Rob Copland - Edinburghs Comedians Choice Award Winner, Comedy Mosh pits and The Importance of Being Unique

In episode three of "Kidding I had the pleasure of interviewing the  talented and award-winning comedian, Rob Copland!  Rob's electric live performance style has made him one of the most exciting and inventive comedians on the circuit. With accolades like being a finalist in esteemed new act competitions and winning the unique gong show, Brian Gittens' The Honk Show, Rob's comedic prowess is undeniable.

In 2022, Rob made his Edinburgh Fringe debut with 'MAINSTREAM MUCK (gimme some of that),' a show that received critical acclaim and became a word-of-mouth must-see among audiences and fellow performers. It even earned Rob the prestigious Best Show award in the Comedians Choice Awards, making him the first comedian to achieve this honor with a debut show.

But there's more to Rob than just his exceptional stage presence. He's also a gifted comedic actor, having produced, directed, and co-written several online sketches and short films. With a first-class degree in film studies and experience working in television, Rob's unique perspective allows him to shine both in front of and behind the camera.

In this episode, we dive deep into the inner workings of a comedian's life. Rob shares insights into his early years in stand-up, the adrenaline-filled excitement of taking the first steps towards his Everest. We explore the importance of effective communication and delivering great performances, shining a light on the skills that make a comedian truly exceptional. We also discuss the significance of writing, finding inspiration, and the dedication required to hone one's craft.

Links

Rob Copland instagram
Mainstream muck

People mentioned

Jeff Innocent
Sam Simmons
Matt Hudson
Hannah Layton

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Transcript

0:00

Here with Rob Copland, award winning comedian. You won the 2022 Comedians Choice Award at Edinburgh. Comedians Choice. So, so grateful. It's scary winning awards. I thought it would just be like, circle one of the award. But really, I'm like, oh, fuck, everyone thinks I'm good. Maybe I'm not good. You know, it's just filled me with self doubt. It's actually just like backfired and like made me really scared to do comedy. But it sounds so impressive. It is and I should just get over it. I should just stop being so English and like, I'm not actually good enough. How did you find out you won the award? Did they tell you that? They stormed the stage. of that award like they used to with the old Edinburgh Fringe Award which is really exciting. It happened at the end of my second to last show at the Fringe. The day before, something like had been going on, because the room that I was in was Banshee Labyrinth Chamber Room and it's not a huge room so I can tell if like, obviously I can tell if someone gets up and leaves. Oh no! But I could tell that something was going on at the back, like someone had come in late and then left early and I was like what the fuck is that all about? And then the next day the award happened and the guy said to me, I came and scouted out how we do it yesterday and I was like that's who was skulking around at the back of my show yesterday. But yeah, they just, I've got a video of it, I kind of, if I was a person who put videos on Instagram and stuff I'd put a video up of it, but that's a whole other line of conversation. why I don't put videos up, because I don't have any self-esteem. Did you have any sort of idea that the award was coming? No. None at all? No, not a clue. Like when... Because it's voted by comedians and stuff, and when it happened, I kind of put the... They post about it on their Instagram, so I reposted it to my Instagram stories, being like, oh, you know, only vote for me if you genuinely mean it. I think I said something along those lines, just on my story. And I completely forgot about it. I think on the day, I fantasized for a second, like, oh, imagine winning an award, and it'd be so cool if I won that. Maybe I'm in with a chance, because comedians didn't... And I completely forgot about it. And then this guy stormed the stage. What happened is I was doing my bucket speech, I was saying thank you, and then my tech, Christie, was like, oh, Rob, you forgot something. And I was genuinely like, what have I done? What have I... I was like, my trousers down, like what's going on? And then he said, ladies and gentlemen, I want to introduce you to the Comedians' Choice Award winner, Basho. And then he came on with this guy and they gave me the awards. And I genuinely thought I was being pranked. I was like, I was in like safe, I went into defensive mode and I thought someone was going to throw a bucket of cold beans on me or something. I really, yeah. That's amazing, congratulations. Thanks mate. That's lovely. I'm so proud of the show. I'm so, so proud of that show. And I'm so glad that, it's easy to think as a comedian that if nothing happens, it didn't happen. If you know what I mean? Like it was just like a cigarette that got flicked into the ocean. Do you know what I mean? Like it's gone now, no one ever cared about it. But you know, even if it didn't win an award, or anything, I'd still be really, really proud of that show. But it's so cool to have a terrifying looking trophy sitting at home. I can look at it and just remind myself, like, you're doing the right thing. You're moving in the right direction and stuff like that. Once I get over all the insecurities and stuff. It's the ultimate validation. Not only are the comedians laughing at your jokes, but they're like, yeah, okay, we have chosen, we have chosen Ro. Yeah, it's so nice. Why can't I just embrace it and be like, don't write. I don't know why. So has this been a struggle then since the award you've been? I wouldn't say a struggle, but like, oh shit, what do I do now? I guess. Cause it was the first, sorry, correct me if I'm wrong, it was the first debut show, like, winning the award? Yeah, I think so, yeah. It was, yeah, it's the first time it's been. debut show had won that award, yeah, which again I'm really proud of. Well let's take a way back, when did you start comedy? I started doing stand-up comedy, I kind of like started gearing up for it towards the end of 2015 and then I think I might have done like one or two gigs around the winter of 2015. What does gearing up mean? Sorry, does that mean like not in all the shows? Just like, just saying to myself I'm going to do it, like I tell people at my office I'm going to do stand-up, you're like creating a situation that I can't get out of where I have to get on stage and start doing it. I remember on my 25th birthday which is like eight years ago now, I remember getting into the bath, I was climbing into the bath and I was thinking... fuck, I'm gonna be 25. Like, and I haven't started actively engaging with the things I really want to achieve in my life. And I haven't, I've just been like having fun. I've just been like, life's great, I'm having all these experiences. And eventually my dreams will just come true. Like, cause it'll just happen. But I hadn't actually set anything off in motion. And I remember just thinking like, oh, I need to be the catalyst. I need to be the active engagement in this. So I start, yeah, I did a course. I did a Camden Comedy School course, which wasn't very helpful at all. They're not very helpful courses, I don't think. Was it like mic stand adjustment and then straight into five or what did they do? No, we do like zip. Zap-zop, you know what I mean? I don't know what that's like. Like memory and improv games. Basically being taught to make sure you're present, make sure you're in the moment, make