Grow Your Clinic

Jacey Pryjma: Intentional Leadership, How Values Drive Decision-Making in Business and Family Life | GYC Podcast E289

• Jacey Pryjma • Season 5 • Episode 289

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In this episode, we chat with Jacey Pryjma, clinic owner of the Australian Children's Chiropractic Centre in Newcastle, Australia. Jacey shares her journey of significant growth in her clinic over the past three years, despite facing personal challenges and raising a family. The discussion delves into the key decisions Jacey made to navigate the complexities of balancing business and family life. She emphasises the importance of being intentional with values when making decisions, which serves as a guiding principle in both her personal and professional life. Jacey also discusses the sacrifices she made, including her personal income, as an investment in the clinic's future. Tune in to hear practical insights and inspiration from Jacey's experiences in building a purposeful life and thriving clinic.

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This is the Grow Your Clinic podcast from Clinic Mastery. We help progressive health professionals to lead inspired teams, transform client experiences, and build clinics for good. Now, Welcome to the Grow Your Clinic podcast. My name is Ben Lynch. In this episode, I speak with Jacey Pryjma the owner of Australian Children's Chiropractic Centre in Newcastle, Australia. With 14 therapists and several admin team members, Jacey has grown substantially over the last three years. And we discuss some of the key decisions that she's made to enable that to happen all whilst growing a family. In fact, we go really deep on some of the hardships and challenges, the adversity that she's faced in her family and business in growing both of them at the same time. We also explore some of the practical things that she's done to navigate those challenges. The thing that really resonated with me as Jacey was talking was how intentional she is at using their values to make decisions. Not that she does it perfectly, she'll admit that, but that that is the anchor point through which every decision is made so that on balance they create a really intentional and purposeful life, business and family unit. Let's pick up the conversation with Jacey now. You just described to me how your personal lack of income over the last few years has been an investment in the business to help grow it. Can you expand on that and help listeners understand what you mean by that? Because it's very hard to grow your business and also take care of yourself at home. So tell us a little bit more So I guess being a female in practice with a young family and having children along the way, I've had to make some pretty big decisions on how I was going to progress through this time. So it was my choice to have a practice, my choice to essentially have a bigger practice with the dream of having a big team. And for me, I really had to make sure that I was investing in myself and my family in various means, but unfortunately the finances wasn't one of them. But we were investing in different ways. So making sure that I had support at home. I have an incredible husband who is very, very hands on. So having active conversations around what I needed support with. So, you know, say I might need to do some computer work at home. I can't have the kids on top of me while I'm doing that. And even though they want mum so much, They have to be out. And so there was periods of time that it wasn't feasible for that to happen. So I would have to go to the office or to a cafe, or my husband would have to take them out for a baby Gino. So that was one part of it. But another part is really making sure that we had the care that we needed for the kids. I'm a big believer in staying at home as much as possible and supporting a really slow childhood. And so shipping off to daycare every day wasn't in our family value set. And so we invested in nannies. And so that came at a big cost, of course, for our family. But it allowed me to continue to tick over things at the business, to be present enough there but also present enough at home knowing that I had full control of my children's days and what they were eating and what they were up to and the exposures that they were having so I could then be fully present in my business. So that was a big part of that as well as having a cleaner once a fortnight or once a you know every three weeks That was another big part of being able to take care of our family and that was a very conscious decision as a family to do so, to really facilitate me to actually have some kind of separation. with home and business. And yeah, and from there, you know, making sure that I then had the capability of not taking too much of a wage so I could continue to invest the finances that I would have generated otherwise back into the business. So I really saw this as a massive investment period. for the family but also knowing that when my head comes up above water out of this time I will be able to progress forward knowing that that business has actually already made some strides ahead and I can hit the ground running rather than having to backtrack and Just to interrupt the podcast for one moment, did you know that one of the common challenges for a growing clinic is the inefficiency from scattered systems? You got duplicates everywhere. No one knows where to find any of the information they need for policies, procedures, or training, and it creates a bottleneck. Always coming to you as the owner or leader of a clinic to have to know where everything is and how to do it. Well, that's why we created a tool called Ali. It is your one place, your source of truth for all policies, procedures, training, and performance. It plugs into your patient management system and is the storehouse for all of the important compliance docs that you need to have to run a good business and have your best practices documented, shared with your team, and importantly, acknowledged by your team. Yes, you can even track have they read it for any auditing or compliance purposes. You can head over to alieclinics.com and you can test it out for an entire month for free, no credit card down. There's like literally no risk. Give it a crack and I'm sure you'll love it and reach out if you need any help in systemizing your business and streamlining those things so they're no longer scattered. Right, let's head back to the episode now. Sounds like you've been super conscious about how you want it to work and set it up. Talk us through some of the challenges in maybe the early days in making that work in the way that you had thought about it because finances are a real constraint. Time is a real constraint. What were some of the challenges in being able to bring that version of family Yeah, look, to be