From Takeover to Triumph: Sam Cooke's Journey with Blue Bricks Magazine

Happy Monday and welcome back to the Girls in Property Podcast!

In today’s episode, Athena hosts an exclusive interview with Sam Cooke, the owner and editor of Blue Bricks Magazine, following the inaugural 2024 Blue Bricks Awards.

Join Athena and Sam as they explore the origins of Blue Bricks Magazine, Sam’s inspiring takeover, and the exciting future ahead. Plus, get an insider's look at the behind-the-scenes challenges of organising the Blue Bricks Awards ceremony, including surprising invoices like £8,000 for tables and chairs!

This episode is filled with laughter, fun, and candid conversations. It’s one you won’t want to miss. Tune in now!

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Disclaimer: None of the content in our podcast is intended to constitute legal or financial advice. All interviews and statements are the thoughts & opinions of the hosts and guests themselves and should be...

Transcript

0:01

Good morning everyone and welcome to today's episode of the Girls in Property podcast. How is everybody doing today? I hope you're all well, whatever it is. Is it a Monday you're listening? Is it a Tuesday? Is it a Friday? What are you up to? Let me know as always. So today I actually have somebody that I would love to introduce you to and I'm very excited about. I, he basically recently did his Blue Bricks Awards, which was amazing. And I'll get him to tell you all about it. And also is a real fantastic advocate as well for women in property and ethics in general in the property industry. So if you haven't guessed it already, I would like to introduce you to the incredible Sam Cook. Hey Sam. Hi, thanks, we've got a lot to live up to now. The incredible sound cook, that's a good one. Thank you, Athena. No, you are, you are. And I love what you stand for as well, which of course we're all going to get into, you know, for people who don't know you and the way that you hold yourself within the industry as well, which I really want to talk to you about. But I've, as I mentioned to you just before you came on the podcast, you are actually my second gentleman to come on the podcast, which is really, really exciting. Cortes did an amazing job when he came on and I very much welcome guys to come onto this podcast. And actually I've got a couple of guys coming on over the next couple of weeks, which you all, all you ladies have to look forward to and gentlemen, of course. but predominantly I want to get guys on who really are about sort of ethics within the industry and have something to say in a wonderful way. And you're definitely that person. So I very much am looking forward to this conversation. Thank you, yeah I've been looking forward to it myself too because I know you'll probably ask some interesting questions. Yes, I do do that. I'm sure you know. So why don't you first of all introduce yourself to everyone, let people know about you, who are you and maybe something interesting about yourself, Sam, and we'll take the conversation from there. Yeah, definitely. So my name is Sam Cook. I'm the owner and editor of Blue Bricks Property Magazine. My background is a little bit bizarre. I used to be a stand -up comedian originally. That was like one of the main things that I did. I traveled down the UK doing stand -up comedy alongside my full -time job. And then I left that in 2019 to go traveling. I had a massive love for property. I used to sit at my desk at work and just listen to property podcasts and... people on YouTube and read property books. And I just became obsessed with it. And I started to talk to property people on LinkedIn, go for coffees with them. And I went traveling to Southeast Asia, came back and I was like, this is it. I need to kind of take the leap and actually get into property and start a career because I've been working since I was 16 years old, but I'd always just taken jobs that paid well. There was no like direction to what I was doing. So I started my career as a state agent basically. And we'll probably talk about that later on, because you've asked for a proper horror story and I've got a few from that job. It was very interesting time. And then from a state agency, lost my job in COVID and started sourcing properties using my experience in the areas in the state agent, because it was like, three weeks, we'll flatten the curve and then it'll all go back to normal. What a perfect time to start business. And obviously that was extremely difficult. And during that period, I was recruited by Blue Bricks magazine to be their marketing manager. So I worked for Blue Bricks magazine, a set market manager for a long time. Blue Bricks was owned in part by a good friend of mine called Caroline Munch and in part by another extremely good friend of mine called Nathan Winch. Nathan runs a private equity firm. So his job is to, they buy and sell businesses in the simplest terms and invest in businesses. Knowing I was quite ambitious, Nathan showed me that side too. So I was part working for Nathan, helping him talk about businesses as an investment analyst, and then part working with Blue Bricks, just helping him on their marketing strategy. And then after a while of helping Nathan, he kind of turned around and said, look, I know you want to do what I do. We're looking to sell Blue Bricks magazine. Why don't you buy it off me? And that can be your first kind of acquisition. You already know the business, you're in property. you're a good writer, you know what you're doing, take it over. So that's how I came to buy Blue Bricks off of them and then come to run it two years ago. amazing I love that and okay I've got a lot of questions to ask you about that but the first question I've got is you used to be a stand -up comedian I did not know that Nah, it's because I'm not funny, you can't tell. Why do you think I'm reading magazines now? I had no idea about that. I think it takes a certain type of personality and it takes a certain type of character to actually decide to go into that profession of being a stand -up comedian. So did you actually stand on stage and do stand -up comedy to an audience? Was that your life? Yeah, well, I did it. It was more of a hobby that I was trying to make into a career. I've not told people about it for the longest time. It used to just slip out in conversation and then I got really weird reactions with it. So I thought, you know what, I'll start weaving it into the conversation because it's a bit of an icebreaker. So yeah, I would tour. On evenings, I would do open spots like across the UK, I mean Liverpool, Manchester, Hot Water Comedy Club. I performed there twice. performed in front of 250 people. That was kind of like the biggest show I did. And then sometimes did a pub to four people, which was always like the worst. So yeah, that was me for close to a year and I loved it. Wow, that's like, that's amazing. That's one of my fondest facts about you. I love the fact that you did that. But you know how you just said, I used to tell people that and I used to get like a strange reaction? What sort of reactions did you used to get when you used to tell people that? I think it just takes people by shock. You know when you do something and a novel it kind of wears off? It's like I didn't realise that people like I stand up comedy like I couldn't imagine myself doing that or actually a lot of people turned around said I would love to do stand up comedy and I've never know how to get into it. So it just ended up sparking quite nice conversations with people. I can imagine. Yeah. bit different to the kind