Wine and...Comics: SEX CRIMINALS Omnibus Vol 1 by Matt Fraction and Chip Zdarsky

The joke comic that turned into a sincere dramedic epic, today we tackle the first third of the series as collected in the BIG HARD OMNIBUS Vol. 1

Matt Fraction is a long-time indie comics and Marvel writer, and now the co-creator of the tv show MONARCH: LEGACY OF MONSTERS with Chris Black. Be sure to check out our previous interview with Chris about the tv show SEVERANCE and his working with Matt on Monarch!

Chip Zdarky was a Canadian journalist turned comics writer and artist, with SEX CRIMINALS being his very first.

Today we cover the origins of the series, the super fun stories about its launch party at a Canadian sex club, discuss the story's merits, and of course tell you which wines you should pair with such an outlandish yet strangely grounded work.

THE WINES:
Dallas' Wine
Inniskillin Vidal Ice Wine
An Austrain and an Italian started up a Canadian winery with an Irish name in 1974 and was granted the first winery license by the Liquor Control Board of Ontario since prohibition. Cut to 1991 when they brought Canadian wine into the international limelight by winning the Grand Prix d’Honneur at Vin Expo, France for Karl Kaiser’s 1989 Vidal Icewine.

Icewine is made by allowing grapes to freeze on the vine then crushing them with the juice still frozen. This keeps most of the water out of the high-sugar must that remains, creating a highly concentrated, sweet wine with complex, concentrated flavor.

Inniskillin makes icewine from the Vidal grape, Resling grape, and Cabernet Franc grape. Prices range from $40 - $100+ depending on the vintage and style.

Dave's Wine
2021 Ludovic Montginot Cote du Py Morgon Beaujolais
Morgon is considered one of the premiere areas in the Beaujolais region, and Ludovic Montginot is an actual one-man show tending to his 3 hectares of vineyards and working in his cellar completely unassisted! His Morgon conatins all the freshness and vibrancy of a Beaujolais while also containing a rustic, meaty quality rarely found in this style of wine. A perfect harmony of the frivilous and the serious, much like the Sex Criminals comic, plus Montginot's solitude represents where the comic begins - being alone in the world before finding another to share it with.

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He's Dave and I'm Dallas. We have opinions on just about everything. Sometimes they're on point and sometimes they go down better with a glass of wine. Join us. This is the Wine and Podcast. Welcome back everyone to Wine and the podcast where we pair wine with entertainment. Delude ourselves into thinking you want to hear what we have to say about different pieces of pop culture and art. But know for a fact that you need to hear what we have to say about wine, because who knows anything about wine? We sure don't. Well, that's not true. We actually totally do. And we can help you find the perfect pairing for whatever it is you're planning to read, watch, or listen to. Before we get started, please, as always, make sure to hit that follow button and subscribe. It does help this podcast grow, reach new listeners. Also, please leave a rating and or review. At least do so if you love us. And you can also find us on Substack. That'll be wineand .substack. where you'll be the first to know when new episodes drop, get in -depth show notes, sometimes uncut versions of these episodes, bonus pairings, articles, chats, pairing directories, so much! Wineann .substack .com, be a cool kid, drink the wine, cool aid. Join us on Substack. So in our previous episode, we interviewed TV writer and showrunner Chris Black. We chatted with Chris about his work on the TV show Severance. Also mentioned that he's currently showrunner on the Apple TV Plus Godzilla show, Monarch Legacy of Monsters, which he co -created with comic book writer Matt Fraction. So go check that episode out. It's the one right before this one. And what better way to follow up that episode than by jumping right into a comic book co-created and written by Mr. Matt Fraction himself, Sex Criminals by Fraction and Chip Zdarsky and published by Image Comics. Sex Criminals is about people who can stop. time whenever they have sex and so get it in their heads to rob a bank with this ability. Even to the creators, this started out as a one -note dick joke miniseries but soon evolved into an honest drama, romance, and world -building epic tackling the topics of sex, physical intimacy, relationships, independence, self -care, commitment, and more. It ran for 30 issues before coming to an organic climax. You're welcome. And today we tackle the first third of the series as collected in the Sex Criminals Big Hard Omnibus Volume 1. Here we go. Look, weirdos, we are recording this the morning after the American presidential debate between Kamala Harris and whoever the fuck that other douche is. So even though it went really well for dear Kamala, we are nevertheless ready to drink and escape into some really great comics. So Dallas, speaking of douches, what comic are we talking about today? come on, Low bar, low bar. Anyway, today let us welcome you to the wild and arresting world of sex criminals by Matt Fraction and Chip Zdarsky through Image Comics, which marked a pivotal moment in the careers of its creators. The series, which began in 2013, won the Eisner Award for best new series and has been praised for its innovative approach to storytelling, blending humor with poignant explorations of human relationships. In sex criminals, the only thing hotter than the crotch rubbing are the audacious crime sprees. Susie and John discover they can freeze time with their orgasms, and together they embark on a comically odd adventure robbing banks to save Susie's beloved library from the clutches of bank foreclosure. Yes, you heard right. But hold on to your nipples because it's not all gazoms and guffaws. As they navigate the complexities of love, friendship, and the occasional run -in with the law, Susie and John quickly discover that adulting is tray -overrated. Done with razor -sharp wit and full -frontal approach to taboo subjects, sex criminals get your heart, your loins, and your mind revved up with equal intensity. If you take anything away from this comic series, then it should be that time waits for no man, woman, or they. But if you can, Find your own way to slow it down and cause some trouble, preferably with a partner who matches your particular style of freakdom. And this just goes to show you guys that sex is what saves libraries. So libraries keep talking those sex books, which everyone knows you have because they keep trying to ban them, right? absolutely do. like sex and libraries, they go together. It's what saves this particular library. We're going to talk about that when we talk about the comic more in depth. That's right. That's right. But first, I kind of want to get to the pairings. Do you, Dave? Of course. What you you got? these days. Tell the people what you're bringing, buddy. So for this comic and what we're doing today, you know, this