Episode 36 - His Name was Nex Benedict

Jess and Taryn join Vanessa to talk about the devastating tragedy around the assault and death of Nex Benedict, a child just trying to make his way through his high school years in Owasso, Oklahoma.

His Name was Nex Benedict. Remember him. Cherish his memory.

Links:

Sean Cummings: https://www.tiktok.com/@sean_cummings_irish_pub

Under the Desk News: https://www.tiktok.com/@underthedesknews

https://www.freedomoklahoma.org/

https://itgetsbetter.org/

Trans Lifeline (877-565-8860)

The Trevor Project (call 1-866-488-7386 or text START to 678-678)

The LGBT Hotline (888-843-4564)

Transcript

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Vanessa: 0:00

Hello, everybody, welcome back to transcending humanity. I'm Vanessa, I'm joined by Taryn and Jess this week, I want to do do a little bit of a content warning ahead of this, we are going to be talking about next Benedict this week. And just for the content warning of, you know, assault, and honestly, murder, that we're going to be talking about whether or not that murder was meant to be that way or not so, and wherever you demonetized here, so we can just talk about whatever we want. So I wanted to just jump in, say, this is our next Benedict episode, it spin on all of our minds, it's the news, it's just been absolutely devastating to the trans community. And just has a little bit of an update on Nexus pronouns. Just to start us off, would you mind going into that real quick? Sure.

Jess: 1:00

Yeah. Happy to Yeah, we just were discussing before we started recording. So it came out, really kind of came in the more public social media discourse yesterday that that next actually preferred he him pronouns. And so I know, like I have gotten used to thinking of next with the pronouns are they them as that was the beginning of how the reporting started about about next. But we are going to do our best to respect that and use he him and I just want to acknowledge that that is why we're going off of the most current information that we have, even though there has been conflicting reports about that, and a lot of details about next his life. We are just we're trying to be as respectful as we can, to next his memory. And so we will be using him.

Vanessa: 1:55

Amazing. Yes. Because as we are starting to understand, it sounds like next identify this trans trans male, so. So yeah. Thank you just for bringing that up. Because that's something I hadn't heard yet. I know Taryn did kind of as well. So yeah, get into business really quick. Don't forget, we have a Patreon transcending humanity.com There's all the links to it. We would love your support. We pour our heart and soul into this show, and the more support that we can have financially, the merrier because, you know, it's money's good. So, price of coffee, less than a Starbucks Caramel Macchiato. You can support people. Yeah, exactly. So how are you to holding up through all this? It's been tearing. I know, you've posted that it's kind of torn you up?

Taryn: 2:54

Yeah, I mean, I went through. It was kind of like, it was like various stages of grief. Right. So when I first read the news, over the weekend, this past weekend, well, actually wait wasn't this weekend, it was the fall the previous week. But I decided to post that on LinkedIn. Right? It surprisingly went viral, right. And a lot of people weighed in on it. At that time that I was posting it. I felt a lot of anger. Right. And I can't speak for you too, and we'd love to hear you chime in. But for me, as somebody who has literally been beaten in the school, when I was in high school, I understood kind of Nexus mindset, right? When he went to the cops, and he was being interviewed on that camera. He was like, why we even bother reporting it. You know, you feel this, this helplessness, right? With the bullying. And even though this is creating a conversation, like think in the country that is necessary. This is nothing new to anybody who's been in that LGBTQ two S I A plus community, like this is our life, right? School for me felt like a prison because I felt like I kept getting beat up in the cell, like all the time. So I stepped through that emotion and then it just was kind of sorrow and helplessness, right? Because I feel like as an elder, right, in the community, you know, and as somebody who's mixed indigenous, you know, my my brother is Cherokee, right sitting nation that you know, next died and and it just felt like what is the point of, of doing what we do, right when we can't even stop something as grotesque and as brutal as this was, you know, and I just it still stays with me, right? I'm like, I still have that agitation, irritation and anger. That it's like an IT Think the subsequent videos of some of these politicians have only worsened.

Vanessa: 5:06

They've been horrible. Absolutely.

Taryn: 5:09

What the process they all went through. Right? And how, like how you felt on hearing the news? And did you have that flashback to your youth? Are there any challenges you add?

