Ep 75 How to Tap into Bravery With Jess From Joyus Non-alcoholic Wines

Ever felt like everyone around you thinks you're a little crazy for chasing a dream? Join me for an inspiring chat with Jess from Joyous Non-Alcoholic Wines, where we dive into her incredible journey of bravery and determination. Jess started with just a few lackluster options in the non-alcoholic market and transformed it into a thriving industry of award-winning, alcohol-free wines. Despite working in a high-drinking culture and facing countless naysayers, she persisted and brought her vision to life.

This episode explores the magic of celebrating small victories and tapping into your inner bravery, no matter the opposition. Jess’s story is perfect for anyone feeling stuck or doubting their path. Her mission to normalize not drinking is inspiring and a testament to the power of persistence and joy. So, get cozy and pour yourself a mocktail because it’s time to toast to living our best lives without alcohol. Cheers!

Save 10% when you order Joyus by using code MOCKTAILMOM -- I know you'll LOVE it!

Get in touch with Jessica!
Website | Instagram | Facebook

Thanks to Giesen 0% Wines for being our exclusive non-alcoholic wine sponsor!

Connect with Deb on Instagram: @Mocktail.Mom

• Grab a guide to help when dining out: Ordering Out Made Easy
• Join my wonderful membership community, Thriving Alcohol-Free: Mocktail Mom Membership
• Website: MocktailMom.com
• Celebrate your Authentic Freedom

You are loved. Big Time Cheers!

Transcript

Deb: 0:01

Buckle up, friends, and welcome to the Thriving Alcohol-Free Podcast. I'm your host, deb, otherwise known as Mocktail Mom, a retired wine drinker that finally got sick and tired of spinning on life's broken record called Detox to Retox. Let this podcast be an encouragement to you. If alcohol is maybe a form of self-care for you, where you find yourself dragging through the day waiting to pour another glass, I am excited to share with you the fun of discovering new things to drink when you aren't drinking and the joy of waking up each day without a hangover. It is an honor to serve as your sober, fun guide. So sit back and relax or keep doing whatever it is you're doing. This show is produced for you with love from the great state of Kentucky. Thanks so much for being here and big time cheers, all right. Hey friends, it's Deb. Welcome back to Thriving Alcohol-Free. I have th e guests of all guests today for you. One of my BFFs from Instagram. She was one of well, one of the very first Instagram lives that I did. I know I was actually the first Instagram live that you did. This is Jess from Joyus. You all probably know her. Joyus non-alcoholic wines, one of my absolute favorites and has been for years and years since I first became alcohol-free. So let me just give you a formal introduction. How's that sound, jess? Sounds great. Okay, all right, perfect, okay, jess is as the founder. She's the founder of the USA's 100% sober-owned and woman owned non-alcoholic winery. Jessica's innovative joyus non-alcoholic wine is a celebration of life's moments, both big and small. Enjoy joyously and authentically without alcohol. Joyous proudly stands as the highest and most awarded non-alcoholic winery in the United States, boasting numerous best of class and double gold wins. One of US Today's 10 non-alcoholic wines has been featured numerous times in Forbes and the New York Times and if you've been in the alcohol-free space for two seconds, you've heard of Joyous and hopefully you've already tried it.

Deb: 1:57

But if you haven't, I don't want to interrupt the sound, but I do want to show for the people who are maybe watching. This is how joyus comes. It comes like a gift. Every bottle is wrapped in this beautiful paper, so I'm going to open it. It's going to make a little bit of noise here, but I'm going to open this and then each bottle. Hang on. Please hold for the sound. Sorry, I'm sure that sounds terrible for those of you listening on your headphones or whatever you're doing. I mean the bottle is heavy, the bottle just has such a wonderful feel. And then I love just that the bottles come with this, always like a beautiful card, just to connect with you. And then there's always an inspirational quote on here and I feel like your bottles not only does the drink just encourage us that there are good things to drink, but your whole messaging, your whole packaging is that this is something to be, like you said, celebrated. It's an elevated experience. This is not like oh, wah, wah.

Deb: 2:51

It's the exact opposite. It's everything the opposite. So anyway, that's all Welcome. Welcome, that's a long introduction.

Jess: 2:56

I apologize. Thank you for having me. I'm so happy you're here. I'm so happy you're here.

Deb: 3:00

So, yes, it's been a long time. We haven't connected in a long time, so good to see you.

Jess: 3:04

We've been doing things. It's been crazy. We have a crazy time.

Deb: 3:08

I know, okay, so you've been sober for 18 years 18 years. Is that right?

Jess: 3:13

Yes, and it's building, joyus, like the company, and figuring out how to make non-alcohol wine, how to make it great, how to make it better and better and better and better. It really is just like one step at a time. It's just bit by bit, step by step, especially especially early on and even still now, because as we grow there's new challenges and new things. I was, um, I was talking to our UPS driver, like the UPS driver that comes and picks up all the, all the packages every day. We get into chats, we chat quite a bit, and so I was talking about the ins and outs of your business.

