The Wise Person: Enneagram Type Five Special Guest

Kelly and Damon talk Kelly's trip to Paris which will lead us to our next Episode - Travel and the Enneagram.

Today's special guest is not Donald or Joe it is Walt Walton.

Hear Walt's Enneagram 5 Voiced in Verse.

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Chapters

• 0:04 Enneagram U
• 6:50 Discovering Enneagram Number Five Wisdom
• 15:34 Understanding Enneagram Type Five's Relationships
• 19:44 Navigating Relationships as a Type Five

Transcript

Speaker 1 0:04

Welcome to Enneagram U with Damon and Kelly, where we explore the mysteries of human personality and help you learn more about you. Whether you're a skeptic or an enthusiast, together we'll take you on a journey of self-discovery using the ancient wisdom of the Enneagram. This is Enneagram U. Hey, everyone, welcome to Enneagram U. My name is Damon and I am here with my friend Kelly. Hello Kelly, Hello Damon, You're back. I am back. Welcome back to the States.

Speaker 2 0:33

Thank you, I am very happy to be back. We had an amazing trip, but it's always good to be home. I know it's cliche, but there's no place like home.

Speaker 1 0:41

Was there an air traffic controller strike?

Speaker 2 0:43

There was, but God just blessed us, so it just basically dissipated. So people that were flying out on Wednesday because people were preparing, they got bumped, and so our flights though everything went very, very smooth, and so it was amazing, that's awesome no hiccups. Matter of fact, I feel like God blessed every aspect of our trip, so I'll go first. And fact, I feel like God blessed every aspect of our trip, so I'll go first and just say I feel so grateful.

Speaker 1 1:08

Okay, well, you just came back from Paris, yeah.

Speaker 2 1:10

Time away Grateful beautiful.

Speaker 1 1:14

Was it more or less than you expected?

Speaker 2 1:17

I don't know that I really had any expectations, so it blew me away.

Speaker 1 1:22

Wait, was the Eiffel Tower shorter or taller than you thought? It was going to be Taller, and let me tell you this.

Speaker 2 1:27

When we went we just decided well, you know, we've been on a flight, we went, like on Saturday, so it was our second day there. So we had an option of either taking the elevator to the second floor they weren't going all the way to the top, for whatever reason that day.

Speaker 1 1:42

So it was like two floors. I know why no air traffic controllers.

Speaker 2 1:45

Yes. Well they were not striking yeah.

Speaker 1 1:48

Yeah.

Speaker 2 1:50

And so I was like two floors, we could do this. Two floors in France is not two floors in the United States. Really, 600 steps To the top, to the top. Well, no to the second floor. So that's not even the top, that's just like floor two so it is taller than I think. It is much taller, okay, and I mean we would go up a couple of however many. And then I mean, my quads were burning, my heart was racing oh, we all feel so sorry for you and your stair stepping on the eiffel tower?

Speaker 2 2:22

yes, but we got our exercise in. I figured we probably walked over. I think it was over 12,000, or, I'm sorry, over 112,000 steps on our trip.

Speaker 1 2:33

That is insane.

Speaker 2 2:34

So it was like the average was like 17,000 a day. Okay, that's crazy.

Speaker 1 2:37

Yeah, that's crazy high for every day.

Speaker 2 2:39

So that's why the French can eat whatever they want and they're slim, so maybe they are working some by walking.

Speaker 1 2:45

Walking eating, if that's work.

Speaker 2 2:51

Was Paris cleaner or not as clean as you thought it was going to be? I mean, really, they had great people that were out cleaning, so I saw people cleaning all the time. Some of the bathrooms, though, weren't well, and I didn't use a lot of public bathrooms, because that is one thing they tell tourists is make know, make sure, if you're at a restaurant, use their restroom, don't use like the public restroom. So we went into this beautiful gallery, gallery, um, what was it called? Gallery Lafayette, this beautiful, beautiful shopping mall.

Speaker 2 3:18

Like we didn't even think about buying anything, because it was like I don't think I've got the yeah, yeah the money on my credit card to buy something here, but we go into the bathrooms there and those were disgusting. Ah, so but anyway.

Speaker 1 3:31

So that was the only downside.