Jess: 5:21

Yes, go ahead. Yeah, I? Um, yeah, I mean, hearing the news. It's interesting that, Darren, you mentioned kind of bouncing through different stages of emotion with this, because I think I did do. For sure. Like, I came out in high school. And that was really hard. I was not, I didn't experience. I wasn't like, beaten by peers, that wasn't my experience. I had, like stuff thrown at me and yelled at me. And, you know, I was bullied, not to the not to the extent of that, you know, that much physical issues from school peers, I had other issues. But, um, but yeah, it definitely, you know, took me aback in that way. And there's been a lot of a lot of people online talking about how this has brought up a lot of trauma for them, you know, and just, this has been traumatizing on so many levels. I think that it's interesting, because I know that I have this, like, there's anger somewhere, I haven't really been able to access that anger. And, like, anger is a hard one for me to access a lot of times. So I've been pretty stuck in sadness and grief. And, and really thinking a lot about what, you know, what can I do? I have, you know, fears around this as a parent who's going to support their child being whoever they are, you know, very much in a in a red area, even though luckily, the specific local area I'm in is, is really progressive, but the state is not. And I mean, another thing that I've been thinking of, kind of in all of this is, it's just kind of brought up like, school just seems so dangerous. Now, you know, I mean, like, school was dangerous when we went to school for people who are othered, for different reasons. But like, the point of like, the fears of mass shooting, and the the incitement to violence from the right, which is a lot of the kind of more systemic, cultural, through lines, that really unfortunate, unfortunately, like supported this action, being perpetuated by individuals, but it's like, you can't think about, you know, if you, if you always blame things on individuals, you're never seeing the picture of the system, right. And so really kind of taking that away of like, yes, this happened to one individual student by some other individual students, but this culture that we are in, is so pervasive and hatred and divisiveness, that, that it's so dangerous for kids, like next just to go to school just to like, exist, you know, and we know it's so dangerous for adults. And then it just, of course, just seems so much more sad for to know that kids are having that experience, even just at the point that they're just trying to figure themselves out and just trying to like, think about doing homework and shit. And like, don't even have that, like clarity to do that because they're trying to survive. So I've been thinking a lot about, just like bullying in general, just the culture of bullying in our schools. Obviously, there's a lot around that with, with all of the everything that the right is pushing around that to support that culture. But, you know, but thinking about like, this is so terrible that this happened to you next, obviously, but how many other kids are getting bullied? You know, that hopefully will survive that bullying, but how like scarring is that to them? And what can we do about that, you know, as elders in the community as advocates and activists, you know, like, what, what can we do to try to help students that are, especially those that are in areas like Oklahoma where that culture is just so tough compared To, you know, a more progressive area like New York or California where, sure that still happens, they're uncertain, but it's just a different level of the system. The systemic level is different in those places, you know. So yeah, I mean, I've, I've been thinking all over the map with it, but, and I mean, I think part of it is like, I've just really had some moments of just like wanting this to all not be true, you know. But really just coming back to like, this is what it is, and what are we going to do now? You know,

Vanessa: 10:36

it's, I mean, for my high school career was pretty uneventful. Because I was, I didn't come back till I was 40. So, and honestly, my high school classes, pretty decent class, we all got along pretty well. But so I don't so much have that kind of trauma to look back at. But a school nowadays, it's a complete different animal than what it was when we were in school. And, like, as YouTube saying, like, you run the risk of being shot, you have the credit risk of being assaulted. And now we have bullying coming not just from peers, but also from the teachers. So it sounds like a Waso. I pronounce that right. Bosco High School. It sounds like that's a pretty toxic school in general, too. Because we know that I think last year a teacher resigned after being, you know, verbally assaulted pretty much by clips of tic tac. And then there's another student, trans student that had graduated that spoke out saying that, you know, they had been bullied directly by adult staff at the school. So it's, it's coming from them at all angles. And in states like Oklahoma, I can see this probably happening in Ohio and all over the place, too. But like, you have that one senator, calling the queer community fills. And it's the, the state superintendent is like, I saw a little bit of footage of him just talking in his car and just going on about how, like, being queer is wrong, and it's there. It's just as theocratic nightmare. It's an absolute nightmare. And these kids just want to go to school, they just want to survive it and graduate and get out and move on with their lives. And no one's elders, we're here, we're supposed to be trying to be able to tell them, it gets better. But right now, if it's doesn't get better, right now, it's hard. The best way to get through this is to find your community like we have here. For younger people listening, I here to score it's a great place to go to build a community. And we have to stick together. So I mean, we are all of us very different people. But yeah, it's this whole thing would next hit me really hard I, I kind of see him as kind of like, a little brother, or honestly, I'm old enough to be as his mom, but like, there's been other murders and deaths in the trans community. But this one really seems to be resonating with people. I'm not trying to downplay the best of the other other people. But I think this resonates with people so much, because it was in school, you know, people that had been bullied before, like, and the escalation of it. When he was being interviewed by police in the hospital, he said that he was being tormented by these girls, which turned out to be excuse me, younger than him. I believe they were freshmen. You didn't really know them that well. Anyone that pouring water on them? And that instigated that. That's what I don't want to say they instigated that. That's what their response was. The punishment it did not fit the crime.

Taryn: 14:17

What let me like kind of we just got back for a sec. Yeah. So when they were mocking next and a friend bullying next and a friend next response, next response was just water on him. Right. And their response was to beat next to the ground and smash their head into the floor. Yeah. Like that's i And I'm sorry to jump in on what you were saying. But it was like That's to me like the most insane part when I saw somebody's like the article starts saying that next threw water on the right. I was like, listen, a death penalty is never the is never the solution to getting water. Yeah. Like it's See, the crime was so severe, like the, with those girls there was so severe. And like I said, very triggering. I mean, for people like me that were on a locker room floor with three boys beaten my makeup wearing nail polish wearing. But on the floor of a locker room, this was incredibly triggering, I was gonna crawl up in a little fetal position. And I could only imagine what next was going as they were slamming his head into the floor. And I mean, that's the part of it. Just that's part of the rage, right? Was like I couldn't, I couldn't defend myself. Next had people I think there were people in the room, in the bathroom with them. And it's just I feel like it's so heinous. And so to your point, right? It's activated in people like it's never done before. We've seen these murders before, right. And Eric retask, and they are horrible. And they are brutal. But this just is resonating with people. Because of that. I just felt like the, the severity of it and just happening in school, like things are starting to piece together and some people's brains.

Jess: 16:06

Yeah, and I think Sorry to cut you off there. But I was just gonna say that I think the other piece in addition to this happening in school, and that kind of being like, Okay, well, that's new. Like, that's, that's not, you know, I mean, because unfortunately, like, the trans community is not, you know, unfamiliar with murders happening, but, but it happened in school, but specifically, it being is easier to see the links with this situation and the policies, it's easier to see the links to the anti trans bathroom policies, it's easier to see the links to the school pushing out a, you know, queer teacher or a teacher that is, you know, pro queer, and bringing in what's her name? Showing? Yeah, she lives up tick tock person. I don't even want to say her name. But yeah, whatever. Um, and like, all of that, I think it's just a lot more direct in this situation. And Anna in it, something that so many people in the community have been calling out with these policies saying, you know, these policies can cause something like, oh, you know, like, this, actually, is what this can cause, like, you know, and being able to, it's just a lot easier to connect the dots with this, in addition to the fact that school is supposed to be a safe place, right. And you know, that the administration and the teachers and the adults around are supposed to be the responsible parties to keep children safe. That's the whole point. But yeah, just like, even outside of that, just that whole culture of you know, that. You know, this the anti woke movement, and like, this is a this is a direct result of that, like hatred happening.