series, it ran many, many years, not always on a regular schedule. So I think it ran for seven years, but that wasn't like a comic a month, like a proper monthly Marvel or DC comic. This was an independent comic. that was released by Image, but when you do it as a creative -owned independent comic, it's when your schedule allows for it. So there were lots of gaps along the way. So this is, I believe, 30 -ish issues all told, plus a special. And they collected it into three giant omnibuses called the Big Hard Omnibuses. So this is Big Hard Omnibus number one collecting the first 10. issues of the series. That's what we're covering today. Not the other two thirds of the series. We don't know yet what happens in the other two thirds of the series. We can only discuss and what I'm pairing with today is that first third. So, you know, this comic is about someone and we start with Susie, the main female character, and she learns at the young age we all learn when we we learn how to do this for ourselves. But she learns that and it's one of those, I think this is the great metaphor of the comic is of course, when you first orgasm, it's a little freaky, right? Like in life, like it's an experience that like, because it's a culture, we don't talk about it. We certainly don't talk to kids about it. So it's always a like WTF, whether it's a, is something horrible happening? I mean, obviously parts of it, you're like, this can't be horrible. It's wonderful, but it's also extreme. And it's not, it's an experience that is a little terrifying in the fact that you've never been able to do. Like it is just a, like that is that right? Am I weird? Is that wrong? Am I dying? I thought, I thought I like, I had done something horribly, horribly wrong. I thought I was dying. Absolutely. I was inconsolable for three days. Yes, I think for guys, because there is the literal and I apologize for all the terminology we're going to throw out there, the sex terminology, but ejaculation, right? It's like because of that, there is that sense of, it's like bleeding out. It's like, my God, my God, my God, my God, my God. You have this terror about it because that is, it's not just like plainly the pleasurable sensation is there. But then when that happens, It's so extreme and so unexpected. And again, no one fucking talked to you about it beforehand. So you don't know it's normal. You don't know. Welcome to the childhood of the zeniel. Yeah, we didn't get those talks, kids. Nope, nope, not even a little bit. And sex on screen, of course, it's like this was the 80s and 80s into the early 90s where it was like the saxophone sex, right? Where it's all covered like People are kind of undulating and making noises, but you don't know what the fuck is going on. There's movement, but you don't know what the fuck is going on. Sorry. We're sorry for all the bad sex puns. By the way, this comic started, the writers thought it was basically just going to be a bunch of dick jokes and sex puns. didn't realize they were going to write a very serious, emotionally charged, character driven story. But then they will get to that in a minute. But anyway, the point of this is that when you orgasm, you're in this place where you're sort of like, Is that normal? You know, there's an element. And in the comic, these particular characters and Susie is the one who is the character we start with. It freezes time. She walks around the rest of her house. Her parents are frozen in time like the world stops, which is that fun metaphorical thing, right? Where it's like almost like time slows down and stops for you because you're in that moment. But this is literal. We're like time stops. for a certain amount of time. At first, you don't know the rules. When we start off in the comic, you don't know the rules, but it's like, it stopped. It will resume eventually, but for a while, you're just in this bubble world. So then she realizes over time that no one else experiences this. Everyone else just has like an orgasm, but they're frozen in time. but then she, and then when she comes back out of it, she got all the puns. When she... Everyone. I know. I'm get all the puns out of my head and then we'll just have a normal conversation after that. But when she comes out of it, because let's say she has her first like sexual, like true blue with another person, sexual experience as a teen, and then she realizes when time resumes, the other person time did not freeze for. Like, you know, it's like she just realizes, this is just me and then she tries to feel it out with other people and then she realizes she's on her own. No one else seems to experience this. And then the comic really kicks off when she does have a young adult sexual experience with someone and he's not frozen in time in that moment. And then they both freak out about each other because they thought they were both alone in the world where this happened to them. And then they realized it's Susie and John. And then they realize, shit, we can do that. we're not only do we like each other, but like we seem to be the only two to do this. But then of course, as the comic goes on, if there's more than one, there will be more than two, right? That are out there. like that's not, so it is a small percentage of the human population, but there are more. And that's part of where this series goes and what it is for. So based on that, this is this. first graphic novel, even though Suzy and John find each other in issue one, right? It is very much this first third of the series seems very explorative in terms of like them. First, they find each other. Then of course, they start finding out more and more that even they're not alone. And there are more and more and more people. But this first graphic novel is about the alone part of it more than anything else. And then slowly broadening to have more and more and more. at first I thought, okay, this is all about two people who have sex and stop time. It's got to be like maybe a pairing of grapes, maybe a husband wife duo at a vineyard, things like that, right. But at the end, I'm like, you know what, maybe for volume two or volume three. But for this one, I picked a wine that is made by a bit of an auteur winemaker. So much of an auteur, he attends his vineyard and his cellars completely unassisted. He is a pure one man show. He does a three hectare vineyard in the Bujolais, in the Cote de Pai. this is, I actually paired this wine not too long ago with, it wasn't one of the podcast episodes, but I recently for Labor Day, I did the two John Woo, the killer. movies, the OG killer and then the remake that just came out this year. And this is the one that I paired with the OG John Woo, the killer. And partly because I was like an auteur with an auteur kind of a thing. But then there is a similar flavor in that OG John Woo movie where there's absurdities. It's over the top, but it's very sincere about its absurdities and over the topness. And it is telling a very truly emotional story, truly, it's really exploring the ins and outs of morality, even while being this candy colored 