sure you're focused. And talking about, the one thing I can remember being told that was like, oh, that actually sounds useful is the audience want to see behind the curtain. The audience want to peep behind at your life. They want to know who you are. But it's, you know, I struggle to express myself in a normal conversation or just with friends and stuff. I'm not the best communicator. I struggle to understand my own emotions and how to translate them. So I think really great comedians are masters of communication. And for me, like the first two years of standup was like. I was so like, the feeling that I get just being on stage, all the adrenaline, all the excitement. And also because I was like, I built that up in my head, like this is what I've wanted to do my whole life. These are my, I'm taking the first steps on my Everest. Do you know what I mean? It was such a big deal to me that I couldn't handle. My head would explode when I got on stage and I'd be like shouting and doing weird shit and chanting and stamping. But I suppose it created an original, interesting act, which I'm really proud of. And that's the thing that when I look to comedy, it's originality that I'm really keen to see in the world. And that's so hard. It takes a long time to find an original voice. Some people start and they just have a crazy voice. original voice straight away. So where was the first gig? Was it a showcase? Yeah the first gig was a showcase at Backyard Comic Con. And it went fine, but it was a bit of a safety zone because it was Jeff Innocent hosting and he was like, everyone's new, everyone's new. So I went and did the Comedy Virgins at the Cav and had a really shit gig. Really bad. I got on and I did a different set from the one that I'd done a week before. I don't know why I'm like, you learn something, you need to hone in on an act. And you have an act and that constantly builds and you add things to it and things within it change. But I was just like, oh, I'll do a completely new five minutes. And I remember I'd overheard a guy. in a Tesco the day before talking to his girlfriend about how much protein is in each pack of porridge and thinking that's probably the most boring thing any human being's ever said. That's funny, I'll say that on stage tomorrow. Said it, and it was just boring. And I just stood there in silence and nobody laughed. And then I thought someone in the crowd looked like somebody who had been on Don't Tell the Bride. So I just went, are you in Don't Tell the Bride? And he was like, no. And I was like, ugh. And then I saw myself in the mirror at the back of the room bombing. And I was like, I've been robbed. That's been like 10 minutes. No, then I rushed. I tried to say the rest of my sentence. I thought, well, I've got to say it quicker to fit it in. Got to say the word. And it was just awful. Yeah. So in those first two years, what were you sort of focusing on then? Good question. What was I really focusing on? I think I was just focusing on, I think in those first two years, I was thinking a lot, not about the material, not about the jokes, but more about the energy that I bring to a room. Because quite often I would scare an audience after like 10 seconds because I'd like come on and be like, yeah, or I just make a really loud noise or I hit the microphone or I'd be just really intense and it would scare people. It would like trigger a fight or flight response in the audience. So I was learning to be like, I was obsessed with like standing out from everybody else on the bill. I was like, no, but these guys are just trying to be themselves. it for a hobby, I'm going to be a fucking star. Do you know what I'm in my head of? I'm going to be a fucking artist. These idiots don't get it. And I'm the unique one. Like that's the kind of crazy voice that was going on in my head at that time. And I was, but I obviously just wanted to make people laugh. So I had to get rid of all of that shit before I could just be comfortable and have fun on stage. But I think the thing I was focusing on was like finding my stage persona and I gravitated towards clothing. You might have noticed that I wear the same stuff on stage and I find it like getting, like if you're an actor, like in the, in the dressing room, like getting your costume on and then going out as the character. And it's not so much a character or anything, but it's like. you know, if I put on like a tuxedo, I kind of, all day, I'm like, oh, I'm a tuxedo guy, do you know what I mean? Like, oh, look at me. And when I have my stage cozy, then I feel, I know, because I have tattoos, and I had like a nose ring when I started, and that is who I am, like, you know, I'm a tattooed person or whatever, but like, I thought if I walk on stage with like a fucking Thrasher T-shirt and Dickies, you know, they're gonna be like, oh, here comes like the fucking, it's a demon, yo, what's up, we're just coming in from South California. People are gonna judge me before I get to the stage, and I also like, when you start comedy, you learn so much about yourself, like, just learning that I'm maybe quite, like I look like a low status person. but when I act high status, it's funny. Finding that dichotomy. So the first two years are like a journey to find my persona, find what's funny about me. I'm giving really long-winded reviews. No, no, it's just super good. I know, it's really, really good. So did you have persona in mind? Because I did a comic book as well, and then I heard the term persona, and I was like, oh, that makes sense, because some people go up and you just like them as a person, you're interested in what they say. Yeah. Whereas I would just write awful one-liners. I think what I discovered was that I was a wild card. I was like a moose-bouche between manes. Like everyone was getting up and doing their stand-up, doing their stand-up, and then I'd jump on stage and be like, listen up. If I could live in any town, any place, any time in history, I'd live in the Wild West. And I'd go into these crazy fancies where I'm really committing to the bit. And everyone's kind of like... I remember describing it like this. Like, it's kind of like if you think about comedy as like a sound frequency or a sound wave, I wanted my frequency to come in at a different frequency from everybody else's. So how can I like jolt people's attention? Because I struggle with it. I have ADHD. And all through school, I was told that, like, you know, you struggle to concentrate, you struggle to focus, you struggle to organise. And so I want other people's attention. If I don't have my own attention, I'm going to get everybody else's. So like what noise can I make to like... really like, zzz, like jolt the night. Like be, be like the lemon on the side of the fish and chips, you know what I mean? Like, what's the standout zingy thing that I can do? Rather than just blending in and just, but then that gave me a problem where like, I actually never figured out how to write standout. I've just done it in such a weird way. I'm so jealous of amazing joke writers. I really wish I had that skill and I'm working on that. But I'm always just working on like, being someone who's in control of a room, who's kind of dictating the energy in the room. Cause that's what, I've always thought that's what comedy is. It's like an energy composer, you know? It doesn't have to just be joke telling. It's amazing. when it is and amazing jokes are the best but like you can see a silent clown just move the energy around the room and like ride it and surf it and I'm I was obsessed with all of that stuff in the first couple of years. So were you so you didn't write you weren't writing your self-love? Yeah I would but maybe it's my like lack