Vanessa: 18:18

Yeah, definitely.

Taryn: 18:21

Cause and effect. Yeah. Yeah.

Vanessa: 18:24

Looks like that just joined us. By Is that so? Yeah, it's the adults in this situation have failed on so many levels, knowing that he identified as a trans male, really makes the bathroom thing really make a lot more sense to my dog is dreaming over there. Just to be clear, who are we talking about? Next, Next Bennett? Oh,

Zach: 18:58

if I could just say something on that. So I I'm with the four freedoms Democratic Club in New York, and I was talking to the diversity, equity inclusion and belonging panel that meets every other every couple of weeks. And we were going over things that we can do to prevent bullying in schools because that's how this happened. Even though he was he was on his deathbed and they, they were going to press charges because he dumped water on them. But um, but what my idea is to kind of have a panel where people from the LGBTQ i plus community can share their stories about you know, what it's like to be in their bodies and wouldn't Just be members of that community, it would be members from organizations that support that community. And we would exchange ideas about how we can work together to do something substantive to have an impact on reducing, if not outright, ending bullying against transgender and non binary youth. And while there is no date in place yet, I was wondering if this if this discussion is something anybody would be interested in? joining in?

Vanessa: 20:37

Yeah, yeah. I would say so. Okay,

Zach: 20:41

I can provide details, but I just wanted to, because I'm actually on my way to another appointment, but I just wanted to come on. And, you know, kind of see, see where you were what you thought of doing a panel like this, because the thing that we need to understand is, it's going to take a lot of education, about, about that community and a lot of self reflection, to really, to really do something substantive. So this never happens again. Because, you know, it was it was next, but it could be, it could be any one of them, especially with all the anti anti trans and anti non binary legislation out there. Yeah, so. But really, thank you for having this discussion. Yeah,

Vanessa: 21:34

thanks for popping in and sharing that. We are. It's a, I was talking about just the failure of the adults we've had, like from the school. I mean, the resource officer officer didn't do anything. And no ambulance was called, and their penchant

Zach: 21:54

for dumping water on these bullies head like, really?

Vanessa: 21:58

Yeah. Press charges. Yeah. When next was in the hospital. The police were telling him that, you know, he was just as culpable as the girls that beat him up, because you know, it. But yeah, the escalation is said escalation was just mind boggling. So I'm

Zach: 22:20

sorry, but I have to I have to go. Provide details when I can.

Vanessa: 22:25

Okay, thanks. Thanks. Yeah, of course. Yeah. suppressor, took the, I was talking earlier about how he, how he identified as, as a trans male, that makes this bathroom thing make a whole lot more sense to then. Then on the non binary level, and you can see, you can kind of just hear what it was like in the bathroom, those girls were like, What are you doing here, your boy or whatever. Or you will never be man enough, you'll never be warm enough, whatever they were saying, you know, I had to be just absolutely cruel. But, I mean, that mentality that these kids have. That's not that's learned, you know, that comes down from their parents. And hatred is just it goes on through generations. And as Zach was saying, you know, we have to find a way to stop it. One of the biggest Oddish to my daughter's over there, like grunting, and here's like, one of the biggest things that we can do is get these Republicans out of office in order to actually start creating change, because this, it's like, it's like a rot that's festering from the government, to the people. And we have to stop it. So having allies, I'm going to share an ally video here in a little bit. But having allies is very important. And I think this case also can be confusing for airlines, too, because next has been identified as non binary. And I know a lot of people just don't, the entire idea of non binary just breaks a lot of people's brains. So we're so broke programmed on a on a binary genders that it's not that way. So for

Taryn: 24:38

socialization since birth, of assists at binary, Yep, exactly. Exactly. That crap for years and decades. Yeah, and now they can't think past that. Now I think it to Zach's point, right, you know, I don't have a lot of hope on stopping bullying. This has been going on for ever. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I can share stories with you of how I got the beatings in school, right? For being a GNC makeup wearing, you know, assigned male at birth person. Um, so and that was in the 80s. So flash forward. That's right. It's always been happening, it will continue to happen, I think just hit on an inmate on just spot on on the point of the intersection between cause and effect, right. In Oklahoma, they are still trying to pass 49 Anti trans anti LGBTQ plus laws 49 of them, right. This school district has been problematic, you know, and I think just to your point, exactly, people are starting to connect the dots, like, oh, we do this, then this happens. You know, it's an a shame that somebody has to be brutally assaulted, and die from those injuries, for somebody to connect the dots. I mean, I'm gonna soapbox for a second. But like, you know, in the last two weeks, we've seen a couple of different things pop up, right? A clump of cells is a child. And yet a trans non binary child is not as filth. Okay, that is what one major political party in this country is selling. A clump of cells with no consciousness is a child. But uh, but an actual child is filth. And I want that to set in with every person listening to this pod, every ally? Okay. You know, we had the IVF rolling, which is ridiculous. We had the index, which came directly from these Oklahoma legislators in school district people and superintendents. I mean, all of this is connected in this weird ass, or in the French, crappy theocracy that one party is trying to put into place, right. And it's getting tiring to remind people that we belong and we exist, we are not felt. Right, we are human beings. And we should be treated with the basic respect and dignity of a human being. You know, I also saw something encouraged. So is the first conviction murder conviction of a trans woman. So the federal, I think it was a federal jury or judge court courthouse, convicted a man of killing a trans woman, because after he had relations with her, you know, people insulted him, and he got really mad and butthurt. So decided to take it out and and kill somebody for that. So you know, and that was in South Carolina, I believe. So, you know, why we have the red states is a mix, right? Next murdered in Oklahoma, a transforming gets some sort of justice in a federal courthouse in South Carolina. Yeah, you know, and there's so much further that we have to go, you know, and I just feel like, Jess, I'm glad people are connecting the dots. Right? Because, damn time, it really is it really no more stolen children, no more stolen siblings. Like, people need to stand up and wake up. Because when they're coming for IVs, or IVF, for abortion, right, this is all connected people. Like I just feel like, I don't know how I can scream that I feel like I gotta build the quarter of like, some major intersection in California and be like, it's all connected holding a giant ass sign. It's I mean, it's nothing is coincidence. Nothing is happenstance notices, like this is the plan.