of stale, yeah I used to be in a state age and you know it's just a bit more of a fun way of attracting people really. completely and it tells me so much more about your personality as well because my background is the arts I used to be in the arts till I was about 18 and so my world has very much been on stage and performing and everything like that and a lot of my friendship groups I know a lot of stand-up comedians and I know a lot of people within that world and I know also how difficult that world is and actually quite frankly it teaches you a lot about rejection doesn't it as well you know when a joke just doesn't hit right or You have four people in the audience and it teaches you a lot of character, I can imagine. You know, I'm just trying to picture that world really. Yeah, it does. Comedy is a weird one because it's like, if you do what, like people are scared of public speaking and I always say to people, if you do a presentation and even if it's a bit boring, people will just respect you and they will be polite. You're in a professional setting, they'll clap, they'll smile, they'll be nice. Comedy is one of those ones where if you do a set that's not good or one of your jokes doesn't land, people will let you know vocally while you're on stage. So it builds character, it builds resilience, I think. And it teaches you a lot about public speaking, a lot about psychology, a lot about events and how to run events and how to set up certain environments. I was saying to Zach, my marketing manager on the way down from the awards, I genuinely think out of all of my kind of past things I've done, stand -up comedy is probably the one that I still use the most to this day and has taught me the most. Yeah, I absolutely love that. And you know, it actually makes complete sense because when I saw you stand on stage at the Blue Bricks Awards to speak, I'd of course never seen you speak before. So I had no idea what to expect. And you stood there with such confidence and you spoke with such heart and clarity. Now it all makes complete sense. I was like, wow, Sam's a good speaker. And I was like, now I know why. Now I get the whole thing. So sorry that I detoured on that, but... just had no idea that that was your story, which is fantastic. So thank you, I love that. And then Blue Bricks, for example. So again, fantastic story. It's the fact that you actually went to work for Blue Bricks effectively, and did that. And then from there, you had this opportunity to take where you went, actually, I will buy it from you because I know the direction in which I want to take it. And I love that. I love when you have a vision. people who have visions and they go, I know I can make this work. I know I can make this great. And clearly you've done that. How did you feel when you first, like how many, how long ago did you actually take it on completely on your own? two years ago now, so I think it was 2022. Yeah, it will have been 20. And what was the feeling you had? Like if you take yourself back two years ago to Sam two years ago and you've just taken it on, you're now like, right, this is now mine, I now own Blue Bricks Magazine. What were your initial feelings? What was your initial sort of like, okay, now what do I do? Yeah, I think first of all, it was massive imposter syndrome, like huge imposter syndrome. And at the time, it was really, really difficult when I first bought Blue Bricks because someone very close to me passed away at pretty much the same time. And that was really affecting me. But I took over Blue Bricks right as the next issue was due. So it was like, there's no time to grieve because I've just publicly told everyone that I've bought Blue Bricks. now I need to deliver the first issue that's going to have my name on it. And that was like a big kind of scary burden. So I had a lot of imposter syndrome and I'm like, so this first issue that I do needs to be perfect. So I don't really have time to grieve. And that was really affecting me. And also the person that was supposed to be doing a handover ended up leaving. So there was no, like the handover process was, you know, Nathan and Caroline helped me out. but it wasn't very smooth and seamless. So I had to learn how to put a magazine together while putting it together while trying to grieve. And that whole process was quite difficult. So yeah, and there was a lot of fear when I first bought the business. It's a big thing. It's the biggest thing I'd ever done at that time. And it was just the fear, the imposter syndrome, I would say, because I know that I'm young. I know that I look young and it was like, what are people going to think? Is there going to be a lot of judgment there? That was a huge worry at the time. Well, let's come on to that conversation in a moment because I definitely want to talk to you about that as part of this conversation because we've got quite a lot of younger listeners as well and I really want to have that chat with you. But before we sort of delve too deep into it because I just want to learn and hear all about Blue Bricks and you and everything. But before we do that in true traditional girls and property style, can you also please tell us something you're... clearly a lot of things that you are celebrating at the moment as well. I'd say well at the time of filming we're one week away from the award after the Blue Bricks Awards I think I'm still celebrating that really because putting the Blue Bricks Awards together took about eight months best part of the year so now that's done it was a huge success and I'm still celebrating that. You should, you should massively celebrate it. And you know, I know what it, how it feels to put these events on. And I think you did absolutely brilliantly. It is hard work. You know, you put your soul into it and I just, I loved the detail that you had. I loved everything. Also, you know, you managed to get a Britain's Got Talent magician. He's the soldier magician is his thing, isn't it? Yeah, Soldier of Fallusion. Richard Jones, he won in 2016, I think it was. They don't. So we had live first -hand magician there as well. And also the, you know, the awards were fantastic. Not gonna lie, Sam, slightly gutted that I didn't win for girls in the property. I'm just gonna put it out there that I'm not sorry about it at all. That's good to know because I was worried you would be. No, honestly, I think it's brilliant. And I think, do you know what, like, if anything, I think it's sometimes a good thing when, and I've always been a believer of this, I think it's a good thing when certain things don't happen to you at certain times, because it almost just fuels your fire even more, just to go, do you know what, let's go again next year, let's go again. And quite frankly, you know, a lot of these other companies, I've been there for like five, six years and got like, huge teams of, as I've said to you before, and like I am still very much one woman band doing everything that I do for Girls and Property, which hopefully will be expanding soon. So, you know, I'm still extremely proud to even have been a finalist. So it's okay. I'll take the fact I didn't win, Sam. It's fine. You know, I think you were finalized against some real powerhouses in there, like some really good communities came forward, some almost national ones came forward. And I think for you to be finalized alongside them and to be finalized as an event that only focuses around women was like a huge achievement too. You know, what, cause you've got that kind of niche, so to speak. So you did so well. thank you, thank you. But yeah, so you're celebrating Blue