Speaker 2 3:33

Disgusting bathrooms, just a few yeah but, everything else, like literally people have asked me what's your high and low and my low? The bathroom well, not even that really because that was just a very, you know, momentary thing.

Speaker 2 3:46

The low was the Airbnb that we stayed at had it was. I mean, everything there is much more condensed and smaller. So our bathroom I don't even know if it was like a three by three, but it was the small sink the shower and the toilet were all like probably as close as you would an eye setting here, okay, and so the shower. When you would take a shower, of course the floor would be wet, and so anytime you would use the bathroom, the floor was wet.

Speaker 1 4:14

Wait, that didn't sound right. Anytime you would use the bathroom, the floor was wet From the shower. Okay, that's helpful.

Speaker 2 4:21

Because of course there were no boys there. That would be a whole other thing.

Speaker 1 4:24

You're right, of course, Anyway, but yes.

Speaker 2 4:26

I feel so grateful for a great trip, but how are you feeling today?

Speaker 1 4:31

Well, back here in the United States, where we work for a living, it's been a crazy day today. I feel scattered. Okay, yeah, like I don't know up from down right now. I've just got so many events happening at the same time. I'm trying to work through that.

Speaker 2 4:48

Yeah, You're juggling a lot of different things, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 4:50

So I mean like, yeah, I came in here, the mic wasn't set up for our special guest and um had to do that, which is totally humiliating because he you know, he expects things to be a certain way. Just kidding, you'll understand that it was true at all once you hear who. It is the total opposite of our guest. Yeah, so I'm a little bit scattered, but now I'm dialed in. Yeah, you're in the groove, dialed in, so I'm ready to talk about the number five the type five and listen to our type five special guest yeah.

Speaker 2 5:25

We've got a great special guest.

Speaker 1 5:26

I didn't know that you were a type five Enneagram. I thought I don't know what number I thought you were. I didn't think it was five.

Speaker 3 5:32

Maybe, maybe I knew that, anyway, yeah, you can be so many different things.

Speaker 1 5:36

He could be a four because he's very creative.

Speaker 2 5:38

He's definitely got a strong four wing yeah.

Speaker 1 5:41

So I also see the six loyalty. Yeah, there's that as well, but there's a wisdom and he's not. He's very peaceful, so there's the nine, um, anyway, yeah.

Speaker 2 5:52

Well, without further ado, should we introduce our wonderful five.

Speaker 1 5:56

Guest is wait, let's try it again let's try it again joe, yeah, another. Yeah, we can cut that out. Now our five guest is walt walton. Wait, let's try it again. Let's try it again, joe, another. Yeah, we can cut that out.

Speaker 2 6:09

No, our five guest is Walt Walton. Yay, yay, welcome Walt. Hey, how's?

Speaker 4 6:14

it going Good, bonjour, bonjour, welcome back.

Speaker 2 6:17

Yes, thank you, sir. Yes.

Speaker 1 6:19

Walt, you have a radio voice man. Hey, yeah, Walt does a little rapping on the side.

Speaker 2 6:23

He does. That's his creative side.

Speaker 1 6:24

That's why I thought maybe he was a four. Yeah.

Speaker 2 6:28

So welcome. Do you want to start Walt first with how you're feeling? We'll throw that at you Feeling great, you know sitting across from these two legendary people who have been doing this podcast for quite some time now.

Speaker 4 6:39

So you know to be in the presence and be a part of this is wonderful.

Discovering Enneagram Number Five Wisdom

Speaker 2 6:43

Well, we so appreciate your willingness to come share with us about being a five, and it's been fun to just journey along with you. I know last year I think it was when we were doing let's see how did that work we did the Enneagram lunches here at VU and so Walt really didn't know a whole lot yet about the Enneagram but just was learning along and he wrote like a voice and verse for each of the numbers.

Speaker 1 7:09

I remember that.

Speaker 2 7:10

And so through that then he really connected with the five. So tell us a little bit about that journey, Walt, and just how you connected to being a five.

Speaker 4 7:17

Yeah, that's kind of how I first figured out what number that I was.

Speaker 4 7:20

I took the test there and yeah, happened to be a five, and a lot of the things that it said just kind of lined up with some of my characteristics and how I conduct myself. So I was like, oh, this is cool, but even to do the enneagrams and do the jingles probably should remaster those. But that was fun though, to get to see perspectives from each number and then for different people reaching out like, oh man, you did my number. It was spot on.