1980s action Hong Kong extravaganza. And in the case of sex criminals. this is, first let me just name the wine here. This is the Morgane Cote de Pied, Beaujolais. This is, and I have this pulled up. as some notes here. Hold on real quick. I'll jump right back over there. This is so the full name is Ludovic Montigno. Ludovic Montigno is the man. He tends three hectares in the Cote de Pied. As I said, the fucker prunes his own vineyard, works his own cellar unassisted. So he is the lone person, you know, of this graphic novel where it's like, this is where we start. where it's all about learning how to deal with your own passions and your own POV and thinking you're alone in the world while you do this. And then of course you expand out this, actually, I'm in the States and I was able to buy this. It's currently on a website called Wine Access, which I do purchase this from quite a bit. they bring, and it's called Wine Access because you get access to a lot of wine that isn't available anywhere else. So this is a very small lot. in the Côte de Pai in France and they got it over here. They still have some. It's not a pricey parcel at all. believe, you know, this probably go, I think this goes for like around the $25 mark a bottle. And the thing I liked about this one, Bougelet, is of course, you've got that nice acidity, the freshness, the fruitiness and sex criminals is nevertheless a romp. especially this first graphic novel, you can tell it's going to get serious and serious as it goes. It's going to get more sincere. It's going to get more characters. It's going to have a much more serious and touching heartfelt story. But one of the fun things about this comic series is when they started it, they thought it was only going to be four issues long. That's right. And that's right. They only realized they were going to keep going at the end. They had finished issue three. And then they realized like image, the publisher was like, Nope, it's popular. Keep going. And they're like, this is popular. Right. It's like, this is a joke comic. Like you want more of this? and one of the things you find out is of course they call it sex criminals and they're like, they rob banks by freezing time. That is really the first three issues. then that's right. That kind of goes away after that because they need to rob one bank to save a library. Like they have a goal and they're trying to do it. And then after that, it's more about, okay, where do we go from here and explore this world and what consequences are there? And now other people who are like us know we exist and we know they exist and so on and so forth. So the whole Vista just expands and it's not really about robbing banks anymore after that. becomes honestly weirdly about community. It's so weird. It's so odd to say that, but it really is sex criminals got a romp becomes about building community. Yeah. Right. And the truthiness, not truthiness and the truthfulness. of like the our personal experiences coming of age, coming into our own sexuality, learning how to be that way with other people sincerely, being emotionally available, learning to deal with our own shit. Like it's very much it's both a metaphor and an actual relationship that you're following and a metaphor for intimate relationships. And so there's a lot of true heartfeltness there. And this Bujolais is more intense. It's more, there's more extraction, there's more juiciness, there's a bit more intensity than your standard boujeelee. And that's one of the reasons I thought it went well with with John Woo's original, The Killer, it had that intensity that that kind of like 80s Hong Kong golden age bullet ballet cinema had. And then same thing with sex criminals. There's a lot, there's an honest heartfeltness, there's an honest intensity to it. And so there's a bit of something more. to this boucherlet, even though it's got that freshness, and I think for volume one, you need the freshness, you need the liveliness, you need the lightness on its feet, but not too light. I think standard boucherlet is a bit too porch -sipper, and this one, you got some meat on those bones, just a little bit, and I'm like, ooh, this is the right balance of everything. this Ludovic, once again, the guy's name, Ludovic Montignan. which we will have it written down in the show notes if you need to how that. It's a French name. it is -O -N -T -G -I -N -O -T Ludovic Montignot, Cote de Pays, Morgan Cote de Pays, Vendagne à la Main, Bougeray, Appalachian. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that is the wine that I'm pairing with. All right. Yeah, I like that. Yeah, I'm curious about this guy now. I know he's my kind of people. Probably I know he can probably deal with people like minutes out of the You're all by myself. That's possible. I know I want to run a vineyard. I never have to talk to anyone. You got to sell the wine. You still got trust me. You don't. That's what you're for. That's what you're for. It's like Dave, come over, sell this wine. Yes, have. I'm definitely curious about that. I have not tried that one. Okay. Who's tried it? That's very true. How much was the how much was it by the way? I will look that up while you talk. Okay. So pairing this piece is it is a romp as Dave said it is a romp with surprising complexity. It is genuine. There's a genuineness to the relationships. There's this vacuum that these characters kind of exist in. And it is a great parallel for what it's like being a child discovers, you know, those sort of existential kind of life moments on your own. You do feel as though you're the only person this thing is happening to. You're unique in all the world and it is bad somehow. So to see these characters kind of Develop in their own vacuum and then find one another is a beautiful thing and it's very sweet. It is a very sweet piece to me and generally I don't go on the nose with my pairings, but because this is the first of three, I think it's three Omnibai. I decided to perhaps treat this as sort of a curation, assuming that we will definitely cover the other two at a future date. That is the plan. Yeah. And so I decided to go with something that was a little sweeter, a little more delicate, a little higher in sugar content. Because I do think because this is the kind of the act one of this movement, to me it is sweet. Those are the dominant kind of That's the dominant sort of note for me. The relationship between these two characters, the way they meet, finding one another and immediately realizing that they share this thing. It is just so incredibly sweet. Yes, it's very sexy and it's very adult, but it is terribly sweet as well. And so I decided I would go not for a Gewurztraminer, not for a pure Riesling. but some iteration of those, some variation on those, because those are kind of two of my favorites and for different reasons. And I remember hearing about this vineyard in Canada, which specialized in ice wines. And so I went with an ice wine just in case you hadn't picked up on that. the wine itself is of course made from a pure Riesling. has a perfect balance