Beyond Your Number
You’re not just a type — you’re a whole story. Beyond Your Number is a conversational Enneagram podcast where Damon & Kelly explore real-life growth through personality. From relationships to team dynamics, we help you go deeper than the label. New episodes every Wednesday. Formerly EnneagramU.
Beyond Your Number
Navigating Faith as a Six
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In this episode of Enneagram U, hosts Damon and Kelly discuss how Sixes can develop a strong relationship with God. They talk about the importance of Sixes feeling safe to doubt, question, and explore their faith. Damon and Kelly share how finding security in God can help Sixes overcome their core fear. They suggest spiritual practices like lectio divina, worship music, and scripture memory to help Sixes deepen their trust in God's truths. Join Damon and Kelly as they offer encouragement for Sixes building an authentic faith.
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Journey of Self-Discovery With Enneagram U
Speaker 1Welcome to Enneagram U with Damon and Kelly , where we explore the mysteries of human personality and help you learn more about you . Whether you're a skeptic or an enthusiast , together we'll take you on a journey of self-discovery using the ancient wisdom of the Enneagram . This is Enneagram U . Hey everyone , welcome to Enneagram U . My name is Damon . I'm here with my friend Kelly . Hi Kelly , hey Damon , I am feeling . Look how I jumped in there .
Speaker 2I know you're just getting so well versed in your feelings .
Speaker 1Well , yeah , I'm starting to think about it , mostly out of fear .
Speaker 2Well , we are in the fear triad right now . Yeah , no , I'm feeling thankful .
Speaker 1Today it was Father's Day . Yesterday , yes , had a good Father's Day . Have a great son . He always makes me feel really good .
Speaker 2Good .
Speaker 1And just gives me a lot of gratitude .
Speaker 2He's older now he's his own man and they have an appreciation for us now . I think so , and he's just really good at writing cards .
Speaker 1I'm like I can't read this in front of certain people because I'll cry like a baby and yeah . And so well , I guess I just told the whole world that I do so it doesn't matter .
Speaker 2I guess I'll read the card in front of all of you right now . It's different being in the moment , though . If you're reading it and you're in front of people , it does feel like . Oh , here come the feelings .
Speaker 1That's all right . I mean I'm grateful , and then we're all we just don't , we're a wreck .
Speaker 2Everybody's emotional . Yeah , it's so good though .
Speaker 1He's our only child , so there's that aspect of it as well . So that's good . And I'm also confused today . You're feeling confused . I am feeling confused because I was thinking about we're talking about the six today , and then I was trying to remember last week's show and I'm like I can't really remember things , Kelly .
Speaker 2So we kind of chatted about that . I'm like .
Speaker 1Am I really forgetting ?
Speaker 2things . Anyway , I know Well , the other day I've noticed , like I don't know if it's just , I've gotten so many people's names in my head that then like names , I not like my close people , but like other people . I'm like I am spacing out on this person's name or that person's name and I'm like , and eventually it comes to me .
Speaker 1But then I think the anxiety in the moment too , I'm just like freaking myself out thinking oh no , it's a very strange feeling it is , and so I we've lived in several different communities and so we have friends from several different communities , and I will literally see a friend and put them in the wrong community , or somebody or talk to somebody and like now where are you from ?
Speaker 2I can't remember you know which life , I know you which life was that .
Speaker 1And one of our co-workers , um , I won't say morgan , um said to me you've lived several lives . Oh my god , you're old .
Speaker 2But you've just had several segments of life . You're a cat , Damon .
Speaker 1You've had nine lives . I'm still alive . So I'm confused and thankful today . I'm thankful for being confused . That does bring up fear because I mean as we get older .
Speaker 2I know there's that fear of am . I going to have dementia .
Speaker 1Yeah , that's a thing I said to my wife . It's okay , just put me somewhere , I won't really know .
Speaker 2Did she have you go ahead and sign something . I'll sign it .
Speaker 1I'll sign it . We joke because it's a very serious thing for people .
Speaker 2Very , very serious , and I don't mean to make light of it .
Speaker 1but in some ways I'm kind of serious about that . I mean , like I'm I'm really wanting her to do what's best at that point , and yeah , I know we're at that age where , like I , know when I started to be you . I'm like okay . Long-term disability yes Sign me up for that insurance .
Speaker 2You just don't know and I don't want my kids to feel like they have to care for me . Are we burdened by that .
Speaker 1That's a word that my dad used a lot . You know he passed away , but before that he was like I don't want to be a burden .
Speaker 2And then we're like dad , you're not a burden , but it was hard . It was hard caring for him at times . Yeah , I've had friends who've cared for family members and yeah , you just see the depth of like it's a 24 seven . We did a hospice with my husband's mom but it was just a very , very quick kind of thing , Like literally she was at our house less than a week . She was just ready to go . But even those days it was 24-7 . And you just didn't know what this is going to look like it's full care .
