Passing the Baton of Life: Staying in the race and finishing stronger

As Viola Davis once eloquently captured, life's akin to a relay race where we pass the baton between our past, present, and future selves. In this heart-to-heart session, we unpack this powerful metaphor, discussing how our history can tether us down and exploring the liberation that comes with confronting childhood trauma. Through personal tales we reveal the delicate art of glancing backward without stumbling, encouraging you on your path toward healing and discovery.

Embrace the challenge of standing back up when life knocks you down. We delve into the triggers that unexpected present-day events can set off and the fortitude needed to face them head-on. We reflect on the importance of turning reflections of our past into the fuel that propels us forward.

Normally when we run a race, we feel weaker, but we talk about how we feel stronger as we pass the baton to move on, in life. We have to take a glimpse back to see where we've been in order to grab that baton and move forward. The pair discuss, Viola Davis' quote that she had stopped with success and not significance. 

Finally, we draw inspiration from Denzel Washington's concept of "falling forward," emphasizing the growth that comes through adversity. Join us as we navigate the journey of self-acceptance and capture the essence of what it means to triumph over life's hurdles.

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:08

Welcome to Real Talk with Tina and Anne. I am Anne, I'm Denise. It is break around here, so Tina is off and about with her family and Denise is filling in, which I'm very grateful for. I recently listened to a 2022 episode of Viola Davis on Hoda Kotb's Making Space podcast which is an amazing podcast, by the way, If anyone is interested in deep life conversations, which I often like to listen to but I was blown away, as always, by Viola Davis.

Speaker 1: 0:43

She had written a book Finding Me and I actually got this book on Audible and I listened to it over and over again. I took notes. I mean, it is so good. There is always healing when you listen to other people's resiliency and hope in their own stories of abuse, trauma and pain. During her interview with Hoda, she said quite a bit that I wrote down, but the one thing that prompted this episode was she referred to life as a relay race. She painted this picture of her child self running and passing the baton to her young adult self, who passed the baton to her married self, who passed the baton to her married self, who passed the baton to where she is now, and she said I was going to drop the baton because I kept looking back. I mean, isn't that an amazing visual?

Speaker 2: 1:36

That is. That is, that's crazy.

Speaker 1: 1:39

It is so good. I literally saw myself when I heard her talking about it. I saw myself running this race as a child all the way in each phase of my life, passing that baton all the way up until I am today. And I can honestly say that most of my young adult life from the time I was a kid until at least my 30s and maybe even upper 30s but I probably could have dropped that baton many times because I lived in it I kept looking back in a negative way. I think that there are many ways to look back. One, of course, would be as we do here on Real Talk with Tina and Ann, and we use what we have been through to help other people or let them know that they're not alone and that there really is hope, to show that you can move past it and be more than your childhood circumstances. And that choice enters in and we can be more than our parents, more than what we thought defined us as a child, just more and better than we thought that we could be. But of course, there's always another way of looking back and I can honestly say that I really did live there in my 20s.

Speaker 1: 2:54

I kept recreating the scene of the crime. I was unable to live a different life because I was 100% living as if I was still there. I wasn't at home anymore. I was married, I had done college, you know, I had recently graduated and continued to not be able to breathe and feel free. It was really awful, in fact, all the way until my mom passed away and I was in my 40s when she passed away I was not able to move forward emotionally.

Speaker 1: 3:28

I went through the motions and was actually very successful in some ways, because I got a degree and you know, and then another degree and had a lot of very fulfilling jobs, adopted my two older kids. I mean, I had a life, but on the inside of me I was not operating as if I was fully alive. I think actually a part of me was dead. I was still emotionally living as if it could happen any moment, as if it happened yesterday, you know, like it had just happened Now. Granted, my mom was still alive and a lot of those things were still reminders of yesterday, but it was my constant looking back to what life was in a traumatized state that kept me from being able to live emotionally successful, because I was still that 11-year-old child. I was still that 12-year-old child that lost her sister to the system. I was still that child, even though I was in my 20s and 30s.

