The Construction Veteran Podcast
Welcome to the Construction Veteran Podcast. This is a podcast connecting and celebrating veterans in construction, those who have the desire to be in the industry, and those who support them to create the built environment.
SUPPORT THE SHOW: https://www.paypal.com/donate/?hosted_button_id=M6ZMR2J2FVX4W
The Construction Veteran Podcast
Strength and Strategy: Veterans Thriving in the Construction Industry
Ever wondered how a career shift from the military to the construction industry unfolds? Join us as Chris, a seasoned electrician and now superintendent, opens up about his transformative journey from serving on the USS Nimitz to leading teams in construction. His fascinating background, starting in East Texas and transitioning through active duty to the reserves, sets the stage for deep insights into the challenges and opportunities faced by veterans venturing into new careers. Chris shares captivating tales from his Navy days, including deployments and ship remodels, weaving them into the fabric of his construction career story.
Navigating the construction industry requires resilience and adaptability, as both Chris and I have discovered. From my personal experiences transitioning from military service to higher education, and eventually into the construction realm, we highlight key lessons learned about teamwork, strategic problem-solving, and the importance of aligning career paths with personal strengths. The conversation sheds light on the nuances of tenant improvement projects, the significance of hands-on experience, and the invaluable mentorship from industry veterans like Chris Greenwood. These narratives offer a compelling look into the rewards and challenges of construction careers, especially for those with military backgrounds.
Encouraging veterans to explore trades as a viable career path is a central theme of our discussion. The strength, resilience, and leadership skills gained in the military uniquely position veterans for success in the construction industry. Chris and I passionately advocate for the support systems necessary to navigate this transition, emphasizing mental health and the importance of finding camaraderie and purpose post-service. Through personal stories, we celebrate the grit and determination veterans bring to the workforce, urging them to embrace the opportunities in the trades, where meaningful work and financial benefits await.
This episode is brought to you buy Aerial Resupply Coffee. Aerial Resupply delivers bold flavor with every sip. Their beans are expertly roasted for peak freshness and a smooth, invigorating taste. Elevate your coffee game by using code CONSTRUCTIONVET10 at checkout to receive 10% off every order. Stay caffeinated with Aerial Resupply Coffee.
For precision that sets the standard, choose Benchmark Abrasives! Their high-quality discs and pads deliver unbeatable performance and durability. Get the job done right—every time. Benchmark Abrasives, where excellence meets efficiency.
BENCHMARK ABRASIVES
If you're a military veteran in the construction industry, or you're in the construction industry and support our military vets, and you'd like to be a guest on the podcast you can find me at constructionvetpodcast@gmail.com , or send me a message on LinkedIn. You can find me there at Scott Friend. Let's share the stories and motivate others!
- TCV Email: constructionvetpodcast@gmail.com
- TCV YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@constructionvet/featured
- TCV Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/constructionvetpodcast/
This is the Construction Veteran Podcast Construction Veteran Podcast Connecting and celebrating veterans in construction. Now here's your host, scott Friend. Hey, chris, how are you, sir?
Speaker 2:Better than I deserve.
Speaker 1:Amen. So Chris and I know each other. He was actually an electrician on a previous job of mine in a former company, and then he decided to take a leap to the dark side and come join the general contracting world and is now a superintendent at a former employer of mine. So, chris, it's good to catch up with you, man.
Speaker 2:You too, brother.
Speaker 1:So I want to talk about where you're from and what your service history is. So give us a quick rundown.
Speaker 2:Oh, where I'm from your service history is, so give us a quick rundown when I'm from. East Texas. Generally speaking, I was born in Jacksonville but mainly grew up in the Tyler area, a little bedtown community called White House. A lot of people know about the Chiefs quarterback being from my hometown, but I graduated in 05, so no, I don't know him I was just about to ask yeah, I don't know him, do not never heard of the kid.
