Step into the shadows with Phoenix and Jason as they reveal the dark artistry woven into their latest cinematic venture, "The Geechee Witch: A Boo Hag Story." Discover the decade-long journey that brought this chilling horror thriller to life, from its roots in the boo hag folklore to the screen. Our conversation peels back the curtain on the rich Gullah Geechee heritage that not only serves as the film's haunting backdrop but also brings to light the underrepresented African-American culture in horror cinema. Phoenix and Jason recount navigating the film's development, embracing the challenges of storytelling within a budget, and the power of a narrative steeped in personal experience and regional mythology.
Pull up a seat as we chart the uncharted territories of independent filmmaking with our guests, guided by the bright beacons of dedication and resourcefulness. Phoenix and Jason articulate the essence of a producible script, the dexterity required to adapt to feedback, and the importance of a cast and crew in perfect harmony. They share the tightrope walk of balancing financial limits with crew welfare, offering a candid look at what it takes to film in the most demanding of locales. With a subtle hint at the spine-tingling plot of 'The Boo Hag,' our discussion not only sets the stage for an anticipated horror saga but also shines a spotlight on the collaborative spirit that pushes the boundaries of genre storytelling.
Step into the shadows with Phoenix and Jason as they reveal the dark artistry woven into their latest cinematic venture, "The Geechee Witch: A Boo Hag Story." Discover the decade-long journey that brought this chilling horror thriller to life, from its roots in the boo hag folklore to the screen. Our conversation peels back the curtain on the rich Gullah Geechee heritage that not only serves as the film's haunting backdrop but also brings to light the underrepresented African-American culture in horror cinema. Phoenix and Jason recount navigating the film's development, embracing the challenges of storytelling within a budget, and the power of a narrative steeped in personal experience and regional mythology.
Pull up a seat as we chart the uncharted territories of independent filmmaking with our guests, guided by the bright beacons of dedication and resourcefulness. Phoenix and Jason articulate the essence of a producible script, the dexterity required to adapt to feedback, and the importance of a cast and crew in perfect harmony. They share the tightrope walk of balancing financial limits with crew welfare, offering a candid look at what it takes to film in the most demanding of locales. With a subtle hint at the spine-tingling plot of 'The Boo Hag,' our discussion not only sets the stage for an anticipated horror saga but also shines a spotlight on the collaborative spirit that pushes the boundaries of genre storytelling.
what's going on, guys? Welcome back to the innovators, then. I am formally known as hashtag. You can find us on instagram at the innovators, then, and I'm here with steve all business and we got a very, very special guest.
Speaker 2:We got phoenix and we got jason. They got a a cool movie coming out and I thought it was great to like highlight them. So I'm gonna give the stage to uh phoenix, to what's up, phoenix? Yeah, what's up, man? Thank you for having to come and see us. So yeah, you know we got him on on the run, but it's, it's an honor to have you. I think it's a beautiful thing what you're doing with the movie and the storytelling from the the dc uh community. So, you know, highlight your story, man yeah, man.
Speaker 3:Well, first of all, thank you for having, thank you all for having us. The innovators, den jason and I, are super excited to to be here. And yeah, man, so we have a movie coming out. It's called the Geechee witch a boo hag story, and it tells the story of a couple that relocates from Harlem to the Georgia Savannah Georgia area, and it's a horror thriller about what happens when you go to a place and you are not necessarily welcomed, and when bad things happen to you when you go to sleep at night.
Speaker 4:So that's the big.
Speaker 2:Thing yeah don't go to sleep well, what like inspired the film like that, you know, for you? What inspired the film like that for you? What inspired the film for you guys?
Speaker 3:Yeah, so well, first of all, I'll just take it back a little bit. Yeah, let's go back. We're going to go back All the way back. 10 years.
Speaker 2:Let's go all the way back.