honest, a lot of emotions and frustrations. You know, you're working so hard and you're stretched so thin. And one of the things is a female who is not in 40 hours a week in the practice, but essentially going to be doing 40, 50 or 60 hours from doing work late at night, early in the morning, all those sorts of things. You know, we're just stretched so thin. And so the challenges for me is that it didn't take much to like pit me off my post and It could be a cold or a child being sick or the nanny being sick or someone at work not being able to work and then I have to do additional hours. Those sorts of things were really tricky to navigate at different stages. Finding the right nanny is also a really tricky thing. I've been using nannies though for a long time now. So I feel like, and I've hired a lot more people through the practice. So I feel like my hiring What are some little practical tips, Jacey, that you found useful in recruiting the right person? Around nannies? Yeah, because it is something that I see a lot of families doing and engaging in our community. What are some of the lessons you've learned and some of the things you found useful in finding the right folks to work Making sure that we use the terminology around these are our family values and as a family deciding what is important to us. So for us, like I said, it was slow mornings. I'm a big person on organic food and supporting our children to have the best food possible. I'm big on sun safety, so getting some great exposure in the morning and afternoon, but being really aware of high UV. And so those kind of values and slow play, no TV, you know, during nanny hours, I have to say we do use TV as a family when I need it done, not when I'm paying someone else to look after my children. So they were some of the things. So find out what's really important for you first. And then that means it's a much easier conversation when you're talking to someone. And then, yeah, talking about like the communication style that we want, the way that we focus on redirection, we try not to get the kids in too much trouble as such, you know, you're wanting to redirect them and support them in other ways. And, you know, there might be some things that I do as a parent. Yes, I do get cranky. I'm not someone who can be the quintessential gentle parent the whole time, but for our nannies, I don't, I, you know, it's a lot easier when it's not your own children. So my expectation for them is that their voices don't get raised at all. And they focus on redirection and they are crafty in the way that they can move things around. So I wanted to make sure that they had some, experience in that kind of style of working with children. And of course, having a really good chat to their references and talking about, you know, do they engage well with the children? Do you, you know, did you ever get comments from your neighbours on how much fun they were playing? And, you know, we'll always get comments. Our neighbours will always tell us what's going on at the house. And, you know, that's always beautiful feedback for us. We've always had wonderful feedback. To, you know, really correlate that we've made those good choices, but also for the first few weeks, you want to see that the nanny is coming while you're working from home. So they can see how you are with the children and how your household runs. And so then they can learn how to really take over from there as Top tips. That's good. Really practical tips as well. I love the distinction of the family values that carries through into clinic as well and hiring in a clinic sense and using your values as a strong filter through which you recruit. That's lovely. I find it really cool when you can translate some of the business things that you do into the home life as well, whether it's structure, using values, using different systems. My wife and I often sort of laugh. We listen to a little bit of Hamish and Andy. Do you know Hamish and Andy, the greatest drama duo? And Hamish is more fast and loose and Andy is much more structured and like systems. So my wife is fast and loose and I'm all about structure and systems. And trying to find the right balance is always a good conversation to have. So finding the right support at home, you mentioned being a really key part to enabling you to do what you need to do in business in particular, as well as as parenthood. Talk to me about some of the financial side of things, that investment mindset specifically, because when we're all starting out, there's often a lack of finances. You're kind of working hard to build up by serving patients and build up a sustainability of income. Take me through some of the decision making to invest in some of these things that other people might otherwise say, well, that's a bit of a luxury item. I can't do it right now. How did you go about making that happen and thinking through Yeah, I think this is one of the conversations that honestly has come up so many times with my friends as well. And yeah, a lot of families think, gosh, you know, you must have a lot of money to be able to hire a nanny. But for us, it was really about recognizing that, yeah, it is an investment. And just because my income literally went to pay for the nanny doesn't mean that there was no worth in me working. And so I think that's a major distinction for people to ensure. And also, that even though it was my income from a dollar to dollar that was sort of covering the nanny, at the end of the day, we have to look at finances as a combined household income. And so then we could look at that investment as part of our percentage of our whole household income. So of course, we had to live more frugally to be able to do that. And we had to forego other luxuries that we would have otherwise enjoyed. It was certainly something that at times it felt really tough, particularly when the interest rates all went up. That was a really hard conversation to kind of realise that, okay, we've really hit a point where it's actually now not viable. So what do we need to look for? So then we looked for a home daycare. with a small amount of children who had the same values, who just happened to be around the corner, who just happened to be wonderful, you know. And so we were able to progress into a new stage of living and my eldest went to school, so that also made things a little bit easier. Knowing that this is a season and that the children will grow, their needs will change, that was also part of our investment decision making, that was an important thing to remember. And they are only little ones. And for me, this was a high time to invest my money and really have a grounding foundation I felt was really important for my family. Everybody will have different ideas of what is optimal for them and what they can do. And I'm just really grateful I was able to, you know, essentially