Tampa Bay, family's deep-rooted in Ybor City 20 years old decided I wanted to cook professionally, so sat down with my dad. We went to a bar at 20. I was getting ready to kind of sell insurance it's what the family business was and I'm like man, I want to be a chef. I want to do this. You know not most people pick this thing to do for the rest of their life and I'll never forget it. We go to Four Greenfields, we sit there and I'm like, hey, let's take a shot. Like I got to tell you something.

Speaker 3: 13:46

So right, when we go to take a shot, right before he takes it, I go, I want to be a chef. And he just slams a glass on the counter and he looks at me. He goes all right, well, you're going to have to go to New York. And I'm like I. So, 20 years old, culture shock. Go to new york, start my journey. I'm in culinary school night program three days a week and then start working under tom glickio at um river park. So, seven days a week, I'm in the kitchen all the time and exposed to this city of, like you know, coming from tampa bay to new york is debaucherous.

Speaker 1: 14:23

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 14:29

The first thing I said when I came with planes like wow, there's a lot of trash here. Nothing has changed. Yeah, from there you know, just kind of immerse myself in cooking and the whole journey there. It was an experience.

Speaker 1: 14:42

something that I think I strongly advise to anybody that kind of goes in this industry is go out of the box, go somewhere well, just the two, just the two outfits that you, you know, that you mentioned to us is that's, that's a, that's, that's a big deal, you know? Yeah, glickios and the cathedral, cathedral, yeah, tal group.

Speaker 3: 15:03

I was with la pacora bianca for a while, so you know, did my rounds, you know, and it's just the city in general. Just you see the grind and the hustle and then the culinary, it's just perfection, like there's no ifs, ands or buts and kind of came up in the world before hr was a thing. So there were those chefs were not easy on you, jeff.

Speaker 1: 15:24

How, how lucky are we. There was no cell phones, nothing like. There's no proof, all it is is rumors that's it.

Speaker 2: 15:31

Yeah, the 90s never happened, never. Because there's no, there's no, there's no evidence, no picture evidence of it. Let's put it that way.

Speaker 1: 15:39

I mean, I feel terrible for some of the things you know, that we used to do. So you know, I'm from the business too, but not at the level of anybody here, and I was always front of the house. But my favorite, my funnest, I should say job in a restaurant was at Bennigan's. Okay, and this was like mid-'90s Bennigan's and it was just crazy Because I don't know, yeah, you're working it, and this was like mid-90s Bennigan and it was just crazy Because, yeah, you're working.

Speaker 2: 16:08

It happened.

Speaker 1: 16:10

You're probably it literally happened. Yeah, like you're lit up working, you know what I mean.

Speaker 2: 16:16

It was just like a movie. Any story you heard like Waiting is the perfect example of what the restaurant industry was back in the 90s.

Speaker 1: 16:22

Yeah, specifically there.

Speaker 2: 16:27

But then we would end up at like shenanigans. Well, shenanigans first and then flicker light, yeah, yeah, and then we would throw, which is still around, by the way, today that we the the day.

Speaker 1: 16:32

One specific day, there was about 10 of us from the, from the restaurant, and we ended up there and it got a little crazy. The drinks were flowing, the shots were just endless, and all all of a sudden somebody threw a dish in the water and we're like what the hell are you doing? What are you doing, man? And then another dish, and then a chair, and then a table and another chair, and then you look down the Intra Coastal because this restaurant is right on the water, literally on the water.

Speaker 1: 17:01

And there's the plastic chairs and the tables are just floating down the coastal and the plates are. And you know, I'm like what the hell are you guys doing? Because of course I would never do that, but it was probably you I might have been, I might have.

Speaker 1: 17:14

I'm not admitting to any of that. But then a buddy of mine who was the bartender and I can't even remember his name, but he was funny as he should have been a stand-up comedian he gets out to the uh, he gets out to the dumpster and this guy he's like come on everybody, and he and dude, everybody was whacked and the dumpster went over yeah, it was yeah, I don't know how we didn't go to jail that night.

Speaker 1: 17:33

Honest to god, there's a lot of times I don't know how I went to anyway, I just, I just put this into the uh, the universe right of uh, but again I admit to nothing that it was me All right back to you.

Speaker 3: 17:46

Enough about the 90s.

Speaker 1: 17:48

Enough about the 90s, how important was being part of CHOMP. Ultimately, you went in there and you won. Congratulations, by the way, thank you, thank you.

Speaker 3: 17:58

It was an accomplishment, right? I think a big self-gratification moment. Right, you went into a kitchen. You don't know recipes that are wacky, yeah, wacky at best.

Speaker 3: 18:08

Yeah, and a clock, that's very real. Right Before going in I'm like no way, this time's not real. No, it's real, it's moving. And to go through and win and meet the other competitors and kind of see their background and see how they move really opened your eyes to this whole competition realm of even the production side, to like Food Network and what they do, and it makes me hungry. I want more.

Speaker 1: 18:36

How did they contact you?

Speaker 3: 18:37

It was on Instagram. It was a casting agency that just reached out to me and we got on a phone call. She's like I love you. Like you're great, let's do a phone call. She's like I love you. Like you're great, let's do a zoom call. So we do a zoom call and usually you have to do a couple. It was just like one and I'm like oh, they're not going to call me back. I get a call. I'm in Savannah, georgia. That's where I was working at the time. I got a call and they're like hey, can you leave next week to chow house? Somebody bailed out. And I'm like no, I can't, I can't, I can't. Just leave my job. I'm a culinary director. And they're like all right, well, we'll call you back. And then, like another two weeks, it's like hey, we have you on episode of chop. This is the day. And it's like it was like a month out. So I was like okay, let me get ready to do this competition.

Speaker 1: 19:16

I mean, they're both great shows but chopped is like.

Speaker 2: 19:24

I feel like CHOMP is one of the premier. It is.

Speaker 1: 19:25

Right, it has become that.

Speaker 2: 19:26

Yeah, yeah, that's so cool, even though some of the stuff is like he said is kind of wacky some of the ingredients.

Speaker 3: 19:31

Yeah, some of the ingredients get a little like come on, man.