Vanessa: 28:41

It's very, very, it's very organized plan. It's terrifying. And you're right, it is all connected. And they're attacking from all fronts. They have to be stopped. And the only way to stop them is to remove them from office. But it's it's hard to get through to people to say this. It's not just the trans community under attack. It's huge swaths of the population. Anybody with a uterus that has any plans of having a kid, or that's right, or anything? All this stuff is just it's such an absolute mess that yeah, it's apparent, as you said, like they consider an embryo a person, but a trans kid filth. I remember George George Carlin was one of my favorite comedians, and he had his bit about what conservatives only care about the unborn. And once you're born, you're, you're on your own, you're fucked. It's true. You know, they don't care. Alabama also takes I believe they took away school lunch programs. So they want these kids born but then they don't want anything to do with them. They don't want any support. If you people don't want to

Taryn: 30:02

WhatsApp, I was gonna say something. Go ahead.

Vanessa: 30:06

I was just going to give a quick plug for people that want to follow the news. The investigation is ongoing. And initially, the police said that the death wasn't related to trauma. And they are, they're backpedaling on that. But it's they were working after the initial medical examiner report. And there's a bunch of different ways causes of death. And the trauma is just a medical term. But if if you look up under the eye keep on saying under the table, under the desk news, they are covering this very, very closely. They have a very close eye on everything, they have multiple multiple videos, kind of explaining what's going on. And they go into much better detail than I ever possibly could. So they are the ones to check out under the desk news. I think they're most active on Instagram and Tiktok. But that's where I'm finding out most of my news on this. And it's all ongoing. From what I understand. The police have a lot of things on the table, they do have murder charges on the table, they have hate crimes on the on the table. So it's good to hear that that's happening. But Had this not gained this national attention. It very well could have been swept under the rug. So because this happened back on February 8, and no one knew about it for two weeks. So scary. Are you gonna sit here?

Taryn: 31:40

Now I was just gonna say the commonality between all of this right is something the three of us have the privilege to enjoy, which is bodily autonomy. We can seek the health care that we need, right? And live the lives that we want to live our lives. Right. And the common thread for all of this is its control over others. It's bodily autonomy. In every case, you're saying this, right? You're protecting somebody with these laws. You're protecting power, your privilege in your hegemony. Right. In, that's it.

Vanessa: 32:16

I wanted to I just want to tell them, like, leave her bodily autonomy alone. You can go without wearing a mask. You know, if that's what it takes? They're so backwards. Well,

