002: From "When Can I Drink Again?" to Alcohol Free with Shannon Morris

I'm so excited to share this interview that I did with my childhood friend, Shannon. Shannon was born and raised in Northern Virginia. She dove head first into the party scene at the young age of 13, drank through high school, and during all of college. She moved to Charlotte, NC in 2015 and took over the Queen City with her drinking shenanigans until Covid hit. Shannon has been sober since March 2, 2020 and hasn’t looked back since. Her passion involves advocating for people who can’t and helping others who struggle with substance abuse by sharing her recovery story. She loves all things involving the ninja turtles, enjoys collecting/wearing shoes, and is obsessed with 90s music and movies. She loves to travel, enjoys going to concerts, loves walking her dog Hendrix, and finds herself at peace by practicing yoga regularly. If you’d like to get to know more about Shannon and her sober journey, check out her blog at smofosho.blogspot.com.

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Transcript

 Hey guys, I am super excited. We just had a real big technical difficulty. So sorry we're a little giggly. We just recorded the whole intro, but we weren't recording, so we're still trying to get past this. But I am so excited for this interview today because this is one of my best friends, Shannon Morris.

We have known each other. For at least 29, 30 years, guys, since we were little kids in elementary school.  We are talking today about her journey of becoming alcohol free. We were just chatting about how, where we were raised, we were raised in Northern Virginia, we were products of the nineties and two thousands, and partying and drinking as a teenager was totally normal.

 It just was a thing, right? Everybody was doing it. We started drinking at a super young age and it didn't seem like a weird thing or an abnormal thing. And as you move through your life and that you just keep doing that and you don't really question it, things can become out of control. Like I was just telling Shannon, there have been times where I.

Just quit drinking because I like wanted to have a baby really bad. And when I would drink a lot and I would smoke a lot of cigarettes. And I knew if I was gonna quit smoking cigarettes, I had to quit drinking. And that was the thing that made me quit, for a year. Like I wouldn't have a sip of alcohol.

So I think that it's very interesting to see how. The way we were raised and the way that our childhood, our childhoods were, and what led to us then. And Shannon was just talking too about the binge drinking in America, how this leads and affects our adult life. And Shannon, I want you to just, sorry, go a l a little bit backwards about what we were just talking about of, how you feel in society now with all of this drinking and how it was hard to.

Make that decision. Yeah, for sure. And like you said, like. How you wanted to quit, to have a baby. And I'm sure like in your head you were like counting down the days to like when you could drink again. And I did that a lot too. I quit sometimes in college. I would take like breaks.

And it was for like certain reasons, it wasn't because I wanted to quit drinking. It was because like, oh, I'm taking a medication so I can't drink. It's not good to drink on it or, Hey, I wanna start like working out more, so I'm gonna take a couple weeks off because if I was drinking all the time, there's no way that I would work out.

And it's just so hard because yeah, you said in society, like it's such ingrained in our culture, it's such a normal thing. It's considered, a social activity like we are and we're humans, so we're very social creatures and we like to be a part of a group and like a community, and we wanna feel like we're.

We're in. Yeah. Like we're involved with people. And when everyone's doing the same thing and you're not, it feels really, you feel left out. You don't feel like you're part of that group anymore.  So definitely it was really hard to quit.  But yeah, there just came a moment in my life where I was what is this actually doing for me?

Is anything positive coming out of me doing this other than. Being social or like having fun or,  letting loose. Like you can do all of those things without alcohol, but it's really hard to wrap your mind around it when everyone around you is doing it. Yeah. And when you've been doing it for such a long time, like you're in our thirties now and,  we were also saying too We just hope this episode if you're listening to this and you've recently become alcohol free or you've really been considering it, and you're going over in your head if you want to or not.

We were saying that alone is probably already a pretty good indicator that you should at least give it a shot. But, It's very hard. I think when you have something that you've been doing for such a long time, that's just a normal part of your life, and to be able to then just cut it out is incredible and like I said guys, cuz I wanna give her the proper introduction since we missed the recording the first time.

But this is my dear friend Shannon Morris. She lives here in Charlotte. We know each other though, back from Northern Virginia, from kids. And she's just a super incredible person. And this has been an awesome journey for her. And she's actually inspired her older sister to become alcohol free. Who, they were like a duo back in the day with the partying and.

That was just what we did. And then of course you go to college and it's even more intense, right? Because Yeah. It's just, it is what it is. Again, it's the normal. Yeah. And like we were saying, we both came from single mother households. We had a lot of freedom as kids, even as kids in, as young kids, like in elementary school, we had a lot of freedom and so we had to parent ourselves in a way.

And of course, when you a lot of times can do whatever you want. You don't always make the best decisions, and so we're just gonna dive into all of that stuff. And so we have a few bullet points we're gonna go over and then we're just gonna chat about all of them. So the first question, Shannon, was what was your drinking routine like before?

And, looking back now, she is three years sober guys. Her, what's the alcohol free date March. Yeah. March 2nd, 2020 is when the first day, like I, I stopped March 1st. I was hammered drunk. Yeah. And March 2nd, I was like, I can't anymore. So yeah, I was probably still a little drunk from the night before.

But you, yeah. You were done. So yeah. So tell us what your drinking habits, routine, what it was like, and then what was basically. The decision, like how did you make the decision to be like, I'm just done with this forever. I'm never doing this again. Yeah. So my drinking routine was, I was very much a binge drinker.