Speaker 1: 19:34

Well, what's funny to me, or what's interesting to me, is the lead up to getting on the show, like how the communication happens. I think that's fast to me. That's the fascinating part, because the reality is, social media matters. You know everybody, we all want to. You know, wag a finger at, you know social media, but in the end it changes lives potentially.

Speaker 3: 19:59

Yeah and it's like a lot of it. You know you can apply to the show and stuff and most people I've known that have got on it was social media, somebody reaching out, caster agency, and then once you kind of get in that world, that like food network world, now you continually get kind of You're in a rotation yeah.

Speaker 3: 20:17

Like they'll continue. Like hey, what do you think about this show that's coming up Like yeah, like they'll continue. Like hey, what do you think about this show that's coming up Like what do you? And now you're kind of in that realm and you can build up in that realm if you want.

Speaker 1: 20:26

Yeah, I, it's interesting because, well, another interesting component of this is that what the last two months, three months something, ish quarter, you know we've had a fairly decent flow of of food network folks coming through here.

Speaker 2: 20:40

We should have by now that he would have been the fourth one, more than that, no Cause. We had Robert, we had but this is Nikki.

Speaker 1: 20:48

He's the only winner. No.

Speaker 2: 20:50

I'm not. I know that. What I'm saying is you're the gold star standard. Steven's going to come on, I guarantee you, from the spring show. I know that Robert's been talking from the spring show. I know that Robert's been talking about it.

Speaker 1: 20:59

I don't want to talk about it.

Speaker 3: 21:02

Listen, this man here is our.

Speaker 1: 21:04

He is the feature. Oh goodness, can you believe it? You sure I've got to deal with you.

Speaker 2: 21:08

So what about Rosanna, who beat Bobby Flay?

Speaker 1: 21:11

Okay, yeah, Bobby Flay, you know see, I'm losing track myself.

Speaker 3: 21:15

You just need to sleep.

Speaker 1: 21:16

You've got to bow down to Rosanna. Yeah that's awesome yeah.

Speaker 3: 21:20

Do you know who she is? No, I don't. You told me, though, recently. Where does she work here she's in St Peter.

Speaker 2: 21:27

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 21:27

Yes, what was the dish she beat Bobby Flay with.

Speaker 2: 21:31

Oh, empanadas, the empanadas.

Speaker 3: 21:32

No way.

Speaker 2: 21:33

He has never won what we were told by her, ever won an empanada competition, wow. So she just went right in, and I think that's the only.

Speaker 1: 21:42

The first was she was the first female right.

Speaker 2: 21:45

Yeah, I mean, listen, she beat, she battled her husband to get there yeah, it was a husband and wife that was the reason. Yeah, they were looking for something and they were talking to her and like, oh, my husband's the chef, he's the pastry chef, blah blah. And they're like, oh, you guys want to go on the show together? And she thought it was going to be like a valentine's day thing and she's like, nope, it was totally not and it was like legit and when it was all it was all three of them.

Speaker 2: 22:06

So she, she battled her husband. Like the first part, you have to battle somebody else and then once you get, once you win that part, because you're cooking what bobby wants, then you cook what you want against bobby. So she beat her husband to get to be.

Speaker 3: 22:20

Yeah, that's savage.

Speaker 2: 22:23

Well, in our whole conversation funny enough, the whole conversation was that he was over here. I'm like, so do you guys get along? Since he gets to working out and she goes oh no, he's like a hundred percent, he's just, he really wanted me to do it and it's great when you have a person that you're a partner with, both in life and in business, that you can have that, and they are. They do catering too, and they do the yeah, but they do so much together.

Speaker 2: 22:48

It's just. It's really great to see that how they kind of gel.

Speaker 1: 22:51

Let's talk about your dish. What did you make, oh, today, yes, well, yeah, we're going to get to that. I'm not. We're not done with chopped.

Speaker 3: 23:03

Oh my dishes. Yeah, bring it back, oh man. So the first basket was a vanilla milkshake, spicy Cheeto mac and cheese, a head of cauliflower and then like smoked turkey legs, like pre-cooked ones that you buy from like a theme park, like a big old turkey leg. So I kind of did, took the milkshake I made and the cauliflower and did like a vanilla cauliflower puree and put that on the bottom plate. I made a turkey salad. I used the packet from the Cheeto mac and cheese to season it but I added, like tarragon chives, just tried to bring some more flavors a little bit of red onion. But I added, like tarragon chives, just tried to bring some more flavors, a little bit of red onion and then did like a radicchio salad on the side. So that was my first dish. How long did you have for that that?

Speaker 2: 23:50

was a 20 minute round and you don't find out what the ingredients are until you open that basket.

Speaker 3: 23:55

No, they'll give you the basket and you try to peek through a little bit, but they're like blacked out. You cannot see what's in those baskets.

Speaker 2: 24:03

So you have no idea what we're opening up.

Speaker 3: 24:06

No idea. You open it up and then you put everything in front of you and then you're like, okay, this is what I have to work with. And the part that doesn't really register, at least with me, like right away, was the use of ingredients, right. So like you can, I guess, with the mac and cheese, I did. But you can use as little or as a lot of the ingredients you want. So if like the like, for instance, the vanilla milkshake, if you just want to use the cherry on top, you can just use that. But then you have to deal with is it kind of incorporated in the dish? Is it taste, is it? Did you use it right? So my kind of whole thing going into every round was let me take two ingredients in the basket and kind of combine them together and then from there I know I'm using those good, and then I can move forward. What's your?

Speaker 1: 24:49

anxiety level. Before you get there, right, you're like, okay, chopped, here's my date, I got to go do my stuff, right, and maybe you don't even think about it because you're still working and you're, you're fixated on what you have to do for your you know, for your career, for work. Then you get there, and now it's like it starts to become a little bit more real, right, you start to meet contestants. You're, you're seeing what's going on Cameras everywhere. Like all of a sudden you're thinking to yourself oh, I actually I got to cook, I got to, I got to represent right.

Speaker 1: 25:17

What's your stress?

Speaker 3: 25:18

level. It wasn't high, it was, it came natural. It didn't bother me.

Speaker 1: 25:22

You know I would normally not believe the person saying that to me, but, like if you're looking at your demeanor, I think it's true. What do you think? Okay, john spoke. Yeah, he did, it's true.