of self-esteem but every time everything I'd write I'd be like it's shit it's awful you're copying this person you're writing in this person's voice you don't have your own voice you've never found your written voice because you're so focused on what's the funniest way to climb on a table again? But I do I have observations like every now and then they happen and stuff and that's the kind of comedy that I write like observations. All of my stuff is observational. But I like, kind of like, okay, how can I bring this to life and bring it up in a weird way and how can I act it out and how can I play it out in an interesting way? But in those early years, were people trying to pressure you to be more, like, conventional, I guess? No, not at all. No one liked it? No, that's the beautiful thing about stand-up is that nobody, maybe I was pressuring myself to try and fit in a bit. I think I went through stages where I was like, oh, and like, maybe you just need to wear my normal clothes on stage and just act normal on stage, you know what I mean? But you've gotta let the dog off the leash. You know what I mean? Like, it wants, like, whatever it is, the creative impulses that you have, you have to set them free. It's like, you can't bottle them up. You can't, like, you just have to let yourself go and then try and rein it in a bit. So I think... I think the first couple of years it was like a rabid dog and now I'm trying to train it to sit and stay and wait. Waiting especially, listening. But in those early weird gigs, for example, it's like a bar with five people. Was that good for you or bad for you given that you're going to go up and stand on tables? Hit or miss, like anyone else. Because sometimes I turn up to gigs and not have anything to try so I'll just be like, what if I just went round and held the mic up? What if I interview every audience member? Like this, hey man, how are you? Because I know this gig's going to be bad, what if I do something crazy that everybody remembers? And that's kind of what's created my stage persona I guess. Well we first met at the Isle of Wight and you did amazing, it was very, very fun. And it was very, like, everyone else sort of went story tellers or one liners or whatever and then you come on and it was an experience and I loved it, I was like wow. Thanks man. One of those like, oh you can do anything. So it was very cool. Yeah. Then I was very bitter. Oh really? I was like, oh, it's so good that people can do that. Did you really think that? Well when people are like, when someone goes from smashing it down to like very unique, like original stuff, you're like wow. Okay and then you start to feel like maybe I should be more like that or this. Well no, but I have that feeling when I see people doing great stand and deliver stuff. Do you know how you do that? Regan? No, but I'll show notes. Okay, she's amazing. Australian, Aussie comedian. So, so good. I always see her as like the polar opposite to what I do. She almost, sometimes when I'm watching her, I just watch her feet. They don't move, but I'm enjoying myself. I love listening to her. She's so engaging. Her written stuff is so good and so clever. But I remember the first time I saw her, I'm like, is she going to move? It kind of annoyed me. I was like, why is she so stationary? But it was all my own weird ego shit going on. But I get really jealous and really bitter when I see someone able to not almost sacrifice themselves for the gig. Sometimes I put so much into it. it and I'm learning to put less into it but you know less is more and like you know you don't have to fucking sacrifice yourself every ten minute spot you do do you know what I mean? But the high energy you bring really does like people are for a good time and then it's it's suddenly like it's almost concert-esque yeah yeah yeah a big a big like inspiration for my like creative performance stuff is like lead singers of bands like when I was a kid I used to grow up watching like there was like a local venue near me called the joiners and there were bands who started like at my school and colleges and stuff and it was such a cool scene it was such like the music was fantastic and I used to just love watching like bands fucking rocking out I still do. I love that leader of the lunatics, someone who can hold a crowd in the palm of their hands and get everyone going. I love that shit. Well, you actually do, correct me if I'm wrong, you do a mosh pit? That was like what my show that I've just done was, Mainstream Muck, give me some of that, was the kind of the joke premise of the show is that I'm attempting to start the world's first comedy mosh pit and if I don't then I'm going to quit comedy forever and move back to Southampton and be a fisherman. But that was all kind of like metaphorical cover up for what I was really talking about just for my show. myself, but the mosh pit is also, but then that is also like, I think that's funny. Like I think that's a funny thing, premise for a show and you should do what you think is funny. So yeah. Yeah. Very original again. And it was also about bringing people together. I think I was at a place where I was just like, if I want to do something, like why am I doing this? It's because I want to bring people together and everyone have a great time. And I worry that sometimes, cause it's like, it's a lot. I ask a lot of my audiences, I'm asking them to stand up and push each other around. That's like a stupid, insane thing to do. Like Barbara 54, precious. She might be like, I'm hating this. Why am I being negative? You're not negative at all. I remember somebody came to my show and I know that they're autistic. So before the show I was really anxious and I went to them just before the show. As they came in I saw them and I said, just to let you know, there's a lot of like, BOW! It's like sensory, it's a bit of an overload my show. But they were like, fine, and they were in the pit at the end. Causing all this chaos, that was fun. So from the start you said you were quite motivated. Well, so did you have any sort of strategy on how the world was going to get to know Rob? Strategy, interesting. You seem like quite a strategic, because you've only just started comedy and like, there's like four cameras and two lights in this room. I also explained that we spent ten minutes. and darkness as I try to adjust the light. Not even sure if it's truly recording. It was pitch black, then it was flashing lights, and then it was just torch lights, and then it was green light, and then it was red light. I was trying not to have a breakdown. It could have been like, oh, this is fine, we'll figure this out, the light's like red, and then it's off. But it's nice. I have ADHD, I have learning difficulties at school. I struggle to be like on top of my shit, and I'm just like a bumbling idiot, and I wish I was more organized and strategic in my business affairs with comedy. I'm just trying to be the best comedian I can be. That's always been. That's always just the thing I'm working on. And I just assume that the rest will take care of itself. It kind of has, like I've ended up with an agent, I've ended up having a show that's gone to the Soho Theatre, but it's all just been like, well, I hope that happens, or like, maybe I will reach out and ask somebody. Like, I'm never the guy who's like, these are my plans, this is what I'm going to do, by next year I'm going to achieve this. That was such a wanky question for me, I do apologise. No, it's a great question, because it is, you know, as a comedian, especially early on, you need to be your business manager, you need to be your gag writer, you need to be your make-up artist, you need to be your PR guy, you are a one-man