Jess: 32:29

then they're gonna say my body my choice, right? Yeah. Except,

Vanessa: 32:33

me. So just

Taryn: 32:37

for me, and not for the

Vanessa: 32:39

Yeah,

Jess: 32:40

yeah. Yeah, no, that I mean, it's totally agree bodily autonomy. I just also want to hit on like, kind of more macro level, I think it's like, a push towards, you know, Christo fascism. Right. Which, you know, we could get into a whole rabbit hole about, like, moving towards, like, eugenics and like, that's part of, you know, the desire for eradicating trans people, and, you know, trying to control reproductive rights, and you know, all of that, but, but I just think that, it's what also just really is so irritating to me, kind of on a more general level, just so consistently, is that we have so many problems as a world, and as a country, and in our own communities, that really do need to be addressed, that are just not addressed. Because this, the Conservative Party is so focused on trying to restrict bodily autonomy, and trying to restrict, you know, more open education, and trying to erase, you know, identities that are not white. And, and all of that, and instead of focusing on all of the problems that we have, that are so real, you know, of climate change, housing crisis, you know, cost of inflation, like all of these things that like we could really use help on that with, like, that's really what I want politicians to be working on. solutions for, like food insecurity, like all of that are things that that's really what I want politicians to be working on. And I hope and I hope although, you know, we'll see with this election, it seems like so far. The politics around bigotry are really kind of a losing battle. Yeah. I mean, the thing that sucks is that when that when people are in power, they're going to legislate their asses off to like, do everything they can, which is what we've seen this incredibly high number of bills that are anti trans and, you know, even anti queer a little bit more broadly and anti reproductive rights and all of that, but, but um, But I think that it does seem like and, you know, I certainly hope that it is true that like that this party is failing, and it is falling apart. And that, you know, if we do as much as we can to get them out of power, and not just on the national level, but all the way down to the local level and 100%, like, all the way down to the school boards, you know, like, this guy, Ryan Walters, like he needs to be off the freakin he needs to be out of the school system. Like, there's no reason and I don't even understand how people like can be a part of a school system. If they're not if they don't live there. You know, like, like, like, certainly, I don't know anything about the rulemaking around that. But like, in my opinion, it's like, if you're not a parent, or a teacher, or at the bare minimum or resident, like you should not be involved in that school system. And really, I don't even think a resident should be involved. I think it should be like parents and teachers, or people who at least were parents or were teachers, you know, skin in the game. Yeah, you know, because otherwise, what are you doing? Why are you trying to control this? But, so I think that, like, I think that kind of on a bigger level is a thing. And I do want to just kind of acknowledged to I was, you know, doing a little bit of looking stuff up last night on on the situation with next and trying to just make sure I was as up to date as possible. And I want to give people a little bit of hope around people who really want to take some action. So I want to mention, we've Taryn mentioned a little bit but like it, you know, next was a part of indigenous community. That's been there's been a little bit of a conflicting reports around that. That's why I'm kind of saying this slightly hesitantly because there's been some conflicts of was he Cherokee was he Choctaw, there's been a little bit of there's just been conflicting reports around that. And like, we don't know, that I did find a really cool organization, though, that is very involved with the tribal nations in Oklahoma and the two s LGBTQIA. community, that organization is called freedom, Oklahoma, which when I first came across it on Google, I was like, this is freedom, like just because that's like such a conservative like rallying word. But it is it is a very progressive organization. And they're really specifically have a vision of, of working with all the different. It's like there's 39 Different sovereign tribal nations in Oklahoma. And, you know, advocating for them, and especially for any individuals who are to spirit lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender. So if anybody wants to, you know, find a way to support that organization seems like a really good one, too, to support a financially if you have the means to do so that organization is also in the wake of next is tragic death been offering some support groups. For people, I think some of them have even been virtual, but it does seem like they actually have a 501 C three and a 501. C four. So they have a political arm and just a nonprofit arm. And they specifically talk about on the website, that they do not take, like big funding, they don't have like funders and one of the reasons for that is so that they can stay independent and stay really true to their values. I just want to mention that for people who are looking for any any little hint of positivity in any of this or a place to direct their energy. And I just want to mention to you, like we were kind of we were talking earlier about, you know, what this brings up for us about our past and I when I came out in high school, it was really tough. One of the things that got me through it was finding a local organization for LGBTQ youth that was supportive, where I could go to support groups and find people in the community and also people, like adults who were volunteering, who were helping mentor LGBTQIA youth and, and I just want to like, just support any, any youth who might possibly come across this, you know, there's definitely resources online, the It Gets Better Project as a good thing to check out. There are some good resources through there. There's some apps if somebody is in an area where they cannot find a local organization, they don't feel like it's safe to go to a local organization. You know, I totally understand some people maybe in that situation, but if you are in it around a local organization, you can do some research or feel like you have enough support to go to a local organization in person. It can really help you get through this as far as, uh, you know, like kind of going back to addressing, like the people who are still being bullied day to day. I just want to encourage that. Because if you have the access to that, it was something that really, really helped me a ton. And the It Gets better.org has resources to like lists of local organizations too. So just want to mention that. Amazing.

Taryn: 40:29

I think, um, yeah, it's all initial reports, right? We're that next was Cherokee Choctaw. So to me, I look to the family or to the tribe. This occurred on Cherokee land. Okay, this is Cherokee Nation, land that was chosen. So for me, I was encouraged by seeing the principal chief come out with a statement from the Cherokee Nation. I also think in part of this comes back from what happened with so Zephyr up, I think it's the Montana is talking to an indigenous politician up there. And I was like, we need the tribes to weigh in. Right? We need the tribes like, there is history of our people. And when I say our people, I'm talking about the three of us, right? Like there is this three of us on this continent, we need that we need that security and safety of the tribes. They are independent nations within this country. And our trade is such so it kind of made me jump a little bit. So I'll take that your dog agreed with me. So. But yeah, this occurred on Cherokee land, I want to know exactly what the tribe is planning on doing. Right. I want to know how it works to have a public school on native land, right, and what those connections are like, I want people to dive down deeper in this. So we can figure out some stuff because I think like for us, I think the tribes are somewhere that we can actually have some support. Right. And like I said, the statement from the principal chief was encouraging, but I kind of want a little bit more. Right. You know, and I think that's important. You know, like for me when I belong to a tribal community back east, led by two spirits, right. So it's like, I chose that tribal community because of that, because I what my journey was heading. Right. And it's important. I also want to add one thing just to like, when we talk about what next right, so next, was friends identified as trans and masculine. Not every indigenous person is to spirit, I refer to myself as Two Spirit, because I blended both male and female spirits together into something different. And I'm comfortable with that. And I'm comfortable with that label. But no one should ever assign an indigenous square person, the label of two spirits without talking to them first. Right and to understand their journey in their walk under percent.

Vanessa: 42:52

Yeah. Yeah. And we're here where Cherokee blood has been spilled on Cherokee land in a building, stolen from Cherokees land by colonizers. And I don't know who I don't know anything about the girls that assaulted him. But I don't know. Took get to circle back onto the politics part. We need to I do have a feeling that Democrats are going to do pretty well in 2024. I saw a stat from the Ohio Democratic Party that 18 year olds have registered 35% More 18 year olds have registered to vote in Ohio than any other than the past. So people are getting they're passionate about it. But what if the Democrats win? We have to hold their feet to the fire to actually get them to do something. Because that's the problem that we have is why hasn't the Equality Act passed? You know, they had so much time to do it. They need to actually get the stuff done and solidify and protect rights for everybody, you know, codify roe into law, rather than all that stuff. That's just kind of keep it going. Since we're starting to run short on time, I do want to bring up allies here. We've found we in the trans community have found a very powerful ally in a guy named Shaun Cummings in Oklahoma. He's the vice mayor of a place called the village which is like on the outskirts of Oklahoma City, I believe. And he owns an Irish bar there, but he's been very vocal against these horrible school boards and horrible rulings and I know he's been attacked by I, the lives of tick tock person. Speaking of her, I would talk about an unassuming person, she just looks like another mob. And that's even more terrifying to me than anything that usually when you think of a bar zealot of hate and stuff like that, you think your brain just thinks of someone like Trump, you know. And what's terrifying is she blends in. So we have to watch out for that. I want to share this, it's about three and a half minutes long. From Shawn, this is a very powerful mission. This right here is a perfect example of how to be an amazing ally. So I'm gonna go out and play it.

