Private Club Radio Show
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the podcast offers a unique perspective on the private club industry, featuring expert guests, product spotlights, predictions, and more.
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Private Club Radio Show
377: Culture Creation & Cultivation w/ Jim Miller, PGA, CCM
In this episode, we’re joined by Jim Miller, PGA, CCM, General Manager at Sonnenalp Club, who takes us on a journey through his remarkable career in the private golf and country club industry. From his early days as a back waiter to his current role as a leading club manager, Jim’s story is a testament to the power of varied experiences and the invaluable role of mentorship. His unique career path, which includes roles as a line cook and head golf professional, has equipped him with a diverse skill set that’s crucial for maintaining smooth operations and fostering effective communication across all departments.
Jim's insights reveal how his multifaceted background enables him to navigate the complexities of club management with ease, ensuring that every aspect of the club runs like a well-oiled machine. He shares how these experiences have not only shaped his leadership style but have also instilled in him a deep understanding of the importance of teamwork and collaboration. This episode is more than just a discussion on club management—it’s a compelling narrative on the value of a well-rounded career and the profound impact of mentors who guide you along the way.
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Culture is everything for us. You know it really is. It really is Like on a scale from one to 10, it's number 11. And it's everything we're about. And I think one of the cool things is, once you know where you were and you've built this new culture and you know it's good and you know it feels good, you always want to make it a little bit better, but you're here.
Speaker 2:This is the show where we go over any and all topics related to private golf and country clubs, from governance, management, leadership, the whole gambit. And we talk about private clubs, we mean all the private clubs city clubs, golf clubs, country clubs, yacht clubs, military clubs, athletic clubs, all the clubs. Grateful you're here. I'm your host, Denny Corby, this episode, I'm excited. I have a friend of mine. I always say friends of mine, but he's a legit friend of mine and I'm excited to bring him on. We have James, Jim James, Jimothy, Jim Jim Miller, PGA, CCM. He's on right now just laughing and I only did that because that's an office reference.
Speaker 2:But we have Jim Miller on here and we've been friends for quite a few years now and one thing I noticed was that when I met him I think we met at a CMAA event, I think it was and I just felt this warmth about him. But when I met Jim, he and I just clicked and connected immediately and I went out, I performed at his club and it was so much fun and you can just tell I don't know, I've been at a lot of clubs and you can just tell a lot by the club and the culture from the moment you step in and from the moment I stepped into the club, I knew there was something special here. And from the moment I stepped into the club, I knew there was something special here. And I'm not just saying that, you just knew there was something there. And he and I have chatted a few times on this. So I wanted to bring him on, and today we're going to talk about culture creation and culture cultivation, Because that's just what I felt, that he was possessed. No, it's just what I felt and what he's done there at the club and I brought him on.
Speaker 2:Private Club Radio listeners. Please welcome to the show. Jim Miller. What's up, Jim?
Speaker 1:Denny Corby. How is my favorite person on planet Earth from Scranton, Pennsylvania? How are you doing, my friend?
Speaker 2:That started off way too good. I was like this is good, and then you ended with I was like, oh okay, so you just tried to toot my own horn, but I am doing very well. Thanks for asking. How is the weather in Colorado?
Speaker 1:It's always spectacular in the summer. People come for the winters but they stay for the summers. It's spectacular up here in the mountains. Vail, Colorado, could not be more beautiful today.
Speaker 2:I love it. I love it, and you were at the beautiful Sonnenalp Club.
Speaker 1:yes, yes, sonnenalp Club, actually in Edwards, colorado, but in the beautiful Vail Valley.
Speaker 2:It's a fantastic club and the club also has a hotel right, but not on property.
Speaker 1:Not on property, but 15 minutes down the road in Vail. In fact, the Sonnenhof Hotel was just ranked number 23 in the United States. So very spectacular property, One of the leading hotels in the world and just an unbelievable place. If you've ever been to Europe and Germany and kind of the European feel low ceilings, archways it's just an amazing place.
Speaker 2:And it's in a great location also.
Speaker 1:Yeah, right at the base of the mountain, so pretty spectacular.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's awesome. Now, how did you even get started in the golf space? What's your origin story? Quick, in the golf space how like what's?