of this acidity and sugar. You get these really strong pronounced notes of orange peel and ginger and their straw and toasted walnut. You know, it opens up, you know, in one sip, there was some pumpkin pie in there and their little lemon and the acidity definitely kind of rumbles, I guess, for lack of a better term, it kind of ebbs and flows. And it really is just an amazingly satisfying and tangy. There is a tang to this and you don't often find tang. I don't in wines. And when I do, I appreciate it because it is a totally different sensation. And I think this piece, their piece here is very tangy. is. And that has a lot to do with the this sort of intersection of the sweet and the the the sour and the sour. Yeah. And it is such a beautiful wine. Like I said, lots of stone fruit in there. So a bit about the vineyard. The vineyard is actually called and I'm going to get this wrong in this skill in which is a Canadian winery and they are noted for their ice wines, of course, in Niagara on the lake. near Ontario. It is a pioneering Canadian winery located in Ontario. Like I said, it was founded in 75 by Donald Ziraldo and Carl Kaiser. And fun fact, they were the first winery license issued in Ontario since prohibition, making it Canada's first state winery. It is as I said, they are renowned for their ice wine production, which think is kind of rare to have such a very specific focus. I mean, not when you're a frozen land. That's the kind of, that's the addendum is, but then again, they're in Canada, near Niagara. And by the way, for those folks who are unfamiliar with ice wine or what it is, an Eiswein, if you ever get it from Germany or Austria or what, but it is literally they let the grapes freeze. before harvesting them. So you leave them out during the cold months as as the temperature drops, you let them get super ripe, then they freeze. So it freezes the water and it concentrates the sugar like crazy. So you make this in intensely sweet dessert wine out of the frozen grapes. And that's why it's called ice one. they're so fantastic. And it they seem a little sinful to me, which is another reason. more than you know, more than you know, most people associate, you know, the deeper reds with the sort of sinful quality. But for me, it's ice wines. There's there very few varietals or concentrations of wine that are as sexy as ice wines to me. I don't know my knowledge. No one has ever done a red wine ice wine. Right? It's like it's there. always whites to mine as far as I can tell and I'm assuming it the acidity has something to do with that because you usually imagine so yeah that white wine acidity to counterbalance all the sweet to make something that is pleasant to drink. Nope, I was wrong. They do make red ice wine. In fact, in a skill in the very brand that Dallas is talking about here makes a Cabernet Franc ice wine that is red. So yeah, just another example of me talking out of my ass again. All right. Back to our show. Because ice wine has that acidity to go with all that heavy sugar so that it feels, I mean, it feels unctuous. feels dessert. it's, but it's still, it's not cloying, right? It is. It isn't cloying at all. It's so, so now I, now we have to do an episode on ice wines. We actually, okay, we're to do a special episode on ice wines guys. Anyway, yeah, not cloying at all. It is, they're so unctuous. They're so satisfying and you do still get that acidity. and you get that tang more than I find in most other classes of wines. And it just leaves you feeling exceptionally satisfied, but also a little dirty. that's my pairing. is indulgent. is incredibly indulgent. Yes, it is. That's my pairing with sex criminals. And I think you guys will see why as a little criminality, a little ice wine. That's right. And there you have it. Yeah. OK. So getting into the comic itself, let's talk a little bit about first the two guys who created this map fraction and Chip Zdarsky. Fun fact for everybody. You recently listened or you should have recently listened to our five part coverage of Severance season one, which we had a very special guest in part five, Chris Black. who ran the writers room and is credited writer on episode eight of Severance Season One. And he is also the co -creator and showrunner of another Apple TV plus show called Monarch Legacy of Monsters, their Godzilla show. And he co -created it with Matt Fraction. Matt Fraction.-creator of Monarch Legacy of Monsters. And Matt Fraction is, of course, the co -creator of Sex Criminals, along with this guy, this fella, this artist. named Chip Zdarsky. So where did these two guys come from Dallas? Yeah. Well, first of all, you guys may be familiar with some of their back catalog, shall we say? Let's see. Where are we here? Sorry, where my notes? Hold on one second. No worries. So I will say that Matt Fraction and Dallas, go ahead and rattle off some of his Marvel work after I say this, but you he started he was an indie image guy to begin with. And Casanova might have been one of his very first. Casanova. But then he got invited over to Marvel, started writing a bunch of their big flagship titles, which include Dallas. Take that away. All right. You got the invincible Iron Man 2008, 2012. You got Hawkeye. You got the Mortal iron fist you got uncanny X -Men mighty Thor Odyssey and of course Casanova, is one of his early works I think it may have been his was that his first I think I think it's it was the very first that I ever noticed his name Yeah back in the day and it was pretty popular for an indie image series. It was quite popular He got Marvel work out of it now the fun thing is by the time the reason he started up sex criminals is he was basically not so subtly being shown the door at Marvel. That's right. Right around that time. And he was getting the sense that they were like, no more work was coming. They were like, you're cute. Thanks for writing these for so many years. But it was not what Marvel was looking for at the time. And so even though it really let him establish himself, because working for a Marvel DC book, at that point, you have people who now know your name for better or for worse. They know your name. They might have hated your run, but they know your name. And sometimes those who hate your work know your name more than the others who enjoy it. 100%. Now, Chip Zdarsky was a journalist. And Sex Criminals is actually his very first comic that he wound up doing. But as a journalist, Chip and Matt met at a Comic -Con at one point. And it was some party, some bar get -together kind of a thing during San Diego Comic -Con. I think it was San Diego Comic Con and they just hit it off. made each other laugh. They liked each other a lot. but you know, Chip at the time was just like, yeah, I'm a journalist. But he was also in Matt Fraction's own words, he thought he kept seeing cries for help from Chip in the crazy things he would do as a journalist. Like at one point he climbed a building as Spider -Man. Yes. And he was like, what are you doing? And was like, well, we got to you know, we need clicks. We need we need readers. So