Speaker 3:Yeah, 10 years to about 2013. So there's actually three of us. It's me, jason and J Craig Gordon who couldn't be with us today, I think we've met.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you all have definitely talked to J Craig. He's an amazing guy, man, super talented, and about 10 years ago he and I were talking about a bunch of different ideas and he had a boo-h hag experience as a boy and man. When he told me about it I was just like that's, that's the story needs to be told. So we kind of started kicking the idea around and put pen to paper a little bit and I was like we need to call my boy Jason. He's, you know, he needs to be a part of this too. He gets the vibe.
Speaker 3:So we gave him a call and, man, as soon as we started talking about it, he was like yo, I'm in it, I love it. Started talking about it, he was like yo, I'm in it, I love it. And, um man, we, we just kind of went from there and we wrote a script and we did what everybody else does when they write a script we shopped it around and we got told no, a whole bunch. And lo and behold, the pandemic hits and we were able to get some private equity behind us and call Craig, call Jason, made sure everybody was a hundred percent.
Speaker 2:Are we on the same?
Speaker 3:Listen, we, we sure we want to do this. And uh, the answer came back as, yeah, let's do it. And we, we started man. So I'm giving you the big overview, but it's a lot of gray hair and sleepless nights in there.
Speaker 2:What's the narrative? Before getting to this movie, Like you already was in the film industry, Were you already in the yeah well, Phoenix and I met working with another company and did several projects leading up to 2013 together, I think like 2011, we were talking earlier.
Speaker 4:actually, one of the first things we covered together was a Bitcoin convention. Right, that had been like 2011 or something Back when Bitcoin was what? 50 cents a pound.
Speaker 3:We should have been buying it.
Speaker 4:Oh, that would be a whole different trajectory. But you know, what's interesting is, back then, kind of leading up to when they brought me onto the project you know, Get Out hadn't even become a thing.
Speaker 1:That's right.
Speaker 3:The movie right, yeah, that was a good one. It was, but this is pre-Get Out, yeah exactly.
Speaker 4:There was a big void where African-American representation, and especially horror films, needed to be filled up, and so Phoenix and Craig were innovative in wanting to capitalize on that. And also, just like here's an audience that loves films, why aren't we making movies for them? That's right.
Speaker 3:So the film is called the Geechee Witch Right, but there is an entire nation of people called the Gullah Geechee, and they number well over a million.
Speaker 2:In the United States only.
Speaker 3:Yeah, here in the United States, man, it goes from Wilmington, North Carolina, all the way down to Jacksonville.
Speaker 4:Florida, that's right, and this is called the Coastal Empire. And these are all a lot of descendants of West African slaves who, plantation owners, didn't enjoy staying on the islands off of the coasts down there because they're very, very brutal the temperature, the bugs but they were great for rice plantations, they were great for growing okra, they were great indigo indigo, which were all very similar to the western coast of Africa, that's right. So a lot of these descendants ended up being given a lot more free reign than a lot of their brothers and sisters who were on the actual mainland and out of that this really beautiful culture developed yeah, it's it like and it's everything is cultured more like a folktale that's been passed around, so the boo hag.
Speaker 3:So the, the gulligichi are people. You know. They are a distinct people with their own language. It's not slang, it's not a dialect, it's a language and they have, you know, customs and and folklore and food, food, food.
Speaker 1:So is the story like a folklore tale?
Speaker 3:so this story touches on a part of their folklore called the hag or the boo hag Right. And the boo hag is a demon that attacks you in the night and does a variety of things to you, from just disturbing your sleep to chopping you into a thousand pieces, what's really fascinating. And she hides in people's skin during the day, so Absolutely she could be Danny and you wouldn't know it. Right, really fast. And she hides in people's skin during the day, so absolutely she could.
Speaker 4:She could be Danny and you wouldn't know it what's really fascinating about the Geechee, which, about the boo hag, is in every culture around the world. There's some sort of folklore tied up around the sleep paralysis effect and and for the Gullah Geechee, this is the way that they communicated that.