Speaker 2 7:41

Yes, yeah, he would just take different attributes of the numbers and then just come up with I love how you call it a jingle, just like a musical, talking about the numbers.

Speaker 1 7:53

And you can find those. Can you find those on our website?

Speaker 4 7:56

Maybe not, but I can put them your way though, Right when did we post those they? Might have been on our older site. On our older site.

Speaker 1 8:03

So we could put those back out there. Yes we definitely should All right. Yes, we definitely should All right. Well, maybe we'll blend one of them into this episode, even Definitely. So maybe at the end or something we'll play a little bit of it.

Speaker 2 8:13

And we'll play the five, because that's what number it is Absolutely Okay. So that was fun for you to learn your number and do it that way and share creatively with us.

Speaker 4 8:23

And then to attend some of those lunch and learns too, and like receive more information about the numbers too, was pretty neat yeah.

Speaker 2 8:29

Well, and when we think about the five, as the wise person, I think you know you're someone on our team that definitely shares your wisdom with us and, just like as we're doing a Bible study or reading different things, you'll bring in just different points of how those verses are tied together to other things in the Bible and I don't know. I've just so appreciated that.

Speaker 1 8:49

And the rest of us sit and yak, yak, yak over it and Walt sits back real quiet and at the end he just drops the big mic right there and we're like okay. Well, the rest of us should have just been quiet and waited.

Speaker 2 9:01

Which is definitely what the five does. You know, we talked last time about how the animal for the five is the owl, so someone just sits and observes. You know, doesn't necessarily feel like they have to just put in all their thoughts, but, man, when they do, it is that mic drop moment or like those pearls of wisdom.

Speaker 1 9:17

Can you turn your head all the way around? Not quite. Pretty far though it's awesome.

Speaker 2 9:25

Well, have there been ways, Walt, that you feel like just learning about your number has helped you grow personally?

Speaker 4 9:30

Yeah, I think with the Lunch and Learn kind of learning more about myself through the number and then seeing the healthy side and the unhealthy side and being aware of where I'm at, you know, being able to identify and kind of indicate like, okay, maybe I'm not in the best healthy stage that I need to be right now, let me go and do whatever it is I need to do to get back to that healthy stage.

Speaker 1 9:52

Yeah, what number does the? Do you remember, kelly, what?

Speaker 2 9:55

number the five goes to when they're unhealthy Well it can be both the seven and the eight in the traditional Enneagram. So it can be the eight of kind of digging in and kind of having that it's my way or the highway, or the seven of just kind of getting caught just in the head with planning or different things like that. But then in the harmony triads it goes five, eight and two and so it can go again the. The eight which is part of that original uh, but then also the two, maybe having some challenges with boundaries or you know, those kind of things are you dig your heels in kind of guy sometimes uh it

Speaker 4 10:37

all depends usually kind of like you say wait and sit back to see that use wisdom in order to not just jump out there, right away, you know.

Speaker 1 10:45

I was just wondering, like when you're unhealthy, what that looks like so I can stay kind of away from you at that point.

Speaker 2 10:52

Well, I think sometimes for the five it's hard for them with holding that information or having just wisdom but being free to put that information out there.

Speaker 3 11:03

Do you ever?

Speaker 2 11:03

find Walt for you. Is that hard? You may have a thought or like hey, I see how this connects together, but I don't know if I should put it out there.

Speaker 4 11:20

Yeah, kind of like, the way that the information may be presented might not suit what I may think is the most useful in the midst of those moments. So I might hold on to the information for a little while until I find out a way to kind of demonstrate or use illustrations to get the person to understand what the information is being given. Apart from just like I think this is right, and then just here you go yeah. Not like maybe not meeting the mark that I wanted to meet or meeting the expectations that I may have.

Speaker 2 11:40

Yeah, so. So what I hear you saying is using wisdom on when to share your wisdom.

Speaker 3 11:44

Yeah, yeah, wow yeah.

Speaker 2 11:46

When's that right timing? Yeah, none of that.

Speaker 1 11:51

Yeah, I'm going to hang out with Walt more.

Speaker 2 11:52

This is where for the eight they say eights need to lean into fives of like, having that contemplation and not just having an e-jerk reaction. I need to remember that.