Bricks, of course, because this podcast will be coming out literally next week, so it'll all be really relevant as well. And then in terms of my, I was thinking about my celebration, so, because you were coming on, of course, one of my celebrations is the fact that Girls and Property was a finalist, which is fantastic. But then something else I thought that I was celebrating, which I haven't actually spoken about yet, is I recently went away to Greece on holiday. And I've trying to get away quite a lot this year. I love to travel. You know, you spoke about earlier that you went, you went traveling. I also went traveling for a year when I was younger and took a gap year. And I went around Southeast Asia and, you know, Australasia and South America. And I love to travel. Like travel is literally in my blood. And I was trying to explain this to somebody the other day where they're like, is property like your true passion? And I went, no, travel is my true passion. Property is the vehicle that gets me to travel. And that's how I describe it. So my passion is travel. That's what I love. I love culture. I love food. I love meeting different people. I love learning all the time. And it's just such an amazing thing. And I was away in Greece and a lot of the times I'm constantly working when I'm away. And this time, because I was with my extended family, I was like, I'm not gonna work. I'm literally just going to have a holiday for a week, which was amazing. And what I actually noticed was before what was happening was I was working and then of course there was monies coming in because I was working and I was like, yeah, that's what I meant to do. I meant to keep the businesses alive. I meant to do this. This is what everything will implode if I don't carry on. And actually what happened was I put my laptop to the side, played cards, played backgammon, went for food. And actually what happened was the money was still coming in. So ever so often I'd be like, plus X. Plus X, money here, money here. And every single day there was money coming into the businesses, because I've got multiple businesses. And I was like, maybe I've actually achieved something here. Maybe actually this is what life is supposed to be as an entrepreneur, where you've done all the hard work or still doing the hard work. And actually you can relax, take a breath, be on a beach and money still come in. And actually it took me a while to realize, wow, maybe. maybe I am doing okay. And that was quite a nice feeling actually to have that moment of thinking, okay, I've worked really hard, still working hard, but actually I am where I'm meant to be. And I'm on a beach and I have got money and life is okay. And that was quite a big moment for me. It was quite nice. And I got to share it with my family. So that was nice. I can imagine, I think every kind of entrepreneur has that fear when they go away somewhere. It is almost like, if I go away for two days, will the world end? And I think the first time you do it and you realize, actually, I've come back and everything's okay and everyone's fine and I'm still making money. It is like a massive sigh of relief. Yeah, don't get me wrong. I've also been on holiday where everything has gone wrong. I can tell you holidays where literally I've had it where guests have called me, the cleaners haven't turned up, the tenants have been locked out their rooms. Like I've had both ends of it. One where a holiday went well, both when a holiday didn't go well. So it's not always like glitz and glamour, but sometimes you can have certain moments when you just go, just breathe. it's everything's gonna be okay and yeah that was quite nice so I think that's a good celebration to to say to people it's okay it's okay to take a moment You know what, I'm quite lucky in my business really because there's very rarely ever like an emergency that needs to be dealt with right now. Because obviously we print magazines and send it to our readers who have advertisers unless something went severely, severely wrong. I don't know. Someone printed something that was completely incorrect which wouldn't happen because we have proofreaders and all sorts. There'd never be a, I need to be there right now. And actually it's something that's not occurred to me till I spoke to other entrepreneurs in property where I'm like, wow, like if you have a guest that's really unhappy that needs dealing with immediately. I very rarely have that emergency. you know what, and actually Sam, hold on to that for dear life would be what I would say. Like that is fantastic because, so I'm talking about the celebration of me and Greece living my best life, but hold on, let's just have a reality check, shall we? So on Saturday, I was at a family barbecue, so I was having a nice barbecue, la la la, birds are tweeting, happy days. Suddenly a guest is supposed to be checking in. They're like, hi Athena, the apartment hasn't been cleaned. And I was like, what do you mean the apartment hasn't been cleaned? And they showed me the photos and the apartment definitely hadn't been cleaned. And I was like, my God, what has happened here? And so then I had to contact the cleaning team. Then I had to be like, have I got to go in and, you know, to the apartments? Then suddenly people are like, saying like my family are like, why aren't you eating? Why aren't you like, you know, why are you on your phone? What's going on? And I was like, well, the apartments haven't been cleaned. This is happening. You know, and it completely takes you out of a moment that you're in because you've got to deal with that. And it's like, and you have moments by the way, let's just be really real. Like in those moments you go, why am I doing this? Like, why am I doing this? Why do I do this to myself? Is this even what I actually wanna do? And like, I know that there are so many other people out there that feel that. So Sam, hold on to dear life what you have. I tell you a funny story actually, when I was setting the awards up, we had one evening, we had, there's a long story behind this, but I thought that chairs and tables came with the venue as you would. And the venue said, there's no chairs and tables, something's going to be stood. And I was like, sorry, excuse me. They're like, I have as good a studge. So I was like, there's no chairs, there's nothing to eat, to sit down and eat, there was no chairs or tables. And I was like, well, hang on a minute. And I was like, don't worry, we can order them in for eight and a half grand. And I went, I, we solved this problem in the end as you can tell because she was sat on a chair eating. I went to Wales to my auntie, my auntie lives in the middle of nowhere in Wales and I was like I need to get into the countryside before I explode. Turn my phone off and just be out there. And I was walking around a little farm shop in the middle of Wales, surrounded by mountains and thought I could do this. I could put a little apron on, serve people some cheese and milk. Like why am I torturing myself with entrepreneurship when I could just... work this, you know, nine to five, meet some people and be smiling. So yeah, I think everyone has those days where they go, why am I putting myself through this? Honestly, sorry, eight and a half grand for tables and chairs. yeah, yeah. It got to a point where, like setting up an event, invoices just come through left, right and center, what's that for? it's for the center pieces from tables. Okay. I got to a point of absolute apathy. Just pay it, no question. It was, yeah, I mean the awards, absolutely incredible. Loved every second of it, but so much