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In this episode, we cover:
Use my code JACY10 to save on your order of Gut Personal Supplements! Visit www.gutpersonal.com and take their online quiz to get personalized recommendations of supplements for your gut health needs! I recommend starting with the Miracle Worker! It is my favorite and will literally TRANSFORM your sleep.
Want to Connect with Dr. Christine Jehu?
Listen to Beyond Your Limits HERE
IG: @therealdrjehu
Remember that, you are worthy. You have value. You get to take up space in this world simply because you exist. Don’t let anyone, including yourself, convenience you otherwise. If that idea or vision for your life is in you, then it is for you.
Need a Community of Audacious Women to Join:
⚡Join the Have the Audacity: Audacious Human Free Facebook Community:
CLICK THE LINK HERE
⚡Click Here to Access Our Podcast Guest Self Care List:
CLICK THE LINK HERE
⚡Want to Work Together?:
ALL THE DETAILS HERE
⚡ Connect on Instagram:
CLICK THE LINK HERE
Want to Support the Have the Audacity Podcast?
⚡I would love it if you take 30 seconds to leave a 5 star review and a rating sharing why you love this podcast! If you have left a review, please share it with a friend!
Hi and welcome to the have the Audacity podcast, where we are all about living our own version of our best life. My name is Jacey. I'm a multi-passionate human obsessed with personal growth, and I want you to come on this journey with me, where we share our stories and learn tools, tips and tricks to live the life we were always meant to live. So let's lean into the uncomfortable celebrator highs and embrace our lows, because all of it's important. It may get a little messy, but it's time to have the audacity. Hey, audiences, human, I'm so glad you're here and.
Speaker 1:I am so excited for today's episode. I am excited to introduce you to one of my friends and I feel like it is such a privilege that I get to call this powerhouse of a woman my friend. So let me give you some context about how literally I manifested this moment. I tell her.
Speaker 1:I want to say on the call, we talked a lot before the call. We talked for an hour after we recorded this podcast episode. It was so good. But anyway, leave us some context.
Speaker 1:She hosts the podcast. It's called Beyond your Limits, but it used to be called Beyond the Couch, with the real Dr J. That's her Instagram handle and I started listening. Beyond the Couch was one of the first podcasts I listened to, Like 2018, 2019 times, 2020, like that's when I was really getting into the podcast, basically listening to them. She was one of the first ones I listened to and actually her podcast was what really was one of the catalysts to me really getting into therapy and for the next year and changing the trajectory of my life in a lot of ways and you know so it was huge. And so I listened to her podcast all the time and she went to the same event that I went to in Phoenix in 2022. And from that time we had mutual friends and I had seen her in on Zoom calls and was like she's really cool and I followed her on Instagram.
Speaker 1:For a few years she's been listening to her podcast and I reached out to her and I was like, hey, I love what you talk about and I really wanted you to come on Because I've heard her talk about her zero fucks method and I was, like everybody, I have the audacity, you need to hear this. Like you have to hear this woman. I'm pretty obsessed with this and so I was like you have to come on, Like I want you to come on, so will you. And of course she was like yes, I mean of course, like yes. She was like yes, I would love to come on. And so we schedule it and literally halfway through the call, I'm like she's going to be my friend, we're going to be friends. Like from this moment, we are friends, we're going to be friends.
Speaker 1:And so it's a funny, it totally comes through in the conversation and like, by the end, if you like fiction books, tell her about, we're talking about self-ca, let me know, Totally, read it with us. So, be a thing, the people want to do it, we're going to do it. Oh, it was just fun. Like it was just a fun conversation and so much value in it. It was just a fun conversation. Today's guest I have on Dr Christine J Hu and I'm so excited we're just gonna jump right on in. Thank you so much for being on the show. Yeah, of course, Thanks for having me. So if the listener has unfortunately never met you before, knows who you are.
Speaker 2:Can you give him a?
Speaker 1:little like you're. You're gonna want to be in her world after this, I promise, but can you a little overview of who you are?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I am a clinical sports psychologist and a lot of people are like what is that? So I have training in mental health. So I have a PhD in counseling psychology. My master's degree and my specialization is in sports psychology. So I get to do mental health performance enhancement with Division one student athletes which listen. When I found out that I could do sports and psychology as a job, I said sign me up. And then, 15 years after I learned about the field, I landed my the job that I got into the field to do and I've been doing that for about four years. So that's what I do, you know, in the nine to five situation, but I've been an athlete my whole life and I also have a podcast it's called it's now it used to be called beyond the couch and now it is called beyond your limits where we really just talk about all things personal development, mental health but all through the lens of high performance and how to level up our lives.
Speaker 1:And I have been like. I listened to your podcast when it was beyond the couch and I was like I and I'm never told to this. I listened to it like from the beginning, thank you. I actually, like several years ago, when I got into therapy and stuff, it was from listening to your podcast.
Speaker 2:Stop it. I had no idea.
Speaker 1:Yes, that's incredible, that it was like. So I was like I need to tell her because I've never told you that that was what got me into it and really was like a huge moment in the trajectory of my life now. So thank you?
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh, that's incredible, of course, thanks for sharing that with me.
Speaker 1:But I'm just I'm so excited and I like well link your podcast and show notes because everybody needs to listen to it. It's so good. We were just talking about an episode before we hopped on that I listened to, that, we had a mutual friend that you had on, and but I really want to talk to you today about in your perspective.
Speaker 1:it's the holiday time and burnout seems to be a thing right now in a lot of conversations that I've been having with listeners and even just people in my life. I'm a teacher and so really filling it right now and I and I felt like it was something 2020 really opened our eyes to, with like the pause and what that was, and then I felt like now that we're in 2023, about to be in 24, it's almost like we've forgotten the lessons of being slow, yeah, and we're just back into the rat race of it. It seems like at least that's been like my perspective in conversations with it.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And. But we also know that it doesn't feel right, because we remember what it felt like to have a pause, yeah, and I felt that's made, like the discomfort in this, different than absolutely I've experienced it in the past.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because we haven't had the contrast before, right, like I talked to folks in therapy about this a lot, right, especially if you let's use anxiety for an example and people who've had panic attacks are just really high level anxiety and then you get a handle on it through therapy, maybe introduce some medication, and you have such a decrease where you can breathe again. Right, because you've kind of lived this life of oh wow, I'm used to this heightened state of being and then you have that decrease. So then anytime it peaks back up, it feels like such a contrast because you now have two ends of the spectrum, so there's a bit more room to move and you know what it feels like to feel good and you really know what it feels like to not feel good.