Taryn: 45:46

So are you doing this? I'm just gonna let that person who runs oops, the TIC tock has an enormous platform and is making outrageous amounts of changes in a very negative way. I don't know if you all saw the video of her getting interviewed by a reporter in LA. But yeah,

Jess: 46:04

I know, that's been like, really a pretty hot topic in the last week as well. And I have not, I've seen clips of it. I have not watched the entire thing. But I've seen clips of it. And yeah, I kind of have a I kind of have a both an perspective on it, honestly, but I'm curious to know what you think.

Taryn: 46:27

So my view is this right? Like, I think it's important that Chios speak, because I found for me, what was most illuminating was, number one, conservatives can never handle a follow up question. And number two, she sounded like an idiot. Right? She doesn't know what she's talking about. She's Trent, she's trafficking in selling fear in selling this lie, and then when called on it, she folds like a cheap suit. So I looked at it like, yeah, I can understand where people are like, I can't believe you give her a platform. I'm like, no, please show people how stupid she is. Yeah, please show how short sighted she is. How ignorant she is. Right? She started a tick tock probably because she says her real estate. I don't know, just like her. Her number one guy. So I'm just sorry, I'm a little bitter on this one. But um, that's kind of how I felt just what about you?

Jess: 47:21

Yeah, no, I mean, I, I felt like, um, this is understandable that it is very traumatizing to trans people, you know, specifically, or LGBTQ plus people, but like, you know, specifically people in the trans community. And like, I kind of have to say, like, like, that wasn't for us. You know, and it wasn't for her staunch supporters, either. I see that as that this is something for the people in the middle. This is something for the people that don't know anything about her. This is something for the people who may be curious. And maybe pretty uninformed. So I saw it as like, good. Good to get it out there. And also important for our community to understand that we still need to have our own boundaries around it for our own mental health, you know, and like, we don't have to like it. But I didn't I didn't see it as, as something that really helps her promotion at all, you know, because I do, I do think that, you know, hey, even if her staunch supporters really liked it, like, who cares? They weren't going to be swayed anyway. You know, so I really see it as that it could be good for, for the people in the middle for the people that don't don't have a lot of information that aren't very invested, who are kind of coming into this going, Who is this person? You know, what are they? Like, what are they about? And really kind of? Yeah, poking at that? It does seem to be that. Yeah, that it was pretty apparent that that there's no there there, you know, that that she's got nothing beyond just platforming hatred, and that there's ended there's really nothing behind it. And it was interesting, because the couple clips that I saw, I remember her saying something about like, well, I don't like lies, but then there was like, another clip where she was saying, Well, is it illegal to lie, you know, and it's like, you know, it doesn't even okay, you know, it's like, I don't, I mean, and, you know, even that argument is silly because it's like, okay, you know, you don't like lies. I mean, that's just like saying you don't agree with anything anybody does. You could consider it a lie. I mean, you could consider somebody's religion a lie. You could consider I mean, there's so many different angles where it's like, okay, whatever. And you know, like, that doesn't mean that you then need to destroy people's life. But yeah, I mean, like, I I would I'm hoping that, like, I certainly don't hope she causes more havoc, but I think she will, I kind of hope that her history goes the way of like Alex Jones, you know, in the sense that, that, you know, that somebody takes her to task and, and, you know, sues her for defamation or whatever in a wet whatever needs to happen to get her to stop because she's just actively harming the community. And I don't know why I don't know what it is that like people just get like, into whatever the ego like power thing is that like, trips up, and then they just, like, fall down this hole of like, just continuing to go into like, infinity around hating some group that like, I doesn't seem like did anything to them ever, you know. And so I just, I don't get it. But no, I actually thought that I mean, I thought that the interview from what I saw of it was good. In that sense. I just also think that like the trans community is just so sensitive right now. Yeah, you know?

Taryn: 51:15

Yeah, I mean, I totally respect that. Like, everybody's gotta look at this from their own unique perspective, right. Like for me, you know, I've kind of dialed back on some of the neck stuff right? Over the last couple days, because it was just, it gets too real, right? It's too close to someone who brings his iPad, and it's just like, so I totally understand protecting that piece. But I think you're right, I mean, from the middle. That's what I liked about it. Right? Was like, I don't like seeing anybody who's just a plain old hater, like in any kind of platform, but the way that she was just dismantled in her logic, right, in her lack of facts or lack of knowledge. I want that to resonate. I want that to be there for all time. And yes, I do want to see her sued into oblivion, like the rest of these hate mongers. Right. And then they'll be in like the maybe they can check up in the same apartment with Giuliani after he's a pay stub. Yes. I'm super political in case you

Jess: 52:12

didn't know that. No.

Vanessa: 52:15

There we go. Set better. Yep. Okay. I was trying to get the screenshare to record so they could hear it, but I don't for some reason they couldn't, and whatever. So I'm going to plug that in right now.