you got to fill pages. So you would do all these outlandish things. And the last thing Chip did as a journalist was he covered the Canadian boxing bout between at the time not yet prime minister Justin Trudeau and one of the senators, Robert or something like that was his name. I'm gonna, yeah, I'm gonna forget the exact name of the other guy, but he covered that and that was pretty much the end of it. That was pretty much like after that he needed something else and he and Matt had been talking about doing a comic together for some time. They did a couple drafts of sex criminals. They came up with this idea, but again, it was mostly they're like in their own words, they're like, it was mostly dick jokes. Like that's what this that's what the first drafts of this comic were. They thought it was going to be kind of a one off something kind of funny. Ha ha. But not that serious. And somewhere down the line, they just cracked a draft where they knew it was these two characters, Susie and John. But they were really taking it because they're two guys. They were like they thought they needed to do it from John's POV. And it was all very much John's story. And at some point, they were just like, I think it was Matt who who said, I think this is Susie's story. I think we need to like Mix this up and come at this from a different angle. And as they started making it more Suzy's story, and maybe it's because two guys writing a female character in a sex joke comic, but it suddenly became much more sincere and much less. Let's just do a bunch of, I don't know, pussy jokes, right? They're like, no, this feels that feels not quite what we should be doing. Let's maybe do this in. Be more sincere. Get more of a real story, real characters behind it. And it just started to take shape. in this way. That said, they still thought it was going to be a four issue limited series in and out. They were going to do the story and still mostly, or there was still a heavy element of humor to the whole thing in those first issues. And you can read that and even they think they're like, you can see where we realized we were going to keep going. Because issues one, two and three, they had finished them. Then they realized they were going to keep going. And they're like, there is such a cutoff between issue three and issue four. where now all of a sudden it's just like we're handling the story differently, we're treating it differently. They were stunned that it was so popular. The first trade paperback, not the omnibus trade paperback they were doing now, but just the first trade, which probably was just the first four issues, maybe the first five or six issues, something like that, made the New York Times bestseller list in comics and graphic novels. Matt said that that's the only reason his parents know that he wrote this comic. that he wrote a comic called Sex Criminals is because it made that list and then they're like, what is this? And okay, so one of my favorite stories that before we get to the contents of the comic itself is that they had a launch party for Sex Criminals at a sex club in Toronto. Sex clubs in Canada are literally sex clubs, not strip clubs like we like we refer to them here in the States. In Canada sex clubs, you have sort of the club floor on the bottom, and then actual bedrooms up above for sex. So it is literally a sex club. But they did a lot. did a launch party at the sex clubs and thought it would be really cute and funny, of course. And it was apparently unventilated, crazy hot. The people at the door, had a certain number of the comic they were gonna give out at the door. And when they ran out of comics, that was the max capacity. They were supposed to stop letting people in. As soon as they gave a comic to every person, they did not do that and the people kept letting people in. And so this was unventilated, crazy hot, over capacity. And so the bottom floor was clubs, the upper floors, were the bedrooms, the sex floors. The special rooms. The special rooms. so Matt was going to get his nipples pierced on stage. That was going to be his big thing too. I didn't hear this. I didn't read this. What? Yeah, yeah, But it was so hot, he only got one nipple pierced and almost passed out. And so had to cancel the second nipple. But here's the best story from all of this. They thought it would be funny. Chip Zdarsky's parents were there for the launch party. And they thought it would be funny to have Chip's mom hold Matt's hand while he got his nipples pierced. gosh. So when he was ready to get his nipples pierced, they went to go look for Chip's mom. His parents had absconded to the sex floors. gosh. So his parents were not to be found and were unavailable. man. At the time. So Matt just got his nipple pierced unassisted. and almost passed out and then it was like, okay. And the other fun story of this, later after almost passing out and he's like, okay, I'm gonna stop there because I think doing the second one, I will definitely pass out. Let's not do that, let's not go there. So we stopped and then the asymmetry drove his OCD nuts afterwards. So he eventually went to go get the second one pierced and he said it was so compared to the first one. It was over. He didn't even realize that it happened. And the first one was so painful, he almost passed out, even though it was super hot. And he then kind of realized that the person who pierced his nipple was kind of a BDSM guy at the sex club. And he wondered if maybe he thought the pain was supposed to be part of the point of doing the first one. not read the story. That's hilarious. In this place. And when he re and he was like, even the equipment the guy used looked horrible and painful. And then he went to the real thing, like just some random, you know, piercing place. And he was like, this all looks those are really tiny, like an easy and like and Sarah. And then it was done. And he was like, did the guy actually make it painful? that was supposed to be part of the point. And people contact right contact and live and learn right live and learn now like how to communicate when you depending on where you are so that was their debut Their launch party for sex criminals. So yeah, anyway real quick some of the you guys might appreciate this knowing that backstory and how sexually electric the whole production of this thing has been The initial run, of course, was Image Comics, September 25th, 2013. The series ran for 31 regular issues and one special issue, concluding on October 28th, 2020. The volumes and collections are listed. Let's see, we have the first called One Weird Trick, which was a collection of issues one through five. The second collection was Two Worlds, One Cap. No, One Cop. Interesting. Two Worlds, One Cop. Sorry, for those of you who understand what two girls, one cup is, you'll get that. That is issues six through 10. The third collection is three, the hard way, which is issues 11 through 15. The fourth collection was called 4G, F -O -U -R -G -Y exclamation point. 