Speaker 1 12:01

I mean we weren't going to say anything. Well, there's a reason Walt's here today. It's an intervention.

Speaker 2 12:07

Well, I know just personally in my life too, like, as you know, because Walt's on our team and so we get a lot of times of having conversations and even I know personally for me, when I've been kind of in my you know crazy times, you know Walt always just kind of has that word, you know, or that encouragement, or he'll come in with his little post-it, they'll have scripture for me on there, or that encouragement, or he'll come in with his little post-it, they'll have scripture for me on there, and I'm like, oh, I tell him it's like a prescription of just exactly what is needed at the time.

Speaker 2 12:33

So I have so appreciated Again. He's sharing that wisdom, he's waiting for that right time and he's doing it not in a way of like hey, kelly, here's what you need to do, but like, hey, and he'll do it, even just like let me just give you this, you know, and just kind of set it out there and kind of put the ball in my court.

Speaker 1 12:51

You're saying I don't do that, I never do that.

Speaker 3 12:56

Actually never.

Speaker 4 12:56

You did kind of do that. Once, though on the retreat you wrote me a nice letter that was just perfectly timing and everything that was in it had all the wisdom and knowledge that I needed. Really. Wow, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 13:07

What did I write?

Speaker 2 13:08

Tell him more.

Speaker 3 13:09

No, I'm not writing things. I know what I wrote. I know what I wrote that's cool.

Speaker 1 13:12

I'm glad it was helpful yeah.

Speaker 2 13:13

Yeah, for sure. Well, and so, like you said, then too, it helps you to just learn more about how that is in a healthy state. What does that look like, would you say? Or how does that feel to be in your healthy state as a five? I?

Speaker 4 13:30

think it feels good to be able to help someone in need in a timely manner when they need it, and I have to I don't know kind of go through the obstacles of what it would be if I were unhealthy. So kind of get a clear vision and clear view of what the person may need. I don't know.

Speaker 2 13:52

I'm hearing a lot of healthiness in that too, Like I want to help, you know, because sometimes I think for the five and that sense of their challenge of greed, and again, not that greed that's materialistic but, more of like keeping things to themselves. But I hear you saying like when it's an invitation to help someone, that feels really good. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 14:11

It's giving.

Speaker 2 14:13

What are some of those indications for you? Maybe, when you're in that unhealthy side, are there some things that really are your signals?

Speaker 4 14:19

Kind of like what you said the eight and the two. You know what I mean it's like maybe you're giving help when it's not needed, or the eight like oh man, you kind of want to be in charge and you're being a little too direct. Maybe you need to kind of sit back and observe to see where those boundaries are, and not overstep in the midst of those moments.

Speaker 2 14:34

Yeah, yeah for sure, just having that awareness.

Speaker 1 14:37

I've never seen you in that state, Honestly.

Speaker 2 14:39

I don't think I've ever seen you where you've overstepped.

Speaker 1 14:43

You know, maybe I'm missing it. Tell me what to do. Yeah, no, I really really so you must sit in a healthy state for quite a bit of your life.

Speaker 4 14:52

I try. Yeah, you're thinking about it for sure. Yeah, I'm kind of like a sloth when it comes to it. You know what I mean. Just take your time, no rush.

Speaker 1 14:59

Yeah, Kelly's probably going to ask this, so sorry if I step on your question, wondering like do you find yourself um studying a lot in the areas that you enjoy? Do you find yourself like man? Once I get on something, I just keep digging and digging, and digging I kind of.

Understanding Enneagram Type Five's Relationships

Speaker 4 15:12

It usually all depends on what, uh, the topic or the subject is right, yeah, but I feel like, um, sometimes when, if it's for someone else, then I'll really take that deep dive to kind of give them the answers that they're searching for. Okay, um, and I think that uh is allows both of us to receive something apart from, like, the greed, apart from me holding on to the information. Now I can. Oh, man, this is great. You've got to come see this for yourself.

Speaker 1 15:34

Because often we think of the five as kind of the analyst, and so I was just wondering how much of that is in you, and it seems like there might be quite a bit. So, you sit back and take it all in yeah, I definitely see that in you.