Jess: 3:45

He knows what's happening over there. Yeah, he sees it all.

Deb: 3:47

Yeah, he should be making the behind the scenes videos for the company. You know what's it like to pick up a joyus he will tell you a winter time on a Monday.

Jess: 3:56

He's like whoa, because like cause we can't ship every day of the week. So things, most of it goes out on Monday.

Deb: 4:03

Yeah, so it doesn't. Yeah, it doesn't sit on people's porches and freeze. Yeah, yeah.

Jess: 4:06

He knows all the stuff in the boxes are heavy, so, okay, he's fantastic. But he was like, oh yeah, you're, you're fighting bigger bosses. And I was like what he's like? Oh yeah, like like video games, right challenges. It would mean that you're being that, you're stagnant.

Jess: 4:23

If you have bigger challenges and bigger things to like figure out or overcome, it means you're leveling up like a video game.

Jess: 4:36

And I was like, oh, that's kind of a nice way of looking at it, right Cause, yeah, cause, sometimes, you know, I mean every life, everything you're always going to have challenges. And sometimes you're like, oh, I'm so sick of like figuring things out, but it's almost kind of this, I don't know. It's a nice way of looking at it where you're like I'm just growing more and so the challenges are different, they're more complex or they're bigger. And if they were just tiny and easy to do, then it means I'm not challenging myself that we're not growing, so it's actually a good thing. Know, we're not growing, so it's actually a good thing, and so it's funny. You said that. And then I think about it a lot when I've, when I'm like banging my head against the wall about something and I'm like, okay, we're leveling up, we're just leveling up, leveling up, yeah, yeah, that's a great way to look at it yeah, gamifying our businesses in our own minds.

Deb: 5:15

It's just a mindset. It's just shifting your mindset, like none of the challenges have changed, right, everything's the same, right, but your mindset has changed.

Jess: 5:23

Because everything's a mindset right, like so much stuff. There's so much stuff on a daily basis that's beyond our control, that you really can't do anything about except change your mindset on it.

Deb: 5:34

A hundred percent.

Jess: 5:35

You know, and I think that's kind of the hard one of the hard things about life and challenges You're like I want to wish things to be different, I want to wish things to be easier, and it's like, I don't know, trying to flip, flip scripts in your brain.

Deb: 5:47

Yeah, so 18 years ago, when you decided to break up with alcohol, you probably could never have imagined 2024. No you know, yeah, a couple of years into a non-alcoholic wine brand. What have been the stages of your sober journey?

Jess: 6:05

Oh, when I first quit drinking, I was, I was a mess. It was very, very messy. I needed to quit drinking. And so I was talking to a friend of mine and I was like I just need to get my life under control and then, once my life is like manageable, then I'll be able to drink again. So this is just temporary.

Jess: 6:18

And then I think after I'd like spent more time around, you know, sober people, other people that weren't drinking, kind of was like and took off the um, the fog, you know, took off the fog of alcohol. I was like, oh, this just doesn't work for me. And if someone had told me like, hey, your life is going to get exponentially better, your insides are going to like feel so much better, you're going to experience amazing things. All you have to do is not drink this liquid, then you'd be like, sign me up, of course, but for some reason, when you're like I can't drink alcohol, it's such a hard, a hard thing to do. So, yeah. So my original plan was like just get my life under control. It's not under control, yeah. And then I realized, no, alcohol is just, you know, it's a symptom of the problem and it just doesn't. It's something that doesn't work for me. And then the longer you know, the longer I go without it, the more, the more my life changes for the better.

Jess: 7:09

And I think it's easier to say 18 years out, because definitely, like month, one month, three month, nine year, one year, two, like those are, those are the hardest, those are the hardest times here. At 18 years sober, I'm rocking and rolling, you know, because I've like walked through a lot of things that life has thrown at me. And so I think what happens the longer you've been sober or not drinking, it's kind of like an onion. You know, you clear out a lot of stuff at first and you're like, yeah, this is great. And then you start walking around doing life and you're like, oh wait, this doesn't feel comfortable now, or whatever. So you start walking around doing life and you're like, oh wait, this doesn't feel comfortable now, or whatever. So you start getting like deeper, deeper into it, deeper into like your relationships with other people, deeper into like your relationship with yourself and life. And you know we get one, one shot at this thing.

Deb: 7:57

Yeah, we get one chance.

Jess: 7:59

Yeah, it's like we'll never be this age at this time in this year in this place again. It's one of those like terrifying things, but it's also one of those beautiful things to really, you know, take the time to like be present for it. And for me, you know, drinking was much more a drinking to hide and a drinking to oblivion, you know. So I wasn't present for it and then missing out a lot, you know, afterwards, by just feeling, you know, feeling sick.