more goes into it than I originally anticipated. you know what, I hear you and I know that mine was, because obviously I did my event and mine had 82 women there and of course yours had like 300 whatever, but it's still like, you know, okay, how much for the goodie bags? Okay, now they've got to be printed. Okay, how much for the cookies? How much for the centerpieces? How much for the food? How much for the Prosecco that we're gonna give them? How much for this? And suddenly, you know, you create as many budgets and flow charts as you want being like, I'll profit this much. And then when you actually look at it, you're like, okay. So basically it was just a really fun party. No money was made. You know, I was really stressed about it. And then a lot of people I spoke to, especially people around the world, went, I don't worry. You never met money on your first one. And I had a really good grip on my cashflow. And I got to a point where I just, every day there's money coming in that I didn't expect, and money coming out that I didn't expect. So I don't even know where I am anymore. But yeah, I think your first one's always a bit like that, but I'm sure you will like me on your event. I've learned so much from it that if I did. Again, if I did another big event, it would be seamless now because I know what questions to ask. I know what things look out for that I didn't originally like. Does the venue come with chairs and tables? It's a question I didn't think to ask. That is insane. That actually is insane. I have to admit, I've never heard that one before. I've never, ever. I mean, it was in a castle, so it was stunning. Stunning venue. was my fault because I kind of pushed into the absolute limits. I'm like, believe in yourself, you can do this. And they're like, no, we've told you that we can only fit certain amount of people in. I'm like, believe in yourself. And we did it. And I think I'm probably one of the biggest fence ever done. And we got chairs and tables in the end. But yeah, it was. Yeah, I've had some very strange problems this year, problems like that way. It's like your family's like, what's wrong with you? And you're like, I don't know how to say this without sounding like an absolute madman. Yeah, yeah, but you did it. You did it. And let's just go back and have this conversation then. So, if you don't mind me asking, because I think it's important for the listeners to know the answers to these questions. So, how old were you when you acquired Blue Bricks? And you know, I'll tell you the honest truth because people ask me my age all the time and what I do now, I just tell people random numbers. So I've told some people I'm 40. I think I've told some people I'm 18. It just, it depends on the person how well they know them. So I was 20. I was either 22 or 23 when I bought Blue Bricks. No, I think I was 23 when I bought Blue Bricks actually. Cause I'm 25 now. So yeah, I was about 23 years old. Yeah, incredible, absolutely amazing. And do you know what? Like I've always been a massive believer that age is completely irrelevant. It really is so irrelevant. It's all to do with the person that you see in front of you. So you had a vision and it's so inspiring for young people that listen to this podcast to go, do you know what? Like if Sam can do it, so can I. Like why can't you, as it were? And like, how did you feel? For example, let me ask you this question. I don't know what would have happened to you in this moment. Like, how did you feel when you were that age? You had just taken on Blue Bricks magazines and you now had to get, I don't know, was it a case where people still were writing to you because they wanted to be in your magazine or were you having to reach out to be like, would you like to be featured in the magazine? How did it work? Yeah, it's changed. When I took it over, there were a few people who were regular features. I was like, you know, do you want to keep writing for us and blanked us? And it was really funny when the brands grew, they were coming back like, I'm really sorry. I forgot to reply to messages. I'd love to be in the magazine again. And so in the early days, it was a bit harder because we had to push a lot to try and get people and to try and draw people and to try and get the right people because no one had ever heard of Blue Bricks. And then you're trying to show people that Blue Bricks isn't just like... cute little magazine run by this young kid, which is, you know, if people saw me at an event, I didn't have a beard then, so it would be even worse. I'm calling this a beard, that's generous. But, you know, you have to try and really prove yourself, I know that was difficult. Whereas now, because the brand is well known, and because they've seen it all over social media, and they've seen the awards, we've got our content booked up to the end of the year. People are constantly coming to me and saying, can I be in the magazine? Can I do this? Can I do that? So it's a lot more of a pull game now than it is a push game. And a lot of people, to be fair, don't even realise I'm the owner of Blue Bricks when they meet me and stuff. And I always tell people I'm the editor. I very rarely say I'm the owner. So that's what... The first time around was insecure about my age. I never lied. If someone said who owns it, I'd say me. I'd never lie. But I'd indirect so like I'm the editor. And now it's just... Just to... When I say I'm the owner, a lot of people are like, right, I really want to be in the magazine. I want to do this. I want to do that. So if I say I'm the editor... It gives me a bit of leeway that people don't kind of jump all over me sometimes. And it gives me a bit of breathing space to kind of figure out like who they are, what to do, and if they're going to be the right fit. So you feel a bit bombarded then as soon as they find out you're the owner suddenly Do you feel like their personality maybe changes around you and they want something from you? Yeah, sometimes a little bit, yeah. And it's not a lie either, I am the editor of the Blue Ritz, I edit it, I put it together, so it is the truth, that is my kind of primary trouble. Yeah, definitely. I don't, well, certainly now I think people know that you are the owner of Blue Bricks after the awards. I think people do know that now. And I think it's fantastic and I really think it's so inspiring, I really do. And I think that actually a lot of, you know what, even like a lot of younger people, I categorize myself in the same category as you, Sam, like I like to think I'm young as well. So us young people, let's go for. I'm holding onto it for dear life, my youth. It's like, yeah, let's, like, we have so many different perspectives, I think. Like, I feel like we're a different generation. We see things differently. We were raised differently, potentially. And I just think, like, we have so much to give. Like, you see so many young people coming up the ranks now, both men and women, who are doing incredible things in the industry. And then you find out they're 21, 20, 22, 24. And people do say to me, to be fair, I've had the conversations where people have said to me, well what would they know? They don't have any life experience, they can't possibly know the things that a 40 year old, 50 year old would know. And I just say to them, I say that's so narrow minded, because it doesn't matter about an age of a person. You could have a 40 year old that has half the experience of a 21 year old. You really could. You don't know that person's story, that person's life up until that point. I completely agree and I mean I've spoken to 40 year