4G. Which I actually like that Have a 4G. Have a 4G. Is that a real term? should be a real term, right? I'm going to go ahead and say it's probably, yeah, I would imagine it is. I would imagine it is. It better not just be them being clever because that was great. They are fairly clever. They've proven that with this. Collection 5 is five finger to discount. I don't want to say what I think that issue is about, I'm to file that away until we get to that issue. And Collection 6 is called 6 Criminals. Additionally, the hardcover big hard sex criminals, Omnibus One, which is what we're reviewing today. What do say? OK. Yeah. OK. So 4G is a term, but it does not mean what you think it means. go on. Go on. No, it's boring. 4G is a not so social gathering in which everyone involved exclusively browses social media, usually on their phones or crowded around a power outlet. I don't think that's how they use it. But yeah, I'm going imagine that's not how they're using it. But yeah, I like that. Turn. Hey, that's weird. But OK. Interesting. Interesting. Forgy. I'm trying to be. Is it because you get the it's a 4G network? Right. interesting. Interesting. OK. it is spelled forgy like an orgy. So it's like you're all using your 4G network at the same time. That's the only thing I can think of because I'm like, the number four doesn't enter into it otherwise. Why a 4G? so I think because I think, yeah, that's a good point. Maybe. Yeah. Yeah. No, no clue. Anyway, sex criminals received significant critical acclaim, which you've already heard us run through in 2014. It won the Eisner Best New Series Time Magazine honored sex criminals as the number one serious graphic novel of the year. Though there is no specific year mention results. 2015, Matt Fraction made a deal with Universal TV to turn sex criminals into a TV series. However, the project appears to have entered development hell as no further information. I could find no further information on. I hoping the success of the boys and whatever the especially the spin off one, the younger generation spin on one Z or something. Yeah. Jen something, Jen why? Yeah, something like that. Whatever it is, because that is so violence and sex heavy. I'm like, maybe sex criminals got a future now that that is. And now that Matt Fraction is like, thanks to the monarch legacy of monsters, like he is taken off now. Yeah, I mean, I hope he still he still retains the rights. And it's not like, you know, up in some nonsense held up in limbo. But I imagine we're going to get some really good content out of. their new deal. I imagine we're going to get some great new content and I hope Sex Criminals is one of those because it's fun and it's got legs. unfortunately, the American Library Association reported that the hardcover release of Big Hard Sex Criminals was the seventh most banned and challenged book in the United States in 2016 due to being considered sexually explicit. So bravo on you guys for getting on that list. It's it is, but not in it's certainly not deviant Lee sexually explicit. I mean, there is you get to see a guy's taint like it is sexually explicit up to a point. But it is weirdly for a book called Sex Criminals that is part of comedy that is about people stopping time when they have sex. It is surprisingly tame and surprisingly chaste in its way, not chaste, but but classy. almost like things are there's not a ton of just absurd nudity all over. It's a literary honestly. It is a literary work. It is not just cheap thrills and spills. It is a literary work. Yes, there is not actually issue at least after the first issue. Yes. Like they said, they thought it would be a shorter run that would be a bit jokey. And then they really did like have to go someplace with it, but they did. and then they go places with it and they really start exploring these characters and what this means to them and how it changes them. And yeah, it absolutely becomes a literary work from there. Yeah, absolutely. So, yeah, let's get into the to the meat of this this guy. What did you think of the first act of this omnibus, Dave? Walk us through it. First act of this omnibus. I liked it quite a bit. It was well written, well structured. the idea of robbing a bank to save a library and how these characters get to that place. I mean, they do a decent job because it's a bit over the top. It's a bit absurd, but they do a good job of like, know, one of them and they do a good job with the two main characters, Susie and John, because John is the type of character where one, he had already abused his power as a teenager a little bit like by thieving from porn shops and things like that. And so it's like, he already kind of had it in his head. Like he this was a kind of a more okay thing. Now, of course, they were robbing. They were doing it was a very Peter Pan. I'm Peter. yeah. Robin Hood was a very Robin Hood like robbery where it is like you're you're taking from a group where it's like, fuck these guys. Yeah, and truly like the bank redistributing the wealth you do redistributing redistributing the wealth the bank was being a little shit that and had no reason to be And it was for what most people would probably consider a good cause so it's like it wasn't just like robbery because you could or anything like that But then John was more like he's the one who's like this is what we should do to save your library and he goes there much easier because he has used his powers this quote unquote powers this way in the past. He even uses it like the one thing that really annoyed me. It makes sense as a character quirk, but like the fact that he shits in his boss's potted plant every day at work just as a pranky kind of thing to do is I'm like, come on guy. Like there are elements of John's character where I'm like, I don't think I'd like this guy very much, honestly. I think that's going to come into play later on as we get into this piece, actually. does even later in volume one. As we get further into it, like he is a much more problematical character than even first you first realize. And Susie realizes it as well. needs he needs medication. He needs therapy. He like he is a bit of a mess more than you thought when you first made great TV. If it does go to series, it's going to make great tea. Yes, 100%. You can almost see even in volume one, it's an omnibus volume one, so it's really volume one and two. But even in this first volume one omnibus, they're already having issues with their relationship by the end of it just because Suzy is actually pulling herself together more and more. and becoming more mature and more adult. And John starts to like, is kind of going off the deep end a little bit. He's losing it more and more. Right. So then they have to start reconciling with that. And they're still a fairly new and fresh relationship. So I think the book for me, some of the humor is a little too comic booky juvenile humor. Not my thing. Not my bag. I've never really liked comic book humor very much. think it's. Yeah, it like some of it works. Some of it lands, but a lot of it. I'm just like, it's so lowbrow. And it's not being done by people who are actually that good at