When the waves of grief crash over us, how do we hold on to our faith without being swept away? In our latest episode, we invite you to join us as we share our personal encounters with loss and the solace we've found within our spiritual beliefs. It's a poignant conversation that dares to embrace the full spectrum of mourning while honoring the authenticity of our faith journey. Together, we reflect on the strength and vulnerability Jesus demonstrated in the face of sorrow, a reminder that our own tears are not only understood but welcomed by the divine.
Amidst the echoes of heartache, we turn our focus to the Enneagram Type Three personalities, those Efficient Achievers who often struggle to untangle their self-worth from their success. My co-host Kelly and I delve into the challenges these individuals face in seeking a deeper relationship with God that transcends their accomplishments. We confront the deceptive narratives that can ensnare Threes, guiding them towards the liberating truth of unconditional love and acceptance that lies at the heart of their faith.
Capping off this episode, we discuss the transformative power of spiritual disciplines, from the introspection that unveils our inner anxieties to the restorative embrace of the Sabbath. For those who resonate with the Enneagram Three, we highlight the importance of navigating confession's vulnerability and the struggle to slow down and simply 'be' with God. As we bid farewell, we leave you with an invitation to join us next time for more heartfelt discussions as we journey together through the complexities of faith, personality, and emotional well-being.
When the waves of grief crash over us, how do we hold on to our faith without being swept away? In our latest episode, we invite you to join us as we share our personal encounters with loss and the solace we've found within our spiritual beliefs. It's a poignant conversation that dares to embrace the full spectrum of mourning while honoring the authenticity of our faith journey. Together, we reflect on the strength and vulnerability Jesus demonstrated in the face of sorrow, a reminder that our own tears are not only understood but welcomed by the divine.
Amidst the echoes of heartache, we turn our focus to the Enneagram Type Three personalities, those Efficient Achievers who often struggle to untangle their self-worth from their success. My co-host Kelly and I delve into the challenges these individuals face in seeking a deeper relationship with God that transcends their accomplishments. We confront the deceptive narratives that can ensnare Threes, guiding them towards the liberating truth of unconditional love and acceptance that lies at the heart of their faith.
Capping off this episode, we discuss the transformative power of spiritual disciplines, from the introspection that unveils our inner anxieties to the restorative embrace of the Sabbath. For those who resonate with the Enneagram Three, we highlight the importance of navigating confession's vulnerability and the struggle to slow down and simply 'be' with God. As we bid farewell, we leave you with an invitation to join us next time for more heartfelt discussions as we journey together through the complexities of faith, personality, and emotional well-being.
Welcome to Enneagram U, damon and Kelly, where we explore the mysteries of human personality and help you learn more about you. With your skeptic or an enthusiast, together, we'll take you on a journey of self-discovery using the ancient wisdom of the Enneagram. This is Enneagram U. Hey, everyone, welcome to Enneagram U. My name is Damon. I'm here with my friend Kelly. Kelly, how?
Speaker 2:
are you today, hey Damon, how are you? How heavy.
Speaker 1:
Okay, kelly.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, I uh.
Speaker 1:
What's going on?
Speaker 2:
Yeah, someone, I just met recently passed away and I hate grief and loss.
Speaker 1:
Is it hard for you to share that?
Speaker 2:
It is yeah.
Speaker 1:
We've talked about this before. How, if we're having a bad day, would we really say it on the podcast?
Speaker 2:
Yeah.
Speaker 1:
All of you listeners know that. You know this right, we're real. We talk about this stuff off the podcast a little bit. So I knew that was coming. Yeah, yeah, so it's hard, isn't it?
Speaker 2:
It is. I think you know part of me as a former counselor. You know I compartmentalize, I think a bit, but yeah, I feel it. I, you know, heard that she had passed away on Friday and even, like it was interesting, sunday I spoke at Woodcrest on grief and how Jesus is the resurrection in the life and just felt like God really met me in that like, yeah, even though this has happened, like even though it was so raw, so tender, I don't feel like I can fully let that truth sink in yet, Cause I think you know, when we think about grief, I think right now I'm still in the shock phase.
Speaker 1:
So, and that's really fair because you could easily, especially having been the speaker, you could easily spiritualize that.
Speaker 2:
Sure yes.
Speaker 1:
And then you can spiritualize that sadness away, heaviness away yeah. So I'm glad that you're honest about that. That's probably not the best thing to do.
Speaker 2:
Right. Well, and I think even the depth of. I was talking about the story of Lazarus getting resurrected and just to see Jesus telling Martha that he was the resurrection in the life. So that was the message he gave her, but then, with Mary, he wept.
