Sustainable Sports Events: Eco-Friendly Equipment & Branding

In our second episode, we had the pleasure of hosting Neil Hamp-Adams, an experienced designer and marketer with over 27 years of expertise in the events industry. The topic of discussion was Eco-Friendly Equipment and Innovations in Sustainable Sports and Events, with a specific focus on branding. 

Neil shared his knowledge and insights on the significance of sustainability in the events industry, particularly in branding. 

He explained how reducing waste benefits the environment and helps clients' budgets. 

Neil discussed his sustainability journey, including his launch of Driving Force, an event management company, and the acquisition of Clever Frame and Expandabrand franchises, which provide eco-friendly branding solutions. 

Neil talked passionately about his shift towards more sustainable business practices, starting with waste reduction and expanding to energy usage and materials sourcing. Neil also gave an example of Expandabrand's commitment to sustainability by repurposing waste fabric used to manufacture flags, repurposing an estimated 14.2 tons of material, saving it from landfills and producing functional products together with Uzwelo Bags that benefit local communities.

He also explained how the Uzwelo project, in addition to providing functional products for local communities, has a percentage of its sales going to the Bateleurs, a South African Non-Profit Company (NPC) with over 200 volunteer pilots and aircraft. This organisation uses private aircraft for aerial surveillance to relocate animals around Africa and protect wildlife. 

He stressed the importance of considering sustainability in every aspect of event planning, from design to execution. 

He encouraged planners to think creatively and innovate to create Eco-Friendly solutions for branding and event equipment. 

Throughout the discussion, Neil explained his three simple principles for sustainable events: Durability, Longevity, and Reusability.

He emphasised the importance of education and awareness in driving change towards sustainability.

In conclusion, Neil's experiences and insights highlighted the significance of sustainable branding in the events industry and how it can positively impact both the environment and clients' budgets. 

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Transcript

Sid: 0:01

Welcome to the Pre Zero Sport Talk Podcast. Show your home for open, straightforward, and trailing conversations on the latest happenings in the world of sports. Leading the charge for carbon neutral sports. We bring you the most exciting and engaging discussions on the airwaves. Hi everyone. I'm your host, Sid Bensalah, a seasoned professional in the industry with over 20 years of experience. Join me as we dive deep into the latest and most compelling topics in sports with no bias or restrictions. So get ready for an honest and unfiltered journey into the world of sports that will leave you informed, entertained, and wanting more. Let's get started! Today's guest is a longtime friend and an expert in marketing and event branding with unique talent for creativity with whom I had the privilege of working for nearly 19 years on various projects and sporting events. He has always been a tremendous asset to our team. My good friend Neil Hemp Adams. Neil is a seasoned designer and a marketeer with over 27 years of experience with a degree in architecture. He brings a unique perspective to visualizing and designing spaces and brand experiences that work seamlessly. Over the years, Neil has worked across all aspects of the events industry and played a vital role in delivering major international and regional events. In 2005, Neil launched"Driving Force", an event management company that delivered a wide range of events and services. Then in 2016, he expanded his business by acquiring two franchises,"Clever Frame" Modular Exhibition System, and"Expandabrand", a portable outdoor brand. However, in 2022, Neil consciously decided to focus on delivering more sustainable solutions to his clients. He began by tackling the issue of waste reduction by offering a turnkey branding solution that manages the entire process for clients, including storage, transportation, setup, cleaning and repairs, Neil's experience and expertise in the events industry and his passion for sustainability make him a valuable guest. On our podcast, we are excited to learn more about his journey, insights and challenges in sustainability in the sports meetings and event industry. Welcome to the show, Neil. It's been a while since we last spoke. How have you been?

Neil: 2:24

Very well, thanks, Sid. It's good to catch up with you after quite some time, and thank you very much for the invite onto the show.

Sid: 2:33

Great. Before we dive in into today's topic, eco-friendly equipment and innovation in sustainable sports meeting and events with a particular focus on branding, I'm excited to catch up with you, Neil, and hear about your recent endeavors.