fund the world that we needed here. And it was really only over the last two years that we had to do that, you know, Hey, just interrupt the podcast for one moment. Did you know that beyond this podcast, we have a consulting service where we work directly with you as a clinic owner to help grow your clinic? Now, if you're wondering, how does it work? And are these the right people for me? You can send an email to hello at clinicmastery.com and we'll arrange a time to have a conversation. Now, on average, people have three conversations with us spaced over a couple of days or a couple of weeks to figure out whether we're the right folks to help you in your next stage of business. There's no pressure whatsoever. We want you to feel fully committed to either working with us or not at all. That's totally cool. but that is our specialty that we've built our brand on over a decade now. You can read our reviews, testimonials, and case studies. We've done a ripping job at helping heaps of people from a variety of backgrounds grow their clinic sustainably, but probably you want to know whether we're the right sort of fit, a values alignment for you. Best way to do that is to have a phone call with us, a Zoom call, and see whether we can help you out. Send us an email, hello at clinicmastery.com. Let's arrange a time, see where we can launch you into the next stage of your growth. All right, back to the episode. You mentioned that it was a bit of a, and has been a bit of a rollercoaster in emotions at various times. I think that's, maybe that's just life. It's definitely business. One thing I hear a lot of clinic owners say to me is that they feel some version of guilt when they're maybe away from family or they're putting in the time, because ultimately they're like, I'm doing this for my family or for my kids, so they can go to the right schools or that I can provide for them. But it also typically means a trade-off that I don't have as much time with them. Is that Yeah, of course I have. You know, just so we had some changes in staffing this year that was really disappointing and tough. And it meant that my little guy had to go in care four days a week rather than three. And the tears I had in that moment was so massive. I felt I was failing as a business owner because I had to step in more. I felt like I was failing as a mother because I was, you know, leaving my child. And then, of course, we rolled into this new season, and lo and behold, there were some pluses there that I hadn't considered. He is a very, very busy kid, and I was finding it really difficult to even get some basic phone calls done when I was with him at home. And he needed more than stimulation than what I could provide. And so now that he's in a family daycare center, setting he is stoked and happy and comes home you know run off his feet and ready for bed whereas with me he wasn't having his naps because I wasn't being able to get out and do much with him because I still had some phone calls to do because I was trying to mix a lot. So yes I can't remember what your original question was but yeah that was other guilt yes and so that was Yeah, that was big. For me, work and being able to provide a service to families that is so needed in the community. And I'm incredibly passionate about bringing so much change to the industry of chiropractic care and children. It's been a driving passion of mine for so many years. So I didn't experience guilt for working or going back to work, but I did feel resentment for the practice when I had to step back in at three and a half months or four months when I have such a nurturing soul. Originally, back in the day, I actually planned to be a stay-at-home mother and I have another business called WellKids, And I had planned to just build up WellKids, run it as an online business and be a stay-at-home mum. So there were certainly times where I was feeling frustrated. I was thinking, gosh, I'm doing all this work and I'm hardly getting paid for it. Yes, I made the decision to invest, but the reality when you're feeling low, you feel it so hard. And, you know, so they were some of the things that I have certainly had times with my life where I felt like I resented the business. and how it impacted my family financially as well as stress wise as well as time. So I was always happy to work but the reality of running a business is that it's really hard work and it really will throw you curveballs and it can be at It often is, isn't it? How did you navigate some of those moments where you were feeling that resentment? Perhaps you still find some useful principles today in navigating tough spots in business. But talk us through how you actually worked your way through them because as you pointed out in the family sense, it's almost seasonally that these tough moments happen and we need to find a way to navigate through. And for some people, I see that that is the catalyst for a change, like literally a career change or they sell their clinic and that's okay too. You've continued with it. What were some of the things, the principles or practices that you found useful in navigating those periods where For me, I have really learned that I am incredibly stubborn. So when I set my mind to a goal, I will find a way around it. And I do have good self-belief and self-confidence in finding a way. So having that attitude has been a huge part of being able to push forward through some pretty hefty different things that have come up in the history of our family throughout this time, as well as the practice. You know, the biggest turning point for me was, and I am someone who shares a lot, so I am going to talk about pregnancy loss now just as a warning to any women that are listening that might be you might want to just hold off for the next few minutes otherwise. But I did have a moment where I had a beautiful associate who was offered an opportunity to take over a practice but at the same time managed to hurt her finger and that meant that she was out of practice and in the middle of all of that I had a miscarriage. And so throughout all of that and dealing with the aftermath and then obviously feeling the call to have to cover the practice, I came back a little too soon. And I ended up having to go home again with huge pain and discomfort. And I remember sitting in the car, crying my eyes out saying, this is not how it's supposed to be this and I'm feeling teary just talking about it was such an awful time. And look at me going now I'm the girl that cries. And that is in that moment, because it was mid-morning, I called Clinic Mastery. And so that was the turning point. I just said, this is not it. This is not how this story ends. This is not how my journey, you know, continues. This is not okay. I don't have breathing space to even have a health crisis as such. Um, and I need help. And so I put my ego aside