comedy. They're there. They are funny. But comedy and being funny are not the same thing. That's a weird statement to make. being funny, just in general in life is one thing. And you can be very good at that most comic writers are good at that they can put quips into Spider -Man's mouth for that reason right they get some nice easy going humor out there every once in a while they can really land some situational humor well right. You know comedians being a comedian being a comedy person is another level of getting your brain to work around how comedy functions and how it really lands and most comic book humor are just people who are funny. but they're not good at comedy per se. So some of the humor doesn't land for me. Some of it I roll my eyes a little bit or get a little like, let's get back to the sincere stuff because man, guys, this ain't working. Or it works only so well and it kind of bugs me. But the story here, the art is fantastic. It's perfect for the story. I do think Chip Zdarsky really gave a lot of TLC to this book and it shows. Matt Fraction as the writer, the primary writer, He is also giving a lot of TLC to the story, especially the longer it goes, the more TLC it gets. The sum of the characters they bring in, the way they're tying things in together, the extra characters that start becoming main characters by the end of volume one, it is evolving at a wonderful pace. I'm like, kudos, I can see why this is popular, I can see why it's a hit. I can see why it's a hit amongst comic people, especially a lot of people love comic, like a lot of comic people love comic humor. And it makes sense. makes sense. It's part of the ethos. You get it. You know, it's kind of like you said, it is fairly ubiquitous and you just kind of accept it as a part of the genre and you kind of look for it in order to to make you sort of feel as though you're in familiar territory. So I get it. I get why it's done. You know, but I think because I like the characters in this so much, you know, not personally, but, you know, sort of artistically, the characters are drawn very well. They're narratives, their profiles, and it is so sweet and touching in a weird way. And there is this sort of innocence to it that that kind of low brow. I I hate saying low brow low bar. We'll go with low bar, low bar, comic, low hanging fruit. Yeah, it just. It almost cheapened it for me. But I get it. I get it. get it. It's part of the reason I think it is so popular. Yeah. And I do think volume one is a was that work in progress where they were. And you see the evolution. You can see the evolution. They're finding the voice of what this series is really going to be, especially now that it's going to be more than four issues. They're like, knew from the get go that the low hanging fruit was not going to support more than four issues. So they're like, OK. If we keep going, this needs to be more and this needs to be even better than because they had already cracked the draft to be like issues one. Don't get me wrong. Issues one through four or even just one through three before they realized they were going to keep going. It's not just all low hanging fruit. No, no, no. Already made it more Suzy story, made it something more touching and had found the heart. Yes, they found the heart. Yeah, 100 percent. And it was working like as a four -issue limited series. It was 100 % working. I would have been impressed by it even then. But where it goes after that is better. think especially with like my issues with John's character, it suddenly starts to acknowledge all those issues with John's character where I'm like, OK, good, because he was he was a little bit of a but I'm bummed. Dick. mean, he was in ways that were just unnecessary and weirdly immature for who like his age and who he was. And especially when you first meet him, it was one of those things where he was getting away with being so not those things. And then and then they start to crud then he starts to show that because it is that being on your best behavior on a first date kind of a thing. Yeah, we are like, okay, and then you start seeing the underbelly of that. And you're like, no, he's hard, isn't it? In in in Gen Z parlance, I guess that's Gen Z. He is the ultimate fuck boy in guy. He just he really just puts on a great cloak and dagger side of routine. Bond. Yeah, it's brilliant. But to their credit, it really yeah, I mean, that character is actually well drawn. Narratively speaking, well drawn and and artistic and both both both well drawn. So, yeah, yeah. Yeah, so it's great. So for you, best moment of these first 10 chapters? honestly, it's going to be kind of difficult to beat the series of pages where she I call it the Carrie series where she is early on where she is having this experience alone and she's reaching out, I mean, vehemently aggressively trying to find someone to give her context for what this thing is, why it is. It is just it was so that's I'll be honest. I had very low expectations for this series. You know, I remember we mentioned this series in our legacy early on, just in passing and kind of forgot about it. And then you just thought by the title and the concept, you're like, that's cute. We got to do that. Because you're the one who texted me and was like, so so. this is what happened. I was in a cafe. And I was having a conversation with a guy about comics and graphic novels, because he knew who I was, because I was the big black guy from Killing the Grizzly who he sent his package to years ago. I apparently, you know, wrote back and told him, no, I, you know, I responded and said, this is great effort. You've written a lot, but, you know, here's what we recommend you sort of do and, you know, come back to us and blah, blah, blah, whatever. And of course, most creators who were sitting in their own ego, that was a personal affront. you know, how could I not love it? How could you not? know? Right, right, right. And so I was just sitting there. This guy knew exactly who I was from 10 years ago, because again, as I like to say. so you weren't meeting up with him. No, you just stumbled upon him. yeah. This is story of my life. So I was sitting there and and and this guy's like, I know you and I was like, no, you know, which is my least my least favorite phrase in the English language. I know you. And so, you know, we sort of did the back and forth for a while and he, you know, he said it. And this girl overheard us discussing comics. And I guess she didn't have anyone to sort of discuss comics with graphic novels. And so she was like, my God, I'm reading this new thing. It's amazing. It's about this girl. who can stop time with her orgasms. And I went, huh? I was like, go on. And it started clicking and I was like, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, Zdarsky, that's right. The Zdarsky fraction, yeah. And so I was like, fuck yeah. So I texted you that day. I was like, that's what we're doing. We're going over the list. So. is interesting. I will mention that female audiences like this comic, seems. yeah. very, very much, I think because