Speaker 1:No, I think that's such a, that is such a good like point of the contrast of it, because it has been, and I know like I have just been in conversation with people like I don't know what to do, yeah, like and even like listening there and you know, I feel like a good start would just be like you know what, how do you explain burnout? Because it's kind of a buzzword but not everybody knows exactly, like, if what they're feeling is burnout.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, you know burnout's going to look different for every person and I think, as you were, as you were leading into this, it just makes me think about the pandemic. Yes, slowed us down and the pandemic brought so much more to light for people. So I always say to folks if you claim that your mental health wasn't impacted during the pandemic, then you are not self aware, because we were all impacted in some way, and some of us more than others. But we all had a drastic shift in that immediate slowdown and then for some people they had to keep going, right, Our first responders and folks who are working in retail that was still going. So I just completely lost my train of thought. So we've all been impacted by it, right, and so it. I think everything feels just as different on the other side of the pandemic and so our baselines may have shifted right, as here's where I was going right, as our mental health has been impacted. That stability, that baseline likely looks very different for most people because we've realized, okay, I like maybe a slower pace of life or being at home for some people was actually better because it decreased the stimuli around them and slowly and slowly we have been reintroduced back into life. And I'm speaking very broadly, right, Because there are some spaces where it was zero to a hundred.
Speaker 2:Pretty quickly, you know, athletics kind of snuck back in. You know, we were competing, we didn't have fans in the stands in a lot of places, and then all of a sudden it was like the, at least in college athletics. It was the next academic year and it was like, boom, we're back to normal, nothing's changed. And I'm like, but half the people around here are still wearing masks and like we're testing every other week. You know it. Just, it was this bizarre juxtaposition, almost, and this expectation of go back to reality when actually our reality has, or, like normal, when everything has been completely changed. You know, this virus didn't just go away, it's now a part of our everyday life and so all that to say there's so many stimuli in our world has just changed that I think we are all. Our filters are different, right, Our filters for the world. We have this new like illness filter and, hopefully, an increased sense of self and an increased sense of need that shifted as we went through this massive global experience. And so when that slow isn't there, when the elements that we need to re stabilize, to re ground ourselves aren't there or they start to tip. I just think, again, going back to that contrast, it feels just stronger and more of a stark contrast which sets our equilibrium off right. And then if we're, it's a slow creep is what I'm seeing.
Speaker 2:For a lot of folks it's not this one thing where you know if you're in school and all of a sudden it's midterm week, yeah, everyone's going to get off their their baseline and you're going to feel really burnt out because you are just going and going and going and going.
Speaker 2:Or if you've got a really big project at work that's taken up a lot of time, or you know a relationship that's going sideways, those are very clear things that you can identify.
Speaker 2:But as we've returned back to life as it is today, I think those, those stressors and those elements that are maybe tipping us just a little bit, are showing up in multiple spaces of our life just differently than they were pre pandemic. And it's that cumulative effect, I think, for many folks, especially when all of a sudden you feel like you've run into a brick wall and you don't know how you got there. And that's where I say, okay, well, let's pause and look at all of the areas of your life and over the last, say, two to three months, what has started to shift? What have you noticed? Where are some of those little like nagging pokes that just keep coming and keep coming, and keep coming and keep coming and then all of a sudden you're like, wow, I've had a million little pinpricks coming from the front, the side, the back, and now you're really hurting. I think that is some of what burnout looks like.
Speaker 1:That was so eloquently put in and I feel like can really resonate with a lot of people listening is that I've seen that even I was, as you were explaining it. I was like, oh, I can see that in myself in some aspects of like, oh, all of a sudden, even just I know there has been like the great resignation like we're in, that everybody, like there's a large group of the population that's I don't like what I'm doing. Yeah, this is it. And especially like in my field, like they're mass exodus right now, yeah, and they're such a huge teacher shortage and it's like you kind of woke up to oh wait, this isn't working, and like I was okay with this before, but now that I know, like there's that contrast different, and then you're just kind of navigating in this land of, okay, what do I do next and what?
Speaker 1:is shifting everything and honoring the fact that that's stress in and of itself.
Speaker 2:Yes, Absolutely yeah, I mean those changes. What they say like changing a job, moving, a shift in a relationship, whether it's a marriage or divorce or a loss like those, are major life changes that we tend to see folks experience difficulties with. But then some people had all of those at one time, right or in a in a six month period. I mean that's a. It's a lot to navigate.
Speaker 1:And I think we just live in this like Amazon Prime, filtered Instagram, picture perfect world where it's like, oh. Like. Where it's like glamorized like, oh, no. Like, if you're not happy, like change job, like that's great and I mean it is, but nobody on, like we don't talk about hey, you know that relationship was unhealthy and you left it and you know that was the right choice, but like, that's hard and that's still stressful.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. And it uproots so many parts of your life.
Speaker 1:You knew like you needed a different job and you like that was a good choice for you and you know that, but like that's still hard and we just focus on the good. And you're like, okay, why do I feel awful? And now, why is this bleeding into other areas of my life? Absolutely, and I had was listening to one of your episodes and it really changed everything, like helped me a lot, and I was like we have to talk about this. That I felt like part of what's going on, especially like in job situations where you're just feeling this, like you're not happy, the burnt out, anxious, low energy and it kind of tense. I've seen it bleed over into where you're just unmotivated in other areas of your life now. But you talked about identifying your values and how, looking at, is what you're putting time on, where you're spending your time actually aligned with your values? Yeah, yeah, and so that was huge for me and like if you told me, I was like Okay, we got to expand on this, cj's got to got to share this one.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, you know I was, I was sharing with you a little bit. You know, like I think I've recognized burnout in my life and some misalignment of values and just to share a little bit, I in. I was like, what year are we in? I still cannot believe. It's like the end, almost the middle of November, like I still feel like it's July. So at the end of 2022, or like fall of 2022, I asked my ex-wife for a divorce and through that process and at the start of 2023, I really realized that I had used my job as a coping strategy. So rewind even further and my the final year. Well, let's go a little bit further.
