Karen Hertz Holidaily Brewing Gluten Free Beer

📢I talk🎙️with Karen Hertz 🎇👏 Chief Brewista and Founder at Holidaily Brewing Company;🍺100% gluten-free and the only certified 🍻  women-owned 👩 brewery in the US, distributed in Colorado, Arizona, Kansas, Missouri, Wyoming, Texas, and California. It is currently the largest gluten-free brewery. 🍻 😋 

 As a two-time cancer survivor, she had to give up many foods but she wasn’t ready to give up beer. 😋 Since nothing in the market hit her tastebuds😋  she opened her brewery 🍺 in February 2016.  She was the 5th gluten-free brewery to open its doors.

In their Golden, CO location, the brewery has food trucks and at the Denver Tech Center, they share space with Just Be Kitchen which servers gluten-free items and beyond.

We tasted 4 beers 🍺on the podcast.

1) Favorite Blond Ale
2) Riva Stout
3) Fat Randy IPA (the name comes from Randy's Wipeout at Jackson Hole🎿)
4) Big Henry Hazy IPA

Resources
Craft Brewers Conference
Pink Boots Society - started by  Terry Ferindorf
WBENC - Women's Business Enterprise National Council
Atomic Habits by James Clear
Traction EOS System (how you review people) Feeling Organized and Running your business

Website   Online store   Twitter   Instagram   Facebook   LinkedIn   YouTube

#Beer #GlutenFree #fnbInnovation

Articles
USA Today
colorado biz
The Denver Post (24 Medals at World Bee

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Host Jessie Ott's Profile on LinkedIn

Transcript

00:00:00:20 - 00:00:27:21
Jessie
Welcome to Thursday, Thursdays at 3 p.m. Eastern Standard Time. My name is Jessie, the host of this podcast, which is all about beverage innovation. I talk with innovation pioneers from agriculture to glass. Thank you for listening and be sure to subscribe to be notified of all new episodes. Hello everybody, and welcome. I am Jessy and I have Karen Hertz here from Hollywood Daily Brewing Company.

00:00:27:23 - 00:00:31:17
Jessie
I love that name. So, Karen, where are you calling in from?

00:00:31:19 - 00:00:46:02
Karen
Thank you. Yeah, I'm calling from Golden, Colorado. We have a tap room. We have two tap rooms in Colorado and a production brewery here, but we distribute in seven states throughout the southwestern U.S. But I'm in our.

00:00:46:02 - 00:00:52:18
Jessie
Hopefully the most fires going on. I, I think there's a bunch of snow being and you guys.

00:00:52:20 - 00:00:57:18
Karen
Yes. Yeah. It's been a little snowy, but that's extended to December.

00:00:57:18 - 00:00:58:22
Jessie
So it is.

00:00:59:00 - 00:01:05:15
Karen
We can handle it. Yeah, exactly. We can do it. That's how we have beer skiing.

00:01:05:15 - 00:01:09:11
Jessie
Makes all the pain go away. Do you ski?

00:01:09:12 - 00:01:31:18
Karen
Exactly. Yes, I do. Yeah, I, I try and get up most weekends. Really? In January, sometimes February. I have kids that interfere with that a little bit. But we mostly ski Keystone in Vail in our family. And I'm a native of Colorado of skiing since I was little but love it.

00:01:31:20 - 00:01:35:10
Jessie
that's awesome. Do you do use to skis or do you slalom?

00:01:35:10 - 00:01:51:04
Karen
Yes, I used to skis. Yes, to alpine skis. Okay. We have all kinds of ski members in our family, snowboarders, telemarketers, Alpine skiers. I'm in the Alpine ski party. Nice. Yeah.

00:01:51:05 - 00:02:05:13
Jessie
So I remember back in the day, like when I was, you know, able to do it moguls. I wasn't I was never very good because we never we never went, you know, we didn't go enough being in Iowa, but I always thought those would be really fun to get a little air time.

00:02:05:15 - 00:02:15:16
Karen
Yeah, it's very fun. But now, like, I'm getting old enough that it's the landing isn't quite as fun as it used to be. I don't know. You know?

00:02:15:18 - 00:02:25:05
Jessie
I mean, I like it when you go all day and then so you get used to all the runs and then it gets kind of icy at night, so it gets a little faster. And you're like, Yeah, I'm ready.

00:02:25:07 - 00:02:26:03
Karen
You know.

00:02:26:05 - 00:02:27:23
Jessie
You will be fine.

00:02:28:01 - 00:02:33:12
Karen
Now you're a daredevil. You might need to go East Coast. East Coast is like, icy and fast.

00:02:33:14 - 00:02:34:18
Jessie
No, just it is.

00:02:34:19 - 00:02:38:15
Karen
More like powder. Yeah, yeah.

00:02:38:17 - 00:02:39:20
Jessie
Yeah. I'm a wimp.

00:02:39:20 - 00:02:41:10
Karen
We got to get you racing.

00:02:41:12 - 00:02:46:21
Jessie
Yeah, it was. Well, it was fun then. I mean, I haven't been skiing in years, but I'd like to.

00:02:46:23 - 00:02:49:02
Karen
I'd like. Come on, you. You let me know.

00:02:49:04 - 00:02:51:03
Jessie
Okay? I will. I will.

00:02:51:05 - 00:02:51:20
Karen
Yeah.

00:02:51:22 - 00:02:54:18
Jessie
I'll have you hold me down.

00:02:54:18 - 00:03:09:23
Karen
The blues. I can. I can provide some tips and tricks. Yeah. Golden location, is it? We're about an hour away from Summit County, which is Keystone in Breckenridge and Copper and some of those bigger resorts. So it's not too far.

00:03:10:00 - 00:03:12:17
Jessie
that's awesome. Beautiful part of the state, I'm sure.

00:03:12:19 - 00:03:21:15
Karen
Yeah. Yeah, it's awesome. We get people all the time headed up to the mountains on Friday, picking up beer for the weekends. Yeah, it's a little location. Yeah.

00:03:21:21 - 00:03:44:06
Jessie
We took my niece up there and looked at a few colleges. We drove from New Mexico all the way up, you know, And I was really surprised she didn't go because, I mean, the week as a student up there, you get all kinds of discounts. You can go skiing every weekend and I'm sure drink clubs. And I was like, if I could if I could only do it over.

00:03:44:08 - 00:03:51:14
Karen
Having to do over. I know. Yeah, people love it. And a lot of people that move stay. So there's a reason. Yeah, yeah.

00:03:51:16 - 00:03:54:05
Jessie
Yeah, absolutely. 100%.

00:03:54:07 - 00:03:54:13
Karen
Yeah.

00:03:54:14 - 00:04:18:22
Jessie
So, Karen so let's jump right in to what you're doing. I, I, I, as I mentioned to the audience, we're changing things up slightly just so we can make sure that if you only have 20, 30 minutes, you can get the, the, you know, the meat and potatoes of the of the actual interview that we're trying to get to in terms of the brand and what Karen's up to now with her brewery and her different beers.

00:04:18:22 - 00:04:31:19
Jessie
So we want to make sure that, you know, we kind of get to that first. So. So you want to talk a little bit about your brewery and then maybe we can get into a tasting. I'm super excited. They're all gluten free.

00:04:31:21 - 00:04:32:20
Karen
Ooh, yeah.

00:04:32:22 - 00:04:39:07
Jessie
And they're nice and cold and yeah, we have four different types, so I'm super excited.

00:04:39:09 - 00:05:07:05
Karen
Awesome. Thanks. Yeah. So holiday Brewing Company, we currently I had mentioned about two taprooms and distribution. We have three year round beers that we distribute and then a seasonal that we rotate every season. You had mentioned everything is entirely gluten free, so there's over 9500 craft breweries in the US. 17 are dedicated gluten free, meaning what they all they make is gluten free beer.

00:05:07:07 - 00:05:09:04
Karen
Wow. And of the seven.

00:05:09:06 - 00:05:09:16
Jessie
That many.

00:05:09:16 - 00:05:39:17
Karen
See at 17, I know one of the 17. We're the largest in the country. Only two are are certified gluten free, which we are. So we go through really the process of getting certified gluten free. We you know, there's testing and training requirements for us. We get audited every year, but it helps me sleep at night just to be sure we're doing it all correctly and getting a product out that everyone can be safe drinking.

00:05:39:19 - 00:06:02:04
Karen
And then we are also the only woman owned certified brewery in the country. So of the 9500 were the only women owned certified brewery. And what that means is you probably seen on other products that it says like women owned, there's a certain logo to it. So what I have to do, I'm I'm, you know, a member of this group called We Bank.

00:06:02:06 - 00:06:21:07
Karen
We eat and see and they certify us and you have to prove that over 51% of your company is owned by women. So we do that and we get to put that logo on our cans. And it's just something I'm really proud of. And yeah, a really unique differentiator for us.