Neil: 2:49

Thank you, Sid. just, first of all, I'm, I just wanted to say I'm very flattered to be invited onto your podcast. and, I wish you all the successes. This is a topic that's extremely, current and, having a focus on sport is particularly intuitive and relevant. And I know your experience in that sector is obviously a key building block to the reason for this, this podcast. So I wish you all the best, and as I say, thank you so much for the opportu. I'd also like to just, preface this conversation with a small disclaimer, if I may, and that is just to, to remind maybe the listeners that I'm not, I do not profess to be an expert or an eco warrior or pioneer in the field of sustainability. In a quite the contrary, I prefer to see myself really as. As a small player, making a small difference to a very big problem. and, if I can make any contribution, it would be hopefully to get others, like myself to do the same. because if the small players make the small differences, I think this is where I think the big results can be realized. Really just, I wanted to mention that just to set the tone. I'm aware and I've listened to a couple of your previous podcasts, we've got some real heavy hitters in the space of sustainability. But it's great that you're leading someone like myself come onto the podcast to talk about how we are doing. I'm really excited about what we're doing. and, it's changed the way, I suppose my interest in the business overall. This has been completely changed and, I look forward to sharing some of the information with you. just to answer your question, really, we are a, an portable events branding supplier. We supply Flags and Tents and Gazebos and Inflatables and Banners and Backdrops, all of the portable variety. In other words, we operate in that space where people can put branding up quite quickly and easily. And obviously sports is a major area that we operate in. and the product that we produce is, in my opinion is a of a very high quality, and one of the things that I've noticed is that we have. A huge amount of wastage in this space. In other words, we supply these products, but invariably the clients just don't know how to manage them. And, that bothers me to say the very least it bothers me. But, yeah, that's really the big, the bigger picture. And, we manufacture our products outta South Africa, and I am a distributor really, of these products. And the difference I wanna make is what I do on the ground in the market that I operate in, which happens to be Dubai and, our manufacturing planters in South Africa. And so being on the ground in Dubai has given me a lot of insight into, how the product is deployed and how the product is managed. And I see some glaring opportunities, exciting opportunities, actually, on how we manage that branding.

Sid: 5:31

Great. And, can you share, Neil, your thoughts on why sustainability is becoming more critical in the sports meetings and event industry?

Neil: 5:41

I think it's no secret that, and it's very ob it's very evident to the casual observer like myself that sports events, especially the bigger global ones, they must have huge challenges when it comes to sustainability. It's, you don't have to be a rocket scientist to see that. And the amount of waste that must be generated and emissions and water consumption, must be, significant. And people are becoming more conscious of the impact that the actions have on the environment. I think it's just becoming more and more prevalent and people are just a lot more aware of this. People like myself, for example. and they're becoming more demanding, and that the sports events that they attend are sustainable, environmentally responsible. And then I think this potential for cost savings as well. if you can reduce energy and water consumption and waste production and other expenses, you can, this can lead to, to cost saving. But I just wanted to say one thing is, as I mentioned right in the beginning, the tendency is often to point at the big players because, as for them to be the first movers, in terms of being proactive in sustainability, but for every World Cup, there are hundreds and thousands, even millions of weekend games playing played at community club level for. Around the world, what can they do to make a difference? And I think there are, I think there are a lot of smaller clubs that are more agile and more able to make a difference on the ground, than possibly some of the bigger entities. So again, going back to what I said, I'm a small player, making a small difference to a big problem. And I think that is, where it's becoming more critical, but I think it's being driven by the fans and the players in the communities..

Sid: 7:17

I believe that it doesn't matter the size of, your company, but mainly your experience, Neil, you've been in this business for almost more than two decades, How can the industry reduce its environmental impact while maintaining the excitement and the spectacle of sports and events?

Neil: 7:34

Again, I'd like to address this from a small player's pers perspective, as I believe that's where we can make a big difference. And I'd like to draw an analogy to SMEs, small medium enterprises, businesses in the world. If you look at the statistics they represent about 90% of businesses, in the world are SMEs and the employer, half the world's population are employed by those SM. They are small players, but they employ half the bulls population and they are 90% of the businesses in the world. so they, and they make a big difference. They make a huge difference to the economy and in the same sort of context and model where these small players, surprisingly can make a big difference. I like, again, to answer your question is how the industry can reduce these environmental impact. I'd like to look at it from a point of view of those small operators. So again, it's just a, adopting sustainable practices, L.E.D, lighting and recycling, waste water saving technologies, transportation.

Sid: 8:33

Yeah. And is it easy to achieve? Is it easy to, to execute or it's like you said earlier, rocket science, complicated, impossible to achieve.

Neil: 8:45

I don't think it's, I don't think it's difficult at all. and it's just the big issue is the why. Why should I do it, it's easy to rationalize and intellectualize the benefits, et cetera, but unfortunately people will not do something un unless two things happen. One is they get told to by law or something happens, something catastrophic happens where they have no choice but to act and, respond and do something. And then there's, a third point, which is the one we, that's just the growing concern. And I think that's where the difficulty about how easy it is to do it. It's like when you have to do something that you don't have to do, it becomes a lot more difficult. But if you actually have a, there's a will to do something. Yes. I think it's, you can do a lot. You can do a lot. And again, a lot of what we are trying to do is the low hanging fruit. If you look at sustainability as a big subject, It's pretty overwhelming. it looks very complicated. There's so many parts to it, and sometimes it's also for me, very difficult to understand half of it. And, but then I know in my business there's certain things I can do that make the, they will make a big difference, we, you don't, like I said, you don't have to become a sustainability. Consultant and professional in order to make a big difference on the ground. And I'm talking about basic things like proper waste disposal and utilizing energy correctly, and managing transportation and, getting people involved. But like I said, unfortunately, this task is perceived to be overwhelming because it's sometimes requires funding. and that can be quite a challenge, but, in our business, if I can elaborate a little to give you an example of how we are doing, making a little bit of a difference, if we re sell, a flag to a customer, a portable flag, you have essentially two components. You have a pole and a base. Then you have the fabric. And from a asset perspective, the fabrics are effectively essentially a half to 40% of the cost of the entire flag. And the hardware, I call it the hardware, the poles, and the bases account for the other 50 or 60%. And we tend to sell everything to the client. And what actually happens is the client purchase this. They do their event. Okay. And they think they've made a wise decision because they have, they've bought some branding that they can use repeatedly on occasions in the future, which is exactly actually what we sell them. And we have clients that do that very effectively. But we have a lot of clients, unfortunately, that don't, so the reality is quite the opposite. and I'm not just saying this, I've been doing quite a lot of research, and almost every single client I talk to just goes. Where have you been? this is exactly what I need. we have bought this branding with good intentions, but we've actually created more work for ourselves. We've created a lot more headaches. we actually end up losing the branding, or it gets damaged or lost or, yeah, you name it. But we just have this dream that we're gonna use our branding again, and we go and look for those flags and we can't find them, And so what do they do? You said they go buy and more branding and I think that's where the first sort of major