Speaker 1:We have a similar story in our culture. We have El Cuco, which is like in Dominican culture, like what they tell you that you gotta be scared of. They have, like Galipote, different kind of stories like that that things will come at you at night. So you gotta be careful.
Speaker 3:I think Danny's giving us another movie. Has the movie been made?
Speaker 2:Not yet, no, no, not yet we can talk about that after we can discuss, after this episode, the reason why he's saying that is because you guys are a production company and you guys are building out, you know, systemized to produce more movies, correct?
Speaker 3:Yeah, so the movie started from a conversation, but we decided to shoot this particular film because movie making is very difficult and you have to be strategic about it. So there are reasons that we chose to do a horror film first strategic about it. So there are reasons that we chose to do a horror film first, right. So one of the reasons is there is no expectation of a list actor in a horror film, right?
Speaker 1:Nobody expects to see Denzel and saw Right, yeah, right and well maybe Jason does, but the question did, like, filming in Savannah have like any effect on the movie itself?
Speaker 4:because you picked that spot for a reason, right, you know what was wild is Halloween ends was filming at the same time that we were filming and they actually used the house that we shot in after we oh yeah yeah, because there's so much history in Savannah so Savannah's, the I think it's the Number one most haunted city in Savannah's the number one Most haunted city in America.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So they have a rich Horror history. There's a lot of. Which is wild, because when you actually Go to Savannah it's absolutely gorgeous, right Like there's nothing scary about it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I didn't feel scared. No, no. But it's.
Speaker 1:It has so much history like plantations, the houses from the 1800s.
Speaker 4:Before that, the history goes back centuries.
Speaker 2:So the Jiu-Jitsu also is part of that community in Savannah Georgia, correct?
Speaker 3:An integral part. Yeah, I mean, have you ever heard of Carolina Golden Rice? I mean, have you ever heard of Carolina golden rice? So there's a rice. Africans were enslaved and brought to America. A lot of times we hear that word. Slave is like this kind of overarching word that makes it feel like it's a monolith. But these are people, these are artisans, these are rice, these are people with expertise in rice growing, indigo growing, architecture. These aren't just people who are wandering around doing nothing right. So when they got here and to jason's point earlier, they were left largely, you know, autonomous on these coastal islands and they were able to keep a lot of their culture. Carolina rice is a direct relationship to that rice expertise that they had. There would be no Carolina rice were it not for the Gullah Geechee Carolina golden rice, were it not for the Gullah Geechee. The Carolina golden rice is a billion-dollar industry. It's worth a lot of money, right, it's worth a lot of money.
Speaker 4:You know, not just like culinary did this country benefit from the Gullah Geechee, but because of the Gullah presence and the development of their communities down there, we actually got a lot of what we know as voodoo is attributed to that. That whole area became this beautiful mixing pot. But getting back to the question about shooting in Savannah, it's interesting because it was also very difficult. Savannah itself, even though there's a film school there, only really has one equipment shop, uh, to get film equipment.
Speaker 4:Shout out to them and shout out to them yeah, uh, uh, jml, yeah, right, yeah, benoit, shout out to Benoit, you know, but we didn't just shoot in Savannah, we also. We also decided to shoot on one of these Coastal islands Off of the southern tip Of South Carolina. There's this island called Tafusky, which also has a tremendous history, I think going back some like 9,000 years. They have artifacts Onto this island and we were the first film crew to shoot a narrative movie out there and I tell you it wasn't easy.
Speaker 2:But yeah, I mean making the movie had its trials and tribulations.
Speaker 3:Steve, listen man well. Every movie has trials, and tribulations but when you're going to an island like Daufuskie that doesn't have is not set up to deal with a production crew. They don't have that sort of infrastructure.
Speaker 1:Is it like a livable island?
Speaker 3:Oh, it's beautiful, it's 100% livable. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4:But there's no roads out there. I think there was a road.
Speaker 3:They tried to establish a road out there in like 1970 or something, but it didn't last. But road meaning like from the mainland to the island. There's roads once you get on the island, but there's no way to get to.