Speaker 1:what's your origin story? Good question Actually started in college and moved out to Denver. I was house sitting for a friend of my girlfriend and that house was the sister was the sister of Jack Vickers, personal secretary at Castle Pines Golf Club in Castle Rock, colorado, and she said you should run out to Castle Pines and see if you can get a job. And I said great, and I did, and I got hired on as a back waiter and then ended up spending 13 seasons at Castle Pines. Yeah, a long time. Wow, did literally every job at Castle Pines. That's actually not true. There's some cottages on property where members can stay and there's a housekeeping team called Turn Down and they turn down the cottages at night, but they actually. The uniform is kind of a short skirt and kind of a maid's outfit and that was the only one that I didn't do yeah, but I literally I copy it.
Speaker 2:There's a photo somewhere, Jim. No, I'm kidding.
Speaker 1:There very well could be. There very well could be. But I was a back waiter, I was a front waiter, I was a line cook, I worked in the men's locker room, I worked for engineering, I worked for course maintenance, I was a caddy, I was a bag room. I was actually assistant maitre d' for a summer, believe it or not. And then the last six or seven I started on the golf staff and one of my mentors, mr Keith Schneider, who's actually retiring this year after the BMW, but he got me into the golf side and has been an amazing mentor to me in my golf career. But started as the you know fourth assistant and then third assistant and second assistant, first assistant all the way.
Speaker 2:So that's what got me going and I, and that probably, that experience alone is probably why your culture is so good is being able to know, be in all those positions and do all those things and being able to relate and be and interact with all those people, all the staff, all the members, and just working, your, you just know, you know the game plan, you know what to do, how to see, how to act, all like. You just understand the assignment at that point, because now, as a leader, no one can tell you something that almost you don't know, like you've been there and done that.
Speaker 1:That's exactly right. It's exactly right. No, and it, you know you, you get a little street cred when you can go in the dining room and you can carry six plates and clear a table and, um, you know the waiters are like Holy cow. We do. And you know the waiters are like holy cow, look at you and but yeah. And then the same thing on the golf side, when you scrub a set of clubs and you can put on some grips and you can do all the stuff that you ask them to do and and and have done it before. I think it does, I think it adds a little weight and you get a little street cred from that.
Speaker 2:Now you, you, you are, were a PGA. Was that like the end, all like? Was that the goal? Oh, still, I'm sorry, Sorry, not to know. No, but what was that Was the goal, that was the goal. Gm. Was GM just like an added thing? What was? What was the trajectory for?
Speaker 1:No, that was the goal? The goal was to be a head golf professional and I was blessed and lucky enough to become the head golf professional at Catamount Ranch and Club up in Steamboat after Castle Pines. And then they had asked me to take on some more management duties and so I became club manager there, which was great experience. Great experience and that's a really interesting property Tom Weiskopf Design. They actually have a 350-acre private lake there with a lake clubhouse and then a golf clubhouse as well. So just unbelievable experience with conservation easements and things like that. So that was unbelievable.
Speaker 1:And then got out of golf for a bit and you and I were just talking about this and I was in private residence clubs and I thought I was going to be in private residence clubs for the rest of my life Very similar to a private club but a little different. So I was with Timbers Resorts, an unbelievable group there. Lance Thompson again one of my mentors kind of taught me the art of being a hospitality linebacker, which is one of his favorite terms, which I love. But they actually have properties all over the world and they bought a golf course in Kauai, hawaii it used to be Kauai Lagoons and now is Hokuwala unbelievable property. But I always imagine the conversation like around the boardroom table, like okay, we bought this golf course. Does anybody in the company know anything about golf? And somebody said I think Miller does. In steamboat Somebody probably goes does anybody else know anything?
Speaker 1:about golf and they were like no, just Miller. So they sent me out um to beautiful Kauai, hawaii, and the Hokuwala property and the staff there just wrapped their arms around me and took great care of me and we transitioned that property from Kauai Lagoons to Hokuala and then I came back to Colorado. I was actually away from my family for a bit and then came back to Colorado and was blessed and lucky enough to hear about this position at the Sauna Nup Club. It was a chance to kind of combine my GM leadership duties with my PGA duties and was asked to be a club manager here at the Sonnenup Club. So that was eight years ago and I'm in my ninth season, so it's been an amazing time.