Speaker 3: 25:32

But yeah, it didn't, it was. It came very natural. I just went, I kind of just blocked everything out and cooked. I was like I'm just going to come here and cook. I'm not going to try to do something crazy, go out of the box and do these things where people are like wrapping beef in Swiss chard. That's what one of my competitors did and didn't go well for him. But I was like I'm just going to sear a steak, I'm going to cook it well, I'm going to stick to the basics as basic, but then use these wacky ingredients, and that was just my plan. So I'm like, all right if I cook a cook, if somebody cooking better than me, then they're cooking better than me. But I was just going to go in there and give it the cameras and everything didn't really bother me.

Speaker 2: 26:09

I think the other aspect too is I asked him did he prep for it and then did he practice for it?

Speaker 3: 26:13

And your response was I was like I've been practicing 12 years now, which is a great answer, right?

Speaker 1: 26:19

No, you're you're, you're ready for it? Yeah, see, but that's cool man. And then if it were me, I would just be, I would have to do it would be nerves all nerves, nothing but nerves.

Speaker 3: 26:30

You'd be in the fetal position on the floor.

Speaker 1: 26:32

No, no no fetal position but. But I would be nothing but nerves, right, and I would have to sit there and spend days and I don't know how many. You know, practice runs doing it, training, train. Yeah, like I'm talking like 1980s you gotta run up.

Speaker 3: 26:50

Yeah, fly to stairs, flight of stairs, ladle and well, that might be at 220.

Speaker 2: 26:55

That might be something dangerous for you right now.

Speaker 1: 26:57

You might want to wait, so funny, funny story we're coming back from.

Speaker 2: 27:02

We're coming back from from oklahoma city, right did they ask you to move to balance the plane all?

Speaker 1: 27:08

right. So we, we have a connection flight in atlanta and, of course, the plane is delayed, right and you know, on to to atlanta, where we're going to catch our connecting flight. Oh so it's even worse. It's worse. Harvey, and there's like 10 of us on this trip and we're just, you know, to Atlanta, where we're going to catch our connecting flight. Oh so it's even worse. It's worse, horrible, and there's like 10 of us on this trip and we're just, you know, everybody's going to different places. Whatever, I had to run, I was sprinting, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: 27:34

Is there footage?

Speaker 1: 27:36

No, I mean, footage may exist, but I don't think.

Speaker 3: 27:41

Jackson.

Speaker 1: 27:41

Hatfield something. So I had to. I ran and I was doing the running and I would hit those like a walking. You know, the walk, the walk people movers or whatever.

Speaker 1: 27:50

And uh, and as I'm, and I'm still running on the people mover, and uh, and I was just thinking to myself, man, when, when I have to hit the pavement, you know, like when it, when I'm off that thing, I better be careful because I'm not going to be the guy that just eats it, you know, because then there's somebody would have a freaking camera at that point. But yeah, no, I ran all the way there and it was crazy. I wasn't the only one that the whole group was doing it. I was like all right, were you last?

Speaker 2: 28:14

No, I've been that dude, I have literally been that. It's the worst feeling Running with a group of people, oh yeah.

Speaker 1: 28:21

I have enough healthy vanity to where I don't want to be like. You know, I was suffering when we got to the thing. I suffered, there's no question Like I was not happy and I'm huffing and puffing, but no, I wasn't. I was not the last one I represented. He showed up. I was mad, sweating from head to toe like it was terrible, you know, by the way, it was crazy it was. This was like six in the morning, central time, right. The day started hit to hit. You know, hit these uh field. You know the feed lots and all that, and I didn't get home till two in the morning, eastern time. That was. The entire day was like just non-stop.

Speaker 2: 29:03

I feel like a champion, though, you know until he gets home later today and crashes out for a day. It's gone. That's gonna happen. Saturday morning we're gonna get. Hey, I just woke up, that's gonna happen and I embrace that.

Speaker 1: 29:16

I look forward to it how it feel to so, from a chef's perspective, what are the differences between catering and restaurants? I kind of want to go into a different direction here.

Speaker 3: 29:25

Yeah, wow, there's a huge difference.

Speaker 1: 29:27

Which do you like better? No, no, no, don't, don't, don't do that. So which one do you like better?

Speaker 3: 29:35

I mean my heart's with restaurants, right, Like that's where I came up in, that's that's, that's that's where I live. Like restaurants, especially when I started out in restaurants because river park, especially, was a special place. You walked in and you can just see how everyone was competing against each other, Like you were there to help each other. But the talent that was in the room was a builder, everybody's building each other up.

Speaker 3: 29:59

Yeah, like you wanted to be a sous chef before that guy was sous chef. There wasn't like, oh, I've been here for two years now, I get promoted. It was like, no, you're going to show up and you're going to work. Catering is a different world, though, and I see, you know, I was the event chef with Tom Colicchio, so there was that sense of like catering. But it sense of like catering, um, but it was like catering within our own area. So we had our own banquet halls and stuff like that. We had the kitchen, we had all our firepower that we can do to get it out.

Speaker 3: 30:27

Now, catering now, what I'm doing now is a whole different ball game. Right, like packing up a truck, making sure hot boxes, not forgetting anything, bringing stuff on site. What can we execute in a site? What it's the best of? What I said to you guys earlier, when we're talking about the kitchen, what I tell chefs is is you have to be a chameleon, you have to adjust into your environment, because a lot of restaurant people, you know you come to that restaurant for two years, three years. You know the ins and outs, you know everything about it. Catering is gonna throw a different ball game at you. Yeah, you'll learn the venues, you'll learn this here and there, but you're still gonna have to adjust to things. So there is that sense of like adjustment that gets you excited, keeps you on your toes. But you know restaurants where I started. Maybe down the line I'll like catering more.

Speaker 1: 31:12

I still love catering, don't get me wrong it's a different, it's a different challenge, exactly right. Would you say that catering I have three people in front of me that I'm going to ask for One doesn't have a mic. One without a mic, juan?

Speaker 2: 31:28

is in the house and he's taking notes.

Speaker 3: 31:30

Definitely taking notes, sorry, man.

Speaker 1: 31:36

I mean, you know, the CEO is sitting right here.