Speaker 1:
Right.
Speaker 2:
Not just once but twice, and so I think that was a reminder to me, like, yeah, the truth is, Jesus is the resurrection life, but also we have to grieve. And so, yeah, just just feeling that, feeling that for people that you know also loved and cared for her, and yeah, yeah so Well, I'm just right there with you on that today. Thank you, yeah.
Speaker 1:
It's interesting what you just said you. You reversed your saying, where I feel this, but the truth is this. This time you said the truth is this, and I still feel this.
Speaker 2:
Yes, yes, it's interesting. Yeah, I think we can hold both, because in the midst of the feelings, like sometimes, we just have to be in the feelings for a time until that truth really does take hold. And I don't think I'm quite there yet. Right, yeah, right, mm-hmm.
Speaker 1:
Well, we'll walk through this together, yes, and as friends and coworkers.
Speaker 2:
That's right.
Speaker 1:
And we'll do our very best to hold our heads up and also grieve well.
Speaker 2:
That's right. Well, and one thing as we even think about our relationship with God, which is what we're talking about today, when we think about, there's a verse in Ecclesiastes 311 that says that God created our hearts for eternity, and so, if you think about, our hearts were never created to say goodbye, never die, never lose someone.
Speaker 1:
Right.
Speaker 2:
And yet what is so incredible, I think, is that God really modeled especially Jesus really modeled how to grieve, that we don't just put a happy face on, and I think I don't know if that's how you were brought up, maybe in the church like, well, there's trite responses like oh, the person's in a better place, or but it's like, yeah, we've got to work through the feelings before we can really get to that place, because our hearts weren't created to deal with Right, ever saying goodbye to anybody.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, I definitely grew up in that, where there were a lot of trite sayings, learned not to do that. Maybe to a fault, though also Sure. So if you swing too hard one way or another, I mean, the truth is that better place does exist. That's right, and that is hope, and so we can't remove that truth just because we're sad.
Speaker 2:
Yes.
Speaker 1:
But at the same time, we can't ignore the fact that we're sad.
Speaker 2:
That's right. It's a delicate balance for sure. Yeah, and it just takes time.
Speaker 1:
OK, so that's where we are today, everybody.
Speaker 2:
That's where we are.
Speaker 1:
And yet we're still going to talk about a really good number and their relationship with God. That's the number three.
Speaker 2:
The number threes. We are just as we think about threes. They are the efficient and the effective person and I heard it said this is kind of interesting they reflect God's efficiency and effectiveness. Sometimes they don't think about God being efficient, like, ok, got to get this thing done quick. Yeah, definitely effective. God is definitely effective. But I've heard it said just like in creation and I know there's different viewpoints on, did God create the world in seven actual days? Right, but if you think about just even how God efficiently and effectively created the world and created like, even if you think of the human body, just how all the things work together, it's amazing.
Speaker 2:
It's amazing. It's amazing, and so the threes really reflect things working together really well, because, in their abilities just to, first of all, take and use the most time, or have a way to see how time works together with all the things they need to get done very efficient with their time management, the rest of us are like how are they able to coordinate all those things? Well, that's just how God's designed them.
Speaker 1:
Right and working is a good thing. Yes, I mean. I think there are verses that speak to that. I couldn't quote them right now.
Speaker 2:
Well, paul says if you don't work, you don't eat.
Speaker 1:
No, well, that's true, the paid one, yeah, right.
Speaker 2:
Yes, and doing our work unto the Lord is another great first Workers worth their wages, something like that.
Speaker 1:
Yep, that's right. Pretty bad at a lot of stuff.
Speaker 2:
Well, and even before the fall, how God gave Adam and Eve jobs in the garden. Again, it wasn't the after the fall, where the toil of man would never feel satisfied. But yeah, that work is good and that we can find just that connection with God in our work.
Speaker 1:
So, yes, you know, in some ways it's like I wish God would have held back on that, like a name, the animals thing, because then work would have been just that'd be the only part of the curse and my laziness would be like heaven.
Speaker 2:
Yes, you as the nine are saying oh no, please, just yeah that's so.
Speaker 1:
That's not the day off, so not Jesus. Yes, but Jesus was a carpenter, that's right. Jesus worked, probably had to work, that's right.