Deb: 8:26

Yeah, not waking up with a hangover is phenomenal, it's great. It never gets old, right? No, it's great, right? Do you still like? Is there still that magic feeling, like there's days where I wake up and I am, I mean, almost four years in it. It's like, thank you, I do not have a hangover this morning. It's Tuesday, it is, you know, wednesday. Like I woke up without a hangover, I took my dog on a walk, you know.

Jess: 8:47

Yes, there's so much more time for things you know, because you're not spending that time drinking. You're not spending that time then like hungover.

Deb: 8:55

Recovering.

Jess: 8:56

Recovering yeah.

Deb: 8:57

Yeah, or then, and then, once you recovered you know by the afternoon or whatever then thinking about okay, how much do I have at home, or would it take up a lot of your headspace?

Jess: 9:06

Yes, the amount of time drinking takes. It's a lot of time invested. I remember the first time I got sick I just got a cold after I quit drinking and I was like, oh man, I was such a baby. And I was like, oh, I feel terrible. This is what I used to feel like all the time. How did I do anything? How?

Deb: 9:23

did I do anything? Yes, okay. Now was your background in wines. Did you have a background in bottling products? What were you doing before you started? Joyce, can I ask you?

Jess: 9:33

that? No, I was working in the communications, design and advertising. Oh right.

Deb: 9:40

Yes, that's why your packaging is so beautiful. Yes, it's all about the details. It really is.

Jess: 9:46

Yeah, yeah, so that was. My degree is graphic design. I was working for a company where we were doing advertising for good, so it was like a lot of nonprofits, public health, women's health, anything that was like doing good in the world. That's what we're working on. And now you're continuing to do good in the world. You are. That's one of our core values.

Jess: 10:12

I think that life gets distracting and it's very easy to get lost along the way with what you are all about. I think in businesses especially, it is really easy to get lost right With what you started out to do. I mean, I think it was Google where they had it in their manifesto, where they're like do no evil, and then they just took it out. People are like wait a second, wow, yeah. So I set down core values before anything could influence it. So that's one of the core values is are we putting good in the world? Treat other people how you want to be treated, which seems so basic, but you can really ladder up to a lot of stuff with it. I was really influenced by this podcast I heard with the founder of Patagonia. Okay yeah, can I listen to. There's this podcast called how I Built this, which is a lot.

Deb: 10:57

Yeah, Is that? Uh uh, what's his name? Guy Raz, guy Raz. I'm like, oh my gosh, I can, I can, I can hear his voice in my head. I love his podcast. Oh, he's so great. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, yes, all right, I want to hear this.

Jess: 11:11

Yeah. So he's got the how I Built this podcast. It's all entrepreneurs, all different industries, all different people, all different backgrounds. So interesting, funny thing about him. He also has like a kids podcast with this other lady and it's um, wow in the world, it's like the science, kids science, and it's like really silly, okay. So it's I don't know, it's really cool. So it's just like oh, you're an interesting person, very yeah. So he did one with the founder of patagonia and it was interesting hearing his story because he was like I guess there's a lot of garbage and mountaineering and mountain climbing and stuff like that, so they're trying to make reusable mountain climbing pieces. I'm not gonna remember all the exact terminology. I don't climb mountains physically.

Deb: 11:53

Yes, yes, yeah. Mentally I climb many mountains, yeah yeah. In business, you're climbing mountains.

Jess: 11:59

Oh man, so many, so like. So that that was like, what kind of started them Was there? Like, well, we're out in nature and we love the environment, but we're making a bunch of garbage, you know. But continue on to Patagonia grows and they've got all this different stuff and all this different products, and so one of the things was like we're going to be a company that's around for a hundred years and so everything they do was laddering up to that. So they would look at what they were doing and they're like because you can buy a Patagonia clothes and if they get damaged, you can ship them to them and they'll fix them and return them, but it's that we're going to be around for a hundred years. We don't want to be making all this garbage, so what should we be doing? We should be fixing the clothes instead of fast fashioning them.

Jess: 12:39

So it's all of this, even stuff for like how they treat their employees where they're like well, if we're going to be around for 100 years and maybe our employees' children will want to work here, so of course we're going to have daycare on site, wow, so it's just all this stuff that you wouldn't even think about, that you're like okay, well, if you really really like, we're going to be around for you know. So it was just, it was so fascinating. And then also like the Patagonia employees, they're like, yeah, if the surf is great, go surf and then come back and get your work done. Like they're just very like live, you should be living life. Yeah, there are scientists, psychologists have done studies on the employees of Patagonia because the company they do really really well, but they're so independent. They're like almost quote unquote I'm doing air quotes quote unquote unemployable because they're not used to like being micromanaged and all this kind of stuff. And they're like why does this work? It's so different than corporate America.