Speaker 2:In the summer, between when I finished my master's program and I started my doctoral program, my father was diagnosed with stage four cancer and he was battling cancer nearly the entire time that I was in my PhD program and on our final year of our programs, we have to do basically a residency, and so I had moved back to my hometown and was where I was matched for my residency and my father ended up passing away that year and I went into pure survival mode and I put all of my focus not all of it, but the majority of my focus into my career, because I had this understanding of myself that if I didn't anchor myself in something, then I wasn't going to finish. And I had just done seven years of graduate school like six and a quarter at that point and I was like I could finish in this thing. You know, like we're going ham. And then this it was like the year from from hell, honestly, and it just was like a series of unfortunate events that occurred that year, and so I stepped into this, into this place of survival that carried me through the next seven years of my life, and so I recognized that part of surviving was over functioning, particularly in the workplace, and so I went into 2023, with a commitment to come back to myself, to reground to. You know, my my ex-wife had moved out.
Speaker 2:At that point. I was a fresh start. I painted this room and got new furniture you know all this stuff and it was like I am no longer going to over function. I'm going to go to work at the time I'm meant to be at work. I'm going to leave at the time I'm meant to leave, and in athletics sometimes that ebbs and flows. You have to go to games or whatever. But I was also going to give myself. If I stayed for a game then I was going to come in later, you know, some other time. I was actually going to do do only what was intended for me to do on my job and not completely and utterly over function. And I'm still working on it.
Speaker 2:But in the process I was recognizing that I had been so over identified with this value of work in my life which as a psychologist it's a bit hard because it is so much of, at least for me, that identity, is so much of who I am as a person. And so it's been recognizing I can still really value work but it's no longer my lifeline and I value it but I don't needed in the same way that I had been using it for the last eight years of my life. And part of that is the bleed over right from graduate school, where you're sort of trained to let school consume your life. So I mean that's a whole other podcast we could get on about how all of that happens. So I was recognizing too that you know, through my last relationship and moving and this, this focus on on my career, that I got so removed from building meaningful relationships. And when I looked around, I was like, wow, I have great people around me, but I didn't actually feel like I knew how to cultivate relationships anymore. And when I look back to times in my life when I felt grounded and I felt like I was thriving yes, my, my career was there, but it wasn't taking over. I had really great relationships in my life. I was playing soccer, doing some sort of physical activity that involved other people, and you know a couple of other things in terms of hobbies or spirituality and things like that and I realized I didn't have any of that outside of my career to the level that I knew I needed to be my full self. And so I've spent this last year trying right. Trying it's not perfect trying to be really intentional in re grounding myself in some of those areas and it has been so transformational.
Speaker 2:And and in some of those right, like going back to values based action is also a way to. When we talk about burnout, there is actually a really, really great book that's called burnout and I'm obsessed with it, but it's it's completing the stress cycle. And so when we engage in meaningful relationship, when we do physical activity, when we laugh, when we have I always tell my students consensual touch with other people, right, like those are ways that we are communicating to our body hate. We're safe and I think if we tie this back and that helps complete the stress cycle, all of the things that are happening under the under the hood, if you will, that we can't see, that keep us alive and keep us well. So much of the pandemic turned on this heightened level of we're not safe because there's this invisible threat that we can't see and people were literally dying around us, and so I think we were also turned on and you know, like thinking about a car, right, we are just revving the engine over and over and over and over again and we're burning out.
Speaker 2:Burning out the engine and so coming back, like tying these together right of one of those ways that, if you're recognizing that there's burnout, I think a lot of people are like I just need to shut it down for a day, I need to go to the spa, I need to do these like fancy things, when really it's if we can come back and ask ourselves what are my values, what's truly important to me and am I living in alignment with them?
Speaker 2:And it's not a total overhaul. It's what's the first thing that I can do that helps me start to realign, and for me that was okay. I'm going to pull back in my work and listen people. I'm not slacking off, I'm an overachiever but I put boundaries up, really firm boundaries up, and at the same time I focused on intentional relationship building and I did that for like three or four months and then I've started to add in other pieces and make adjustments in other areas and slowly I could. I can honestly tell you that in the last three weeks of my life, even though I haven't sick for most of that, I feel more like myself then I have in the last eight to nine years. That just with that realignment Let me not say just with that intentional realignment- yeah, no, I just like that's a lot, there's a lot of work.
Speaker 1:I see a lot of myself, like I identify a lot with what you're saying. I myself am an overachiever and I have recently, like in this year with teaching, like I did the same thing, like my whole life was teaching, like that was it. And I looked around and was like I only have friends for teachers in the building that I work at. We get together, we only talk about school.
Speaker 1:Yeah exhausting and I was like, beginning of the year, you'd like fill out, you know, like, what are your hobbies? And I'm like, ooh, work, works, not a hobby. I don't have all these anymore. I'm like reading books about work, like this.
Speaker 1:Is that, literally, was where I'm at and the part part was was so real was that I was very good at my job in that and you get praised for it that feedback cycle. So then you know you're stuck in this loop and I found myself like really hitting, and it was during, like this. I was one of those people like, yes, my anxiety was at an all time high during the shutdown, like invisible threat. That was really rough and but I also was like living my best life because I was majorly like depressed at my job and I liked being home, yeah, and I just was like, oh, I like this. And it was really weird because it was like I was stressed about everything going on, but I was like I like not being there and I didn't realize that. And so then I like intentionally came back with with those boundaries of like and I had to start very baby like, baby steps of like, instead of saying till six, like we're going to stay until 530.
Speaker 1:Yeah, really good about that. Like, okay, now it's five and I have it down where now it's like one day a week I stay late and like that's what feels good for me, because I like, because I'm an overachiever and I like for myself to get a lot of things done, and. But it was a process and like I want to speak to and I wonder, like how your experience was when you start doing that. It doesn't feel great, and like the initial I'm going to, I mean, I'm sure it didn't feel great. If, when you were like, if I stay late for a game, I'm going to come in later the very first time, did that feel where you're just like, oh no, this is great. It was like it was kind of not anxiety, not anxiety, but you know, like this comfort.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I think not necessarily in that regard for me, because I have done that at other points in my career, but different because I'm the head of my area, and so in that regard it was like oh, but you're in charge, aren't you supposed to be there? And then it's like you're in charge, so yeah, you're the one who's staying late. And then I was like wait a second, the house is not going to burn down, we're going to be okay. Everybody has your cell phone number, like you're good.