band, really. But... Were you going with like, okay, I'm going to go for competitions, I'm going to do gong shows? I did some competitions early on, was fucking awful. Because I haven't figured anything out yet. I did them in like my first year, which I, some people do do them in their first years and that, but it took me a while to like just calm down and be not insane on stage. So I calmed down, I started entering competitions after like two or three years in stand up. Have you got any good, have you got any horror stories from that first year of competitions? Yeah, I did. I did. Who do you think you are? No. So you think you're funny. Who do you think you are? Oh, you think you're funny. I did. I did that and I had I told you. The first routine that I got that was like, like a five, it was a five minute routine about hide and seek. And I still do like a small part of it. And I was doing that in competitions. I was like, oh, this, this bit has everything. It's got a callback, it's got an act out, it's got good gags, it's got physicality. And I did that, so you think you're funny. And I went out the room for like the first two acts or something. And then when I was on stage, there was a potato. There was a potato on a table in the front. And I was like, why is the potato? I couldn't not be distracted by it. So I just stopped what I was doing. And I was like, why is there a potato here? And it was just silent. I thought, you know, you think, why is there a potato? They'll get a big laugh. And everyone's just silent. And I was like, is it your potato? Did you bring a potato? And it was like just like silent and weird and I was like, oh, okay Why is there a potato? I couldn't stop thinking about it I just kept asking and no one was and then I got off stage and I was like, yeah Like a guy was on two acts before you and he he was doing a whole thing with the potato I was just not in the room to see it. I'm a fucking idiot But someone should answer your question like someone should have answered that question Yeah, and then and then the judges held up their hand to let me know I'd run over my time And I just kept going I finished the routine like I did at that first gig just Just do it real quick. Yeah, and then what sort of change in the two years now that made you feel more confident I started what changed I got better as a comedian. I'd started doing stuff that was like Letting the audience know who I am a little bit more bit, like just doing a joke how I have a Blink-182 tattoo, you know, like just sharing a little bit more of myself I think. I kind of just established a bit more of a voice and had like a five minute set that had like a good opener, a good closer, fun weird stuff in the middle, it just felt more well rounded. And you're just finding that out from the audience or from how you're feeling on stage? How did you know it was getting better? Because gigs were going better more consistently and it just felt more professional and slick. I felt like a comedian rather than like some weird artist, you know what I mean? Like some weird performance guy. It was like, oh that's like an opening bit, I've got two short opening bits, cool. and then there's all that corner slightly longer. Like I had it, like my competition set had like a routine in the middle about finding a top seat on a bus. How embarrassing it is to walk up there when it's full and walk back down. Which I recently just saw a clip of Sean Walsh doing pretty much exactly the same. We have different jokes, but it's the same joke that you come up there, look around like a twat, go, I'll just go back up there. But my bit was more like, in my routine, he just comes up and then goes back down. But I was like, you turn to go back down, there's somebody else there. And now you're like the leader of a group of people. You have to pass the news down. There's no space, we gotta back up. Yeah, whatever. And what if they don't trust you and stuff as well and they're trying to push past. Yeah, exactly, yeah. Yeah, it's like a, you didn't ask for this responsibility type thing, yeah. That's very good, well I'm sorry, well you were just ahead of Sean Walks, that's all that happened, you were ahead of your time. He got there first, he was doing that years ago, that bit, and then I've just seen it, it's an old clip from when he had long hair, and he's like, doing Michael McIntyre's Comedy Roadshow, but yeah. So I'm super obnoxious and post everything ever that I've ever done, why do you not post clips? Yeah, good question, I don't know, I should. Should you, should you Rob, be the best comedian you can. I don't film, there's something that I really love about the transient nature of the art form of stand up, and it's so wanky, and it's so, it's so, I love that there are these nights that have happened, and these events that have happened, that have just gone forever, but they live in my memory. But like, these days, it's dumb not to, really. So I kind of, because I do a lot of improvising on stage as well, and I also don't like watching myself back. I don't like putting it under the thing. As soon as I put it out, I'm like, oh, I just want to, the act of putting it out is just because I want people to see it. And why do I want people to see it? Because I want people to love me. Why do I want people to love me? Because I don't love myself. Do you know what I mean? I can just spiral into like, oh, it's just for my ego. It's just because I want to be better than that person. My video got more views than your video. All this stuff. By Detroit. It's more like imagined like I don't feel like Maybe I do feel like that. I don't know. I don't know why I have so many complicated feelings about it I should just be like an American psychopath With I'm a comedian. That's my job. I put them out. Oh Yeah God, maybe it's cuz I'm insecure and I'm scared people won't like me. I Just find it because you get up on big stages and you do your show and stuff and that seems a lot more like And for me, it's just like oh no the people and their online run the video don't like me. Oh, no But the show is I owe Jesus It's it's a really interesting topic. You know, I have a joke in my I have a joke in my show about Not filming it. Like I say that I'm a I have a tapestry team at the back of the room. That's like my joke about the fact that I don't film stuff. But I did film quite a few of my Edinburgh shows, but like, I also just don't like, I don't have a laptop to edit them on. It's a practical reason. Yeah, there's also practical reasons. My phone was a bit shit. I've just got a new phone though, so. I think I should film my stuff. I think I should, and clip it up, the improvised stuff. Material, I like saving my material. And I'm working towards the new show at the moment. I'm gonna do like a half run work in progress at Edinburgh this year. I'm getting married this year. Congratulations. Thanks, mate. And I just wanna have a bit more. more of a chilled year with like, I don't want to hammer, hammer, hammer the gigs this year but I'm really excited to start working on a new show. And what's the sort of gig cadence you're doing at the moment? Right now, well I just got out of TV, like I work in TV as a freelancer but I've started working as a joke writer for a social media company who manage corporate brands' social media pages. I write jokes for Fred Bentos pies at the moment. So I'm just getting set up with a new rhythm to my life. I was away for like the five weeks before that working on a TV show in Gloucester. What was the TV show? It was a police show, it would be on Channel 5. It was shit. Channel 5 was so weird. Are you one of the artists? Yeah. No, no, no, no, no, no, it's not, it's unscripted. It's, you know, like