Unknown: 52:37

And you're trying to counsel stretch, everything else. Real nice. But that's the person on the library board now, as we expected to have happen. Because it's happened 20 times when she talks. Now, or look at the Alonzo situation. And I don't want to sit here and say on the Nostradamus of everything, because none of it's funny, I would open up with a joke, usually, because I picked this up correctly. You and your rhetoric and your inability to do anything as board here are partially responsible for in bolding, bullies and jumping. Three older girls don't just jump a 16 year old in the bathroom for no apparent reason. Especially when there are the alphabet community who you personally have attacked ever since you ran for office. And you brought in the chief attacker of this Chai chat. Okay, it's on you. You remember when I said the bloods on you guys and everything? I think what you're looking at now is a federal lawsuit for each one of you. Personally, I hope it happens because it'll bankrupt. And I hope it happens for you, Ryan, because your money oriented I hope to bankruptcy as well. There is legal culpability here. No Title minors home. Teacher intern in principle didn't turn it in. Is it mandatory reporting? Is that what it's called? Mandatory? Give me a nod. If you're on the school board, you should know is it mandatory reporting for somebody to report a hate crime? Is it mandatory? Did I not tell you this was going to happen? Yet? Here I am again. And I'm sure when I leave your Chiron check check will tweet myself out again, I'll get more death threats. That's who you brought into the room. You embolden these three girls yourself? Chaya right? Check in Bolden. These three girls by being on the library board. It's already difficult to be in high school. It's very difficult to be different. But when somebody is attacked for the being different, this isn't even about the death part because that's coming next we'll see who gets charged and how many families lose their children to prison. You are liable. You so what are you going to do about down the line? Literally, what are you going to do to change your behavior? It was real nice. You said thoughts and prayers for everybody in the beginning. You brought it home to China. Write check, do something in that school against the alphabet from the teacher. And together getting so many friends she quit. Yet you still brought her on and within a month, magically, something happened. You have no deniability, here. It is a pattern Forrest Gump could see this pattern. You don't deserve that you have actual blood on your hands, no matter how sincere you tried it, you probably practiced it in the mirror, the look sincere today, but human worthless at Chaya rideshare. Literally blood on your hands, and everybody that still sits at this table should have shown up today. And then some kind of a protest to show you're not okay with this, get a backbone. Literally, it's embarrassing. I am humiliated, embarrassed. For every one of you that showed up today. Shame on you, man. And as I told you, sooner or later, you're gonna get a parent contact for you. And yours. That's the way this works. Keep it up.

Vanessa: 55:56

Next, we have Mike. Okay, we're back. So, Shawn, I actually reached out to him and asked him for if he had a statement.

Jess: 56:14

I was hoping you were gonna read this. Yeah.

Vanessa: 56:17

So I'm gonna read what he said he gave me his cell phone number. And he said he would like to be on the show. He just wasn't able to join us today because of some personal stuff that he had. But he said the lives of tick tock threats and everything forced me to lower my social profile for a bit. The single most important thing I would tell anybody in the public community is that they have to vote. It seems so simple. But in Oklahoma, we have a terribly low voter turnout. Everyone needs allies. You don't have to agree on everything. But you need to have allies in the trenches to get candidates in that aren't insane. It seems so simple to people to be kind. But that isn't where the money is these days. And let me know if there's anything else I can do for you. So that was a statement from Sean on his main thing is he's speaking Oklahoma and stick it out in the vote. Your vote does matter. i It's you may not always like who you're voting for. But it's the alternatives that we have. It's just deadly for too many people. And not voting is just giving the other side more power, because they show up. We need. We need people that are progressive to get out and do it. Yeah, and I know it can feel like your vote doesn't matter. But it does. The only reason it feels like it doesn't matter is because propaganda has told you that in that propaganda is false. What was the last presidential election was in the end, determined by something like 45,000 votes, even though there's like, like an 8 million vote difference. But when it came down to like the electoral college, it was very, very tight. And we see that over and over and over again. We have to get these people out. So, Shawn, if you're listening, thank you so much for being an ally. I encourage people to follow him. His he's on Instagram and Tiktok most most active on Tik Tok, but Sean is spelled s e a n. So Sean underscore Cummings underscore Irish underscore pub. And we need more people like Sean in in office. So because we need people to actually do something. I said it before the clip, but we have to hold Democrats feet to the fire to actually get them to do something. If they get in office. We can't let them just slack like they've done before. We have to call them out on that kind of stuff. Because you know, they are also getting a lot of them are getting paid off. They don't nurse as well. So if you're elected by the people, to be representative of the people, you need to represent the people and not your corporate sponsors. This country is being torn into a horrible mix of a theocracy. And corporate like I I can't even remember the word for it. But we are owned by our corporate overlords. Like right now we're going through this thing with Wendy's where they are wanting to do surge pricing for their items. And as if it's not already so expensive, like around me, a spicy chicken sandwich is almost $7 And how much more money do they need? I mean, they're already making tons of income. You know, Dave Thomas and linden wood. You're probably just rolling in their graves at all this. But it's stuff like that you see happening, if people can't afford to live, we have to push back against that. And we are certainly not going to have any pushback against it while Republicans are in office. So I'm sorry, Jeff.

