The Bear | Getting Ready For Season 3

In an effort to streamline the uploading process, we tried to let AI summarize the episode for us.  AI, however, is stupid, and in attempting to encapsulate our show, it hears what it wants to hear and frames it in a saccharine, markety way that's pretty gross. Our show is about The Bear and how it relates to the world at large.  Before The Bear, we covered Ted Lasso on Apple TV+ and Wayne on YouTube.  Below is what AI came up with, which is idiotic.  Don't let the terrible summary deter you!  Jump in the pool with us!

AI summary:

As we gear up for the anticipated Season 3, our excitement is palpable. Expect lively debates, heartfelt stories, and even a humorous detour into the great pizza debate of New Haven vs. New York vs. Chicago. This episode isn’t just for fans of "The Bear"; it’s for anyone who appreciates a good character study and the intricate dance of dysfunction and love within families. So, tune in for an engaging mix of laughter, introspection, and a sprinkle of culinary critique. And don't forget, we’re also championing the cause of supporting local libraries and promoting literacy—because great stories deserve even greater readers.

~~~

The Tedcast is a deep dive podcast exploring the masterpieces that are Ted Lasso on Apple TV+, Wayne on YouTube, and The Bear on FX/Hulu.

Sponsored by Pajiba and The Antagonist, join Boss Emily Chambers and Coaches Bishop and Castleton as they ruminate on all things AFC Richmond, entertainment, and everything in between.

Boss Emily Chambers
Coach Bishop
Coach Castleton

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:22

Welcome to our Ted Lasso talk, the Tedcast. Welcome all Greyhound fans, welcome all you sinners from the dog track and all the AFC Richmond fans around the world. It's the Lasso way around these parts with Coach, coach and Boss, without further ado, coach Castleton.

Speaker 2: 0:40

Okay, welcome back, beautiful people. Today we are discussing the Bear. It's a little show they have over on FX slash Hulu, you may have heard of it, won a couple awards here and there. Here and there, what we usually do is we break down episodes, but we had an advantageous moment here to take advantage of it's redundant.

Speaker 3: 1:04

Of me. Use advantage twice. Take advantage of it's redundant. Use advantage twice. Take advantage of me is what you mean to say.

Speaker 2: 1:08

We had an amazing opportunity to stick it to coach in a way that used all of his own core values against him and of course you know I was going to jump at that. So here's the situation Today we are discussing the Bear writ large and the reason we're doing that is because season three is about to drop. In fact, by the time you hear this, season three will have dropped and we will be prepping to go over season three. Now, if you're just joining us, welcome. Thank you for joining us.

Speaker 2: 1:44

We love to talk about shows that matter and that have implications for society and reflect values and changing dynamics of socio-political sort of events in modern society. We like to break down episodes. We like to talk about what makes them work and maybe what doesn't in certain cases, but generally we try to pick great shows. Today, Uh, we're with the bear. We started with Ted Lasso. That was the impetus for this podcast was say, why is a bear podcast not called the bear cast? Why is it called the Ted cat? Well, because we started with Ted Lasso, and usually we we wear the required uniform, except today, I don't know, must be laundry day for coach and boss. They are out of their fatigues. They're beating you. I am your host, Coach Castleton With me. Thankfully, as always, is Coach Bishop.

Speaker 3: 2:41

Fresh off drinking from a hose. Yes, that would be me. Um, that was a lot. That was a lot. Lot of emotions, a lot of laughs, a lot of a lot okay, so uh, also with us is our boss, emily chambers.

Speaker 2: 2:58

And boss, before you, uh, jump in. I, I, I I'm gonna let you finish, but I wanted to explain what's happening is that boss and I had had previously watched the bear. We watched it, you know, when it dropped immediately and and uh, coach, it wasn't on his radar. He thought it was white nonsense, I think was his direct quote why I didn't watch it.

Speaker 2: 3:18

No, that was not oh okay, no, I made that up. That's just racism. That's just that's just garden variety, everyday racism. Folks, um, no, no, uh, uh, coach, uh, he just hadn't gotten around to it. It's on his list. He heard good things, and so what we've been doing is we've been have been covering the show and having him sort of um sign on to uh, as it's sort of happening, as the reactions are happening, and um, then we said, hey, actually, coach, uh, season three is dropping and we're gonna have to cover that. So how's about you watch everything? Uh, in about 11 minutes, just watch every episode of the bear. Uh, just take all that natural anxiety you were born with and just compress it into something that will later become sickness. And, and so he has finished his watch through. As of last night.

Speaker 2: 4:11

I was so impressed, he wasn't sure he was going to be able to do it. Very proud of him, but he is nothing if not a team player. And and he was he said I don't know, I don't know, and I was like I've been on teams with you before, bro, you're going to do that. I don't know, and I was like I've been on teams with you before, bro, you're going to do that. I knew it. I knew he was going to figure out a way, and so he has. So what we're going to do here is explore Coach's experience of what he calls drinking from the hose and what it feels like to just binge straight through every episode of the Bear. But first, boss Emily Chambers, hello.

Speaker 4: 4:50

Hi, how's it going? So I will say I like this idea that we are going to be talking about the larger topics explored in the Bear grief and, you know, trying to achieve greatness and what that takes and how you heal and taking responsibility and accountability for your actions and offering forgiveness to others. And in that vein, because it's very timely, I will say fuck Justin Timberlake.

Speaker 2: 5:21

Ah, you know, I'm maybe you can fill me in. We have have um.

Speaker 3: 5:27

It's gonna ruin the tour, but okay you know what?

Speaker 4: 5:30

wait, wait, which tour, which tour yeah, the world tour, world tour uh, in case anybody is listening to this many months out for some reason. Uh, recently in the news, justin timberlake was pulled over for drunk driving in the Hamptons in Sag Harbor. It's been a bit of a news thing. Twitter has fucking run wild with it.

Speaker 4: 5:50

I'm not even on Twitter and I know all that shit Same here, I was not a fan of Mr Timberlake's before, so this just sort of reinforces my idea that coming off of this and saying, oh, I had one, martini, I didn't do anything wrong, having hit piece in the fucking new york post about how the cop who pulled him over is like a local menace and all of the residents hate him, it's fucking garbage, it's all it's. It's a lot of avoiding responsibility. Oh, believe me, I have been feasting on this shit for days.

Speaker 3: 6:25

My coach. He's like how are we here? How?

Speaker 4: 6:27

are we here?

Speaker 3: 6:28

I know, but I love it, though I'm this is this is our problem slash secret sauce.

Speaker 4: 6:34

It is, it's it's the truth, but I think I genuinely I mean this when I say this. I say this I think that what the bear does a great job of is acknowledging people's faults and giving them space to grow, and also acknowledging that those faults shouldn't be overlooked just because we like a person or we see growth or anything else. That there is a way of dealing with those issues. And uh, timberlake would be like I don't know. What's the opposite of a bear? What? What is the opposite of taking responsibility for your actions and growing over time? Yeah, I don't know.

Speaker 3: 7:09

He is a Somewhere.

Speaker 4: 7:10

Yeah, I don't even want to say crocodile, because I know that they've been around for millions of years. But Right.

Speaker 3: 7:16

Crocodiles Is there an animal that shits in your nest and then makes it your problem.

Speaker 4: 7:21

Yes, yeah, who does that?

Speaker 3: 7:23

Is there an animal that does that? That?

Speaker 2: 7:25

does what? That shits in your nest yeah. That would make it my problem, wouldn't it? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4: 7:34

So I would much rather talk about the bear and the exploration of growth, but I did need to get in here and make sure, for timely reasons, to be like JCc chazay deserves that career that was our mistake I hate that.

Speaker 3: 7:51

I know who jc chazay is because that's just a matter of my sister-in-law having been just the perfect age when I got married, that I soaked that in and that's like that's real estate I could use. That is space in my brain. Like those Uber Eats commercials. That's space in my brain I need, but I want to toss this in. That was my idea happening.

Speaker 4: 8:17

Yes, I was like oh, we've got sound effects now.

Speaker 2: 8:21

Who got the?

Speaker 4: 8:22

soundboard. I love it.

Speaker 2: 8:23

No, no, that's what that sounds like when I have a thought I am I am on a mac for the first time, everybody, and that was me and I'm like wait, I just immediately run your general sound through your headphones as well, because probably right now you're only running your um yeah, yeah riverside sound through your headphones.

Speaker 3: 8:41

Ask me how I know? How do you know, coach? Because, uh, I've dinged up on this bad boy in the past. You may not remember that. Okay, got it. You might also want to put your focus on, because it sounds like you're getting dinged to shit and I'm very popular called adhd.

Speaker 2: 8:59

I'm very eyeballs are gonna how do you do that on the mac?

Speaker 3: 9:03

you're gonna sprain a retina up on your right. Yeah, it's like a thing that looks like um sliders.

Speaker 2: 9:09

Yeah, yeah, probably next to oh my god, are you still hearing these dings?

Speaker 3: 9:13

shut up guys these are my best friends in my, in my soul, I want to text you as I'm explaining if you had done that I would have been so, so impressed.

Speaker 2: 9:29

That is, that is, that's Machiavellian. I, I'm not, I'm not.

Speaker 3: 9:32

That that's more of a me move than a you move I, I really, I guess I do not like that I'm rubbing off on you.

Speaker 2: 9:39

In that way, I'm empowering you. Yesterday, yesterday, was my birthday and Coach, of course I've got the loveliest birthday wishes. That's interesting, it's so funny how birthdays work over the years. But for some reason yesterday was particularly thoughtful messages and Coach Especially mine. Yeah. And then Coach always sends me bitmojis and I'm like what the he knows? I hate bitmojis. He sends that to me for my birthday and then I just thumbs down it, I don't even respond. I'm like everyone else is sending me the most you know, loveliest thing that coaches. And then what he does is directly texts my children Because he's their favorite uncle, and then they start texting me, my own offspring, on my birthday.

Speaker 3: 10:35

It was so funny. Oh, my God. It did not take much encouragement for them to be like oh, are we busting dad's walls? Oh, no, no, no much encouragement for them to be like oh, are we busting dad's walls?

Speaker 2: 10:45

Oh, no, no, no. They were thrilled, thrilled to jump in with Uncle Orlando. Oh my God. That was not fun. But, coach, all right, so let's start with Boss. Thank you. As the token white man on the podcast, I think it's my job to defend Justin Timberlake. That's funny, and I will not. I just don't. You said Timberlakes, you pluralized it Like Liam Neeson's.

Speaker 4: 11:18

Sure, yeah, liam Neeson's.

Speaker 2: 11:21

So that's something I wanted to not let slip by as people were listening. I wanted to, uh, not let slip by as people were listening. Uh, I, I, uh, I wanted to call that out and, um, as far as the other stuff, I, I have just blissfully, magically avoided reading, hearing or having it part of my consciousness. Uh, and so, um, yeah, I believe in the rule of law and the story. Okay, uh, I don't, I don't, it doesn't. I did see something where it was like, oh, this guy's a menace, the local, or he's a rookie, or he's young, and I don't, I don't, I don't, do not care.

Speaker 4: 11:58

Well, sorry, I need to point out, if this were a, if this didn't feel like a hit piece, I would also not care. It felt very intentionally like they were trying to smear the arresting officer as part of the case, and that is icky as shit, like you fucked up. You made a big mistake, fucking, fix it. Don't go out of. The unintentionally funniest things that the New York Post has ever done is that they were talking about the nicknames that this poor officer has gotten from the local millionaires in Sag Harbor, and one of them was something about how he's the Sag Harbor Nazi, traffic Nazi, and I'm like, yeah, that's exactly what Nazis were known for. That's why we make that.

Speaker 4: 12:43

And the other one was the Exactly it, fucking exactly. That's the insult. And the other one was the that's what it stops saying. Exactly that's what we hated about them, that they were such rule followers and sticklers. But the other one was that they nicknamed him that red headed dipshit and then they showed a picture of this very ginger man and I'm like, wow, the originality, guys. Little red headed dipshit, that's what you came up with, nice, that's. That is fucking great Love it, you got to. You got to. Yeah, you really got it.

Speaker 2: 13:19

It's really a boy picture of ourselves in a national uh newspaper. Uh, with something like that as as the uh, as the uh uh description boy that would be.

Speaker 4: 13:32

That's gotta be rewarding sometimes there are insults that are so on point, like uh I in fast and the furious when uh the rock says something about, about, you need to cover up that big-ass forehead. It's the gif where Ludacris is doing the spit-take because it's so funny. There are some times where it's so on point that you're like that's hilarious, and this is a case where it does not work.

Speaker 2: 13:56

Calling him the little red-headed dipshit.

Speaker 4: 13:59

It's like he does have red hair. How did you figure that out? The perception Super original. Fucking amazing.

Speaker 2: 14:06

Love it and now the bear who owns the post, by the way, isn't that like one of those? It?

Speaker 4: 14:12

might be a Murdoch one.

Speaker 3: 14:14

Yeah, it feels like it's Murdoch I feel like yeah, I was going to say it feels like it's some not very far but indirect kind of thing, big recollection.