when you turn on, like, there's been a disturbance at a kebab shop, obviously, so you know. Oh, like cops in the US? Yeah, cops, that kind of thing. But I just back up the cards. I was just living in a hotel, backing up footage. So I know how to do it. You know, there's no reason I shouldn't be. Professional. Yeah, professionally I do it. Maybe that's why I don't, because it feels like a job. It feels like a business holiday, and the standup's just a creative outlet for me. So what sort of jobs have you been doing during, like while you've been doing standup? TV, working in TV. I worked in TV development. I work as a runner. I work as a second shooter. But I've been trying to get away from it for a while, because quite often it takes me away. Like I have to go and stay in Leicester for two weeks. and film interviews with people and stuff like that. And I had to cancel gigs and shit. Yeah. So you're gigging everywhere though, just from traveling with work? No, I mainly gig in London. I gig outside a little bit. I've got a car, so I'll drive to gigs and stuff. I like gigging in Brighton. I love gigging in Bristol. I need to get up to Manchester and gig, but yeah. But it's really hard when you're having to do all this different, freelance work especially, with travel, I imagine. Yeah, it is. And has that been a recurring theme of comedy? It seems very common. The struggle between work. The struggle, yeah. Yeah, it has been. The best situation for me is something that's based in London and finishes at five or six o'clock. and you can just clock out and go get on with your gigs and stuff. Finding time to write as well in those times is important, you know, writing in the morning I like. I'll get up and try and do an hour or so in the morning. Also just making sure you write shit down when you think about it. So you actually have sort of a routine in your head then for... For writing? Yeah, I'm somebody who kind of like has like big bursts of writing and then works on stage for a long time and then goes back to writing for a little bit. I think it's better if you write a little bit every day because it's a skill set in itself where you're constantly trying to figure it out, you know. During the pandemic I did a lot of that. I transcribed a lot of stuff that I've done, a lot of stuff that I like. like, like other comedians, stuff that I don't like as well, and just trying to see it on the page, set it out how I would. When I write, I kind of write every line that comes out my mouth, enter, and then I say that, enter. It's all like, ba, ba, ba, ba. So I'd lay out other people's work like that and see, oh wow, their lines are really, really long and mine are really short, or like the first couple are short, or every routine is different, and you say, oh, you bring that up at the beginning, maybe that word should reappear at the end, and blah, blah, blah. So, yeah, that takes a lot of work, but it's really fun. I actually really enjoy writing. I was actually reading a description of how it goes, because it seems to be quite a messy process for everyone, but you just sort of chip away at it. And every single routine is different, and I always try and think of them as one. like songs or like dances or like skits rather than like a joke that's gonna go on a cracker. Oh no, jokes don't go on crackers. What am I on about? Like, you can try hard enough, it'll get there. I get it, my next show is gonna be printed on crackers. Um, yeah, I just try and think of like, what's the intro to like a song or something? Or like, maybe this routine has like a big intro or maybe it's like a long drawn out intro and then it goes crazy in the middle and then there's like a cool repetition at the end or something, do you know what I mean? Like every, think of them as like sculptures or like visceral, like, you know. But that's what makes me a weird comedian. Like, I was at the Moth Club last night and I watched Josh Pugh and I love him. his stuff so much and they're all such great gags. He probably doesn't talk about stand up like I do. Like, oh, it's like a weird intro. And then it's just like a great gag about an observation. So I always try and rein myself in and like, just reel it in and just try and write a good joke. But why are you trying to reel yourself in? I know it's awful, isn't it? Yeah, you know you're so right. I don't know. I just gotta stop questioning myself and lean more into it. I just, I'm just afraid. I don't know what other award they can give you to do a good job. Best, best idiot. Oh, that's very cool. So how did you go about getting an agent? How did I go about getting an agent? I got into having an agent. from the competitions. I did the semi-finals of the 2 Northdown New Act competition and somebody saw me at that they asked 2 Northdown for my email address, got in touch with them and then I signed with them. It's crazy how you kind of obsess over that. Do you think about that a lot? I'm sort of... Do you want to get signed or what are you... How long have you been doing stand-up? Very, very new. Less than a year. So I'm not... I'm really... Something's wrong with me where I'm just like trying to... Because I came from start-ups so for me this is just... I'm just in a little weird like programmer start-up mode and like get the clips try to get better stand-up, do stand-up. But I don't... I think for me to be that wrong but I just would. quite like the independence. Yeah. And like, okay, I'll post this. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, you don't. Yeah, having, you're still independent when you have an agent, but, um, yeah, that could be me, me or something misunderstanding to be fair, what an agent does. You can, in this day and age, I think comedians have as much power as, as an agent could. You can do it, you can do it all yourself. It does give you credibility and it depends who you're working with. Like my, the first agents that I had, I wasn't super happy there just because they are, they, I just, they're not very hands on or it wasn't a very, I want, I used to have a routine. I had a, I did a 45 minute show before I did my hour and I had a routine in that where I was talking about how, how I was, how I was, how I was, how I was, how I want to get an agent or something. I think the idea of it was I want an agent, but I don't just want an agent, I want a coach. I want somebody who's going to be on the sideline, being like, you know, more of this, less of that. Like somebody who's guiding me. I want an Alex Ferguson. But what I had was just somebody on the other end of an email being like, what are you up to and stuff. And me being like, feeling insecure, I don't know. But the agent I have now, Hannah Martin at Parker's, Hannah, I love you. She's like a buddy. We were hanging out last night. We were having some pints, we went to see a show. She manages Josh and Ray, and they're both on at the Moth Club. And she's like a buddy. and that's amazing to have where like they get me and she comes to shows just to hang out and stuff. So I think everyone's agent relationship is different but you get them by entering competitions and being seen, you can pester them, it depends what you want out of it, it depends what you want out of it. I kind of want like a professional relationship, somebody who gets what I do, gets what the industry is like, sees how I fit into it and helps me, gives me the confidence to go for it because I don't push myself enough. Yeah. That's really cool. Well how does she embody to you? Does she ask like what do you want to do this year Rob? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, we talk about where we like set out like a plan each year and say what we want to do and work towards that and tick things off. Yeah, that's cool. So for the show, the 45 minute show you made, was it just a collaboration of all your bits or did you come at it as a show? That was me figuring out just how to, because I'd done I'd done two fringes by my, on a split bill. And in those, I was always the person who kind of took the back seat and let the other person like run the operation. And I needed to like figure out how to do it for myself, like just welcoming people into the room I found overwhelming, getting everyone sat down. I was always obsessed at the beginning with stand up and I kind of still am about that, that first moment. you're on stage and like I would hate at like an open mic if I had to like do a bit of crowd work before I was on because people would be like oh this is his voice like you know I don't like I don't act like this when I'm on stage and I don't want people to kind of see this before they see me going oh welcome to you know I kind of play on that first initial impression so I was always like I wanted to be like backstage when people were coming in and stuff so it was like crossing that barrier of like well hi guys come on come you sit there and then oh welcome to the show like I found it very hard to do that for some reason and then do a bucket speech and also be honest with them say like I need some money this and I think it was good today so please give me some money or whatever you know. What was the question? No, I was just about the show but I think that's a very fair point for your act because you're like so high energy and everyone's so involved that it would be like seeing the lead singer of the band. Yeah, exactly. She's going to do scenes and then they're up here in Leather and they're like let's go and you're like oh. Yeah, exactly, the spotlight comes down and they like come down on a wire but that wouldn't work if they were just like chatting to people before the show, yeah. So when did you do the first split show in Edinburgh then? 2017, 2018, then 2019 I did the 45 minute show, then there was a pandemic and then did Mainstream coming back. Was the first split show fun? The first split show was so fun, I probably had about 5 minutes of it. I probably had about five minutes of material and I had to do half an hour every day. And it was so fun just like being a nobody and having no expectation, no pressure. Matt, Matt Hudson, who's doing his debut hour this year. I think it's called Go For It or something like that. Or I don't know what he's named it, but Mattie Hudson. I'll put it in the show notes. Yeah, he's fantastic. Go see his show. He's like one of my best friends in comedy. We just like it was just so fun being like me and Matt used to like have this in joke all month being like show read. We'd like go to other people's show. We'd like look at the show and we'd be like show read, show read. And we'd like joke that we were going to raid people's show. We felt really like, like come out as world. We're like, we're coming for you and we're going to do it. And we just had a lot of fun. And I learned to improvise and use my energy and not freak people out. Early fringes are so important to just go up and have fun and train and figure out who you are and get better at stand-up. Was the show in a good place? What, that split bill? Yeah. Oh, no. Matt's half hour was good, but I was just figuring out how to be a stand-up. I don't mean location-wise, sorry. Oh, I was on the Cowgate in Opium and I really liked it. I really liked being on the Cowgate. It was a fair enough room. It was like a side room in a bar. And it had curtains separating it. I remember on the very first show, I've actually got a picture on my Instagram. But it's like from the first show. I'll throw it in the video as well. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'll pull it up. But it's like it's me behind Matt. I'm like so basically like the back of the stage was like a hang, like a black curtain, but it just fell down. So instead of like being like, oh, I better not stand behind you. There's no backstage. I was just like just standing by. Imagine how off putting that was. If you're doing your ten minutes and someone's just standing behind. Oh, don't mind me guys. I'll be on next. Yeah, yeah. You guys enjoy it. Taking a picture. It's so funny. But yeah, it was it was a fine room. And then the next year I was in Barbados. And that second split, Bill, I had a bit of a rough time because I'd spent the whole year not really writing and just kind of, I was working at the Cav, making pizzas in the kitchen. And every shift I'd go on stage for five minutes, but I decided to like never write anything. I decided I'd be somebody who could just go on stage and just riff. And I can't really, I don't riff like a normal comedian. I don't like, oh, strong guy in the front row. What do you bet? Yeah, I don't know. That was my attempt at a riff. I don't riff in a normal way. I'll just come up with some weird conceit. I'd always come up with like these things. I'd walk on stage and be like, come on, where are they? Where are they? Come on, don't mess with them, you know. Don't, don't, don't. Don't hide the fish from the fisherman. Don't hide the pole from the pole dancer. Come on, where are they? Where are they? Come on. And I'd be like, someone's taken my gospel choir. And there'd be like these weird high concept conceits that I was playing with. But some of the Cav gigs were really fun, but that fringe. I was also doing this character. Oh my God. Oh, I dabbled with character. Oh, Reese. Oh God, he was a Dutch filmmaker. Oh my God. Oh my God, I blanked this out of my memory. I did this character for a while. He's a Dutch filmmaker, second unit director. I'd come out on stage and I'd have like this yellow turtleneck and this red hat. And I had a boot. because I used to be a sound recordist. I'd come out, I'd take the mic, I'd put it onto my boom pole. I'd be like, look at this! Everybody's come to be in the movie! Amazing! Thank you so much for coming out, guys. So obviously, you know today we're making a movie about the greatest joke ever told, okay? And you guys are gonna be extras in the movie. And this is the scene where the comedian comes out and he tells the joke, okay? So just imagine for me, he's just told the joke. I remember doing it once at Angel. I did it once at Angel and they probably wrote in the post-show notes, like, you know, never book this guy again. Insane. The Bill Murray of the role? Bill Murray didn't even exist, I think, at the time. Oh, that's very good. It was bad, man. The thing is, the thing is, that character worked so well sometimes in London alt-nights, like, kind of like alternative nights and stuff. It went really, really well. And then as soon as I got to the fringe, it would just... And also I was doing like, I was doing half an hour, so I was doing 15 minutes of that and then being like, and scene. No joking, it's just me. Anyway, I'm going to do some straight stand-up for you now. I was like caught in this place between being super weird and just trying to be like a normal straight down the line comedian. And it was just, I just made some... I think everybody needs to have like a fringe where they're carefree and they can do whatever they want and a fringe where they just have an awful fucking time and they're like... that felt bad, I don't want to ever feel that again. But that's so good that you were actually like experimenting and then find, like you were, because it's just like rapid iterations versus maybe like I'll do a set, it doesn't work, don't change it, fine. No experimenting, so that's cool. Yeah, I guess I think that's just part of my nature. I'm quite an impulsive person and I really want to, I