Speaker 2: 4:40

I have moments where I do have that break and that breather, but I agree, I think for the longest time I dropped that baton because I was still that 14-year-old. Every time the baton dropped it was because I'm looking back and trying to scream as if I'm that 14-year-old that 12, 13, 14-year-old where I couldn't get it out then. But now, as an adult, I'm still screaming and I didn't realize that I was still screaming as the 14 year old and not an adult.

Speaker 2: 5:12

As you know, I'm 49. And I think that that for me, like I think, I kind of got it together probably within the last few years, where. I kind of got a handle on things. But yeah, I agree, it was. You know, I think when we're faced with all that trauma, it's hard to realize that we're still looking back. I mean, I think we always will look back, but I think it's still hard to realize that you can look back really without living in it.

Speaker 1: 5:41

And it takes a while to grow up. I think In my 20s for sure I was a child. I was not. It took me a really long time to reach the age that I am emotionally. In my 20s I was an attention seeker. I was a problem. I mean, no doubt I really was. I would have been looking at me as another you know, adult looking at and I would have been like, oh, she's a mess. I really was. So you know, everyone was a problem to me. No one was trustworthy and I was the one that was creating problems. I was living in a shutdown mode.

Speaker 2: 6:32

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 6:37

Because I was not able to move out, move away from what happened to me as a child, so I continually relived it every single day, even to the point where I moved into a situation where I was reliving the trauma every day that I did as a child.

Speaker 2: 6:50

I just recently and you know we talk all the time and you know I just started to go through this I've had something happened where something was brought up and it kind of took me off guard, because I've come in in the last few years, have been able to grow up and kind of come into my adult maturity and looking at things in a different perspective. You know I might still be at times looking for that. You know ability to use my voice, especially with the people that were in my life that I wanted to tell things to, but I, you know I was too silenced about. Yeah, recently I've been triggered about something and it almost throws you right back into that. All the things you worked on so hard.

Speaker 2: 7:40

I find it interesting that you know we've made so many strides and come through so much, yet there's that times where something comes up and this was a first for me in a while. So it's like I'm still in shock and it really does cripple. You metaphor pick up that baton and you're like, okay, I can do this. You know what I mean. It's like trying to figure out how to pick up something that you've already been walking with and it's great, and all of a sudden, everything drops out on you.

Speaker 1: 8:13

Yeah, it really is, and you go into freeze mode and I think you actually stuck again for a period of time. You know, it really is amazing how somebody who's been traumatized as a child and you look back at a point where you were and it feels like right now.

Speaker 2: 8:33

Oh, I mean, it shocked me and this is, you know, I told you this is only in the last five days and it's like I realized, you know, you're stuck. Like I was like, oh my God, I cannot believe I'm stuck, I cannot believe this is happening to me. I've worked so hard to get um where I am and I'll tell you what something that came into my mind. Um, I had to be okay with that. Like I had to say it was okay, like I'm not a failure, like you know, all of a sudden you feel broken, you feel all this stuff and like I literally had to just kind of stop and say it's OK, it's OK, you feel that way, it's not your fault While you're talking.

Speaker 1: 9:14

I'm wondering if, maybe, when those things happen to us, that maybe there's something that got triggered in us that isn't quite healed yet, oh yeah, and maybe that's why that piece of it got triggered, and then we have to kind of work through it again a little bit.

Speaker 2: 9:31

I'm not sure, yeah I don't know, but it makes sense. You know it makes sense, but I I love the analogy of of this baton. Um, yeah, you know, and I think it's okay to drop it every once in a while, it doesn't mean you can't pick it up and go on.

Speaker 1: 9:47

Oh, absolutely. I have dropped the baton so many times. I lived in this and I was consumed by it. I drank, I numbed, I looked for trouble. She said something else that was so profound. She actually said so much, but she said she explained why she didn't move on from it. She said I didn't have arms to run into so I just kept running.

Speaker 2: 10:12

Oh my, oh, my Right.

Speaker 1: 10:15

Yeah, I have spent decades running, running the wrong people into toxic relationships, into my own demise in my 20s because I didn't have someone to run to as a child, as a teen, as a young adult. It ended up that I spent my life running my life running.