Speaker 4: 14:23

Which I should clarify. I do not read for news sources. This was on reddit. Somebody was like look at how fucking hilariously bad this shit is. And I was like I will look, I will definitely look at that it listen, that's.

Speaker 2: 14:36

One of the benefits of uh generational wealth is that you have a pr team who goes to work and they, uh, I have, I have, uh, I've. I've been on that side of it a couple of times in a business capacity where someone I was working with blew up and and then there was this, these meetings about how to spin it and how to turn it and how to you know, and I was like, wow, it's. And I was like, wow, it's, it's legitimately gross, but it's a job and uh, you know, some people are very good at it.

Speaker 4: 15:12

The weirdest part is that, uh, justin Timberlake has the money to do that, to spin this, and somehow couldn't afford a fucking Uber. It's wild.

Speaker 1: 15:23

It's wild. That's the thing. It's wild. Can't figure that out.

Speaker 3: 15:27

And I will connect this because I know we've been trying to get over to the bear, for I don't know the entire time we've been on.

Speaker 3: 15:38

But I think the grossest part and the reason why I was so aware of it to join in with boss on ruin the tour is, excuse me, there was such privilege, like it was just the whole incident was just drenched in fucking privilege and that your comment to this guy, as if he should like now you know, get it and get you home and keep this quiet is like you're going to ruin the tour. Like no, you're going to ruin the tour, you know you're going on tour.

Speaker 1: 16:12

What the fuck are you drunk driving for Whoa whoa. What do you mean?

Speaker 3: 16:15

You're going to ruin the tour. Wait a second. Whatever, this is good, like it's not like. Who told you to drive your drunk ass down this road?

Speaker 2: 16:24

Coach, Like, who told you to drive your drunk ass down this road? Coach? What are you doing? Coach? What good is privilege if you don't use it? I mean, it'll expire, coach, If you don't use it. That's the whole point of privilege. It's being privileged.

Speaker 3: 16:37

It was so clear to him that that was what was supposed to happen, and I feel like the post going after this police officer police officer which I am a renowned

Speaker 1: 16:49

defender. Yeah, yeah, no, you like the police oh, oh yeah.

Speaker 3: 16:52

There's nothing else you you should take away from life around me is that I loves the police. But but seriously, I'm just like what, like it's just. It's amazing to me because it's not even like he wasn't, it wasn't even. Do you know who I am. It was like come on, man like this is not the system. Yep, it hasn't, it has not been. It has not been the system it's so his expectation that he was kind of like what, what are you doing? And I just find that astounding.

Speaker 2: 17:28

I remember I find it amazing. I remember reading I think it was a Frank Sinatra biography and I could be wrong. Someone who knows better one of the buttercups can correct me on the community site. But I remember reading something along the lines of the fact that the police in angeles had a special unit to deal with celebrities when they fucked up. So it was like it was like sinatra and I don't know. It wasn't pink cross, it's not trying somebody driving around la shooting out street lights for fun with guns right.

Speaker 4: 18:02

What fucking Christ, what the fuck man.

Speaker 2: 18:04

Yeah, like you do. And I mean, coach, how many times have you done that? And then the police come up and they say like oh hey, mr Bishop, we want to knock that off, please. And you're like ah, and they're like let me escort you home. Do you need us to replace your bullets?

Speaker 3: 18:22

It was that type of thing.

Speaker 2: 18:24

Exactly, and so, yeah, so to get from there to here, lest we lose track of the entire arc of the universe, does feel like progress. There's some accountability. Well, yeah, my biggest takeaway and we'll get to the bear was people were clutching their pearls that he had traces of cocaine in his system. Oh my God, can you imagine someone like Justin Timberlake with cocaine?

Speaker 3: 18:53

in his system. I hadn't heard about the coke. Well, that explains the jumping behind the wheel. He probably thought he could triple jump home, seriously.

Speaker 2: 19:02

You're a superhero. Okay, coach, you watched everything.

Speaker 3: 19:08

Oh, oh well, yes, but yeah, but to connect, ah, I, I know, really. I love one thing I love about the bear and one of the reasons I needed more processing time, like I will definitely have to re-watch all of that, like that really was you. Those of you who've been listening since the beginning of Ted Lasso know how I watch things, so the idea of me watching all those episodes pretty much most of the show in a day, is a lot. But one of the things that I did love about it is the show One.

Speaker 3: 19:45

The way foibles, faults are presented feels very real to me and we tend to fall into good characters, bad characters, right, and this show is like yeah, no, no, not really, like you know, everybody's fucked up to some degree, everybody's got love in their heart to some degree, everybody's nursing their pain to some degree, and but the show doesn't, in my opinion, let them get away with being flawed in the way they're flawed. It's not like well, I guess I can talk about anything on this one, because we're warning people yeah, we're gonna talk about the first two seasons.

Speaker 3: 20:28

Yeah, yeah, so fast forwarding um to the season two finale. There's a version of this show where car me is in the free. If you have not what, I'm gonna pause again. If you have not watched all this shit, you might want to stop now because I'm gonna just time travel all over official spoiler warning.

Speaker 3: 20:53

Thank you, coach. But but he's in the walk-in and he does his mea culpa speech which the whole time he was saying it I was like I don't really think this is like the takeaway. But like I was with the show so I was like, okay, let me see how this plays. But in real time I was like I don't think pay attention means you can't have healthy human, human relationships. But okay, like let's see where this goes. And then to have this absolutely wonderful woman who's done nothing except say I like you a whole hell of a lot and I have liked you a whole hell of a lot for a whole lot of fucking years, have her sit there and listen to him say that there is no happiness life with her could produce. That would be worth screwing up anything about the restaurant. Now, do I think that if you get him out of that freezer and give him a chance to take a deep breath and maybe have a drink and hear about how things went that night, that he maybe wouldn't have said that quite that way or might have reconsidered his position. Sure, had that been sydney on the other side of that giant metal door, might she have said well, you've got on, which I thought was what was gonna gonna happen. I thought there was gonna be somebody, some wise, mentor-ish kind of moment there, but he had to fit. He, I mean, if I'm him, I'm like, don't cut me out, this motherfucker, just leave me here. Just leave me here in this motherfucker freezer, because out there is where she is and she might kill my ass on sight. I'm safer in this fucking freezer because he really fucked up, but it's, it's they would.

Speaker 3: 22:47

They did not let him off the hook and I that may be the choice in the entire series so far I respect most. It was interesting to end on it. I was like I motherfucking respect that. They were like no, no, no, no, no, no, you, you, you have to be held to fucking account for how you are living. And they would not let him off the hook. I just really, I, I really appreciated that. I thought not every show has the stomach to do that. That was like you know, yeah, as, as we've decided with, there's not some, there's not. It doesn't take balls, it takes vagina, but it takes a lot of vagina takes it.

Speaker 4: 23:31

Takes a lot of do that, takes a lot of whatever insides you think show uh fortitude. Yes, absolutely. I think also to go along with that point, that some criticism of the bear that I've seen is that sometimes things work out too well. So to also jump around a lot in the episode four. It's in season two, the Richie episode, one of the best somehow they do all the shit that ordinarily I should fucking hate, and they put it off to such a high degree that I fucking love it, I love everything about it Every once in a while.

Speaker 4: 24:10

there are these moments where it's like does that seem reasonable? Is it reasonable that that is the moment when Claire would decide to go back into the kitchen to find Carmi and she just happens to stumble upon him giving the speech?

Speaker 4: 24:23

No, it's not realistic, but also it's a tv show like it is it is a contrived right, right, right, and it is done well enough that I am fine with it. I feel fine with it. I think that part of what you're talking about, with him being stuck in the walk-in into giving that speech, and how it parallels the last episode of season one uh, the second to last episode, season one. Carmy loses the shit, screams at everybody, knocks the donut out of marcus's hand because the order system is wrong, takes everything out on everybody else in the next episode, manages to apologize to marcus and reach out to sydney and apologize to her and try to make things right, and then at the end of that episode we get this. I don't have my phone next to me but, as Bishop called it, the Dave's ex-Mikey-na.

Speaker 4: 25:13

Dave's ex-Mikey-na? God damn it. I saw it and I loved it and it was so good.

Speaker 2: 25:20

That's pretty good. It's really good.

Speaker 4: 25:23

Yeah, that Carmen gets rescued, because Mikey and his drug-addled state had been hiding wads of cash in the cans of tomatoes, because why wouldn't that be the thing that happens? So my point overall with this is that Carmy showed enough growth in season one where he was trying to own his mistakes. He was trying to tell sid that his behavior wasn't acceptable, that the way he treated her wasn't okay. He's trying to move into this leadership role. That things kind of worked out, and in season two he is building on all that. He's becoming a better leader and a better person and everything else. But he is still mistreating himself so poorly that it spills out and gets on to claire that, uh, what did you say about? Um, you need to make sure that you don't.

Speaker 4: 26:13

Yeah, if you don't yeah, if you don't, if you don't heal where you were cut, you'll bleed on people who didn't cut you right so I I don't think that it's supposed to be a direct one-to-one comparison, but I think that there is something about his growth allowed good things to happen and his refusal to grow past this idea that he is undeserving of love or joy or happiness is what is holding him back in season two. Because nobody's being mean to you except you, Carmi. Nobody's fucking this up except for you. Everybody else is on your side and trying to help you out and you are fucking it up well, yes, I love what you just brought up there, that that we have.

Speaker 3: 26:53

Okay, there are a lot of things I don't like anymore about, uh, tony robbins but I'm watching coach's face because I know he's like and we just hit three hours, um, but no, but. But one thing that I did get from him and I've been doing, looking back, I've been doing like self-help, personal improvement shit for decades now. Right, so I see, I, I see, and one of the things that he was really that I thought was brilliant that he did was he said that we people think, um, in term, in terms of their mood and into their station in life and achievements. They think in terms of their mood and into their station in life and achievement. They think in terms of a thermometer right, like that you want or whatever. But he said but people are actually thermostats. So if you believe you're at, you know you should live at 70 and you heat shit up to 80, you will find a way to cool the motherfucker off back to 70, where you belong.

Speaker 3: 27:44

That's my, my, obviously, my language and I always thought that was a really fascinating idea and I feel like I've seen it in the world where I'm like shit was going too good. Huh, you, you had to do, you had. Those is too much, and this show is filled with people having to contend with their thermostats. Yes, that's probably my favorite thing about the show is that everyone and they use the Coach K book, which obviously. I've watched Coach K's masterclass. I've watched a bunch of documentaries about him and how he built the Duke basketball program, which I would come to as a surprise to no one who's been around here. But his whole thing about courage and confidence like that is the show, like that.

Speaker 3: 28:31

To me, every step of this show is like will you step out? It's safer here. You've been hurt before, you've been whatever. You've failed. If you're Sid, like you know. But will you do it again? Yes and um, I just yeah. I found with karm the answer was yes in every way. But taking care of himself. Sugar told him off rip, you can't take, because what he said in the freezer was you know what? I was off being human and and experiencing human emotions and creating a healthy human relationship, and that fucked up the restaurant. So you know what? I'll just won't be human, yep, and I'll just be chef, yep, yeah, and I think it, think it was good that the show was like. No, that's not the fucking answer either, bro.

Speaker 4: 29:28

Yes, and just to make sure I agree with everything you said, just to make very clear, I think that what you were talking about is much more similar to what Molly Ringwald's character at the beginning of season one, episode three, is talking about, when she says I know that I played a role in his abuse, in my abuse, like I not this is not car me no, no, no, this is not like you don't feel like you deserve to be treated well and that's why you're being mistreated.

Speaker 4: 29:58

No, no, no. This is saying, like your frame of mind and how you behave and how you expect other people to treat you contributes to how your life is. So if carmy is saying, I am not worthy of joy, like, what I need to do is get this star and be a kick-ass chef and that's it. That's the only role he's going to see for himself and he's not going to be able to expand that so that he can be a good partner to claire and be a good boyfriend and experience that joy Like this is a limitation he is putting on him.

Speaker 4: 30:28

This is not anything deserved this is. He is putting a straight jacket on himself and then can't figure out why he can't get out of the room.

Speaker 3: 30:34

Like you're doing it, you did it, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, he, he's got the key to his own cell, all that stuff, yeah, the straight jacket thing, but, but, but so all right, so that that that was the big picture of it all, but I I loved that every character faced that essential choice that I did take out of it and maybe that could hit me because of how I watched it, but whether it was Ebro, whether it was Tina, like I texted in real time yeah.

Speaker 3: 31:07

When Sid asked Tina to be sued, I was like, oh my God, like great writing. Because when Tina turned up the fire in season one, I was like I don't know if this is going on.

Speaker 2: 31:23

Yeah, I was like I think Tina's got to get cut from a team going on. I was like so many people like from the team.

Speaker 3: 31:26

Yeah, I was like immediately like she does not finish this shift. So I was like, oh no, tina, no. And to see, because that didn't happen, what eventually happened. I mean, in season two, there are a number of moments where I was like Tina is the voice of fucking reason right now, in this craziness, I was like how the fuck did that happen? Like when Sid and Carmi are arguing and like, frankly, losing their shit in front of the team, she's the one who's like, like, look at this shit. So I yeah, I thought that was um ebro. I thought but and I am sure because this is daphne's favorite character, I will shout it out daphne did come over to watch the flashback episode. She didn't tell me why she went to see a certain episode, oh, but she was like, oh, whatever. So when I told, her.