Speaker 2: 31:38

By the way, I didn't set you up for that one because he's sitting next to me. Here's my thought process. I've been I don't know how long in the restaurant industry and the catering. Catering to me is a lot easier because you know exactly what you're getting into.

Speaker 3: 31:52

That is a big thing. When you go to prep it's like all right on the line, I'm going to get hit with. You know you can look at your big hitters or whatever. But when you come to cater you're like I know exactly what I need for the weekend.

Speaker 1: 32:04

I know exactly what I and there is a little bit of curve, unless it's a pop-up party or something that comes up.

Speaker 3: 32:11

But most of those, it's not like a thousand person pop-up party.

Speaker 2: 32:14

Even if it's a thousand, we have a saying I'm prepping for one or I'm prepping for a thousand. I'm just going to go through the motion of whatever I need to do Is catering the same as banquets at a hotel. Yeah, I think there's some. Yeah, yeah, I think so. Yeah, I would say yes on that. There is so one sits.

Speaker 3: 32:33

I got a three, yeses, two and a half, I think. Yeah, it is. I mean, I don't have experience in the hotel world. I've seen them and I see the similarity of chafing dishes, the kind of this, I think what chef said was they had the firepower when he was at tom calicchio's.

Speaker 2: 32:46

He had the firepower there and in a hotel you have the firepower there when you're doing catering and you're doing specifically off-site catering. You are a macgyver, yeah, like if you. If you don't go to the venue first to find out what the venue is and you don't shop the venue and you don't know what you're going into expect what you expect.

Speaker 1: 33:04

A lot of those venues don't have the right equipment too for you, or even just the plug. Nor equipment, no equipment.

Speaker 3: 33:11

You're bringing a hot box and it's shorting out every five seconds. You're like what plug can I use here?

Speaker 2: 33:18

You don't know the electricity of the place.

Speaker 1: 33:26

Pull out a lighter and start cooking things. I don't know who's responsible to find that that out who's supposed to do recon.

Speaker 3: 33:29

Who scouts that? We, yeah, we have staff. The salesperson will go there and check out the venue. Then we have meetings weekly that we discuss you know what they'll bring it. Hey, this is the layout, this is what we can do.

Speaker 3: 33:40

A lot of them know like hey, we can fry on site. We can't fry on site. We can do this on site, you know, here and there, and then as a chef coming in, like what, what logistically makes sense on our end, like what can we all? Right, yeah, we, maybe we can cook this on site. Now we don't have to worry about doing that here if we're going to create a better product there. Or do we do it here and then send it there because you have nothing to do, but then we're going to send it at a later time to make the product good.

Speaker 3: 34:05

Or maybe we hold it like this you don't wrap this because it's fried, so there is a lot of elements to it. Where it's not, you're in a restaurant and you make a dish and then you send it to the guests. It's a different world, even on plate ups too. Like it, like it's, it's just, it's completely different. And you know, I think another big part of it too is that I would like to say the type of people that you kind of get in in those different kinds of restaurants, because the catering lifestyle does add a lot better quality of life when you're in the restaurants, especially the higher you get up in restaurants, you're so immersed in it.

Speaker 1: 34:43

Listen, I binge watched all three seasons of the Bear.

Speaker 2: 34:48

I got text messages. I was texting this guy. I still haven't gotten through season one.

Speaker 1: 34:55

I only did season two halfway and it was just like it got away from cooking for me and I'm like, well, hold on, let me just get into this for a second, because I think that it was so well done. Okay, the whole thing was so well done. Obviously, they're looking to. It seems that they want to draw this out for a few more seasons, right, so you have to have some character development, that that goes on with it. And that's where it starts getting a little bit off of cooking.

Speaker 1: 35:22

But once you get and there were like a handful of episodes where I was like, okay, this is dragging, you know, but, man, once you get past that and you get back into it, they don't miss a beat, they don't miss anything and for me, there was so many nuances about being in the business that I had forgotten, like, the feelings. You can look at it and go I've seen, I know that happens, but you don't remember the feeling of it. And I'm sitting here and I'm watching, I'm eating potato chips and I'm just like I'm sweating, I'm sweating and it's crazy. I think it's such a great show and I I did the three seasons in one week.

Speaker 2: 36:01

That's insane. I think the I think one of the best shows that really emulates what the restaurant industry goes through is John Favreau's chef, like the behind the scenes chef show.

Speaker 1: 36:12

Oh yeah.

Speaker 2: 36:13

When he does the makeup of how he went through it. And I never knew the training that not only he went through, but did you see the Josh Rogan one that he went? No, so they're doing it and it's Wolfgang Puck and John Farvo and Roy Choi and and Josh Rogan, and they're talking and they're like we're going to do chicken and all of a sudden he picks up a knife, the, and he starts whacking the chicken and I'm like holy, he's got skills and he goes. Don't you remember I did that movie called Chicken Something? And I'm like I didn't even know he did a movie called Chicken. He goes I had to go ahead and fabricate cases of chicken the right way, because I have to do this for my job.

Speaker 1: 36:46

You can see he's got knife skills Seriously.

Speaker 2: 36:48

And then John Farvo, when he was working with Chef Wolf, wolfgang Puck. As soon as I heard Wolfgang, look I'm getting chills. As soon as I heard Wolfgang's voice, it's like I just went.

Speaker 1: 36:57

I used to work for him.

Speaker 2: 36:59

And as soon as he slapped, as soon as he slaps John Fargo and says you want your stuff to taste like silicone, Cause he was using the silicone spatula, he goes use a fork and I'm like, oh God, that just triggered me. That's, that's exactly how Wolfgang was, but the the way they went through the process to emulate what really goes on in the restaurant industry was Bravo. I mean seriously just fantastic, because it really captures what we go through on the personal level with our family, especially this particular story with John Fargo and his character and Dustin Hoffman, how that whole started out, and then he went to the food truck and had this son. It's a beautiful way of like emulating what we go through in the restaurant industry. Bear is too much for me right now because it triggered me for what happened a couple of years ago. Will I get over it? Eventually? I'll probably end up sitting down and watching it, but right now I can't. There's no way.