Deb: 13:29

Anyway, so freeing, no, it's so freeing, right To be able to. Yeah, and I think it makes it makes the employees want to do more.

Jess: 13:37

Yeah, like it's like okay, so I have to stay later or get something done, or right? Yeah, because the company is given so much to you, you give back so much more. Yes, they're treating people like people and so it's like the. You know you have a baby, you can go breastfeed your baby and then come back to work and it's just like I, it's just was so cool and so yeah. So for us, treat other people how you want to be treated sounds so basic, but it ladders up to a lot of stuff. So even for us and you know we, you know work with distributors, we self distribute in places, we're direct to consumer shipping in the mail, like we're manufacturing, like we do so many things, and so, looking at like our winter shipping speaking of shipping and I was like, oh my gosh, we have the capability here to make so much garbage that would be around forever. And so one of the beauties of owning 100% of this company is I can make great environmental decisions that are terrible business decisions. Yes.

Deb: 14:34

Yeah, oh yeah, you have a little heat pack. I mean it comes. Do you want to explain how it comes in the winter?

Jess: 14:40

Yeah. So I found this company. So cutting edge technology, it's like this. So a lot of wineries use styrofoam. And so I found this company that makes insulation. It's insulation, but it's made from like corn.

Jess: 14:54

It's extremely biodegradable, so you can compost it in your household backyard composter, you can melt it down your drain, you can dissolve it in a bucket of water and use that bucket of water to feed your plants. It's clean, burning, so you can use it to start a barbecue or a fire in your fireplace. It's, it's cool, it's cool stuff. And then the heat packs we use the same thing that people use to ship like plants or lizards and it's like sawdust and stuff is how, and then it like activates and it warms. And so, financially, styrofoam would cost like a temp it would, yeah, but so we make, you know, and I'm like, well, that's a lot of garbage. So so we use these very, you know, eco-friendly shippers because it's the right thing to do. I mean, we do have to make some other decisions. Like you know, we don't do free shipping in the wintertime and stuff like that, but even then they're so expensive. But it's the right. It's the right choice.

Deb: 15:46

Yeah, yeah, and shipping is so expensive.

Jess: 15:49

Yes, oh, yeah.

Deb: 15:51

Our stuff's heavy. This is heavy. I mean you can just lift weights with the joyus bottles. You can you will be so in shape in no time. You don't need to go to the gym, just order yourself some bottles.

Jess: 16:02

It's premium. It's like, really, because I'm like someone if you're not drinking alcohol, you should be feeling really great about your decision, whether it's just for that night or whatever. Yeah, However long it is, I want to make it easier for people to feel good about good decisions. And so, like it is, it's extremely premium glass it's, which means it's very, very heavy. Right, Our sparkling glass is what you know expensive champagne comes in Yep. Our sparkling glass is what you know expensive champagne comes in Yep. So I think I was.

Deb: 16:34

I'll tell people to be out doing like a trade shows and stuff, Be like oh, feel it, feel the bottle.

Jess: 16:36

Feel how heavy it is. Yeah, and one of my other folks was like that's a little, that's a little weird. You gotta stop hating people.

Deb: 16:41

Feel the bottle, Touch it. It's heavy and you can. It feels substantial.

Jess: 16:47

Yes, you are not just picking up this little lightweight.

Deb: 16:48

No, it's heavy and it feels substantial. It does feel it. Yes, you are not just picking up this little lightweight. No, it's. Yeah, it's so good. Okay, what about the sugar content? I know that's something that actually somebody in my membership in thriving alcohol free, which shout out to the ladies of thriving alcohol free Love you guys. One of the gals was asking about sugar content because and I know you know, even for myself like just trying to cut back on sugar. Can you talk a little bit about that?

Jess: 17:10

Yeah, so this is this is like a fun one, because core values, right, include everyone. That's one of our core values. So one of the one of the beautiful things about joyous is we are very, very low in sugar, if not, if not the lowest, one of the lowest. So what's kind of interesting're also a de-alkanized or alcohol removed wine, technically. So our wines go through the whole winemaking process, their age, they're fermented and then we take the alcohol out. So people get kind of confused about it and it's like well, because it does go through the fermenting process, right, you start with, you know, grapes. Those sugars are turning into alcohol. The alcohol sugars are like very, very in calories. So when we remove the alcohol, we're removing those alcohol sugars and that's why, like joyous, it's like 18 calories a glass. For our sparkling, it's 90 calories a bottle. The cab.

Deb: 17:59

Yeah, it's 25 calories. I'm holding it, I'm touching it. I'm touching the bottle. 25 calories per glass, yes, so five, five ounce glass.