Speaker 3: 32:32

I kept telling her where I was, and then she came over during four and then we watched five together and then I guess six is the flashback episode.

Speaker 2: 32:42

So she had watched the whole series, coach, without you.

Speaker 3: 32:44

Oh no no, she's seen it. She went to re-watch.

Speaker 2: 32:47

Yeah, how come you didn't watch it with her the first time around, out of curiosity?

Speaker 3: 32:50

Oh, I'm a bad husband.

Speaker 2: 32:52

I thought we had established that. I knew that. I thought that was a given.

Speaker 3: 32:57

Yeah, I was probably out here watching philosophy videos or some other nonsense, but anyway, I wouldn't know it. But but yeah, so, so, yeah, so, richie of everybody. I found myself most happy for him because it struck me this morning, because I was thinking about it this morning. I'm walking a dog, I'm like processing, wow, oh yeah, I can't forget that happening. And I was like it's kind of wild that a show set in Chicago is about the audacity of hope.

Speaker 3: 33:39

Oh Okay, I don't think there's any place where that audacity is most on display than Richie going from fuck this system and let's do it our way and delicate ecosystem I mean. What he was really saying was I am delicate and I don't know that I can survive in a different ecosystem. I know I can survive in this ecosystem I have. It hasn't been fun, but I have survived I have status.

Speaker 2: 34:15

I don't know if I have status in this right, I can go out on the street I can talk to them.

Speaker 3: 34:19

But then sid did that and then somebody called police on those guys. I I'm not saying it was definitely richie, but I'm not saying it wasn't that, but I mean, you know, I mean so he, he had to, like, really step out. And I think when he showed up in that suit for me the beauty of it was even within the context of the show that was such a declaration, because he could have come in with a new attitude in his old t-shirt. But he said no, no, no, no, no. I want you to be able to see from a motherfucking distance that this is a new Richie. And I was like whoa, like that took a lot of heart and a step out there. And then for him to be the one who made the kitchen rock after he was from the first episode, I was like, motherfucker, will you move? And then instead it's played, played through me, and this guy's the one who makes it all work. I was like, are you fucking kidding?

Speaker 3: 35:22

yeah, I didn't see that and I'll just add so you guys did this to yourselves, because you shoved all this shit in my brain in 24 hours no, no, this is great but I also in the total, you know, total restauranting, total chefdom.

Speaker 3: 35:43

We needed him in that moment, Like he's the guy who, however it is he going to take some napkins and some epoxy. And that moment didn't call for saying everything the exact, perfect way it's supposed to be said. That moment called for keeping your head way it's supposed to be said. That moment called for keeping your head and whatever comes out of this machine, figure out how to make it happen and we'll deal with the rest tomorrow. And that's a specific kind of personality, His ability, in the midst of that. He's not Sid. Sid would have started getting more testy. Carmi would have started getting more testy. I thought it was fascinating that they had Richie saying good job, this, that, yeah, we did this, blah, blah, blah. He was part cheerleader. I was like and that's what they needed all along. Even Carm recognized it earlier when he was like I don't want to change. I forget what change Sidney wanted to make, but he was like you notice how it's chill.

Speaker 2: 36:48

I want to hold on to this for as long as possible.

Speaker 3: 36:50

I want to hold on for as long as possible. Exactly.

Speaker 2: 36:51

We're a little bit chill for the first time, yeah.

Speaker 3: 36:54

And I got it. But in a way he was like there's still problems, but I want it to be calm on the surface, which has a value. I'm not arguing that it doesn't, but Richie's version incorporates the chaos and gives you calm. Yes, it's not ignore the chaos and gives you calm. It's not ignore the chaos, it's I got this shit. Everybody. Calm the fuck down, you go fire up this, you do that, blah, blah, blah, whatever. And I thought it was brilliant. He was the only member of the team who could do that. That's the thing. Coach Tina couldn't do what he did. Carmi couldn't do what he did. The team who could?

Speaker 2: 37:31

do that. That's the thing. Coach Tina couldn't do what he did.

Speaker 3: 37:32

That's the thing, Carmi couldn't do what he did.

Speaker 2: 37:34

Nobody else could do it he had an anxiety reaction to leaving the ecosystem that he knew he had status in without realizing he was uniquely suited was uniquely suited His personal skill sets were uniquely suited to not just exist in the other ecosystem but to thrive and do things that other people can't do.

Speaker 2: 37:59

There's this there's a beat that I love. We'll talk about it when we get to this episode. But there's this moment where, okay, so in the first episode I think it's the, I think it's the first episode Karmie's yelling. He's trying to get everybody guys, guys, I need hands. It might have been hands, it might have been a second episode, but it was Richie holding court and talking One sec, cousin, one sec, and he wanted to finish his story and the entire group is around Richie, right. And then later on and, coach, you make a great point about Tina.

Speaker 2: 38:27

Later on, there's this moment where everyone's working and Richie defaults to Tina. Everyone else is busy. That crew that he used to have is gone. His last hope is Tina and she's like you need to come outside right now. And then she's the one that's like I have something good, my skills have gone up 300% in two months. Yeah, yeah, yeah, up 300 in two months.

Speaker 2: 38:51

Like, and you know when they say, sometimes they say um, uh, this is not the right way to say it, but they say, oh, you can't teach an old dog new tricks, meaning if you've been in a system system long enough, it's hard to see outside of that system but, to tina's credit, she's been in the system longer than anybody, I think. Right, boss, like she's been in it for she was saying to sydney I've been doing, I've been in the kitchen since before you were born. To Sidney yeah, so so for her to recognize that, I thought, showed so much I was really impressed with her as a person and they intentionally set it up like, oh, she turns up the fire, she's obnoxious, you know, she, she's willfully, uh, obstructionist in the kitchen when Siddney is, uh, trying to try to absorb her new role. Um, and she goes from that to like actually, like holy shit, and the and we'll talk about how that happened. I think it was the moment where she was behind and she burned the mashed potatoes and and then sid was like she turns around, and sid had everything prepared and she's like I don't have time to fuck around. That's an interesting beat, but it was a hard note, a particularly hard note between the two of them, but somehow worked for Tina. And then when she brought the mashed potatoes to Sid to taste, she's like get it over with, I know it's whatever.

Speaker 2: 40:05

And all of a sudden, the validation of saying like no, you can make something good. Like you can make something good, like you can do it this other way. Same as Richie. I'm not sure I can exist outside of the ecosystem I'm comfortable in. And then she finds out she can, which is the thing that enables her to pull him outside and be like no, like no. And that's the moment where he goes. Where are you going to fuck it? I'm going to quit. Where are you going to go, richie, like, like that is so. Where he goes? Where are you gonna fuck it? I'm gonna quit. Where are you gonna go, richie? Like, like that is so.

Speaker 3: 40:35

I'm like oh, my god, right um, that was uh that, that, that, that. That was uh an officer and a richie because it was.

Speaker 3: 40:43

I got no way to go like you know like it was like, but it was clear you're're divorced, getting divorced. Where else are you going to go to work? Nice, resume, what are you talking about? And he knew it. He knew. She didn't have to say it twice and she didn't have to explain what she meant by that. It wasn't an informational question, it was. You got nowhere to go.

Speaker 3: 41:13

Homie, get yourself together. You're going to have to do this Quick, not quickly, so I'm not going to lie. I'll share. Knock it off, all right. So I have a tattoo that I will describe in a second on the inside of my bicep, and I think I've mentioned this audio before, but I had an opportunity to direct a movie based on a script I written. I directed in 2018. It's called Dinner for Two. The lead actor, the woman, needs to sing a song, and it's a classic R&B song and blah, blah, blah, and that really wasn't her type of singing. She sings Americana, so she was very nervous and, frankly, I was a little nervous that we had to pull off this song. I was a little nervous that we had to pull off this song. Like you, don't sing Shirley Murdoch's as we Lay half-assed, unless you want all of Black Twitter to end you.

Speaker 2: 42:20

Just end you Speaking from experience yeah, I've made that mistake. Do not get on the wrong side of Black Twitter folks.

Speaker 3: 42:29

But so we're getting ready and we're in the studio and that's a whole amazing experience, I'll tell. I can tell folks about some other time and she's about to go in. Her name is Chaley Rose and I said, chaley, you know she comes over. I'm like, listen, when I was and I'll tell you the story real quick is that when I was 14, I was when I was a teenager, rather, I was working for Prep.

Speaker 3: 42:50

For Prep, we had to do this in the training. We had to do this ropes course that we went across about 10 feet over a pool. You had to go through these obstacles, right, and after you got to the end, you call across this net and you jump. You have to grab this rope and ring the bell. And of like the 25 of us or so who started, started the course, like five of us finished and rang the bell. Wow, who made it through all obstacles and rang the bell? So I was one of the five, like one of those people. So we get back down, they take us back to where we were camp and and then they um had the same course, but laid out on the ground and, of course, on the ground it looked easy as shit.

Speaker 3: 43:34

But what I noticed was the net and the bell were far enough apart that there was no way to hold the net and ring the bell. If you were going to ring the bell at some point you had to jump. And that moment, when you're between the net and the bell, that's scary as shit. I said you got nothing now. You ain't got net and you ain't got bell. I said, but that's where all the magic happens. Chaley Rose, I want you to go in that booth and I want you to sing this song from between the net and the bell. And she did. I was very proud, I think she we had some conversations let me know that she'd gotten more out of herself working with me on that film than she thought she had to give, which was really cool. Oh, shit.

Speaker 3: 44:37

And my coach ego. But then she texted me and she was like between the net and the bell. I really liked that. And she said she might get a tattoo. I said, well, I've been thinking about getting another. At that point, I get a tattoo. I said, well, I've been thinking about getting another. At that point I had one tattoo. I said I'm thinking about getting another tattoo myself. So you know, when we see each other on Monday, we see how serious you are. So she writes back I'm serious. Exclamation point Cut to Monday, which was our last day of shooting.

Speaker 3: 45:06

We wrapped and we went together to a local Atlanta tattoo parlor. We rapped and we went together to a local Atlanta tattoo parlor and she has Between the Net and the Bell on the front of her bicep here on her arm and I have it on the inside of my biceps. We'll always have that Between the Net and the Bell.

Speaker 3: 45:23

And I tell the whole story because I feel like this show comes to us from between the net and the bell and all the characters' greatest moments come from between the net and the bell, from when they're able to jump anyway, even though it's scary, even that's the worst part, even though if you jump and miss, you will have nothing Like. That's the price. It's not a video game where you just reset back on the net and see if you can make the jump this time. But it doesn't matter, you still have. If you want to live that life, if you want to be where richie ended up ever in your life, you have to jump, and that's just how it works so, number one, I love that story, love everything about it.

Speaker 4: 46:11

I love also that you phrased it as so many characters on the show living between the net and the bell. Uh, very specifically, because there is a character that did not make it like the big, big part of the show is somebody sort of trying for the bell, and mikey isn't around anymore. Mikey didn't make it like there is so much. I will get into this when we are back on the recaps and the deep dives, because there's a very specific scene that I want to talk about this more. But the bear like, for all of its amazing qualities, this is one of the few shows. This is one of the few shows. This is one of the few anythings I've ever seen that has dealt with what it feels like to have a loved one who has mental health issues and addiction issues and who dies by suicide and you love them afterwards anyway.

Speaker 4: 47:13

There are a few shows now that are like unshameless monica and frank gallagher are fucking terrible parents and their kids hate them and brock meyer brock meyer hates his parents. And there are a few other shows where it's like here are terrible parents, here are terrible loved ones and you get to fucking hate them and there aren't shows that deal with the aftermath of somebody leaving you in this way or feeling like somebody left you in this way. So the fact that all of this is coming out of their shared grief over having a person that they cared about so much, who Like believe me, I understand people who have contemplated suicide or people who have died by suicide. I'm not trying to be Like so much sympathy, but for the loved ones, it is Well, you left us and so it's dealing with Like Everything that Tina does, everything that Richie does. A lot of the shit that Carmi does is based in that idea of we need to get better because the not doing so leads to, like literal life and death circumstances.

Speaker 3: 48:27

Wow Boss how do you know anything about suicide? Oh, I don't know.

Speaker 4: 48:45

Nothing personal. What was it? Wow, catching up right now I am so sorry about everything I'm about to say. Um, so I I have two dead fathers, a dad and a stepdad. My uh father died by suicide when I was 12, and then my stepdad died from a heroin overdose when I was 17.

Speaker 3: 49:06

So so, like I said nothing, personal and I'm going to toss this in for those catching up Boss has been, and it's true for the show, as you may have gathered otherwise from us, boss has been so generous, seriously so generous with her experience, because if you don't know, if you don't know, you don't know, and it it has come up in ways that have been instructive about the show conversations, but actually it's, it's impacted how I've looked at some things in terms of family and, um, forgiveness, and yeah, just yeah, it's, it's been of great value. So, anyway, anyway, I just wanted to call that out because, yeah, it's very generous.

Speaker 2: 49:53

One thing I always say to my boss. She's very generous.