Speaker 1: 37:49

There was a few parts in this, in in there. My family is not like the family there, but some of it was. You mean, richie, no, a percentage of the mother, okay, okay, and I'm just and and it that freaked me out, richie, you know, I can identify with that character a little bit, you know. But then he comes, he, he ends up coming around, you know, and that, and that's the cool part about it, the characters have growth. I think it's super. Anyway, you know, I can't stop talking about it.

Speaker 2: 38:23

I'm just, you know, I'm a huge proponent of this, this series, man, as long as they put the limelight on us in the right way, exactly, yeah.

Speaker 1: 38:32

I think they're accurate Forget the limelight. Forget, for I think they're accurate, forget the limelight.

Speaker 2: 38:36

Well, that's what I'm saying, as long as they keep it to what it really is and they don't embellish or they don't do like the menu, for instance, like I mean, oh yeah, we would all like to do that.

Speaker 3: 38:47

Yeah, it's a lot of like glorification in this and you see a lot of you know it's funny because I remember when I was younger in this industry and I come in the kitchen. A couple of years ago it was 12 years, I was 20 years old.

Speaker 3: 39:00

I walk in the kitchen and you know there's guys in there 30, 35, 40 sous chefs or whatever and you know they're. They're the real deal, like they're they're throwing down and you don't realize. When you first get in you're like I want to, I want to create dishes, I want to do this cool stuff. You don't realize how much repetition it is. It's not coming in there and like oh, I'm going to be this superstar chef and I'm going to create a cool dish, or I'm going to plate this, even at nice, like if you go to a Michelin star restaurant. It's repetition, it's doing the same thing every day.

Speaker 1: 39:32

Yeah, 300 covers.

Speaker 3: 39:39

I was brunoise shall thing every day. It's like 300 cover. I was brewing wine shallots every day and and until I got good at it and it wasn't, I wasn't good in a week. I wasn't good in a month, I wasn't. I wasn't good in two months, I was good in like a year, two years, three years. I'm like, oh wow, I can use my knife really good now. Like and you get a lot of that, like kind of just people that don't really understand that, and I think a lot of it comes from shows and stuff, cause they'll see this. You know, food network had a big thing. I, when I was in culinary school you had a lot of kids are like, oh yeah, I'm going to be a chef. You know what? Like look at David Chang and Bobby Flay and I'm like, yeah, they still went and got rocked. It's a hard, hard game.

Speaker 1: 40:15

It's funny. I just had this conversation somewhere I don't remember, but before food network, and I'm not pro or con on food network. You know they, they serve a purpose, they do what they do well, Right Before then, the people who ended up in kitchens. You've you found your way there.

Speaker 2: 40:32

You know it was because you had a. Not all of us you had had a. Some of us were idiots and said I want to go, yeah, yeah, but guilty, yeah, hold on that percentage. It's very small oh yeah, very small percentage okay so usually you had a record.

Speaker 1: 40:47

It was, you know, like last resort, I guess I'll get out of the kitchen right, exactly so. But then you had the advent of you know these like superstar, celebrity chefs and culinary school, and all of a sudden now people are going to school because they see all of the glitz and the glam, but they're still. You still have to learn, you still have to get, like you said, get rocked. You still got to get kicked in the face.

Speaker 2: 41:11

Well, that's like when Kurt was, if you don't.

Speaker 1: 41:12

If you don't get kicked in the face, you'll never be anything. You've got to get kicked in the face a lot.

Speaker 2: 41:19

Well, there's a right way of getting kicked in the face. I think there's a way to do it the right way Back when I was going in. I started when I was 12. Child labor law yeah.

Speaker 1: 41:28

It wasn't.

Speaker 2: 41:40

But by the time I got into culinary school and I was in my externship, I was working at La Cucina Toscana in Weston and the chef there was French trained, loved Italian food and stuff that we went through. Even with HR Today, we couldn't do that. There's just no way. So there's things that we have to do differently. But I think when you're talking about superstars for me, the superstar for me and I mentioned this when we talked to Kurt and some other episodes I had Julia Childs, I had Graham Cure.

Speaker 2: 42:00

I had I think Galloping Gourmet is Graham Cure and Jacques Pepin. Those were the people I watched. I didn't watch. I did watch cartoons, but I also when I wanted to watch something to get my mind off of school, or whatever I was doing, I always gravitated to food and that was the culture I was raised in.

Speaker 1: 42:15

But it was a process Because you went from that first group right. And then you started getting into, like the Emeralds and all these people.

Speaker 2: 42:21

Well, emerald came out when I was in culinary school and boy, when I first saw Emerald and he was a JWU grad and he would sit there and double dip and taste the food with his finger and you'd say oh, my God, where's the surf safe?

Speaker 2: 42:33

And you would like you know, cause that's when you were going through culinary and it's so funny and you're going to. He's going to laugh, and so is Juan. Every time you go through a food service like when the health inspector comes in for about what three days you guys are on your tiptoes and we're going to do it this way now, and then all of a sudden things go back to the way they were and everybody probably instead of just doing it from the get-go, yeah right, but I think that's the difference between what we do.

Speaker 1: 43:00

No, oh, you, oh, so you're that guy.

Speaker 2: 43:01

Yeah, processes matter, processes matter. Oh, I would 100, but I think for you. What made you, at 20, go to your father?

Speaker 3: 43:10

I want to be chef so a lot of it stemmed from it started with my grandmother. So I'm really really close to my grandparents and my grandmother loved like, would wake up in the middle of the night to stir a sauce, kind of like thing, like it's just Cuban grandmother.

Speaker 1: 43:25

She was.

Speaker 3: 43:25

Cuban. Yeah, so like just big into cooking, but she didn't really cook like Cuban food she did, but like she cooked kind of. She was creative, she would make stuff from scratch, like make her own dishes. So I always thought that was intriguing and I remember her telling me she's like just put whatever you want in it If you like it, make it taste good. So that would kind of spark my creativity and I started like cooking here and there. When I was around 12 my dad started cooking heavily, very into food network, so this is the food network time and he he would. He would get it wine, drink wine and just had food network on, play some music maybe, and then he would just cook dishes and he's, he's a phenomenal cook, like he's very good. And being young, I just sat there and watched him, watched him on the bar, and that was the first time in my family, because you know my mother, my grand, my both my grandmothers, but both my good catch baby boy good catch.