00:06:21:09 - 00:06:25:12
Jessie
Yeah, for sure. Yeah. Congratulations. That's amazing. That's awesome.

00:06:25:15 - 00:06:26:03
Karen
Yeah.

00:06:26:05 - 00:06:28:13
Jessie
Thanks to the YouTube audience here.

00:06:28:14 - 00:06:48:10
Karen
Oops. yeah. The. This little guy. Okay, that that one. Yeah. And then there's, like, gluten free certification on the can as well. On the other side of the label. There you go. Yeah. There you go. Yeah, that guy. So gluten free shoppers will be looking for that logo. A lot of, you know, celiac and really sensitive shoppers will be looking for that.

00:06:48:10 - 00:06:53:02
Karen
And yeah, for sure, we go through the hoops to make it happen. So.

00:06:53:04 - 00:06:56:09
Jessie
So now are you celiac or.

00:06:56:11 - 00:07:22:15
Karen
Yeah, no, I'm not celiac. Yes. Good question. So I'm a two time cancer survivor. I had melanoma as well as thyroid cancer. Okay. And an autoimmune thyroid disease. And I had surgery and radiation treatments for both. But actually skin issues and thyroid issues are highly related to gluten intolerance and gluten sensitivity. And I have a kid that has gluten sensitivity as well.

00:07:22:17 - 00:07:27:01
Karen
So they had suggested I cut gluten out of my diet. I had known that, yeah, there's.

00:07:27:01 - 00:07:29:20
Jessie
There one that there's a relationship.

00:07:29:22 - 00:08:03:02
Karen
Yeah. Yes, there is. Yeah. So yeah, if you look up like thyroid issues and gluten, they're definitely finding there's ties in there and skin as well. Eczema, all the way. I mean, I had melanoma but I had, you know, kind of double whammy in terms of things that are related or could be related to gluten sensitivity. And so I did gluten now of my diet and then a whole bunch other things cleared up.

00:08:03:02 - 00:08:28:17
Karen
You know, I did have I you know, that cleared up I had seasonal allergies. Those cleared up. So I probably had it a lot longer than I was aware of. Yeah. But yeah. And then opened Holiday daily in February of 2016 and I felt like I could replace some gluten. I don't miss gluten. This items with other gluten free options or cut it out, but there was no really good gluten free beer.

00:08:28:21 - 00:09:00:12
Karen
And I was actually working in the industry. I worked at Coors for about ten years here in Golden Oak, and it just the beers that were out there just wasn't, you know, that's like craft beer was booming and I couldn't enjoy what all my friends were enjoying and after skiing, I couldn't have an apres ski beer. And so I was just hoping there might be other people out there that just wanted to have a beer and, you know, go to a tailgate party and have beer, not have to have, you know, vodka or whatever.

00:09:00:15 - 00:09:02:01
Karen
Right.

00:09:02:03 - 00:09:02:19
Jessie
I missed beer.

00:09:02:19 - 00:09:04:22
Karen
To let you read.

00:09:05:00 - 00:09:14:13
Jessie
I missed beer. I've just completely cut out beer for you. Yeah, pretty much. Totally. There's a few options, but, Yeah, you know, it's just.

00:09:14:15 - 00:09:37:15
Karen
Yeah, yeah, it's. And I feel like the quality isn't great. And for me, there was this a lot of research into ingredients. Like, why weren't these gluten free beers tasting this good and there, there is a kind of a branch of gluten free beers called gluten reduced beers. And I don't know if you've seen any of those, but those beers are brewed with barley and wheat, so they do have gluten in them.

00:09:37:17 - 00:10:00:11
Karen
An enzyme gets dropped in and it cuts the gluten protein into pieces, but it's actually still in the beer. So I can't I'm too sensitive to drink gluten reduced beers. And the FDA says they can't be labeled as gluten free. So you'd see them out there labeled on a shelf as, like, crafted to remove gluten. They're crafted to reduce gluten.

00:10:00:13 - 00:10:28:01
Karen
And those are those beers. And I couldn't drink those either. So I needed to find ingredients to make it entirely gluten free and taste awesome. Yeah. And so a lot of beers at the time, the gluten free beers were replacing grain, replacing the barley and wheat with sirup like sorghum sirup or rice sirup. And so if you've had a gluten free beer and you're like a kind of taste like cider, it's just sweeter.

00:10:28:01 - 00:10:49:00
Karen
There's like a weird taste to it. That's because they're using that ingredient rather than real grain. And what I did is I went and found a company that actually malts and roast all gluten free grains so that people like me can brew with that rice. And it's actually another woman owned company here in Colorado. It's called Grouse Smokehouse.

00:10:49:02 - 00:11:16:06
Karen
And we make all of our beers with a combination of millet and buckwheat. Okay. So the grains, there's still grain in the beer. It's just gluten free grains. And then I think, you know, as you get to taste down you I'm excited about you'll see like that it just makes a big difference. They actually taste like great craft beer rather than like good enough for gluten free or not good at all for gluten free.

00:11:16:08 - 00:11:19:07
Jessie
So now, did you brew beer at cause then?

00:11:19:09 - 00:11:46:20
Karen
No, I mostly worked in distribution at Coors, so I really felt like I knew the distribution side of the business, but I also knew I wasn't going to be the head brewer. I did learn how to homebrew a little just to be dangerous and drive my brewers crazy, but I was not going to be the brewer in. And part of that process was finding someone we opened in February of 2016.

00:11:46:20 - 00:12:08:07
Karen
So, you know, eight years ago and finding a brewer just willing to do gluten free. And I came across a guy that worked in the business for 25 years. He'd brewed four bowls. He brewed for Breckenridge out here, tons of experience brewing, and was willing to take on the challenge for gluten free beer. So that's great. That worked out amazing.

00:12:08:07 - 00:12:21:13
Karen
And he really took the level of quality of the liquor that we were making to beyond what I was hoping. And we've continued that trend and just really focus on making a great quality gluten free beer.

00:12:21:15 - 00:12:28:11
Jessie
That's awesome. So were there any were you so you were you the first gluten free brewery back in 20? We were.

00:12:28:13 - 00:12:29:09
Karen
With You.

00:12:29:10 - 00:12:31:20
Jessie
Were the fifth. Okay.

00:12:31:22 - 00:12:52:04
Karen
Yeah. And you know, when I say, like commercial gluten free breweries, it means they have a commercial license to brew beer. But some are very small. Some are, you know, small taproom that are open a couple of days a week. Some are one, one is a they have like a drive thru and you can purchase bottles once a week.

00:12:52:04 - 00:13:08:06
Karen
That type you. Yeah. All the way up to us. Yeah. All the way up to our size where you know we're in seven states, we have two taprooms and but we are the largest in the country so hoping to keep growing for sure.

00:13:08:08 - 00:13:12:18
Jessie
Yeah. Now do you serve food in their taprooms or are they just beer?

00:13:12:20 - 00:13:37:21
Karen
Yeah. Yeah. So we have in Golden in our golden location, we have food trucks that come and they are entirely gluten free. And then we share a space with a restaurant in the Denver Tech Center. And that restaurant is gluten free as well, Entirely gluten free. The restaurant's name is Just be Kitchen. And they're very focused on really all food allergies.

00:13:37:21 - 00:13:47:15
Karen
And so they're a great partner in that space for us. You can buy beer from all the daily and then food from just the kitchen and be in like gluten free heaven.

00:13:47:17 - 00:13:49:05
Jessie
Yeah, I'm ready and ready to go.

00:13:49:06 - 00:13:54:14
Karen
I know you got Now you have another reason to come out eating, drinking and skiing. We got it. We got you.

00:13:54:15 - 00:14:00:04
Jessie
Did did do all the fun fried stuff that we never get to eat, like fried pickle and onion rings and.

00:14:00:06 - 00:14:09:01
Karen
gosh, yeah. Well, that actually happens. Yes. Yes. Like fish and chips and fried pickles. Like, yeah, they can come up with all that good stuff.

00:14:09:01 - 00:14:10:13
Jessie
So I'm ready.

00:14:10:15 - 00:14:16:06
Karen
I mean, I know it's crazy. I know it. Yeah, it's.

00:14:16:06 - 00:14:22:01
Jessie
Awesome. I'm so excited. That is so cool. So you want to start tasting some of the beers?

00:14:22:01 - 00:14:25:04
Karen
Yeah. Yeah. Let's start. Let's walk you through a few.

00:14:25:07 - 00:14:27:03
Jessie
Okay.

00:14:27:05 - 00:14:52:13
Karen
All right, let's start with that one. So that's favorite blond. A cool story about that label. My grandpa called me his favorite blond, and he was an eye doctor. So it's an eye chart. Like that Logo is an eye chart? Yeah. After him calling me his favorite blond, But this is our biggest selling beer and particularly in distribution.