Speaker 2:That's awesome. That's awesome and because I'm fortunate to chat with a lot of people and get a lot of different perspectives and things. So the fact that you're a PGA CCM, you're a club manager, like you've been able to do those roles, I think, just going back to reiterate, you know, it was all those positions early on that helped shape and focus and kind of shape that that career path a little bit.
Speaker 1:Yeah without a doubt. I mean there's some ridiculously talented people that are now GMs at private clubs that have come from that hospitality side and they're amazing. But I guess I'm a little biased, my golf side's coming out. But I think, especially at a private club, there's certain things that when you have a PGA, ccm, gm, whoever but when you have a PGA GM, maybe some of those conversations with the course superintendent are a little easier. Some of those conversations around timing, with food and beverage around the member guest are a little easier.
Speaker 1:Some of those conversations with your head golf professional are sometimes a little easier. Some of those conversations around merchandising in the in the in the golf shop can be a little easier. It's just I don't know. I think if that's a desire and you're a PGA professional, you should absolutely get into CCM. I mean, as CMAA you should absolutely get your CCM. You should learn as much as you can, because I think you have some institutional knowledge that maybe those who are coming from the hospitality side will eventually learn. But I think you have a little bit of a leg up sometimes.
Speaker 2:Yeah, when did culture become important to you? Was it always important? Did you have good mentors? Did you have good staff? Did you have bad leadership? When you were growing up that you were like oh, I know, I know what not to do now, or what you know what I shouldn't do, Like how? When did that all start?
Speaker 1:That's. That's really good question. That was worded well, I think. I think in my case I've always been surrounded by amazing culture, whether it was at Castle Pines Golf Club, whether it was at Castle Pines Golf Club, and then in the winters I would go down to the Vintage Club and Paul Lemke was the director of golf there, huge mentor of mine. So amazing culture at the Vintage Club. Then went to Timbers Resorts Great culture there, super positive. And then came to Sonnenelb no, owned by the Fessler family, and now again my current mentor, johannes Fessler, and then his son, sebastian Fessler. Just amazing business owners, amazing people, and they've created this amazing culture here and now we've created this amazing culture at the club. So I don't think it's that I've seen bad culture, I've just always been surrounded by elite culture and then when I don't see it, we're able to kind of correct that midstream.
Speaker 2:How would you define culture?
Speaker 1:That's a good question. What was that? There was a Supreme Court justice and they were, they were talking about pornography and he said. He said I can't define it, but I know it when I see it, it's the same. I think it's the same with culture and, like you said, I mean you go all over the country and you see clubs all over the country and you know the minute you walk in that that place has a good culture. And I guess I would define it as you know.
Speaker 1:First there's the place and like here we're super blessed. I mean it's Vail, colorado. We have mountains and we have this beautiful Valley and we have this beautiful sense of community here in Vail, which is great, great. And then the club needs to match that place and so the club needs to reflect, you know, that joy, that fun, that positivity, that friendship that the club needs to reflect the place. And then the members need to identify with that place we always talk about here at the club. Third place, you know, there's members have their home and their family and we want to be that next place. If they're not home and they're not with their family, they need to be with us and they want to be with us, which is great. So then the members reflect the club, that's reflecting the place, and then the employees identify with all three and provide that connective tissue and they all just play off each other.
Speaker 1:And then your job, once that's established, is to just not screw it up and just keep it going. But you know it takes. You know you were talking about cultivation. It takes a lot of daily cultivation we talk about with our team and with our members and with our club. You know constant gentle pressure. We talk about that all the time. Are we keeping up with our amenities? Are we keeping up with our standards, our service standards? Are all of our frontline employees, hospitality linebackers, are they looking for opportunities to blow members out of the water with experiences?
Speaker 1:You know Keith Schneider, my old mentor at Cal Spines, used to talk about a golf grip. You know, denny, you come into the golf shop and you say, hey, I want that new, tailor-made. Could you order that for me, jim, I need a 9.5 extra stiff, whatever we order it. And then the club comes in and then we say, hey, mr Corby, your club's in and you say, great, thanks, a lot expectations, yeah, probably. Have we exceeded your expectations? Probably not, but you know you got what. You got what you wanted. But let's say, hey, you and I played and I know you have.