Speaker 1Wow , I really took a somewhere dark .
Speaker 2We've just nosedived .
Speaker 1But I'm thankful . That's a happy positive thing and , yeah , I've also been accused recently of being kind of negative . So I think that's my nine . Going to my bad part of the six .
Speaker 2Okay , yes , that fear . Look at that yeah .
Speaker 1I'm not trying to be fearful , no . Well we live in a world where so many things . How am I going to turn this ?
Speaker 2corner in this conversation except to say how are you feeling , kelly ? Well , I was no , no , no , like you , I am grateful . We had a great weekend celebrating my husband and my dad , and just grateful for our kids too , just their gratitude for their dad and just , yeah , I feel like , and you get this , you and Paula get this too . It's just a joy to raise your kids and see them , you know , being grateful and thriving .
Speaker 1Oh , my goodness . Not to interrupt but just to tag onto that on Facebook . I've got to take . I don't know what I'm going to do . I'm not on Facebook , my wife's been on .
Speaker 2Facebook for years . Did you see those posts ?
Speaker 1Some pictures oh , my goodness .
Speaker 2But I have to say , damon , I mean , you actually look the same now that you did in those pictures . Kelly , you do , you have not aged your eyes are worse .
Speaker 1That's what's wrong with you . They're getting bad . I could definitely tell . But did you see what she did with Blake and me through the years ?
Speaker 2Yes , where we're twins .
Speaker 1There are days I'll see him and we have the exact same clothes on Well , not the exact , but he has a white shirt . I have a white shirt . He has black shorts . Yes , and isn't where .
Speaker 2Paula has bought you guys the same outfits . No , this is not no , no so it's not like oh , you're twinning because Paula's bought you the same outfit . No , you guys just have the same kind of style .
Speaker 1Yeah , I don't know . I don't know he's way stylier . Is that a Okay ?
Speaker 2But yeah , so many pictures of you guys just 20 .
Speaker 1I was like , I was like what happened ? Anyway , I said what happened to you asking me about pictures that go ? She's like I'm done with that . Yeah , I'm putting everything out there .
Speaker 2We have either be on Facebook and defend yourself or not . There's one picture , though that Blake's kind of looking at you like .
Speaker 1Oh yeah , giving you the side .
Speaker 2Oh yeah , well , of course , old he was there , probably about 13 oh , I think he was older , though I think it was like being funny that you guys were dressed alike like oh he's always . He's always been good yeah , great sense of humor anyway , so I'm grateful yeah , it was a good weekend , yeah , glad .
Speaker 2So we're talking about the six today six , yes , and we were so blessed last week to have lauren on as our sixth guest . I think she just set us up well even for the conversation today with sixes and their relationships with God .
Speaker 1Yep , she's good .
Speaker 2Yes .
Speaker 1She's on the list to come back .
Speaker 2She , yes , very much , and I love too that her mom got her into the Enneagram and like she's just been one of those that have kind of not necessarily grown up with it but like really has embraced it and has seen , like just this acceptance of herself as this mom of young children and a wife , and , yeah , I wanted to call her , though , and say , hey , did you get the house ?
Speaker 1Yeah , I don't know . Was it like again , can't remember . Was it like soon they were going to be making this ?
Speaker 2decision . Well , they were going to go look at it that day .
Speaker 1Oh yeah .
Speaker 2So , lauren , you'll have to let us know .
Speaker 1Yeah , let us know , Lauren .
Exploring Faith and Questions With Sixes
Speaker 2Yes , so anyway . But as we think about the six again , just a little bit of a reminder that sixes are loyal and faithful and so they will also act heroically for a cause that they believe in . They make great , great contributions to our team and I loved what she shared last week too , of her as a friend . She's going to reach out to that friend if they feel disconnected . But also when we're in relationship with a six , reach out to your six friends and just let them know , like hey , thinking of you , or hey , let's get together because sixes and twos are the ones that initiate those friendships .
Speaker 2But it means so much to those numbers if you reach out to them too Okay .
Speaker 1Okay that's good .
Speaker 2But she also mentioned too , as a questioner so she'll question everything that there's some suspiciousness in relationship , and I think that's important for sixes to know , even in their relationship with God , that's pretty normal To be just kind of maybe resistant , or even , if you've grown up in the church , having to make it your own and so to ask those questions , because once you can really make that pathway to that relationship with God and put your trust in God , I think then sixes are set .
Speaker 1Yeah , because what you're saying is the trust is an issue can be , and so if they get past the trust with God , then the loyalty with God is steadfast .