olds, 50 year olds that they spent up until they were 30 partying and going out and never really went traveling, never experienced the world and realistically worked a job where they did the same thing every single year so I think it's not just about being young it's like every year since I've been 16 I've tried new things, done new things, traveled, met people, I read a ton of books and was listening to podcasts and meeting people and I'm always trying to grow myself as a person so realistically if you know Physically I'm 25, mentally I've put as much into that as I can to be older in my mind if that makes sense. Whereas some people, like I say, just repeat the same year, year after year, even though they're 40 physically, in the brain they've not really progressed since we're 30. Well, also Sam, I can quite tell you, as I'm sure you know, as the listeners know, I may be 30 -something year old, but I'm very much 85 within my heart. Absolutely. Like, I wanna be in bed. about... be in bed at 8 p with a cup of tea and you're like pulling me in being like right coming to the after party at the Blue Bricks I'm like I'm like no Sam I'm going to bed you're like no you're coming to the after party and actually I have to say that's where the best conversations happen like I had the most amazing chats with with Van and Brandy and everyone and actually had a great time but you know my 85 year old spirit was also pulling me back going no Athena time for bed I tell you what, two things. Number one, I suffered for that after party for a day or two after and B, I'm glad you can remember it because it's kind of a black hole for me. But yeah, like I've got an age now where if someone's playing music or if I'm out of school, that's a bit loud, isn't it? And that's how I know I'm getting older. Yeah, we've got our old spirits as it were, but it's brilliant. I love that. And so also, like, what's wonderful, I actually haven't announced this yet, but hopefully I'm going to do a post about it. You also gave me the most wonderful privilege of actually writing for the Blue Bricks article as well. So I've actually got a, which is quite, it's quite bizarre actually. And actually I'll tell you something I would like to say, and I'm going to make a post about this as well. As you know, I'm a dyslexic. I've always said I'm dyslexic, I really struggle with reading and writing, like I've always said that. And so when you said to me, I think I'd love for you to write for Blue Bricks, I first of all was like, right, okay, how am I gonna do this? And then you said, I want 1500 words. And I went, God, it's like university all over again. And then you said you've got about two days to do it after your retreat. And I was like, my God. I was like, okay, how do I do this? And what I wanna say is, please, please, Obviously support Sam and Blue Bricks and definitely get yourself a copy. But also, you know, for anyone out there who has imposter syndrome, who has dyslexia, who has dyspraxia, who feels that they can't do something, believe me when I say this to you, if I can do it, like anyone can do it. That's how I feel, literally. It's just such a wonderful thing when you prove teachers and you prove lots of people and be like, well, here you go, you know. I've done it and you gave me that opportunity to write my first ever article. So I just want to say like, thank you so much from the bottom of my heart. Like, I really appreciate that. No, my pleasure. And I think it's really good to mention that. It's one thing I do want to say to people is like a bit of a, you know, people think they almost have to be famous to be in a magazine or be like multi -multi-millionaires and that's not the case. We also want people to react to doing property and doing stuff in property, but we're just looking for great stories. People have done good projects or have an interesting angle as to how they've gotten to doing what they're doing. So not just the imposter syndrome around writing, but if you would like to feature and get in touch too. we can always have a chat. The worst thing I'll ever say to someone is it might not be right for the magazine right now, but let's keep in touch and maybe in six months here it could be. So yeah, I think if anyone's worried about that, just reach out. Yeah. Sam, I am famous. You were like, you don't have to be famous. I'm like, I am famous, Sam. you are, you're different, you're pretty well known in the industry. That's just your protocol name though, no one's going to forget Athena. I'm... I was going to change my name to Amy Smith. the most boring name you can possibly imagine. By the way, if your name's Amy Smith, I mean that the most polite way. But, you know, Amy Smith. And that's what I would have been from 16 for the rest of my life, when basically my mum stopped me from doing it. But I was gonna legally change my name because I hated my name so much. And actually, I now in later life realize that my name is a blessing. So please don't ever change your name, anyone. Keep your name. Unless you're called Amy Smith because Athena's just really bullied you then. Yeah, but I mean, if you were John Smith and you were trying to fame a sort of Bill Viard Brown, that's going to be difficult. Do you know John Smith? Which one? So yeah, no, I think you've done the right thing. And you know what, when I saw my name on the front cover of the magazine, on the Blue Bricks magazine, and actually, first of all, that was so cool when I saw my name on there. And then the second thing that was really cool is when I saw at the Blue Bricks Awards, Helen Chauley, who is fabulous, a massive, incredible woman in the property industry, she was sat there reading Blue Bricks magazine, and then she flicked over and it was my article. And I just had to be like, by the way, that's me. Yeah. it was the most surreal experience of having the person on the front cover of the magazine then turn and read, like be like, that's you, that's your article. And I was like, yeah, yeah, I wrote an article. That was a very surreal experience for me. So that was cool. Helen is absolutely fantastic. I interview a lot of people for the magazines and people you build an okay relationship with but Helen was one of those people that I was like, you're just my kind of person. I think she's brilliant. And I feel like I find a bit of a friend in her now. Yeah, she's great. So talk to me about the future of Blue Bricks Magazine. So for the future, talk to me, because you mentioned a little bit of this at the awards, but I want to delve a bit deeper to this. So for your vision going forward, what are we doing? What's the plan? Yeah, I've got a careful around what I do say because I'm launching a new product that no one really knows about that. I'm keeping on the apps until it's launched. All right. So we'll be launching new products. Basically the vision for blubricks. I just want to make the lives of property investors easier. I want it to be a path. I want blubricks to be something that a property investor needs. It's going to be something that they have in their toolbox. That's a long walk to help them. grow their property portfolio. And the vision I see it being is I want us to be the source of reliable information in the industry that people can turn to and go, I know the information I read in here is going to be honest, it's going to be truthful. And it is genuinely going to help me. There's a lot of not just magazines, but articles, podcasts, YouTube videos, and a lot of the content is just feel good. It's like, it doesn't really help you, it doesn't really show you what you need to do, but