that I wanted to do it all on my own. Not that I ever made that, you know, direct, you know, uh, thought that I need to do this on my own, but I've never found a coaching group that I felt served my, um, needs, but aligned with my values. And from the first, first phone call with Rick, I was so impressed with what he spoke about and the way that he, you know, uh, talked about the coaching and the progress and some of the things that we could be working on. Uh, it really helped me recognize straight away that, that need for structure and systems and some groundwork. was needed to facilitate some growth so the pressure could I didn't realize that specific point was the start of our time together. Yeah. I know plenty of mothers have been through that experience. And as you said, it is challenging. You've obviously experienced it yourself. And during those moments, yeah, to be able to have the time and the space to work through it is important. And when you've got a business that is demanding a lot of you, especially in that season, I can imagine that would have been really quite something to go through. I can imagine the following couple of weeks or months were challenging. How did you navigate through that? What were some of the things that got you through that season? To be honest, I can't even remember. My brain has really like blocked it out. But no, I think that was one of those turning points where I could really go, no, the business can wait. You know, this is ridiculous. My highest value is health and here I am not prioritizing my health. So that was a big part. But having, I started coaching with a gorgeous Kate and she, having a female coach as well, I think at that pivotal time was just so important. And it just really allowed me to have some support and talk through things and prepare to come back into the practice when I had essentially my head screwed on right and I knew what I needed to do. So rather than using my team members to bounce ideas off and talk about my concerns or worries moving forward, I was able to do that outside the practice. And then I had a a clear opportunity to walk in as a leader, rather than sort of leaning on others that didn't have the skill set to support me in some of those decision making moments that had to happen. So yeah, so that was a really pivotal part and And I know for me, when I'm given an opportunity to work on a task, I go for it. And so from there, procedures and everything was put in place. And I was then really able to work on the infrastructure of the practice, which has given us you know, so much more confidence, so much more grounding, that we are now able to thrive in different areas. And so, yeah, that was the start of my Click Mastery journey, but also a new beginning in terms of how I viewed the practice, my leadership, and I want to tap into that point you made around your leadership and the journey that you've been on, because it's quite an interesting one for us as health professionals, starting out as practitioners and then becoming business owners. I notice a lot of people struggle to perhaps make that mindset shift that they are now a business owner. And especially if you progress to consulting less over time, and really then that becomes the majority perhaps of your week. What are some of the big lessons you've learned in your leadership journey? It sounds like there was a moment there where you really maybe embraced it or leant into it or thought about it differently than you had previously. Talk us through your journey of being a leader and growing a team. Yeah, there's definitely been a whole heap of change over the last. So I've had the practice for eight years now. Those first five and a bit years, I was on my own and then I've been with Clinic Mastery, I think coming up to three years now. So I've always been a visionary. So someone who could share a really exciting future of how we could really transform the public's perception of chiropractic care for children. how we can transform health through chiropractic care and provide an incredible service to not only the children, but then create community for the mothers and be part of their village. So that image of connection and our practice purpose is cultivating connection. So that for us has been our steering point from the start. And so I felt, I've always felt very confident in coming with that. I'm full of creative ideas, getting a lot of our education programs off the ground. I used to teach seminars to chiropractors as well. And hopefully again, we'll, we'll someday soon, but you know, Those sorts of elements of my leadership have always been there. I've always represented the profession on various boards and been very much at the forefront of our profession in various ways. Then coming into the practice, that pivotal moment of recognising that I need to take care of myself to take care of the business, Again, it sounds so simple, but it's funny how you lose your way and the practicality of that when you just have that, I have a real sense of duty. So making sure that my sense of duty isn't overtaking my values and being then incongruent with what I need as a woman, a partner, a mother, as well as family. So just being a lot clearer on that and recognising that no, the business can wait and I can have some time off or holidays and all those sorts of things. The other thing in terms of leadership is making sure that I am always doing the do so people can, so I can lead by example. And so having strict rules for myself about how I turn up clinically, how I turn up into practice, and of course, we are all human. There's times that I think, I really need to work on that again. That has also been a big part of that. And also my leadership style in terms of when I'm feeling a bit frustrated or bored, I'll start looking in the clouds. And I love that you've got the clouds and dirt behind you there. You know, I remember having a conversation with you, a conversation with Daniel, probably even Jack. They're all the times that I reach out to someone else. I'm like, oh, I don't know what I'm doing. Do I open another practice? Do I do this? Do I do that? And the answer every time has been, Jacey, just work in the dirt and get all the baselines done, because that is what will propel you in the future. And so knowing that I do need to kind of come up into the clouds for a minute to see what is possible and what is out there, because I need that visionary side of me to be really engaged. But then also not being afraid to go, well actually I need to get back down, work in the dirt, do the grind and just make sure that we are practicing and finessing, practicing and finessing, practicing and finessing our day to day because it's those one percenters that I love that distinction on coming back to the dirt and doing the 1%ers really well. I just want to pick on something that you