Sid: 12:00

This is for every single event.

Neil: 12:03

Absolutely. I know clients that buy the branding. It ends up in a warehouse or a storeroom, or if at worst it gets lost, they actually forget to get their branding from the last event. They're like, oh my goodness, where did it, what happened to the branding? Oh, we left it at that event. Okay, we've go find it. And then they get pieces of it and they go, you know what? We this buy the new branding. And that's where I see a huge gap. And from a sustainability perspective, it's about the lifespan of a product. Nevermind what you do with it afterwards. How long can you make it last? And I think that's one thing that people. And I don't see that much in the sustainability conversation, it's about longevity. If something can be utilized for double its time, you've reduced half the waste that you would've done because you've bought, you've bought twice the amount of stuff. that, that is, is one of the challenges.

Sid: 12:51

Yeah, let's talk, a little bit about, expand the brand, which is, as you said earlier, it's based in South Africa. why South Africa, Neil,

Neil: 13:00

really, I'm, I have to feed my family, business is opportunities and, I just saw a gap in the market here. South Africa is a, it's a 25 year old company. It was a signage business, in Durban, And, they saw an opportunity. In fact, it's a bit of trivia, but the classic teardrop banner that everyone sees everywhere, another one that's shaped like a teardrop, we call it the filler banner, is actually, we have the worldwide patent for that product. We develop that product, and we have the patent for it. Of course, everyone makes them, and it's just too, it's impossible to enforce the patent. But, as I say, the company is known for. Its in. And when I spoke to, when I first came across the company, I just really liked the product. And, we all, we also, I say we, but the manufacturer in South Africa who I feel very much a part of the team for expanded brand. we make our own fabric, so we have our own loom. we don't buy our material from China, we buy the yarn, but that, from a transportation point of view, it's a lot easier to move around. But we actually make our fabrics in our factory. and yes, we have, we ship worldwide. So we actually, it's a global company and they have, offices around the. and we happen to be one of those officers. that was the one, one opportunity is the product. is top notch. Like it's probably the best that you can buy, but also,

Sid: 14:13

Say top notch, this is, vis-a-vis the, quality itself, the fabric, or the manufacturing process or both.

Neil: 14:21

The manufacturing process, definitely. So for example, having your own loom, you can weave differently for different types of performance on the different products. for example, a gazebo tent versus an inflatable, versus a flag versus a banner. They have different requirements, umbrellas. the fabric have different requirements that we designed those fabrics to perform according. We can do fire ret hardened in our fa in our, in our fabrics. so we have a lot more control and that gives us a nice competitive edge. We, it's very often people don't realize when they're buying branding, they don't even know what, whether they've got put the right fabric on there cuz it all works. But some of it, and this goes back to my point about longevity. How long does it work for? How well does it work? So it looks great when you buy it and then, after six months it's not performing properly because they've actually used their own fabric. So we take a lot of pride. Tailoring the fabric. Then in terms of the hardware, I'll give you an example of connectors. We don't, we avoid, try, avoid using rivets. We use screws, which means we can change the components, we can replace them, and fix them. Also, the, they're not made of plastic. They're made of nylon, plastic, connector and an nylon connector. You wouldn't know the difference. You wouldn't see the difference. But an nylon connector is a lot more dur. And has a lot longer. Last one. It's more expensive of course, but it's engineered to perform a lot better than a plastic connector. And tho those are the areas that we definitely, and then of course, anybody out there will understand. You look at the, you, what's an umbrella? What's what constitutes a strong umbrella? there's a lot of parts to it. and as a supplier, we take it on our take on the responsibility to supply a product that we believe will. So I feel confident that we have a very good product.

Sid: 16:04

Yeah. And your product that, is it, eco-friendly?