Speaker 1:You're good. Yeah, I love that, like just the reminder, like it's not going to burn down. Not going to burn down, it's going to be okay, yeah, and I feel like we forget that. And I know I've had conversations with people and I'm unfortunate, like with podcasting, get to connect with people all over the globe and I'm like this is kind of like an American problem. It's not, seriously, it's such an American problem.
Speaker 2:It's so gross. And that's where I think, like one of the things, too, that I have been working with my athletes on, but also challenging myself, is to identify what does success look like in this season? And this season, when we talk about sports, could be your off season. It could be the season where, like your competitive season for academics, it could be this academic year or this academic semester, right, it could be this week, this month, this next 28 day. Push for whatever the hell you're pushing for, you know, but what does success look like in this season?
Speaker 2:And I challenge folks to identify, you know, your smart goals and all of that stuff where you can measure it and all of that. But then, like, what is success internally, right? Like who is the person that I want to be on the other side of whatever this identified time frame is? And so if success like when you said that you went from staying at six o'clock to 530, I was like, oh my God, that is.
Speaker 2:I was thinking in my head I'm only about 550, right, and then I'm going to meet by 540, right, and we're going to go back in 10 minute increments, so like that could be success that over the next month, I'm going to work on leaving 10 minutes earlier, and then 10 minutes earlier, and then, you know, to get that shift back. And so, in alignment, like thinking about what are my values and what does success look like in this season? Maybe, as it pertains to the values, right, because if we're combating burnout and we're trying to live our best day in life, we want it to be values aligned living, because then you know what the hell are we even doing?
Speaker 1:Okay. So I have to ask, like, what do you say to somebody who's like okay, I get it, I need to know what my values are, and it's super important, but like I don't even know what's important to me, like how do you identify your values? Because I also think like it can change in seasons, absolutely, and so how do you figure out what your values are?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I've used a number of tools. There's actually this thing called a values card sort that you can find on the internet and print it out and cut up the pieces of paper, but that can be a bit laborious. So what I might say is go. I have two sort of thoughts in my head, because I have this sheet that I use with our athletes that looks at like relationships, family, career, slash, school, health, finances. It's like about 12 different areas, spirituality, things like that and so you could just you could go online and you could say dimensions of wellness. You could say you know like values, words and find the ones that resonate with you. And then what I? What I tell people to do.
Speaker 2:So let's say we have, you know, five areas types finances, work, health and hobbies right, so then write those on a piece of paper and then say if I was living in alignment with these areas, what would I be doing? How would my life be that type of thing? So, like career, maybe it's. I'm working for my damn self and I get to go roll into my office at my home wearing sweatpants and, you know, I don't know drink kombucha all day long. Whatever. It is like doing what, what you love and maybe health is. I want to be, you know, in a decent level of fitness where I can sign up for all the fun five Ks and just go have a good time and I can touch my toes with no problem and carry in the groceries, right, like just to find what it is. And then I say, from a scale of zero to 10, how important is this area of your life right now? And so zero. You're probably not going to have a zero level of importance if it's a value on your page, right. But like it may be, hey, my health is in a really great spot, so it's not a super priority. So I'm going to say I'm going to give it an eight, right, not a top priority. It's in a good spot and it's still something that I want to make sure I'm attending to every day.
Speaker 2:But maybe you are in a place of, say, starting your own business or transitioning into a new job, and that's where a main focus of your time is. So maybe that's a 10 right now. Or you're trying to get out of debt Hello, all of us who are paying student loans back again, right, Like that is, that is a area of focus and importance right now, in this season, as you define it. And so then you look at it and it's like, okay, if I have my finances and my family, are my 10s right now my most or highest importance, or however it shakes out for you, then that's where we want to make sure. Okay, how do we start living that life that you laid out right?
Speaker 2:So, if it's finances, and let's say, you're carrying $5,000 worth of credit card debt, speak into myself right now, I'm paying off a big event that I did over the summer, so I'm carrying some credit card debt. If that's my main priority, then what does it look like to pay that off? Well, I'm going to get on a budget. I'm going to cook at home and not be door dashed in every other night. I'm going to be mindful and track my spending on a weekly basis. I'm going to actually set a budget for what I'm going to pay to my credit card, and I'm going to stick to that. I'm going to make choices in alignment with that value, and so is that making sense, right?
Speaker 2:We're identifying the area, we're laying out. Here's what it's going to look like. It doesn't mean tomorrow you're going to wake up and all of a sudden, you've got all of this aligned, but you can start with okay, first step is I'm going to look at what's coming in and what's going out in terms of my finances. Like do that on one day, because that can be a little bit overwhelming, and then the next day it's okay, what can I, what can I call my phone company, my cell phone, and get a better deal? Or you know, like start wheeling and dealing and pull in your spending and then be really intentional, chip away at it, right, and then that's how you start living in alignment with your values.
Speaker 1:I love that and, too, you're not shitting on yourself, because I know like you talk about that and I say that all the time on this I'm messy, we do not should on ourselves here, and because in that and your energy behind it is so different when you take that approach, instead of, if you're working on your finances, being like I can't spend anything this month, like I can't door dash because I have this and you shame yourself that you're when, instead, you look at it differently and the energy behind it's different when you're like, no, this is important to me right now to pay this off, and so I'm going to make choices that support that choice. Yep.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and then sometimes like, let's be real, it's an honest look at yourself of, okay, I had a long day at work and I just don't feel like cooking, so what am I? I'm going to door dash my favorite burger and fries that I get when I don't feel like cooking. And then when I go to Costco this weekend, I'm not going to go to the alcohol section because I don't need to buy three more bottles of wine because I just spent it on door dash. Right, so you can look. If you know where your money is going, you can make those choices.
Speaker 2:And I think oftentimes the whole like YOLO culture of like I only live once, like whatever those those small actions they add up, right, there's this one podcast or that I listened to and she's like it's the little yeses that lead to the big yes. That's actually the yes that is potentially detrimental to my life, right? So I've been thinking to myself, like, what are the little yeses that are getting in the way of my big goal? So, okay, maybe I don't actually want the burger because I have other health goals. I still don't want to cook, but let me order the salmon, right.