Jess: 1:00:22

We're both like, I'm sorry. No, agreed, um, if you don't vote, like, I know, there's been a lot of conversation recently about protest, protest, voting protests, on voting, with holding a vote out of protest. You know, that gets into a whole nother topic that we certainly don't have time for today. But like, I get it that like, I am not happy with everything that this administration has done, I am not happy with their foreign policy, I am not happy with many things. But not voting for the Progressive Party right now. will not help any of those causes, and will not help any people affected by any of those issues. And, you know, there was, I don't know if I can articulate this super well, but I'll try. Like, there was something I saw that someone said that it's like, you have to imagine that you're on a bus, right? We're not on a we're not on a race car to an end here. You know. So like, if the next stop is four more years of Biden, you know, assuming his health holds, like, let's hope it does, you know, that, that that may not be your goal. That may not be you know, he may not be like the ideal politician for you. He's not for me. But I certainly think that it helps, it does not help me, or anyone I care about, or anyone that you know, anyone that I care about that I know or or anyone that I care about that I don't know, by withholding my vote from the Democratic Party. And yes, I totally agreed, Vanessa, that, yes, we need to vote them in, and then we need to hold them to it. And then we need to push them to change these things about the party that we want to see changed. But but, you know, not participating. At some point is is kind of a point of it's a maybe a false sense of, like privilege. It's not anything that I can afford right now.

Vanessa: 1:02:36

No, it's at this point, like people that don't want to vote because they don't like either party. Yeah, there's downsides to both. But there's a much bigger downside to voting Republican. If the Republicans win, again, in 2024, we're honestly facing between looking at Project 2025. Trump's agenda 47. We're honestly looking at this could be the last time in America that people can vote. That's where we are right now. Or, at least their votes matter?

Jess: 1:03:14

Well, as they said at CPAC, you know, welcome to the end of democracy. Yes, exactly.

Vanessa: 1:03:19

And that was very telling that they are no longer us hiding anything. They're saying all the white parts out loud. And we need the fucking believe them. Because it's scary. You have to get out there. I understand the withholding vote thing. We should not be supporting Israel, we should be giving given that money and spending it on Americans. Like they said, I keep hearing a number of something like $12 billion would solve homelessness in America. So let's do that. But yeah, again, that's a conversation for a whole other time, but free Palestine. So

Taryn: 1:04:03

we can add a couple of things. Yeah. So just with the protest vote, right. So we saw this in Michigan. Protests about what's happening in the primary right now. should happen. Right? This should be nudging him into a more leftist mindset against an ongoing genocide against indigenous population. Right? So I totally support that. If you're going to withhold your vote in the general election, I will not engage with your content, I will not share your content, I will not promote your content, because our rights and our lives are at stake. When we talk about it, also, we need to understand the privilege of telling people to go out and vote. Right, because as we have just kind of highlighted on Oklahoma, in many red states, there is disenfranchisement of black and brown Americans across the country. When we talk about like Oklahoma, I need to do some work. research on what laws they've passed to prevent people from sovereign nations tribal nations from voting. I know that Noam had passed some things and made it incredibly difficult for indigenous First Nation people to vote in a general election. Right? They do these small little changes, right, knowing how a certain people live, they do a small change whether you have to have a physical street address, well, nobody has that up in South Dakota, out there in the in the on the reservation, right. So events and suppressors are better. So while we can sit here, privileged, right to say, please vote, you know, don't don't stand standby. Get in there and fight, we have to also acknowledge to that there are so many millions of people disenfranchised every year in this country. You know, and I'm just gonna just Vanessa, to what you had said earlier, America is one of those rare countries where you can have $30,000 in your checking account, becoming a senator, and in five or six years have about 1015 20 million. So that's not how it is for me. I know anyhow, this for you got some guests. And it's not how it is for you, either. So, you know, I think for us get the money out of politics, please, stop this dark money stop this, these political action committees who are just their sole existence is to suppress us, right? Their sole existence is to get rid of us. Like, we've got to change politics, and I'm not going to tolerate it. The Democrats have a landslide, it was a giant blue tsunami, I am not going to stay silent. Now I'm like, I'm going to be pushing to get rid of the Electoral College to take out that dark money from the forest forces, and to expand the goddamn Supreme Court for God's sakes. So that's the kind of shit that I'm going to be pushing. Sorry. I'm a little profane On this episode, because I'm a little salty. As

Vanessa: 1:06:51

this episode is rated explicit, you can say whatever you want. Someone thought

Taryn: 1:06:55

you're stuck. So those are some of the things that I believe so. I think we're all on the same page. So we just got to, like help make this happen. I, I had been this past couple weeks, I've been thinking more and more about my exit plan. And my exit plan is, what country or state can I move to? Where I can take my money out of this country, and live in relative safety? Like, that's where I'm at right now. I

Vanessa: 1:07:21

know, that was one reason I'm so desperate to find a job because I'm broke. You know, I can't afford to go anywhere. And it's terrifying. So

Taryn: 1:07:32

yeah, there's a whole bunch of a whole bunch of people like that. You know, we're in tough straits. Right. And we have to, we have to fight through and just, I mean, God put everything we have been told. Yeah.

Vanessa: 1:07:44

Jess, you have any closing thoughts? No,

Jess: 1:07:46

I just want to thank you, Taryn, for bringing that up as far as the disenfranchisement of motors, because you are 100%. Right. I, I know a little bit more about it from the, like, criminal justice angle than indigenous populations. So, but I really appreciate you bringing that up, because it is absolutely true. You know, specifically again, for like people of color in this country. And again, that's a whole nother conversation. But like, but yeah, you're totally right. So I agree. It is a privilege. I think, if you have that privilege, especially in the general election, please use it. Yeah, but yeah, thank you for saying that.

Vanessa: 1:08:28

Well, thank you, both of us. Thank you, both of you for being on This Week. I need to wrap up this I'm about to pee my pants. But yeah, so thank you everyone for listening. His name was next Benedict, his name and please support the show and support support your local queer community. Reach out when people struggle I Trevor Project said that their their calls went up like three or 2% after the news of next broke, which it means it's resonating with a lot of people. So but we will see you next time. Thank you.