Neil: 16:08

So that's a, yeah, that's a, it's obviously a very good question. So when it comes to our inks, we use water soluble inks. Again, something that, we are, very consciously aware of, and we do that for the exact reason that you've asked me. So we are very proud of. we actually offer and manufacture because we have our own loom, we do, fabrics outta recycled plastic bottles. Our pet, admittedly it's an option, but it's available at a slight premium. and. we have clients that are interested in it, but I think also with this new model of sustainable, branding, which I haven't really explained yet as to why, how are we gonna manage the branding? But this, having the sustainable, using water soluble inks and having our pet fabrics are something that we can add to our mix, can potentially, make a big difference. And then, I stand to be clear, about six years ago, maybe a bit longer, seven years ago, the factory in South Africa noticed, and became very aware of the amount of, orcas wastage that we have when we manufacture a flag. Now, again, people won't know this, but when you manufacture a. The machine that produces a flag. If somebody orders one flag, the fabric's wide enough to do two, we end up with wastage. And so that just gets thrown away. and so the guys in South Africa looked at this one day and they said, how can we, what can we do with all this fabric? It's perfectly good fabric. It's brand new, but we haven't turned it into a flag because it was leftovers. So what they did a really cool concept. They created a bus, they started a business called"UZWELO". And, Uzwelo is a business that is spun off the side of Expanderabrand, which takes the off cuts. And then we use our skilled staff within the factory to train up unskilled staff people that have and bear in mind South Africa. We've got very high unemployment people that are actually literally uneducated. It's very high. Unemployment in south. I think it's 60 or 70% right now, but, and I'll stand to be corrected there, but it's high and they take people off the street and they've trained them up to become seamstresses and we make bags for underprivileged communities. More specifically school bags for children. you need to understand that in parts of Africa and South Africa, children don't have classrooms live one school bags. They sit under trees, and get taught in those kind of environments. The conditions are appalling, unfortunately, and very limited. So they have a school bag is a, is like having a bicycle. So what we, what they've done is they've partnered with corporates and utilised trained up these, ladies to, to become skilled seamstresses. The corporates help with the funding of the cost base for labor and distribution, and they produce school bags. And I think we've produced maybe 30 or 40,000 school bags over the last, five or six years,

Sid: 19:08

And this is all from the extra fabric? What originally was meant to?

Neil: 19:13

Would've been thrown away. And then on top of this, so you've got the training of, you've got, you're creating, you skill, providing skills, which allows those people to feed their families and educate their families. You're giving kids school bags. Okay. And then on top of that, the money that they raise from it, the profits that they generate from their contribute, a percentage of those goes to aerial reconnaissance In wildlife, we talking about a company, there's a, there's an organization called"BATELEURS". They, these are private individuals that air have their own aircraft, helicopters, and they do reconnaissance, looking for rhino drink, relocating animals, around Africa. They do an amazing job. They volunteer their time. And so some of the funds that we raise through the, Uzwelo project. they contribute to bateleurs to help with wildlifes. It's a fabulous story, of how a, a business has taken waste and helps in three different areas. I'm very proud of that. I love telling the story and, as I say, my job now is to see how we can transfer that extend. And improve on that when we, when the product lands on the ground in the Middle East. and hopefully, I can get more customers that want to be part of that process.

Sid: 20:24

Great you've been in the business since two decades. You've done, amazing events you've been involved with. And here I'm talking about major events. So for being a small company, I know exactly what you're capable of, Neil, and you've seen it all since almost two decades. But then for the listeners, because when you see the action on TV or even, from, let's say from the grand stand and you see the pitch, you have no idea what's goes behind the scene. Pre-event planning, executing, and then all the visual, which is the branding that you see, on pitch, off pitch in the hospitality within the village and things like that. It's a massive, How I say from the size point of view, quantity point of view, and most of it, correct me if I'm wrong, we use PVCs and we use mainly, polyester and yeah. And we are gonna talk about this from a design point of view. And I've seen it because when we host events, the biggest mistake we were doing is putting, dates. And, and then after the event, what you do, you find yourself. Hundreds or hundreds of kilograms of branding that you just,

Neil: 21:31

Absolutely. Yeah.

Sid: 21:33

I don't want to even talk about our, can we recycle the material and things? I don't want to even touch that, that point. Maybe that for another, maybe it'll be a good topic for, for a future episode. But do you see Neil in today reality where there is so many events, not only, concerts, within the entertainment, within the meeting industry. do you see that there is some solutions, sustainable solutions within the manufacturing?