Jess: 18:08

And then our still rose is 15 calories a glass. Yeah, so very, very popular with diabetics. Yeah, Because you can. You know you can have a glass.

Deb: 18:17

You can still have your wine and not be spiking your sugar.

Jess: 18:20

Yes, so it's more so. You know it's funny because very early on and even still, people are like who's drinking non-alcoholic wine and I'm like who's not.

Deb: 18:29

I love that. Yes, turn it around. Turn it around. Who's not?

Jess: 18:37

There's so many people, so many reasons and, like I said, whether it's just that night, just one glass, or if it's a longer term thing, talk about having time. Yeah, you can hang out with your friends on a Friday night and drink a bottle, and you just drank 90 calories. You know what I mean. Like you don't have the alcohol the next day to feel awful and you don't have, like, as I get older, like too much sugar. I'll feel kind of funky the next day.

Deb: 18:58

Same, same. My daughter got married and I had so much sugar. I ate all these crumble cookies, I ate so many of them, but I had headaches from it because I had before her wedding. I'd really been like cutting back my sugar, increasing my protein. I was like on a good track and then literally it was like the crumble cookies, like come back to us, come back, we missed you. And so we had a little love affair, and now I'm done. I broke up again, so doing better, but um oh, that's a.

Jess: 19:23

That's a good one to say. Cause, like I see, um, cause there is right. There is this like sugar craving. So if you're someone who's like has stopped the alcohol completely a lot of people I see that online a lot where they talk about like the sugar cravings come up right yeah.

Deb: 19:36

Yeah, very much so.

Jess: 19:37

Oh, that one was big, for me too. I was just like eating candy. You know, eating candy, energy drinks and I will say, don't worry about it in the early days, agree, you know, because people are like well, and it's like you're already doing one thing, like do not stress, because, man, I think I lost like 10 or 15 pounds when I quit drinking and I was eating a ton of candy, yeah, and even when I get stressed out now, sometimes my body's like I want candy, you know. So there's something we get kind of programmed into that sugar, like the alcohol sugar, and there's something I think there I mean, I'm not you know there's something about it in our bodies. But I just say like please don't worry about it, especially when you first quit drinking. You can get to that one later.

Deb: 20:18

I agree that's such great advice. That's such great advice, yeah, because in the beginning, yes, it's like, for whatever reason if it, if that candy wasn't nailed down, this house, like I stopped drinking end of December. I mean I think I was eating like the Easter candy that was still in the pantry. I was finding anything. It was like what's in my daughter's room and, yeah, I think that's such great advice. Like, just like let that one go for a minute, and just focus on you know, one thing at a time. One thing at a time ..

Deb: 20:59

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Deb: 22:04

Okay, I do want to talk about. Okay, so when you started the brand, there were no other. Well, there were barely any non-alcoholic brands. Yeah, there were a few, very few. The landscape was very different four years ago when you started Joyus. I mean, you've gone from like a deserted parking lot to now. You know it feels like we're in like the big city.

Jess: 22:24

Oh, it's crazy. It's craziness because, like when I first started, cause joy has took me seven years to launch. So, there you go.

Deb: 22:32

Working full time, were you working.

Jess: 22:37

You were working and this was in the back of your mind. So, cause I think it was okay, it was on the back of my mind for even longer, but actually being like, okay, I'm going to do this thing. So I'm like that's why my math gets all funky Cause I'm like, yeah, you could be like, was it in my mind? It was in my mind from like sober year one, sober year two, oh, yeah, yeah, and just the stuff where it's like I love the ritual, I love the beautiful glasses, I love the togetherness. You know all those, all those, all those things. So it was, it was there the whole time, you know.

Jess: 23:03

And even quitting drinking like my coworkers I had at the time, I could tell you I was in a very high drinking culture and job at that time and people would keep alcohol at their desks and I can tell you to this day, oh, this was so-and-so's favorite. This person drank whiskey, this person loved this. You know what I mean. And it's just because my brain was so paying attention to what other people are drinking Sure, sure, no-transcript three. But it was just like this is it? This is what you get. You've got no, you've got no options. It was like beer too, cause I would buy we were talking about earlier. I would buy the beer. Buy O we were talking about earlier. I would buy the beard by.

Deb: 24:06

O'Doul's Just to have something. It was like I just want something yeah.

Jess: 24:09

Yeah, yeah. And so it's completely different, completely different landscape. And in that journey of like talking to people, talking to the wine industry, trying to figure out how the heck you do this and having everybody telling me like nobody wants that, Nobody wants that, or they.

Jess: 24:27

Or they'd be like, oh, it already exists. And I'd be like, well, there's one, there's one like that's not, that's not enough, no, it's not enough, it's just, it's just so weird. They'd be like, oh, it's for pregnant ladies and alcoholics. That was overwhelmingly what I was told. And even then it's like well, guys, uh, maternity clothes exist. I don't know if you know that, but there's a whole, you know there's a whole line, yeah there's a whole industry of things.