00:14:52:15 - 00:15:16:18
Karen
But this is. This is our flagship and our front runner. It's a really approachable beer. It's 5%. Cheers. Cheers. 5%, five, 5%. You know, there is some hop character, just real mild, citrusy. Yeah, Just a light, crisp, super refreshing beer.

00:15:16:20 - 00:15:19:12
Jessie
Got the nice from it.

00:15:19:14 - 00:15:27:06
Karen
It is. You know, I mean, you'll definitely smell a little bit of hops, but nothing overwhelming. Yeah, right.

00:15:27:07 - 00:15:28:13
Jessie
And crisp.

00:15:28:15 - 00:15:49:22
Karen
Yeah. Exact. I wanted to put some hop character in there because forever we've had gluten free beers where we were like, it's man, it's bland. So there's enough in there. Yeah, for sure. Let you realize it's a craft beer, but not overwhelming because so many people like you are trying it again for the first time, or maybe for the first time ever.

00:15:50:00 - 00:15:52:17
Karen
So every single beer you'll find is very approachable.

00:15:52:20 - 00:15:54:08
Jessie
Yeah, that's really good.

00:15:54:10 - 00:15:57:15
Karen
It's like, I mean.

00:15:57:17 - 00:16:03:12
Jessie
Yeah, you can't have one sip. It makes you me. You're like, we need some more of that.

00:16:03:12 - 00:16:04:14
Karen
It is.

00:16:04:16 - 00:16:17:20
Jessie
But that's like that little hoppy flavor. It's not overbearing sound or powerful. It's real light, refreshing, very easy to drink. I'm surprised it's 5% is it doesn't feel like a heavy beer or something that. Yeah, yeah.

00:16:18:00 - 00:16:19:12
Karen
You know, high alcohol.

00:16:19:12 - 00:16:21:20
Jessie
Another 5% or super high or anything.

00:16:21:22 - 00:16:34:03
Karen
Right. Yeah. Yeah. Just nice and smooth then. Yeah. Me can see why it's our biggest seller because people can have multiple versus just one of, you know, one some of our bigger beers.

00:16:34:03 - 00:16:45:14
Jessie
So now is do you just love that. Do you have these that we're chasing cans right now but for the flagship do you have that in kegs so that restaurants could bring them in and whatnot.

00:16:45:14 - 00:17:07:09
Karen
Yeah, Yeah. So we do yeah, we have, we offer them in kegs as well. So they're, Yeah. Restaurants and we also do our beer sells really well and breweries out here. So we're in about 82 different taprooms in Colorado because they want to have a gluten free option. Yeah, but they don't want to deal with brewing gluten free beer.

00:17:07:11 - 00:17:14:14
Karen
No, they should have like, period, which is really, really cool. And a lot of those guys carry us on tap as well.

00:17:14:16 - 00:17:26:16
Jessie
Yeah. that's great. Okay, so are all of all three or flagships brands and all they all have? okay. And how do you buy it as a consumer?

00:17:26:18 - 00:17:53:01
Karen
Well, so as far as like our packaged beer, we're in a lot of any major liquor store in. So the seven states that let me I can tell you where those are, but it's Colorado, Wyoming, Kansas, Missouri, Texas, Arizona and California are seven states as of right now. And so our sales are very focused on major, you know, liquor outlets at any of those places.

00:17:53:02 - 00:18:21:21
Karen
Okay. And we're getting in more and more chains. So, you know, total wines, Whole foods, sprouts, some Krogers, Walmart, so really that's, you know, that's the best place to purchase us. You know, our taprooms here and then lots of bars, restaurants around here, a really cool niche. We've gotten into a couple. One is stadiums so perfect, you want to have a beer at a football games?

00:18:21:21 - 00:18:22:04
Karen
That would.

00:18:22:04 - 00:18:23:19
Jessie
Be so awesome for someone.

00:18:23:19 - 00:18:45:02
Karen
Like I know, right? So yeah, Rockies field, Coors Field here or the you know, our avalanche and nuggets are both really awesome. The Denver Nuggets basketball So you can go there and have a holiday as well. Have a beer at a basketball game or a baseball game. So awesome. I love that. That's been really cool. And we're expanding that to other cities as well.

00:18:45:04 - 00:19:14:00
Karen
And then something you need to know about, there's a company called the Celiac Cruise, and they go out and rent cruise ships and make them entirely gluten free. And we are my wife just loves practice. Yes. So we're the official beer of the celiac cruise. I would say husband. That's fine. He's good. So like I've been to European cruises on it to help post and I've been they go to Alaska, the Caribbean.

00:19:14:02 - 00:19:17:05
Karen
So that's just global exposure for us.

00:19:17:09 - 00:19:24:11
Jessie
Yeah, no kidding. How do you get connected with that? That's awesome. I guess we're sure. Which is the through the whole.

00:19:24:13 - 00:19:47:08
Karen
Yes. And just people just get to go on vacation and not worry about it. Yeah. So cool to see that level of appreciation and the like when you were saying like, is there fried food and like beer and all of that? Like we get full blown tears in the taproom. Like, thank you so much. You know, I get hugs and tears and it's just about so much more than beer.

00:19:47:08 - 00:19:58:23
Karen
It's just like that freedom that a lot of people take for granted, that you can have whatever you want, wherever you want it. And this group of people just really they're so appreciative. So it's that's a highlight for sure.

00:19:59:00 - 00:20:05:14
Jessie
Yeah. Well, and you have a more obviously you have a market for it. There's people out there that really need that.

00:20:05:15 - 00:20:27:16
Karen
Definitely. Well, you know, it is growing to every day. You hear of now Paleo, keto, vegan, gluten free are all gluten free diets. And when you know when you think gluten free beer, we want people to think call the daily And that's really what we're we're aiming to achieve is to be the obvious choice for gluten free beer.

00:20:27:18 - 00:20:31:00
Jessie
Love it You try number two.

00:20:31:02 - 00:20:54:10
Karen
Let's do it. That's our Riva Stout. So this one's our seasonal. It just came out maybe a week ago. If you haven't had a stout in a long time, you're going to love this. It's rich. It's chocolaty coffee. Just a really easy drink in, again, approachable, so very dark.

00:20:54:10 - 00:20:55:03
Jessie
Really dark and.

00:20:55:03 - 00:20:55:18
Karen
Jazzy.

00:20:55:21 - 00:20:58:00
Jessie
Great foam at the top.

00:20:58:02 - 00:20:58:21
Karen
Yes.

00:20:59:00 - 00:21:02:00
Jessie
It's it looks and acts like a real beer.

00:21:02:02 - 00:21:06:05
Karen
And you really know. I know.

00:21:06:07 - 00:21:09:06
Jessie
Yes. It smells great. Yeah, there's definitely chocolate.

00:21:09:08 - 00:21:22:03
Karen
I'm excited for you to try. Yeah. I tell everybody, like, this whole company was a bit selfish. Like, I just. I wanted to have a good word. this is great. Yeah, I love that thing.

00:21:22:05 - 00:21:25:23
Jessie
Do you ever taste these against gluten beers and see if people.

00:21:25:23 - 00:21:57:17
Karen
Can see the difference? Yeah. So, yeah. So we've done blind tastings before and people can't tell the difference. We've done that, particularly with blind. But our brewer is not gluten free. So if we say like, okay, make us a stout, she'll go pick like his three favorite stout and then make it to kind of match that too. To match what you know, what he thinks are the most award winning stouts or whatever it is so that he's picking some profiles in there that he can match.

00:21:57:19 - 00:22:14:15
Karen
Okay. Well, that makes that. Yeah. So, I mean, that's really how a lot of our recipes get started. And you know, even some of I've been gluten free long enough that even they'll do a different craft style and I'll be like, It's good. But is this how it like, I don't know if that's how it's supposed to taste because I've never tried it, you know?

00:22:14:17 - 00:22:16:06
Karen
Yeah, well, that's true.

00:22:16:08 - 00:22:19:07
Jessie
Yeah. So that's such a benefit for you to have him. Who?

00:22:19:07 - 00:22:20:15
Karen
Who? yeah.

00:22:20:17 - 00:22:32:23
Jessie
So does your supplier of grains. Does do they get kind of involved then, in helping you match some recipes and kind of fine tune? You know what you're looking for?

00:22:33:01 - 00:23:06:18
Karen
Yeah, I mean, it is a huge partnership, not only in like us initially figuring out how to brew with these grains because there are the process is very, very similar. But there's very there's intricacies that are different, like temperatures and different timing of things. And we have to use some different enzymes early to help like get as much sugar out of this grain as we can because it's just not as efficient as barley and wheat.

00:23:06:19 - 00:23:28:05
Karen
So I mean, 1,000% of total partnership all the way up to like, hey, we, we want to do a pumpkin beer, yummy. Think we need a caramel roast that looks like this and she can help work on that. Or, you know, she may say, well you know, if I can add three new rows, what what kind of beers are you guys thinking about?