said there around the alignment between your sense of duty and your values and those things maybe not reconciling at various times and maybe causing you to sort of go off track. Can you just expand on that so that we understand when you say your sense of duty and Yeah, so a good example is we have two chiropractors going off on leave in November, and my sense of duty would have wanted me to cover, and I'm covering a lot, don't get me wrong. We approved that leave when we thought we had more staff on deck, but we did have some changes. And so I am doing a lot, and so I am investing a lot of time, but In the middle of all that is my birthday and my daughter's birthday. So I'm not doing those days. And also we've realized another Saturday needed to be covered and we are just closing the practice. So being able to recognize that, you know, I'm okay to step up in these short bursts, but it can't, cannot overrun my whole life. It cannot put too much stress on my family and my husband. And there is a point where I just have to say, I'm sorry, we just can't service families on that How strict are you with those rules today and have you sort of deviated from them? And I'll just position it on the other side, which is, I've also seen folks be so rigid with their ideas or use the term sometimes stubborn. that maybe there's an opportunity in being a little more loose or flexible with some of those rules in their life or in their business that could actually help them get through this season perhaps a little easier. So how do you go about the rule versus the exception? Are you fairly rigid or are they a little bit loose? Talk us Well, it kind of depends on how much care I can get for the kids as well, you know, that there's the practicality behind all of that. But You know, you just have to check in with yourself. So for the first half of this year, I was dealing with a concussion. There was no way I could have done more, you know, that really knocked me for six. And even though it was a mild concussion, it really played with my autonomics. It played with my capacity to think it played with my capacity to think big. I had lost personality. I didn't even realize I wasn't feeling joy. So, you know, there are seasons, injuries, postpartum periods, trickiness with children. That just means your capacity is just not there. And so making sure that we are very in tune with what we need as a human, as a person, and what is able to be given to the practice. It's a lot easier for me to make these decisions now we have more team on deck. and my children are a little bit bigger. So again, my season has facilitated me to say yes to this period of time, but within that, I actually didn't have it in me to train up a locum. We do such specialized, very significant, you know, really detailed care in our practice that we just can't get a locum from down the street to come in. We have to train them up and there's a whole investment side of things that goes into that. So I didn't have it in me to do that. And I just knew for a three week period, I could step up and do, you know, an extra 10 to 12 hours, or it might be a little bit more on the tools to, you know, to facilitate the practice through this time and to allow two of our beautiful team members to The thing that I'm really getting from our conversation is how conscious or purposeful you are in a lot of decisions and choices. And I want to go into what are some habits or practices that you have to keep them front and center and use them. But just to say, even through hearing you talk about your journey and dealing with adversity and challenges, and I certainly see this with a lot of clinic owners, is that actually sometimes just changing the perspective or lens on the current situation can be the thing that gets you through it or unlocks the way through it. And to your point around, if I'm too stubborn in certain points, I can come back to maybe my purpose or my values or my sense of duty to run it through a filter, or I can lean into a coach or a mentor who sees it from a different perspective and then navigate from there. And I'd certainly say that of a lot of clinic owners I've worked with, is that when they can actually kind of separate themselves from the circumstance or the season, and maybe tap into a different perspective, it can just all of a sudden unlock opportunities of progressing forward. But how do you keep it so front and center? What are some of the things that you do practically Uh, I'm a big person and not making the same mistake twice. So I learned from my mistakes to be honest, and I'm very, um, keen on progressing forward as a human. So I'm forever checking in with myself and I really do take my, uh, you know, development as a leader and as a human really seriously. I, you know, listen to podcasts that are going to facilitate not only changes in my habits and things like that, but. Yeah, I'm just forever learning and recognizing that there's always a new level around the corner. I give myself pep talks, I guess. I do have very good positive talk internally, and I think that is really important. You know, I remember when I was younger, I used to kind of give myself these internal high fives because I did two tasks or two or three tasks in an order that saved me five seconds. So I think, you know, like I've had this kind of, you know, Yeah, you go you kind of thing on the inside. And look, and I don't think there's enough of that. I think that we, for whatever reason, whatever backgrounds, that is very difficult for some. And so those tiny little high fives do make a difference. So I think that's a huge part of all of that. In saying that, I am incredibly diligent about my health. I eat extremely well. I, you know, drink beautiful filtered water. I am back to exercising and doing all the things and moving my body. Um, you know, we have a house chemical free. I love all my wooden toys, you know, like I live a very conscious, um, wholesome life and that gives me great stability. And I've had to make a lot of those decisions to facilitate my health along the way. So I've had a, had to learn a lot of, um, you know, rules and, you know, things to live by personally. And that strength and diligence has certainly come through into my work. I do reporting every week in Slack. So that makes me ensure I'm across Yeah, so I report to the team. So we have a leadership one, but then also to the full practice so we can celebrate wins Just talk us through practically, I know you hit me up around some practicalities of Shane Davis's diary, as an example, we'll have him on the pod. For those listening in, I'm sure they're going, yeah, but what do you what do you do in that? Like, what do you put in a report? What do you post? What's what's part of a regular makeup of announcement or update to the Yeah, so we use a traffic light system, which was introduced to me