Speaker 2: 10:43

You know, I don't gosh, that's really, it's really heavy, isn't it? That is so profound? Yeah, because I you know what? And I love my husband Like he is incredible to me and obviously I have two incredible kids. I have great friends, you know Wow, and it's true, though. When I have great friends you know Wow, and it's true, though when I was a kid and we've shared this before it's like you desperately wanted someone, and when I say someone, you wanted that mom to be able to run to and to swoop you up and make everything better. Maybe that's why I continue to run, is because I don't know if I'm searching for something or if I'm starting to learn that it's okay to just keep running.

Speaker 1: 11:21

Yeah, I mean I don't really do that anymore, but it reminds me of my son. This morning I had to take something to school and it was really interesting because we really hate when he sees me. Because he does that he will run from wherever he is the second he sees me and just jump on me and he won't let go. He won't let go so it takes staff members to get him off and I feel really bad that that happened, because that was not the intent for him to see me, was not the intent for him to see me. But you know, it reminded me of that when I was doing this podcast was how he's, so I'm safe for him. I said, no matter what, I'm going to catch him.

Speaker 2: 12:09

It's like you're looking for that safety. Maybe that's what it is. It's a learning to be accepting of these good things, because we're not used to that.

Speaker 1: 12:17

Right.

Speaker 2: 12:18

But oh, that's great though that he has that, you know, because you and I wanted that so to be able to see that actually happen with a child, to see the child see that.

Speaker 1: 12:30

Yeah, awesome, yeah, and it feels good to be on that side, the other.

Speaker 2: 12:34

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: 12:36

Yeah, you know, the last couple decades of my life have been the most fulfilling, because I learned to look back in a different way than I do. I learned to do it in a healthy way, in a productive way, I would say. I think looking back needs to be done in the ways where it is beneficial to our moving forward. And if we find that we are continually dating our fathers or continually trying to numb, or continually finding ourselves in abusive relationships or sabotaging our success which I've done many times in the past- yeah.

Speaker 1: 13:12

I can honestly say that I think we are living in looking back. Looking back with a feeling is completely different than looking back when you back with a feeling is completely different than looking back when you've had a lot of work done.

Speaker 2: 13:23

Yeah, so I've learned to do that. Again, I always say the last five years because I think the last five years I've come into my maturity and myself and until this last trigger, which I was I was caught off guard. I did feel like I could look back. And you know, when I started speaking, there's always been a why. So there's always, like you know, you always hear. Well, what is your why? Why do you do what you do? And so my why is that there's a 14-year-old girl sitting out there in a classroom who is feeling a pain and a sadness that is indescribable and that feels alone, that feels defeated.

Speaker 2: 14:20

Now, why do I look back at all? Is that learning process? Like you said? It's like I'm looking back and I'm seeing all these areas, so now I can help somebody else. You know what are you afraid? One of the things I constantly ask is if you weren't afraid, who would you be? It's, it's that taking that exactly, looking back and saying, okay, well, I'm not going to go back, I can look back. Like you said, you can look back because I think that's natural for all of us is to look back, but I don't have to be back if it makes sense. And in that same sense it makes total sense with the baton, because you are looking back to catch that baton right, you have to be able to look back to see where your hand is.

Speaker 1: 15:02

So you just move forward.

Speaker 2: 15:04

Yeah, so it is interesting. I mean, I think that that's been my thing for the past. You know how I started speaking and how I went that way. Is you do look at it differently? So I guess you know really this what happened to me in the last five days. I'm like, oh, there's the drop. I'm gonna go pick it up, though, and I'm gonna keep going.

Speaker 1: 15:27

You know, and there's nothing wrong with that. I mean, that is part of moving forward, it absolutely is. You know, I can remember a minister looking at me and asking me to pray during a visit to his office, which was really different. I mean, he had never done that before and it was not done in a way where he was just asking me to pray yeah, at that moment, because of who I was and I was a mess Okay, there was no doubt about it, but he was it really. It did feel like this. He was testing who I was spiritually, because this was a church with a lot of judgment from the leadership down, and I really felt what he was doing. It wasn't like a genuine do you want to pray, you know, kind of thing. It wasn't that at all.