Speaker 2Yes , because , like she said , even with friendships , once you really get past that point and that a six really trusts you , they're set . So it makes me wonder too , people that I've known that have grown up in a church where it's been pretty rigid or they weren't really able to push back or ask questions , and now that's really impacted their relationship with God . Or maybe where they're like , no , I'm not interested at all . So I think it's important for sixes to know that , hey , god wants you to ask questions to . You know , push the envelope a little bit . You know there's nothing you're going to say or do or question where God's going to be like , well , I'm done with you .
Speaker 1Yeah , I can't handle that no .
Speaker 2But I think a lot of times maybe sixes , as kids or teenagers , just weren't allowed to ask those questions important to ask those questions . I kind of think about doubting Thomas , where he was the disciple who wasn't in the room when Jesus appeared after the resurrection . And yet Jesus , when he appeared to the disciples were like here , see my hand , see my side . And then , because Thomas wasn't there , he was like I'm not , I can't really believe this unless I see him myself . And then Jesus appeared and Thomas was there . And I think so often people , at least maybe some teachers of the Bible that I've heard of in the past , would say oh , thomas doubted and like that was a bad thing .
Speaker 1Don't be a doubting Thomas , we still say that .
Speaker 2Yes , but I think it's important to be able to doubt , because it's on the other side of doubt we can really trust . So I don't know just something to think about if you're a six and maybe you've kind of pushed religion or your relationship with God to the side of , like , maybe giving it another chance , you know , and maybe even just starting out by saying , okay , god , if you're really real , like , just make yourself known to me .
Speaker 1Or another question might be is their vision of God because of , maybe , their upbringing and not being able to ask questions ? Is their view of God correct ?
Speaker 2Right , that's another thing .
Speaker 1So do you think Thomas was a six ?
Speaker 2Maybe , I think maybe a six with a five or a five with a six , Because he was the one too that would ask a lot of questions . It took yeah .
Speaker 1What was Judas's number ? 666 .
Speaker 2Well , it's the day after Father's Day , so I guess you still get a dad joke in there .
Speaker 1Yeah , I do . That was a dad joke , a religious dad joke . Kelly , you called me on a dad joke . That is really good . I'm proud of you . I'm so proud of you . That was awesome , whatever , yeah .
Speaker 2So , anyway , for sixes , though , they are looking for safety and security , and so we think about with our relationship with God and Lauren mentioned this last time when you know your safety and security is in God , that really helps with those thoughts and questions and concerns .
Speaker 1What a superpower then for a six ?
Speaker 2Yes , absolutely .
Speaker 1To have faith .
Speaker 2Yeah , to see and really not only know about God , but to really experience His being a refuge , being that safety and security that they need .
Speaker 1Yeah , I mean she said like I don't know something like this misquote coming . I don't know how people get by in life without faith , right , right , especially from her lens as a six .
Speaker 2That's right .
Speaker 1Very interesting .
Speaker 2Yeah , well , and I think too , because their besetting struggle , as we've said , is fear , and if you think about the world that we live in like fear of I mean , there is no place you can look where there's not fear , and even just internally , like our own fear is about , you know well , family , friends , you know work , economy , the election coming up . I mean gosh , if we just sat here for five minutes and just went through everything that we were having fear about .
Speaker 1it would be on and on . And we're not even sixes . I mean , you go there as the nine , but I do .
Speaker 2I've been accused of being a six .
Speaker 1I mean yeah , Accused is the right word . I think , you're a six , I'm like . No , I don't know . Yes , I can be . Yes , I'd also be very loyal .
Speaker 2That's right , yeah , so there you go .
Speaker 1Well , true , but as a nine , you can go to all the other numbers . Stop , okay , anyway , but for the six .
Speaker 2you know and that fear , you know to recognize that , you know for them being able to embrace the fear and actually deal with the fear by okay , what is my plan or what is the truth about this ? And I think you know , when we think about our relationship with God , god is all about helping us not to have fear . Again , we live in a fallen world , so there's gonna be fear , but , like we shared last week , several verses throughout the Bible , do not fear or when you are afraid .
Speaker 2I remember as a little girl , so again I think I shared that . My mom , I really believe , is a six , and so the very first memory verse she ever encouraged me to memorize is from the psalm . It's one of the psalms , and it's "'When I am afraid , I will trust in you'" . Wow , that's good so even as a child , when you have those natural fears like I'm scared of the dark .
Speaker 1I'm scared .
Speaker 2For me . I was scared of tornadoes and she was like here's a verse that would be really , really helpful .
Speaker 1That's good .