Speaker 2:
We see the disciples worked, yeah, so work is good. And so I think the thing for the three, as we think about their relationship with God, is the trap that threes can really fall into again is that desire to try to survive by impressing or attracting people to them, trying to reduce their anxiety by winning or being kind of the star. So I think for threes that there is this sense again of unconditional acceptance from others you know, I need to work really hard in order to perform or prove to you and I think that can easily get translated in their relationship with God. Okay, I've got to work, I've got to do all these things so that God will love me.
Speaker 1:
Right, that's good.
Speaker 2:
Yeah. So you know we said with the two that as we think about being in the world for God or being in God for the world if you remember that Bob Mulholland quote that for a three it would be tempting to be in the world for God just being busy about doing good things. And so this is where the invitation for the three is to really find their place in being in God and then let God show them what he would have for them to do. So for the three, you know, for them they try to avoid failure at all cost and maximize success. And so for them, just recognizing that failure, learning, struggling through, is part of the learning, part of the growing process, it's part of depending on God you know that verse that says and our weakness got us strong.
Speaker 2:
Well, for a three it's difficult to admit there's weakness you know, or admit there's times where they're not at the top of the game.
Speaker 1:
Right yeah, and that's their natural. That's their natural bent right and then Paula kind of mentioned that last week she asked the question on nature and nurture and kind of said that like you might be naturally a certain way but then your nurturing kind of draws you toward the positive or the negative side of your number? Yes, that's right To kind of summarize.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, exactly. Well, and, as you know Paula was saying last time, I love that illustration that she used of growing up on the farm and, you know, getting up in the morning and knowing, okay, this is my chore, but I'm going to get in trouble if I don't get my these other chores done too. That weren't mine. And so I think sometimes that can be a subtle side of that deceit for the three. So we know threes, their besetting struggle or their besetting sin is deceit Again, not to say that threes aren't honest people, because they are, but things get spun in their minds so there's lies that they tell themselves and there's lies that they believe, and so it's really important for a three to identify what are those lies, I believe.
Speaker 2:
And so for Paula, as that little girl, that lie that she believed and that was reinforced by nurture was if I don't go out and do everything I see that needs to get done, then I'm going to get in trouble.
Speaker 1:
Right.
Speaker 2:
But I think for the threes, just recognizing what are those lies that I believe and what are those lies that I might be telling myself. So again, that's where that deceit can come in.
Speaker 2:
So lies like I'm not worthy unless I'm performing that lie that says that no one's going to love me unless I, you know, succeeding at this or that, the lie that says I could lose my job if I'm not at the top of the game, or whatever that might be. That's so important for the three to recognize. What are those lies that I'm believing? What are those lies I'm believing about God? Because I think those can be the real barriers for them.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, yeah, I'm not accepted unless I do these certain things or get this done, or kind of a workspace thinking.
Speaker 2:
Yes, workspace theology. You know that. You know, if I don't do these things, god's not going to love me. So I need to perform and that's where I think for the three, they can really get into. Some of those check the boxes off in their relationship with God. You know, if I go to church, if I read my Bible, if I tie the five, you know all these things, then God will will love me or bless me, and what's interesting about that and I've seen this in myself and others too is that we'll often say, yeah, I'm on the gray side of things here.
Speaker 1:
God, it's going to love me no matter what I do. I don't have to do anything for him. Yet my life doesn't really reflect that.
Speaker 2:
Right, I'm doing.
Speaker 1:
I'm checking boxes off, you know, and so we, we do need to be careful that you can say today I'm going to get up early, I'm going to have a journaling time, I'm going to read scripture, I'm going to pray, and I'm gonna do that every day of the week and I'm gonna check a box and that will earn me.
Speaker 2:
God's favor.
Speaker 1:
But we'd never admit that. I think I've seen it in myself where it's like I'd never admit that. That's what I'm trying to do there. Because, really my motivation is to please God and to get closer to God, but then that can become this well I didn't do those things, so evidently I didn't please God.
Speaker 2:
Right. And again it's the motivations, and so sometimes our own motivations are so subtle, and even for the three, I think that's where that deception can come in. They deceive themselves of what their motives actually are, and so it's this place of again being with God instead of doing for God. So being in God, then for the world, versus being busy or being in the world for God.
Speaker 2:
I heard once someone said that they finally felt like they experienced God and their time with God in the morning when they would get up and watch the sunrise.
Speaker 1:
That's great.
Speaker 2:
And they wouldn't do anything else. It was just like I'm here, I'm waiting, god shows up by bringing the sun up, and that was their time with God versus and I'm guilty of this too, and not that these are wrong things, but like I've got my stack. I've got my book, my devotion, my journal, you know, and so.