00:23:28:07 - 00:23:53:01
Karen
So we work on all of that together all the way up to, hey, here's how much we think we're going to grow this year. Can you make sure you have enough grains so we work really close together? Yeah, she's super important. Yeah, she is integral. I think so many people think about brewing as really that process that we do and brewers like technical brewers are like, No, no, no, no.

00:23:53:01 - 00:24:15:11
Karen
It starts like in the field with the farmers, especially with our gluten free certification. So like none of that equipment can be cross contaminated that they're farming with all the way to the truck that ships it to her, that she utilizes it, you know, all the equipment she's using. And then the different degree of malting and malting can definitely impact the flavor of your beer.

00:24:15:13 - 00:24:25:10
Karen
So, you know, the real technical brewers are like, it's way longer than what we do and that that grain pieces hugely important.

00:24:25:12 - 00:24:35:10
Jessie
Yeah yeah you're right it has a supply chain effect on from from the ground from the ground a glass literally. So yeah you got to really protect that.

00:24:35:10 - 00:24:37:01
Karen
That's, that's Yeah.

00:24:37:03 - 00:24:56:17
Jessie
Yeah. That would be super challenging I would think. But I guess there's probably farmers that just know it, They know what they're doing and they've got a system down and, and you know, I don't know how that works with fields being is in so close to another field or anything like that. But they've obviously figured it out.

00:24:56:19 - 00:25:17:18
Karen
Yes. Yes. Yeah. And you know, a lot of it to your point and to their fields right next to each other and or equipment that they use. So they can't go like harvest a wheat field and then harvest a millet field and have it be safe. So really their it's got to be dedicated to the gluten free grains.

00:25:17:19 - 00:25:20:20
Jessie
Wow. That's a lot of, that's a lot.

00:25:20:22 - 00:25:22:01
Karen
But it's it's a lot.

00:25:22:03 - 00:25:26:11
Jessie
There's people that yeah that will do it for people like us that can enjoy it.

00:25:26:13 - 00:25:29:11
Karen
Yeah exactly exactly.

00:25:29:12 - 00:25:32:05
Jessie
Should we try beer number three?

00:25:32:07 - 00:26:06:05
Karen
Yes, beer number three is our Fat Randy's IPA. This is one of my very favorite beers. We make it is boozy. Boozy. So this is a 7% IPA. It's a West Coast IPA. And what I love about this beer is the balance of it. You can thank you. That multi-color that malt flavor, it balances so well with the hops that we use.

00:26:06:07 - 00:26:20:14
Karen
So it is you know, this one is definitely more hoppy than yeah, there's fat Randy. I'll I'll explain that story too. It's happier than our blond for sure. But I just I think it's just an awesome, balanced spirit that.

00:26:20:14 - 00:26:23:04
Jessie
Randy lot more foam beers.

00:26:23:06 - 00:26:38:05
Karen
Yeah. And that's another thing with gluten free beer like you don't see that it's you don't get your hand on any gluten free beer. Yeah. So even if people come to me and they're like, I don't really like IPAs. A lot of people like this IPA.

00:26:38:10 - 00:26:55:00
Jessie
I'm not a IPA fan, but yes, this is very good. This is very smooth. Yeah, it's not over Hoppy like a lot of IPAs are, right? It's just kind of got that, that, that hint to say I'm an IPA. Yeah. But yeah, I would totally drink this.

00:26:55:02 - 00:27:15:20
Karen
Good. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. I just again, they're all approachable. We know our consumer, they haven't had a beer in a while, but it's, you know, we talked a little bit about the consumer group. It's reaching out now to people who have had beer before, but now they're cutting gluten out. So we want to have beers really for that.

00:27:15:21 - 00:27:36:01
Karen
You know, that highly sensitive who hasn't in a while, but also now we've got to start making beers that are people went from Bell's or New Belgium or whatever to a gluten free diet they still are like, okay, this is still a really good craft beer. Yeah. And I feel like we've accomplished both of those for for the consumers that are out there.

00:27:36:03 - 00:27:46:17
Jessie
Yeah, No, really, you have I would say if, if you were to ask me the two favorite beer styles is Kölsch and Belgian beer. I love.

00:27:46:19 - 00:28:10:23
Karen
Belgian beers. So we have a our summer seasonal is bucket Belgian, so it's a bit stale beer. You know, I spent my days at Coors, so I wanted a blue moon gluten free and that's really what we dialed in on the whip. So all in the summer, I'll have to send you a wet just. Yeah. So seasonal.

00:28:11:01 - 00:28:12:06
Jessie
is that a seasonal? Okay.

00:28:12:07 - 00:28:28:07
Karen
Yeah, yeah, yeah. That one's seasonal. So the Riva Stout, which is what you had previous, will be wet in like spring and summer. And then it's our pumpkin. They'll actually water's functional and then it spits out again. So it just rotates throughout. Right.

00:28:28:09 - 00:28:30:21
Jessie
So you've got a regular crew.

00:28:30:23 - 00:28:59:17
Karen
Yeah. Flavor. You do. Yes. Yeah. Nice. And then the story on the fat Randy can Fat Randy is my husband's best friend since they were little. He is not fat at all. But he did take a good fall in Jackson Hole that you can look up on YouTube called Randy Wipe out Jackson Hole and you'll see why he's upside down on skis on the fat Randy can so I would encourage everyone will watch that video I.

00:28:59:17 - 00:29:02:14
Jessie
Will if I can I'll try to put it up on the and.

00:29:02:19 - 00:29:03:18
Karen
Yeah.

00:29:03:20 - 00:29:07:04
Jessie
I'll try to play it a little bit on our podcast.

00:29:07:06 - 00:29:09:01
Karen
To love it.

00:29:09:03 - 00:29:10:15
Jessie
No promises.

00:29:10:17 - 00:29:19:13
Karen
Okay. All right. Randy probably would be happy if it didn't make the well.

00:29:19:13 - 00:29:22:14
Jessie
Maybe you, the people that are listening to the podcast won't cross paths.

00:29:22:15 - 00:29:33:10
Karen
With Randy, right? Yeah, But he comes around the taproom every once in a while. And good fun. Fun to have a funny story about him, for sure. Yeah, well, what.

00:29:33:10 - 00:29:39:06
Jessie
An honor to be named after one of your flagship. One of three beers. That's pretty incredible.

00:29:39:08 - 00:29:48:08
Karen
Yeah, he's an all right guy. Sounds like it. Yeah. Nice. All right, you got one more to try.

00:29:48:08 - 00:29:52:13
Jessie
One more? Yes, we've got the big Henry.

00:29:52:17 - 00:30:18:17
Karen
Henry Hazy IPA. So Big Henry is the fish you can never catch. Like the trophy. Trophy fish that jumps in front of you next to your bobber. And if we caught it, we caught a hazy IPA that's gluten free. This one is our happiest beer for sure. So let's see how you like this one. Has really awesome sense of pineapple.

00:30:18:18 - 00:30:24:09
Karen
More tropical hops than fat Randy. Yeah, good. A lighter And he's dead.

00:30:24:10 - 00:30:27:03
Jessie
Certainly. It looks like pineapple.

00:30:27:05 - 00:30:51:06
Karen
Yeah, Yeah. Lighter hazier color. So we've won, you know, the super Bowl of beers, the great American Beer Fest. And we've won three medals at that previous. And this beer. One, two, one, one, one. One of the medals for us. So this is one of our award winning beers. Big Henry Hazy IPA.

00:30:51:08 - 00:30:54:23
Jessie
Wow, that's really yummy. Again, not over.

00:30:54:23 - 00:31:00:05
Karen
Not a night here, girl. Yeah. No. Yeah. Good. Because think a lot of.

00:31:00:05 - 00:31:21:16
Jessie
Times they just overdo the beer and hops and it's just not a favorite or I like it more clean and crisp and balance. But these are all really well-balanced. This is is a it does. It is an IPA you can tell by the style, but at the same time it's clean and refreshing and it's like you say, you've got those tropical notes to it, which is totally different.

00:31:21:18 - 00:31:27:05
Jessie
I mean, not that I've shopped around IPAs or drank a bunch of them or anything, but this is certainly a unique one.

00:31:27:05 - 00:31:40:09
Karen
And yeah, award winning, award winning. There you have it. Yes. So that one is our hazy and definitely lots of hops in that guy.

00:31:40:11 - 00:31:44:00
Jessie
Yeah. But they're so well balanced it doesn't seem like it.

00:31:44:02 - 00:32:13:04
Karen
So yeah it's Yeah. Yes, yes I like I said, none of these beers are going to be so bitter or so, you know, off the wall. We really want to just make these approachable styles, approachable brands that everybody can enjoy and people can enjoy together, you know, like you said. So then it's hard to bring guests places because you're like, is the food not going to be as good or they won't be as satisfied?

00:32:13:04 - 00:32:22:15
Karen
And really the goal is everyone can come to Holiday li or drink a holiday and not feel like they're sacrificing. It's right here. You know.