Speaker 2:Um, yeah, so that's where I'm from. Uh, it's where I obviously joined out of. I joined, um, let's see if I can remember my dates. It was in February of the year I graduated and then I shipped out August of that same year to be an interior communications electrician, went to Navy boot camp in Great Lates, or as we call it.
Speaker 2:Great Mistakes and you know, did my little two, two and a half months up there. Uh left that command, went across the street to another training command for two schools, one called ATT and the other one was our. The interior communications breaks down to IC. It's how we do in the Navy, it's called our uh, and so went to ICA school. That's where I learned about all the equipment that we would work on, and we worked on basically everything you can think of, from telephone systems to satellite TV, paging systems, shifts, order and telegraph system, mirai, wind indicating. So I learned about all those pieces of equipment and more of like how to identify them.
Speaker 2:Then I went out to the USS Nimitz on the West Coast. At the time we were stationed in San Diego, off of North Station, north Island, coronado, and let's see, I think I got out there, if I remember right, march of 06. And we were going through a thing called PIA and in that time it's kind of a remodel of the ship. Uh, so you know we're getting rid of old systems, installing new systems, updating birthings if needed, and you know anything and everything.
Speaker 2:Um, so we were in port for about the first six months of being there. Then we did a deployment for six months on a Westpac it's what's called when we go on to the western side of America but to the eastern side of the world Jibali in the UAE, chennai, india, hong Kong. We went to Guam, sasebo, japan and Hawaii. That's all the stops that we made. I think I got everyone. Oh, singapore, we also went to Singapore as well. So, yeah, did that time Came back for about two months. Then we went back out on a surge deployment for four months and basically hit all the same places, but we also include Pusan, korea, yeah. So yeah, we hit Hong Kong, pusanorea and guam and hawaii.
Speaker 2:Like I said, it was only four months, so it wasn't, uh, that many places that time around. By that time I was kind of short timing and they were about to go on to another six month deployment after being back for about four or five months. But I I was between my EOS and when they were deploying I was going to be getting out too quickly and so it wouldn't be cost effective to send me out to the ship just to fly me back to the States. So that's when I got out of active duty and then I was out for probably two months and then I joined the reserves after that and the reserves is a whole different animal to get all together.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm getting an education because I wasn't a ship guy, so this is all new to me. So, uh, did you do the same job or the same rate in the reserves?
Speaker 2:Yeah, actually. So it was kind of a weird story because in the Navy we have mannings, so you know they don't want to overfill a rate with too many people. And when I was joining there wasn't enough room for ICs and so I switched it to Poets as Mate, because I had to. It was either that or I didn't join, and so I did that.
Speaker 2:But when I went to go take my advancement exam I sat down with it or you have to sign off for it to get your exam. And when I did I saw it was an IC exam and I was like, hang on, a second, I'm supposed to be cross-reiting to Boats' Mate, and they're like. I saw it was an IC exam and I was like, hang on a second, I'm supposed to be cross-reiting the boats, this mate. And they're like they couldn't find any information about that anywhere. So somehow, by the grace of God I'm sure, I slid in and I still stayed my same rate and once I took my advancement exam I actually made it to second class E5 at that interval. So through the grace of God, I made it yeah.
Speaker 1:Good thing you didn't have to uh cross rate to BOSA mate, so you want to tell us uh, tell me real quick. So I know you worked on a lot of communication system.
Speaker 2:What would you say in a nutshell you could kind of so when I was in, only certain rates had a clearance available to them. I had a secret clearance. Before secret clearances were cool and in a nutshell, you would call it an electrician with a secret clearance. I was kind of the bridge between an electronics technician which deals a lot more with mainly computer boards, circuit boards, and an actual, real electrician, like I used to do, as you told in the beginning how we met. So yeah, that's kind of sum it up. That's basically what I was doing.
Speaker 1:Okay, so let's, let's transition here. So what are you? What are you doing right now in the construction industry?
