Ep. 44: Unleashing Creativity in Leadership and Whimsy at Work

In this episode, Maria chats with Cathy Lloyd, founder of Whimsy at Work, LLC. With over 30 years of experience in higher education, including key roles at UCSF, Harvard, UC Berkeley, and UW-Madison, Cathy shares her journey from being an internal consultant to a Chief Data Officer and beyond. Cathy opens up about her unexpected career promotions, self-doubt as a perfectionist, and how humor helped her overcome personal challenges. Cathy's story highlights the importance of self-belief, humor, and creative problem-solving in overcoming challenges. Her leadership philosophy emphasizes empowering others and fostering a creative work environment.  Maria and Cathy chat about their shared love of GSM and as always the episode ends with a guided relaxation.  

Tune in to hear Cathy's inspiring story of resilience, creativity, effective leadership and how you can create Whimsy at Work! 

To connect with Cathy: 

https://www.linkedin.com/company/whimsy-at-work-llc/

https://www.whimsy-at-work.com/

Featured in this Episode of Chakras & Chardonnay: 

Cathy’s Favorite GSM: https://www.bonnydoonvineyard.com/product/2022-galactic-stellar-manifestations-gsm-/

Maria’s recent choice: https://www.hearstranchwinery.com/product/2021-GSM-Reserve-Red-Wine

Learn more about Maria and her work at Take5.Health and subscribe to receive tips and free Guided Meditations each Wednesday. Connect with Maria on social:
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Transcript

Episode 44: Unleashing Creativity in Leadership & Whimsy at Work

 Mayes: [00:00:00] So thank you so much, Cathy, for joining me today. Thanks Maria. I'm thrilled to be here. How are you? I'm good. I'm doing great. So will you share a little bit for our listeners and your background 

Cathy Lloyd: so, um, let's see my background. So I. have always fallen into jobs and then been promoted against my will. 

So, because I never believe that I'm good enough because I'm a perfectionist. And so a lot of the development of my career has been one of, , yes, I do have it in me and the belief of others that I have it in me.

And then this sort of idea, you know, idea of leveraging strengths To in several areas. One of them is, uh, if I, if you do the via character, it's my favorite one because my, my number one strength in the via Institute, um, characteristics [00:01:00] is humor. And I grew up in a family where, um, I mean, literally we watch television together and make fun of what's going on. So. In some cases, in other cases, we're all crying and it's terrible.

You know, like it, it, it hits you the way it's supposed to hit you. But most of the time it's sort of this light approach. And I think some of that came out of the fact that I've been a depressed person since probably my adolescence. And so this, this, this fighting of the darkness, this, this being dragged down by assumptions that I'm making about the world and feeling like.

I'm lost, I'm alone, I, nobody gets me kind of thing, um, as an introvert. So, so, you know, when I started my career it was always like, I don't, you know, I'm sorry, I have no experience in this, I don't know what I'm doing and then just figuring it out, and using creativity to figure it out. And so my journey [00:02:00] to people leadership really happened also against my will, where I was, you know, in charge of teams of people, and I realized that I couldn't do it for them, I needed them to be, you know, and so, because I had already always been attracted to inspirational leaders, people who made it fun, people who And so, yeah, that's Didn't take it so seriously, but kind of opened up that space so that I could be creative and free.

That's where I went when I became a people manager. And so I suddenly realized that that was weird in my industry and higher education, like that, that a lot of people could not let go of their control. And. They, they thus didn't unlock the potential and the creativity of the people they were working with.

So, so that was the strength that led me to these different roles, et cetera, or just wanting to [00:03:00] experience more and learn more. Um, and so. Over the course of my career, I was known for things like silly, silly gifts that would make people laugh. So, for example, we had a, um, we had a, like, most valuable player, I guess, award.

And we used, uh, at Harvard, we used a pile of rocks. Because nothing says thank you like a pile of rocks. And 

Maria Mayes: This is that. 

Cathy Lloyd: And at Berkeley, I used, um, a little Jerry Garcia gnome. It was like the gnome for Berkeley had like a tie dye. I was saying piece of it. And so it was that moment because really what those moments are about are acknowledgement and being seen for the people who are getting those awards.

And so if people like really got excited about that. And so [00:04:00] then I sort of got. You know, I was a project manager. I got more into change management and changing people's belief systems. And I work in an industry right now that's going through a lot of change. Um, and so then I started working with people who are in change management.