Speaker 3: 44:32

But both my grandmothers it was always the women that cooked. So when I saw my dad doing it and like really doing it, like making pasta from scratch or like breading beautiful chicken or whatever he was doing, making paella, he did that a lot. It was like, oh man, guys can cook. And you know, I didn't even know the whole restaurant industry and it's actually funny. So I started working with Steve, owner by Caterham Family, around you know 17 or 18, and I was cleaning dishes, cleaning dishes there. I never did it. And then, you know, went to New York and Steve always kind of like would come visit me, cause me and his son's my same age as me and it's just like a full circle. Now I'm back there and I think that's interesting, but the whole thing was watching my dad cook, I, and it's just like a full circle. Now I'm back there and I think that's interesting, but the whole thing was watching my dad cook.

Speaker 3: 45:18

I think I was like, oh man, guys can cook, I'm going to start cooking and I think I just had a natural work ethic because the way they drilled me. So my work ethic was very hardworking person, my palate was very quickly like I had one. A lot of people don't necessarily. Some people never get their palate, but my palate was there and the creativity kind of grew. But I think it was just the attraction to it. I played sports growing up so it was almost. It's a competitive field, right Like. You're on your legs, you're running around, you're sweating, you can't use the bathroom because you're behind the line for six hours cooking.

Speaker 3: 45:55

Cornstarch works in a lot of different ways, so this depends yeah whoa what?

Speaker 2: 46:01

okay, that's not if you can't get to the bathroom. He knows the story.

Speaker 3: 46:08

Oh, you should have been there, stop it I'm not going there, stop it, oh my god. But I think that competitive field it was just just, it was very. You know, I wasn't going to be a professional football player, baseball player, I knew that. But I was like man. You get in this realm and you just meet some of the coolest people, man, like some of the from all over, like some people that that you know I don't necessarily see or haven't seen in maybe seven years, but I still talk to.

Speaker 1: 46:34

Well, whenever you, when you share time in a restaurant and you do, you get your butt kicked and you might you might be in the back there and everybody's yelling and you know daggers at each other and whatever to put it nicely. But like when you do that and you go through that a little a of time with somebody, even the people you didn't like, you end up kind of buddying up with. And that's the cool part I think about the business is that you make some really good friendships and with people that you wouldn't have been friendly with, you know, because you know who they are and you know kind of what they do. But when you bleed together like that man, there's a bond.

Speaker 2: 47:19

Well it's not only that, it's breaking bread too, Like when you have a family meal we've talked about that too, you sit down, you see, especially if you're the chef or the leader, you're there with those people more than you see your own family. So they are an extension of your family. So there are going to be times where you're going to argue, there's times where you're not, but at the end of the day, when you, when you set yourself up for success and I'm about to lead into a question for you it's a great thing. My question now is taking over something has been a heritage style catering. How long has it been in business? Steve's at it for 40 years.

Speaker 3: 47:57

So 40 years, and you've got line cooks and people prep cooks that have been there for how long? Some of them, I think five, ten years.

Speaker 2: 48:03

Tim tim's been there for 20 years, so my question is like taking over a kitchen where someone's been there that long which is almost as long as you've been alive how, how do you then cater you like that cater? How do you cater your leadership skills to get that person to then buy into what you?

Speaker 3: 48:24

want to do. This is awesome Cause it's funny, cause, tim, being 20 years there, he knew me when I was a kid at the shop, so he knew me when I was little coming to the shop and now I'm there. You know, that's. It's how I would do anywhere. Being a leader to me isn't barking orders or telling people what to do and standing over or on top of people, it's getting down and dirty, right, like yeah, I can cook a pretty dish and stuff, but I get gritty, like I'm in there, I'm cleaning, I'm on my hands and knees and I will do it with you every day. There might be some days I get pulled away for a meeting, but in doing all that you gain that respect, right, so that when it comes time to like, oh, I got to get pulled away to go to a party or I got to do this and they're getting slammed, then they kind of respect that and I think that's followed me.

Speaker 3: 49:13

It took me a long time to realize that, because when I first became a sous chef, I was just, I was in a very hostile place because everyone just barking orders and we're lighting people up. That's what we did and everything kind of changed and you had to learn to kind of adapt and like what do I have to do as a leader? What leadership's quality do I have to create? And I think that was the best way is to create a leader. Like, to become a leader you have to do show a team that's been there for a long time that like, hey, I can do it, but I'm going to do it faster. I'm there before you, I'll stay after you, I'm going to clean longer than you. And you do this not again, not for a week, not for a month. You do this continuously, continuously. And then you build a team that trusts you and you don't have a target on your back and wants to be by your side and will do anything they can to help you. So you know it's just hard work.

Speaker 3: 50:09

And then in doing that, what I've learned is also another big trait about a leader is creating other leaders. Right, like, necessarily, I don't want to be the only leader. A lot of chefs have that problem. Like you know, power of like I'm the only leader, I run the room. It's not about that Like, because they want all the glory and you want everyone all eyes on you. At the end of the day, if somebody comes to the room and all eyes are on my team, my team is doing well and they've progressed, then I know that and it's a reflection of me well, you have to have.

Speaker 1: 50:43

You have to have the security in yourself in order to do that, and that's where a lot of people fall in their face well and we've talked about what's the difference between a leader and a boss.

Speaker 2: 50:54

the boss is the one, like he said it was, barking orders. A leader needs to get to roll up the sleeves and get down and dirty. I think the attribute to is like the creativity part of it, like how do you get them as a mentor and how do you get your team to like do you have tastings? Do you have like you go to a? Hey, we're going to do tomorrow. We're going to have you come up with additional.

Speaker 2: 51:14

You give them enough time whatever it is Do you do stuff like that to get them involved in menu development?

Speaker 3: 51:19

Not yet. That's definitely the plan. That's one of the harder things right that I've learned is spiking people's creativity. Mine was spiked so young and I'll never forget it. Shout out to Jesse because I fucking love him. So he created a dish and I'll never forget it. He kind of brought me to the front of the table we're doing a tasting and it was a beautiful Swiss chard pan, purdue Bavette steak. It looked like a log, and then carrots and it looked like a forest, like the whole dish. And he looks at me and he goes what do you think it needs on it? I was like man, maybe if you pickle the Swiss chard stems it'll be cool. And I said that and I'm like he's like that is a good idea. So he put it on the dish and it went on the menu and that kind of like just that little thing.