Neil: 21:59

Again, simplistically, if you can get a flag that you would've only used once to be used twice, you've halved the landfill at that thing because that fabric's gonna end up in landfills. I can guarantee you that. But if you can get a flag to be used twice, you've halved the landfill. If you can get a flag to be used twice as long as it would've been used, you've haled the landfill. So it's not about, I know, I'd love to say we can reduce, eliminate the problem, but it's actually really, again, about making a little difference. So you got, you touched on it earlier about what do you put on the flag? Events tend to have, it goes without saying you've got an event and you wanna have the event logo on then the event logo's got a date on it. So that's immediately ring fences. What that flag or banner, what can do, okay. Or QR code or a website or a telephone number. It gets crazy sometimes. It's branding. I think we've gotta really understand what does this stuff mean to do? And I can tell you it's about adding color and vibrancy and visual sort of spectacle. that's what branding, especially at events, it's really about creating that sort of, what's the word I'm looking for? It's, I wouldn't say a carnival, but it's really about, Brightening up the environment, so when you look at it from that point of view. If, again, giving you a little example, if you were to imagine having a series of flags and you have, and again, event organizers are obliged to support and promote their sponsors. So what we do, and I'm guilty of this and I, and it's just the way it is at the moment is, and I'll use it a brief simple example. Like you take a flag and you put four of your sponsors logos. that flag is really only usable on that event because if one of those sponsors disappeared, the flag is irrelevant, and the chances of not being there the next year is pretty good as well. But what happens? What if you gave each sponsor a flag, okay? And then gave that flag to the sponsor to use at another event if they wanted to, because they are partners in that event. small thing like that, what if you didn't put, if you need to put the event logo on it, don't put it on every single flag. Put it on every second flag. It's about adding color and vibrancy. People won't necessarily notice that there's a logo missing on every second floor. I can guarantee you, especially if they're in a row, but these are the things that, that you can do. The other thing that, that an organized can do, and they're really with proper planning, is say, let's design this for, if you're doing events on a repeat basis, in other words, annualized or monthly, or whatever the case month, then it's a lot easier. But if you are talking about an annual event, ah, can you think about what you're gonna be doing next? And just see if you can utilize some of the branding from this year for next year. And if you think about it, you'll be amazed. You can actually achieve it and you can do a huge, a big difference. And again, it's not about eradicating, but it's about getting a li. for me, it's all about lifespan, durability, longevity, and reusability.

Sid: 24:48

And with your clients, Neil, do you engage in this, in this kind of discussions? do you, do you try to, let's say, talk to them, for the sake of, reducing the carbon footprint?

Neil: 24:59

Full disclosure. So as I said, this whole sustainable brand concept that I'm working on is very new. I've embarked on conversations with clients for the last 12 months, six to 12 months. and we have actually signed up some clients now that are interested in it, overwhelming. Because, and this is the key, when I said to you, we were talking earlier about what's the appetite to do, the bottom line is what's the benefit? Or I have no choice because law tells me I have to do it or crisis happens, but in my position by offering a client, and I think I need you just elaborate a little bit cuz I mentioned about the flags and the fabric and the components that if I may just elaborate on what our solution is. What we are gonna do is we are saying, we're saying to clients instead of buying the whole. You just buy the fabric from us, okay? And we'll keep the pole on the base and what we'll do is we'll store your flag in our warehouse for you at no cost, relatively low cost. All you do is you call us and we'll deploy your branding for you. Okay? Now this is upon the basis of a client that has branding that they redeploy on a regular basis. This is the guys that I'm talking to, I mentioned earlier that are pulling their hair cuz they can't find their branding that they bought six months. So what we do is we say to them, we'll keep the fabric for you when you need it. You just call us overwhelming. 100% of every single client I've spoken to just said to me, we would be very interested in this. There's no like, when, where do we sign up kind of thing. So we are in that process now of locking in those clients. And I look forward to being able to give you some real numbers in about three or four years time where we can show, look, this is what we've achieved because there's a logistics part to this whole puzzle. And because we do. Not the client who happens to be a, an energy drink, for example. or, I don't know any, an automotive brand. Their job is selling cars. Their job is not managing branding. Be because we do it and we store it and we clean it. Will you repair that? So when that brand, when that flag gets damaged and it will get damaged, that flag gets toned, we fix it. We extend its lifespan. We bring it home, we clean it, we put it in a nice air tight storage container. We know that when it comes out in three, four months time or three weeks time, it's ready to go and it looks amazing. So the client knows that because the headache part and the here, my point said the headache is the part that they're interested in, not so much the sustainability. And I hate to, and I might be wrong, but again, it's a need. So we address two things. One is we say we can make your life a lot. And we are gonna, in the process, we're gonna save you money because your brain is gonna last three times longer. Plus, again, I hate to admit this, but we are saying, plus you're doing the right thing from the environmental point of view, and it makes the whole pitch,

Sid: 27:47

w Yes. When you mentioned the environ.

Neil: 27:49

Yeah. I, no, it's exactly, and that's what I said to you, Syd. It's it's, I wouldn. Again, it depends on individuals, I don't think, people are jumping up and down with excitement. I think they're more interested in the headache removal and the money saving and then, okay, great. We're doing the sustain, the sustainability part is, and I have to be careful because, some people genuinely do actually like that, and I, and only time will tell where I can say to them, which is more important to you? The headache removal? The money saving? Or the environment?, the fact that we are gonna extend the lifespan of your product and it's gonna get you, you know what, which is we, which one ranks highly that, it's a tough one because I think we all know what the answer says. People are running businesses yet, and there's no regulation. The pressure's coming on from society and certain, certain governments, there is, there are, there, there are significant moves. I know, As living in Dubai. It's an oil-rich country and there's a lot of eyes on this part of the world and a lot of fingers pointing, but they are making major strides in the recycling sort of sector, and it's very easy to criticize, but I can see things changing, and there's a lot of conversation about it as well, which is important.

