Helping Hands: Enneagram Type Two Special Guest

 Joining us is Vanessa from the VU security team, who, as an Enneagram Type Two, shares her heartfelt stories of support and service that are sure to resonate with anyone who's ever felt the deep satisfaction of lending a hand.

Vanessa's experiences as a Type Two shine a spotlight on the tender balance of giving and receiving care, a poignant theme echoed through tales of navigating life's disruptions, including the pandemic's curveballs. 

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Transcript

Enneagram U

Speaker 1 0:00

I sometimes feel like the licking puppy We've, yes, like it's like yeah, that's cute at first, but it gets real annoying after a while.

Speaker 3 0:12

Welcome to Enneagram U with Damon and Kelly, where we explore the mysteries of human personality and help you learn more about you, whether you're a skeptic or an enthusiast, together we'll take you on a journey of self-discovery using the ancient wisdom of the Enneagram. This is Enneagram U. Hey, everyone, welcome to Enneagram U. My name is Damon and I'm here with my friend Kelly. Hi Kelly, hey Damon. Yeah, that's all I got, yeah nope. Why don't we?

Speaker 2 0:39

just dive in with how you're feeling.

Speaker 3 0:42

Why do you ask me first, I'm not fast enough. I'm feeling. I'm feeling happy. I'm feeling happy. Yeah, I like the weather. The weather's good today. That always does something for me. If it's good. If it's cloudy, I feel cloudy.

Speaker 2 0:55

I know.

Speaker 3 0:56

But if it's sunny, I feel sunny. Yes, so that's my quick answer. But yeah, I just think I think it's a good day today. I'm pretty busy at work. That's doing some things I really enjoy and so, even though I'm busy, it's all fun things. We had a great staff meeting this morning. We did Got a good leadership. We'll keep him around for a while. Yeah, and yeah, and we could stay around a while and Maybe, maybe you'll keep me around for a while I know you're in, yeah, so how are?

Speaker 3 1:23

you feeling today. I'm happy, you know I'm grateful. You're always grateful Come on.

Speaker 2 1:28

I'm usually excited or energized.

Speaker 3 1:30

Well, we haven't seen anything bad, though, like man, I'm depressed.

Speaker 2 1:33

Well, I mean, you have seen me where I have felt overwhelmed that day with the airline tickets and getting my 43 friends to Jamaica. That was a tough day.

Speaker 3 1:42

It was, we laugh, now we do. But yeah, that was a nightmare, yeah, but yeah, feeling grateful, I'm glad you're grateful, like you said we get to work for an amazing company, do great fun things.

Speaker 2 1:54

I think you and I are both living out our passions.

Speaker 3 1:56

You've already had your review, you don't have to keep doing that. I did tell Matt.

Speaker 2 2:02

I said you know, Matt, if it ever comes a time where, like you, need to let me go, can I just volunteer?

Speaker 3 2:07

Oh my gosh, I probably shouldn't have told him that. Yeah, no, because they'll take you up on that?

Speaker 2 2:11

Yeah, yeah, you're in. That was just for that day.

Speaker 3 2:14

Yeah, but Well, you're grateful what? Because of your great job.

Speaker 2 2:17

I am grateful for my great job. I am grateful to the last few weeks have just been full. I say that every time you were in Jamaica. Yeah, I was in Jamaica a few weeks ago. I'm actually going back to Jamaica. This week Well looky, here I'm noticing a pattern. Another mission trip, sure.

Speaker 3 2:36

It is another mission trip. That's what we're going to start calling them.

Speaker 2 2:38

Not with VU, but I get to go with a dental team from Columbia to help people in Jamaica. They don't have a lot of dental care there so there's a lot of teeth that get pulled. I don't pull the teeth. Oh my gosh. But, I do get to help people. I get to pray with people before they get the big shot in their gum.

Speaker 3 2:59

And a lot of people would appreciate that, because the dentist is, I am 100% I don't think there's been ever anybody that's been like.

Speaker 2 3:04

no, thank you, they're like yes, please, and we hold my hand.

Speaker 3 3:08

Right, the dentist is a praying thing. Yes, we want to pray when we go to the dentist.

Speaker 2 3:12

That's right, well, and their dental experience is a lot different. So, basically, they go into a little room where they actually see the big shots. Those are big shots If you've ever had dental work. But the thing we get to do here is we've got the sunglasses on, we've got the music, we're tipped back in the chair. Oh no, they have to see exactly what's going to happen. Wow, yeah. And then they go into the room with the dentist and it's like a folding chair and they just tip their head back.