00:32:22:17 - 00:32:24:11
Jessie
You won't feel bad when you leave.

00:32:24:13 - 00:32:48:02
Karen
And yeah, you may even feel a little bit better. So yes, and we do get weird, like just weird feedback, obviously know why we did it, but like, I do think I'm a little less hung over or I'm less bloated for sure. You know, I don't know. People get like swollen fingers or whatever, and that doesn't tend to happen.

00:32:48:04 - 00:32:56:08
Karen
So just some weird side effects that we get feedback on outside of celiac people saying thank you for making beer.

00:32:56:10 - 00:32:58:10
Jessie
Yeah, exactly. Making really good. You know.

00:32:58:11 - 00:32:59:19
Karen
You're.

00:32:59:21 - 00:33:01:17
Jessie
Not just beer. Really good beer.

00:33:01:23 - 00:33:03:23
Karen
Yeah, exactly.

00:33:04:01 - 00:33:04:12
Jessie
it's yummy.

00:33:04:12 - 00:33:07:08
Karen
So we need to plan your trip to Colorado, I think, Jesse.

00:33:07:08 - 00:33:21:10
Jessie
I think so. I think there needs to be a plan. We have some friends that have a place up there, and, yeah, you know, we'd like to at some point, ultimately, you know, but it has to be in the summertime.

00:33:21:12 - 00:33:26:03
Karen
Fair enough. Fair enough. But we're not really calling you. Yeah, well.

00:33:26:03 - 00:33:32:12
Jessie
I would like to do a ski trip, so there's. Yeah. And I've never skied in Colorado.

00:33:32:14 - 00:33:34:14
Karen
So I better come give it a try.

00:33:34:15 - 00:33:36:11
Jessie
You have to do it or not.

00:33:36:13 - 00:33:37:19
Karen
That's right.

00:33:37:21 - 00:33:47:02
Jessie
Well, our friends, my best friend, her husband and her kids, they're like 13 and ten or 11 now, but.

00:33:47:04 - 00:33:47:10
Karen
We're.

00:33:47:10 - 00:34:02:00
Jessie
Going to Puerto Rico over right after Christmas. And they since they have so much time afterwards, they were going to come and stay a few days. But they're like, now we're going to we're going somewhere skiing. I don't know. They try to do a ski trip every year.

00:34:02:02 - 00:34:02:17
Karen
Yeah.

00:34:02:19 - 00:34:05:08
Jessie
So far we haven't kind of been able to make it with them.

00:34:05:08 - 00:34:09:19
Karen
But one these you got out voted, you got topped by skiing.

00:34:09:19 - 00:34:15:06
Jessie
I guess we did fireworks. Not so much skiing. Yes.

00:34:15:08 - 00:34:22:04
Karen
And then yeah, Puerto Rico sounds pretty good, though, too. So they'll get the best of both worlds.

00:34:22:06 - 00:34:27:01
Jessie
Yeah, sure. They'll get nice and toasty and get some diving in the kids dive.

00:34:27:03 - 00:34:39:18
Karen
in your skis. Yeah. Yes. Perfect. That's the best of all worlds, I say. Yeah. Very good. Yeah, well, we'll have to make a call so I can send you one of those sometime.

00:34:39:19 - 00:34:41:21
Jessie
Yeah, Not ever do. Sorry.

00:34:42:02 - 00:34:43:14
Karen
I was.

00:34:43:15 - 00:34:45:07
Jessie
Implying that.

00:34:45:08 - 00:34:46:09
Karen
No, no.

00:34:46:11 - 00:34:52:22
Jessie
Pulses are so yum and refreshing, and I just. For some reason, I just absolutely. Just love that style. It's just something.

00:34:52:22 - 00:34:53:08
Karen
Else.

00:34:53:13 - 00:35:01:21
Jessie
I we have a German restaurant here, and every once in a while I'll just get a call or sit on the patio or something like that.

00:35:01:21 - 00:35:32:15
Karen
And yeah, I think, you know, really there's trends are showing that a lot of people are drinking more like kölsch, lager style beers, like just lighter ales in general. And that's tough on craft brewers because they take so much longer to make. Okay, you really got the. Yeah. it's about the yeast that you use. So just in, in terms of converting the sugar to alcohol and it all settling out, it just takes longer in the tanks than ales do.

00:35:32:17 - 00:35:53:05
Karen
And so that's why you don't see as many like craft courses out there because you could be making a couple of beers in the time you're making one while it's just sitting in the tank. So interesting. Yeah, that's why there's a ton of those out there. Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah. Yeah.

00:35:53:07 - 00:36:02:16
Jessie
So are we ready to transition? Is there anything else about holiday daily brewing that you want to mention before we kind of jump into your journey and how you got here or.

00:36:02:16 - 00:36:21:11
Karen
No, I think we're good. We can cover it. I mean, our goal really, you know, as I said, is to be the obvious choice for gluten free beer in the country. So, you know, our future really is dependent on growth and we'll grow in the markets that we are. And you'll probably see us add some additional markets in the years ahead.

00:36:21:11 - 00:36:42:15
Karen
And it won't be overnight. It's it's pretty strategic and where we're going and how we're doing it. But we're definitely focused on getting beer out to the people and just making an awesome gluten free beer that everyone can enjoy everywhere, hopefully even. Yeah. Yeah.

00:36:42:21 - 00:36:45:17
Jessie
Can you ship beer from Colorado?

00:36:45:19 - 00:37:08:05
Karen
You cannot, No. Yeah. So this is a state you cannot ship beer from. So anytime we want to distribute in another state, we have to go get license there and get on board with the distributor there and then go through the three tier process in terms of us for a distributor, a distributor to the retailer and then the retailer to the consumer.

00:37:08:05 - 00:37:40:11
Jessie
So have you heard of Lip, Deb know? So I'm curious what the what your what you know, like the beer industry, what they know about it. It's become a a another means of distribution. It's still the three tiered but you kind of control it. So they they are kind of in partnership now with R&D see so if you get enough volume in a certain state, they'll take you on an R&D sees, not a beer distributor.

00:37:40:13 - 00:38:11:07
Jessie
Right. So I doubt that that would be the path. But I'm just curious where that could fit in, because what happens is, is you you go online and you are you set up your beers within the states, you know, that you've registered in, and then you can go and call on accounts to bring in the beer and then you ship it into the warehouse that is in that state, and then it gets distributed out to the restaurants or retailers that that actually want to take that that product on.

00:38:11:07 - 00:38:38:20
Jessie
So if you were on Instagram or if you had relatives or friends that wanted to go and, you know, help you kind of distribute, say, for example, in Florida, you could do that like literally almost overnight. It's that simple. But, you know, with beer, too, with the distribution, it's different than than it's different than spirit. So so I don't know how that would I don't know how that fit in the model, but I'd be curious to see if there is.

00:38:38:22 - 00:39:07:01
Karen
It's definitely look, I mean, all the laws are so different everywhere. And even in Colorado, liquor laws are different. Well, spirits laws are different than beer. Laws are different than wine laws. And it's like having nice if we could streamline this a little bit, but there's so much old, I don't know, power and rules and and so much federal government.

00:39:07:03 - 00:39:36:05
Karen
Yeah, yeah. It's very hard to make changes and yeah you know it's it's an emotional discussion when you when you're sitting in that room. So yeah I mean all the rules are totally different here. We just got well this year we got wine and grocery stores 2019, we got beer in grocery stores. There's still not spirits in grocery stores here, so I just feel like we're behind the times.

00:39:36:07 - 00:39:50:01
Jessie
Yeah, we don't have spirits in grocery in Texas either. Yeah, there's only I don't know how many states have it, but in in Texas, you know, we voted to stop dry counties.

00:39:50:03 - 00:40:01:09
Karen
Yeah, that's still a thing, right? Yeah, I know. It's crazy. And again, just different states, different rules. You got to learn them all and yeah, so.

00:40:01:09 - 00:40:02:03
Jessie
How do we get this.

00:40:02:03 - 00:40:33:06
Karen
Industry shipping thing? Yeah, I kind of feel like long term, it's just with consumer behavior, it's going to have to work itself out because so much of consumer behavior is shopping online now and ordering digitally and getting things delivered and we're going to figure out a way legally and, you know, compliance wise to get in the game. But it's really hard when your hands are tied.

00:40:33:06 - 00:40:46:15
Karen
So just as a whole, craft beer has got to figure out how to make that more accessible if we can, while working with every party, because we don't want to hurt any of our partners either. Right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And.

00:40:46:17 - 00:40:54:09
Jessie
And you wouldn't in this in the case. It's just it, it maybe may not be a great opportunity.

00:40:54:10 - 00:40:55:03
Karen
To check it out.