Deb: 24:53

Yeah, and women are only pregnant for nine, ten months, right, right and um and guess what the options are?

Jess: 24:58

more than just like one shirt and one, you know, and one pair of pants. Yes, yeah, like, oh my gosh. Like, just like the sexism and like I don't know what you would call anti folks with alcohol problems. You know what I mean but same, like, just so not understanding, not understanding at all, yeah, yeah, yes, yeah, so terrible, but like oh my goodness.

Jess: 25:21

And now to today, where it's like I never imagined in my wildest dreams that there would be enough non-alcoholic anything to fill an entire bottle, like they call non-alcoholic bottle shop, but it's like it's a liquor store or a wine shop, but it's all non-alcoholic. Never imagined that there would be.

Jess: 25:40

Oh, the first time I tried non-alcoholic tequila, it blew my mind really yeah, it blew my mind because I just never I mean, my head was so in wine and I knew that beer was possible.

Jess: 25:51

You know, like I just never thought anybody would try for the spirits, and it's so. It's so interesting because some of them dealkinize, some of them build it up from science, like it's just really really fascinating. And then one of the cool things too like culturally outside of the U S, people started doing non-alcoholic long, long before us. Right, the UK was ahead of us and they historically drink a lot of gin and so they were playing around with gins. And what's I think is really really interesting is in the U S there's like non-alcoholic botanicals, like botanical spirits where they don't taste like alcohol but they are interesting and adult and complex, and I think it's really interesting that the US really dug into that. Do you know what I mean? Because it's like, oh yeah, we kind of think differently here and we do things differently and we are more open to like breaking the norms and traditions, and you know.

Deb: 26:41

Different flavors and stuff doesn't necessarily have to be yeah, it doesn't have to be an exact like one--one replica of what you might think of as a tequila or a gin. Yeah, but you can still have complex flavors.

Jess: 26:53

Yeah, and then everybody's influencing each other. So now there's the botanicals from all over the world, and whether it's more of a botanical spirit kind of experience or a botanical kind of wine-ish experience, it's so interesting, so interesting, yeah, so exciting.

Deb: 27:13

Okay, I would love for you to share because, for the listeners, maybe they're not thinking about starting an non-alcoholic wine brand, but there's something in all of our lives, right, that we're trying to do or trying to accomplish or be brave about that. Everybody's looking at us, going you're crazy. You know whether it's industry or maybe it's your family. It's like no, you've always done this, you've always been this way and we want to make changes, we want to make adjustments in our life and sometimes those influences of people. So what encouragement could you give to people who are just trying to be brave in our own life today? Because it is what you have done. What you did to start this brand is so brave, so brave.

Jess: 27:50

And where we are today is just it's kind of. It's kind of mind blowing.

Jess: 27:54

It's kind of mind blowing. And we're on, we're on Amazon now too. We just got an Amazon in January and we're like we're in the top 10. We kind of everything kind of moves on Amazon. So sometimes we're number five, sometimes we're number three, sometimes we're number nine. You know what I mean. Like it, wow, but it's like I don't know. So sometimes I go from like nobody wants that and now it's like wow, people want this, people want this. And you know people have been like no, not gold, wine, poo, poo. And you're like hey, here we are, gold medal, gold medal, double gold, best of class, best.

Jess: 28:23

I think the hardest thing for people to do is to start.

Jess: 28:28

I think, like with the internet there is the opportunity to reach out to people that can get you onto the next step, that maybe can answer that one question and lead you to the next question.

Jess: 28:38

But I think sometimes we look at folks and we're like, oh, there's so many more people so much better than me at everything. You know, forgetting that sometimes you're seeing someone at step 1,282 in their journey. You know, not realizing like hey, you aren't seeing like the first video someone posted from eight years ago or one year ago or whatever, I think we all think we have to have this thing so polished and neat and done when it's like you don't. And every everybody learns and everybody grows and everybody gets better. And I think that there's a lot of't and every everybody learns and everybody grows and everybody gets better. And I think that there's a lot of anything and there's a lot of opportunity and a lot of things are much, much more findable and much, much more reachable. And even if you think that you have it all planned out and it's in a little bow, you don't guess what the ups guy is gonna show up and explain to you?

Jess: 29:28

you don't yeah, I mean, there's so much stuff, like there's so much stuff. I didn't like trucking and transportation logistics. I'm so focused on how do I make the best non-alcoholic wine I possibly can you know, to have this thing that I imagined in my head, in my mouth, you know, and it's like, oh yeah, there's all these other things. Guess what your bottles are gonna like? Turn into popsicles in the wintertime?