Speaker 1:You love Lampkin cross line grips. You've got them on all your clothes and I know you work in town and you're leaving for a trip, um, in two days. So, um, I know you love Lampkin Crosslines. You order the driver. The driver comes in, I strip off the stock grip, I put on a Lampkin Crossline grip which is the one you like. Instead of calling you and saying the club's ready and your clubs are here I know where you work I say, hey, mr Corby, I'm going to drop your clubs by your work tonight. I put on a new Lampkin Crosslineline grip for you. That way I know you're leaving the next day. Uh, so you won't have to come by the club and just cross one more thing off your list. Thanks so much. Now have we blown you out of the water with exp, with our service? Absolutely. Is that something you're going to remember and tell your friends? Absolutely. Was it really hard to do? Absolutely not. But you're just looking for opportunities to blow people out of the water some of our show partners.
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Speaker 2:Stand out from the crowds and you don't want to advertise, but you want more exposure in the marketplace, then you need to check out Golf Life Navigators. They are the only resource that helps golfers discover experience and ultimately secure their ideal club membership and golf community home. There are experts at connecting your club with people who will truly appreciate what you have to offer. It's like eHarmony meets Zillow for golfers. It's amazing. So go give golf life navigators a try. You're going to love the results. If you're interested in learning more, head on over to golf life navigatorscom. Take us back 2016. You're just showing up to sona now. Club was. What was the culture like there?
Speaker 1:well it was. It was interesting. It was a business plan that probably wasn't working very well and obviously the fessler family knew that. And the fessler family said um, you know, in order for us to be a sustainable business, we need to change this business plan a bit. So they built out of their own pocket a $6 million fitness center.
Speaker 1:And you've seen the fitness center. I mean it's ridiculous. It's gorgeous. It makes you want to work out. Yeah, actually it doesn't. So you can see me, I've walked through there many times. It seems like people are having a good time in there, but I've never really seen what they're doing. There's a lot of machines in there and things. Uh, but yeah, but um, immediately we got 200 new fitness members and that took our median age down.
Speaker 1:We got younger, we got kids in the group and then, of course, not too much later, the whole time, we had always wanted to go take steps towards more exclusivity in 2016. We say, hey, we got this great new fitness club. We're going to make these changes with the golf side as well and we're going to be more exclusive as we go. We had actually had allowed a little outside play in 2016. But then the fitness club came on brand new fitness members.
Speaker 1:Then COVID, not too much later, came in, and then what can you do during COVID? Well, you can swim, you can work out, you can golf and you can go out to eat, and that's everything we do. So we were full on the golf side, then we were full on the fitness side. So that's quickly going through it. But now we fully function as definitely a private golf club. If you stay at the hotel, like you said, we have two tee times a day where you can stay at the hotel and play, but everything else is members and guests only, and so in 2016, we were about 140 members and now in 2024, we're 700 members and wait lists on both. Yeah, it's about evenly split, about 350, 350.
Speaker 2:Yeah, what was one of the first things you did to turn it around? Was it that fitness stuff, like, what was on? Like the culture level, what? What did you see lacking? What, like, what was like? You know, you, you're, you're, you're coming in. Now it's 2016, culture is meh. What's one of the first things you did to flip it or try to to start that process?
Speaker 1:one of the first things we did. We didn't have a beer loop here. It's an interesting course designing just goes 10, 11, 12, 13 and 13 goes out and there's really no loop to it. So, um, the back of 12 uh is this beautiful par four goes up the hill and on the back we found this flat spot and we were like how cool, cool would it be to finish 12, make a T up here, play 17 backwards and then go play 18. So you'll have a little five hole beer loop. Takes you an hour. And we did that.
Speaker 1:And the way we constructed the T was, unless you were a member, you didn't know it was there, like you could play every day and you wouldn't even know the T's there. And so it sounds like a small thing. But for the members, like it was like their thing, like this is our secret T, you know, and this is our thing, and we named it for a member who had just recently passed, and so we call it the land hour loop. Um, and then, if you come play at the sonno club, our scorecard the picture is of 17 backwards and it's from that secret tea. So for the members they were like, oh, I know where that is, and but nobody else knew where it was, so it was kind of their thing. So it was like the first thing we did, where it was like this is our club, this is our culture, this is a cool thing that we did. This is a cool thing that I know about, because I'm a member, and if you're not a member you don't know about it.
Speaker 2:And it sounds like a small thing, but it was kind of like the first thing we did, where they were like oh, this is cool, this is going in a new direction, like do you know like what little things you did, like what the, what the process was, or like what, like what happened, like what was the next thing after the, after the tea?