Speaker 1:
Here's my book on how not to hurry, but I got to get out of here right now.
Speaker 2:
I'm reading Ruthless Elimination of Hurry.
Speaker 1:
I've got five minutes. I wasn't gonna call it out, but you did.
Speaker 2:
But that's true story. That's a yeah, it does, it does.
Speaker 1:
We have a stack of stuff we wanna get through to for the greater good.
Speaker 2:
Yes, my greater good, it's both you know part of it is like oh, I really do desire to have this connection with God. But then the other part is and I really want God to bless me, or I really wanna get ahead you know, in my relationship with God.
Speaker 1:
Yep or learn more, or whatever it is.
Speaker 2:
Yes, yeah right.
Speaker 1:
And we're not dismissing scripture or good books or anything like that so don't misunderstand we often talk about balance here. That's right and that's what we're talking about.
Speaker 2:
Yes, well, which leads us to the downstream practices for the three. And so, as we've said before, downstream are really the easy kinds of spiritual disciplines or the easy ways to connect. They just kind of fall right in line.
Speaker 1:
Working your way to heaven.
Speaker 2:
Number one yes, no okay, okay, go ahead. Give your church lots of money.
Speaker 1:
There's a number.
Speaker 2:
No, but one of the downstream practices is Bible study.
Speaker 1:
Okay, or taking Bible classes, or classes.
Speaker 2:
you know small group classes because these are classes, or you know opportunities to really engage in something that comes easy, like a three loves Bible studies you know, to be able to learn more, to be able to get through material. Yeah.
Speaker 1:
They're achievers, right? Yes, achievers, is that right? Yeah, three's the achiever. And so that's why my wife has two master's degrees. Yes, that's right. And has been through lots of Bible studies and has led lots of Bible studies and she can smoke me in all of that, yeah.
Speaker 2:
But you know, for like the one year Bible. I don't know if you've ever read the one year Bible.
Speaker 1:
I have once yes and I was like I can't do it. Yes, no.
Speaker 2:
I mean, it is a chunk of scripture every day.
Speaker 1:
It is Yep, I've done it once.
Speaker 2:
But for the threes, they really appreciate that. Yes, because they know what the goal is, and the goal is being able to get through the Bible, you know, in a year, and to be able to have like their foot in the Old Testament, new Testament, psalm and Proverb every day. The difference, though, would be and again I'm guilty of this, you know, some days I can really kind of simmer in what I'm reading, and some days I'll finish something and I'm like what did I just read?
Speaker 1:
Right, because your mind has moved on for the next thing.
Speaker 2:
Yes, what is next? So? I think, the three has to watch that. Okay, now the upstream practice. So these are the little bit. This is the much more challenging not the little bit challenging, but much more challenging for the threes. The first is confession.
Speaker 1:
All right.
Speaker 2:
Now I know in our faith tradition we don't necessarily do confession.
Speaker 2:
You know, I know our Catholic friends have their priests that they can go to to go to confession, and so a lot of times Protestants maybe have that personal confession with God which is important to be able to name specifically hey, these are the places that I've. You know, as I look back, that I've sinned or that I've messed up that I, you know, would want to just say to God. But this is also where it's good for threes especially to have one or two trusted friends that they can also be like in an accountability group with, to be able to name where they're struggling or to be able to name even some goals that they're working on, and to really be able to be honest with their friends, knowing it's not going in going, hey, I get a gold star today.
Speaker 1:
Oh right.
Speaker 2:
But more of like hey, so you know where, where have you, you know, fallen short or where have you struggled? Again, not in a condemning kind of way, but just a really honest kind of way. Yeah.
Speaker 1:
What does that do for a three? Does that keep them kind of off of the works based path or the earning or achieving path? Or it kind of gives them like, hey, I can really see where I'm not. Um, it's perfect. Probably isn't the right word, but, um, I'm not getting everything done.
Speaker 2:
Right.
Speaker 1:
I'm not getting everything just right.
Speaker 2:
I don't know. I think a couple of things. One is that it is a place of self-examination and that, uh, even though it's self-examination, we don't just do that by ourselves it could be than that self-examination with God. Um, you know where we ask God. God, would you search me and show me you know what's, uh, maybe places that I'm feeling anxious, or you know where I'm living out more of my dark side or doing things just for self?
Speaker 2:
And so it creates a space for that where they can have that self-examination and then also humility you know to be able to, um, you know, share with someone, somebody, something that you're working on, and then go back to that person and to be able to say, yeah, here's where I've maybe fallen short or here's where I still need to work on.