Speaker 2 15:46

Well, and take it all in yeah, I definitely see that in you Well, and hearing too, when it has to do with someone else, almost that puts a bookend on it to where it's like I have to share this with this person, because this is why I'm doing some of the studying, yeah, yeah, and so it's not just the, I'm going to just keep researching and researching. It's got to have an end point so you can share it yeah.

Speaker 4 16:04

Yeah, cool, so you can share it?

Speaker 2 16:05

Yeah, yeah, cool, very good. Well, and with that then, too, you know, when you think about knowing about yourself. Has that helped you, then, in relating to other people, like you know, your relationships with your friends or your family? Yeah, being a five, what would you say?

Speaker 4 16:20

I think you could, I think you maybe. Yeah, in some ways like not really knowing their number, but maybe like guessing.

Speaker 2 16:25

Yeah.

Speaker 4 16:28

And really knowing their number, um, but maybe like guessing, yeah, and then uh, going about it in a way, uh, or speaking in a way that would benefit their number um, like so communicating with them, like to where they understand but might not necessarily know, like what you're doing, yeah so I think, that helps in that way.

Speaker 4 16:39

Yeah, like okay, this is the eight. I gotta approach this a little differently than what I would. Uh, two or three, so it's kind of speaking that person's language, whatever number they are, or having that maybe just a. I don't know, maybe you are you know what I mean. And then going from there.

Speaker 2 16:54

Again, just using that wisdom of what the person's numbers are, which is exactly what we're really hoping from doing the relationships with the numbers is just this idea of how do we come together and meet, knowing my number and knowing your number? How do we meet in the middle?

Speaker 3 17:09

to have good relationships, good communication.

Speaker 2 17:11

And you're right, not that we know for sure what other people's numbers are, but we can definitely have a guess at what those are, yeah, and meet them. Well, and another thing, as you were talking about just gathering wisdom and sharing it with others, I know one of the things that you guys do, you and your wife you homeschool your sons.

Speaker 3 17:29

Yes.

Speaker 2 17:29

And so has that been fun for you as a five just to kind of teach your boys, kind of being that role of teacher, yeah, I mean it's been great.

Speaker 4 17:36

I mean, you have your moments. They're all different learners, so you have to kind of teach them a different way and kind of talk to them differently too, especially with them being in different grades one in kindergarten, other in first grade. So, but yeah, it's been fun, though you get to sit back and just watch them learn, and they're always listening you know what I mean Even when you think they aren't. So true.

Speaker 4 18:02

Sometimes when you find yourself like talking about something and something comes up that may have been in math or Bible and they're able to specifically identify and they're like, oh yeah, that's from whatever book that was. Oh yeah, that equals this. So it's like really helpful and a joy to see them learn in those ways and be able to now read and write and add and do all of those things that we've been able to teach them.

Speaker 2 18:23

So it's just been a blessing. I'm sure that's been really fulfilling, especially in that five space, you know, sharing knowledge and yeah. And again, that wisdom of each child is different, you know. And not being restrictive and oh, we have to just do it this one way, yeah, Cause they might be different numbers.

Speaker 4 18:41

You know what? I mean, so it's like oh man, you're three, you get it. Well, you're two, but what's going on? Okay, you get it, but you just get it a different way.

Speaker 2 18:49

Yes.

Speaker 3 18:51

Yeah, for sure.

Speaker 2 18:52

Well, and one of the other questions that we like to ask is what is it like to be on the other side of me? And so what is it like to be for you on the other side of you when you're in a healthy state? How do you think that's received from others?

Speaker 4 19:06

Healthy state man, I would say joy. I mean you're going to laugh. You're going to be happy.

Speaker 3 19:14

You're going to feel all of those things that you want to feel so yeah, I'm just going to meet you wherever you're at.

Speaker 4 19:18

If you're down and out, then I'm going to be down and out with you. I'm going to lift you up in that process.

Speaker 2 19:22

Okay, yeah, yeah. Well, and I mean right there, you can hear the five going to the seven. You, know that joy that, and then also that four wing too, of that empathy of I'm going to meet you where you're at. It's going to be authentic with what you're feeling, but also I'm going to bring some joy to the situation.

Speaker 1 19:38

Definitely seen that in you.

Navigating Relationships as a Type Five

Speaker 2 19:39

Yes, oh, yeah, for sure, yeah. And then the other side of that is what is it like to be on the other side of you in those times where you're maybe not in your healthiest state?