it just makes you feel really, really good about yourself. And I don't want to be doing that. I do want the advice and knowledge to be practical. The idea is that if you read Blue Bridge, you can actually go, all right, I can do that, I can do that, I can do that and start to see results. So whenever I'm putting magazines together and make sure we have stuff like in there, like your, for example, your article was extremely practical. You outlined proper steps on how to leave your nine to five and get full time into property. That's the sort of stuff we love, not just do your journaling and your affirmations and get cold shower. Like, I mean, if you want to do that, fantastic, but you know, it's not what we're writing about. Yeah, I love that. Well said. Hilarious. Because the reason I'm laughing is because it wasn't me, but somebody went to one of these events recently and literally they just spoke quite a lot about manifestation, which I'm massive for. I'm all for manifestation. I always have been. But then it was things like, well, how did you get this? How did you get this? And they just kept replying, I manifested it. I manifested it. And it's like, well, Can we just give some practical advice here, please? So yeah, that just made me giggle when you just said that. But you know what, I have to say Sam, because I tell you why I have to say it, because I think you're very similar to me, right? In the respect that I think you and me maybe find it a bit hard to kind of like shout about ourselves to be like, okay, this is why I'm doing this. And this is why I'm doing this. Because it's a bit awkward and it's a bit weird. So I feel like I have to do it, I'm like, right, I'm gonna do it for you in that case. It's really hard to do it for yourself, but you can do it for other people. So what I love about the, what differentiates you is the fact that the magazine has authentic, ethical, good people in it, doing good things within the industry. And like when you stood on stage and you spoke from the heart saying, I just wanna do good in this industry, like let's face it and have a frank conversation. There is... Property is a minefield and property can be wild west and cowboy and everybody knows it, right? Everyone knows it. And you, you know, the most common thing I get, I get told or asked when people come to me to start out in the property industry is they say, Athena, I just don't know who to trust. I don't know who to trust. I don't know who to turn to. And quite frankly, I think they come to me sometimes not even expecting me to be the answer to their solution. they're actually coming to me to say, Athena, who should I go to? Which is such an honor because they then think, you know, Athena will tell me the truth, which I've always done. And I always will stand for authenticity, integrity all the way. And I think that's what you stand for as well, where you're like, I want to have a room full of good people, good property investors. Like I think it's getting such a negative stigma at the moment. And we're seeing so many things almost coming out in the woodwork for things that are happening within the industry that maybe people didn't know about. And actually it's like, well, can we just remember that there is still good within the industry. There is still good people doing good things and let's all, let's all collaborate. Let's all come together to represent the change we want to see. And I find you very much at the forefront of that, trying to be part of that change as well. And I, that's what I love about you most, like the fact that you're really super charging that forward. So. I really respect that. thank you. It's really, it genuinely is really important to me. And I suppose maybe I do need to shout about it more, but the reason I don't is I don't want it to be preachy. It's just, I always try and do the right thing and help people. That's what's important to me is making a positive difference in everything that I do. And so I hate the term because it's so generic, but like add value. I like to just help in, you know, give to people and make a positive difference. And that's what the Blue Bricks Awards was about was it's about celebrating people that are helping charities doing. social housing supported living making a really positive difference in the industry and okay they're doing mega deals and making good money at the same time but that was our kind of my way of saying we're getting all this really bad legislation against landlords we're really getting hammered the stereotype around landlords is awful if we can do an award ceremony that showcases 12 -1 there is a lot of good in this industry that's one nice way of fighting back and it's something I've struggled with massively over the past six months is who to trust because it's terrifying. This industry is statistically, it's not even an opinion, this one of the worst industries for people who have got dark personality traits. So in psychology, there's what's called the dark triad. I spoke about this on one of our podcasts, you've got Machiavellians. narcissists and I forgot what the other ones is now, I think it's psychopaths or something along those lines but basically people that don't have the nicest traits about them are really drawn to the property industry so it's scary, it is a minefield. But then, you know what's so interesting about that? So that's one side of the industry, right? But I can tell you, and as you know, right, I have met some of the most amazing people within the industry as well. And I've always said properties are people's business. You know, I've got friends for life within it, both men and women, you know. And I find that if you, I find that... I said this to Van about three o 'clock in the morning when I'd had a couple of gin and pronics in the wine cellar. I said to him, if we could all just be good people, the world would be such a wonderful, easy place. Like it's not rocket science. If we just come from a place of just, just well -guarded goodness, then that's, that's all that matters. So I think that, you know, let's continue to be the change we want to see, which is what I would say, you know, continue to do blue bricks, continue to, to, you know, have people featured who are doing great things within the industry and get them exposed so that people then know who to trust, who to go to and do that. Because that, I tell you, that's the number one question I get asked the most is who should I be trusting within the industry is the question I get asked. Yeah, and the thing is that there are some incredible people in this industry that are just amazing human beings and doing so much good and can't do enough for you. And I'm blessed, I know you've got the same with your community, that somehow, I don't know how I've managed to do it, I've just managed to magnetise them towards me, that the circle around me are typically really good people. And I've learnt to trust my gut now, I've started to get quite good at picking out people who I think are just not good news. But yeah, I think we've both got that ability to draw the right people to us. Yeah, I love that. And did you say like, I can't remember when you said this to me, did you say that like, you had a background in psychology or? yeah, one of my magic tricks at two o'clock in the morning, which I normally do after a few pints. I studied psychology quite extensively under probably one of the best and most respected. I can't really explain him, but for the sake of these of reference, we'll call them psychologists in the UK who... I originally started working with him for my own stuff to