And then we started because we were in such a huge amount of change. I, I got, I, they brought in the Berkeley executive coaching Institute and I was like, yes, finally, you know, these are my people. I see these people. Um, And so that got me more involved. As I was thinking about the later part of my career, like in my 60s, it was really about giving back, about mentorship, about coaching and helping people through that pain of, of growth, of growing into somebody who is a leader, not just a, you know, somebody who's controlling, but somebody who is That's what Opening up the possibilities and making the impossible happen.[00:05:00] 

Um, and so that was sort of, uh, like a, you know, I've always been in the place where I'm a change agent and things are happening. And so, you know, whimsy at work came out of this idea that. We take ourselves too bloody a lot of the time, and our egos and our judgment of others get in the way of possibilities and and being open to different ideas and not and and and not opening.

So, so, um, So one of the things that I love to do is sort of do exercises where people open up their creativity and get out of that rut of seeing things because I get into situations a lot where people are needing to, um, I see myself this way. And it's based on some version of their truth, but like the more they work with other people, the more they realize [00:06:00] as I did that.

It's sort of the marketplace of ideas and if it's a safe place to bring up ideas you get better ideas and people get inspired and they actually work really hard if they, you know, if they believe like Ted Lasso right. So, and Ted Lasso by the way is an incredible bit of whimsy. I mean, every little thing that happens in there is unexpected and tiny, um, things like those little biscuits he cooks, you know, for her.

It's just this massive amount of like tiny whimsies that build up to a positive, um, mindset, an open mindset, a creative mindset. Um, 

Maria Mayes: I love that. I mean, there's so much there that I think will resonate with so many. I mean, just as you're sharing that. , I immediately went back to being 22 years old, fresh outta college, being recruited of Fortune [00:07:00] 500, being thrown into this, uh, wolf pit and then getting promoted right away by, by no work of mine really yet, but just by the way things happen and, and just dropping into that.

Holy crap. What am I doing? I don't know what I'm doing. Yeah. These people are all 20 to 30 to 40 years, my senior that I'm leading. They're not going to take me for seriously. So tapping into that creativity to get through that and to get out of the head, which you did naturally. And I ended up doing too, in that circumstance, that's tapping into that sacral chakra, that place of our creativity.

And I, I love that you, you started with that because what I find is, you know, a lot of people don't think of themselves as creative beings, but we are all infinitely creative. And we all 

Cathy Lloyd: started that way for sure. 

Maria Mayes: And the thing is, oftentimes what I found in my own life is when I tap into it, it's because it was a necessity.

I was in [00:08:00] some sort of problem or struggle and how to figure out another way. Okay. Well, this doesn't work. What else can we do? So trying to come up with solutions. So it's in that problem solving that we become really creative. And I don't think people, when they hear the word creativity, they think of, you know, Painting a beautiful landscape picture, right?

Not necessarily. I just created a new solution for a problem that we thought was unsolvable. Um, so I love, I love that. And I think so many people can relate 

Cathy Lloyd: to that. There are these exercises you could do. I was telling somebody the other day to open up people's creativity. So one of the things that I'll do is like, take an object, let's say it's a tennis ball and you play a game where everybody has to say what it is.

Um, and if you pass, you're out and the first person, only one person can say it's a tennis ball. Everybody after that has to say, Uh, it's a sticky wad of [00:09:00] gum, or it's a, um, apple, it's an orange, it's a, you know, whatever, and unlocking that, you just see people's, people light up when they're doing that kind of thing.

And I, I really, you know, I think we need more of that because then we see each other and we stop like sticking with our biases and it's like, you just have to break out of that rut. How do you do it? You do it with. whimsy and play. Hmm. 

Maria Mayes: That's an awesome example. Keep, keep telling us a little bit more about this whimsy.

Like how do we, because the thing is, No matter what line of work you're in, tend to get really in our heads, really intellectualized and really then oftentimes get pulled by our ego, by our saboteurs and so darn serious to the point where it's like, it gets just [00:10:00] so tension filled because of the seriousness.

And so to bring in this play element is so huge, especially as a leader to, to be the one setting the tone, the energetic tone for the rest of the group, whether you're a leader in the family, a leader in your church, a leader in community, or a leader in the workplace, being able to free people up and liberate them to have fun by being an example, huge.

So give us some more tips on how we can do that within our lives. 

Cathy Lloyd: So, you know, it's sort of interesting because it kind of ties into the positive intelligence program in the sense that people are starting to recognize that it's little habits that are the things that remap your brain so that you so, so as a depressed person, this became, this becomes a huge.

benefit to me. So, you know, it's the, it's the glass half empty is the glass half full. And so you start to, you know, I have this thing called a whimsy [00:11:00] walk and the whimsy walk says, um, I'm walking along and I find some piece of whimsy. There's always something I go on a walk. There's a dog in a funny sweater.

There's, you know, somebody, you know, and, and I will tend to walk. with my heart shaped glasses on because then I'm just walking and everyone's smiling at me. It's the easiest thing in the world. You're like, that cost 20 bucks and now I have heart shaped glasses and I'm delivering joy out, which, which sort of boosters, you know, bolsters gratitude, helps people, um, get out of like this sort of negative mindset.