Speaker 4: 49:58

I mean not with my time or money or feelings but other than that, yes, 100%.

Speaker 2: 50:02

I was thinking that, first of all, I realized I made a terrible joke and for people who are trying to Google what I did to piss off Black twitter, that was just a joke.

Speaker 2: 50:13

I've, never, I've never, I'm a smart enough man. I've never pissed off black twitter, but um, uh, I, uh, I was thinking that, coach, listening to your story, I, I, uh I don't know if you have a bigger cheerleader than me, maybe boss these days because you're her thrall but um, I, uh, I uh always say to anyone listening to this podcast I think coach is like the most amazing coach on the planet. Um, that goes for his directing and the film space. Uh, he's just amazing. But I, uh, listening to you, I thought you amazing. But I, at listening to you, I thought you know god, what a manipulative motherfucker. Because you have the right voice. You're like, hey, let me, let me tell you a little story. I'm like god damn it, I know. Whatever's at the end of the story means I'm gonna do it now skip the story all right, everybody, bring it in.

Speaker 2: 51:09

I'm gonna'm going to tell you a little story about something happened to me when I was growing up in Flatbush. Like shit, god damn it. Okay, yes, I will saw off my finger. I didn't think I would ever do that, but I know that the end of the story means it's a beautiful story, coach, I really loved it.

Speaker 2: 51:27

And yes, you guys make amazing points. And, boss, your lived experiences are profound and painful. No, it is. It's hard to hear, honestly, as someone who pretends to care about you, boss, it is very difficult to. No, no, it really is, like all the stuff over the years when you've been very open about it and honest, and this is where growth comes from, this is where understanding comes from. It's really you can bury it and not share it, but throughout all of our recordings, you've been, you know, just really vulnerable and raw about it. You know just really, uh, vulnerable and raw about it. And and, and you, you haven't patted yourself on the back the way coach does every single time he does something everybody's getting real sick of it, yeah everyone's real sick of coach uh, coach, where'd you go?

Speaker 2: 52:24

to college, by the way oh, for christ's sake and what kind of car do you drive?

Speaker 3: 52:30

Oh, you're such a jerk. Okay, coach. Yeah, I went to Yale, yeah.

Speaker 2: 52:36

Oh, yale, is that the one in New Haven?

Speaker 3: 52:38

I do drive. It is in fact that one, and I do drive a Tesla.

Speaker 2: 52:45

When you got your Tesla, did you kiss Elon directly on the lips, or was it some sort of like just a little dance thing?

Speaker 3: 52:53

I don't know, I don't know if you'll get full reception on the Cape, but I'm going to answer you now, but, but, but, but, no, but I do want to. That piece around the um, the sharing, right, um, as you were describing it, I was thinking that what the shows we've now look, that we're looking at, I guess, with the bear, but that we've chosen to look at, I think all have required a level of vulnerability from the characters in the context of the story. That even I mean stories. Right, you got to run people up trees and all the stuff we've talked about. But even in the context of like that, especially seem to demand it, especially seem to say what got you here, won't get you there.

Speaker 3: 54:00

Now, what the fuck you gonna do? Well, son, it's not just as simple as just become a barbarian, is it? Well, coach, yeah, you can't just come in and oakley, doakley your way through every goddamn thing, can you? And, and it just and in each in their own way, they're kind of un-fucking-relenting and they're saying no, you're going to have to, you're gonna have to do the thing you're going to have to. Jamie, learn that there's 11 of us out there and your greatest greatness will be be when you recognize. Good, he ted told him that the thing is. Yes, it was him who finally saw. But early on, when he was, when ted was trying to win him over, he said you're me, but I think you're gonna you might be the best player I've ever coached yeah, I've ever coached right.

Speaker 3: 54:58

So he, it's, it's, it's all there. So, anyway, I, I, I really respect that. And I want to say this about um, who I was somewhat dismissive of. I have like in retrospect and I kind of took as like oh, I get it, mikey was super magnetic, had a bunch of talent, party boy snorted 300K. Now everybody else has to fucking deal with. Okay, get it like I'm not, I'm not mad at him, but okay, I get it, I get I get what this is. And he left this mess. He just left a fucking mess. And what I came to truly respect about him it's sad, it's a sad assessment, but what I came to truly respect about him was, it seemed to me, from where we are now, my take is that part of his calculus was I have fucked up my life, I have this thing's fucked up and it's you know, it's a fool bar right Fucked up beyond all recognition. However.

Speaker 3: 56:17

However, I can be part of making sure somebody else's life is not fucked up and so he sacrifices his life. I watched, I told you to, I don't know if I've said it on recording. I've recently, was just moved to. So I did watch the Matrix. And if folks are wondering why I haven't seen a number of series, it's because I might be sitting around on a random Saturday and go, I need to watch the Matrix again and that's two hours. No, no real reason, just I guess I needed that. But I'll say that there's something about morpheus in the matrix deciding I will get neo out, I will jump into, probably death. Get neo out. And you know, for those who you know, have read the bible, even just thinking of it as literature, thereiment or disembodiment of hopelessness, like he may have been the most hopeful of the bunch, he, as everybody else, was like well, this is our lot in life, things are gonna be this way. He was like maybe not, maybe not. I have, I have an idea.

Speaker 2: 58:04

Um, yeah, yeah, uh, yeah, I, I'm gonna, always I'm, I'm. I've had a hard time discerning my understanding of mikey's plan, and maybe it's just me, maybe I'm missing something about it, but I'm like okay, so you borrow the money and then you buy a canning machine, presumably, presumably, and then you re-can San Marzano tomatoes with saran-wrapped stacks of money. That's accruing interest. You don't pay your bills, and then you offer yourself to give that debt to your brother, who then will find the money and owe that money.

Speaker 3: 58:58

Well, I think the thinking is you'll never save up nor will I $300,000 in cash, and no one's going to lend you $300,000 in cash and no one's going to lend you $300,000 in cash.

Speaker 2: 59:16

Well, that's, one of the knocks on the show. It's like a James Beard Award winner can get that type of money. Investors will. If you are the best chef in the country, you have the investment opportunity.

Speaker 3: 59:33

Well, I don't know that world, so I didn't think of it. It would be like being an all-star in the NFL.

Speaker 3: 59:40

I get that and I'm sure that's true. There's a million things I know nothing about, and this is pretty close. Okay, I mean it makes sense to me. I'll say, though, in the context of the show, so I'll put it that way, that my sense of it is Carm went off, did his things, but if they were going to turn this place into the dream, at least from mikey's vantage point, this is how I can help. Like you know what I mean, this is how I can help it happen, it it may be, and I actually, as you say it, I guess it makes sense, right, like if you went around and said you know, know, I was food and wine.

Speaker 2: 1:00:33

I was hoping one of you guys would be like no, no, oh, because you missed this thing Obviously. Blah, blah, blah.

Speaker 3: 1:00:40

I mean I watched it at the rate we discussed, so maybe I did miss some stuff. I just took it as he was like kid.

Speaker 2: 1:00:52

I can't do much for you, but I could do this. Did you have the sense that his plan included Carmi from the start? Because for me. I thought like his plan was like I'll stash away money and then shit got dark and then he's like fuck it, at least the least thing I can do is leave it for my brother. I can do some good on the way.

Speaker 3: 1:01:11

Oh, maybe you're right then. Yeah, I don't know. I would need to. You know like I've watched every episode of Ted Lasso.

Speaker 2: 1:01:20

Why don't you let? Boss talk if you don't know. Coach, why don't you let boss say one thing? Can she get a word in edgewise, or are you just going to just fucking man spread all over this podcast?

Speaker 3: 1:01:29

Well, yeah Well, you know, as the representative of the patriarchy, I think my work here is done.

Speaker 4: 1:01:36

I've said all that needs to be said Go ahead, boss, I'd like to clarify number one it is mansplaining. And number two you need to take me off mute if you want me to say something there. Castle, this is real rough.

Speaker 2: 1:01:47

That's funny that you pivot.

Speaker 1: 1:01:54

I'm trying to stick up for you for once in the 12 year run of this podcast and you find a way to pretend that I've been shitty.

Speaker 4: 1:02:00

What a delight. This is a hostile workplace environment. I know. I think we should take it to the manager, the person who runs this podcast. I think they need to say something.

Speaker 2: 1:02:10

Who the fuck is in charge, the person who is actually who the fuck is in charge. Who's named boss of this podcast Shit? Right, yeah, exactly, let me know if you want to slap yourself on the wrist over that. Yes, I'm in charge of HR obviously.

Speaker 4: 1:02:24

No, actually. So I think that there are a few different things happening, and the most important of them is that hindsight will always tell you where you fucked up. So even in this plot, like, it makes perfect sense to me that Mikey was like we're going to do this, we're going to do this, we're going to do this. And then halfway through he was like oh no, fuck, we're going to do this, this, this. So it isn't going to be a linear plot from. Mikey had this idea that Carmi was going to take over this restaurant and do this. At the end, like he saw all this. I don't think so. He I think that he did have some ideas about franchising. He did have some ideas about like. Also, I don't know if anybody else has had the joyful experience of working for or being very closely involved with the management of a business as it is actively going under.

Speaker 4: 1:03:12

I was put into the business manager and I am doing scare quotes on that business manager position for a small medical clinic that I worked for 12 or 14 years ago or something, right after the 2008 economic and housing collapse. We were like it was called an ambulatory service, not ambulance, but that means that we were like treating people with vitamins. This was for rich bitches who wanted to reduce their anxiety and depression with vitamin C. I actually, you know, vitamins were great for me. It's fine. I'm not trying to talk smack, I'm just saying we were not primary care responsibility when the entire fucking economy was going under.

Speaker 4: 1:03:55

So we then spent the next four years spinning our wheels and like trying to keep the place open and trying to figure out how to hold off bill collectors and get more patients, even though we didn't have the money to do any of that shit. It's fucking bad. It was not a great time. I fucking hated my job. So there's a part of me that understands.

Speaker 4: 1:04:14

When mikey was like we can't pay for napkins, like what we're just gonna have to own again, so we can't fucking pay for him, like it is a I'm gonna do this thing and then I'm gonna put out that fire, and then I'm gonna put out that fire and then I'm going to figure this shit out. So like having some. You know, five years ago, when Carmi said we could put this place together, you and I can run this place together. I think that sometime after then, mikey started thinking bigger, saying we're going to franchise. I'm going to borrow this money. It got dark. I can't remember what exact part it was exactly, but Ibram at some point says because Mikey was on drugs like whatever.

Speaker 4: 1:04:57

Whatever the question was like why did we do it this way? Well, mikey was on drugs. Like how did this happen? He was fucking stoned. So this is again one of those things where I don't think everything about the plot is 100% realistic. I think that they were asking us to buy in a little bit, and I'm willing to.

Speaker 4: 1:05:15

Um, I believe Mikey felt like if he left Carmi enough money, carmi could save the restaurant in the way that he couldn't. I think that Carmi even being, like food and wines, best new chef of whatever year it was, if he had gone out with other business partners and said we need 300,000 to start an upscale restaurant in this gentrifying neighborhood, I think a lot of bankers would be like, yes, we're going to do that. If he shows up and he's like we've got a shithole that has a C rating and right now we owe 300 and mold and we owe 400 or 500 000 there is not. He would need to give up the restaurant. He would need to give up the beef in order to start a new place. The only way that he is taking the beef to the bear is with the money that mikey saved for him and as just sort of a, a side note with that.

Speaker 4: 1:06:11

Yes, it was collecting interest and whatever else. I believe that because cicero said like I loved mikey too, I I loved him. I think mike mikey felt like cicero was gonna cut car me some slack and he was right about it, like they had a great business plan. But when they showed up to tell Cicero in season two, episode one, that they were like no, we're turning this into a fine dining tasting menu establishment and he's like what the fuck is that noise? Can you turn off the fucking beeping?

Speaker 4: 1:06:42

Like nobody besides Cicero is going to be involved in this, but they had Cicero involved in this.

Speaker 3: 1:06:50

Yeah, and in a in a, in a wild way, they actually Mikey got Cicero a little bit pregnant, like not really really, because he could have just been like everybody, get the fuck out, I'm selling it right. So that was an option. And Carmi acknowledges that that's an option, but essentially he says but you also love me, right, and in your heart you also have hope that we could pull this shit off. Yeah, so let's do this shit. And I I kind of like that. He kind of like the way he laid out. It was like no more angles, no more. Because he even says I would, I found the money and I wasn't.

Speaker 3: 1:07:35

I was not gonna tell you about the motherfucker buddy, I'm just telling you because I need more money. I was like that probably got you the fucking money right there. Because if you say that to me, I'm like oh, so we all the cards on the table now, yeah, yeah, like I was going to keep your motherfucking money Trust and believe I was not going to give you that cash to pay back this debt period. However, now I have a business proposition. I don't know I got why. I trust I, I get why. I mean you could obviously make the argument. The sister would be like get the fuck out of here, whatever. But I got why. He was like all right, yeah, let's try it. And and I'll just toss this in, I know this takes us to a different place quickly we can come right back, we're giving him the chocolate covered banana oh my god I I don't even know the name of the emotion I felt.