00:40:55:03 - 00:41:20:16
Jessie
Yeah, but yeah, so be fun to kind of see what that would look like, you know. And if it's not, what, what, what does it need to get there. Right. Because to me, beer being from beer and wine background distribution is a whole lot easier and completely different than beer. You know, you might have you'll have one house and maybe they have five locations in different parts of the state where you have beer.

00:41:20:16 - 00:41:27:02
Jessie
They have 45 different locations around the state. That's that blows my mind.

00:41:27:04 - 00:42:02:17
Karen
Yeah, Yeah. And the territories are very defined, but it's a by road too that don't exist anymore. Like, you know, old Coors family or either Bush family or whoever, you know, on a dirt road was the boundary of the distributor. But that's not a road I like. It's so crazy. It's just geographically chopped up where I do feel like a lot of wine and liquor, like they cover a bunch of territory where, you know, we can have, I don't know, 2 to 8 distributors in one state.

00:42:02:19 - 00:42:05:16
Karen
It's crazy. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:42:05:16 - 00:42:12:15
Jessie
It's almost like, I don't know, I thought of this. It's like the police, right? They can only be in their county.

00:42:12:16 - 00:42:15:01
Karen
Yeah, exactly. They can't pull anybody.

00:42:15:01 - 00:42:19:06
Jessie
Over outside their own county. No. Same with beer.

00:42:19:07 - 00:42:40:21
Karen
Totally true. It's 1,000% sure. And as a matter of fact, I'll get real mad if you are even in their county. So, yeah, they're very territorial. And, Yeah, so it's, it's a complicated distribution process in the beer world, really. Any liquor world. But it feels extra complicated.

00:42:40:23 - 00:42:41:15
Jessie
Yeah, it.

00:42:41:15 - 00:42:44:12
Karen
Is. It is. I'm going to check out LibDem for sure.

00:42:44:14 - 00:43:08:16
Jessie
Yeah, just let me know what I mean. I'm curious what you find out. I don't. I don't know if it's an option. I don't know the laws and rules of all of it, but it could be. Could be an interesting option if you just want to reach out to, you know, you have a relationship with X, Y, and Z in the state, and it might be just a quick entry way to at least you you have your legal in that state, right?

00:43:08:18 - 00:43:29:17
Karen
Yeah. So yeah, you got your license. Yeah. Well, and I, you know, for us we get requests every day all over the country, sometimes all over the world. Can you ship beer to people that just want to have a good free beer, Right. Yeah. For to be able to get some access to market anyway, we can get people beer.

00:43:29:17 - 00:43:37:10
Karen
I mean, that's at the end of the day where I did it would be anything we can do to do more of that would be awesome.

00:43:37:12 - 00:43:43:06
Jessie
So we kind of talked about your career. Did you were you in the industry before you worked at Coors?

00:43:43:08 - 00:44:07:04
Karen
No, no, I, I mean, really, my in my background in starting this crazy, wild ride was I, I have an MBA in entrepreneurship, which really only meant I couldn't pick a track. And I liked writing business plans. I don't know. But I and I was not going to start a company, just I just was what I liked studying and, and it all kind of came together.

00:44:07:04 - 00:44:31:12
Karen
But I was working at Coopers at the time, again, primarily in distribution. So I was getting beer from the big brewery here in Golden to distributors really in the South and central U.S. and then ran into my health issues. And, you know, Colorado's a huge beer state. It's just part of my social life. And I felt like there was no good beer.

00:44:31:12 - 00:44:50:00
Karen
So again, we opened in February of 2016 when we opened and we was me in that brewer we talked about, we were open three days a week with three beers on tap because I just wasn't sure if people would come to a gluten free brewery. And by the end of year one, we were open every day of the week.

00:44:50:00 - 00:45:05:23
Karen
We had ten beers on tap and I was distributing two beers out of the back of my car. Wow. And it's been kind of that growth trajectory since we've grown over 1500 percent since we've opened and how to keep on keeping on.

00:45:05:23 - 00:45:06:20
Jessie
And that's keeping.

00:45:06:20 - 00:45:11:20
Karen
Us in that motion. Yeah. You know, this has been a tough year for craft beer. It's not doing great.

00:45:11:22 - 00:45:13:21
Jessie
You're right.

00:45:13:23 - 00:45:35:16
Karen
But we continue to grow and really find find our crowd, find the people that want to have a beer. And just to you and I talk, you know, like sometimes the people that are gluten free aren't even looking in the beer aisle. So our biggest challenge is educating people on really the difference between gluten free and gluten and why it matters, which we talked about earlier.

00:45:35:16 - 00:45:56:07
Karen
But then also there is an awesome craft beer out there. That's because they're, you know, they might be in the wine aisle or the spirits aisle or maybe the seltzers. And so we want people to know, like, look, one door over there is really a gluten free beer and it's awesome, my promise. So we've got some educating to do.

00:45:56:08 - 00:46:17:07
Jessie
Yeah, I mean, you're right mean gluten free. You know we what's not by choice so most of us I mean but if people choose it that's that's that's fine too. But yeah we don't get a choice of you. We know that we can get those beers out there. Then we. We absolutely want to want our own section. I want to pick right.

00:46:17:07 - 00:46:32:22
Jessie
And I want, you know, we, we want to be it's like being heard. It's like being, you know, understood that, hey, you know, we get we get it. So it's coming. I mean, the gluten free options that are available now is is unbelievable. Really?

00:46:32:23 - 00:46:34:18
Karen
Yeah. Yeah. And the.

00:46:34:20 - 00:46:43:09
Jessie
Flavors better. I can't keep my oatmeal chocolate chip peanut butter cookies in stock here.

00:46:43:11 - 00:46:45:00
Karen
Yes. Yes.

00:46:45:02 - 00:46:48:00
Jessie
You can't tell the difference with cookies and sugar and sugar. So.

00:46:48:00 - 00:47:12:18
Karen
Well, and you find, like, really good options that people even prefer. And for us younger generations, Gen Z, millennials, that the tables are turning where like my generation would be like if I have an item and a gluten free item, I'm going to pick the original item always because I don't know what this is going to taste like.

00:47:12:19 - 00:47:37:01
Karen
And when the table is turned to where 40% of Gen Z and millennials would pick the gluten free item first, like if I could get the same thing, but have it be gluten free, that's better. And so that I mean, that's great for us and for our industry, and it's going to create even more of a demand for quality gluten free products too.

00:47:37:03 - 00:48:03:13
Karen
It's not just good enough anymore. It's like what they're preferring if they have a choice. So that switch is a really big one for us and in a great way where it's, you know, people are more willing to try it than be like, do I have to? Right. So, yes. And when that willingness comes, then we can show, yeah, that's just really good beer.

00:48:03:15 - 00:48:12:15
Jessie
Do you have any mentors or or resources that you've utilized along the way or people that you, you know, want to mention that kind of came.

00:48:12:16 - 00:48:38:13
Karen
man, I yeah, I have had a ton of mentors, really, man. I there's a million I could mention one really great story I could share just on this with you is when I was getting started, I couldn't afford to go to the Craft Brewers conference, but I found a women's group that was having a lunch, like during the Craft Brewers conference.

00:48:38:15 - 00:49:04:12
Karen
You've probably heard of them. They're called the Pink Boots Society. But it's it's a women's brewing group. Yeah. Terry Farren Dorff had started it. I didn't know anybody, but it was, you know, the conference is $600 and lunch was 15 so I could do the 50. So I went into the lunch and just listened to her listen to the story, what the you know, what she was up to and with this group and grabbed your card on the way out.

00:49:04:14 - 00:49:28:13
Karen
And I emailed her. No, I called her like a week later and it was one of those where I was like, I'll just call leave a message because she won't answer. And then I'll just say, I have checked the box. And she answered, and I think I fumbled through some form of a sentence around like, Hey, I want to open a gluten free brewery, and I don't know how to brew and I don't have a recipe.

00:49:28:13 - 00:49:51:13
Karen
What do you think? I mean, that's probably what like fumbled out of my mouth and out of her mouth was That's what you're worried about. And I'm thinking, Yeah, yeah, that's it. But she helped me find consultants that could help me pick out equipment and work on recipe development and help me find a brewer. And wow, you know, she just had a list of people she would refer.

00:49:51:13 - 00:50:14:04
Karen
People like me, too. So, I mean, just huge lesson. A couple of lessons for me in that experience were like, just be brave and ask people for help, which was hard. And I'm glad she had answered because I wouldn't I wouldn't probably have been as brave had she not answered. And then, you know, people ask you for help, help them.

00:50:14:04 - 00:50:41:07
Karen
Like really it was a five minute phone conversation and she sent me an email. But it totally changed my life and maybe has changed the future in terms of gluten free beer, which is so cool. Yeah. So she's out there for sure. I have just a ton of mentors all over. I focus on really surrounding myself with people that are experts in areas that I'm not so.

00:50:41:07 - 00:51:09:00
Karen
I have this team I can really rely on. And then we talked a little bit earlier about We Bank, which is it's the Women's Business Enterprise National Council, but they have been awesome. Their resources are amazing. They help make introductions for me to change. You know, buyers at Target or whatever it may be to help get us exposed to those guys.