Speaker 2:So right now I work for a company called Rand and love it there. I love the guys, love the community that we have, and we do Class A interiors, so high-end interior build-outs for various clients Currently doing one, for I believe they're the ninth largest company in the world. We're doing three floors out there, so that's what we specialize in is high-end interior finish outs, and so, being a superintendent, it's my job to coordinate all the trades to work together for the end goal that the client and the architect have come up with together, and so that will include putting out schedules of what needs to happen and when and by who. Problem solving as a constant battle in the TI world, because I'm trying to build something to fit around things that are existing, and so when I'm doing that, also have to keep in mind the cost-effectiveness of doing a particular task or trying to find a way to, you know, deviate a little bit from the plans, with appropriate notification to principal parties in order to give them the same product, while maintaining other avenues open, such as at this particular job site of mine, we have some structural steel going up to support a pour-in from an old stair system that we've taken out.
Speaker 2:There was a lot of what we call MEP mechanical electrical plumbing. That was in the way, and so we had to revise the steel drawings a little bit to go around those items, because it was more cost effective to do it that way than of dollars to move them instead of just redrawing the steel out and relaying that steel out. So I do things like that and I have lots of partners involved. Obviously, the trades are the subject matter experts, so we'll take their opinions into consideration. Um, also, you know I have a whole team behind me in the office that helps, uh with their experience, uh, solve those problems and uh and uh, of course, uh, what I, what I call, since I am from East Texas and I am one of these redneck engineering engineering, so sometimes it's about putting lipstick on the pig and I'm actually quite I think I'm quite good at putting you know, making things happen and still having a great end product for the client.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, very well said, man. That sums up what we do very well. And so, taking it back to when you transitioned out of the service, you didn't go right into construction, am I right?
Speaker 2:Right, yep, I did not.
Speaker 1:Okay, what did you?
Speaker 2:do. When you transitioned out, I actually went the kind of the standard route of going to college, getting a degree and all that. And the way that evolved was is I went to Tyler junior college. It's the largest junior college in America, or at least it was at a time, unless something's taken its place within the last 12, 15 years. And so when I was going to TJC, it was mainly to become core complete was the main point of it, but also to kind of figure out what I was interested in doing. And so I had a couple of different paths that I was interested.
Speaker 2:I was not really interested in being an electrician anymore. I just didn't really care for it at the time. I was just, I would say, young and dumb. I should have cared about it a little bit more. And so I landed on criminal justice. I got an associate's degree in criminal justice from TJC and since I was court complete and I am a homebody at heart, I went over to University of Texas at Tyler and took courses there and got my bachelor's in criminal justice with a minor, graduated with a minor and got into leftives. But that was really mainly because I moved to the Dallas area and it was my second to last semester. So when I did that and so I had to change it from minor in psychology to guided elective so that it could open up more opportunities to take online classes, so I could finish my degree on time without having to retake a bunch of classes, so that was kind of my evolution out, getting out.
Speaker 1:You didn't go into law enforcement, correct?
Speaker 2:No, I did try. It just didn't work out. For those who don't know, it is actually quite difficult to do that. So it just didn't work out for me. Just not to go too deep into personal stuff. But I was, was am a little bit of an alcoholic, so I made some poor choices. But the good Lord got a hold of me and so I call that my BC days, my before cross days, and because of the decisions I made when I was young and dumb, it was really difficult for me to try to even get in there to a law enforcement agency. But everything happens for a reason and I'm I'm very happy where I am now.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Very good man. So what was it that actually got you into this industry? I mean, how'd you start that path as an electrician?