Speaker 2:You have to take a boat or a ferry, so you had to suit up with all the camera trimming oh, you gotta load it up by hand, you got no idea we had a whole fleet of boats.
Speaker 4:We had a marine coordinator who was just figuring out how to get things to and from. No idea. We had a whole fleet of boats. We had a marine coordinator who was just figuring out how to get things to and from and then we had like a, a key guy on defusky.
Speaker 3:Shout out to ron and um everybody on defusky. It was shooting in savannah was it had challenges, but overall man, the entire community, the entire city of savannah was super supportive super supportive and they still call and keep in touch and you know they want us to come back and do something else I think it's really cool that when you know, when people make film, the, the audience sees the final result.
Speaker 2:But there's a whole movie and journey that happened to making it, to making a film or creating a podcast or having an experience. So basically it's been a process for you guys to make the movie. But here we are. So now when we release again, February 9th 2024. We got a solid date.
Speaker 3:We got as solid as a date you can have for independent. That's dope.
Speaker 2:That's good, because not a lot of people are ready to go independent right yeah but you guys put yourself in a position to say, hey, we know the information, we have the content, we got the story, we got the support, let's start, you know, as independent and direct-to-consumer. So what's the first theater you guys are going?
Speaker 3:The first what.
Speaker 2:The theater release. Are you guys going to release a specific place, the movie?
Speaker 3:No man. So shout-out to Regal for doing the deal with us. They have been super supportive and super easy to work with. Shout-out to Mike at Regal. We are also in talks with AMC, so depending on how that goes, it'll change. You know, or add to all the places that you're able to go see the film.
Speaker 2:Also, you guys are going to have a website to go probably see it directly.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean you can follow Geechee Witch on all socials.
Speaker 1:Can we go back a little bit and kind of speak more about the process of creating the film? Yes, because you were talking about the story and then we kind of diverted. Can you go back to the script writing, the casting of the crew and how did that go about?
Speaker 3:Well, jason and I have, and Craig Jay Craig we've been at it for a long time. So that's the first thing I want to put out there To all writer-producers, producer-directors, director-writers whatever your hyphenate combo is this is not a get-rich-quick scheme man. You're going to essentially dedicate your life to this.
Speaker 4:If you're not prepared to dedicate your life, do not get into this yeah, and you, even with with time, you know, as, as our, our main tool, like the wind in our sails, the amount of money, even for an independent movie, is astronomical, and just because you have a script doesn't guarantee that you have the business savvy like the genius of phoenix j craig brought to this um to get it financed. I mean, when these guys approached me, it was december of uh or november of 2013, um, and we, we, we, pumped out a first draft of the script by by february, uh, uh, 2014, and since then, I think there was about 10 separate revisions at least, at least, at least just getting it to, to what you, what our audience is going to be able to see as the Gitche Witch today. But all of those, all of those revisions came from getting the feedback.
Speaker 2:You know, all of those, all of those revisions came from an understanding that this has to be the best it could be, you know well, but that started also with, like research, right when y'all said, are we gonna do this movie, there was a lot of research into that culture, into that experience and what.
Speaker 1:What's going on and I think you mentioned jay craig is actually oh that's yeah, jay craig, is he, he's, uh, he's gulligichi.
Speaker 2:So that was the door to that, yeah, so we.
Speaker 3:We kind of had a little bit of a cheat code because we had somebody on the team from that world. I think his aunt's name is is millicent. Um, auntie millicent is a griot, so she's an oral storyteller. Nice, so she is a repository of information. Man.
Speaker 1:Can you say?
Speaker 3:that word again Griot, griot, g-r-i-o-t, I think, is how it's spelled. Yeah, so just having access to that gave us an inside track Nice, just having access to that gave us an inside track. And kind of going back to process a little bit more, I just want to say to every producer, writer, director, watching, please pump out a producible script. Like dude, if you got Tom Cruise running through Times Square shirtless with snow falling, like that is not going to happen. Do not submit that script to anybody because that's a two million dollar day Right, and nobody's going to produce that. It has to be a producible script and I think that people don't necessarily know the difference between a good idea and a producible idea. They're not necessarily the same. That's just like. That's the first lesson. Yeah, that's right.