Speaker 3: 1:08:33

I don't know the name of the emotion I felt. I was like that was so beautiful and kind of funny and deeply human and a little bit sad like when's the last time in this entire show, who gave cicero anything?

Speaker 3: 1:08:51

cicero's, who you call when you need some shit? We need this, moved along. We need that, moved along. We need fucking this money. We need that money. We need the 300K that you're not ever going to see again. We need another 500K because we already spent your 300K but we didn't even tell you we found your motherfucking 300K. All anybody fucking ever does is ask this dude for shit, including at his house, where you can drug some children, and he's so starved for some fucking peace that he doesn't think, oh, you almost killed children. He thinks, oh, my god, I got a minute of fucking peace I've talked about this I've talked about.

Speaker 2: 1:09:27

I've talked about. I'm not sure who the comedian was, but I think it may be a now disgraced comedian. I remember somebody saying the best part of my day is when I put my kids in the car in their car seat, and then I walk around the backside of the car to get to the truck.

Speaker 3: 1:09:42

You've told me this yes.

Speaker 2: 1:09:44

And it was like that's a vacation, that's like a cruise, that's like going on a cruise, as I have that silence from the passenger side backseat all the way around to my, until I open my driver door.

Speaker 2: 1:09:56

I was going to say what is someone given, cicero, and I was going to say that there was a silence. He got silenced for, you know, unintentionally, but you know, you're right, he doesn't sometimes people in in where you know, there's a, there's a friend of ours, a coach, and I have a friend who's very wealthy, um, and it's just he. He is so generous that he pays when people go out and things like that, and I will sometimes just send him some shit, just so he gets something on it, and it could be just like a baseball cap I think he'd like, or whatever, just so it's like not always in one direction, you know what I mean. And so with Cicero, it does feel like it's in one direction. But more to your point, in that moment when the xanax happened, carme didn't lie to him and and there's like this thing, there's this there's this thing where people get like this is how you, this is how you operate, um, or like this is how I understand our relationship.

Speaker 2: 1:10:56

For whatever you know what, I feel close enough to you that I'm going to just give you the straight dope. Karmie seems to default to that with Cicero, with Uncle Jimmy, and it's like there's this I don't know. It's really interesting, because he's left holding the bag when Mikey's gone. Mikey, sometimes I'm so boss. Are you going to say something? Go, you jump in.

Speaker 4: 1:11:19

Well, no, what I was actually going to say is that I think, part of why their relationship works so well in addition to the fact that Carmi was like we found your money, I did spend it. I wasn't going to give it back to you when he's like that fucking honest with him Also, the fact that what Carmi is proposing to Uncle Jimmy is a legitimate business. This is a place where you don't need to worry about people hiding fucking $300,000 in the tomato cans. I'm giving you an honest business. Maybe you'll watch some cash through. Maybe we don't know for sure. I'm giving you this.

Speaker 3: 1:11:56

Because I want you to come back to the point you're making. So please note it, I'm on it. I love that he was like he didn't. This can just what when? Because I want you to come back to the point you're making, so like please note it I love that.

Speaker 3: 1:12:00

He was like he didn't put it in a bank, did he? And then he go no, no, no, he put in the cans and they were, and he, you could see he was like, oh, good boy, which I was like you have to understand yeah, a certain brand of life to understand why he was like oh shit he didn't put it in a bank, did he?

Speaker 2: 1:12:18

that's not on the radar, is it?

Speaker 3: 1:12:19

yeah, you do not put that money in a bank. So I just thought that was like a brilliant way to show like we're not in a normal space here, like we're not normal right like the one we're custom seeing.

Speaker 4: 1:12:31

So anyway, I just want to like highlight that that was another one of my favorite on reddit, when people are like why wouldn't uncle j, uncle Jimmy want the money in the bank? And I'm like, because his name is Cicero, because he's in the fucking mob, because it's all it's all drug money.

Speaker 4: 1:12:43

The fuck are you thinking, oh my God, but yeah, no. So what I was going to say is the fact that Mikey, as you know, part of his mental health issues and his addiction issues lied about everything to everyone all of the time, and so I think that part of the connection between Carmi and Cicero is that Carmi's like I'm not going to lie to you, I will give you the absolute fucking truth every fucking time and even though Cicero loves Mikey, it makes him feel like he can trust what Carmi is telling him. If you say you can run this restaurant, I believe you can run this restaurant. I believe you can, because you fucking told me that you drugged the kids. You fucking trusted me to think that I to not lose my fucking mind when I found out you put Xanax in the Ecto Cooler. So now I'm going to trust you.

Speaker 3: 1:13:37

Yeah, no, that's a really interesting piece around the trust and I also think I used to have a bit I'll tell us how I mean it, because I'm trying to filter too much. So I used to have a bit because, um, you would know, by you know, coach likes to bust my chops about yelling all that. But like my family, like there's members of my family, by you know, coach likes to bust my chops about y'all and all that, but like my family, like there's members of my family who, you know, maybe don't live on the same, haven't lived on the same side of law as me, let's, let's just say that and and so, and. So one person in particular was, you know, going to get higher. You know, smoke some crack from time to time and, uh, as one does, yep. And so I came up with a whole thing called crackhead logic.

Speaker 3: 1:14:25

I used to have a bit about it when I used to do stand-up and I was like crackhead logic is like some shit. A crackhead will say to you, believing you'll believe it, because they are so fucking high. It is lost on them that that is fucking crazy what they're saying. So I know someone who, using crackhead logic, um explained to their parent at the time after take them taking them a considerable number of years to make any progress in college that they needed to get the tuition money in cash because that was the only way the school would accept payment. Oh, that makes sense. That is some other fucking crack at logic, like how do you part your lips to say that to another sentient human being, like what is happening right now. But that's the kind of thing.

Speaker 3: 1:15:15

So to me, in some ways, I wonder if Mikey got to that point where because because I'm careful in the bit, part of the bit is like it's not a lie as such, because they convince themselves on the way to saying it that that's the story and they are now telling it to you as their new cracked out reality is uh, oh, yeah, no, no, I need the money because and they can say it a hundred times I bet they could pass a lie detector. Yep, but it is complete. They are telling you utter bullshit. So I think you're right about cicero, but I also think part of why he didn't say mikey, get the fuck out of my face is he was looking at this guy and going you really fucking think you're getting ready to franchise this shit? Huh yeah, just take this money, just go, yep. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:16:06

I don't know. Yeah, this is interesting about Mike, so I want to. I want to point out something people would say about. So we have Ted Lasso, we have Wayne and we have the Bear. Ted Lasso and Wayne share.

Speaker 2: 1:16:23

There's a lot of commonalities between all three shows. One of the things that the Bear probably doesn't have in the same way that Ted Lasso and certainly Wayne has, is the prevalence of a very clear rooting interest. Uh, prevalence of a very clear rooting interest. So when you're watching wayne, you go yes, wayne, dell, I am with you, let's fucking rock, right. Um, you're with them.

Speaker 2: 1:16:47

Uh, ted lasso gets called a wanker and right away you're like okay, I am with him, right. And then by by, uh, the associative property, everyone he touches. We talk about him, him being the pebble thrown into a still pool and the ripples affect everyone he touches. Then, by association, those people also become sort of rootable. With the bear it's less clear and so that is a.

Speaker 2: 1:17:14

It's a knock on the show for some people, because that is a prerequisite for some watchers. Sometimes viewers are like I don't know who to get behind here. Everyone lets me down, even when they are great, they're kind of messy and along with that comes a. There's a commentary about the bear in general, up until we're recording this before season three drops, so up until this point, there there is a quality of, of passive victimhood that, um, some people have called out in in that, uh, the shared experience of all the characters, uh is like, especially when they're coping with grief, we understand it and and it was not it's not meant in in a pejorative sense like, oh, they're such victims. It's like the one unifying quality is that they're all contending with things. They're just kind of generally shitty and and and a people don't seem in and of themselves to sort of um, produce change on their own outside of a system or outside of like a uh, uh, clear methodology. So it's not like, um, I don't know. This is something that these are. These are concepts that have been brought up by people who say one of my favorite comments about the Bear is oh, my God, it is an amazing show.

Speaker 2: 1:18:47

I wish I liked it. I might love it, but I'm not sure I like it. Or they'll say you know how other shows make you. Oh, I remember that scene Somehow. When I watch the bear, I don't remember anything. There's nothing memorable about any of the scenes. In the same way, other shows are memorable, like these big moments, and I was like, oh yeah, that, that really that resonates with me, not because it's not memorable, but I'm like, oh, what are they trying? What are those people trying to get out of the show? That it's not satisfying.

Speaker 2: 1:19:17

I think rooting interest plays into it when I look at this show. Juliana asked me who, who do you relate to? And I'm not going to say the answer because I want to hear from boss and from coach. Coach, especially you, I just like you a lot more than I like boss, and I, yeah, no, I, uh, yeah, no, I really actually cause it's fresh in your mind, coach, I'm curious as to if you have a person that's like your person on the show. Is there someone you relate to more than anyone else?

Speaker 3: 1:19:52

Um, yes, that would be Richie Sid tina right okay, okay, no, no, and I say that obviously I'm fucking around, but, but, but it's funny because, as you were asking it, actually it's one of the things I do like about the show and I, and, and what struck me because you were saying, is that they want a rooting interest. I think sometimes what we, what we want sometimes from our entertainment, is clarity. Yeah, right, and some of the stories I love the best. I'm not going to present this here as like oh, I'm into new.

Speaker 3: 1:20:31

Right like no one, no one, no one is like oh, but what was thanos's dad like? Right like no one. Like you snapped your fingers. You're the bad guy, we're gonna stop you. We're the good guys. Right, we're in, we're out, we got it. I actually like about this that the show insists on on being like no, carmy was out of fucking line. He did not need to slap a donut out of a man's hand, regardless, regardless of what was bothering him, and even if he did think that Marcus was fucking up, that you were just an out-of-control.

Speaker 2: 1:21:05

Marcus was fucking up, he was, he was fucking up.

Speaker 3: 1:21:08

No, no, no, it's like dude, we are in the shit and you are like, hey Dad, you want to see my drawing? Like no, no, no, not now I don't. Hey dad, you want to see my drawing? Like no, no, no, not now, I don't. The house is on fire. Like I have to look at your drawing some other time, kid.

Speaker 3: 1:21:22

But that doesn't mean you get to be out of control, right, and I like that they didn't just let him off the hook, that he, like you, are out of fucking line. And if this place is going to not be the places that we're talking about, to not be the places that we're talking about, that cannot happen. You have to figure out how to do something else, and maybe it's that fist to the chest, maybe it's whatever I don't know what the fuck it is, but it's something. It can't be that. And so, yeah, I guess, throughout I found myself like appreciating that I love them, and there's not a single character in this show who at some point I didn't want to choke, at some point where I was like, god damn it. And that's what sometimes, friends and family and people we love and situations or whatever feels like, there's times with my. I quickly I'll tell you that this one's gonna be quick.

Speaker 3: 1:22:25

This one's quick, okay, but I had a confrontation recently and had the, the, the, the wherewithal to record this confrontation. I will say more about the confrontation after I've documented something is that also tattooed on your body.

Speaker 2: 1:22:37

That conversation, that conversation is not Although.

Speaker 3: 1:22:40

I have put a lot of shit on my body the last few years. A lot. I have told a whole fucking tale across my torso, but but, but but I think she said to me that at a certain point watching and this was to the positive but at a certain point watching it, she was audibly telling the people in the video to just go home, because she basically was like oh, he's going to demolish you now you don't even understand. You just walked into a buzzsaw and I I've known him my entire life and he's about to crush you. So she told me that in the context of the video she was like right, please, god, just go, because he's gonna destroy you now you don't even understand.

Speaker 3: 1:23:36

But there are also been moments she knows that about me because there have been moments that we pass that point and you can just see my friends or cousins or whatever, just all sort of like, hang their heads a little or step to the side a little because they're like and there he goes, and when I exploded, I exploded and I you know what I mean and so she knows seeing that and that was my experience of several moments like sid would do some sid shit, like the sid marcus argument, which was a hilarious argument because the argument was basically we both like each other and are too fucking awkward to end up on a date like I was like this is amazing. I was like this is amazing writing. But I get where people are like look, there's shit everywhere. I just want two people to be good looking and smile at each other and have a first kiss, and now I've got to decide if it's someone's fault that they had an argument. I get where it's like give me a break. And that's what I love about the show.

Speaker 2: 1:24:42

The barrier to it is actually relevant because there's been tons of studies on how reticent some of the younger generations are to get together and how the complexity seems more are to to get together and how, how the complexity seems more and they're they're, they hook up less and they, uh, you know, hang out less and in person and stuff. So, uh, there's, there's all those uh things, the the show has a quality to it. Um, where, uh, my daughter, my college-aged daughter, watched it and she's like what is it that drives me crazy about this show? She's like I love it, I absolutely love it. I said, for me, it's like when you're playing with a dog and the dog has like a treat that you want to throw and you have it in his mouth and you're like, all right, come on, give me the fucking treat.

Speaker 2: 1:25:30

And you're pulling on it, you, because you know there's better things out there. Namely when you throw the treat or whatever the toy right, and the dog refuses to go to, to like, do what's better for him, and but every once in a while the dog will let up and you have a brief glimmer, you know, like where it slips out of his teeth a little bit before he clamps back down and the show has that quality.