Speaker 2:And like, where are we making those choices? And if we don't know where we're going I think that's where a lot of the YOLO life comes in is that if we don't know where we're going and we haven't defined what a success look like in this season and we don't know what our values are we haven't spent the time to explore and get in touch with that then we really are flying by the seat of our pants. And that's where YOLO comes in, because it's like well, whatever the fuck, like let me just go do this and that and like maybe you're having a great time and that has consequences.
Speaker 1:And your nervous system is probably on the fritz. Yes, it's going wild. It's going wild. Your brain's like we need direction.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, yeah, I mean, and we like our brain, like structure, and I get this pushback a lot from people who are like I don't want to do all of that because I don't want to be boxed in, and I challenge them with okay, yes, but discipline gives you freedom.
Speaker 2:And they're like what are you talking about? Because really, what we're talking about is, if you have the direction right, you know you've defined what success looks like in this season. You have values aligned action, and hopefully those value aligned actions become some of your habits, which then take less energy. Once we've created these habits because we've got the muscle memory, we've got everything the routines are set up and that actually provides us with more freedom to move through our life, because the things that are foundational to us, aka our values, have become part of how we have framed up our life. So you have a framework for your life that you're moving through and it's become automated and it's working. So then you have this time.
Speaker 2:Everyone asked me like, how do you get so much done in the morning? Because I have a really solid morning routine. That took me years, years to cultivate and figure out what works for me, what sets me up for success so that I can be great at my job, and now I don't have to think about it because it's just, it's what happens. And when those pieces are missing, something's off. Because that is values, aligned action. That's built, the foundation for my life, that sets me up to be great, but that takes less energy now because I've done the work over time.
Speaker 1:I love that you're transparent and you're like. It took years to figure out what worked.
Speaker 1:Like this is not an overnight. You make the decision, it's just all going to go flawlessly the next day, like no, it takes years and it's a process, but the payoff and it is great. And I love, too, just how much you had rated like it's what works for you, because I feel like right now you know, like social media is just such a big part of our lives and it's like the 30 minute or hour long morning routine for success or all the things and you're like that doesn't work for me. Like I know people who like swear you have to work out in the morning. All the high achievers in the world, the one percenters, they work out in the morning If I get up early.
Speaker 1:When I don't like to get up early, I like to go to bed early and sleep in. I just like sleep, like yeah, yeah, it's great. It's not even like a stay up late, like no, if I like to go to bed early and I don't like getting up, so it's just like I'm a nine hour girlie. Yeah, like nine to 10 hours Perfect. If we're under nine, eight is too short, oh, wow, yeah.
Speaker 1:And so it's like people are like you need to work out before you go to work Like, okay, when I'm going to have to get up early and I'm not going to like it and I already go to bed early, so going to bed earlier is just getting a bit ridiculous and like not having evening time, and then I'm going to get sweaty, then I'm going to be hot while I get ready, and then I'm going to be because I'm hot. I'm getting ready Cause it's not like I'm in the work with a messy bun and no makeup and like it's great or I have you know hours. So no, this is not the good start to my morning. Right, right, oh, my gosh.
Speaker 2:But you know I'm laughing so hard because when I, if you talk to one of my girlfriends that I had when I was in college, she used to call me a monster in the morning she was like you are just this grumpy ass monster. And my girlfriend now she's like, she's like I know I'm going to wake up and you're going to be sitting there and bed like hi, hi, good morning. Are you ready? Cause I've already been up for like two hours. I've like read a book, I've gone to the bathroom, let the dog out, I'm drinking coffee and I'm like good morning.
Speaker 2:But that took decades to get there and also my phase of life. In college I was a college athlete, I partied my ass off, I was involved in so many things and so I wasn't going to bed until like midnight, but I didn't have to get up until like eight o'clock. But now I, in grad school, all of that shifted because my tool is my brain, and if my brain isn't good as a psychologist, I am no good to you, like none whatsoever. So I shifted in grad school I made the intentional shift to be in bed like before 11 o'clock and that was like fricking monumental earth, shattering stuff, and then it wasn't until like five years later that I was going to bed wearing workout clothes so that I could get up and workout in the morning, Cause I had a really long commute and so it wasn't realistic for me to work out at the end of the day. So we're talking decades and season and phase of life right, it's going to look different. And the other thing, too is like, when we're thinking about routines and habits and these foundational elements for our life is having like best case scenario and then also your shortened version.
Speaker 2:So this morning I hit snooze for an hour this morning because I had a long ass day at work and then we had a basketball game last night. So I was back up at work, I got home and I was wired and it took a while for me to fall asleep, and so I knew, okay, I cannot do all of the things, but what are the key things? The key things were making some coffee, taking the dog out, getting my food ready so that I was prepared for the rest of the day, and then I think I was listening to podcasts when I got ready, and so I'm still like filling my mind, but I couldn't sit down and read. I couldn't sit down and journal because your girl just hit snooze all day, but I still knew okay. Here are some of the anchor points within that routine that are values aligned that set me up for further values aligned action throughout the day.
Speaker 1:I love that point of like, here's your ideal, but here's the shortened version of like the must haves. And then it makes it okay if you just do the must have the part of it, yeah, instead of feeling crappy about yourself for not doing the whole thing. And then you get into the spiral of. I have found like even just myself personally it was I need to do this 12 steps Like this is the ideal morning routine, and then I don't do it. Then I'm like why am I doing this? So then you just give up all together and you're like no, no, what's the most important things? Do those things, and it's defining what success is.
Speaker 2:Yep, understanding why those pieces are important for success, right. So part of it for me is I have to turn my brain on right. Other people can go to work and their brain can still click on, but if I'm in a meeting or with a client in the first hour of my day, I have to be turned on. Ethically speaking, I have to be turned on. So I know it takes me this amount of time to get, to get up and going. How do I turn my brain on? How do I activate my body and how do I prepare myself to step through the door in that space where, boom, if I walk in the door and there's an emergency, I can handle it? Right. So again, values aligned and knowing what works for you, and the secret is you write the rules for your own life.
Speaker 2:So, if it's not working or you realize, hey, I need to switch things up, like just change the rules.