Speaker 3:Because people approach us all the time with stuff and it's like, yeah, it's a good idea, my man, but you know the budget is not going to work for that. You got to transform a fighting Godzilla.
Speaker 4:I can't. When we first started with this back then a decade ago, part of the constraints to the creative process was can we write something that we could make for maybe $120,000? And the first rendition of the script actually had I don't know like half or a third, as many members in the cast was even more of a limited location. But it's inside of those constraints that I think actually you come up with some of the most creative stories and, going back to encouraging directors, producers, writers, innovators who want to get into telling movies cinematically, embrace those constraints. You know, maybe you can't have Tom Cruise running through Times Square, you know, with the snow and everything, but what can you do, you know, or, most realistically, to start with this, start with something that you know you can accomplish. That's right.
Speaker 3:That's right, 100% Start there. Instead of saying, oh, I don't have enough money, what can I do with the money that I have?
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 4:Because, along the way you're going to find, you get more support because what you're picturing, what you're envisioning, is actually tangible, it has value, whereas when you're approaching it from a purely astronomically expensive or too creative of a position I don't like to say too creative, but kind of an unrealistic position that's not valuable. I can imagine that I have a million ingots of gold, but that's not real.
Speaker 3:And adding to that listen, it's your baby, I get it, it's your idea, but you've got to stay open to collaboration. Right, because filmmaking is a team sport. Right, it's not going to end the way it started. Right, that idea is not gonna look exactly. Even when we, even once we, had the, the producible script, it still changed. What you see on screen is not exactly what we had in the script. It's gonna change. We got we had jeremiah, fantastic director, who came on board and he added a ton of value. Kat Van Cleve, who was our production designer, she came in, added a ton of value. You got to be open to to these very talented, you know, smart people saying to you there is a better way to do this yes.
Speaker 4:And.
Speaker 1:I was the casting. Sorry, you were going to say something.
Speaker 4:Oh, I was just going to say, and especially, especially in a space where your budget is a main constraint, like the, the collaborative energy that you get out of it again feeds into that, that even more creative um and product yeah, I was gonna say like, how about like the casting, how was that?
Speaker 3:and castinging was tricky. Shout out to Caroline Sinclair, our casting director. She was very patient with us, she worked with the limitations that we had and she did a fantastic job.
Speaker 1:When it's a horror film at least, I picture it that you kind of have to have actors that are able to Emote.
Speaker 3:Yes, you do.
Speaker 1:Emotion that silence.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you do. Motion that silence yeah, you do. It's a lot of, you know, facial work and you know we had a wonderful cast man we steven cofield, jr trafina way, ernestine um, morrison, johnson. Johnson morrison, basil, williams, basil lance, nichols, sinclair daniel. So we had a fantastic cast that we honestly could not have and and that's what jason's saying, like people, it's gonna come right. We couldn't really afford these guys. Like these guys, this is a top-notch cast. And they came, they loved the script, they got into it and they said, yeah, we'll do it. Just, you know, can you meet this benchmark? We said, okay, we'll find a way to get there, but they could have charged us way, way, way more, because that's what they get, that's what their market value is. But they believed and they wanted to contribute and they came. Listen, it costs money, though they're going to charge you. It has to make sense for them and their agent. But you need people that believe and we had a cast that believed and you're going to see it on screen. It comes across on screen.
Speaker 2:That's amazing.
Speaker 1:Now, what can you say about, like as far as the? You said the budget was a restraint, but what other restraints did you guys encounter?
Speaker 2:Waking up every day and not jumping off a bridge. It's just crazy, right.