Deb: 29:49

Oh, my gosh Okay. So was that the first winter when you shipped?

Jess: 29:52

That was the first winter.

Deb: 29:54

That was what 2021?.

Jess: 29:55

That's 20. Yeah, 2021. Okay, 2021.

Jess: 29:59

And it was like oh man, I also got lucky that it was a later, a later winter, where it didn't things didn't start freezing until like mid-december, where now we watch the weather starting in late october. So we've got like a map of the country. We track the weather in like major, major locations, but across the country, like we've got a whole weather system. Yeah, across the country storms too. So you're like, hey, it may be cool right now, but on wednesday there's this arctic blast that's gonna hit here so we can't ship through there. And you know what I mean, like because I want it to arrive to people. I don't want them to get a popsicle yeah, you know just shattered glass, yeah, yeah.

Jess: 30:39

So we, I mean try and try and everything be as perfect as we can. It's not. We can't control the weather, so it's not 100. You know it's not 100. But people comment on it in this industry where they're like, oh, your stuff arrives in such great condition and beautiful, keep getting all this other stuff that's frozen and broken. They're like we do our. We do our best.

Deb: 30:55

You're darnedest yeah.

Jess: 30:56

But going from, like that first winter where it was like we had this week, where it was like the all these emails happening and it was like oh, what's, and just never never thinking about that Not.

Deb: 31:09

I mean right and, like you said, like you can make all the plans, you make all the plans right. You create the most delicious non-alcoholic wine and then and then, this happens.

Jess: 31:17

Yeah, and especially like nobody knew. You know what I mean Nobody. Nobody really knew back then because like there wasn't enough stuff, or you know there was enough it wasn't enough people to talk to each other, to be like cause that's the first warning I give other non-alcoholic brands now I'm like, by the way, it's going to freeze in the winter Like you need to figure out how you you know how you're going to account for that and in the system that we have in place is you know what I mean?

Jess: 31:38

It changes every, every year and our, our you know our packaging and how to deal with it, and all, all of the OGs in this space.

Deb: 31:44

I mean really like you're so young you know you are.

Jess: 32:00

Yeah, I don't. I think one of my hardest parts is that I feel like there's so much more to do and there's still so much farther to go that I'm like I'm not. I'm not even close to done yet.

Deb: 32:07

You're just getting started.

Jess: 32:08

I feel like I'm just yeah. So I'm like when I say like, oh, yeah, we're going to turn four in, like September, august, september, I'm like it still feels like year one, you know. Or when it's like, oh, here's all these awards and here's all this stuff and New York Times and Forbes and you know NBC and USA Today, and it's just like it doesn't register to me. I guess Our mission, our actual mission, is to normalize non-drinking.

Deb: 32:37

I love that. Oh, I'm on board with that a hundred percent.

Jess: 32:47

Yes, that is our mission. So our mission is not to sell X dollars worth of wine. Our mission is not to build this company and then sell it in two, three years, because that's a lot of missions. Our mission is to normalize, not drinking, and I'm just like we're not there yet.

Deb: 32:57

But you are getting there, we're getting there. You are helping move this movement and I think we are. We're normalizing, not drinking. That the fun is not over.

Jess: 33:05

Fun's not over.

Deb: 33:10

Fun's not over at all, it's more, it's more fun. You know there's so much more fun Could never have imagined, I think, like what you said, you know, just the thought of not drinking, you know.

Jess: 33:16

Yeah, and that's the. You know that's the name too. People are like cause I felt I've heard, had so many people email or I talked to where they're like. They think if they quit drinking they're never going to have fun again, they're not going to have joy and they use that word joy they're never going to have the joy again. And my life? I have such a good family. I have like two amazing kids, my husband's a great you know great human being and like fantastic, supportive friends. So you know, Joyus is a bootstrap company. Like true, true, true bootstrap. Like I don't have any rich family members or aunts or uncles or whatever.

Jess: 33:52

Like I saved up the money for many, many, many years to to launch this, which is why that's why I said earlier I was like, oh, I own 100 of the company I can make. All these makes us faster you know what I mean more nimble with decisions. But it was also because nobody believed in it at first, you know. So I had to put all my, all my skin and all my work in the game. But you know it's like there's a benefit to that. You know where I can keep us, keep us on this road and keep us on the core values and I've got lists of stuff where it's like, when we're Patagonia size, we're gonna have a daycare at our facility, cause, like that makes sense to me, it makes sense to me. So there's, there's stuff even, just you know, operationally.

Deb: 34:35

Yeah, growth and literal literal lists.

Jess: 34:38

Yeah.

Deb: 34:39

Long lists. Yes, are you a post-it note person? I'm a post-it note person. I'm an. I'm a list person, and then I post notes everywhere.

Jess: 34:45

Oh, there's magic. There's magic in writing stuff down.