Speaker 2: 1:25:53

Sometimes you have these beautiful moments where you're like, oh my god, look. And then right away the show is like. But also you're like, oh my God, and then right away the show is like but also, you know it's. It's still business as usual. Boss, we didn't get to ask you if there was someone in particular you related to in the show.

Speaker 4: 1:26:09

Not a single person that I'm like that's there's my guy. Like I will fully admit that when I was watching shameless, I have said before like I am in love with lip gallagher and also I feel like lip gallagher and that's a whole narcissism thing that I'm going to need to figure out in a different amount of therapy. Um, I do not, I do not have that personal connection with car me. In the same way I don't know if this is like a second child thing or whatever it is um, I, um, I will say that there are elements of all of the characters that I do identify with. We talked before about Richie being able to fit into the running, the what was it? The not executing I'm forgetting the word but whatever he was doing and oh, the CDC stuff yeah.

Speaker 4: 1:26:58

Just like managing the kitchen that he, his ability to find calmness and chaos is what did that for him. Um and I'm going to talk about richie so much when we go through each of the episodes, uh, we find out in the forks episode that he says my best friend's mom was like my mom and knowing now what that best friend's mom was like, you're like, well, what the fuck was happening in your house, richie.

Speaker 2: 1:27:27

Yeah, seriously Donna.

Speaker 4: 1:27:30

Donna was who you went to.

Speaker 3: 1:27:33

That's a great fucking point. Jesus Christ, what was your? House like. And so there's more Italian than that.

Speaker 4: 1:27:41

Fuck Jesus, motherfucking Christ. So there's an episode of the TV show house where the whatever patient of the week or whatever she has some sort of her brain is killing her. Whatever it is that her brain is fucking up, her brain is killing her and he realizes that her brain is set in a brain is killing her and he realizes that her brain is set in a way where chaos and noise and everything else. She's a kindergarten teacher. All of the like yelling and shouting actually chills her out, makes her more subdued and she is more able to deal with the screaming children than anything else interesting wow, richie has so much of that like yeah, that's, interesting this

Speaker 4: 1:28:18

is when my niece accidentally set some wooden flowers on fire and I just calmly walked over and grabbed them and put them in the sink. I think when you are raised in a level of chaos where it becomes second nature, that feels very oh, I've got this. I've mentioned before there are people at the beginning of pandemic, once we got used to not going anywhere, we like, oh, the world is on fire. Okay, I, I got.

Speaker 3: 1:28:46

I got this, I could I can do all of this yeah, um it's funny you say that I'm sorry guys you know, so I.

Speaker 4: 1:28:50

The only other thing that I was going to say about this is that what you were just talking about castleton, with that like you're dog, like wanting it to turn a corner, wanting it to get better. I jokingly, although not so much, when we were texting earlier this morning, I said Bishop said, after mainlining that level of the bear, I'm going to need some more therapy. And I was like the thing that's wrong with me is that watching the bear is therapy like that's.

Speaker 3: 1:29:21

We could screenshot that. That is the text I got in response that's it.

Speaker 4: 1:29:25

But I I, I do mean that. I mean that every time that they are like here's a good moment, and now this is fucking horrible, and like this feels so great and also, oh my god, how did you live through fishes like I it it does make me feel better. I did like it is comforting in a weird way. There is an element of you don't want to stand too close to the fire because it burns, but also like have it being able to experience some of those emotions with a little bit of distance, just enough, so that it's not, I am not in danger. But I get to experience a lot of that shit where I'm like, oh yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:30:08

I get that A hundred percent. I love that. You said that Fish is Holy shit Also, by the way. Sorry, just real quick, the funniest shit I've seen in a long time.

Speaker 3: 1:30:22

Fucking hysterical to me but I think I would want okay. So here's one question, because I also there was there, as, again, going through at this pace was insane, because I'm like processing all and trying to remember like facts. It was really wild, but I share your. There was part of me that was laughing during Fishes, like through all of it and like as she, as Donna's, melting down and I'm like, oh no, like early in the episode I was like mm-mm, yeah, mm-mm, this ends so fucking poorly and what I love that the show did and sometimes shows can fuck this up I feel like they were like, hmm, your family's chaotic too. Huh, oh, let me tell you another story. Your family's chaotic too. Okay, okay, great, okay, great. Here's their mother driving through the house. So I think for 99% of people you go well, okay, well, my family was fuck up.

Speaker 3: 1:31:19

Okay, okay, you win, all right yeah, you know, I'm saying like god damn, and I love, but then too, like to watch sugar, even that, because sugar is, you know, not literally, because we had that conversation the other day, but sugar is sweet, right right. So I didn't know why her name was sugar, but that's the thing I could imagine. I mean sugar, ray lennon, right, like, like this, you know sugar is a nickname I've heard before. But that reason, like even that even the cutesy fucking nickname is a a badge of your fucking trauma yep, yep.

Speaker 3: 1:32:00

That is a reminder of one of your worst moments and I saw her watch that car drive in and everyone else went reasonably fucking berserk and she's just sitting there because it's not calm, like on the outside it's calm, but I feel like, oh, she's, like, she's detaching from y'all, like she's like I'm not in this place anymore, like she's just back, like emotionally leaving, and it makes all the more sense that she will go in that motherfucker restaurant. I wouldn't go in that motherfucker either. You motherfuckers are crazy. I don't know why god popped me down in the middle of you lunatics. Yeah, yeah, I I'm not. I want no fucking parts of this. I don't want to smell it, I don't want to hear about it, I'm fucking out yep, and this is like obviously we are going to get into this.

Speaker 4: 1:32:54

But the thing is, I could talk right now for an hour straight about natalie, about her being sugar, her being referenced as sugar in the beginning, everything that happens in the second season, with her becoming the project manager for this rebirth of the restaurant, her choice in husband and how he plays into it like amazing.

Speaker 2: 1:33:13

No, no, listen, we have to talk about.

Speaker 3: 1:33:15

We have to talk about Pete Amazing we have to talk about Pete. Oh, I'm in. I'm in because that is fucking fascinating. Is this a Chicago thing?

Speaker 4: 1:33:23

No, this is being a fucked up girl thing.

Speaker 2: 1:33:27

What I mean is we meet Pete through the eye. We don't start out by sort of meeting Pete through through uh, sugars slash natalie's eyes. We we see how, like our biggest entree to pete, you know in the, in the beginning it's like no sweetie, I wasn't talking to you or whatever you're not in the room.

Speaker 4: 1:33:49

No, sweetie, you didn't say anything you didn't say anything, right she's a fucking hilarious line. No, no, honey, you weren't talking, no no, right.

Speaker 2: 1:33:56

So that's the, that's the first sort of you go. Okay, but that's like about them. That's about them when we see them at the children's birthday party and Uncle Jimmy's like, even when he's passed out, he's like I want to beat him up so badly I fucking hate him and I'm like, oh my God, and they hate being around him. And then when I look at what he's saying, it's moderately ted, lasso, ish, it's very positive. He's uh. He says to carmen hey, I followed you and I watched what you're doing and it took an amazing amount of courage to do this stuff. And they're like fuck you. And I'm so I go. Oh god, like there. Well yeah, is this.

Speaker 2: 1:34:39

I'm asking for you, for the two of you. Is there a commonality to this? If it felt, it almost took me out of it in a way where I'm like it, pete's not that bad, like, is the joke that pete's not that bad, or is the joke like like the pete is annoying? I get all that and p Pete can be grating and Pete whatever. It's like Crooked Mike is right outside the door or whatever. What's the guy dealing drugs right outside the oh, nico, there's Nico too.

Speaker 2: 1:35:10

But the guy that Richie shook hands with Crooked something.

Speaker 2: 1:35:14

Oh yeah, crooked Mike, or whatever, and the other guy is like mr carl or whatever, whatever, like those guys are actually legit trouble. It's like, boss, when you're like oh, coach, I don't trust you because you're not able to uh, to uh recognize danger. It's like pete is not danger, like, but they treat him like he is a virus and I'm like what is that dynamic? I thought it was like an inside baseball thing for Chicago. Everybody has someone in their family that sucks shit. I thought it was this kind of thing Because I'm still not 100% on. Okay, I'll go with it, but I'm like Pete is not. He's irritating.

Speaker 3: 1:35:58

But he's Well, I'm curious You've had. Oh sorry, boss, Go ahead.

Speaker 4: 1:36:02

No, no, no. I was going to say I would love to hear what you have to say about it.

Speaker 3: 1:36:07

My sense of it is they're unhealthy. But if everybody in the circle is unhealthy, you kind of don't have to deal with unhealthy. But when there's somebody in the circle who's like, hey, you're the mother of the two people who just opened up an amazing fucking restaurant, why don't you come in to an opening you were invited to and enjoy this moment of success and the like that is and this word is dangerous, but I'll say it this way for this context. That is and this word is dangerous, but I'll say it this way for this context that is normal. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, that is a normal way to behave. Yes, we get, and I think on some level, even if it hurt, sugar, every character would get. Why there is 0.0 fucking chance that Donna can trust herself in that restaurant? Yep, yes that Donna can trust herself in that restaurant. She's not going in there because she's like it's the New Haven club again. She's like, oh, that that they just created over there. That's way too motherfucking nice for me to be a part of.

Speaker 4: 1:37:13

Yeah, and she'll drink too much and she'll cause a scene and she'll ruin the night.

Speaker 3: 1:37:17

I don't want to ruin it.

Speaker 2: 1:37:19

How's the pizza in New Haven? Out of curiosity.

Speaker 3: 1:37:23

It's a point of pride for New Haven being from New York. Okay, that was always my. I was like I'll eat it, it's fine. I'm not mad at the pizza here. I'm not sure that it's what you think, but maybe mad at the pizza here.

Speaker 2: 1:37:40

I'm not sure that it's what you think, but maybe butter on our, on our, uh, on our community site, uh, marie uh posted a question. She's like how, how the hell is new haven, the pizza capital of the us, and I was like I don't know, it seems wrong to me and then um, buttercup, buttercup, eric is enlisting your help coach to back for backup. He's like there's at least three.

Speaker 3: 1:37:57

Pepe's.

Speaker 2: 1:37:58

Yeah, there's several modern.

Speaker 3: 1:38:00

Sally's bars the parties.

Speaker 2: 1:38:02

Sally's yeah, yeah, yeah, so I didn't know if it was, I wasn't aware that was a thing. Pizza Capital.

Speaker 3: 1:38:08

No, that is definitely a real thing. I'm not sure that I would rank it tops tops myself, having had New York, chicago and New Haven but it's quite good.

Speaker 4: 1:38:20

I will state again for the record Way to walk on that fence, Coach. For the record, again, I will state I don't understand why there's any sort of disagreement, like even the slightest kind of like oh no, ours is better. Oh no, ours is better between New York and Chicago. I don't understand why this fight is happening when St Louis pizza exists, when it is still a thing that people are eating and putting into their bodies and choosing to have.

Speaker 3: 1:38:46

Is that with the square cutting? Oh no, that is Chicago Tavern pizza. That is fucking delicious. My mouth just started watering when I'm talking about it honestly.

Speaker 4: 1:38:55

I have a picture, I can see it.

Speaker 2: 1:38:58

Aren't you the one that shared a pizza puff?

Speaker 4: 1:39:01

Yes, Pizza puffs are delicious. They're amazing.

Speaker 2: 1:39:07

I will stand by a pizza puff all day. See, that's we don't. We don't coach, we don't. In the affluent white community we call that martini logic. You know it's just you can't have just one. It's not crackhead logic.

Speaker 3: 1:39:17

Okay, I love everything that's happening here. You know what I mean.

Speaker 2: 1:39:21

You just say oh yeah, she's convinced herself Pizza puffs are delicious. I know she's not lying.

Speaker 4: 1:39:26

You come, you eat one. It's fucking amazing. But St Louis pizza just for those who are unaware is what they describe as a cracker-thin crust. So not like a Brooklyn pizza, not even like a tavern crust, like crackery, it breaks in your mouth. Crust, sweet sauce they call it sweet, they say it should be sweet. And then Provol cheese. And if you've never heard of Provol, that's because it is made in one county in minnesota and sent to st louis for their terrible pizzas. It's not real cheese, it's a cheese product and they put it on their pizza and they expect people to eat it. It's trash, it is straight trash. St louis, I've been to you, I love you. I think your barbecue is fucking amazing. Throw the pizza in the garbage, put it in the mississippi and leave it for nobody it's terrible.

Speaker 3: 1:40:18

Okay, I'm, I'm, I'm this fucking close to finding my way there. Because, I'm just like what, what is this? Straight pizza with cheese product. What's happening? Straight garbage.

Speaker 2: 1:40:31

Makes me think of the quote in Fletch about three names. I admire Hector, Mary and Provo.

Speaker 4: 1:40:37

I don't remember what the two names are before provo, but I remember fletch saying pro I never heard of provol provol yeah, provol provol not provolone because that's what I thought you were about to explain it might technically be cheese, but I think they listed as a cheese product but it's like a combination of provolone and mozzarella and something else and it's trash, it's I'm sorry, the word product yeah, that's always ice cream product like. Well, it's not an ice cream?