Sid: 28:56

Yeah. And do you know, other companies that, or organizations that, have overcome, this kind of challenges and taking, let's say actions and, with their, products, advancing the main issue of, environment impact.

Neil: 29:10

I can't, again, that's an area I can't really comment on. I'm not, I wouldn't be, Yeah, I can't think of anything off the top of my head that I can give you any real examples. You got me on the spot there. Actually. I didn't. I can't think of anything there that,

Sid: 29:23

Since you deal with so many actors, within the event industry, through your network, through let's say, I would not say the competitors and stuff like that, but, what's the mood? what's the trend, do you see a will in terms of doing the right thing? And thinking out of the box, number one, to see what are the simple way to reduce the carbon footprint, And, and second maybe, the companies or the, the various organizations, when you interact with them, is it a topic that is, important now or it's, a topic that, no one wants? Even

Neil: 30:01

No, I think, yeah, I get, I see what you're saying and I definitely think there's, that topic is, five, 10 years ago wasn't even on the, it wasn't really on the radar. But I can, I, I honestly can say that I see it more and more, as every year goes by, I'm just seeing more and more evidence of it. It's taking time. Okay, let's not get ourselves. But I do see it, and I see it popping up a lot, in certain, clients, events. They have some sort of, they have some prerequisites in terms of what they want to do and what they want to achieve. but again, it's this perception. You need a sustainability officer in order to implement sustainability because it's quite complex and you've gotta go and measure it. And you've gotta, if you wanna start claiming to be sustainable or doing sustainable things, you can, you have to measure it, to be, you have to have evidence that you're doing it and you, before you can claim it. You know what I mean? I think that's what makes people a bit nervous is okay, if we do it, but how do we measure it? And then it's, oh, it's gonna cost money to measure it because you. you have to do it before and do an after, for example. But I just, I gen I genuinely do think that there's, there's a move to it. There's a lot more awareness, and awareness is one thing, but action is another. And, but I am seeing things, I am seeing signs of it,

Sid: 31:09

But in your case as a business, how do you balance the environmental concern with the financial goals?

Neil: 31:17

From my perspective, again, as a small operator, my, my bus, this business or sustainability business is, it's, my business is built on the solution. it's a, a very nice position. It's if I can get clients to go, yeah, we want to save money and take away headaches and save the environment, then I'll do it for them. And we can be economically viable doing, which is the exciting part. I find that, that's the part that excites me is this is not going to clients and ask necessarily to spend more money. It's going to clients with a solution that can make a big difference and save the money and time and the environment. So it's like a, it's a win. When it goes back to what we were talking about, it's what do you put on the flag? do you need to put 60 flags up? Why? these aren't difficult questions. And how are you making sure that flag lasts? That's the real question for me is this, if you put a pair of jeans up on a pole out in the, in, in the sun here in Dubai, don't expect it all to be a flying in six months time. It's not gonna happen. and the same guys for any polyester or any other material that you use, I. It's, it wears down, it disintegrates, and then you've gotta buy more. So the question is, how often do you have to buy more? That's the real question. And there's a huge opportunity in my opinion. Yes, from my side as a business owner, I see an opportunity here to drive revenue. and solve a problem at the same time, which is really exciting. I think a lot of area. In other areas, it's a lot more challenging. So yeah, I mean it's, yeah, I think there's, we are in a, we're in a very good position to be able to make a difference.

Sid: 32:48

Yeah, on a broad, aspect. Neil, what emerging technologies or trend do you see shaping the future of sport and events industry?

Neil: 32:56

you spoke earlier about, Stadium branding versus the broadcast branding. were you talking about the punters in the stadium, what they see and what people on, on, they see on the screen. And, I think, event organizers, this, and I haven't seen a lot of it. I've seen a bit of it, but I don't think I've seen enough. But, and maybe it's so good that I haven't noticed it. You've got a hundred thousand people in the stadium. They're there to watch the players. I'm using football as an analogy or Formula One. Yes, the branding is important for those a hundred thousand people, but you're broadcasting to billions and the technology exists that you can brand a stadium through augmented reality or, VR. and so you've gotta look at that number and say, are the fans in the stadium? Cuz all the branding that you need to do, it's so much easier to implement on, on, on screen even. It's, first of all, it's easy to do. Secondly, you can do a lot more with it. You can be very creative with it. You could brand larger surfaces and do amazing stuff with augmented reality. So the question is do you really need to brand the stadium when you, to that level that you do because you are there and it looks great. But the fans are there to play the fans are there to see the players. They see, they're there to see the goal score. They're there to see the main straight with the Formula One drivers, they're there to see the action. The branding is important, don't get me wrong, but again, remember what I said earlier. I was like, I always if you reduce the branding by half, you've saved half. Have you eroded the value of the event by half? That's the real question. the, I've been guilty of it as well, so there's. You've got a hundred meters of hoarding to brand so you brand a hundred meters because it looks nice, is that the right way to go about doing? is that wise? I don't know, I don't know!