Speaker 3: 52:01

like he always kept us involved but that's a big deal, yeah and and for him and I've always told him that like we're very close friends, he runs restaurants in new york for, uh, andrew carmelini. But that little thing he did to me when I was, you know, 22, it it did something in my head where I was like whoa, like that's awesome, he like took my advice and and he was interested in what I said, he actually went through with it.

Speaker 1: 52:27

So then that made me like want to be involved even more, like I didn't feel shunned out yeah, you, you know a lot of people get a newspaper across the nose when they do stuff like that, because it's in the face of what I created Exactly, and how could you know better than me? You know what I mean, and that's something that should change. I mean, that's a. Thing.

Speaker 2: 52:50

And one of the biggest changes I've ever seen. It was Anthony Bourdain, when he was in Denmark and he was with Renee from Noma and after the shift, they had all the cooks there and they were doing it. It was, like, you know, late at night, it was, shift was over and they're literally there was X amount of chefs or cooks that were presenting dishes to the entire team and this one kid was traveling around and going to work and he picked all these things that he was doing, like Noma does, and they did the dish. And Anthony Bourdain looks at you know, Renee, and he says what do you think? He goes this is fantastic, you don't need to do anything else. This is incredible. Blah, blah, blah. And then Anthony looked at him like the normal American chef and said so is it going to go on your menu? And Renee looked at him he goes absolutely not, this is his dish. We're just checking where he's at and he's perfected what he needs to do.

Speaker 2: 53:37

And I sat there and pondered that for a minute, because you know that was 2016, 2015, when I saw that, so I'd already been in the industry for God knows how long. By that point, I'm like, wow, what a thing. Because most chefs are like that's mine, you just gave it to me, it's mine now. I'm not going to give you the credit and that, like you said, Carl, that that needs to change and what that was. How poetic. Renee sat there, the number one chef for four years in a row for the restaurant, and he said no, it's him, and that's just like what he did for you is that he sparked that creativity for you to do that.

Speaker 3: 54:18

And that's awesome. Yeah, it was, and you know he was one of the exceptions. He was really big on that Like he would bring. I always remember when I first came up it was like all the sous chefs. If you were a sous chef, you were allowed to like, do the tasting and taste the food and they would taste over the menu and they'd bounce ideas off each other. And that's kind of when I learned I'm like, wow, like it's not one person that comes up with the dish, it's like the one person that comes up with the idea for the dish. And now all of them are bouncing ideas and they're perfecting this dish and honing it in. But that's the camaraderie part.

Speaker 1: 54:44

Yeah, that's a piece of it anyway, but that's super important.

Speaker 2: 54:48

But you have to, like you said, you have to have a chef that's willing enough to be opened to do that, like when I was in Keith's and we had to do that wedding where we had people that couldn't have onion and garlic and I'm making barbecue beans.

Speaker 3: 55:01

Hello.

Speaker 2: 55:02

Barbecue beans, gets garlic and onions and I'm sorry we had to go through these and I had to be vegetarian. So we had to do. We couldn't do ham hock, we couldn't have the salt, the smokiness. There was five of us in the catering and we're all going. One said, hey, there was five of us in the catering and we're all going. One said, hey, you know what you can do. Take the coconut cream from the coconut milk and add that for fat. Take the plant-based butter and add that. Do smoked paprika for the smoke. By the time it was done people were looking at me and go can you redo that dish? I'm like, absolutely not.

Speaker 1: 55:31

There was five of us.

Speaker 2: 55:36

Nobody wrote anything down. But the dish, dish, as the whole thing culminated. It was such a great dish. I wish I would have written it down, but it was on the fly, we had to do it. Yeah right, the macgyver, the macgyver. I just remember opening up the can of beans and then going, hey, isn't it supposed to be? Like no pork. As I'm about to pour it out, he's like yeah, the beans have pork in it as they should well speaking of pork and beans?

Speaker 1: 56:05

not really so. I saw john. He took some amazing photos today. Obviously, jeff, you had some pretty dishes oh, he had a pretty dish.

Speaker 2: 56:16

I think he took the cake today I'm going to quickly skip.

Speaker 1: 56:19

I'm glazing over you. Are you doing a glaze? I'm glazing over you. You were just a setup. You were a stepping stone into what I'm getting into here. Okay, but I did. I saw some pretty photos. Why don't you talk about? You cooked today and I want to talk about it.

Speaker 3: 56:33

Yeah, I made a very beautiful dish. So it's a white fennel puree and I did a lamb kind of like a lamb rack roulade. So I took it off the bone, stuffed it with duck cell, rolled it use a little mouglou keep it all together. I seared that off and then rubbed it in garlic confit and finished it in the oven.

Speaker 2: 57:02

There was some brown butter crumble there some fennel fronds and pickled fennel stems and you had the roasted fennel, I think right.

Speaker 3: 57:05

Yeah, I had roasted fennel. So the big thing about me when I cook I'm heavy into the produce side, like I like. I love vegetables, I love everything about them, I love seasonality, I love it. I also like using the entire vegetable. So if I'm making a fennel puree, I'm going to use the stems, I'm going to pickle them down, I'm going to use the fronds. Like same thing with the lamb. Like the bone we made that made the jus. Like I'm taking the bones, I'm roasting the bones out Like any kind of fat fat I can find. I'm going to use it somewhere. Like I like to use all the product I possibly can. And that goes back to what I was taught in the beginning. Like we saved every, we compost it and or if we didn't compost to the farm, it was saved and used for a dish like that. And that was drilled in me heavily for five years at river park which kind of stuck with me throughout my whole career. It's zero weight.

Speaker 2: 57:57

And that's also about since the CEO is sitting next to me it's all about ROI and profitability. Look at that smile.

Speaker 1: 58:08

He is. It's ear to ear, right yeah.

Speaker 2: 58:11

But Dan Barber, you know, is probably the person that really put the thing on a map for us and I there's a great, huge, yeah, yeah he's up in out upstate new york and he's the one that they did a whole youtube thing about food waste and it was a great video.