Speaker 3 3:37

So if you don't believe in prayer, this is where you go to start. This is where you realize what dentist, do you go to Sunglasses, music and all that? I don't have any of that it's pretty much a folding chair where I go OK.

Speaker 2 3:51

Yeah, so I'm excited about getting to be a part of that Again. It's really really amazing to do that. That's great, yeah, and I'm grateful because we have a guest on with us today.

Speaker 3 3:59

Another guest Another guest.

Speaker 2 4:01

It happened, See. You were so concerned you said, if we can get a guest, I don't think we're going to be able to get a guest. But we've had Heather as our one and today we have Vanessa as our two.

Speaker 3 4:11

Vanessa welcome to. Enneagramu Hi.

Speaker 1 4:14

I'm so, so excited to be here.

Speaker 3 4:16

Oh good, Good we're excited you are here.

Speaker 2 4:18

So this is Vanessa Graham. She is at VU. So, vanessa, just a little bit about you.

Speaker 1 4:24

Tell us what you do at VU. Well, I work on the security team. Okay, I help on doing risk analysis, it audits, things like that. Okay, yeah, work with a lot of really, really smart people. I have a really great team.

Speaker 2 4:39

Oh, that's awesome. Yeah, well, I mean, as you use the word, help, that's the two's favorite word, yes, yes, Help, you get to help.

Speaker 1 4:46

Keep us all safe. Yes, and I have to say thank you for playing the great number two intro song Love in your Heart. I feel like that was made for a number two.

Speaker 3 4:57

Yes.

Speaker 1 4:57

Yeah.

Speaker 3 4:59

And you said you help with security on the IT team. So are you the protect this house person, that kind of?

Speaker 1 5:04

I am not that person, but yes, that person is on my team.

Speaker 3 5:07

Awesome, that's really cool. Yeah, I've been spammed and fish faked by your team many times.

Speaker 1 5:15

Yes, I'm like this is Well, you're an IT, have you?

Speaker 3 5:17

fallen for. Well, here's the problem. I think I know everything. Oh and that is the problem with most IT people. Okay yeah, we think we know it all. I mean, we get busted and I'm like hey, man don't be doing that.

Speaker 2 5:29

Yes.

Speaker 3 5:31

You're trying to outsmart the system.

Speaker 2 5:32

You're not going to do it. Stan has to call Damon and say hey, buddy.

Speaker 3 5:34

I've only been in trouble a few times. Yes, just a few times.

Speaker 1 5:38

I think. Stan got me one time yeah, yeah, and then I learned my lesson. He's very good, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 5:43

He has to be, because those people out there are good that try to get us.

Speaker 3 5:47

That's right.

Speaker 2 5:47

You know yeah.

Speaker 3 5:49

You guys are cracker jacks. Yes, that's for sure. Yeah, top notch yeah.

Speaker 2 5:56

And we just love to hear, like how did you come to know about the Enneagram and your number?

Speaker 1 6:01

Well, through you, kelly, okay, oh boy, me too.

Speaker 3 6:04

We're having a pattern here.

Speaker 1 6:06

So long, long time ago back in the day, I think, even before you started at VU, there you had an Enneagram weekend retreat. Yes, it was like a Zoom thing, I think, Damon.

Speaker 2 6:19

I think that was your first entry.

Speaker 3 6:21

Really.

Speaker 2 6:22

Into the.

Speaker 3 6:22

Enneagram and blocked it out and blacked out during that. Really, yeah, that's the only way I could stand it.

Speaker 2 6:28

Because it was completely disconnected from like Woodcrust. I think you were just like okay, I'm going to do this. So you guys were in the same group Right, here we are.

Speaker 1 6:36

Old friends, we didn't even know it.

Speaker 3 6:37

That's right yeah.

Speaker 1 6:41

So my sister and one of my good friends, we all got together and did the weekend retreat and learned our numbers, and I think the first time I had heard about it, though, actually was when I was in accounting, and they did a small group on it. And at that time, when I took the test, I thought I was like four different numbers. I had no idea. I was just barely was dipping my toe in and I was like, oh, I relate to this and I relate to this and that's Damon every day. Yeah, Really.

Speaker 1 7:11

Yeah, and I could, just I could not peg my number. I finally thought, oh well, I've got to be a one. I have to be a one.