Speaker 3:I'll give you that part, not so much because we're professionals. We've been doing it for a long time. So the 5 am 4 am call times, that's just movie making.
Speaker 4:If you can't get up early, then you don't need to be in this business because everything is early and I mean we were bringing a lot of crew from both New York and LA in to work on this. These guys were all in it to win it. Nobody was there to just you know hang out in Savannah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, no, no, no, we're a pro-level operation, but I will tell you a challenge that you might not think about, and this is like getting down into producing nuts and bolts. You got to think about food. You got to think about where people are using the bathroom. You got to think about bugs when you're in a place like Savannah.
Speaker 4:Oh, my gosh Remember.
Speaker 3:Daufusky. Oh my gosh, ernestine, I don't know which camera it is. Ernestine, I'm eternally grateful. I am sorry. Lena Lansky, thank you, our wonderful AD, she got completely tortured on Daufusky and she, she soldiered through it. Ernestine got completely tortured on defusky and she soldiered through, and that's what I mean by having people that really support you. But if, if I had known, if we had known what defusky, what those sand fleas were like on defusky, I don't know what we could have done, but we would have tried to maybe talk to a local and figure out, because they seem to be immune to it yeah, and when we scouted it too, it was, uh, in their off season, so it was cold, it was cold, the bugs were cold, hit her on the ground we were there in march.
Speaker 3:Right man, it was just it was brutal, it brutal, so think about that how do you act when you're getting literally bit by not a bug, but literally 500? You can't, you can't, but they did it. They did it, man. They did it Wow.
Speaker 2:On the beach.
Speaker 3:We have a beautiful beach scene. But they're getting bit Because we're stirring the sand up and they live in the sand. Man, they were like what? But it's little stuff like that. That might not even think about you. Got to think about that can kill your day, because the actors ernestine and all the other actors and they could have said listen, we're not, we're not gonna do this, and we would.
Speaker 3:They would have been completely valid and we would have had to rej. And they would have been completely valid and we would have had to rejigger some stuff to make it happen.
Speaker 4:And there's also a human element involved in all of this too. I mean, bringing your crew out to the island in the first place was already okay. Like, where are we even going to put people this? Isn't like there's not like a Hilton and a Marriott up the street. We're going to stay out there for two days just getting island stuff.
Speaker 2:I thought this producer was a movie. Yeah, it really is. This was a whole movie.
Speaker 4:You know you got to as a producer, not just think about what can we afford today, but also think about how's my crew doing? That's right. These are people too and again, it's a team sport. Everyone is just as critical to making that touchdown, to getting to the end zone. If you're overvaluing one department over another department, people start to break down, going back to the biggest limitation with a lot of independent filmmaking. Really, it does come to money, but it's also how do you innovatively approach that situation? We knew we couldn't film more than 12 hours a day because at that rate, the overtime that you're paying people that would have killed us. So a matter of communicating with these guys and being able to understand. Okay, where can I jump in to help out, because the fact is we can't stay here past 12 hours.
Speaker 2:Wow, yeah, because there's legal laws to filming too, right?
Speaker 3:Well, it's overtime, you got to pay. I mean, listen, you can stay for 100 hours, can you afford it? That's the thing. You can stay as long as you want. The crew. I mean, listen, you can stay for 100 hours, can you afford it? That's the thing. You can stay as long as you want. The crew. I mean, listen, there's only so much that people can work before they burn out. And you're working in the sun, it's bugs out.
Speaker 3:I think part of the advantage that J Craig and Jason and myself have is that we came up through the ranks, so I'm not just somebody who doesn't know what's going on, came into a bunch of money and decided to shoot a movie man. I worked my way from an intern intern to pa to production coordinator. Like I've every rung of the ladder. I've been in grip department, I've been in lighting, you name it, so I know what it feels like to get burned. I had people work me for 16 hours and then run off with the money, and I didn't get paid like I know what it feels like to get burned.