00:51:09:01 - 00:51:33:04
Karen
So any women owned business, I would highly recommend looking. We bank and seeing if you qualify, but that could be any women's group. I just there's this surge of like women helping women right now and I really appreciate that. Yeah for sure. And I'd say one other big group for me, something that I got involved in was the Guild, the Colorado Brewers Guild, great networking there.

00:51:33:04 - 00:52:04:17
Karen
They have a ton of resources guilds are fighting for, whether it's, you know, your liquor guild or your or your wine guild like they really are trying to help small companies. Yep. So it wasn't it wasn't just joining the guild, it was getting involved. So I volunteer on a committee and I would say that I would really advise anybody in this business that's a small entrepreneur because that's what they're there for and they're experts at it.

00:52:04:19 - 00:52:08:17
Karen
So those are some of my top couple in my one of my top stories.

00:52:08:22 - 00:52:11:07
Jessie
Those are really good ones.

00:52:11:09 - 00:52:13:01
Karen
Yeah, all good.

00:52:13:03 - 00:52:18:12
Jessie
Any resources that come to mind?

00:52:18:14 - 00:52:42:18
Karen
I don't know. I have. Yeah. Let me think of the book. I'm reading an awesome book right now called Atomic Habits. I would recommend everybody read that book. I got that over Christmas last year. Nigeria. it's so good. I got to listen. I listen to books mostly, but I'm going to double listen to it because I don't want to miss the details, you know?

00:52:42:18 - 00:53:16:17
Karen
Yeah. We also do traction in our company, and I don't know if you've read about traction, but it's a book and it's kind of a system that U.S. where they just help you organize your company, how you review people. It's an awesome book for giving, feeling organized and running your business. Okay. Interest. You know, Hochman is the author and it has made a ton of difference in how I run our business.

00:53:16:19 - 00:53:27:23
Karen
And just I just feel more organized under this, really. It's a system, a process that you follow to run your business. So I would say traction has been a game changer for holiday.

00:53:28:01 - 00:53:32:16
Jessie
Nice. That's really that's awesome. I can't wait to look it up.

00:53:32:18 - 00:53:41:18
Karen
Do you have a favorite resource book plan idea? Anything you've got that you like a lot.

00:53:41:20 - 00:53:44:13
Jessie
And no one's ever asked me that question.

00:53:44:15 - 00:53:47:18
Karen
You turn the tables and turn the table.

00:53:47:19 - 00:53:48:19
Jessie
You mean outside? Are you there?

00:53:48:19 - 00:53:57:00
Karen
Say there's a contest. Yeah, it's probably gotten a lot of suggestions. I didn't know if you had one. That was a fave.

00:53:57:02 - 00:54:03:01
Jessie
Yeah, I. I mean, I don't know. It's too hard. I haven't really sat down and.

00:54:03:01 - 00:54:06:05
Karen
Really thought about it. it's hard to know when.

00:54:06:05 - 00:54:23:06
Jessie
You're building your business. You don't have as much time. You're just trying to get your website done. Then you change places. You got to get your website down and you got to get all the, you know, A, B and C and D through Z all by yourself. It, it, it prevents you from from listening or learning as much.

00:54:23:06 - 00:54:44:02
Jessie
But I guess to point I do get a lot of audio time, like if I'm in the car or going to the gym know I like to listen to the various podcasts either with marketing or with the industry or with to podcasts. So yeah, you know, those are kind of my three.

00:54:44:04 - 00:54:45:05
Karen
Main.

00:54:45:07 - 00:54:58:02
Jessie
Points. And I've been asked what podcasts I like to listen to. I should just post them in and then people are going to, you know, check them out and give me feedback or tell me what they like.

00:54:58:04 - 00:55:01:07
Karen
Yeah, you know. yeah.

00:55:01:09 - 00:55:24:23
Jessie
Because it's just like served up is, is one that I, it's not really a self learning, podcast, but it's an industry podcast. It's, it's done by Julian Bridgett with Southern Glazer's Wine and Spirits. So that's definitely going to be a lot more wine and spirit focus. But they, they touched on women's issues and whatnot. So, you know, that's, that's a good one.

00:55:24:23 - 00:55:34:23
Jessie
They have a lot of fun, fun people on there too, doing, you know, fun brands and whatnot. But, but anyway, going back to you.

00:55:35:01 - 00:55:38:04
Karen
Know.

00:55:38:06 - 00:55:43:05
Jessie
what about any pain points that you've experienced in, in the industry.

00:55:43:07 - 00:56:12:07
Karen
Yeah. I mean probably everyone's has COVID. We did okay through COVID. When I talk about COVID in like in Colorado, especially if you wanted to support a small craft brewery and you wanted an IPA, you have 300 to choose from. But if you want to support the small craft brewery and you have to have a gluten free IPA, you had one brewery to choose from and people came out of the woodwork like they really did support us through that.

00:56:12:07 - 00:56:49:17
Karen
That's great. So we kept growing through the pandemic, which was great pain points for us. AH you're growing at the rate that we have then. It's expensive. Those shiny tanks are not cheap. So yeah, you know, we've we have expanded equipment, expanded buildings. All of that takes investment. So pain point for me is cash up front and in feeding the feeding the beast that is a daily that keeps growing which is a good and bad problem to have.

00:56:49:17 - 00:57:15:03
Karen
It can be real stressful when you're looking for that. But we've got a great group of investors and I spend a lot of my time out networking and talking with investors and really, you know, promoting the brand. But that can be that can be a tricky one for us and probably one of our biggest pain points. The other we talked about was just just being known.

00:57:15:05 - 00:57:49:18
Karen
yeah, being known that you can, how you can make a really good gluten free beer and it's even, you know I from gold and I'll go down to Denver and people haven't heard of us and it's like, my God, like we've killed ourselves trying to get known. And so we really have spent especially this year for next year, a lot of money, time, energy on a very focused marketing program, digital marketing specific zip codes like we've just are dialed in on that for next year.

00:57:49:18 - 00:58:00:13
Karen
So we're ready and I'm excited to see the results of that. Just keep the grind and it's is this is not a sprint. This is a marathon for sure. Have you.

00:58:00:13 - 00:58:07:14
Jessie
Tapped into all the local celiac groups and kind of gone that way and Sherman and.

00:58:07:16 - 00:58:34:09
Karen
Yeah yeah. So we do you know we'll sponsor they have five ks here. We sponsor one of their annual parties every year where they actually host our building. And any time we enter a new market. So like we just launched into Northern California, we, you know, we look for the local celiac groups there and then we also look for local gluten free and celiac bloggers.

00:58:34:11 - 00:59:02:10
Karen
You know, we have a couple of national ones that we have great relationships with. Gluten free. Dave and Phil hates gluten or two really big ones that are national before. yeah, well, you got to go find them for sure. Yeah, for sure. Dave does like cooking and recipes and Phil does like product reviews and like, he'll do call out to companies and say, like, Kraft, you know, make a mac and cheese.

00:59:02:10 - 00:59:25:17
Karen
That's gluten free or whatever. So he's yeah, he's really, they're both really great. But you know, there's local bloggers in every city that are gluten free that know the restaurants really well. So we reach out to them, we ship them some beer, have them on a podcast with us, do kind of what you and I have done, walk them through a tasting and then just ask them to share with with their followers that were there.

00:59:25:18 - 00:59:33:18
Karen
And you can get beer at these places. So yeah, we do everything we can really to get plugged in with that community.

00:59:33:20 - 00:59:38:16
Jessie
Nice. Yeah, that's a great idea. It's a great to kind of get the ground up, you know?

00:59:38:18 - 00:59:39:21
Karen
Yep.

00:59:39:23 - 00:59:40:11
Jessie
Yeah.

00:59:40:13 - 01:00:02:14
Karen
I mean, that's really the lowest, you know, get that low hanging fruit, get the people that are celiac and and highly sensitive. And I've seen it grow. You know we in Colorado our first restaurant was entirely gluten free and now we're in every Buffalo Wild Wings in the state, like Buffalo Wild Wings is not known for gluten free anything.

01:00:02:14 - 01:00:27:21
Karen
But they love our beer and they it moves and wow so that in Canada that's yeah yeah at five years of work but that's the difference that it makes but you got to start with like what you're talking about really that that ground level grass roots Yep. Team and then it word can spread which is cool. Yeah. Yeah for sure.

01:00:27:21 - 01:00:30:00
Karen
Yeah. Yeah. What about.

01:00:30:02 - 01:00:41:20
Jessie
Your outlook? It sounds like you guys are growing. You're kind of set in motion here for some good growth. Are there any states that you're looking to grow into next or.