Speaker 1:
So that's really good, because humility seems like that might be the secret weapon against having to always look like you have it all together.
Speaker 2:
Right, right, yeah Wow.
Speaker 1:
It's good.
Speaker 2:
It's good to be able to be on the side of the Lord and he will lift you up, and so I think for the three it's that kind of flipped of that like uh, lift yourself up.
Speaker 1:
Yeah. You know um and then and you will lift yourself up yes, Instead of he will lift you up and he will lift you up yeah.
Speaker 2:
That's right, uh, and so being able to just have spaces, you know, what's what's under the surface, you know, and we talked about with the three another really healthy practice for them is getting back to their true self, you know. And so being able to have that, um, humility and self-examination also helps them, I think, to get back to their true self.
Speaker 1:
Okay, so confession causes that yes, or helps with that Helps see what's under the surface.
Speaker 2:
Uh, and then another uh practice that is an upstream but really good for the three is Sabbath, so taking an actual 24 hour period off.
Speaker 1:
Okay, I like this one yes.
Speaker 2:
You may go home and tell Paula like okay. I've got the greatest gift for you this week.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, of course.
Speaker 2:
God gave way back when. Uh, but is you know, as we think about it, it is a commandment, it's not just a suggestion but you know, if we think about um, you know, the Sabbath was built for rest and for worship and for connection. Um, you know, and I've heard it said uh, you know that, uh, let it be where. Really, if you don't do it on Christmas, you don't do it on Sabbath. So, like we don't do laundry on Christmas.
Speaker 1:
Uh, we don't you know, go shopping on Christmas.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, and you know, and with that too, uh, even having a fast from social media for um for Sabbath.
Speaker 1:
I think for three it's got to be planned. For sure it has to be planned. I don't think I can go just drop that one.
Speaker 2:
No.
Speaker 1:
Grab her by the hand and say get in the car, let's go and just leave everything behind. Don't worry about any meals, don't worry about the house or your business or anything that you're taking care of. That I should be taking care of, um, and yeah, have you gotten off the couch, I guess?
Speaker 2:
I was just to keep your accountable to ask about that Do you watch the dishes this week?
Speaker 1:
I have, okay, well, not all of them, but you know the ones I dirty. Selective chores here. I've been helping keep the counter clean. Good job, good evenings, yeah, very good, yes.
Speaker 2:
Well, and you know again, you're right with a three, they do need to plan. And you think about, uh, even when the Sabbath was established, that God said you have six years, okay, let's go to go about your work. So threes would be really great at this If they knew they had six days to get everything done. I think threes could really help us and actually have a really great Sabbath, but in their minds right now they have seven days so they can even get more done.
Speaker 1:
Right, true, yeah, very true.
Speaker 2:
Yes and so, yeah, those would be a few things to think of for the threes to have those downstream and upstream practices.
Speaker 1:
Bible study, confession and Sabbath.
Speaker 2:
Yes, and to end with this quote, so Don Rizzo, who was an amazing Christian who really engaged with the Enneagram he's the one that the website that I refer to quite a bit, the Enneagram Institutecom. He had a great quote I thought I would share. He says change and transformation does not and cannot happen without emotional transformation.
Speaker 2:
Say it one more time Kelly, yes, so change and transformation does not and cannot happen without emotional transformation, and so that's what I want to leave for the three. You know again, is it's not about doing, but let your doing come from being, and one of those places where we can really connect to the being is our emotions. So what is going on under the surface, what are the lies that you believe, what are the emotions that you're experiencing? And then you know from that place, connect with God. You know it's okay to share whatever feeling that you're having to share, whatever struggle you're going through, cause nothing's going to separate you from God's love. You know, I love that from Romans eight like neither height nor depth, nothing can separate us, and so I think for a three.
Speaker 2:
Just that's going to be the path to true transformation.
Speaker 1:
That's great, yeah, and so that emotional health is something we're trying to practice when we're feeling heavy when we're feeling down, and if you're feeling that way today, we want you to know that you're not alone.
Speaker 2:
No.
Speaker 1:
We've all felt that way and we're feeling that way right now, but that doesn't mean there isn't some hope as well.
Speaker 2:
That's right, so it's a good balance. Yes.
Speaker 1:
Between hope and grief. And we'll try to do that the best that we can, and we hope that you will too. That's right, so we'll see you next time on Instagram. You thanks for joining us everybody. Bye, kelly.
Speaker 2:
Bye Damon. Tell me what you do With our love in your heart, with our love by your side, with our love by your side.