help me. And he helped me with everything, mindset, my business, me personally, took me out of a really dark place. And I've never felt that remind my wife after meeting him. And I say all the success I've had since then has come from how he helped me untangle my own mind. And then from there. I'm always quite an empathetic person. I did comedy because I like to bring joy to other people. I noticed there's a lot of people that suffer and struggle and I can spot it. And I started saying to him, well, how can I help other people and make a difference? And he sort of started to show me things you can pick up on, things you can do. how to tell if someone's not okay, how to tell certain things about people. So that, yeah, I do have that. And I use it mainly to help others, to help friends, tell people around me, and also to spot people who put on a false face. It helps to identify those people too. I love that. And you know, if I could go back to university, I would go back and I would do psychology because I just find, I just find people so interesting. I'm that type of person. I don't know if you're this type of person. I'll be sitting at a cafe and I can almost zone out because what I'm doing is I'm people watching. I'm watching the tables. I'm watching the people walking by and I'm really fascinated by their body language, by their conversations. I've, I've once sat at a table with somebody and they're like, you're not listening to me, are you? And I'm like, No, I think that table two over there are on their first date and I'm just really curious about it. And they're like, I'm just completely zoned out, like looking at the table over there with their first date. I love it. Yeah, I really struggle in crowded rooms with a lot going on to focus on conversation. So I imagine at the Blue Bricks World, that was a nightmare to talk to because I was like, I'm trying to concentrate on you, but I'm trying to look over everywhere else. And someone just smashed a glass. And do I have to pay for that or is that covered in reinsurance? So yeah, let's see what you mean. Gosh, gosh, are you naturally an introvert would you say? Massively, I'm a massive inch for it, yeah. So let me ask you this final question, right? As an introvert, what made you one day say, do you know what? I want to make an awards ceremony. I've asked myself that for the best part of the year now, why am I doing this? It was, I wanted to do something, so originally it was where I was saying, how do we get the brand out there a bit more from a marketing perspective and show that we're more than a magazine and that we are, and that's how the idea for an award ceremony came around and it started off, and then I was sat thinking, well, I don't just want to do a property award ceremony. There's one out there, there's a couple out there. And I, if I'm doing something, I don't want it to be like anything else, anyone else is doing. I just don't want to be like with someone. So I thought, well, how can I be different? And someone was talking to me and they're like, you know what? I've never seen an award for social housing before. I thought it's really interesting. And I started thinking about it and I thought, well, actually there's not many awards for people that are... doing just incredible things and they might not have the biggest property portfolio but they've made a huge change in their life. Maybe they've come from the background of drugs and drink or maybe they've helped other people and I thought we should do an awards ceremony that celebrates people that are obviously in property doing deals but are doing great things too. So that's where it all kind of came from and that's why I took two days in Scotland after the awards because I'm an introvert, I can do the extrovert stuff, I can you know be the life and solo party but It's like having a phone on, like it really drains my battery doing it. So I can do it, but then I need to recover from it afterwards. Which is why I spent time alone. I love that, but I love the fact that you knew that and you knew that was going to happen and so you preempted it and was like, I'm going to go book two days in Scotland with no phone signal completely on my own. And I think that's fab. And probably you've read all the messages on Facebook and Instagram and you know, all the messages you probably received personally. And I'm sure it's just off praise and saying, you know, great job and everything. It's just so nice to receive, I'm sure. Yeah, to have so many people raving about it's amazing. Some people have had the best night of their life and then you look and you go, I did that. It's this real feeling. Yeah, it was just seeing people enjoy themselves. That was the biggest thing. Seeing people have fun and have a laugh. That was like the biggest reward. Fantastic, I love that. Well, you've definitely, let's just say, inspired me and there'll be some big, hopefully things coming for 2026 where I might need to just have a conversation with you and be like, Sam, what do I need to know to put on an award ceremony? Now I do know to ask that question. piece of advice for you. But yeah, no, I'm always here to help you. And obviously anyone listening to this too, if people just want a chat or a coffee or if I can help with anything, obviously subscribing to the magazine, being in the magazine or just a chat, let me know. I'm always happy to talk to people. Amazing and then in true traditional style salmon and one of my favorite bits of the podcast always I've got to say and I'm gonna be writing a book about about this one day because they're just brilliant Do you happen to have a property mishap property disaster that you've ever experienced yourself or been involved in from your estate agent days or since that you can tell us about Yeah, so I was originally going to do one about a house I refurb that was a disaster from start to finish. We pulled it off in the end. That house, I'm pretty sure was haunted. It was really weird, but I was thinking what would make a better one for the podcast? And I'll tell you about the time I saw a ghost on a viewing. So this is a hundred percent true for all listening to this. When I was an estate agent, kind of have to be careful what I say here. I was an estate agent in a questionable area in a city called Bradford. I'm from that area, so I don't mind saying that it's an area that's got a very good reputation, but it's a very strange area because next to it, there's some beautiful places. So you will go on viewings as an estate agent and you would see like this luxury, gorgeous mansion surrounded by fields for half a million because I'm up north. In the same day as seeing somewhere with like bars on the window and a mattress on the floor. And there's a block of apartments in said area, which I definitely can't name, that is renowned for being like rough. Like we're talking like top boy rough. like really not good. And I had to go take someone on a viewing there. And they're like, don't worry, they've refurbed it all. And it's the kind of place where there's always a dog barking, but like you can't see the dog. So I rolled up and the guy who I was taking on the viewing rolled up and he was like six foot five, massive scar across his neck. I was like, fantastic. So I took him in, we met the block manager there and the idea was that half the apartments had been refurbed and half the apartments hadn't. So she was going to show us one of the new refurbished ones, which she didn't. She took us to one of the ones that had been trashed by a previous tenant. So we went in and there were cigarettes all over the floor, cigarette