01:00:41:22 - 01:01:01:22
Karen
Yeah, so we I mean, for a couple of years we've been really in Southern California, San Luis Obispo down, but we are starting to creep and I had mentioned this earlier, but now we're creeping up into northern California. So we're filling out that state, still one state, but sure a heck of a lot of people. So it feels like a pretty big.

01:01:01:22 - 01:01:30:02
Karen
Yeah, that's a pretty big move for us. Yeah. And then really, we will We haven't committed to anything else at this point, but we will continue looking probably geographically, somewhat near us. And the reason for that is transportation is extremely expensive and it's not good for beer. So unfortunately I will be not be shipping beer to Florida most likely in the next quarter.

01:01:30:04 - 01:01:30:22
Karen
But you said.

01:01:31:00 - 01:01:32:08
Jessie
Texas, so that's good.

01:01:32:13 - 01:01:41:21
Karen
We are in Texas. Yes. Yeah, I mean, statewide. So yeah. Is there a time that you're back there?

01:01:41:23 - 01:01:44:05
Jessie
Yeah. Spring in spring and fall.

01:01:44:07 - 01:01:55:02
Karen
Spring and fall. Okay, so yeah, then you could go. Yeah. Total Wines, Whole Foods, H-E-B's. They've got it. So check it out. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:01:55:07 - 01:01:58:03
Jessie
I will stock up and bring it with three degrees.

01:01:58:05 - 01:02:23:09
Karen
Yeah. Exac. So yeah, that's, I mean, that's as far East really as we are. Kansas City, Missouri. I don't know. Let's trying to remember my U.S. geography, but one's a little further east. But anyway, to fill out the capacity of the brewery that we're in, we'll probably do more localized distribution and then we'll look at what do we do next.

01:02:23:09 - 01:02:37:12
Karen
You know, do we build a different brewery on the East Coast or, I don't know, buy another brewery or do something out there? So that's 3 to 5 years out. We really just focus on building what we've got right now.

01:02:37:14 - 01:02:56:06
Jessie
Yeah, now that's good. I mean, if you still have growing places, you can still grow and grow into. I mean, California, Texas alone will keep you busy, so. Yeah, Yeah. No, I mean, I think it's smart to not overextend yourself, grow to where you can first and you feel comfortable in those markets and relationships before you move on.

01:02:56:06 - 01:03:01:15
Jessie
Because the last thing you want to do is, is ruin those relationships you took so long to build.

01:03:01:16 - 01:03:18:19
Karen
And we don't want to be spread too thin either. So it just allows our resources as our team, our people to be focused for versus just scattered. Yeah. So it will be strategic and timely. It won't be overnight.

01:03:18:21 - 01:03:25:22
Jessie
Yeah. Now that's great though, but I mean in the meantime you have two great taprooms. That's right. Yummy fried goodness.

01:03:25:22 - 01:03:39:18
Karen
Options. Yeah, exactly. And those are doing really you know, those are doing good this year. We're up this year in both of those. And people are still coming out, which is great.

01:03:39:20 - 01:03:50:05
Jessie
Yeah. So outside of skiing, which we know you love, outside of work, is there anything else that we're missing out on?

01:03:50:06 - 01:04:15:00
Karen
Well, I mean, the majority of my time is coming and I have twin girls that are 16 years old. Okay? They are they are involved, the husband in a chocolate lab. So there are days it's lovely that I have access to beer when I've got teenage girls at home.

01:04:15:02 - 01:04:15:17
Jessie
Imagine.

01:04:15:19 - 01:04:32:19
Karen
Yeah. Yeah, they're awesome. They so they're sophomores in high school and they're loving it and they're soccer players. So a lot of my free is either traveling for soccer tournaments or going to soccer games around here. Yeah.

01:04:32:21 - 01:04:35:06
Jessie
I can identify my friend does the same thing.

01:04:35:08 - 01:04:59:02
Karen
Yes. Yeah. And I love every second. Yeah, I love that. So yeah, I love every second of that. I feel like my time with them is just starting to get more and more limited. It is. Yeah. Which is crazy. Yeah. Yeah. So that's really weird. They just started driving, which is crazy. Only one vendor. Yeah.

01:04:59:03 - 01:05:04:16
Jessie
I mean, when you're talking about the north and all the snow and elements, it makes it even harder to.

01:05:04:19 - 01:05:05:14
Karen
Yeah.

01:05:05:16 - 01:05:07:22
Jessie
I suppose as a parent.

01:05:08:00 - 01:05:13:06
Karen
Yeah. Yeah. And you got to let them try and Yeah. Teach them how to.

01:05:13:08 - 01:05:18:02
Jessie
You know, spend some donuts. 2 million kind.

01:05:18:02 - 01:05:45:07
Karen
Of. Yeah. Yeah. See, Yeah. I mean really between the brewery and my family, that's the majority of my time. Luckily, the, the brewery is, it is work but it is so much fun and it allows me to like my social life as well because I can still go see friends or meet with friends. And I feel like, you know, a lot of colleagues, suppliers and even our distributors are good friends.

01:05:45:07 - 01:06:22:10
Karen
So, yeah, like it feels it feels good for sure. And I outside of that, I do a lot of just similar to you going to the gym, running, working out yoga, you know, for my mental stability. Exactly. Yeah. So, yeah, just between them, I mean and while they are getting bigger and there's challenges, they're certainly pretty independent. And so my time is almost freed up a little bit in terms of parenting because, yeah, now they can have themselves places and do whatever.

01:06:22:10 - 01:06:24:09
Karen
So that helps a little bit to.

01:06:24:11 - 01:06:26:07
Jessie
Their independent humans.

01:06:26:09 - 01:06:35:11
Karen
Yes, they are more so than maybe I'd like them to be, but yes, they are. They nice. yeah.

01:06:35:13 - 01:06:41:06
Jessie
So is there anything else we haven't mentioned, Karen, that you'd like to tell everybody?

01:06:41:08 - 01:06:43:00
Karen
No, I don't think so.

01:06:43:02 - 01:06:44:06
Jessie
Maybe once I get.

01:06:44:08 - 01:06:45:11
Karen
On an.

01:06:45:13 - 01:06:47:08
Jessie
Instagram handle or anything.

01:06:47:10 - 01:07:07:06
Karen
Yeah, I mean, yeah. So, you know, we're at Holiday Brew. I think a lot of people say holiday or spell holiday. And that's actually one thing I could tell you. Holiday Li actually was a word we made up and it really is just make the most of every single day or every day's a holiday, especially after I got sick.

01:07:07:06 - 01:07:34:08
Karen
I mean, I think I've always lived my life that way, but it just reinforced like we never know and we need to make the most of every single day. And it's been such a fun brand to work and play with. And we just get to focus on bright colors and positive messages. So anyway, all of our handles are Holiday Li Brew or Holiday Li Brewing, and then our website is Holiday Li Brewing Dot com.

01:07:34:10 - 01:07:43:00
Karen
So we're out there on the socials and would love more followers. And thanks so much for reaching out and having me. It's been fun chatting.

01:07:43:00 - 01:08:03:13
Jessie
Yeah no you've this has been awesome I congratulations on your journey and it's unfortunate the way it happened but now you're a champion of so many people right now. You get to make so many people happy to the point where they're, you know, have tears, which is happy tears.

01:08:03:15 - 01:08:12:20
Karen
Happy tears. I know. Very cool. Most people don't want to make customers cry, but happy tears will accept. Will accept. Yeah.

01:08:12:22 - 01:08:23:12
Jessie
Yeah And you know, you didn't want to have your own business, but you still got that MBA and entrepreneurship, so you're still there. It just, you know, it was in there somewhere.

01:08:23:14 - 01:08:27:07
Karen
It totally is. Yeah. It was there for a reason, for sure.

01:08:27:09 - 01:08:44:19
Jessie
And now you're a business owner, you have employees, so, you know, you're really making a difference for a lot of people. So congratulations on all your hard work and and your success. You're awesome success that you're enjoying right now. And, you know, keep in touch and for.

01:08:44:20 - 01:08:45:14
Karen
Sure.

01:08:45:16 - 01:08:46:17
Jessie
I'll dig around.

01:08:46:17 - 01:08:47:18
Karen
And gear to you.

01:08:47:20 - 01:08:51:14
Jessie
Yeah, I'll dig around and see where I can find it when I get to Texas.

01:08:51:16 - 01:08:55:05
Karen
All right perfect. Yes. We'll be in touch for sure.

01:08:55:07 - 01:09:00:05
Jessie
Anyway. All right. Well, thank you so much, Kerry, and best of luck to you. If there's anything I can do, let me know.

01:09:00:07 - 01:09:04:13
Karen
Awesome. Thanks so much. Bye bye. Cheers.

01:09:04:15 - 01:09:07:17
Jessie
Cheers. Tune in next Thursday and.

01:09:07:17 - 01:09:09:11
Karen
Have a great week.

01:09:09:13 - 01:09:13:21
Jessie
This week's episode was produced by Fedora Jay Productions.