Speaker 1 19:51

You don't have to answer, I never do.

Speaker 4 19:53

That's my wife. Yeah, okay, he's in an unhealthy state Let me kind of get him back to where he needs to be or allow him to focus back on what needs to be done in order to come out of that unhealthy state. So I think it's, yeah, in some ways sad, and then in other ways it could be like, oh man like what are you?

Speaker 3 20:24

you know?

Speaker 4 20:25

kind of like question mark, like you're not healthy. Why is that? You know what? I mean so let's get you back, you know, I mean, it's almost like, hey, grab a snicker you know you're Betty White Wow.

Speaker 3 20:39

Well, that might be the most helpful thing that's ever been said on this podcast.

Speaker 2 20:44

Grab a snicker. When in doubt, grab a snicker. Wow, yeah, what was that? What was that? Uh?

Speaker 1 20:47

yes, you're not yourself. Yeah, in the commercials and then yeah, there was one with betty white, yes, where she was a football player.

Speaker 2 20:53

Yeah, oh we digress but yeah, but I like that too because, um, even that is that question mark of just like okay, we have to have that introspection to see, like, okay, what is going on to where I'm not my true self, and not that we're always like, oh, we're in the healthiest state, we're in the happiest state.

Speaker 2 21:14

But I think a lot of times for a five, one of the pathways to that is recognizing that maybe some of their emotions have been stuffed down, because we talked about how a five just is all about pouring things and putting things in their head and yet sometimes we can have that disconnect with the heart and so do you think for you. Maybe sometimes those off days or those unhealthy days has to do with maybe some of the emotions that just have kind of gotten pushed to the side.

Speaker 4 21:37

Yeah, I would say for sure. Sometimes you just have to hit the pause button and press rewind and go back and see whatever it is that those emotions are rooted.

Speaker 2 21:52

And then figure out how to, you know, discover and grow and heal in the ways that you need to then move forward. Yeah, has that been a tough journey of like connecting head and heart, Like because they say for fives, and like if we say hey, what are you feeling? They're like oh, and they'll give you thoughts. They don't necessarily give you feelings. But do you think for you like has that been a pathway that you've been able to really?

Speaker 4 22:08

Yeah, that's a tough process, but I feel like I've had moments and different things that I experienced in life that have taught me how to navigate through them you know a lot better than what I would before, not knowing. Yeah, yes, I've been able to observe and kind of see and then grow from you know, apart from like oh, let me bask in the distance be unhealthy, more so like okay, that's not good, that's unhealthy.

Speaker 2 22:28

Let me move to the healthy side. Yeah, and does that take for you? Because they say most fives are introverts which doesn't mean that you don't like to be with people. It just means that you get energized by being alone. So for you is that important, would you say, if you are just feeling maybe just exhausted or not feeling so much yourself, to have that space by yourself.

Speaker 4 22:46

Yeah, I think sometimes you got to step away you know, when you need to. You know that is needed, but other times it's important to have someone come alongside you and kind of help you in the midst of those moments when they know like oh man, you, you know, let me yeah.

Speaker 2 23:00

Yeah, have that space where it doesn't just have to be you which I think is really healthy for a five, because so often I think that's where fives can kind of crawl into a hole or just want to be totally by themselves, but it's that space of yeah, I need some, maybe some space to just have that introspection, but also I want to walk along with somebody else have somebody else walk alongside or just be around people that you know, you might receive some information that you find out of if you're alone.

Speaker 4 23:28

So just being around people in the midst of those moments in order to grow and like, oh man, even though this is tough and I'm unhealthy, let me go and see what.

Speaker 1 23:34

I can gain from you know in the midst of Well, do you know if you're introverted or extroverted? I don't know if you're introverted, honestly.

Speaker 3 23:42

You're quiet.

Speaker 1 23:43

it but a little bit of both, but I see you around people, all the time yeah so like it doesn't seem like that takes it out of you yeah, oh no, it's a little bit of both.

Speaker 2 23:52

Okay, yeah all right on that continuum depending on the the setting oh, I think you're saying depends on the person he's an introvert.