Sid: 34:39

Yeah. And from a technology point of view, or from a trend, do you see more digital, branding onsite than classic standard, PVC billboards, flags?

Neil: 34:53

I don't know enough to be able to give you a, I'm gonna give you my opinion. Yes. I don't, it's not an educated answer, but, the L.E.D technology that exists. When on face values hugely, it's got this idea of reusability, right? So you can, it's can be reconfigured so you can change the branding, but what does it cost to manufacture? Where does it get manufactured? And I don't know those numbers.

Sid: 35:19

And to power those, screens

Neil: 35:21

And to next one. It's That's another, yeah, exactly. and how long do they last? And all those kind of things. on, the surface, yes, I. and one thing I do know cuz Evident is that the price is going down because the volumes are going up. More and more people are, so it used to be the realm of a Premier League stadium. It's now creeping into, more domestic environments. And, I mean they're gonna be L.E.D screens. That entire world is gonna be surrounded with L.E.D screens. I think it's inevitable, but really what is it, what is the real impact, as you say, from a power consumption perspective? Et cetera, et cetera. I dunno the numbers there, but, again, it's the same, there's the debate about electric cars versus internal combustion engines. The debate, what is the footprint,

Sid: 36:05

Your take, regarding offsetting Neil

Neil: 36:08

12.

Sid: 36:10

Offsetting a word that we keep hearing continuously.

Neil: 36:14

It's like putting a bandage on a wound. Yeah, I mean it's, I think the concept is a, people are seeing through that. It's just because you're destroying something, planting a tree on the other side of the world to offset that isn't necessarily the best way to go about doing it. So I'm, I get it. I think the question is what does that offset look like in reality? And then I think the priority is not to do the, to have the wound in the first place. You know what I mean? I think that's the real priority is to just, and it's easy to greenwash like that and just go, okay, Used up all this energy, how we're gonna re, set, put it back. And I don't know, it's a start, but it's not, I don't think it's, excuse the expression, I don't think it's sustainable. You know what I mean? I don't think it's necessarily the right answer.

Sid: 37:00

Yeah. Yeah. Now it's time for our lightning questions and, what's your perspective on the future of sustainable sports and events?

Neil: 37:11

It's here, it's happening. and everyone can, I think everyone, and I mean from a business side of perspective, but even individuals, but everyone can make, do their bits, whether it's putting pressure on their local clubs or further higher up the food chain. They, if everybody makes their bit that does their bit, they can make a huge difference. So the initiatives that you can do on the ground, and I really believe. The bigger organizations will get the pressure that they need from the media, but on the ground it's like really where we can make a big difference. So strengthen numbers, communities just be responsible. It's not really up to the organizers, but it's up to the fans to put pressure on them, in my opinion. And this is just. I think that's obvious. that when people, like I said, people will do something because they're told to do it or they have to do it. So if it's a big organization and they're getting pressure from the fans, then they will respond. They're not necessarily gonna be proactive. And, and that's unfortunately how the world works. But the change is coming. I believe it's coming and it's the right thing to do.

Sid: 38:14

Yeah. What book, movie or documentary do you recommend for people on sustainability?

Neil: 38:23

In light of what the small changes and the small difference is a really nice, video on YouTube, on the"Worldwide Waste Channel", on the Inside Business. they've got a channel there and it's called,"Meet Eight Young Founders, Turning Trash Into Cash". And, the fascinating stories out of Kenya and the USA. Youngsters or, recycling glass, making bricks out of tires, and doing amazing stuff, and you can be cynical and say, oh, but it's not scalable or very difficult to do it, whatever. when you're doing it at that level, you discover things and you learn things and they, it's very evident in the video that. They will move on to bigger things, but it's it's those little differences that make the big differences. Cause you don't see them. But then suddenly you realize, okay, we've got rid of all that glass, or we've got rid of all those types. and then there's also another very interesting documentary on, Singapore has fixed its trash problems. That's also one to check out. unbelievable. literally. Converting waste at a turning it into proper, usable landfill, not just, I'm talking about in a product that has been sifted, cleaned, separated, incinerated, and turned into a, into a charcoal type base. and that's, you can plant in it, So it's not just landfill in the true cents the word. so yeah, there's some great examples.

Sid: 39:43

Good. Can you share me a personal story highlighting your passion for sustainability?