Speaker 4: 1:41:05

no, no product hey, yeah, hey, right now awesome if you ever, if you ever meet a poor kid and you want to give them terrible flashbacks. You just ask them about um ice milk and you see, you see them shrivel.

Speaker 2: 1:41:19

You guys aren't even familiar I would like to meet.

Speaker 3: 1:41:23

That's really funny. I don't know what ice milk is. Also coach, that's very funny.

Speaker 4: 1:41:27

Um it's ice cream but it's less fat and less delicious and more ice who who is?

Speaker 2: 1:41:35

give me a name, and give me a name in an effort to have, uh, the other coach or boss appreciate it. Give me a name of um, with all deference to the dear uh ted lasso, who would say there's no such thing as an ancillary character. Um, tell me the name of an ancillary character you love on, uh, on the bear leading into season three. Mine, mine, is fact so I've got okay, we can go that close.

Speaker 4: 1:42:05

Yeah, I like that, but sorry, I do love that every time he's on the screen and he has a youtube channel maddie matheson.

Speaker 2: 1:42:11

Yes, and it's hysterical and I, oh, I never shared. I've been meaning to share because during his he's a, he cooks for his whatever and there was this one, the most adhd moment I've ever seen where he stops in the middle of the video and goes wait what was that? What were we doing? So I'm going to share that.

Speaker 4: 1:42:26

I'll put that on the community site today, but tell me, go ahead, boss and so actually, what I'm going to do is connect the two questions the what's the deal with pete?

Speaker 2: 1:42:34

and also oh, my favorite character, jeez, extra credit.

Speaker 4: 1:42:37

Extra credit here. So the thing about Pete is he is not a bad guy. He's not a bad guy. There is, and I want to get into this a lot when we get to fishes because there is so much there. One of the most discussed scenes on Reddit of the entire is pete showing up with that tuna casserole and the extent to which people are like he was just trying to be a nice guy, like he was invited to dinner, he brought something. Why is everybody mad at him? And it is because they don't understand how badly that was going to fuck the entire dinner and he didn't understand and he did not listen to them Like there's a part Told him not to do that.

Speaker 4: 1:43:24

This is the thing. There's a part where Pete says well, that wasn't expressed to me that I shouldn't do it. And then when Nat is like, I told you not to do this. He was like I was. I was supposed to come up de-handed like you. What did you want me to do? And so, yeah, that is why pete rubs me. The wrong way is that he is a part of the family, he is a nice guy, but he doesn't understand the undercurrent of what is happening and doesn't know how to navigate it and is going to storm into donna's kitchen with a fucking tuna noodle casserole and she's gonna lose her mind not on pete, she's not gonna lose her mind on pete, she's gonna lose her mind on everybody else.

Speaker 4: 1:44:00

So nat is like hey, can you please be on my side on this and just do exactly what I say. Please do not fucking rock this boat for me. And he's like but I need a tuna casserole no, yeah, I so.

Speaker 3: 1:44:13

So I took on that moment because I was like you, dummy, before I knew Natalie, I was just like you. Obviously you've been around enough that everybody knew you were going to be the one to fuck us up. So you need to not be the one who fucks us up, yep, and it might not make sense or whatever. But he said, like, oh, we're supposed to come empty handed. Like, bring a bottle of wine. You know there's going to be a bunch of wine consumed, yes, obviously, yes. So just bring a bottle of wine, like, like, but he, he, so that's where actually, I'm glad you pointed that out, because I was having a hard time, because I was like, ultimately he's healthy, but sometimes being healthy is is also being able to adapt.

Speaker 3: 1:44:57

Yep, and not necessarily adapt in a way that means you need to behave in unhealthy ways also. But, like, if I'm like I have had friends, I have over the course of my life, like I've had friends, those are my drinking buddies, right? So we hang out, that's what we do. We're hanging out, we're drinking, we party and whatever. That's not where I would necessarily start a conversation about like, oh, I was reading james baldwin the other day. Like know where the fuck you are, and this is not the time or place for that brand of you. Know, this is how we operate as a family and nobody wanted to the castle.

Speaker 2: 1:45:35

If they were one fish short and you walked in with that, they were gonna be bad here's I have we talked a little bit about this uh with ted lasso, but one of the theories I have is, uh, that that pete is the anti-mikey. So so when you have we talk about, uh, how iq is the predominant way that people measure everybody in society, but I'm a huge proponent of EQ and CQ, which is emotional quotient and creative quotient. Carmi has that creative quotient. You know a lot of the cooking staff.

Speaker 2: 1:46:08

So this is like an exciting trip where it's like where the creative quotient is really maximized. Somebody like Mikey has EQ out the ass Like he just every room he walks, walks into there could just take the temperature, yeah right and you just go.

Speaker 2: 1:46:24

He just he just owned it, and the concept of everybody thinking that they're your best friend or whatever that whole dynamic um is, uh, it, it's. Certain types of individuals can like nail that, you know, just a really, really big thing, and I like that it downplays the iq part of it and with with pete, he's has no eq.

Speaker 4: 1:46:46

He is I don't know which cue he's going with.

Speaker 4: 1:46:49

Yeah, I don't know which cue he's got, it doesn't seem like any. It seems like he is very kind and nice to natalie and natalie seems to love him and I want that for her. But like, not only did he, not only did he show up with something that was not asked for, that was not welcome, that natalie told him not to bring, but also it went against the grain of everything that donna was trying to do with the dinner it being made from scratch and everything homemade and lots of it's her.

Speaker 4: 1:47:19

Yeah, it's like she was doing all the shit and he's like well, here is a can of tuna and dried noodles and a can of cream of tomato mushroom soup no, no, and I put them together like but yeah, go ahead. Sorry boss go no, no, no, no. So it like on that point though. Um, yeah, the character that I like the most weirdly, because I have mixed feelings about John Mulaney, but it's Stevie, because Stevie is not of the family- I like him a lot, and he became more interesting as the episode unfolded.

Speaker 2: 1:47:55

Sorry, go ahead. No, no, no.

Speaker 4: 1:47:57

That's exactly it. That's a good pull.

Speaker 2: 1:47:58

Yeah, it really is.

Speaker 4: 1:47:59

He is not of the family but he gets the family to the point where I had to pause and stop and cry, laughing so hard when the Fack brothers were talking to him. I knew it.

Speaker 3: 1:48:14

Yes, I was hollering at him.

Speaker 2: 1:48:18

No, no, no no can, I, can I?

Speaker 4: 1:48:19

take those questions one at a time, because am I interested in baseball cards? No, can I get five hundred dollars? Do I have five hundred dollars on me? No, I can get it. I'm a grown man like I. I was when he said I'm gonna give you the money, but I want you to call me every week. I was was like he gets it. He knows exactly what this is.

Speaker 4: 1:48:41

He knows exactly how to handle it. I can't even remember the name of his girlfriend, who's the actual cousin. I keep wanting to call her Sarah and I don't think that that's it, but I knew for a fact that she knew I could leave him alone in the room and he'll be fine. I do not need to babysit him.

Speaker 3: 1:49:00

That's yes, in the room and he'll be fine. I do not need to babysit him. That's yes, and and and. Actually I'm really glad because that's where that's in. That and stevie, kindness meets eq.

Speaker 3: 1:49:10

So if we could create excuse me, here something the kindness quotient, excuse me, which is not being nice, I think we are actually talking about kindness. There's a kindness the fact that he's like call me and tell me the story and I'm going to crack up Like. I don't think he's necessarily going to like, put it in a book and name them and be like ha ha, ha, ha, aren't they stupid? He just knows this is going to be entertaining as fuck. It is likely going to be a shit show, even if it's a rousing success. It's going to be a fucking shit show. And I five hundred dollars is peanuts, yeah, for front row seat to this shit show and to me I was like that's fucking hilarious and fantastic and sounds like some shit. You can convince me to do Like if I'm Stevie's friend and I'm there that night and he's like yo, man, how about you got all ready?

Speaker 3: 1:50:12

And he's like you got $500 on you. I'd be like for that. Yeah, I could move some shit around, I'd give you that $500. Now you got three-way me on this motherfucking weekly call, but I'll give you this $500, though.

Speaker 4: 1:50:25

This is the thing is that he not only was willing to part with $500, he was willing to accept a weekly phone call. Do you?

Speaker 3: 1:50:33

know how much oh accept yeah.

Speaker 4: 1:50:35

I avoid talking on the phone whenever possible, and he was like yes, please call me on my phone so.

Speaker 3: 1:50:42

I could hear you explain. Yeah, it wasn't even text me or whatever, because I'm going to have follow up questions.

Speaker 2: 1:50:49

His ability to understand is remarkable. Yes, and how it plays out, the writing is so goddamn good, so goddamn good. We've talked a little bit about reality TV and the origins of it and how quote-unquote freak shows were used as cautionary tales once upon a time there. But for the grace of God and whatever my genetic encoding is to go, I so lest we lose sight of that in the way that reality TV has often lost sight of it, where it's like, rather than say, jesus, look how these people behave, thank God, I'm not like that and begin to emulate that, because you can't discern the difference I want to point out that one of the elements of Pete so I see this family as a little bit of a it's like a traveling carnival or it's like a bunch of carnies or something.

Speaker 2: 1:51:45

There's a, there's an ethos to it, right, there's a thing that the John Mulaney character gets the Stevie character right, he just gets it, whereas Pete is, he's in it all the time and he still brings, like you know, mutual of omaha, like sort of, or whatever he brings, like this exterior sort of operating manual, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:52:08

So he's always off, he's always misaligned, even though if you, if you look at the, what he's trying to do, or what he's trying to say, or the the intent, because we talk a lot about intent, um, and you know what was the intent of what was pete trying to do? If you break down, it's actually inobtrusive, unobtrusive or inoffensive, uh, but it's wildly offensive because he is not able to sort of mentally program or reprogram to the way that this carnival works, right, right, it's, they're all in this sort of shared understanding, shared agreement, and that it's funny in families when, when you have that, sometimes it's contingent upon a matriarch or a patriarch that holds that, that, that structure together, and then they pass away. Now the next generation can choose to. Okay, we're going to keep it going that way or are we going to do that in this family? This is, you know, everyone's intact and uh, so to speak, and so you have this sort of functional dynamic and only which is only, which is only solidified more by the passing of mike.

Speaker 3: 1:53:17

Go ahead, coach which is only, which is only solidified more by the passing of mike go ahead, coach. So you touched on a couple things there, and there's so much in this fucking show. It really is brilliant and I'm looking forward to oh good, so what you liked looking forward to.

Speaker 2: 1:53:28

At the end of all this you're like you see why we picked it and you get oh yeah, I love this show okay and I and I I love the characters but I love them like.

Speaker 3: 1:53:37

I love a lot of people in my life where I'm like, if you don't fucking knock it off, yes.

Speaker 2: 1:53:42

Coach, wait, that's how I felt constantly in this. You didn't say your ancillary character.

Speaker 3: 1:53:47

I don't think let's just tally that, before we forget, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, hmm, who is so ancillary? I guess, to qualify as ancillary, I would say, is marcus ancillary, is he? No, he's not.

Speaker 2: 1:54:05

I I think he's pretty cool I mean fact is borderline core, so it's kind of so, so fact so.

Speaker 3: 1:54:10

So here's what. Here's what I would say. And it's actually a surprise even to me then, because I was like oh so, let's go outside that kitchen. My favorite ancillary character is Cicero.

Speaker 4: 1:54:23

Oh okay, yeah, yeah, I get that.

Speaker 3: 1:54:27

Like now, like sitting here, because it seems to me, in the context of the telling and you both hit on several things just now that I was like, oh, I want to talk about that, I want to talk about that, I want to talk about that, I want to talk about that. But Cicero both hit on several things just now that I was like, oh, I want to talk about that, I want to talk about that, I want to talk about that, I want to talk about that. But cicero what I like about cicero is he is he is the moneyed version of what we're saying about stevie. He gets that. This is fucked up. Also, can we just have a nice dinner and not throw another goddamn fort? Oh, my god. Also, I want my fucking money back. Eventually, playtime's gonna be over and I will get my fucking money back one way or another. Trust, like I just think. Like he think he's grounded and at peace in this world of chaos like no other.

Speaker 3: 1:55:25

Yes, yes, richie is able to survive in this ecosystem, but he's far from at peace. Carm, he's not at peace. Sid's not at peace, no one else. He's at peace. Yeah, yeah, he's like this is life, this is how it goes. I got goo gobs of money. I can hand a motherfucker $300,000. I'm pretty confident. I'm not going to see back Now. The rules are the rules. I want my fucking money back. But he's not stressed about it and he's not going to break Carmi's legs, because he ain't got to break Carmi's legs. He don't get his fucking money back. Yes, yeah, so I love that. I would toss in because you touched on several things. Stevie also gets and maybe this is where Pete is again off. Stevie also gets that. This is a loving family. Yep.