Speaker 1:I think you know, after we did our beer loop and the land hour loop and the secret tea, I think that was really the start, but then it just started with more and more forward and positive momentum in terms of a club. Then you know, we've gotten new pickleball courts, we redid our irrigation system, we had a new pump house. We took our asphalt car paths out and we put in reinforced concrete car paths. We did an aesthetic project on hole number 15, where now we have this recirculating water that goes down these ponds and it makes for beautiful audio when you're on the tee or when you're on the putting green and it's just good.
Speaker 1:Things just start happening when that culture is good. Now, obviously it helps to have a full membership and regular dues revenue coming in, but it's also that all feeds off one another. When you're full and and dues are coming in and that money's being reinvested back into the club, it just I don't know it builds club pride in want to bring guests and people say this is an amazing place and can I join and know we're on a waitlist but we'll put you on the list and it's just one thing feeds after another and that momentum is once it gets going is is hard to stop, which is great because it's positive momentum.
Speaker 2:That's got to be a somewhat good feeling when, like, a member brings a guest and they're like so where do I sign up? How do I join? Like, hold up, we have a wait list, we have a wait list, hold your horses, hold your britches. No, that's gotta be. That has to be when, when, when a guest comes and has a good time and they go where, do like when they start asking about membership, that's gotta be that's got to be, that's got to be killer.
Speaker 1:Oh it, it feels great because you know I mean, you know the amenities are good and you know the food in the restaurant's great and you know that the pool in the water's refreshing and you know that the pickleball courts are great, you know all that. But when they say there's just, you know there's something different and I love the vibe and I love, you know, the familial atmosphere between the members and it seems like everybody gets along and it seems like the employees have a smile on their face and they want to help me and they you know what they're talking about is the culture and when that culture is good and you know all the amenities are good and you know the employees are good, yeah, it feels, it feels really good because we all my owners, the festers and myself and my executive team you know we, we built this and you can see it and you know it's good and it feels great.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's one thing when, like, the members go like, oh, that was good, but when a guest goes, that was good, that's when you know like, okay, nailed it.
Speaker 1:When a guest goes, this place is different, yeah. Or they say you know, and people all over the country who are at clubs hear this and will they hear, you know, I wish my club would do this, or or I wish my club did this, or I wish my club felt like this, and when you hear that, that that feels good. We really are, Um, we're really proud of that. And uh, and again, it's like the one thing we've built where and it's not a touchy, it's not something you can touch and feel, but it's something we've built um, that makes this place really attractive, and so we're really proud of it.
Speaker 2:Would you say that was probably one of the more impactful changes during that first year?
Speaker 1:I think it was kind of one of those first steps in saying, you know, we had a good culture, but now we're going to have a great culture and you guys are going to be a part of this and we're going to. We're going to have a great culture and you guys are going to be a part of this and we're going to work on it together and you know, we're going to protect that culture. It's you know. Again, I had a mentor at the vintage club, Paul Lemke, who used to say you know, whatever club you're at, you're dealing with people that have some form of income to, where they can be members there, so they can golf anywhere and they can work out anywhere and they can play tennis anywhere and they can swim anywhere. So why have they chosen? Why have they chosen? Why have they chosen our club? Well, it's those and he used to call it those tribal bonds. It's those tribal bonds. That's what they're buying. They're not buying the amenities, they're buying those tribal bonds, they're buying that immediate inclusion in a family.
Speaker 1:You know, people always say you know, especially in private clubs. I think, like culture is really the only sustainable competitive advantage you have in this space is your culture and it's really the only thing that you can control as leadership. You know you can certainly get by amenities and do all that, but that culture, that's something that is yours and you own and you control it and it separates you from everybody else. So people want to be a part of that and they want to be a part of that tribe and they want to come into that club and they want somebody to say, hey, Mr Corby, how are you, How's Mrs Corby, you guys doing? All right, Everybody good. You got everything you need. Excellent. I know you love Dr Peppers. I put two Dr Peppers in your cart. You are set to go today and that's what you, as a consumer, are actually buying and that's what we are selling.
Speaker 2:How do you get your staff on board for that?