Speaker 3 7:19

Me too.

Speaker 1 7:20

Yeah. So then when we did the Enneagram retreat weekend, I was like, oh man, I am like definitive number two. I know I'm a number two Every time you do like the Enneagram bingo. I'm like black out on number two. I was telling Kelly earlier like, if you, if there's an Enneagram dictionary. That's it, my picture would be on number two.

Speaker 3 7:44

On two.

Speaker 1 7:44

That would be it.

Speaker 3 7:45

So, yeah.

Speaker 2 7:47

That's good. Well, and that makes it great point too, because sometimes if we read about the Enneagram, we might really perceive ourselves as a different number. But there is something about hearing about the number presented more in an extensive kind of way. So for you, you just knew definitively I'm a two. Yes, and what do you think were some ways that really helped you to narrow that down for sure?

Speaker 1 8:08

Well, I had to really look into the motivations behind while the numbers do certain things, and then, once I figured out why the number two does things, I was like, oh, that's like the story of my life.

Speaker 3 8:23

Have other people said, yes, you're a two.

Speaker 1 8:25

Everyone who knows me. Okay, yes, I don't know.

Speaker 2 8:29

Again, she gets all the bingos.

Speaker 1 8:31

Yes, yes.

Embracing Your Enneagram Number for Growth

Speaker 2 8:33

Well, and so for you. Like you said, just discovering that, really embracing that you're a two, have there been some ways that you can really see how it's helped you to grow personally?

Speaker 1 8:42

Really, I think I should really embrace my number and it makes me feel good about myself. You know like, oh, I'm a two, I should be proud of that and I should, you know, really embrace all the wonderful things that a number two is.

Speaker 2 8:55

I love that, vanessa, because I think so often we can feel negative about our personality, and I think that is one way that people even find their numbers. They're like, oh, that's me on my worst day, you know, but also it's us on our best day as well. So being able to really see that, yeah, you are designed to be this helper, this person that loves to love people, loves to serve people, and to really embrace that and then also to give yourself grace about that. So you don't have to be all the other numbers, you can just be you and the two.

Speaker 3 9:24

Were you feeling like, now that I know that I'm a two? Yay, woohoo, I'm a two. I'm so happy. Oh yeah, two's are the best number.

Speaker 1 9:31

Okay, all right.

Speaker 2 9:32

That wasn't my reaction to my number, so I was just wondering you know, yeah, absolutely. So what do you think that they would say just about you as being a two? What made that so evident to them?

Speaker 1 9:44

I am definitely a two the helper. Anytime anyone needs anything, I'm the first to be in line to help them, give them, do for them, care for them, and it really does bring me joy to care for people. I very much embrace that caretaker role. It fills my cup so much.

Speaker 2 10:10

Yeah, I know, just in like small groups that we've been in, you're the one that usually celebrates by bringing like food in for someone, or you know bringing food in just to be able to love and serve people. You know you're there to help clean up and just whatever the need is, you're right there pitching in, tell me what you need boss.

Speaker 2 10:29

Yes, I love to serve. Yeah, and you've also. I think one of the things that I really loved seeing just how you embrace the Enneagram is it's not just for you, but like pretty much everybody in your whole family has really embraced the Enneagram too.

Speaker 1 10:46

Yes. So when my sister and I figured out our numbers, we immediately made our entire family take tests and tried to pin them down and figure out what they are, and they love it just as much as we do now, which is so fun.

Speaker 2 11:02

So we'll be like, oh mom, you're number one's coming out, you know so, yeah, and that really does help, I think, in relating, you know, with other people, if we can just know their numbers and know, like, what motivates them. And being able and I know we say this a lot like different isn't wrong, it's just different. And I can only imagine how helpful this would be if your family of origin or your family knew what their numbers were, because that way you could say things like to kind of bridge that gap a little bit instead of like oh, mom, it's like it's mom's one coming out.

Speaker 3 11:35

That just feels a little more Well it's sometimes good to have language in language for things and especially our personalities.

Speaker 2 11:42

Yeah, for sure, yeah, so I love how your family's just embraced that and been able to incorporate that in the family.