Speaker 1: 16:21

And I remember sitting in his office and just said no, and I had this feeling you know what? I've spent enough time with you. Looking back, I've had enough time living as if I'm still in it. I'm not there anymore and I need to stop living as if I am. So you know, my problem was that, because of everyone, from my mom as a child when I was a child, to my husband as an adult. I was not getting what I needed, so I ran to the wrong people and I recreated that abuse, and it's interesting how we as human beings will continue to run until we find someone to catch us, no matter how old we are or who it is, and it could even be the wrong person.

Speaker 2: 17:10

Right, I did that so many times. I think still sometimes now I recreate things when I shouldn't. It's okay to fall down and it's okay to be in that moment of falling down, which you know. Like you said, you kind of go back to that moment, but what's not okay is to stay there.

Speaker 1: 17:31

As I thought about this, I wanted to know if anyone ever caught me. You know, I don't, I don't know, I think so. I think I did. I think I caught me. I think I had some key people that were placed in a position to grab me and hold me until I, like, got to the next part and so I could find myself. And then, you know, I don't know, I don't think I need that anymore so many times people with trauma. I knew no matter who was standing in front of me. I had myself out the door lots of times before I even entered. So staying in good relationships was really hard for me.

Speaker 2: 18:34

It's so. I feel the same way and I talk about this in my book about the. You know, the women and I think that that's true. It's like they they grabbed me at a time to kind of. They kept the lights on for me. They kept me from being swallowed by that darkness. But we talk about this before, about the good things being sabotaging the good things yeah um, you know, I I've said this too it's.

Speaker 2: 18:59

You know, we want something so badly like we dream about. We want it, but as soon as it comes, you, you freak out because you're not used to living in your dream. You're more comfortable in that chaos because that's what you know how to survive in even the good is the unknown.

Speaker 2: 19:21

Yeah well, it's scary, yeah, and I think that as an adult now, like I, I want the good and I'm more accepting of the good and I realize now the difference between the running and the, the and the good space. I gotta you know, you start to learn how to be you. I said in the book too, it's like I finally started to be me and not the running. And that was, you know, when I, you know, cut off contact, I had to learn not to be in that fear anymore and instead learn to be in that safe space, and then I've just built on who I am. Actually, I've always been this way, but I never let it out because I was too afraid to.

Speaker 1: 20:07

I am so glad that I picked up that baton again and carried it to the next chapter of my life. You know, normally when you run a race you feel weaker. Yeah, the miles go, but this is different.

Speaker 1: 20:22

I have felt stronger and stronger and more fit as the more I'm I have run this race and I'm not going to drop that baton again by looking back the way I used to and stay in it for long periods of time, like you said. I think it's really interesting that you made that comment about you have to look back to get the baton, because I didn't really think about that. You do, you have to take a glimpse back to get that baton from the past forward and I think you know, in hindsight we always kind of learn a little bit when we look and then we go back and we to move forward, we can see the things that we might need to change or, you know, definitely the things that we want to do different, and I think that that's kind of a good thing.

Speaker 2: 21:16

Yeah, I mean I'm going to look back. But I'm going to look back and say, okay, that didn't work for me or I'm done with that now I don't need that anymore, let me go, you know, forward. And but I think you know it is true, we always drop the baton. I think you know it's, it's a we're learning as we go, as we go. I go to this quote a lot because I love Denzel Washington.

Speaker 1: 21:42

He said if you're going to fall fall forward.

Speaker 2: 21:43

So I try to think about that. And now with the baton, it's like, okay, well, if I trip, let me just grab the baton and I'll just keep going.

Speaker 1: 21:50

I actually have heard that quote and I think we've talked about it enough. Yeah, or yeah, fall forward. But but you know, even if we fall, each time can be different. Each time can be a period of growth. And I don't fall or drop that baton the way I used to. I'm not even close. I mean, I think I fell, I think I dropped the baton and I lived on the ground for about 10 years or so.