Speaker 1:It's again. We call it CGP constant general pressure. But you say, hey, you did an awesome job right there. You know, what would have been even better is you could have said this, this and this and again. That sounds easy, but it takes commitment to. You know, you might have a phone call, you might have to get on a Zoom call, you might have to do this, this and this, and when you see it you go, oh, I need to go talk to that kid. But then you're like, oh, but I got these other things I need to do. No, like that is part of your culture. That's the most important thing that's happening right now.
Speaker 2:And just say hey.
Speaker 1:I noticed this young lady came around the corner. She was carrying her clubs and you were helping out with some clubs. You were scrubbing some clubs and you saw her and you came back and you kept scrubbing clubs. You stop scrubbing the clubs, you run, you go, get those clubs, you put them on a cart and then you come back and then you can finish.
Speaker 1:You know it's little things like that, but you just keep, and when they do it, great, you praise them, and when they just miss the mark you talk about, you know how it could have been corrected, but it just for all of us as department heads, we all take that very seriously. In fact, one of our new value statements is protect that culture, and that's part of it is. When you see something that's not, doesn't fit our culture and doesn't fit our service standards and doesn't fit what we want our club to be, you've got to say something doesn't fit what we want our club to be. You got to say something. And also, you know honestly, by example too, when, when you're out and you're taking care of people, you have to be that hospitality linebacker as well.
Speaker 2:No, it's 100 percent. And you mentioned a really good word, which is which is values when? So you, you're privately owned, you're not member owned, correct?
Speaker 1:Privately owned.
Speaker 2:Right. So that also changes things a little bit too. But with this new I don't want to say this new culture, but what you're cultivating here at the club, did you have to or did you redo the mission, the values, the vision? Did you work and redo all of that with them?
Speaker 1:Absolutely, in fact, we just finished Absolutely, in fact, we just finished. The hotel that we talked about amazing hotel had their own mission, vision and values, but it's also a separate business. We're 20 minutes down the road, we're a private golf club and they are a big hotel. So their mission, vision and values and their business plan differs from our business plan. And so we've been working on for the past two years this mission, vision and values, and now we have that in place. Our mission creating a place you belong with the people you love. And our vision is dedicated to delivering happiness to our members. Just dedicated to delivering happiness. That is it.
Speaker 1:And then our value statements, super simple protect the culture, integrity, effort and attitude. That's what we hire for, that's what we expect out of everybody. And then just excellence, and what we mean by excellence is just what we talked about exceeding expectations at every single opportunity. But that protect the culture is big, you know when, and it applies its blanket across the club. So if we have a team member that's not performing well or says something they shouldn't to a member, we address it right away. If a member does something they shouldn't or says something they shouldn't to a staff member or to another member. We address that right away and we talk to them about it and we say, hey, that doesn't fit our culture and you need to help us out by behaving in a way that you treat others the way you want to be treated and that, at the end of the day, is it. But you know, the team members need to see you talking to members about culture. The members need to see you talking to team members about culture. The members need to see you talking about culture when it was a member to another member, uh, so they need to see that we're on top of it and that we care about it and that we're cultivating it.
Speaker 1:And, uh, I don't know, at the end of the day, you know, when, um, you're in the bar, everybody's around the bar. Everybody's laughing, going from table to table to table. The employees are laughing with the members. The members are laughing with each other. They're talking about what trips they want to take together. The members are talking about how fun or, excuse me, the employees are talking about how fun it is to be here. The executive team is here for a long time and they love the company and they, I don't know. It's just, it feels so good when you come into a room and you can feel that culture. It's just you're like, okay, we got to protect this and we got to keep this going, because this is what we are and this is what we sell.
Speaker 2:Do you have any ways to keep it going, like, how do you like you've, you've built it, you've established it? How else do you keep it cultivating, keep it going, keeping it moving?
Speaker 1:constant in this case, positive, gentle pressure. It's that constant general pressure and it starts with, starts with us and leadership. It starts with your owner, it starts with your president, it starts with your board, it starts with me. You know, if, if part of your culture is is a joyful, happy place, well then that starts with me. I got to bring the joy every day and I gotta have a smile on my face every day when a member asks how, how are you doing? You know I say it couldn't be better. Literally, couldn't be better. And they say is everything good? I'm like so good, everything is so good. And even if that's not the case, it's my job to fake it until I make it. You know what I mean. It's my job to bring that culture of positivity. If you want that to be part of your culture and we do I need to bring that positivity every day. And you know a big part of it for me is availability. You know the NFL says the best ability is availability, and that's me. You know, when I come to work, I need to be there. You know they need to see me. If you come to the club, you need to see me that day.