Speaker 3: 1:56:24

Right and I think for Pete he's like this is not how loving people behave when he's crying at the table, when he's like you know, I can't tell you. Donna was just outside and refused to come inside and is out there fucking weeping because she's broken and now that's just going to break you more and even though Carmen going to act like he don't give a fuck, he going to get broken but he just sit there like this is not what loving fucking looks like you crazy people. Yes, there's a level on which they are a deeply loving family. Yes.

Speaker 3: 1:57:00

You know, and I've shared my definition, that love is, you know, being invested in the optimization of outcomes for someone or something. That's actually true here, even when Sugar's pissed. Why is she pissed? She softens. When he says I've been going to meetings three times a week, their whole fucking dynamic shifts. Her way of relating to carmy shifts. Yes, she wants him to be better.

Speaker 2: 1:57:25

Yeah, sid carmy, tina, like that was why tina piece of acting by abby elliott, by the way, in that moment, oh, she softened, I mean, you just saw it and what was it?

Speaker 3: 1:57:37

it wasn wasn't. He did something for her, he did something for him, right. Like everybody, this is actually a loving family. They do want mom to be okay. Now, sugar wants mom to be okay, knows mom is not okay, which is why she keeps asking are you okay? Are? You okay.

Speaker 3: 1:57:56

Which is also why Donna hates being asked if she's okay, because she know good and well. She knew good and damn well what the answer to that question is and it ain't the answer she want to give yeah, so now sugar's a fucking problem. But sugar keeps asking you okay, because obviously you are not motherfucking. Okay, like this is not okay, this is crazy. And even if you threw that tuna casserole in the garbage, why do we all know that? Even if mom sees this, fuck up, get it out of the house and get it out of the house.

Speaker 3: 1:58:33

Yes, like that's not normal, no, no, but they do love each other and that's kind of a lot to handle no, no, no, like well, number one.

Speaker 4: 1:58:46

I was laughing because there's an episode of community where the group of seven has to work with one outsider so that each person has a partner and of course the outsider is like community they're a bunch of dysfunctional assholes and they love each other. And so at one point he's like offense taken. You're, you're supposed to love each other. Your love is weird and I get it. I get where he's coming from.

Speaker 3: 1:59:10

I do understand that.

Speaker 4: 1:59:12

Todd, I believe his name is Todd.

Speaker 4: 1:59:14

But on the flip side I also understand being part of that family where your love is weird but, it's still love and so there's something about having Pete as sort of an outsider, not understanding that vibe, not understanding what's going on, not understanding why you don't tell, you, don't ask Donna if she's okay, and the same way that you don't put Kathy at the door with her or with the seat, with her back to the door in a restaurant, because then she's afraid she's going to get whacked Like sometimes you know things and you just have to go with it. You get that.

Speaker 4: 1:59:46

So it's like if there is a comfort with Cicero and with Stevie, where they do seem to understand that the family loves each other, even though they're all fucked up, and that there is a lack of judgment on their part of that and that they they speak that language like, I think, part of the reason why those of us who don't love pete at times, it is because it feels I I hate to say I. I hate to compare this to appropriation, because I feel like in and of itself it is appropriation, but there is something about like being overly familiar and like trying to speak in the same way but not actually speaking the language that comes off as so off-putting, like when he comes in with a tuna noodle casserole he's like hey, mikey, what's good.

Speaker 4: 2:00:39

And it's like no dude, you are so off the vibe that you don't. It feels really weird that you can't even understand what we're what's happening.

Speaker 2: 2:00:46

But who's gonna teach him, boss? Who's gonna teach him?

Speaker 4: 2:00:48

yeah, it's really fun, but like one of the things that's really good to hear, that like in her last, in her last waking moments on this earth.

Speaker 4: 2:00:56

She's just gonna hear your, hear your voice. I got a breeze right past that because I think one of the things that I I want to say threaded, and I might've mentioned it on here already, but I was talking to a friend, an elder millennial, and she was like, yeah, I don't, I don't want to be friends with people who said that their childhoods were good, and I'm like, oh, like, okay, I got that, I get it like there is I remember liking that.

Speaker 4: 2:01:19

That was very funny to me there is, and I understand why other people would look at that and be like, why wouldn't you want to be friends with somebody who had a good childhood? Like what's wrong with you? That a good childhood would be off-putting. And it's not the good childhood, it is the inability to understand my like acceptance and peace and reconciliation and being okay with my own fucked up childhood. Like when there is that level of disconnect where you're like no, don't, you're not actually going to judge this, like we can both acknowledge that this is fucked up, but when you start judging the way that we're doing things, I'm going to find that and I'm going to push you out.

Speaker 2: 2:02:01

Because if you've had that type of childhood, then you have to do the work to have gotten this far and be a person that people want to be friends with, so you know that there's that built in component. You're like, yes, we've done the work.

Speaker 4: 2:02:15

I know that I give you so much shit, but that is exactly it. Because there is this element of like a lot of society thinks if you had a bad childhood and you overcame it, you are still somehow at a deficit, that like there is still something that you're missing out, that you don't understand, that you don't get and I'm like bitch, I have done so much more fucking work than you have. You've got no fucking idea what you're talking about. Like, I actually am not emotionally stunted. Actually, the reason that I choose to be emotional in the way that I do is because I've had to process through all of this shit and I know exactly where I stand so real quick, real quick, real quick, real quick.

Speaker 3: 2:02:54

no, but I I though that what you just highlighted, boss, is huge. I once heard somebody say that religion is for people who are afraid of hell and spirituality is for people who've been through it. Oh, and whether we absolutely believe that or accept that?

Speaker 1: 2:03:14

No, he doesn't have anything to do with this. But yeah, right, Get him out of here.

Speaker 3: 2:03:17

No, I doesn't have anything to do with this. Yeah right, get him out of here. No, I'm kidding, but I think what you just described is huge. And there is a story I want to tell about my brother. My brother, I think it's safe to say, made some different life choices than me and did not go to Yale, and so I'll just leave that there.

Speaker 3: 2:03:43

So it's the summer after my freshman year of high school I mean of college and I cannot find a fucking job. Like that's the short version. It's like I'm like oh, yeah, I'll go back to New York and get a job real quick. And there's no job real quick and there's no internship, and there's no uncle who can say, oh, call my buddy right. Like there's none. Like and I'm like but seriously, I need fucking money. Like I'm not even at this point. It's not even like oh, I need experience. It's like, uh, how the fuck am I gonna buy books? So I go to my brother, who may have had information on a numbers joint he helped run and said, uh, I need a job. I want to be a lookout, I'll just be a lookout. I don't have to be a side. I don't do whatever I don't want to, but I want to be a lookout. Wow, I gotta, I got to make money. I need money.

Speaker 2: 2:04:40

Our life lived experiences are so similar I can't even but this was the amazing part.

Speaker 3: 2:04:49

For all the up and down my brother and I have had, the most loving thing he ever did was tell me no. And I was like yo, blah, blah, blah, yo, I'm jammed up. And he was like are you like he? I remember he actually said are you crazy? The tone was definitely, are you crazy. He was like I just got arrested last week. Yeah, he's like you can't be down there, like he's basically like you don't, you can't like you cross the river like you decided to live over there. You, you don, you don't, you can't like you cross the river like you decided to live over there. You, you don't, don't, you can't come visit like that. And he made it clear that's your own dance, mikey.

Speaker 3: 2:05:28

Now right there, yeah yeah mikey wouldn't let you in the kitchen so the mikey karm relationship from jump, yeah, yeah, I thought about that dynamic like, if not in the pilot, very quickly I was like, oh shit, this is like me and gaspard and he, and so the fact that he was like you can't work here. He was like because if you work here you're gonna be making fucking soggy sandwiches and fucking up the vents. Like I gotta go, you to go live over there for a long time and don't come back here either, so that you can learn how to be like that. Like it was such a because he keeps and I have a feeling we'll get more detail on it, but he kept mentioning it felt to me that Mikey wouldn't let him work there and I was like that doesn't sound like the dude everybody's describing, like even if Carm had done something to piss him off. I don't believe that the guy they're describing was just like fuck you get out of here, bro. Like there might've been a better way to do it, yeah, but I can't believe that what he was doing wasn't, on some level, loving and so it made.

Speaker 3: 2:06:41

That's also why finding the money didn't feel to me like get the fuck out of here with that, like soul food, which is a great. That was a great movie. I love the movie, let me put it that way. But it's a very good movie and there's a moment in soul food where some money has come upon, where you kind of go okay, I guess we got to wrap this thing up, so I guess. But this wasn't my feeling here. My feeling here was like of course, of course, and I there were times when I was like that's how this guy would do it, that was his final, I love you. And the letter rip note and all that was just like.

Speaker 4: 2:07:31

oh my God, he left the recipe for the pasta in his suicide note to Carmi. I don't know if he planned a lot ahead, but he was like I'm going to leave you the recipe. He's going to make the pasta. He's going to find the money.

Speaker 3: 2:07:46

If he finds this, he'll do as I say, exactly. He will make this because it has a meaning.

Speaker 4: 2:07:51

Right, so like the entire first season.

Speaker 3: 2:07:59

he didn't think was going to happen, Like everything that, mikey, thought you were going to find Right, because they never. And the first thing was the first thing Carb said was we ain't making that goddamn spaghetti, we're not making that fucking pasta. Oh, that's right, I hadn't painted that part in.

Speaker 2: 2:08:13

Try to pay a little more attention when you watch it. Keep up, will you? When?

Speaker 4: 2:08:17

you were watching it at one and a half times speed so that you could get everything done just take better notes Come on Exactly.

Speaker 3: 2:08:25

Yeah, no, but yeah, that's yeah. Anyway, there's a lot to love here. I know time-wise we're up against it, but I just yeah last looks and final touches here, coach yeah yeah, yeah, I'm just super glad that we're.

Speaker 3: 2:08:40

We'll get into other stuff. I'm sure season 3 will give us all the more reasons to get into it. But I loved these characters and in part, loved them because they drove me crazy, because each one of them I was like please don't say the thing I pretty much know you're about to say, and you said it you fucking said it boss, where do people find you if they want to find you?

Speaker 2: 2:08:59

you said it and you said it, you fucking said it. Yeah, boss, where do people find you if they want to find you?

Speaker 4: 2:09:02

uh, you can find me on blue sky, which is dumbly underscore chambers, trying to get back there, um, trying to get away from threads a little bit. Uh, the vibe is off. I can't figure. I and listen I'm still going to be there for a long time, but I can't figure out if my algorithm isn't working this week interesting so I so I'm going to split my time more evenly between my two children, but at Threads right now it is emilychambers.31. And also hopefully figuring out something to write at the Antagonist soon, which is antagonistblogcom.

Speaker 2: 2:09:34

Coach, what about you?

Speaker 3: 2:09:36

Wealignalignpcom. What about you? We align that align pcom. We align is our online community for the coaching practice. I began, I've said my coaching practice, but the team is growing and I don't feel comfortable saying my like that.

Speaker 3: 2:09:49

Oh hell yes, I'm trying, I'm, I'm, I'm shifting the we an hour and I'm happy about it. But come through, We've been getting up. Oh, boss, you'll be happy to know that the video you shared about game theory the way to look at life got posted. We have a thing called TED Talk Tuesday, which I shared. They won't all be TED Talks, but that's the basic idea, and so I shared that video, which I found absolutely fascinating. We'll talk about that?

Speaker 3: 2:10:19

Oh, hell, yes, I thought that video was like oh, I could dig into that, you knew when you said it, but yeah, I could.

Speaker 4: 2:10:27

I wasn't for sure, but yes, I love that. I love that a lot.

Speaker 3: 2:10:31

So there you go, we align, check us out. There's amazing content, amazing people and, yeah, that's the deal.

Speaker 2: 2:10:40

Awesome. All right, Thank you, Coach. I want to mention the 2000 film Gun Shy. Have either one of you seen that? It's fun. If you love Oliver Platt, it is a super fun movie. I haven't seen it in a while. It might be dated, but I remember playing its type in the most amazing ways. It stars Oliver Platt and Sandra Bullock and a little known actor. You may have heard a pluralized Liam Neeson's.

Speaker 4: 2:11:06

Liam Neeson's All right as a.

Speaker 2: 2:11:08

It was a charming little indie film when they still made indie films, and Oliver Platt kills it and and I think it's a it's a lot of fun for people who are enjoying Jimmy. Okay, that's it for us. The next time you hear from us, we will be giving you a quick update on our initial reaction to Season 3. This is the last show before Season 3 exists in the world en masse, and so that is it for us. The next one, we are not going to. We're going to do the thing that we did with Ted Lasso, which we're going to catch up Now we're going to blast through season three and come back and finish up seasons one and two just to stay on top of everything that is current, and we hope you will join us for all of that stuff. Please support your local libraries and the written word, raise better boys, and until next time we are Rich.

Speaker 4: 2:12:08

Till we die.

Speaker 3: 2:12:11

Bring an eighth fish and fuck everything up.

Speaker 2: 2:12:14

That's it. That is it. I hope, I hope. Why don't you?

Speaker 4: 2:12:16

do this to me.

Speaker 2: 2:12:17

Yeah, all right, thanks everybody. I love you, is it? I hope, I hope. Why don't you do this to me? Yeah, all right, thanks everybody. I love you dude, let it, let it rip, oh softie.