Um, And then, you know, the other thing I'll tell my clients to do is sort of, you know, get back in touch with your, I mean, I hate to say it, your inner child, cause it seems like such a, um, a cliche, but it's really about sort of that moment in life where you were without judgment. And so I will send people to go and, [00:12:00] uh, sit.

One of my favorite things to do is go and sit at a playground and watch toddlers try to walk. It's hilarious. And it reminds you in that moment that Ah, I can fall on my ass a lot and still get up and not have this feeling of just, Oh, well, I'm never going to walk. Or I could, you know, that's not how children think.

They just think, what's the next thing I can learn? I'll put this in my mouth. That was dog poop. That was a bad idea. You know, like those kinds of things. It's just like, wow. So, so those are the kinds of things. It's a habit of mind. It's a mind of going, this is really bad. I mean, a recent example for me was rented a house for two weeks to be with my family at for my 60th birthday and everything went wrong.

It rained every day. Well, thank you. So old. Anyway, um, it, it rained every day. [00:13:00] And it, and then we were all stuck inside. And then, um, about halfway through, might have been like the day after my birthday. There was a big COVID thing. We all got COVID. And I realized that like, if I were a certain type of person, I would, Think, Oh, everything's ruined.

You know, I had a terrible experience, but I didn't. And I didn't, because there were a little magical moments that I could find. There was one point where my son was playing with his cousin on this stupid like game and they were giggling. And I just thought I'm going to be present in that moment with them giggling.

And isn't that joyful? And isn't it joyful to me? It's like, it's a, it's a way that you tune your mind to what is, And what is positive, it's, you know, you're getting rid of these expectations that it's going to [00:14:00] be my 60th birthday and we're going to do karaoke did do karaoke, by the way, um, you know, and karaoke is another one.

It's like, if you're too good. They don't want you up there. They're like, no, you need to go up. We want to see you struggle. And then we're going to clap and cheer because you were brave. Right. 

Maria Mayes: I mean, for the initial part of pandemic, I remember doing, um, I think it was a neighbor of mine that got me or a friend of mine that got me into it.

But I remember being on a zoom caller to these zoom karaoke's right. And then traveling cross country doing karaoke in the car. It's how we pass time rather than kids being on video games. And it was such an amazing, I mean, there was plenty of that too. Believe me, if you're driving from California to Minnesota, you're going to have all kinds of things to keep their attention.

But I love this small, magical, Moments, the small pieces of whimsy for the habit building, you know, because as we look at, just to [00:15:00] your point of the rewiring, the brain, you know, we're not gonna remove that circuitry that's in there that has those past experiences, past traumas, past ways of being, past habits that have created.

But what we can do is through all these little things you're saying, create new circuitry that becomes so strong that it's much. Larger than that old. Um, so that we can just automatically then tap into that. So it's that habit forming. And I know with some of the work that I do, the breath work, et cetera, I think it's about a six week window from a lot of the data I looked at to where you, if you're doing a daily practice, you can start rewiring, rewiring your brain.

Cathy Lloyd: Um, that's really what positive. intelligence and positive psychology is saying right now. And I actually watched this really interesting, I think it was Simon Sinek, and he was talking about how, you know, how do [00:16:00] you know, is there an event, a moment, a metric where you know you're in love? And he said, you don't, because it's a thousand small moments that build to this feeling of trust and love and security.

Um, and so the same is true for your self perception and other things. It's, it's built of little tiny joys, if you will, happiness is built by tiny moments of joy. And that's what the awareness is, right? You're, you're drinking your wine and you. Really tasting it and you're, you're in that moment and it's just a joy, you know, 

Maria Mayes: absolutely.

Well, speaking of wine, let's pivot this conversation then, um, and talk about wine. Tell me about your favorite, uh, type 

Cathy Lloyd: of wine. I, first of all, that is a [00:17:00] very hard question for somebody like me to answer because I have a lot of loves. And I like blends. And so I was just like, oh my God, how am I going to limit it down to one?

And so I would say that You know, uh, among the white varietal or the white wines, I love like a Sauvignon Blanc that has little surprises. And I mean, not shockingly, this is not a surprise. It's like these little surprises of lots of different flavors. So, um, I do love that. I love a French Chardonnay. I like it to be light and fruity, but without fizz and without oak.

So I'm sorry about the Chardonnay. I love it. I thought, well, I'll give her the French chardonnay. I'll give you 

Maria Mayes: that. So, you know what the funny thing is, um, I love that. Um, I think, you know, with the name of this podcast, it actually really plays into a lot of, uh, what you're bringing in today, which is a whimsy, the thought that, you know, we [00:18:00] can really, you know, I mentioned earlier when we were chatting offline that.