Speaker 2: 58:27

It talks about zucchini and how he comes in with the door, then it shows a regular zucchini, then he shows a squash blossom and then squash leaves and then the stock and then the root and you're like holy cow, you can use the whole thing. So now I question to the farmers we work with them like hey, can you, you know, have that? Can you eat this? Cause cause certain things you can't like. I asked one of the farmers can you eat strawberry leaves? They're like we don't know.

Speaker 1: 58:49

I mean yeah.

Speaker 3: 58:50

I fell in love with the fish. That was a great thing. He if you ever watched that, which one but Dan Barber? I fell in love with the fish. Oh yeah, it's incredible. It's incredible. And just his whole thing about it was the what? The honey nut squash. He created the honey nut squash. He went to his farmer. He's like, yeah, I love butternut squash, but there the honey nut squash created, and I think he was also feeding his chickens, chickens red pepper, so that the yolk was red. It's awesome.

Speaker 1: 59:22

That kind of stuff is amazing, yeah. So how do we? How do we do that? Let's do some cool stuff. Wait for it. Can we do it in experience, science or something? Let's get a chicken and start peanut pepper. Well, well, we have chicken farmers.

Speaker 2: 59:35

We have plenty of chicken farmers. We can talk to Vicky Nicole.

Speaker 3: 59:40

Just tell them to start feeding them peppers.

Speaker 2: 59:43

Is it like a different? Like red pepper? I heard it has.

Speaker 3: 59:45

I mean, I haven't been. I've had a couple of friends. They said it has peppery notes to it Because the pepper I think chickens don't have heat receptors, like they don't feed, like you can feed them hot peppers and they don't. It doesn't bother them.

Speaker 1: 59:58

You know who does have heat John, john, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:00:03

John didn't try the Fuego. No, he didn't. No Fuego, yeah, it was delicious. Yeah, thank you.

Speaker 1: 1:00:09

All right, so what? When's your?

Speaker 2: 1:00:16

next? When's your next like big project? Getting back to work, Cause the CEO is sitting next to me.

Speaker 3: 1:00:20

Big projects. Uh, we've been working on a lot of stuff. We recently did a wedding that was a 30 people and it was we did a high end menu wine pairing, three courses. So it was the first time and it's kind of what we're trying to bring catering the family to is. Is these high end dinners right? Like we want to showcase? And not only are we showcasing the food, but I'm going out there and explaining the food to the guests and talking about it and being immersed in it, right, giving them a show. Like you know, a lot of the back of house guys and chefs, like some of them to these days, don't like to go out and don't like to talk to people I just showed one our the dinner collab we did over in orlando month or a couple months ago yeah, at the porch is it the same one you showed me when you came on?

Speaker 3: 1:01:08

I don't know if it was or not, it could have been the it could have been the first you showed me one and it was awesome was it at a farm or was it? At a market. It was inside a market, that's the market.

Speaker 2: 1:01:16

The porch market, that's the one.

Speaker 1: 1:01:17

Right. So I got to show one and, yeah, we should talk about doing some cool stuff like that. Oh, I would love that, right, I mean, I think anybody. Well, I know everyone who would be involved in it. You know, whoever's showing up, everybody would love that. Oh, I'd have a blast.

Speaker 2: 1:01:36

Well, what's great is and you mentioned it, we've mentioned it on other shows and you definitely hit it right on the nail on the head is that the experience we lost after COVID is the experience of going out and dining, having the chef come out explaining. People love that because they have the sense that they know, especially if you have the farmers there, that's next level.

Speaker 1: 1:01:56

Yeah, all of this only matters if the person talking has some character. You can't send like a you know Ben Stein, even he's, but he'd be entertaining.

Speaker 2: 1:02:07

You know what I mean, I'm just talking about the Ferris.

Speaker 3: 1:02:09

Bueller.

Speaker 1: 1:02:10

In its own, yeah, but in its own bizarro world. You know, execution, that still would be entertaining, you know. But genuinely dry people. You can't do that man, you got to get the right.

Speaker 2: 1:02:22

We talked about it with Christine because she was the front of the house. There normally is a barrier, christine. There's normally a barrier between the wall of the kitchen and the front of the house and some chefs are like I'm not going out there, but that's why a lot of them.

Speaker 1: 1:02:37

That's why celebrity chefism is a big deal, because now people who have you know, who are extroverts, now get into the kitchen and those are the ones that go out and talk to everybody and you know they walk around with a glass of wine and you know, do their thing. That's a whole nother yeah personality trait. You know, do their thing. That's a whole other personality trait, you know. But I think that's cool. Anyway, I think that UCAT you know Juan, included in this, I think has the….

Speaker 1: 1:03:03

Culinary chops, the gear, yeah, whoa. No, the culinary chops are there. I'm talking about the gear, you know.

Speaker 2: 1:03:10

Well, they have everything. Yeah, I mean, it's a one-stop shop. The sparkle, the sparkle, no, it's. What was that called?

Speaker 3: 1:03:20

from the rubber, chef, chef rubber. What were they, chef have?

Speaker 2: 1:03:21

you seen that stuff? No, I'll show you after the show. It's, it's all baking and pastry and they do a lot of great stuff. And the marketing person there, she's wonderful, but she's so itchy.

Speaker 1: 1:03:34

Madison Shout out All right. So thank you for coming on the show. Thank you one for coming on in and hanging out. Your dish was awesome. I know there's going to be really cool stuff that we're all going to do together here. A hundred percent certain. How do they find a, how do they find the company and how do they find you Find?

Speaker 3: 1:03:56

the company we're at cateringbythefamilycom. And then me, I'm zakariaxel, or underscore axel, on Instagram, so Z-A-K-A-R-I underscore A-X-E double L. You fit that too.

Speaker 1: 1:04:11

All right.

Speaker 2: 1:04:12

You know what, make sure you get some sleep and thank you for coming today. We appreciate you. You know what, make sure you get some sleep and thank you for coming today.

Speaker 1: 1:04:16

We appreciate you. You know what I was almost going to be like. Hey, let me give you the coach.

Speaker 2: 1:04:19

When I got that, hey, it's 830, or I'll be there at 830.

Speaker 1: 1:04:22

I wasn't going to let you do all this without me no you were there for eating. I was always there for eating, john, as always you both, both chefs here today. Amazing food, we are out.