Speaker 2:Oh well, so I got this big fancy degree from this big fancy school and, uh, so I had to use it in some way. So my wife actually was friends with a lady whose husband was a security we'll call it a security manager for Target and he helped me get a job in Target. And at the time I was what do they call it? Target protection specialist is what they called it at the time and basically I walked around in a rental cop uniform and try to catch people, shoplifting and did counts and various other aspects. Uh, to the job. But that's basically I was doing, for, you know, 40 hours a week when I moved up here to Dallas, and so I was trying to make use of my degree. After about a year of working there I think it was about a year I got selected to be a manager, got promoted to being a manager. So now I'm a salaried manager working there helping run the stores, and it just simply put, it was not a good fit. I was trying to make the square peg go into the round hole and it was just, it was not a good fit and nothing against Target per se, but it just didn't work out, and thankfully so. So after that I moved into a same role, but an hourly version, working for Kohl's, and I did fine at Kohl's, but I also was me and my wife were, uh, working on having our, our first child, which is my daughter Ryland, and, uh, typically my schedules even though I could outline it myself the best time for me to work was from like 11 in the morning to about six or seven at night. You know, that was kind of like my window there that I could catch people and stuff, and they had requirements that you had to open once and close once and then the rest of it could be up to me. So you know, there was kind of constraints in there a little bit. But, um, you know, it kind of just dawned on me, like, you know, I am trying to have a family and I'll be there for when they wake up and go to school, but I won't be there for when they go to bed. And you know, when they wake up and go to school it's going to be like an hour, hour and a half maybe, of interaction, and then they won't see him again until the next day. And I was. You know, it was just there's gotta be something better, and so I actually called my cousin who works for a company called G cats and uh, they do electrical and telecommunications and he was a project manager for telecommunications. I called him up and uh, sent over a little little quick resume. Uh, you know what I did in the Navy and stuff? Uh, he got me hired on and uh, from that point I started going to the ropes of learning the trade.
Speaker 2:They also have a program and it's national, but this specific one was IEC Dallas. Iec Dallas is Independent Electrical Contractor and it's a school you can use your VA benefits to go through there. It's a good school, it is. It's just like college. What you put into it is what you'll get out of it. And so everyone in GCATS who signs up for the program goes through the program.
Speaker 2:When I worked for GCATS, if you got an A in your class, so there's a tuition that you have to pay and it comes out of your check and it's according to how much you make is how much you pay. Obviously, the higher you you know, the more skills you develop and the higher you go that you'll pay a little bit more, but it hurts a little less because you're making more and so, but if you make an A, they give you all that money back. If you make an A, I think. If you make a B, it was like 80% and if you make a C, it was like 70% of the money came back and, of course, if you failed, you got nothing back, um, so I went through that program. It's four years long, um, to become an electrician a commercial electrician. It takes four years backslash 8,000 hours. I think they've changed the rules, because they changed the rules right when I became a journeyman. I think you can take your test at 7,000 hours, but you don't get your license until eight, if I'm not mistaken at the time of this recording. And so I went through that program. I worked for a lot of good guys. My main foreman that I had was a guy named Chris Greenwood. He taught me a lot that has benefited me now as a superintendent.
Speaker 2:Just a tremendous amount of, to put it in a nutshell, tremendous amount of, to put it in a nutshell, looking beyond the end of my nose at things. So an example would be as an electrician, we have a box that's 12 by 12 inches and you might run, you know 10, 15 circuits in there to make up for a general area of the job site, and so you want to put it in a. You have to put it into an area that's accessible, that could be worked on later, and so something as simple as hey, don't put it inside the office, put it in the hallway. Or if you have to put it in the office, look at the furniture plans if you can. Sometimes it doesn't work out because they change it, but if you can can. Sometimes it doesn't work out because they change it. But if you can, don't put it above a desk.
Speaker 2:You know simple things like that, where you don't have to straddle a desk with the ladder and get somebody out of the office to work on this thing, and most of the time we put it in the hallway. That way you didn't even have to go into these rooms to work on something which helps in the future when there are problems for any service people who come through where they can fit a problem and not disturb the office workers, because then you have to coordinate with their schedules and stuff instead of being a little bit more on your own schedule. And so looking at things like that, how to run a job cleanly? Cause he is a neat freak, um, so great guy. I just really with GCATs I came up under a lot of really good guys. Another good guy was Josh Taylor. Uh, he taught me a lot, um, and so kind of went through that evolution process and became a journeyman after that.