Speaker 1:I love that. It's like the permissions that you don't need but everybody needs sometimes. Yeah, you have rules for your life, change it. Yeah, who cares? Right? And so, like I feel like this just flows with everything. And I was talking to one of my friends today and I was like about this conversation we were going to have and I was like you remember I tell people about this has a very nice title, but it sticks in my brain how it sticks with your college kids about your zero fucks, and I was like this is the most tangible way about spending your energy. And I was like it'll stick with you because you're like, oh what? But yeah, I just really get flows in with this perfectly, because you're like, okay, I have my values, I have like routines, I'm writing my things for me, but you know, with the Evan flow, and I just felt like it was such a great self awareness, so like we have to dive into this.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely Okay. So zero fucks given method came to be because I was working with a lot of college students and they would tell me like I have zero fucks to give, and they were trying to figure out. I have all of these things going on and then somebody else throws something on me whether it's their coach or their, their professor or a friend or a parent, right, and they're just like I don't give a fuck, and what I realized is this burnout piece, right, is they? Like they cared about what was being asked of them most of the time, but they couldn't figure out how do I make it all work, and so I was like I got to come up with something for them to help them make this work. It's going on with my hair, Sorry.
Speaker 2:So this idea of the zero fucks given method came about, and it's all about energy allocation. So basically, what it is is every morning, you wake up and you have 10 fucks to give, and really a fuck is a unit of energy and everything we do is going to use energy or it's going to recoup us, recoup our energy or recharge us. And so the simple way to go through this is think about your week, think about your fullest day, and I say full very intentionally, it's not busy, it's full. Think of the fullest day and just write down, brain dump, everything that you have that uses energy throughout the week, and we're talking meal prep to your commute, if that is using energy for you. For those of you who are in school, or I want you to break down math class or calculus, this science and the lab, the homework which homework is it? Get very, very specific of everything that's using energy. Put the people on there that use your energy and, like, don't judge it, because we know spending time with people uses energy and it doesn't. It's not a bad thing, it's just this conversation. I'm having the greatest time and it's using my energy. So how are you spending your energy? And then you go back through and you assign it a fuck value and you know you're not trying to like make it work out of 10. It's how much energy from a zero to 10 is used on this activity. You may even have some activities that use more. So when I talk to the athletes and I say it is a game day, how much energy do you need for a competition? Some people say I need 12 fucks or I need 15 and that's okay. Let's just like keep it under 20 because it's not really realistic. So, thinking of these units, you know talking to this person is going to use two, or going to this class is going to use five, because it's really challenging, and we just want to understand where are we spending and how much are we spending. Then, on another piece of paper, you're going to write all of the ways that you recharge. So we know you love sleep. Sleep is probably going to give you a ton of fucks back and it's big things like sleep, getting a massage, getting your nails done, netflix or whatever it is.
Speaker 2:But even I like to think of these micro recharge moments. So it's fall, the leaves are falling. I love crunching leaves. So when I'm walking around, I will be that person who zigzags on the sidewalk to crunch leaves because that's going to recharge me. That's a micro recharge. I might get half of a fuck back for that. But if I'm walking from one part of our athletic complex to another and there's an opportunity to crunch leaves and I'm going from one meeting to another, I'm going to crunch those leaves because what happens? That activates my senses. Right, I can kind of feel it under my foot, I can hear it. And then I, just, like you, can't help but smile when you're crunching on leaves Like it's just so fun. Take you back to childhood, all of those pieces. So what are those micro moments? What are the songs that recharge you? Feeling the sun on your skin? Whatever it is those pieces that recharge you.
Speaker 2:Then, when I'm working with college students, I challenge them to identify what's your fullest day of the week. And they're like oh, monday, right, cause I got this class and we map it out. What are you doing throughout the day? Where's your energy going and where are you recharging? Because the idea you wake up and you have 10 fucks to give. So if you're spending all 10 of them before noon, we need to recharge. And burnout comes in when we are spending and spending, and spending and spending and we're not recharging or we're not completing that stress cycle and one, maybe two days of those in a row, yeah, you're going to feel really spent. But if you have that opportunity to recharge and throughout the week you kind of balance it out, that's okay. But if we are, what I see happen in college students is they may be good on a Monday, but then Tuesday they end with negative two, and then it's negative three, and then it's negative five, and then it's negative eight.
Speaker 2:And then what happens? You get to Saturday and you sleep in and you stay in bed all day and you don't get anything done because you have no energy whatsoever. You get to Sunday and you're like fuck, I have to do all of this work and I have to do my laundry and I have to do all these things, but then somebody needs, needs me for this or that or whatever. And it's this vicious cycle. And so what I try to tell people to do is look at your most full day and then where are those opportunities for those micro recharges?
Speaker 2:What are you doing in the morning? If you know you've got a big morning at work or you've got a course load in the morning, that's really intense. Maybe you do wake up 20 minutes early to make sure that you get your coffee. Maybe you can do some deep breaths and you make sure you put on a banging ass outfit because that just makes you feel good, right. And so then, as you go through the day, every time you catch a look in the mirror. You're like, oh hey, girl, you look good and that's a micro recharge because you're feeling good in your body.
Speaker 2:You got your coffee, maybe you've made your lunch. So you know, hey, I'm going to be beat after these, these meetings, but I know I have an hour here, so the weather's nice. I'm going to go sit outside, I'm going to crunch some leaves, I'm going to take a look at myself in the mirror and I'm going to eat this lunch. That's going to fuel my body and I'm recharging. Maybe I'm getting five back for that, because I've got a solid hour, I've got all of these pieces. Maybe I'm going to listen to some tunes, call a friend, and then I've recharged back and I have more to give in the afternoon. And we just start to look at it from this energy expenditure.
Speaker 2:And then if you've planned your week out from that energy perspective and somebody comes to you with an opportunity and you're like, oh, that sounds really great, but I know that I have something else going on and I need to, like, maintain my fucks, then you can say to yourself I actually don't have enough.
Speaker 2:Like this is going to cost me four and I only have two left for the day, so I literally don't have enough fucks to give to this. It's not that you don't care, but you're making decisions based off of your energy and what you know you need to be your best self. So then you can say, hey, I can't do that tonight or tomorrow, but next week I've got time here. Does that work for you? And you're not saying a hard no, you're renegotiating so that you can bring your best self to the thing that you actually want to do. And then for those of you who are people pleasers out there and it's something that you really don't want to do, then you can use the zero fucks given method to say no because you genuinely don't have enough fucks to give. Just don't tell the person that you don't have enough fucks to give. You can just say no and be solid in that, because you're not depleting your energy and you're not going to then invite yourself to a place of burnout.