Speaker 1 11:51

Yes, very much so you know, you know my sister and she's a number eight also, and I think it's really helped our relationship a lot. I mean, we already know each other better than anybody else in the world. But now that I know that she's an eight and why she's doing the things that she's doing, or why she's reacting, the way that she's reacting really helps me. Like, for instance, when she gets angry, I try not to take it personally because I know she's an eight and she's displaying anger because she's frustrated or because she's hurt or you know it's not, it's not me. So knowing someone's number really helps me a lot in not taking things personally.

Speaker 2 12:42

Yeah, absolutely Well, and, like you said, for her, knowing that she's an eight, but that's just the way she's going to express her emotions, is maybe a form of anger and so being able to help her, you know, and like you said, not taking it personally, but knowing, okay, helping her is just giving her a sounding board or just being there to just let her process that anger.

Speaker 1 13:00

Yeah, so if she's angry, I'm like okay, she's frustrated about something, she's upset about something. How can I help her work through this? How can I help her turn that anger into something positive?

Speaker 2 13:12

Yeah, that's right, yeah, instead of it being a barrier, which can happen so often. Yeah, well, and you said, going back, twos are the best number. We are, yeah. So what would you say? That twos are the best because?

Speaker 1 13:25

I feel like we're the most loving, giving, generous, empathetic, like we're the friend that everyone wants. Amen.

Speaker 3 13:37

I can't argue with that. It's really good.

Speaker 1 13:40

Healthy twos anyway. Well to shade.

Speaker 2 13:45

Yeah Well, we say every two needs a two friend. Do you have a two friend in your life that pours into you?

Speaker 1 13:53

I don't think so. I'm trying to think if I know a number two, but I really don't think I do.

Speaker 2 14:01

Yeah, we need to take interviews for Vanessa to find a really good two friend, because she is so amazing.

Speaker 3 14:08

Hello out there in podcast land. I'm sure there's some twos listening.

Speaker 2 14:12

Well, they're hearing Vanessa and they're like we want to be friends with her. That's right, so we need to connect.

Speaker 3 14:17

The emails are going to start, that's right.

Speaker 2 14:20

Well, we've also said too, I've been in like retreats or different experiences where they'll get the different numbers together. And you know, at first for me I was leading an eight group, so I was very intimidated because I was just feeling like I'm going to be in here with all these other eights and I don't know if they're healthy or not. They were mostly healthy, so that was a really great conversation. But all the other numbers too, I think they gave us like an hour and a half to have conversations with, you know, in our number groups and afterwards it was like the numbers did not want to leave their rooms, Like they just got so bonded just in that short time because they were with their other numbers and it was like I'm with my people, I feel understood for the first time. You've had my struggle and so you know to do that sometimes, brother and sister.

Speaker 3 15:03

Yes, all right. Yes, it's great. Yeah, has anyone ever said you over help?

Speaker 1 15:09

Yes, okay.

Speaker 3 15:10

All right. So I wonder now that you know that you're a two you're like oh, that's why, Kind of like, that's why I just want to do that. And if they know you're a two, I wonder if that helps them realize yes, she's a two on the enneagram, so she's going to bring the cake.

Speaker 1 15:28

Yeah. Right, as we say you know, to the events and I'm always bringing the cake. Yeah, and you're like here.

Speaker 3 15:34

David have some cake, and I'm like, no, I don't want any cake. You're like, please have some cake, cake, you know that, that kind of thing. But now I know all your two. So, that's why.

Speaker 1 15:42

Yes, so I am in a relationship with a five, with a very self, sufficient, independent, I can do things myself five, and that is extremely hard for me. Okay, because I want to do everything, I want to be the caretaker, I want to be the helper, and I sometimes feel like the licking puppy We've yes. It's like, yeah, that's cute at first, but it gets real annoying after a while.

Speaker 3 16:17

Is that the animal for the two?

Speaker 2 16:18

Yes, oh okay, all right I thought I remembered that, yeah, they're just so sweet and lovable, but yet okay, too much can be too much.

Speaker 1 16:25

And before I read all about the enneagram, I did not understand how someone could not want me to help them constantly.

Speaker 2 16:35

Constantly.

Speaker 1 16:35

Sure, why do you not want me to do everything for you?

Speaker 2 16:38

Why would there need to be a world where twos couldn't help all the time? Exactly why would you not?

Speaker 1 16:43

want that Right, but apparently some people don't. So, I have had to learn in this relationship that I can allow other people to do things for themselves, even though I don't like it.

Speaker 2 16:55

Yes, that can actually be. The loving thing to do is just give some space, especially for the five who are much more introverted, so and a lot more independent.