Speaker 1:You ended up on one of my projects, um, with another guy who made the jump to the GC side, um, and hopefully I'll get him on here at some point. But, um, yeah, so you've had a, you've had a good run up through the trades. I think there's a lot of respect from our guys when you have guys like us that came from some sort of a trade into the superintendent position trades. I think there's a lot of respect from our guys when you have guys like us that came from some sort of a trade into the superintendent position. So in the route that you took, how do you think your time in the service really helped you out, especially as a superintendent? I'd say.
Speaker 2:Oh man, a lot, really a lot. Leadership, obviously, first thing that comes to mind. You're not going to be able to do this job if you can't get people to follow you and listen to your advice and direction on things. As you well know, Scott, you know sometimes we have to show up, you know, 15 minutes, 20 minutes before everybody, to unlock the gate, to allow everyone to go in, or unlock the building, and so you have that responsibility of, you know, unlocking the building and locking it up or locking up the side, whatever the case may be. So you know understanding that timeliness and, like my chief God rest his soul, John Craven, he would you know there's a few things you got to do to be successful in life Show up on time, look professional and give a damn, you know, and if you can do those things, you're going to be successful, just because there's honestly just not that much going on out there. So I think that was another principle portion of it. And then, you know, in any job where you're working at this kind of this level, dare I say, you're going to have to manage your own time well. You're going to have to manage your own time well and so knowing when it's time to put in the work and time when you can relax and understanding that as far and, going back into the leadership, that not everyone's led the same way that not everyone's led the same way. So some people are better with getting a boot in the butt and some people are better with the carrot method and just enticing them through rewards and praise and appreciation and things of that nature.
Speaker 2:I always have a I say with my guys that are on my job sites how am I in your way? Because they're the ones who are actually building this thing. It's not me. I'm helping coordinate them, but I'm not building stuff anymore. I'm coordinating and so they need answers from other subs that other sub offices would be a little bit more accurate and my job is to get them those answers. So if I'm in their way by not giving them an answer, I'm slowing down the project. I'm slowing down the project. Everyone ends up working more and not with their families, so keeping that in mind as well. So, yeah, a lot of it boils down into leadership and weighing out the concerns of one group versus the concerns of another, versus your client, and what's in the client's best interest. And you know understanding that sometimes you have to make a decision that people don't like, but you know we're all there to do a job and it will be okay in the end. You know, once the client's happy, everyone's going to end up being happy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well said. Um, so yeah, a lot of good attributes in it. I feel like I say this every episode. A lot of the people I talk to. There's less of the well, I learned how to turn this wrench, or I learned how to do this. A lot of it is the soft skills.
Speaker 2:And.
Speaker 1:I I don't know how you feel. This is just my belief that most veterans getting out it's baked into them the leadership skills, being on time, doing the right thing, just that integrity, the grit, and so I'll preach that till the day I die. Then I think most often you'll find a vet and you kind of know what their values are going to be.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I totally agree. Yeah, it's a lot of those soft skills come into play a lot. So, yeah, I totally agree. And the grid aspect is you know, when I got hired on with Rand, I was interviewing and they I forget the question they asked exactly, but my answer was I find ways to win. I don't lose. That's not something that Chris Hood does. So I'm going to find a way to win, no matter what odds are against me. I don't know how to give up. Giving up is not my vocabulary. Quitting is a dirty four-letter word in my opinion, and actually with my daughter I'm if I could brag a little bit to everybody I have a brag on man, please do uh, I have a saying in my house that uh, can't, never could do nothing.
Speaker 2:And so, uh, she was working on a puzzle and it was like mermaid or you know I I don't know the princess name, but the mermaid one and uh, and I was kind of sort of helping her, cause I've, you know, you never want to let, you never want to do anything for your kids that you think they can do for themselves, and uh, so I was kind of helping her a little bit, a little bit of guidance and doing a few, a little bit there and a little bit here, and she said the dirty word that I can't stand, which is I can't, I can't do this, daddy, and I said can't, and she finished it for me never could do nothing. And so you got to approach this job and construction in general as can't, never could do nothing. You know it's American, not American. Yeah, I what I mean.