Speaker 1:This is literally like the best way I've ever heard energy exchange expenditure explained ever. I love this whole method and it makes so much sense to my brain and so that's why I'm like we have to talk about this, because it's so true and I got to thinking about like I was like, oh, there's like fucksuckers in your life. Yes, there is. Because you can think like we all know there's people and it just says what it is for, like whatever reason, and like you're like I don't, because you know you're thinking of somebody, like you can think of somebody you work with. Listen, I could think of somebody like pops into your mind. They're just like I don't have enough fucks for this, like I don't. Yeah, you're like you are like energy vampire, like I don't have, and so you know, you're like some days I can really handle them and it's great and it's fine and I can deal with it and it's not a big deal, and other days I'm like I can't with you today.
Speaker 2:Yep, and you just and that's. I'm glad I said that, because the other pieces it helps you set those boundaries right. So let's say you're you've got a work project and you're like, okay, I can give this to fucks right now. So, rather than saying I'm going to work on this for two hours, give it to fucks, right, spend that energy and then move on. Because oftentimes when we get stuck in these loops, it's because we're trying to force something that we don't actually have the energy for, or it's like okay, I got two fucks to give right now, let me spend it, and then I'm going to go recharge. It doesn't necessarily have to be at a specific time, but I'm going to go recharge and then I'm going to come back, because then I'm going to have four fucks to give it.
Speaker 1:And I love like this whole idea too, because it is such a habit and and to like, I've known about this for a while because I've heard, like heard you talk about it before. But you know you work on this like managing, like your fucks and making sure you're not giving too many and things, because you get to Saturday where you do nothing and then you're like 20 in the whole going into Monday and you're like, oh my gosh, like what did I do? And you know you get in that vicious cycle. But at least for me, it's been my experience that I'm never I haven't been perfect at it Because, like in talking about this I was like, oh, my last couple of Saturdays I've been just like not moving at all and very unmotivated. I'm like, hmm, if I think about it, there's been a lot of times in the last couple of weeks that I have been giving more than than I had.
Speaker 1:I'm like oh yeah, it catches up and it's just like a good self awareness piece and it is to like if, like you said, like for people pleasers, you're like sorry, no something, I don't want to, I just I can't, I don't have any more and absolutely. But it's such great self awareness.
Speaker 2:And makes it to yeah and like and to be at your best self. Right and going back to that values piece right, like if you think about who you spend time with or the the people that you interact with. It's so much more pleasant when people are their best selves and when they're living in alignment with what matters to them. It doesn't mean that you have to care about the exact same things, but it's also a gift to other people when we set boundaries and when we do the things we need to do to show up as our best self. All those people who are like I got to take care of my kids first or this or that, and they are not me. I put myself last like why don't you give other people the gift of showing up as your best self and take care of yourself?
Speaker 1:Like how much better would it be? Like you know, like the whole kid piece I don't have kids personally, but like I have a lot of friends that do and I'm like why don't you just if you think on this whole, like talking about like getting to Saturday and you know your negative, like 10 for the week by the time you get to Saturday and you just like need to recharge and don't have any energy for that day, but like you have other people depending on you to show up. Like which version of yourself is going to be better the person who started the day with 10 or the person who started the day with negative five because they haven't taken care of themselves all week?
Speaker 2:Yep, yep. And what are you modeling for your kiddos?
Speaker 1:Mm, hmm, that's so true. I'm like this has been so fun. I'm like the time. I'm like, well, I want to honor your time. Yeah, no, we're good, we're good.
Speaker 2:Two part episode. Yeah, listen, I could talk about this stuff all day. I mean, it's like we just, we can only just scratch the surface on these things sometimes.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I know I'm like this is weird, but I do want to honor your time though.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And I like thank you so much for coming on, but I do have two final questions to kind of wrap this up. This is have the audacity podcast, and so what does the phrase have the audacity mean to you?
Speaker 2:Well, as you were. I'm thinking in the context of our conversation and I want to offer it as an invitation and almost a gift to the listeners to have the audacity to live a life that's in alignment with your values, so that you can be your best self.
Speaker 1:Mm. Hmm, that's so. That's so well said. The second last question I have is you know, some podcasts do playlists and all those things for all their guests. I have curated this self care guide that I ask every person who comes on what's a go to non negotiable self care? Because I feel like sometimes when you're starting, you think it's like a massage or a spa or something huge and you don't really know what to look at. And seeing a list of all these people and there's been a variety of things it's very interesting. So, like what is your like self care non negotiable I have to do this.
Speaker 2:Well, I will say that one of the things that I did when I moved here and I got this job is I signed up for a massage membership because, being an athlete my whole life, I was like I've got money to do this now and that has become a high level non negotiable for me.
Speaker 2:So I will say I get a monthly massage, but let me see like if I think about other sort of weekly and daily non negotiables, I feel like exercise is always my go-to.
Speaker 2:That I say so, I want to think about this is taking me a long time because I feel like a lot of my routines are my self-care, but I think reading, honestly, reading, has become a way that I take care of myself mind, body and soul and I always have multiple books going so a personal development book, a novel, and then I have this one book that is.
Speaker 2:It's called 400 Souls and it's about the African-American history of our country, and it's one that I am reading at a slower pace because I want to honor the history and honor the lives that were lost in this country and we continue to lose, unfortunately and really sit with what it means one, to be white in America, but two, what it means for black folks to be black in America and how our country was created to oppress people, and so it's a hard read and I want to honor it and really make sure that I'm unlearning things that were intentionally placed into my being, that are just horrible. So that's one that I'm working through and, yeah, but then having personal development and some devotions and things like that going, so that I can check in with my soul and say, hey, what do I need in this time and I can feed myself appropriately in that way.
Speaker 1:I love normalizing having multiple books going, because I have a multiple books person too and I have someone audible too. That's its own category. There's audible, I have an audible book, and then there's a fiction personal development. You got to have a little bit of everything. I went super hard in personal development for two years and that was all of it and I consumed all of them and I was like I miss fiction and sometimes you just need to like escape.
Speaker 2:Yeah, sometimes you need a good beat read.