Speaker 3 17:04

a lot of times, yeah, we mentioned that, that a two loves to give things to people and sometimes the thing to give is to not give Right? That's probably pretty tough to actually. That doesn't compute, right? It does not. Yeah, so I'll quit saying it.

Speaker 2 17:22

Yeah All the twos are like stop saying that I know, what you mean.

Speaker 1 17:26

But that's not helpful, Damon, but that is not helpful.

Speaker 3 17:28

Yes, yeah, I get it, yeah.

Speaker 1 17:31

So it's really funny that you say that. I think one of the first fights we ever got in was when he was trying to do something for himself and he knew that I was gonna try to take over. So he snuck around behind my back to try to do this thing himself and of course I saw it and immediately he started to take control and was like, oh, let me do that for you. And he was just fed up and turned around and snapped at me and said you are not helping.

Speaker 2 18:05

I mean talk about a stab to the heart so crushing. Yes, so crushing yes, and I just immediately busted out in tears and he could not understand why Sure.

Speaker 1 18:17

She had no idea what he had just said to me. Yes, so, after you know, I had to compose myself and like okay, let me Grieve that to yes. Let me explain to you why that hurt me so much. Yes so yeah, just someone saying that I was not being helpful was just the worst thing that they could say.

Speaker 2 18:40

Especially someone so close to you and, like you said, in relationships and that's what we're talking about, you know, this season like it's just understanding how each person really is living out their number and then how we can come together in those numbers. And so I'm sure in that conversation, hopefully in the long run, it was helpful to both of you to be able for him to see oh my gosh, that is soul crushing to not allow you to help, but then also for you to see okay, he's a little more independent and wants to do things for himself.

Speaker 1 19:12

Yeah, so I feel like we both got really valuable lessons out of that. I think his lesson was words are very important and how you say them is, you know, really critical. Yes, you know. So he's much more gentle with his feedback now. Good for him, yes, yes. And then for me it was like you need to let go and allow people to do things for themselves if they want to.

Speaker 2 19:41

Yeah.

Speaker 1 19:42

That was a hard lesson.

Speaker 2 19:43

To really.

Speaker 3 19:45

But very helpful.

Speaker 2 19:46

Yes, yes.

Speaker 1 19:48

Like relationship saving helpful Right yeah.

Speaker 2 19:52

Well, because there is a place of really moving from being codependent, which would be that you know, in that situation where you do everything for him, he's completely dependent on you. You really don't know where you end and he begins. But then you know the healthy version of a relationship is more interdependent. You know where you're connected, but he's himself you know he's in charge of his yard, you're in charge of yours, not so disconnected that you're like roommates, but more connected where you each are. You know able to pour into each other but not be over responsible for each other. So that can be a tough place for a two. Not that you want a codependent relationship, you don't want to call that but you want to have that dependency.

Speaker 3 20:35

I think sometimes and some numbers are a little more quiet and introverted, and so they're just chugging away. And I wrote a note. Do not say this to it too. You are not helping. Yes, don't say that that would be probably like kryptonite Right.

Speaker 2 20:50

All right For the two. Well, and would you want to share about recently with your loved one the opportunity that you have gotten?

Speaker 1 20:59

Yes, so the most wonderful thing has happened my boyfriend has had knee surgery.

Speaker 3 21:07

Okay.

Speaker 1 21:09

And now he is completely reliant on me. I know, dude, I am sorry man.

Speaker 3 21:13

Yes, and I'm happy for you too.

Speaker 1 21:17

It's a very hard life for him right now. Yes, so yeah, but you know he knows me by now and jokes all the time about oh, I bet you're just loving life right now. I said, yes, yes, I am yeah.

Speaker 2 21:32

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So you were made for this.

Speaker 1 21:34

I was Mm-hmm, I was this number two was born to be the caretaker.

Speaker 3 21:39

And he's working really hard on his therapy right now. He's like physical therapy, yeah, moving that leg, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 21:45

Yeah, every day.

Speaker 3 21:46

Well, I'm sorry about the knee surgery. That's rough.

Speaker 2 21:50

Well, and I'm sure there's such gratitude, though, too, because a two can know what is needed before he would even reach out to know what he would need. So he probably hasn't had to even ask a whole lot, you know, but being able, just for you, to say, hey, okay, do you have this, do you have this, do you have this?