Speaker 1:Dude, yeah, I love your mentality of I don't quit and I don't lose. You're going to fail at some point. I like that, but going into it with that mentality, I love that man. I'm ready to go to war with you. Let's do this.
Speaker 2:It's extremely encouraging.
Speaker 1:That's good, man, that you carried that mentality into it. Um, so, along your journey to where you got up, uh, got to now, um, and it's been cool. I've I've been kind of been able to watch you from the sidelines, from coming up to me having discussions about the GC world. Now you're running jobs by yourself. I feel like I find a lot more joy watching other people's success in this industry than I do my own. Um, so do you think there was anything that maybe you would have changed along your journey to get where you're at now?
Speaker 2:Uh, you know, that's a good question, scott. Um, I mean, there are things I will say I would like to change, but I ended up in such a good place. Say I would like to change but I ended up in such a good place I would be afraid to, honestly, uh, cause adversity is what builds your character. Uh, you know, and I, when I grew up, uh, you know, I kind of split my time between my granddaddy's farm and, you know, being kind of a city boy a little bit, and, you know, growing up with that farm mentality. And he was, he was born, oh gosh, I think, 1898 or something, right at the turn of the two centuries ago. Um, and I mean, that's just the mentality they all had back then is you can't, never, could do nothing. And so you're he.
Speaker 2:He worked on his farm, he was a carpenter before that, and actually a carpenter and a world. Two on a carrier, I don't know, I don't remember which carrier, though, um, because back then the carriers had a wood deck on them and so he would fit someone. You know, they got wore out or whatever, and uh, so, yeah, um, that you know this, job, job, you've got to have that grit, you got to have that never give up attitude, especially when you're doing ti work. Ground up is a different animal and I can't speak a lot to it, but from my understanding you know it's in in ways easier, because I'm not. You're not having to build around something, you can just build it the way it needs to go. You know, uh, whereas ti work, you're building around things all the time and you're, you know, always contrasting costs versus quality, constantly and uh, yeah, so yeah, and speed Schedule speed.
Speaker 2:Oh my God, yeah, speed. They want it all. They want money, quality and speed. And it's difficult to do Very difficult, but that's why I love it.
Speaker 1:You know, it's always a challenge.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's always a challenge. When I worked at Target, I sat behind a desk a lot and Kohl's, I sat behind a desk a lot. Um and Coles, I sat behind a desk a lot and it. I don't know how people do it. My hat's off to him. I couldn't do it and I'm. I'm happy I get to walk around and look at stuff and work together to solve a problem. It's, it really is a lot of fun. It might not seem like it's kind of like bootcamp, does it seem like fun at the time, but when you look back you're that was actually pretty fun.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, that's a good way to put it and I, man, I feel like we're spoiled because we get to learn all these different trades, Like we're not the master. I mean, yes, you're an electrician, I'm a carpenter, so we may know our trade better, but I get to learn about so many different trades and I'm I'm big on taking that knowledge home and I can utilize it for the house. I mean, I can't tell you how many times I've called up a buddy.
Speaker 1:Hey, you know, maybe they're a plumber. I need some help. How do I do this? I got to reroute this pipe or whatever. Yeah, I had a septic issue actually last year and I had a buddy. I called him. I said hey, I think this local guy's giving me a load of junk, what do you think? And no way, you don't need to pay for that. Do this, this. And I got you covered, oh sweet. So he ended up saving me thousands of dollars, and that was just a relationship that I made from the job site. So I we're spoiled for sure that we get to to learn all this stuff.
Speaker 1:Um, so I want to talk about mental health real quick. Um, so it's. It's a big issue, obviously, with vets. It's a big issue in our industry. People are starting to see that because, you know, a lot of our folks, especially in the trades, get burned out because we're doing a lot more with a lot less than we did, I'd say, a decade ago. Um, so if you've got some brothers and sister vets out there that are just kind of trudging along and thinking I can't do this anymore, what would you say to encourage them?