Speaker 1:And that's MBWA. That's management by walking around, that's getting out of the office, you know, getting your stuff done. Everybody has their stuff that they have to get done at their computer. But when you're done with that, get out of the office, do laps around the club, do laps around the golf course, make sure people see you. And then you know, yes, management by walking around but then holding people accountable, and then that gets that gets into the minutia of you know, make it measurable. You know monthly departmental cleaning and appearance scores. You know going around checking those boxes and letting everybody know what, what their standards are and what standards they need to beat. And then it's secret shops by members, it's goal setting for my team and holding them accountable for those goals. It's financial, it's weekly, monthly, yearly Financial accountability, whether it's EBITDA or revenue scores for the month. All that stuff it's got to be measurable, you've got to hold them accountable.
Speaker 1:And then for your employees, you know are you the best employer in your city? Are you the best employer in your area? Are your benefits great? Are your pay rates commensurate and are they high? Are you doing 30-day reviews? Are you doing 60-day reviews? Are you doing 90-day reviews? Are you doing 30-day reviews? Are you doing 60-day reviews? Are you doing 90-day reviews? Are you doing weekly staff meetings? Are you doing daily stand-ups? All those things are so incredibly important.
Speaker 1:And then, when people are meeting those expectations and hopefully, in our case, exceeding those expectations, are you recognizing those people? Are you recognizing your hospitality linebackers and showing everybody else this is who you need to be like and this is what we want. And then, from the member side, is it every day? Are you making it a fun and welcoming place? Are your events fun? Do you have glow ball? Do you have dog day afternoons where you can bring your dog and we make doggy ice cream? Are you having superintendent's revenge, where the holes are impossible and the maximum score is seven? You know, are you? You know? And Denny, you've been to our place, do you?
Speaker 1:take a section of your patio fence off, do you put a mat down and do you have a chipping contest down to your putting green, which is hilarious, fun, probably not super safe, and if our insurance company is listening, we really don't do that. But yeah, is there stuff you know, are you doing things? Do you weave your fitness with your Restaurant and your golf? Do you have events where all three of them are doing something together? You know, it's all of those things that make your club unique. And then when you have all those constituents you know leadership, your team and your member and, like we talked about at the beginning, and then you marry that with the place and it all works together and it all weaves together. It makes this like beautiful cultural tapestry that is beautiful to look at, it's beautiful when you feel it, and then it's strong too. You can't break it. But I mean, that's everything is to get that buy-in.
Speaker 2:It becomes that like third place.
Speaker 1:Exactly, that is it. Where do you want to be If you're not at work, you're not with your family and you're not at home? Where do you want to be? You want to be here. We love that. We'd love it. We'd love for members to just put a cot in the back. Wake up, do some yoga, work out, hit some balls, play nine holes, have lunch, come back, play golf with the family, have dinner, have drinks, sleep, get up, do it again, Some probably sneakily do.
Speaker 1:No, maybe, maybe, but from all three aspects it's got got to be. You all have to be on the same page. It's so important for us and especially for the leadership I mean are you it's? It's one thing to talk about it and use your hands and say, oh, it wouldn't be great, but then you also have to have those measurables in place so that, um, employees know exactly what you're looking for. Obviously, you got to show it through your actions, but you also got to have something you can measure.
Speaker 1:Culture is everything for us. It really is. It really is On a scale from one to 10, it's number 11. It's everything we're about. I think one of the cool things is, once you know where you were and you've built this new culture and you know it's good and you know it feels good, you always want to make it a little bit better, but you're very protective of it, like I know for all of us as an executive team. We are all very protective of that and we know when something happens, you know hey, jeannie said this to Mrs Smith we all go oh, we need to address that and that's not okay.
Speaker 1:But what I'm most proud of is A that we've established this culture, which is great and people like and people want to be a part of. That's great. But how protective our team is of it and how much we want to take care part of that's great. But how protective our team is of it and how much we want to take care of it, that's cool to see because it's ours, we built it and again we're its parents and we want to keep it going.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, it's pretty much your brand new baby.