Speaker 1 22:05

Let me get you prepared for what you're going to need while I'm away, and yeah, yes, that's exactly what happens every morning before work, and it's exhausting and draining, but so life-giving to me it really is just. I just live for it. I love it, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 22:26

Two's are caregivers. No matter what your occupation is, you're a caregiver.

Speaker 2 22:31

And, you know, having opportunities to help. Like you said, you're helping on your team, You're helping in your relationship, especially as he's down with his knee surgery, but also you're helping when he's going to be recovered and even before he had a surgery, by knowing, okay, this is just the balance we have to have in the relationship, you know, to keep it healthy and moving forward. And so, yeah, those amazing helpers, those empathetic, just knowing and really knowing what people need before they even know that they need it. You know they say that two's on different teams at work will be the one that checks in with people. Two's just have a radar for sensing like this person doesn't seem like they're having the best day. So are you kind of that on your team, Vanessa, of like how you doing checking in with people?

Speaker 1 23:17

Well, it's hard now, because I feel like I used to be 100% and then COVID happened and we all worked from home for so long, and so even now my team is still kind of hybrid. So I don't even see them every day, so that was really hard for me to not be connected in person with my team. Covid was rough.

Speaker 2 23:45

Yeah, I would say for two's, covid was like a nightmare. Yeah, because even though you might have seen someone through Zoom for a meeting, you weren't getting those personal interactions. Yeah.

Speaker 1 23:57

And it's really hard to gauge somebody through a screen you know Couldn't take their temperature their emotional temperature, mm-hmm yeah. So I feel like I'm getting back there now, okay, but yeah, the more I'm in the office and the more I can connect with people and relate to people, the more I get into that zone.

Speaker 2 24:20

Yeah you just shine when you're able to have that relational connection.

Speaker 3 24:25

That's why I use an avatar on Zoom all the time, although you know, when I had COVID, I've shared the story before. The first person at my doorstep was a tube. Yes, with a meal, right, mm-hmm, when I could have like normal food, yeah, you may not have been able to taste it, but no, I could, I never lost my taste. I'm like another person in my family. Well, she lost her smell. I think it's still gone. That's been a couple of years. I think it's permanent. Wow, yeah, yeah, mm-hmm, I digress.

Speaker 2 24:53

But, yes, no, the two's do show up. She is. She was right there at the door.

Speaker 3 24:56

It was. Yeah, check for the leg, Won't forget.

Speaker 2 24:58

Well, and two's oftentimes too, like I know I have a lot of people who are like I'll reach out to people and say, hey, if you need anything, let me know. Two's just go. You know, and I really admire that in two's, I think, for me, sometimes I'm like, oh, am I overstepping if I just show up with a pizza? Probably not, but a two would just do it.

Speaker 1 25:18

That can be a good thing and a bad thing. We don't always ask for permission to be the caretaker. Well, it's good that you know that.

Speaker 3 25:25

And is it hard to receive help? For you like to take help? Oh, no, impossible, oh, it's impossible. Impossible, yes, oh, but you know it.

Speaker 1 25:34

I do, and that is helpful, because sometimes I have to make myself accept the help. Had I not way before I knew about being a number two? I you know and we've talked about this the pride of the number two I can do everything myself. I don't need help, Don't worry about me, I'm fine, I take care of you, you don't take care of me. So it's really. It's really hard to admit that you need help and accept the help when you do need it for me anyway. Yeah.

Speaker 2 26:12

Yeah, and that's another place that we've talked about how for twos, if they can get their mind wrapped around the idea that it actually helps someone to let them help you, I mean, that's, I think, the only pathway to receive help. You know, it's like it's going to really help this person to let them help you. You know, if you thought about two relationships you have with other people, are there any things that you would want them to know about you, what you might need in relationship, or things that you might want others to know?

Speaker 1 26:39

We've kind of already touched on this before, but like one of the things that's really important is when you're giving feedback to a two, the way that you phrase things are really, really important. The words that you use are really important, I think, just like eights go to anger, I think twos go to hurt feelings a lot. Rejection is huge and if you feel like you're putting everything into a relationship and then they just, you know, turn around and tell you you're not helping.

Speaker 2 27:21

Yes, yes. Or what we've said, too, is that sometimes people are in relationships not just with twos, but sometimes with twos, and instead of being able to really communicate about their feelings, they just abandon the two. And how heartbreaking that is for the two. Yeah, because the twos left with like I don't know why this person isn't.