One of my favorite, uh, teachers and trainers, Roger Gabriel, meditation teacher and the chief meditation officer at Chopra. Um, he will always say, you know, enlightenment is about lightening up. And what I found in my journey to step into some of these things is I had a hard time finding the right teachers that resonated initially, because I couldn't, I couldn't really.

They weren't living the same in my judgmental perception experience that I was in my chaotic world at the time. And I just needed some lightness and some fun to pull me in and then to get deeper. And, and so the chakras and chardonnay, um, well, it just sounds fun and it makes you, it makes you smile. And it's, um, you know, it's really partially to poke fun at the fact that we don't have to be.

So serious all the [00:19:00] time. We can look at this through the lens of a playful environment. And I actually Chardonnay, I really don't drink a lot of it. No, I drink it. It's just French. Yeah. Well, and there's, there's whole, because it has to 

Cathy Lloyd: be light. Well, there's some, I do drink reds though, but I, my reds are very like.

you know, Gradage, Syrah, Mouvedre, kind of blend, red blends are fascinating 

Maria Mayes: to me. Okay, GSM. Well, we might have to really talk more about the GSM then, because, um, it's absolutely one of my favorites. And I think the thing that you started out with saying that there's so many different options, right?

There's so many different flavors to explore and experience. And how do you, in your exploration, of wine. What's your favorite part about it? Just take me through you exploring a glass of wine through the well through the whimsy lens through the heart glasses lens 

Cathy Lloyd: glass of lens. So I [00:20:00] would say I, I really, um, let's see when I'm drinking wine.

You know, I, I'm old so I can only have like one glass at a time before like I've ruined my next day. So, you know, it's really about kind of a combination of flavors and I feel this way about my food too. It's when there's a, an unexpected or, or, kind of edge where you're like, Oh, that's fascinating. Look at that.

This is, um, or delight on the palate. You know, I was going to tell you, uh, you know, so, so, um, I do a lot of wine tasting. We'll go up to Navarro, for example, which I love and have like different ages and, and, and it kind of speaks to you in a voice, you know? And so what happens is, you know, it's gotten to the point where.

If I go to a conference, for example, and I have their [00:21:00] house wine, I'm like, here, take my, like, I don't know. No, because it's not, uh, vibrant enough. It's not alive enough. And so I think about, um, whimsy being the same kind of thing. It's not, there's no delight. I actually, my stepmother gave me this book called the Book of Delights, um, by this gentleman.

I can't, I was looking to see if I had it here. And what the story is, is that he took, um, he started on one birthday and ended on the next birthday and every day he wrote down in his journal. delights. So what delighted me today? What was the, you know, and so, and he's published it. So it's his journal of every day of delights.

And he really reinforces that idea that delights are, you know, In the moment, like you have to be there in the moment and be aware and be, you know, and so that's what wine tasting really is to me. It's [00:22:00] just, is this different from this one? How so? How did I express it through my, when it came in through my nose and then, uh, on this, you know, when you're sipping and it's coming up back and it's just, it's, it's magical.

It's delightful. I love it. 

Maria Mayes: It is. Wow. That is so beautiful. I just. There's so many pieces of wisdom that you just dropped with our listeners and I'm so appreciative and I just want to kind of circle back through them. Um, in particular, just encouraging people to take that moment each day to just, how can I add a little whimsy?

Can I take a walk and look for the whimsy? I think that's a great suggestion. Is it the delight in the palette, you know, with the wine or the food or whatever it is. Wow. Just so much opportunity to bring joy in to pull us out of habits, patterns, [00:23:00] story, all that stuff. Right. Yeah. I love that. Any final words before we say goodbye to listeners?

 If you are thinking whimsically, you are in that whimsy landscape. You're in a learning space and you're open to outcome and you are present in that moment, not worrying about the mind chatter in your head and, and sticking with that. It's a habit.

Cathy Lloyd: It's, you just build it and, and then it becomes almost impossible for you to be unbalanced because. You, you kind of take a step back and are in that moment and go, okay, this is actually what's happening. And this is, uh, this is getting a little ridiculous. I always say, and now this is happening, this is reality, this is happening now, how do I respond?

And hopefully you're doing it from your sage and, and your wisdom versus, uh, [00:24:00] your judger.

Maria Mayes: I love that. The next time shit hits the fan, so to speak. And now this is happening. I love it. Isn't that interesting? Yes. Isn't that interesting? Oh, I love it. I love the whimsy. I love the fun and let's go wine tasting.

Yes, please. All right. Anytime. Thank you so much, Cathy. Thanks, 

Cathy Lloyd: Maria. Love you. Likewise.