remember like hearing it early on in a podcast, I think it was an interview with Sam Simmons maybe, and he was saying like you just need to try everything when you're young. I didn't have an agent, I have nothing to lose. And I wanted to wear different skins, try it in different ways and just see. what worked best and what I enjoyed most, you know. I really enjoyed doing the character until it stopped working. And then it hurt a lot. You can bring back the character whenever you want. Oh my God. It's been real working. It was really fun. I really liked it because it just broke. I really liked being the cat amongst the pigeons. Like there's a comedian who no one fucking knows. Louis Blumfeld, Blumfeld, Louis Blumfeld. He, he, he, he's, I think he's the funniest person in the world. He, he hosts a gig called Piñata down in South London, but he doesn't gig around, but he's one of the most amazing performers I've ever seen. And I remember once at the beginning of a night, he was hosting the night. They, he was introduced off, you know, it was so long ago we were working on the pilot project of or whatever, and then everyone's clapping, the clapping dies down, and he's just leaning on the back wall at the back going. Clap, clap, clap, clap, clap, clap. Clapping, hands coming together, people unified by noise. Clap, clap, clap, clap, clap, clap, clap. And like walking on like that, I was like mind blown by how cool this was. And he would improvise, he'd just pull out a fidget widget and go, look at that, look at it. And he was just like, yeah, like a loose cannon. And I love that kind of stuff. I like the idea of starting my set by like, you know, I'm introduced and then I come in through the main door of like the back of the room, like, wow, everybody's here to see the movie. It was good. So how were you getting stage time in the early days? Just applying every gig? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Just emailing on just Facebook, everything, just begging, yeah. Well that's quite creative to work at the Cavs and Shores to get stage time, to be fair. Say again? That's creative to work. To work at the Cav, yeah. I did it because I did need work at the time, but then I got a job, but then I didn't leave the job. I was working a normal job and working at the Cav because it was fun. But yeah, it was... And also, I wasn't actually supposed to be going on stage. I ended up kind of having to leave the job because they were like, you can't perform when you... And I was like, you're not here. No one has pizzas. Yeah, just make the pizza, stop doing that. And I was like, you can't stop me when you're not here, so I'm going to do it. And also, the MCs really liked my act. And sometimes I'd be like... The MC, this sounds arrogant, but the MC would be like... we need you, like, do you mind just going on when we need you? Because like, oh, there were like two bad acts in a row, do you want to jump on and like bring the energy up? Which is a nice compliment, but yeah. Well, definitely would bring the energy because you can get over my comedy, there's some wild events happen. Yeah, yeah. So it's good to have you in the back. So from- Great class in emergency, Rob Copland, little Rob Copland. I just need three minutes to put my iPhone on. Yeah. That's funny. So from the split shows then you did the first solo show? Mm-hmm. And- Yeah, that was me learning to do it by myself and also attempting to like figure out how to create a show with like a meaning or whatever. And I didn't do that very well, but- I'm glad that I did it before I did my debut because you need to figure out. It's a hard thing. It's like writing a feature script or something or a sitcom. Like, how do you have these themes and things that you want to say about yourself and say about the world? And how do you want to engage with people? But how do you put that into a stand up show? They're just jokes. So like figuring out all that stuff. Did you write meaning on like a piece of paper? I'm just trying to chew. Well, I knew I was trying to say my first show was about being on Ritalin, like being put on Ritalin as a kid and like kind of like trying to tackle how I felt about that. And I didn't. I didn't really. I just at the end of the show said, oh, when I was a kid, I felt like it held me back. But now I'm doing stand up. It's it's the thing that makes me funny. So if you ever have something in your life that you think is holding you back, maybe it's actually. rocket fuel. Maybe it's the thing that could take you to the moon. Lights. And then I played S Club 7, Reach for the Stars. I moved the spotlight that had been on me the whole show up to the roof to reveal some stars on the roof and then I'd jump and they were really high up so it was hard for me to get to them and I'd get people out of the audience to lift me up and I'd grab them. And it was like a nice coming together, kind of like the mosh pit in a way. Getting people, I like the idea of the show not having a high hard end, it being kind of like confused and like fading back to the real world so like the door would open. And people are still thinking about you years later, remember that Mon Weekari dance concept? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, maybe. That's very cool. Right. just randomly tell a funny story about that show. So this is the craziest shit. So during that fringe right there was a guy in the room next to mine. What was his name? Something. And he was, I could hear his show, he was doing a musical comedy show and I could hear his show through the walls. I'm gonna sound like an arrogant prick during parts of this story but that at the end you'll get it. I could hear his show through my walls and it was shit. He was doing this dog shit show and it was like he was doing like Arctic Monkey songs on an acoustic guitar but he was changing the lyrics to be like whoops I stepped in a poop. It was awful and And I was really proud of my show and I was like, it was good. At the beginning of my show, I had like the door open, the door to my room opened. If you walked in late, you'd walk onto the stage. And so I'd be on the stage and the audience are there, lights, and I could see out into the hallways and I could see people queuing for his show. And just kind of for the people who were already in my show, I'd shout out of the door, what queue, what show are you, room three? Rubbish! Room four. Where do you want to be, mate? Right? Am I right? Am I right? To my audience, I'm making it this thing. I'm so, my persona on stage is so self-assured that he's like, fuck that show. You want to come see this? This is the, this is the, making my audience feel like this is the place to be. And I did that for three or four days. I liked starting there... to figure that out after the first week, but that's a fun little bit to do to get to kind of transition into the show starting, how I can be the concierge of bringing people in and be the persona on stage, you know, how can I? Anyway, so I do that a couple of times and I'm shouting at people who are queuing to see another show being like rubbish. It only kind of occurred to me when this happens that that was an arsehole thing to do. But I did in my gut think that he was a bit of a, like, he's never going to make it in comedy. He's just doing this show. I've never met him on the scene. He's doing music, cheap music, like lyric swap comedy. He's just playing the chords to an Arctic Monkey song again. Oops, I stepped in a poop. And it was crap. And I was like, Genuinely, I know that those human beings will have a better time in my show than they will his, okay? I know that's a fucked up thing to think but I genuinely felt that right and One day I start a show I've been