Speaker 1:You just like need to go, but like I don't know what it says about me. But my go to like. I have a series like I will reread sometimes and it's just like I've read it so many times, it's just like a good comfort book.
Speaker 2:But yeah, that's how people are with like watching, like friends or something. Did you say it's hunger?
Speaker 1:games. It's hunger games. I don't know what that says about me. I'm like, just don't be in. America.
Speaker 2:Okay, did you? Did you read the one about snow, president? Snow, no, I was coming out as a movie now.
Speaker 1:I know I didn't have it ready yet, I just ordered it.
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh. I listened to one of my students told me about it and listened to it on audible. Oh my God, it's so good.
Speaker 1:So good I am when we're recording this. The hunger games is coming out tomorrow and I am going to watch it. Okay, good, I'm like I have to go. The book is coming, I'm like I don't even care, I have to go see it first. I watched the movies first, oh really and then I read the books. I actually like read the book, picked up the first book and I quit right before it got good.
Speaker 2:Oh, I read the books during grad school, which was a mistake because that was what I was trying to do to wind down. And then sleep routine got all jacked up because I was like what is happening to Katniss?
Speaker 1:I'm one of those readers, to my mind. I'm going through a series. I'm like we're off on a tangent, but it's.
Speaker 1:I love this though, is the oh shoot the inheritance games. What is this you need? I think you would like it because it's very. It came out in 2020. But this girl inherits a billionaire's fortune. What that? She doesn't know who, like a teenage girl, inherits a billionaire's fortune. She doesn't know who this person is like at all. She like goes from living in her car to like inheriting this and she's like I don't know what's going on. Well, to the billionaire has two kids and three grandkids, and they got left with like essentially nothing, like in the grand scheme of things, and the book. They're gonna be all right, but they got nothing. They didn't really get much, but she has to get the full inheritance. She has to live in, like now her house, her mansion in Texas with, and all the family members get to stay, and she's still there for a year.
Speaker 1:And apparently, like the guy was into like riddles, this billionaire was like into riddles and things and I'm going to leave it at that, but it's the inheritance games they inheritance games, and it's a series.
Speaker 2:It's a series.
Speaker 1:There are okay four books out right now and the fifth one's going to be released next year. It's a whole thing.
Speaker 2:So can we have a book club?
Speaker 1:I feel like we need to have a book club around this because I literally am like halfway through the first book and I already ordered all the other ones because I'm like, I'm invested and I have to know.
Speaker 2:I'm invested now Like I need to know what's happening, so, yes, we can have a book club so we can talk about this.
Speaker 1:Yes, I was like everybody knows the Hunger Games and stuff like that. What is this book? I'm like no, you need to go.
Speaker 2:I'm like, yes, I'm going to be our self care book club.
Speaker 1:I love it. I'm a grown adult reading this young adult novel and it's just amazing. I'm like I don't. Sometimes you're like I don't want to read an adult book because, like I have adult problems I don't read. Want to read adult book about adult problems because like that's my life every day. Like let me read about this team who inherited a billions of dollars. Oh my gosh, the family that got nothing.
Speaker 2:I'm going to order this book right when we are done. Yes, please do. We're gonna have a book club about it. It's going to be oh my gosh, I'm serious, let's have a book club. This is going to be epic. Put a sign up link, whatever. Drop us DMs. You want to come?
Speaker 1:you can join our book club we're gonna be doing. I mean, it's five books long, so we're gonna be real committed.
Speaker 2:We've got this is 2024. This is what we're going to do we're just going to read these books together.
Speaker 1:I love it. We're for sure doing this. So, okay, you DM us if you want to join. Yes, yes, oh, my God, this is the last. It's. Life's too short to make everything super serious all the time. You gotta have a book club about a fun book.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, I love it, I love it. Let's do it.
Speaker 1:Well, thank you so much for coming. This was so fun.
Speaker 2:Of course, yeah, thanks for having me and Ben. Oh, so good.
Speaker 1:And lastly, like I'll link everything in the show notes, but where can listener find you and connect with you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so Instagram is the real Dr J Hugh, I don't post a lot but I will respond to DM, so get up in there. And then the podcast is called beyond your limits. We're on a little bit of a pause right now, but I'm I'm thinking that once the semester is over and I can start to like batch a little bit of content, I have a fun new. I might go, I might go seasonal with the podcast, just in this whole spirit of, you know, preventing burnout and values, aligned action and all that. I might go into series and so I have one. That's fun. I think it's going to be like a reality challenge show recap is what we might be rolling back in with, so I'm excited for it.
Speaker 1:I love that and to just goes back to like it's your podcast, so do what you want with it. I write the rules. Yeah right, the rules. Yeah Well. Thank you so much. This was so fun, thank you, thank you.
Speaker 1:I truly hope that you buy it with today's episode and got so much value out of it and I know CJ would, and I would both love to hear what your takeaways were. So please message us on Instagram, take a screenshot of this episode, tag us in it, touch shares your takeaways and, you know, in the season of unapologetically asking for the things that I want, I just want to ask you that you take a few moments and you leave a review, share takeaway from this episode. Leave a review, five star rating. It truly helps get this message out and it's just one of those things that's like it doesn't cost any money to do. If you've left a review, please send this to somebody you're like they would love to hear this. Like literally push the share button on the episode. Send it to them like. Free ways to just support truly do mean so much to me and I want to thank you for doing that. I truly hope you love this conversation. Please let us know.
Speaker 1:If you want to join our book club, we'll make that a thing.
Speaker 1:Even if you don't want to join my book club, please go buy the book.
Speaker 1:The author doesn't even know who I am, like she doesn't even know I exist and I'm going to promote her book for her because it's so stinkin good, like sometimes you just need a good book, good fiction book, little escape. So anyway, thank you so much for listening to today's episode and you know I cannot let you leave without reminding you that I want you to always remember you are worthy, you have value, you get to take up space in this world simply because you exist. Don't let anyone, including yourself, convince you otherwise, and if that idea or vision for your life is in you, it is for you. I am rooting for you and I can't wait to talk to you soon. Thank you so much for listening. If you love this episode, I would love to hear from you, so share it on Instagram and tag me so I can personally thank you for getting this message off. I'm so grateful to have you on this journey with me. So until next time, remember to have the audacity.