through you guys. And so we will have now let me think. We go through first, so if I'm doing it to the whole team, I say, hey guys, we pre-booked this many people this week, and at the end of the week, we saw this. Looking ahead, we're seeing this many people this week, and then we have a traffic light system and our goal is written above there. And then I'm big on emojis now. I thought they were a waste of time, but now I have embraced my emoji life. And then if we hit a target, the amount of, you know, trophies and rocket ships and, bursts of confetti that come through magical. Well, I think so anyway. And then we look at how many new people that we've had in this week and last week. We look at what spots are available for new people. So I'll actually list them out. Because one of the things that highlighted is that we had a goal of seeing 15 or 17 new people a week, but we actually didn't have enough spots. So then that allowed us to kind of go well hang on a minute what's happening to our spots here because with Cliniko you can't lock a spot for a particular type of appointment. So we were, you know, we're moving some of our little placeholders around a little bit too much. So that was a really good way to for us to get find a one percenter to work on. And then what else and then I would make a comment about the week, you know, the week before, like, you know, this was an amazing week, I saw this happening and go you guys, you know, celebrate a celebration of some sort. And I I think that's probably all of it there. And then of course, yeah, we have goals around, you know, Google reviews and things like that. So we would post any Google reviews into our Slack channel so everyone could celebrate that we had some beautiful comments being made. And then our marketing team does a similar one. And then to our leadership, I will then do a post around the finances that week, you know, what chiropractic brought in, what our events brought in. how that related to our goals with traffic lights. Then I'm just trying to think offhand. There's a couple of others in there. And then our marketing team will come in and say, okay, well, our initial consults here, here's the breakdown of where they came from. This is what's going on. And then our CA, the chiropractic assistant team leader will come in and say, okay, well, this is what I saw happening on the front desk and why, you know, I feel like these numbers might be, you know, related to that. So it's yeah, it's created this really nice ecosystem, but I have to be due diligent on that, to make sure that that is happened every day. Because if I do it later in the week, then some of the stats might change a bit for our forwarding weeks. And yeah, so It's a great routine to have, keeps you across what's happening and making informed decisions. What's awesome to hear is how your team celebrate the progress, achieving the milestones or the goals. for those clinic owners that are listening that haven't got this or maybe they've tried a version of it and hey, the team didn't react like that. What have been some things that you've done that you found useful in getting your team members on board when it comes to talking more of those performance numbers, the performance side of their role? Because sometimes practitioners, clinic owners can feel like it's a little bit at odds with taking care of patients and getting great patient outcomes when we all of a sudden start talking about business outcomes and the performance of the clinic overall. So what are some of the things you found useful I think for us, you know, company culture, of course, plays a huge role in this and how we show up for each other in person and online through Slack. But genuinely, the changes that we see in our families. And so we'll often be sharing magical stories of what we have seen in practice with each other and with our family's permission, of course. And so making the distinction, I don't talk about finances so much with the whole team. I talk about that with leadership. And we talk about numbers and the value that we're providing to the community. when we see a goal and we're, you know, we're hitting a new magical goal, you know, then that allows us to kind of go, wow, like we're really making an impact here. And, you know, the other week we had 24 new clients booking in one week and all of us were just sitting there going, oh my goodness, like we have hit that point After eight years of so much hard work here in Newcastle, a post on Facebook asking about which chiropractor to take your baby to has 90 comments, and all of them positive, and 70 of those were for our practice. It's those sorts of things that we go, wow, we're really hitting this threshold. We're making this huge, huge difference in our community. We've changed perceptions. helping families and supporting these babies to live healthier and be more connected to themselves, to their mother, to their family, to their community. So we are very excited about that. We are providing something that is so desperately needed, particularly for the babies in that space and also the bigger kids. And so it's the excitement of the clinical outcomes, but also just, you know, some of the comments that we'll get on our Facebook page is not, not Facebook, sorry, Google, is that families feel, we have set up a practice that feels like a second home to families. They come in, their babies are cuddled by the team, they get cups of tea, they meet other mothers. It's like a mother's group every day. Often we'll see 20 to 30 babies in a day. It's a really magical space to be in. And so that in itself is a high-flying, vibing space. Every morning we have a huddle and then we talk about what's our positive intention for the day, so how are we going to show up for myself or what am I going to focus on. So we have sprinkled fairy dust, I guess, in all different elements of our practice, but it comes from a genuine love of really serving families and getting change. Everyone that works for us is also under our care. So they personally feel those changes. And then a lot of the women that are on our front desk support, they have young families too. So they are our clientele. And so they can relate, support, and also celebrate those big changes along the way. So when we put their stats up, it's a reflection of the value that they I love that. This has been something that you've been super passionate about from education to building the practice and the services that you offer. but it also sounds like from previous conversations, there's some headwinds, there's some challenges. Maybe that's a nicer, polite way to put it. Just talk us through, yeah, what are some of those things you're up against and what you're trying to do to overcome some of the stigma or regulation that's So, Yes, so this is a big, long story which I'm going to try and summarize for