doing that I start the show and He I'm just like I'm halfway through like the first routine and the door opens and it's here and he goes Are you trying are you shouting at my audience? Like he was like really annoyed, but he was like he was quite like a Unintimidating guy really like he was like a little bit short than me. Oh, hi. Yeah, nice hair and He was like really annoyed at me. He had a go at me basically in front of in front of during the show Opens you're straight on the stage and it almost felt like a like a stick like a like a plant or something and I thought I was like, oh sorry, I'll speak to you after the show. And then he shut the door and I was like, I turned back to my audience like, uh oh. And, but it was night, I turned into a fun game. I was like, can you guys leave with me? I'm scared he's going to put a triangle up my ass and beat me up with a glockenspiel. You know, like turning it into a joke and whatnot. And after the show, I never saw him. And then the next day I saw him while he was flyering. And I went over and I said, listen, man, I only just realized when he did it, when he burst in, I kind of, it did hit me that what I was doing was an asshole thing to do. To like try and poach people's cue and stuff. Even though in my heart of hearts, I knew his show was bad and mine was going to be good. People would have better time than mine. I genuinely felt that. And I apologized to him, but I knew I was lying. I didn't feel sorry. Somebody about him and I just didn't feel like he's stuffed with crap and anyway anyway anyway cut to like two months after the fringe I get a DM from somebody saying oh my god watch this video right and it's one of those videos that people film when they catfish a pedophile and they're like come meet me at this Tesco's and then they turn up like alright mate are you here to meet like a 14 year old girl yeah well we've got messages here saying that you want to do this to her do that to her what I don't know what you mean no it's not and it's the fucking guy it's they were whoever is the guy yeah yeah and there's articles about this I knew there was something wrong and he wasn't he wasn't in contact for like the artistic, like trying to find my pure artistic expression. He was just a guy who wanted to get children in a room. That's why he's singing like Arctic Monkey songs and like pop songs that kids like. It's like they use it as bait. Oh, what's wrong with you? Well it's good advertising to come to your show because you're not doing that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Penal defence. You must have been, were you not really happy when you seen that video? No, I laughed so much. Did you leave a show, like tickets, your event prank link in the bottom? I should have, I should have. Come to this show. I mean I didn't touch it but I laugh about it. Yeah, yeah. From there now you did the civil theatre with your art? Yeah. Yeah, so mainstream muck, I guess, with it winning the award and stuff, it picked up a bit of traction. And I wanted to do it. I said to my agent, you know, actively, we should go for this. I would love to get this show on at the Soho Theatre. And yeah, I did that like two weeks ago. Thanks, man. It was really, really fun. The second show particularly was like. Just like, yeah, people were there to see the show, and it was like I serviced the show, like the show can't happen without me. And I'm excited to be there. But I'm excited that people are excited for the show. And I am like I'm the key in the engine. You know what I mean? I have to be there to make it happen. And it's a surreal feeling to know people are there to see the thing that you created and you you're excited. So you give it everything. And yeah, it was really fun. really really really special and really really fun. And the Soul Theatre is a dream place as well. Yeah, yeah it was cool. And also like a great space for that show, like just coincidentally, it's like it's big stage, flat, like the audience are raised but not too much and it was just, it was actually like a perfect place for that show. That's really cool. And I got, I did something really fun as well, I got some um some like open micers, some newer comedians to get up and do five minutes in the middle of the show and it was just like a really nice little, I think because it was, it won the Comedian's Choice Award, I thought like oh I should like, there's going to be a lot of comedians at the show and how funny would it be if I just got someone like, you're a comedian, everyone's here, fucking comedian. Anyone want to get up and do five minutes? So we kind of made it look like it was improvised or like just off the cuff, but I like had somebody come and do five minutes. minutes each day it was really fun. I did have a reason for it. Oh because somebody said they wanted to come and see the show. Someone messaged me saying oh man I'm gonna miss the show and I was like oh what like what have you got on? What you up to? No I'm doing TNT. Fuck that! Like fuck yeah what you're gonna go to an open mic that lasts three hours and you get five minutes? Fuck that! Come to my show I'll give you free ticket and you can do your five minute set at the show. So that was just like an impulsive decision that I made but you should let your impulses guide what you do I think. You made a really fun environment so yeah what's what's your plan for the future in our world tour world domination? No I don't know if I can handle that. Well you're getting married to be fair. Yeah I'm getting married this year. I'm really excited. excited about that we're going on a like a pre pre wedding honeymoon we're going on a really nice holiday to the Dominican Republic together before that's in September have you checked out there no it's in July it's before the fringe oh yeah have I checked out the Dominican Republic I was gonna say have you been there have you checked out if there's comedy there oh no I'm not you see comedians going on holiday and they're like yeah the airport they're off on holiday and then they're at the holiday and they're gigging on their holiday calm down you're on holiday in the karaoke bar be like I'll just do five minutes no I've been trying to figure out what their national sport in Dominican Republic is and it's baseball oh I want to try and see some baseball when I'm out there I think that'd be really fun but what's the plan comedy wise to do another show but I have to figure out what that show is gonna be about and I haven't figured that out yet. So once I figure out what I want to say about the world and myself and my place in it and anything, you know, what do I wanna talk about now? Once I've figured that out, then I'll start constructing another show, but in the meantime, just writing bits, just writing bits. Like I wrote a joke about tap dancing the other day. I haven't tried it yet. I haven't tried it yet. Are you a tap dancer? It's about the expression tapping out and how you can't use it if you're a tap dancer because then people are like, this kid never quits. Yeah. Even when it gets tough, he keep tapping. He's tapping in, he's tapping out. Oh, that's very good. That's very good. Thank you very much for coming Rob. Thanks for having me Rhys, it's been lovely. It's been really nice. And good luck with the future show and the wedding. Cheers mate. And everything. For everyone else I'll leave everything in the show notes and leave me a good review and any feedback as well send to me. Thank you very much Rob. And what's your socials Rob sorry? At Robert D. Copland. D for Douglas, that's my middle name. Nice. And go to all of Rob's shows so you can experience the wildness in real life. Fuck Instagram. There we go. Rock. Thanks Rob. Bye.