Speaker 3:I had people work me for 16 hours and then run off with the money, and I didn't get paid like I know what it feels like to get burned and I said to myself when I get to the level where, where I'm the producer and I'm responsible for people, I'm going to treat people the way I wish people would have treated me back then. So we don't play around when it comes to lunch and and and money and you're never going to hear about us owing anybody money. No, we don't play those games.
Speaker 4:In Phoenix. I've been to hell and back a few times, Like this wasn't our first rodeo and you really have to keep that end goal in mind, because when you're in the trenches especially, I mean we were doing this with a minimal crew.
Speaker 3:Like minimal, crew like minimal crew.
Speaker 4:Everybody has to be on their game and every day is a challenge and if you let, if you let that get to you, if your spirit is broken, you'd fall apart. I mean, there were, there were plenty of days where you could probably cut the air with, yeah, a butter knife stance, but knowing that we shared this common goal, like we had a mission that had to be accomplished, we were going to do whatever it took to get through it and and to get through it together, you know and now you guys are on the press run and then we're on the press run, but but the last thing I'll say is on that note, um, for you new producers, whatever your position is, when you get to those above the line positions, man, you will come some days and craig would be moving for j, craig would be moving furniture, I would be lifting sandbags, jason would be folding up a c-stand, like just because you got a title, man, like it's still your crew, is your team right?
Speaker 3:you got to get in there. There's a gap.
Speaker 4:You got to fill that gap bro, if you're on the pirate ship, you better be a pirate you know exactly.
Speaker 2:It makes a lot of sense, but you're going off the boat or you're going overboard.
Speaker 3:That's it and the crew will throw you overboard. Like you don't want a mutiny man, like you think a crew won't, won't decide that they're not doing your film anymore, then that means you haven't been around long. I've seen it happen a bunch, but but you know what else I've seen happen? I've seen people work for not a lot of money because they were getting treated right. So we come with the money and we come and treat people well. So that's why you know when we ring people's phones they answer and we're proud of that.
Speaker 2:That's amazing. That's a great business mindset to have. Yeah, what?
Speaker 1:about the storyline behind this movie in particular. Can you speak on that?
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Without giving too much.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I won't give too much. So I don't want to give it without giving too much. Yeah, I won't give too much. But the Boo Hag is a story that's set in Gullah Geechee Gullah Geechee culture. The Boo Hag is a demon that will do anything to get what she wants, and she operates mainly at night, but she also does her thing in the daytime too, as other people so you never really know who she is
Speaker 1:so you can't sleep and you can't stay awake and you get you either way in the cast. Have a gulligit experience after like that's a good question. The movie because I started thinking about stuff. Now I'm feeling like that's a good question.
Speaker 3:I'm going to have to go back and take a survey. Yeah, that's a good point, man.
Speaker 4:But a nice summary of the movie. Like just to set the stage. Is this young couple coming down from Harlem? Head back to the husband's childhood family home after finding out that his mother has passed away under some mysterious circumstance. So they go down there not only to attend the funeral but also to inherit the estate, because his father wants to leave the island completely. Now, being down there the husband Asa, he's quick to be reacquainted with the island with his youth.
Speaker 4:But his wife Leah is a complete fish out of water, and when a combination of anxieties, external marital pressures and bad dreams come together, she starts to have a really difficult time discerning what is real and what is a legend. And that's where the movie really starts to sink in. And we lean into this psychological thriller element for a lot of the movie to really make the audience question whether Leia Robbins is having a mental breakdown or whether this legend of the Geechee Witch is real.
Speaker 2:So it got a lot of twists and turns this movie.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, how about sound? Because I saw a clip of the trailer and the sound was impeccable yeah, the sound, the audio engineering was yeah, shout out to
Speaker 4:max, um max was a trooper man. He one man band down there too.
Speaker 3:He is man, that guy is amazing. But again, you know we, the movie is independent in the sense that it wasn't, uh, supported initially by a studio, but the same people that the studio would use are the same people that that we use. You know, we, we've been in the business for 20 years.