Speaker 1:It's everyone's baby, oh yeah.
Speaker 2:How long have some of the other executive staff and the higher levels been there for? Have some of them been there before you? Do they come around with you? Yeah?
Speaker 1:uh, pete, our director of instruction I mean, he's been here 20 years. Jill, our fitness director she came in same time. I did so nine years. Um, oh my gosh, diane's been here. Our membership director has been here 11 years. Um, peter, or, excuse me, kirby, our new head golf professional, he's been here three years now. And then Neil, our superintendent, has been here 30 years. So it's a long time for a lot of us, but uh, but it is. It is definitely a labor of love. Uh and uh, we're very proud of what we've built here.
Speaker 1:How how big is the team? Yeah, it's not super big. I have like six or seven direct reports. It's not huge. Our, our, our whole team. We're about 120 during the summer and then we go down to about 40 in the winter.
Speaker 2:It's not bad, that's not bad, and I'm sure doing all of this too it must make, I would say, probably hiring easier and harder, because probably it self filters out a lot. Because once you have this culture in this, this thing in place, you know now it's, you know it's a certain personality that probably applies and somebody who might slip in, who you know now it's, you know it's a certain personality that probably applies, and somebody who might slip in, who doesn't fit, they probably self filter themselves out fairly quick Someone who doesn't maybe fully agree with the culture.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I don't know. I think there's still a huge onus on our department heads to keep looking. So we really really take that value statement to heart and we will hire for integrity, effort and attitude, and if they're missing one of the three, then we don't hire them. So so it's integrity, effort and attitude all the time. What was that quote? Uh, oh my gosh. What was his name? Zig Ziglar. He was a uh motivational speaker.
Speaker 1:He said uh um, uh, was it? Integrity alone won't make you a leader, but without integrity you will never be one. So I always love that. But we expect the same out of our membership. We expect the same out of our staff. But when you're hiring for integrity, effort and attitude, it just kind of raises the bar. And if a kid comes in or an adult or whoever coming in for an outside service position and they're two out of three, we're not going to hire them. And if that means we got to keep looking for another two weeks, we'll keep looking.
Speaker 2:You know, I almost didn't want to invite you on the show because you're a thief. I don't think I've ever. I think I was I don't want to say more humbled and upset at the same time. So do you want to tell the story or do me?
Speaker 1:Imitation is the best form of flattery. Imitation is the best form of flattery and, believe me, I will write you a thank you note and you will very much uh recognize, uh, the thank you note denny has. Uh, just so you guys know, denny corby has like the most amazing thank you notes on planet earth and I saw his thank you note and then I said, oh my gosh, that thing's amazing. And so denny gave me the guy who does his thank you notes Notes and the guy was like so what colors do you want? I was like just like Denny's. He's like do you want it? Exactly like Denny's. I was like, yeah, don't change anything, just exactly like Denny's.
Speaker 2:So, and then he called me immediately. It was like, hey man, is this okay? And I was like, yeah, it's fine, I don't care, yeah, whatever, but it's so funny, it's so funny. Yeah, there, it is there. It is Like the exact same. That's so funny.
Speaker 1:The exact same color. I have the exact same reflective, yeah.
Speaker 2:And I have it somewhere too. I'm looking through this too. I'm looking through this is my, um, this is my box of thank you note. You know, anytime someone says like yeah, it sends a thank you note or something, uh, or just like nice letters people send after gigs or whatever, like I just keep this is somewhere in this box, um, so I'm gonna find it. I'm gonna find it. Um, that's so funny and I forgot that's so funny.
Speaker 1:Just to let you know I have had so many compliments on this. Thank you Note.
Speaker 2:It's like yeah, I, I appreciate you coming on. Thank you for sharing.
Speaker 1:Thanks for being a good guest. Okay, man, thanks, I really appreciate it.
Speaker 2:No, thank you. Thank you. I hope you all enjoyed that episode. I know I did always love chatting and when our paths cross with a friend, jim miller great dude, great guy you're enjoying the content I like, share, subscribe, share it with a friend, a colleague, someone you like, someone you don't like. If you're enjoying it and you want to give a five-star rating and a review, on whatever platform you are consuming, that means the world. It costs nothing. Algorithms, love that stuff. If you haven't done so already, sign up for our newsletter. That's this episode. Catch y'all on Flippity Flip.