Deb: 34:47

There is magic in writing stuff down, Actually. Okay, I have a little post-it note right here. Yes, post-it notes Right here. It's a quote by Frank Chumley. I probably heard it on the guy podcast, Maybe. It says joy comes easier the more often one is joyous.

Jess: 35:03

Oh yeah, Isn't that good. Yes, that's fantastic. Joy comes easier.

Deb: 35:06

The more often one is joyous. Joy comes easier, the more often one is joyous. I have this. I've had this sitting here by my desk forever. How?

Jess: 35:10

funny that we're sitting here talking about post-it notes.

Deb: 35:12

I literally have because I just, it's just a reminder the more joyous, the more we find joy and delight and happiness, and we look for the good. We experience more joy. It just happens, yes.

Jess: 35:25

It says let's celebrate on our bottles because, like you, do have to find those moments in life to celebrate. Stop and celebrate yourself, your friends, whatever it is, it's not celebrating the end game, it's celebrating every single step of the way. That was one my oldest brother he really encouraged me to do. His whole thing was like it does not have to be anything crazy. Like you have, you have to celebrate anything. Anywhere you can find something to celebrate and that's I think that's what you know, the joy, the joy in life is you really do you have. You're not going to fall into joy, you have to look for the joy.

Deb: 36:01

I agree, you have to look for it. Yeah, you can either look at a situation and you can see the bad in it, or this another person can look at that exact same situation and they can see all the good, you know. So we riding a bus, it's blazing hot, the air conditioning is not working and they're miserable. And somebody else is riding the bus and they're looking out the window and they're seeing everything go by and they're maybe they just got their sight back and they're. They're looking at the good. You know, they're looking at the good they're finding.

Deb: 36:27

They're finding joy in that moment, despite you know, be blazing hot in a bus or whatever whatever.

Jess: 36:31

And it's like. It's like the stuff we were talking about earlier, where it's like like my friend, my friend, our UPS, our UPS driver yeah, he was like, oh you're, you're leveling up, you're fighting bigger bosses. And so it's like looking at the stuff where you're like at this negative thing instead of being like yay for us, we're leveling up, we're leveling up.

Deb: 36:50

I love it. It's the mindset, it's everything.

Jess: 36:56

There's another good quote. I just want to get it in there because I think it's really important in this day and age.

Deb: 36:59

They also say comparison is the thief of joy.

Jess: 37:01

It is. It is, and it is so easy to look at people's lives online or to look at stuff and you're not seeing the work behind the scenes, you're not seeing whatever struggle they're having in their personal life. You are comparing someone's outsides to your insides, totally Right, and it's like there's always going to be someone that's further along than you. There's always going to be someone that's farther behind you. The comparing thing. It truly is the thief of joy it is. It totally is Exactly. We're not comparing ourselves.

Deb: 37:29

It's just the thief of joy it is. It totally is Exactly Like we're not comparing ourselves. It's just stealing all of our joy, right, yeah, yeah, it's robbing us. It is it really is Precious moments that we have. Like you said, we have one life, so let's not rob ourselves of the joy. Let's not rob ourselves, and the internet is famous for trying to do that. So, yes, blinders on everybody. Yeah, blinders on yes, just live your life.

Deb: 37:55

Live your life have fun and be joyous, so do your thing. Okay, I love you so much. I cannot thank you enough for being my guest today. This is like so long overdue. Whenever this episode comes out, it's gonna be like episode I don't know 70 something or 80. And the fact that I haven't had you here on the podcast for a year and a half is so wrong, so I'm so happy you joined me, jess, thank you. Thank you for being here and thank you for all that you're doing with Joyous Wines. I just love you.

Jess: 38:17

It is such a I love you. It is such a gift to really spend time with you Like you are just someone that's like I'm going. You're just that kind of person.

Deb: 38:30

It's wonderful to connect, yeah.

Jess: 38:31

Yeah, so thank you, thank you, thank you for being here and amazing.

Deb: 38:35

I'm cheering you on joyus non-alcoholic wine with Code mocktail mom. If anybody's shopping online or find, find joyus on Amazon or at your local bottle shop, wherever you can find it.

Jess: 38:43

But mocktail mom, you get a discount you do.

Deb: 38:44

Yes, that's true. Code mock to mom, you get 10% off. But if not, either way, just shop on shop and go find the joyus, go grab yourself some. Everybody Big time cheers to you for tuning into the thriving alcohol-free podcast. I hope you will take something from today's episode and make one small change that will help you to thrive and have fun in life without alcohol. If you enjoyed this episode and you'd like to help support the podcast, please share it with others, post about it on social, send up a flare or leave a rating and a review. I am cheering for you as you discover the world of non-alcoholic drinks and as you journey towards authentic freedom. See you in the next episode.