Speaker 2:Oh man, I mean, you're made of tougher stuff, you are. I mean, you're top 1% of the nation, and all vets know that Not everyone can make it into the military, not everyone can a wholly different animal. But you know, you're tougher than this, you're stronger than your demons, you know, speaking of demons with my alcohol problem. You know, though, I've never, you know, been in combat or anything of the sort. You know, being in the Navy, it's kind of like having an almost a normal job, almost. But, you know, find someone to talk to. You will feel so much better if you just get it off your chest, and it can be me, it could be Scott, it can be any brother and sister or anyone you feel comfortable with sharing. Uh, just share, please share, cause life is not as easy. You know, we have an easier in some aspects than our grandparents and great grandparents did, but also have it a lot tougher.
Speaker 2:Uh, there's, there's a lot going on out there, and you um have to be subject matter expert in so much, especially that transition from from military life into civilian life. We actually on, you know, at Rand, we just hired this guy. Great kid, he's going to be a freaking superstar, end of story. There's no doubt in my mind, everyone sees it too. He came out of the Marine Corps. He was a combat engineer and a good kid and he you know we've talked about the transitioning out of the military and you know that in civilian life you're kind of left to your own ends. You know you don't really have that same camaraderie that we have, where you sit around with the guys and you talk about whatever and you know, and everyone's got that, you know, as the army and Marine Corps call them a battle buddy that you talk to. So find, find you a battle buddy that you feel like you can relate to and talk to and talk, talk, talk, talk.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think that's become a lot more acceptable. I guess Not that it never was, I just think people didn't really talk about it and you were viewed as weak and what's been really cool, I'd say, over the last four or five years.
Speaker 1:You see a lot of these like tier one guys that serve at the tip of the spear, saying I got an issue and I went and got help and that that really encouraged me, cause I'm like man. You know I I saw combat, but it was not. I wasn't shooting at folks, uh, getting shot at, but you know I didn't do what these guys did and I'm like man. If the baddest, the bad dudes, like just rock stars, can go in there and get after it and get help, why can't I, like what's stopping me? And I've used that same uh talk with some of our folks and we're doing safety stand downs and I'm like I don't care how cool you think you are, how bad-ass you think, you are, dude, these guys are like cream of the crop. If they can do it, you plumbing superintendent or whoever welder, you can do it too, man, I mean, and you need to get the help for yourself and for your family and for those around you.
Speaker 2:Yep, and one little tag on there. Let's just look at the, the ultimate man, the perfect man, who is Christ Jesus wept, you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's the one scripture from the Bible I can actually remember, because I'm so bad at it.
Speaker 2:It's the shortest one, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's really cool, good point. I'm glad you interjected that. I appreciate it. So to people that are getting out man, we need people really badly in this industry and there's a lot of vets out there that need work or a lot of them. I don that need work or a lot of them. I don't know about when you transition, but when I went through my taps class they didn't talk about the construction industry at all. I hope that's changed over the last 13 years since I've been out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so if, if you do want to get that word out to people, what would you say to them? To try to encourage them to get into what we do, to try to encourage them to get into what we do.
Speaker 2:Honestly, I think you hit the nail on the head a moment ago. With my personal belief, the best way to become the best superintendent is actually through the trades. That's the old school pipeline and I think that is currently still the best pipeline. You actually get in there, you work with your hands. You understand how hard a task is because it's easy to arbitrarily assign, like I need you to do it this way. That's easy to do. But when you've actually done the work before you've realized what you're asking of the guys. And so when I have like a really rough thing to ask of a guy, hey, listen, I know this is going to suck for you, let me buy you lunch for doing this for me. And that's just leading from the front, you know, as we all know. So I think getting into a trade and two, if it doesn't work out to be a superintendent, that's totally cool. You know how much a a superintendent, uh, electrician mates as much or more as we do. You know easily, easily, and all that you alluded to to.