Neil: 39:49

We are working on some really exciting initiatives with, a new apparel partner. they're called,"REFLOW" and they manufacture apparel out of recycled plastic bottles. And what makes them unique and the part that I really find exciting about their business is that it exists. It's founded on sustainability. We were talking about earlier, it's what are companies doing and what are organizations doing to do sustainability? This is a complete opposite. It's like a, the reason for being is sustainability, which is quite interesting. when you have that as your basis, and it's the foundation for your existence, it's not just a quota. I think it makes a big difference because you, when you talk to these guys, they are thinking right from where the, where those plastic bottles come from, right to, what the end game is in terms of, of the product that they're make and what they want to do with that product and the message they want to get out. The big apparel companies, they have their sustainability risk, but that's 3% of their volume, and so it's a bid. Then I don't see that they're ever gonna be able to change the entire business model to become fully sustainable. Like these guys, when you build your business on a sustainable baseline. You logic tells me that, your trajectory is gonna be, that you're gonna be a lot more, and of course, consumers and fans are gonna, are going to, follow. But just on that point about plastic bottles, one of our challenges in South Africa with our recycled plastic is to find bottles. Can you believe that Sid? and yeah, it's it to find them, to get them to source some, get them together so we can recycle them, it's it's amazing. So we are working with Reflow now in football with some really, but we are having conversations with them, but it's about how can we help collect plastic bottle. You can imagine you've got the technology to recycle, but no one can get the bottles. And I think this is a problem around the world. So if we want to, the facilities exist, they're having to import plastic bottles. Can you believe that? Which is completely counterintuitive. It just makes no sense.

Sid: 41:48

I've never heard something like that. Yeah.

Neil: 41:49

Yeah. Yeah. So it's a real problem. so you can't get the plastic bottles to make the recycle fabric. yeah, that's, there's always a challenge.

Sid: 41:58

Yeah. One piece of good advice for the listeners on any topic.

Neil: 42:04

I think the need for change is everywhere. but maybe one of the reasons that isn't happening fast enough is because we don't always believe we can help. And again, it just goes back to the small differences. you just, you sometimes think it's there's nothing I can do. you feel lot you can do and you don't have to do it all. That's another thing. If people look at the. And they go, are we compliance? Have we got all these things lined up? And you check and you just look at the list and you go, no, I'll just walk away. But actually, no, just do one thing and you're doing so much more than everybody else. I think, we need to believe that we can help. We need to believe that we can make a difference. And then, you can start achieve that. And then going back to events. Event organizers are, they're, they live in the moment. They're live, they're on the ground and it's intensive. It's a weekend or a day or a night. They are very focused and they're very sensitive to feedback that they get at the time and immediately after the event. So if you see some fundamental environmental areas at the next event you attend, then you should say something at least at the right time. But get it out there because, Unlike a established business that gets this noise all the time, they don't hear it, in a finite point. And so the tendency is to just look at it long term. I think event organizers, you have that ability to get to you. You do have an opportunity to make a point about something that's happened at that moment. And so that's again, a nice opportunity to I wouldn't say ruffle the feathers, but certainly to make a point. You make a point. Yeah. Cuz it's there and it's now.

Sid: 43:40

Yeah. And I wanna ask you, Neil, about a recommendation to keep the podcast conversation going. Who do you think we should talk to or invite as a guest?

Neil: 43:52

Wow. I mentioned Reflow earlier. I think they would be amazing. And I, and the reason is because having had conversations with them, these are guys that are, they're in the wheelhouse. they are really, the whole business exists. And when you talk to them, You can see they're very extremely focused and passionate about the subject of sustainability. It's a really very important part of their business. And so they're talking to the stakeholders, the big organizations, they're talking to private sector companies, governments about this. And they have the full story, and they know the challenges. And I think you'd have a fabulous conversation with them, if you could organize that. So

Sid: 44:32

Fantastic, thank you.

Neil: 44:32

be my,

Sid: 44:33

Yeah. I will reach out to them and I will mention your name if you don't mind.

Neil: 44:37

no, I'm, I'd be more than happy to make an introduction cuz they're, as I said, I think they're doing an amazing job, yeah.

Sid: 44:43

Excellent. we come now, at the end of, our conversation. Thank you Neil, for sharing your insight and expertise on this critical topic. Thanks a lot.

Neil: 44:52

Thank you Sid. I really appreciate it. It's been a lot of fun.

Sid: 44:56

Sustainability is no longer just a buzzword, but a critical consideration for sports events and the meeting industry. True innovative solutions and eco-friendly equipment, we can reduce our environmental impact and create more sustainable experiences for clients, fans, and participant alike. Thank you, Neil, for sharing your insights and expertise on this critical topic. As we wrap up today's episode, we encourage our listeners to think about how they can prioritize sustainability in their own lives and in the sports meetings and events they attend to organize. Let's work together to create a more sustainable future for everyone. Thanks for tuning in and we'll see you next time on the Pre Zero Sport Talk. If you enjoyed this podcast, please download, subscribe, write a comment, or let us know what topic you would like us to cover in future episodes. Thanks for joining our Show. Tune in next time for more open, straightforward, and exciting sports conversations. Have a nice day.