Speaker 1 27:39

Yeah, I mean twos are very receptive to feedback, because all we want to do is make the relationship better, stronger, closer, but it has to be in the right way. It has to be very gentle and in a very loving way.

Speaker 2 27:54

Yes, yes, I think that's huge because even you know feedback in relationships or even work relationships too, you know for us to recognize, okay, the ones that are twos that we're working with, to really continue to have that caring kind of communication, you know which may stretch some of the numbers. You know it may stretch a five and an eight to start with, like caring communication, and then here's the feedback, and then you know we'll see how much it with some more caring communication but being blunt or just like or just not thinking not thinking yeah.

Speaker 1 28:29

And pulling from the speed of trust. Okay, always assume positive intent.

Speaker 2 28:35

Yes.

Speaker 1 28:35

There is nothing that a number two wants more than to just love you, care for you, be your friend. So, assume that that's the place they're coming from.

Speaker 2 28:44

Yes, yeah, I love that. That's really good, because I would say for twos, especially healthy twos. You know this idea of okay, I'm not serving you in order for you to serve me, but really, yeah, I have that positive intent that they are coming from a loving, caring place. They're not trying to overstep, they're just wanting to really serve you. Yeah, that's really really good. Well, anything else you would save in us. So you've just shared so many great insights about it too, but just want to leave the some space for you to share if there's other things that would be helpful.

Speaker 1 29:19

Well, I don't know how helpful this is, but It'll be really helpful. One of my favorite things that you said about the number two that I have always laughed about is I don't remember when you said this, but I think you mentioned this in one of the lunch and learn ones that you did, but it really resonated with me from past relationships.

Speaker 1 29:49

But you said something I'm going to paraphrase. But you said hell hath no fury. Like like an unappreciated two yes and boy that is true. Like we will pour and pour and pour into a relationship. But if we don't feel like we're being appreciated or loved back, a lot of resentment can come out of that.

Speaker 2 30:14

Sure, I think originally Richard Rohr is the one that said that, and he said that to give and give and give, let's say three weeks out of a month, twos are just pouring and pouring and pouring in. But watch out, because if they haven't been poured into hell, hath no fury as an unappreciated two where it's just this switch of being unappreciated. It feels unloving, uncared for, it feels like they can't do enough, and so they can go to that eight and it's just like what has happened.

Speaker 1 30:45

It's like where did that come from?

Speaker 2 30:48

Yes, yes, but it's that place of hurt. I think so often you know, and just again for those in relationships with twos to just be able to pour into them by those words of affirmation, I think so many twos just really have that need for appreciation to be said. You know, I appreciate this, I appreciate that. And if you listen to a two, so often that's what they're communicating with people like, hey, I really appreciate that you did that. Or hey, thanks for unloading the dishwasher. Or hey, thanks for you know, putting the order in for this or that. And twos are always doing that but yet may not get the appreciation and a little bit goes a long way, for sure, with that word of affirmation. But, yeah, that's good. Hell hath no fury. As an unappreciated two Boy, that resonates, I can see there's some stories probably going through your mind. Like you said, past relationships, thankfully, the day your boyfriend said that's not helpful. That may not have been one of those weeks that you were like, okay, that's it.

Speaker 1 31:47

No, that was a much different reaction. Yes, yes, that's right.

Speaker 2 31:52

Yes, so we want to remember with our twos, to appreciate them, and I love what you said, giving caring feedback, because the truth is twos want feedback. Just how it's packaged is really, really important. Yeah Well, vanessa, thank you so much for coming and sharing you. Like you said, you were slipping into that eight wing just to be confident in this, because we know it's not always an easy thing. I mean, damon and I are, you know, we're just open books at this point.

Speaker 1 32:20

Well, when you've had public counseling for over a year, like me- Well, you know, twos love being vulnerable and sharing about themselves and connecting with other people, so this has been really great. It's been a lot of fun, so I took way way things.

Speaker 3 32:34

Be careful with your language, with the two. Yes, gentle, and they love feedback, but it doesn't matter how. How that feedback? Is said, also, assume positive intent from your two, because they're trying to help you. Yes, I love that. Yes, and then make sure that you remember to appreciate the two in your life. If we can land with those three things, you've really, really helped you have. So that's awesome. So well, thank you everyone for joining us on Enneagram. You, we will see you next time. Bye, vanessa, bye, thank you, bye Kelly, bye Damon.