Speaker 2:You could potentially do some side work that I mean, I did that when I was an electrician. Everyone does. Um, you could do side work, uh, and you can make some money that way. That's what I did for my family is uh, cause I went from target making like $56,000 a year, um, down to Kohl's to make $14 an hour and or 15, then $14 to become an electrician. I saved my scrap wire throughout the year and I turned it in and I would have a few hundred bucks for Christmas.
Speaker 2:And I just slowly worked my way, worked my way, developed my skills, paid attention to other trades and what they're doing, talked to them when you got a second, like you said, to learn a little bit, and before you know it you've got all kinds of skill sets. Because on my very first project I went out of town, as you know, scott, for my first one my eyes were as big as saucers, but actually when I started talking with the superintendent running the job and with the guys, I was like I actually paid attention a lot more than I give myself credit for. So I think coming in through the trades is a an excellent way to go about it and you can employ those skills on other endeavors as well.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, I mean, you know you talk about side work. So my wife and I we have a small business it's called fusion forge artworks, so I do custom woodwork and metal work still and you know it just brings in a little bit of cash every now and again if I want to buy a new tool or have some more money for Christmas. Actually, as of this recording, we're going to sell at a local fall festival tomorrow in our community. So hopefully we do well, we'll see.
Speaker 2:I do want to inject one thing. When I became a yeah, an electrician, then my first year, yeah, I was making like, uh, what did? I say 14 an hour, but I think now if and I could be wrong, so check into it for yourselves, but I think a lot of those guys are making like 20 bucks an hour. Yeah, walking in the door, I don't know what a phillips head screwdriver is.
Speaker 2:You know that kind of level I don't know what a Phillips head screwdriver is. You know that kind of level. I don't know how to read a tech measure, that kind of level making 20 bucks an hour. When I became a journeyman it was $26 or $27, I think maybe $28 an hour for a journeyman electrician an hour for a journeyman electrician. I know of a green journeyman, uh like a year ago, who got hired in as a green journeyman electrician making $32 an hour, yeah, and plus you factor in overtime, I mean overtime wire If you're an electrician or a plumber, cause they save copper.
Speaker 1:It's not unheard of of folks making over 200,000 a year. If they're a journeyman electrician and they're willing to travel, they're willing to save, like you said. So these guys are making way more money than us, and I will say this the caveat to that is it's not all about the money. Of course, you know there are some trades, like carboners. I'll give you, for example, as a carpenter. Carboners don't get paid very well at all in Texas, and that's confusing to me, but you know, it just depends on what your passion is, though, so you shouldn't look at the paycheck per se, but there is money to be made for sure.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's also a job and I do want to bring up this point, scott it's a job that AI can never take from us, Never. Not your job, not our job as superintendents, not as tradesmen. Ai will never take it over, because there always has to be a physical person doing the work.
Speaker 1:So, whereas a lot of. There's just too many variables.
Speaker 2:Right, there's too many variables, too much thinking outside the box and problem solving A lot of jobs nowadays. You know you have to worry about that kind of thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so there's a lot of job security in this.
Speaker 2:So I think it's a great place for fellow vets. We have a lot of vets in our office, lots.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no-transcript.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I definitely can see that. Um, we, we got busier as well when I was working for GCATS. I was an electrician at the time and uh, yeah, and to you, like you said, with the logistics, uh, you know they're still lingering problems with logistics from that issue, uh, so, yeah, it's, it's a. I never missed a day of work that I didn't want to miss. You know what I mean.
Speaker 1:That's a good way to put it. Yeah Well, man, Chris, I really appreciate your time. Uh, it's good catching up with you. Do you have any parting words of wisdom for anybody?
Speaker 2:Uh, it's good catching up with you. Do you have any parting words of wisdom for anybody Believe in Christ? The Lord would be the first one. Second one is if you're a vet and you are having some issues mentally, please talk to somebody anybody. Find a pastor or whatever your religious affiliation is, a counselor of some kind. Find someone to talk to and we'll see you out there in the field.
Speaker 1:Best send-off I've had yet. Brother, I really appreciate it.
Speaker 2:Not a problem.