butts, marks all over the walls. There was a jar of pickled eggs on the side. I don't know why. And I'm like, I'm trying to sell this to the person to buy it. So I tried turning the light on. like you can't do that. I'm like, why can't I do that? They're like, they've stolen the light fittings. I was like, who the fuck stealing light fittings? So I'm just like, right, okay, look at the view, look at the beautiful view, look at the window. And the guy goes, I thought this come with kitchen cooker. And I'm like, it does, but the person's stolen this one. And they were like, well, I saw a wheelchair on the way in. They were like, yeah, they were disabled. And they're like, well, we're on floor seven and they're disabled. So how have they stolen an entire cooker? And it, it, the whole thing was just a disaster. And it was like Saturday night takeaway. I'm like, I'm in there because someone's going to pop out at any second. But anyway, to the ghost. We went downstairs, I was like, look, just show me one of the refurbished ones. So she's like, I will do, I think one of them's free. She took us downstairs. And as we got to this corridor with the pungent smell of weed, there was a guy with a sheet on his head and the eye holes cut out, just sprinting up and down, making wooing noises, pretending it was a ghost. And I don't know why, I don't think they bought the apartment in the end. But that was one of the worst property horrors I've got of just being on a human. my god, that is ridiculous. Yeah, it was crazy. It was not ready for you to tell, like, be like, my god, and then this spirit came to us, and it was this person, like, in a wheelchair, and you're like, no, it was a guy in a sheet just running up and down the corridor. Yeah, yeah, probably off his head on drugs. Yeah, it was an experience. Like that was bad. did the guy, so the guy didn't go forward then? No, I don't think so, no. In the end, surprisingly. I mean, I'd given up on that point. I don't like elevators. They took the elevator and I took the stairs. And what got me is when people had stolen the floor signs off. So I had to count what floor I was on because like floor three had been stolen. So it was just crazy. I'm sorry. those, I actually enjoyed it. I was just laughing, in a sake way I enjoyed it, because I was like, this is just so mental, that it's funny. Well, do you know what? Also, this would be fantastic material for your stand -up stuff as well. Like these stories. I think so. I think I just see the humour and stuff. So I was like laughing to myself like this is unbelievable. I can't wait to tell my mates when I see them. So no, it wasn't so much chat with an estate agent. You know, it's quite a fun job really, if you get the right team around you. I love that. Do you know these property disasters get weirder and weirder as time goes on? I have heard so many strange things, so I love that. That's a brilliant one. you've got time, I've got a short one. I've got a real horror story here, like an actual ghost one. Go on then. So we had a lady, I can't remember her name, but she was a viewer. So all she did was take people on viewings on like Saturdays and stuff. And she took this one lady to a house and the house was like a bit run down, disheveled. It was owned by an elderly lady and a tenant. And the tenant was under investigation because they thought that they'd kicked this elderly lady down the stairs and she'd unfortunately passed away. So it was a whole investigation around this property and this person. And There was a cellar in the property. So the viewer took, I'm going to call this lady Claire for argument's sake. So the viewer took Claire down to the cellar and it was pitch black and they just had a phone torch on. So anyway, the viewers, you know, going around and going, look, as you can see, lots of room, all the usual stuff, as their agents say, good for storage. And she notices that Claire's just stood staring at the wall and she's like, what? So she goes over to see what she's staring at. And in red, right, and across the wall is, hello, Claire. No! Yeah, weird one. She came in and she told us afterwards. So weird. They didn't tell me, just said it was red. So I don't know if someone was having a laugh. I don't know what the cause, if it was a ghost, who knows, but it was just odd. do you know what? I love all this stuff. I don't know why. It's a love -hate relationship. I love horror, but I hate horror at the same time. So it's like I'll put a horror film on and then I'll watch it behind like my closed hands, but I still love watching it. So I love all of that. okay. I'll have to get some more ghost stories on. I'll have to do property disasters slash ghost stories. I'll have to do that. Yeah. of the houses I was refurbing were quite creepy. So yeah, we can do that. I love that, I love that. do you know, Sam, I've absolutely loved having you on the podcast today. Like I love it where conversations can just be as if we were having a cup of tea, a coffee in the kitchen and people just listening in on the podcast into a conversation in that way. And I just love the fact we've been able to have that and it's been able to just be so just free flowing. So thank you for that. My pleasure. I'm really going to miss you now because I've had you in the magazine and we have the HMO awards and we have my award. So I feel like we've been talking nonstop. Now I'm going to have to find a reason to talk to you. So thank you for having me. amazing and if people wanted to get in touch with you either for just a chat or I think you're you leads based is that right is that where you are Yeah, so the offices in Leeds, I'm going to be moving offices soon, but I live in Bradford, so Bradford Leeds around the area. because I know quite a few girls actually who are in that area. So if you're girls, if you're in that area, hit Sam up. And if people wanted to find you on socials or anywhere else, where's the best place for people to get in contact with you? Yeah, so for me personally, I probably linked in Sam Cooke. I've also got my Instagram, which is SJCook03, which there's nothing much going on there. For the Blue Bricks stuff, which I've updated a lot more frequently, Blue Bricks Magazine at Blue Bricks Magazine. But LinkedIn's where I'm most active. We do do a free trial of Blue Bricks. So you will just send you a free magazine. If you go to bluebricksmagazine .com, just fill in the form, we'll send one out to you. Or if you're interested in being in a magazine or talking about being involved, just email me at sam at bluebricksmagazine.com. Fantastic girls get yourself the opportunity if you think you have something to say, please reach out to Sam We need more women to come forward within this this industry So please do that and then if you want to find me, I'm Athena Dobson underscore official We're of course girls in property on Instagram. Check us out in girls in property pod com We can find all the details about the community group The next session is going to be on Tuesday the 9th of July with Rebecca bar talking all about money mindset. Please come along And then of course I've got the Christmas Gala, which is for girls and property, and that's gonna be on Saturday the 7th of December. So DM me the word gala or community if you wanna get involved with any of those. But Sam, thank you so much for coming on today. It's been an absolute pleasure. Hope you have a fantastic week. Go get some rest after the blue bricks, of course. And yeah, I'll catch you soon. And thank you for your knowledge and for watching. All the best. Thanks guys. Have a good week. Bye.