Speaker 4:So and in those 20 years this is like not everything's a success. You know a lot of stuff we learn through failure. You know you learn in movie making by doing that's right and going out there. It doesn't take that many projects, especially starting out, to realize that the whole thing, all of the energy, was for naught because your sound was ruined. Yeah, sound's really really critical, right, yeah.
Speaker 3:Do you get the sound?
Speaker 1:Have you ever tried to watch a movie with?
Speaker 3:bad sound.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you've tried yeah the only, the only movies that work where sound can be janky and you're okay with it are kung fu movies or silent movies. Yeah, that's a good one, man, what this is what actionable like items would you give, like a up-and--coming writer or screenwriter or producer, or something that they can take on?
Speaker 3:Maybe we can distill it down to three. I'll take the first one A producible script. Start with a producible script.
Speaker 4:An innovative idea that actually highlights an underrepresented community.
Speaker 2:An innovative idea that actually highlights a underrepresented community.
Speaker 3:Innovative idea and the right collaborative team right together, everybody accomplished more team sport and what if you want to go? If you want to go fast, go alone.
Speaker 1:If you want to go far, take people with you and what five roles you think that that that screenwriter or producer will need to kind of get started? I know you guys have each other, but like what other, I see what you're saying like what five? Key crew members. Crew members yeah, to start, just to start out.
Speaker 4:Obviously you need a, so like a football team, yeah, yeah, so, uh. So you could. You could do something I like to call lone wolf movie making, which is like El Mariachi you go out there like Robert Rodriguez and you do everything yourself but which is actually more and more accessible these days with the smartphone, and I think you should start there. I think, if you want to be a writer, if you want to be an innovator in film and television, learn how to make a movie on your own with no money, then expanding out from there. It's very typical. Your writer is also going to be your director or producer, but you're going to need somebody to handle art department and you're going to need somebody to handle sound. Camera, too, is big, so you really are also going to need an actor, somebody to put in front of it, unless you're going to set everything up on a tripod, and you should also have a technician, like your. Cinematographer is really essential.
Speaker 2:Lighting is so important. Exactly, that's what helps embrace the camera and the look that you the ambience right.
Speaker 4:Absolutely. And so I would say, if one additional role that is really necessary is get a runner, get a really solid production assistant or somebody who's just a jack of all trades and treat them the same as everybody else because they're just as important, that's right. That person's going to make and break whatever you got going on, because while you're in it you you got to have somebody able to be working ahead of where you were or somebody working behind you. If your production designer is always one step ahead of the shooting crew and your production assistant is out there running around making sure the food is ready, making sure the truck is parked, it's a whole community man.
Speaker 2:It's a whole community for a movie.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it is that makes what Production, assistant, production designer, cinematographer sound, and you said actor. And then you're actor, director, writer, producer, you're key creative.
Speaker 1:That's amazing, awesome. Well, I appreciate you guys. What can we find out more about the movie?
Speaker 3:Yeah, instagram at the Geechee Witch. You can follow us on YouTube and you and me personally, yes you can find me on Instagram. Yeah, you can find me on Instagram at Phoenix Higgins. And yeah, tap in, man, we would love to to. The more the merrier. If you follow us, we'll follow you back. We're excited for everybody to see the film, february 9th 2024. Shout out to amc, shout out to regal.
Speaker 2:We're coming thank you, whoa there's another episode oh and jason, what tell them when you can follow you?
Speaker 4:oh yeah, you can look me up, uh, instagram. Jw shorts underscore nyc perfect um, I think I have a facebook too. Uh, jw shorts, I'm out there, I exist it's been great having you guys.
Speaker 2:It's an honor to have you. You know you guys have been through your experience in a journey. Uh, you guys inspire us through your work and you know I know you guys have a lot going that's happening that we don't know and it's time for you know the transition of growing where you guys have got going on. You know.
Speaker 3:Well, thank you to both you all and thank you to the Innovators Den no-transcript.