you all, but chiropractic tends to sit a little outside of that standard medical model. We're coming from a holistic perspective and we're looking at supporting families to get the most out of their bodies long term. And so that can be hard to understand when coming from a perspective where we might have a condition and then we have a set treatment plan, that condition resolves or things change and then treatment ceases. And so when we think about those two worlds clashing, there is a bit of a misunderstanding. And that misunderstanding actually goes back many, many, many years and has started over in America. And there is an air of that that continues today. And so two years after starting the practice, there was a government inquiry into chiropractic care for children that was put forth by a politician. I can't remember. I think it was Melbourne, but it'd been Adelaide actually. And based on some video footage that went around about a child being adjusted, that child was not injured. The parents posted and were happy for it to be posted because the child improved with care. Now, out of context, that was then sensationalized. And then the government essentially, well, this PM was saying, we are going to show how dangerous chiropractors are, and that, you know, we need to shut them down, and they shouldn't see children based on no evidence of harm ever. And so That was massive. I had just opened a practice. I can't remember. I was either about to get pregnant with my first or was already pregnant with my first. So here I am in a practice called the Australian Children's Chiropractic Center. It's a massive 300 square, 300 meter practice. And I have a five-year lease. And so with all of that in mind, I thought, okay, well, here we go. And it was a very stressful time, but what was really magical is that 28,000 people invested time in writing to the health minister and they really tried to get us. They went through not only all the research, but they went to the insurance companies to see if chiropractic care had anyone had been sued for the care provided to a child. And we can say that through that massive review that no other profession has been through that had a response so big that they had to get Ernest and Young involved in analysing the data, zero evidence of harm in a child in Australia ever. and so that was a huge win for the practice but heirs of this continue to ripple through and even today there are still sensationalized media attacks on chiropractic care for children and so yeah the wins that we have had in practice have felt so fantastic because we know we do a great job, we know we get great outcomes, and we know we are incredibly safe in what we provide and do. And in our practice, the way that I opened it was because I wanted to be loud and proud about what we did. I wanted to be someone who really stepped forth and could be an inspiration to others that felt nervous because of the different things that were going on internally in chiropractic and externally. And I wanted to just go, no, this is what we do. And I'm really proud of it. So we are incredibly diligent with our examination. We are incredibly documentative in our approach. Every family goes home with a handwritten, not a handwritten, but a personalized typed, um, and we redo those reports along the way. And yeah, the work that we have put in, the hours of report writing that chiropractors don't really do, that we have put in has made incredible change. And it has meant that we have been able to increase communication and confidence in the process that we provide and the care that we provide. And has, I honestly believe, completely changed the whole area around chiropractic care for children and beyond. We have people that travel huge distances to see us now because of the confidence in what we do and also the incredible reviews and As a father to four kids who all have chiropractic care, I can't remember if it was our daughter or our son, was struggling to roll over at one point and then crawl. And after one visit, they were able to roll over the other way and then started crawling about two weeks later. You're like, wow, you know, it all just kind of clicked. And it was fantastic to see that, but they all still do it. So I'm with you on that preaching to the converted. But It's awesome to hear of the impact of every profession. I think it's great when we've got a community of allied health professionals that try and work together rather than try and cancel one another and try and find understanding and mutual approaches. evidence that backs their approach so they can help people live a better quality of life. I think that's always good. It's great to see it in the community as well. You would see this, the support, the collaboration rather than people ragging on one another. I certainly see it. And the difference, you know, for posts in those Facebook groups from Literally, you know, like we have seen, it must be nearly three and a half thousand families and we're 72% children and 60% were under one when they started with us. Huge amounts of babies. So really being part of changing the trajectory of those children's lives because like you said, you know, helping them roll, you know, in both ways. I was teaching a primitive reflexes workshop last night to, um, some, um, medical people came to it, some other chiropractors, some educators, teachers and parents. And we'll just talking about, you know, we have these amazing primitive reflexes and a child needs to move freely though, to express and use those reflexes to facilitate that next stage of growth and chiropractic is just, yeah. you know, something that can be part of that because that That's great to hear. I'm keen to hear what's next. We've spoken a little bit about clouds and dirt, but before we do, you spoke a little bit about your CM journey. What have been some of the things that have been most impactful and things maybe you wish you knew at the start that maybe would have helped you a little bit more? So what's been most impactful for you and what are some of the lessons that Um, let me think. So the big thing that I was missing right at the start was structure and I, we got so busy and I was, um, reliant on, we had the same amazing team essentially from, day zero through to year five. And because we were all working so well and everything was doing so well, I hadn't organized their position descriptions properly. I was reliant on the human and their amazing capacity to turn up rather than recognizing that the role needs to be defined because that human might move on and celebrate as transition into the next phase of life. And I always had the philosophy that I did, I wanted to celebrate people that left, you know, like celebrating, not that they're leaving, celebrate their next stage and their transition because I recognize that their role with me is a