Speaker 2 24:02

Maybe that is it well and just you know. If you are drained, what energizes you, you know, is it taking that time out and just being by yourself? Or is it being Well and just? You know, if you are drained, what energizes you, you know? Is it taking that time out and just being by yourself, or is it being with people? And I think you know there's those in-between places where you're maybe an introverted, extrovert you know, or an extroverted introvert.

Speaker 1 24:17

There we go. Yeah, you should write a book on that. I'm sure there have been.

Speaker 4 24:21

Yeah, I think I've grown a to try to become a better extrovert, pretty much, and not uh, have that greed or hold on to the information or uh, oh, that's cool, or not. Say something in the midst of those moments. I think I've grown a little bit to be like, okay, cool, maybe you should speak up here yeah apart from just sitting back and, you know, observing.

Speaker 1 24:38

I love that yeah, that kind of shows that, uh, you can change, and I think that's we've talked about this several times like the enneagram gets a bad rap because there's no change involved supposedly in it, but obviously you're growing to be the best person that you can be and you're recognizing that and taking steps. That's amazing.

Speaker 2 24:57

Yeah Well, and that's one thing I think you know with the Enneagram, it does give us those places of how we can grow, if someone's willing, and not just staying stuck in their you know, comfort zone Right, which is where I live. On the couch.

Speaker 1 25:13

It's actually a recliner, but okay.

Speaker 2 25:18

Well, and you know. A final question. I think, walt, you know when we think about fives and relationships you've talked a lot about, like how you love to pour into other people. What are ways that people can pour into you, or what would be some of those things that you might need from relationships? For those of us that are in relationship with you, inquiring minds want to know how can we love and serve you. What does that look like?

Speaker 4 25:40

Oh man, Usually, I don't know, I guess humbly just people reaching out and saying small things in the midst of moments like oh man it was great when you did that. Or you know the little words of affirmation you know saying, I'm just saying that they're needed, but sometimes when they're hurt it's like special. It's like oh man, almost like the sticky notes that I give people to receive those same way. Ok, yeah, it's like encouraging Keep going or keep doing what you're doing.

Speaker 3 26:04

Or this it's like encouraging.

Speaker 4 26:05

Keep going or keep doing what you're doing. This meant the most to me, and it lets me know like, oh man, that's great.

Speaker 2 26:10

Yes, well, and I can see as a five words mean a lot, because fives really value words, they really think through what they're going to say to someone, and so you receiving that from someone, I'm sure, is just very, very much a special gift.

Speaker 1 26:26

Yeah, I loved what you said was like it's not necessarily needed, but I what I heard you say then was it's, but it's meaningful yeah and I. I can really appreciate that and I think people should be okay with that for themselves, you know like it's it's okay. Say kelly, yeah, I don't necessarily need you to give me a compliment, but when you do, it's meaningful I love that yeah yeah, we need to make that into a shirt.

Speaker 2 26:48

I mean, you have a line of shirts I do In mind.

Speaker 1 26:55

We will have a merch store coming soon.

Speaker 3 26:57

Most of them aren't going to make it to press yes Well there will be two, one for you and one for me.

Speaker 2 27:04

Yeah right, oh well, and I'm excited to even as we're thinking about the different creative ways that Walt has helped us with the Enneagram how we'll be able to share his five jingle as part of this podcast too.

Speaker 1 27:17

Well, let's do that right now. Then let's do it, Okay. Well, thanks, Walt for joining us on the Enneagram. Everybody listen up. Here's Walt with.

Speaker 3 27:28

I don't remember what the title of it is, off the top of my head, but it is about a five.

Speaker 1 27:30

So here we go. See you next time.

Speaker 3 27:31

Bye Kelly, bye Damon. Alert, insightful and curious Interfering, but yet I studied the world with due diligence. I'm self-sufficient, calm and focused, always learning, defeating my conflict and staying true to my motives. If I need to solve a problem, I start here to see the right path. On four plus one or two plus three, you do the math. I focus intensely on mastering something that has captured my interest in certain situations. If you need more information, just check out my pinterest. Much of my time gets spent collecting, developing ideas and skills. That way, I believe, what makes me feel confident and prepared. Sometimes I have real needs but I forget that they're there. I'm a two plus two plus one. The safety of my mind tells me a ton, like having foresight and prediction, or being able to concentrate and becoming gross. And what has caught my attention? I'm really a 5, so I guess this is an honorable mention.