Speaker 1: 22:18

I think it took a really long time for me to pick up that baton and keep going. Yeah, it's the lessons learned. And I ask my kids, my own kids, when they are doing something that I know is attention seeking or trauma related, and I ask them what their motivation is, because I wish someone would have asked me that question. We all have a motivation behind our actions, and I don't even think that we know why when we are in it. But that simple question makes you stop and think what am I doing? What do I want out of this? What do I want to happen?

Speaker 2: 22:59

Yeah, and I'll just go back to this thing that's recently happened to me and it is like I had to stop and I'm like why am I doing this? You know, why am I letting this get to me and why am I thinking back to where I was then? What is that purpose of? Why am I thinking? Because, again, I threw myself back there? Why I'm doing it is because back then I'm still shouting. I wasn't heard then. I'm older, now You're going to listen to me and hear me, instead of being the adult and saying I don't need to yell anymore.

Speaker 1: 23:40

Well, I mean some things. Just they really aren't a choice and it's it really is a trigger and it's a reaction that we do because of something that happened and we maybe are starting to act the way that we did when we were a child. I'm not really sure, but not everything is a choice, but I try to sort that out. I've learned after I was done running that some of my best friends you know because we talked about running into you know running until we find people. Some of my best friends are right in front of me and have developed some of the best friends over the last couple decades, friends that I can share anything with, be who I really am with. I don't even have to worry about it at all. I think when we are real with ourselves and have faced our trauma and stopped running, you know, after we calm the storm in ourselves, we see the love and true relationships in front of us.

Speaker 2: 24:42

Yeah, oh God, I couldn't agree more.

Speaker 1: 24:46

You know, I think that all that time while we're running the race, when I said that I was running to myself, I think that I really was, I think I was running Viola Davis said she was successful as an actress and that was really important, but she had realized that she had stopped at success and not significance. So I actually like even though I know what significance means, I was like I'm going to look that up and what it said was it is the quality of being worthy of attention or importance.

Speaker 2: 25:54

And we are important enough to hold onto that baton and pass it to that older version of who we are for older versions to say I got that, you know what I am important.

Speaker 2: 25:59

I'm worthy to be important. And so, yeah, I like that. I like the to be worthy because I, you know, I want to be worthy. I like the to be worthy because I, you know, I want to be worthy. And I think until recently I might have said I was, but I think you get to a point and then you realize that you really are. And the running thing again, Denzel Washington, don't, don't mistake moving with progress.

Speaker 1: 26:28

Don't mistake moving with progress.

Speaker 2: 26:35

So you know you could be moving in place, but you're not making progress forward If that makes sense.

Speaker 1: 26:39

But you know what, in our last episode with Tina, we actually said that pain is movement. I think that I might have to disagree a little bit with that part of it because, no matter what, I think that there's movement. You know, it depends on how much you stay in it, I guess.

Speaker 2: 27:06

I get what he's saying. Are you going through the motions of movement or are you actually doing something that's moving you forward?

Speaker 1: 27:14

And when we pass the baton to ourselves in this race, I mean I would hope that we would be in a really good spot as we're moving forward. We have an extra person that has joined us for the very end of the podcast, so I'm just going to end here, but I wanted to say that you know, we really are worthy of trying to move forward and pass that baton to our older version of ourself and and just say to ourselves you know, this has been a long road. This is, this is everything that you have been through has gotten you to where you are now. So pass that baton and just keep getting going forward and get stronger and stronger as you go. So thank you everybody for listening to Real Talk with Tina and Anne. We really appreciate you. We always appreciate our listeners and we will see you next time. Also, you can watch this on Amazon Music. What else? Apple?

Speaker 2: 28:18

Yeah, we have Radio station Also if you want to check out my mom's old videos with me interrupting.

Speaker 1: 28:26

it's on YouTube, Just please subscribe.

Speaker 2: 28:34

Okay, we'll do what the man says bye, bye.