it's from Suzy's POV. And the even though it's two guys that are making this one, they're both in or at least Matt, I know is in a very long term relationship. And he says he's pulled a lot or and I think chip is as well. And I think they both said like, yeah, they pulled from ex girlfriends from their current relationships. I could see they pulled a lot of true stories, anecdotes and whatnot, like to make to really populate this with like, real life experiences of real life women. And so it's like, yes. And it does ring with some authenticity. I think that's even though it's written by two men, which is apparently a horrible thing to do these days, a decade on after. It's a dangerous thing to do, especially if you're going to talk about like, we're going to write a book about female sexuality. And it's like, are you sure you want to do that? That could go bad for you. Good luck. But in this case, it does seem to have gotten a very warm reception from the segment of the audience. Yeah. And she, you know, like I said, she just she was raving about it. Then I talked to another girl who she was in comics for a while and she was like, I guess my favorite series. And of course, she was like, I really hate the idea that it was written by two guys, but they do it so well. I was like, OK, that's that's all right. OK, that's a vote of confidence for sure. So yeah, when it when it came across it, it was one of those things where the pitch and that's always a big tell for me if you can boil something it's kind of cliche being a writer. But it's true if you can boil down the essence of an IP, a film or television show or script or whatever it is into basically a sentence or a couple of sentences and it has inertia, momentum, energy, you know the who the what the when and the where maybe not the why. it sings and you're looking for that thing to sing in your ear and it really does sing. yeah, I think my best my favorite moment is that series where she is my call it the Carrie series, where she's in the locker room with the other girls and, you know, she's going around asking everybody all these questions that that series that panel just that sequence is just just delicious to me. Yeah, what about you? For me, it's going to be near the end when they have to all three of them when they introduced the porn, the ex porn star actress as a main character who already from a trauma, not just from being a porn star, she had this her whole life, but from a trauma in her youth, like really couldn't feel much down there. And so it was always like getting to that point was something that so she's one of these people and she didn't even realize that until later in life because she had never actually orgasm and then she realized she's one of these people but she does it so rarely and so when she goes to the hotel room And she like takes out like 20 different objects, the saddle, the dildos, the electrics, the vibe, the da da da, the clips, the, electric, I mean everything. And she's like, this is a fine tune. It's like the ultimate, you know how they say like men are simple to get off and then women are like a machine, like with all these knobs and buttons and everything. And this was like visually taking that to the next level where it's like even compared to the other woman in the main character in the main trio. This one was like yet another set of knobs and buttons never heard of. And like all of it had to happen in perfect sequence and conjunction. And they were all gonna try and orgasm at the same time. So they were all in the frozen time space together. And that whole moment, I was like, this is great. This is taking the premise and introducing this extra character who is, know, had that beautiful cynicism of having been in the sex industry. And like none of this is like taboo or difficult to talk about. And you can see how wary she is of having to talk to anyone who's even the least bit reticent to talk about it, because she's like, get over your fucking selves, you know, kind of a thing. And so, yeah, that I felt like that whole and that's basically that's almost where the first volume ends. But I felt like that was a perfect but I'm climax to the whole thing. I agree, I agree. Those moments are great. She they do such a yeah, the evolution. It is so rare to see a project evolve as efficiently, I think creatively, narratively, artistically as this one did. And you can kind of see that moment, as you stated, you know, in the sort of production history when they realize they were going to have to keep going. And you can kind of see the giddy up. It was like, well, OK, all right. We got to all right. We got to figure this out. We got to know we're building out a universe. Right. Yeah. Sort of like not just a concept within this fairly contained story. But now we like if we're to take this to the bitter end, what's the bitter like? What is everything that we want to explore and get to that bitter end? Yeah. So 30 issues total, two more omnibuses to come, which we will tackle in the future. Once again Dallas, what are you pairing with this volume? It's big hard. I'm the miss volume one. It's yes and by the way Chip and Matt I'm gonna go ahead and let you guys have my quote Gazams and guffaws for That one he's like use it quote it me put my name Dallas Miller. Thank you, everyone. Gazzams and Gaffaws. actually reveal my last name on the podcast. It is Dallas Miller. Please quote me. It's Gazzams and Gaffaws. Anyway, I am pairing the Inniskillen Riesling Ice Wine. Unfortunately, it is a little pricey. There are some other regional ice wines which you can find. How much is that one? How much is that one again? it's $183. 183 mother of God, I thought it would be like 75. Okay. Yeah, it's 183. I think you can find a few of their other ventures, which are much more affordable. you can find I'm just gonna say I'm just gonna say wine bid the bidding side. That's true in a skill and older in a skill and an ice wine will hold up with all that sugar and acidity. You can find it for more like the 50 to $75 range. So to wine bid sites. That's a very good tip. That's a very good tip. And we are very familiar with the wine bit sites here. We cannot recommend them more. And once again, I am pairing Ludovic Montignot Morgan, Cote de Pays, Bougelet, which is$28 on Wine Access. I did look that up while you were talking. I just forgot to go back to it. So I'm saying it now.$28 at WineAccess .com. I would, and I highly recommend you will find wines, whether you want to get six bottles of this or something like that to get it all shipped to you, or you mix and match a bunch of stuff on wine access. They have a ton of things that you can't easily find elsewhere. So, and a few things you can easily find elsewhere if you just want to, you know, have your mainstays as part of the, the package. But those are our wines, folks. Thank you so much for listening. We will be back. next week with another wine and entertainment pairing for your entertainment but until then ciao for now and we will see you then thank you so much for listening later guys you