chapter in their book and I want that chapter to be amazing. And I want the start, middle, and the end to be amazing. And no matter when that chapter finishes, whether it's a year, six months, 10 years, I wanted to ensure that we were very conscious around that. Now, to have that conversation, though, some things and structures need to be in place. And so the biggest thing I think has So I always knew I needed position descriptions, but I hadn't learned to allocate the time appropriately to do it. I was too busy in the dirt to just get my head up to get some of that foundation. So I guess helping me realize that I needed to do that, that was a big part. And then the next transition came when I really learned around recruitment and always hiring and recognizing that I needed to create an ecosystem and a pathway to facilitate new team members to come along. So that was another huge eye opener. I was like, oh, of course, why hadn't I thought of that before? And getting that started, that was a big, big, big part. And then now my biggest learning is recognizing that I need to get back into the dirt and to get the now the next stage of developing some senior chiropractors. to be leaders in mentorship. So for me to further expand for where I am and still turn up with my family and have Fridays with my boy, I can't mentor extra hours because I'm also now on the tools again in this short term. So I need to develop team members that can take on that mentoring in a way and a process that I want for the practice. So that now all needs to be defined. And we need to continue to build out our hub, essentially, for our guidelines and procedures. policies are in there, procedures are continually being updated. So I think they're the main things and it's really nice now, like I can be at home and know that I don't have 10,000 things on my list because all the things are allocated to either humans or for me in a timeline. So I don't have this waking up two in the morning and being up for an hour because my brain starts racing and I can't settle down. So that's sort of the outcome of getting those structures in place is that I can compartmentalize a little bit easier, but also have the confidence that I know when I am going to work on something and when that's coming up. So that as a mother has freed me up to be a lot more present with my family as well and show up for them in a better way rather than trying to do multiple That's a great point. I actually remember having a conversation with a dad in the community and one of his big goals at the time was just to be more present when he is with the kids. It's like I've got plenty of time, but when I'm there, I'm not there. And so that was one of the things that we focused on for three months as he was working through a whole bunch of changes. So I love that you point that out. As we put a wrap on this episode, I'd love to know, what's next? What does the horizon look like? You said you're visionary, you like to think big and zoom out. You've made some wonderful gains over the last few years, and especially since starting. But what's next? Well, if I go back to my original plan, I was supposed to have a practice in every capital city by now. And then I realized how hard it was to run a practice and have a family and birth babies and breastfeed and all the parts of the puzzle. So I've kind of tapered back a little bit in that dream, just a little. I would still love to see that come to fruition, but it might be something for my fifties. Oh, what is next? Um, like I said, working on leadership for, um, the team. So, um, that next layer, um, in the clinical side of things, working on that, uh, developing and growing the next generation of chiropractors is a huge passion of mine. Um, we have a three year program, a mentorship program that I've put together, um, that really nurtures and fast tracks, like really fast tracks there. development into becoming a very, very good chiropractor that works with children. So fleshing that out, I would so love to actually bottle that up and then also offer that externally to the practice. And so more people can actually get those higher skills quicker. What I'm very good at, I might not be the, you know, the research buff, or I might not be the the neuro buff, but I am very good at putting things together in systems and procedures and very good at targeting the emotional needs of the person in front of me and very good at picking up on what needs to happen there. So I know that I can bottle all that up, maybe some more seminars again. I'd love to get a bit more love and attention to my WellKids program. So yeah, so there's lots of things that are happening there. But first and foremost, I have a course that I have to finish. I've taken the week off work to actually get it done, which sadly I recognize it's not going to be all done in this week, but I'll keep trying. So I'm trying to tidy up some loops at the moment so then I can have the freedom and the headspace to move on to the next things. And it is frustrating for a mind of mine who wants to go and do all the stand the dirt, do the work. What I love from this conversation is that there are seasons in life and in business that saying this too shall pass, whether it's hardship or you're absolutely crushing it, there's just these different seasons that require a different level of skillset, a different perspective, a different system for you to sustainably progress. Not that we don't believe there's any sort of absolute version of success. As a clinic, it's your version of success. Just know that over time as you progress, you need to level up. I think that's probably one of the things I've really heard today in the conversation and seen a lot as well in speaking with clinic owners. is that when you're playing such an infinite game, a long game, it helps you come to terms with where you are today, because nothing worse than going, oh, it'll be all okay when I recruit this person in six weeks from now, everything will be solved. It's like, ah, then you got all these other challenges of onboarding, training, retaining, et cetera, or insert any other milestone in your journey. So what I love is your point to anchor back to purpose, and especially your values that sort of permeate home life and business life as well. Jacey, thank you for sharing so openly. I'm sure we'll do another one of these in the future, but really appreciate it. Thank you. All right, we'll catch you on another episode of the Grow Your Clinic podcast. Head over to clinicmastery.com for all the show notes and a whole bunch of other free goodies to learn how to grow your clinic sustainably. All Thanks for tuning in to the Grow Your Clinic podcast. To find out more about past episodes or how we can help you, head to www.clinicmastery.com forward slash podcast. And please remember to rate and review us on your podcast