Speaker 2So , anyway , I think for the sixes and their relationships with God , encouragement to just be able to embrace those questions , and not just that you have to embrace them on your own , you know , talk with somebody about your questions . You know , and that's one of the great things we get to do as far as our faith and community team at VU . Like one of our great privileges is to just get to walk alongside people with their questions . And also , a little plug for a small group coming up this fall is Alpha , and that is just a safe space to explore questions about God with others that are also questioning , and so you don't have to have it all figured out or even be someone that is interested in faith , it's just like , hey , these are questions that are important to explore , and so Alpha has been a great place to do that too , pete .
Speaker 1Yeah , it's great , great to know .
Speaker 2So for the six , we talk about the downstream and the upstream practices . And so the downstream . What's easy for the six , a practice that they can just really engage in , is being in scripture . So we know in the head triad they love to be able , like the five , to be able to have knowledge about God . But a way of practicing scripture that I think can be really invitational to the six , it's called Lectio Divina .
Speaker 1Pete , all right , is that Latin Jennifer ? It is Pete , uh-huh .
Speaker 2Jennifer , meaning like sacred reading . And so what Lectio Divina looks at is like reading like a same passage of scripture . So you're not going to be reading like a whole book , but just maybe like four or five , six verses , and so you read those , but you read them four different times in like one setting , and so you read it first just to listen , and then you read it the second time , just then to see like does God maybe have an invitation for me in what I'm reading ? And maybe also how does this reflect the situation that I'm in in my life right now ? You read it through the third time and then you read it through the fourth time , and so , just again , you're just kind of simmering in the scripture just to see if God's word we know is alive and active , and so that way God may have something that he wants to say to you through that passage . And so it's not just filling your head but also like are you noticing like God prompting you ?
Speaker 1Yeah , you're taking some time . You're not just reading through the scripture and moving on you're reflecting , and what do we call it again ? Lectio Divina .
Speaker 2That's over my head , yes , yeah , I will forget that for sure , like our listeners can look it up and let me spell it just so you can look it up but it's L-E-C-T-I-O , so Lectio or Lectio I've heard it pronounced and then Divina , d-i-v-i-n-a , so sacred reading , yeah , and Bibles that you can purchase that have like more Lectio Divina kind of scriptures .
Speaker 1So anyway it's just a way of engaging the scripture .
Speaker 2Another downstream practice you'll love this one is worship music .
Speaker 1Why would I love that one ?
Speaker 2Because you love worship music .
Speaker 1I do as a worship leader .
Speaker 2Sure , but the reason that Sixes love this is that it is singing the truth . So it's like this whole body way of singing truth that you believe in , and also when you can sing it with others . So like being a part of like worship music for the community that you're in is really , really good too .
Speaker 1It just fills them .
Speaker 2Yeah , so an upstream practice , so these are a little more difficult . So this is scripture memory .
Speaker 1Yeah , it's hard for me .
Speaker 2Well , I mean we get to a certain age like we said , yeah , it's hard for me . Well , I mean , we get to a certain age like we said You're right , it's coming full circle . I know , yeah , it's okay , and the reason this is important is that it really anchors them to the truth , and so maybe , when you're in the midst of like a lot of fear or you know something's going on , that's really stressful , instead of just simply reading it like this is a truth that you have in your heart like it's memorized , you know , and so calling it to mind can be really , really helpful , be encouraging .
Speaker 2And again , there's so many scriptures about fear , you know , and so even if it's Jesus saying , like after the resurrection , like the one phrase that Jesus said that's recorded most in the gospel is peace , be with you . So , even if it's as a prayer saying peace , be with me , you know , just to memorize that , to help fight that fear , it's good , yeah . And then you know being able , I think , for the sixes to know that , especially in your relationship with God , it's really important not just to fill your head , you know , not just to go through the motions , but to really go beyond just thinking , into acting , you know , and into really doing something . So I think this is where our downstream practices are really good too .
Speaker 1Yeah , practicing your faith .
Speaker 2Practicing your faith .
Speaker 1Yeah , and courage . Right is not being afraid . It's being afraid and going forward anyway in faith . Yes , yes , that's right .
Speaker 2Which is so important because we know for the sixes and their strength , they're really living out courage . And so it's not just , oh , I won't ever be fearful , or I won't ever be afraid , no , it's , I'm going to walk through the fear to get to courage . Yeah , yeah .
Speaker 1That's great , Kelly . That's a lot . Are we at the end of the ?
Speaker 2upstream and downstream . For the stream and downstream , yes .
Speaker 1That's a lot to think about , and I'll have to think about it because I will forget it .
Speaker 2Keep thinking , keep processing .
Speaker 1I mean , I'm right there on the edge .
Speaker 2Yeah .
Speaker 1What's your name ?
Speaker 2Okay , Well , as long as you don't forget your own .
Speaker 1Yeah , oh Lord . Thanks everyone for joining us on Enneagram U . We will see you next time . Bye Kelly , bye Damon . You do without love in your heart , without love by your side , without love playing a part .
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