I started at a very young age since I did have an older sister and I hung out with. You and a lot of her older friends, I was always invited to those parties. The first drink I took, I was 13 years old. I was on a cruise ship. It was a Smirnoff Black geez, tasted like gra great Chapstick and it was delicious.

And then yeah, after I like literally never really stopped from there, like from eighth grade on, I was like, I drank, which is so crazy to think I can't imagine like my nephew Lyric when he turns 13 taking a drink. That's so weird to me. Yeah. But it was really normalized and especially in my family.

Like I came from a family who. Addiction runs in our blood and drinking was like a very normal thing. I saw my parents and my aunts and uncles drink in front of me like no big deal. We were very famous for having the parties ourselves, like New Year's parties. Huge. My sister had a sweet 16 with a keg.

Like it was, we were the party crew. My friends always called like my mom, like the cool mom because she let us party. So yeah, that started what became normal for me and it lasted until, yeah, I turned 30 years old. In high school. It. Elevated. And I had moved to a small town, so like literally one stoplight.

My graduating class was like 80 to 90 people. So all there was to do was have field parties and get drunk. So that's what we did. I was like, dubbed the cool freshman. I drank with all the seniors. Again, I was the party house and it, to me, like I never questioned it.

There was not one thought that went through my mind like, is this. Weird. You almost wore it as a badge of honor. 100%. I'm right off the, I This is where we do the parties. Yeah, we can drink and it's okay over here. Yeah, like I could drink like grown men under the table and thought I was cool.

Wanna see how fast I can chuck the spear? I can chuck 10 more after this. It was like, yeah, like a badge of honor, which is gross to me looking back on it, it's like sick. If you look back, you're such this like beautiful, bright, young, shining star and that was like the route and Yeah.

Yeah. And then college didn't change much. Elevated more again. Especially I went to college in Myrtle Beach. So that's a party town in itself. So yeah, just always drinking. I wasn't into any other drugs really. I smoked a lot of marijuana. But it was mostly just binge drinking, like hardcore binge drinking.

And I was the person who would stay up for hours. Like I was on Coke, but I wasn't, yeah, I was just drinking. Yeah. And like you said, smoke. One to two packs of cigs always. Cuz again, that's a social thing too. Like it goes hand in hand. Yeah. And like I didn't start smoking until someone just like randomly gave me a cigarette and I was like, oh, this is cool.

We're like hanging out outside, we're chatting like, I like this. Yeah. And then I just became a chain smoker somehow. I didn't even like cigarettes. No. But I was like, this is fun. Like it. Put me in another group of people, yeah. And when you're drinking, it like goes together. And then when you do it enough, you, when it's a trigger, when you a cigarette.

Yeah. Then it's like an actual full blown addiction. And you don't even know like how it became, but you're like, whatever. How drunk. Yeah. Then I started smoking on like road trips and stuff cuz I felt weird without having cigarettes in the car. And I was like, what is wrong with me? I guess I smoke and then I was just like, whatever, I smoke cigarettes now too.

Cool. Life is going in such a great deal to the list.

So yeah, that was my drinking routine and then I moved to Charlotte and that's, at that point I was in my mid twenties. Nothing stopped me. I was still drinking. I still could get away with it, cause I was still in my twenties. Yeah. But there were days when I wouldn't go to work because I was too hungover.

I would just make an excuse. The blackouts, I started blacking out more. The hangovers were getting worse. Yeah. It was, it just started turning into not fun. Like I used to think it was like fun and I was having fun. And I thought I was having all these great experiences, but really I was just going to bars and getting hammered and like meeting random people who I would then dub like my friends, but I would really never see them again.

And I was like, is this fun? Am I really doing? Like activities. Cause I'm not, I wasn't doo anything. I was just getting hammered. Yeah. At different bars. And like even when I traveled me and spending all my money. Yeah. Money I didn't even have, and I'd be like, you want a shot Uber? Yeah. It's on me, everybody.

Yeah. Because like you're, you think that you're like the life of the party and you have all these like friends who think you're awesome and they're like, No, they just think you're awesome at the time cuz you're buying them booze. So it's, yeah. And they're drunk too. And they're wasted. They're not gonna freaking remember it tomorrow.

Like it's just so stupid. Everything's so stupid. It's a lot. And then even when I traveled, like I was spending my money to go to a different place to do the same shit I was doing here. Yeah. And like I never, sometimes I would like book fun things to do, but then I was always too hungry over to do them, so I was like, It just doesn't, it never made sense.

Like now looking back on it, clearly when I was in it, I was like, I'm having a great time. Yeah. But yeah, looking back on it, it was just a lot of wasted time. Yeah. And money. So yeah, that is, that was me in a nutshell, just your typical definition of a binge drinker. And just like I, a lot of people don't like to call themselves like alcoholics or addicts, but I am an addict, like through and through, and that's with anything like candy coffee.

Anything. I'm always like, go big or go home. Yeah. If I'm drinking coffee, I'm gonna have maybe three glasses. Do I need three cups of coffee? No. But now it's my only vice, so I'm gonna freaking amp it up, so I'm drinking it. I'll eat a whole bag of gummy bears. Why? I don't know. But they're there in front of my face, so why not eat the whole bag?

Yep, that is me. I'm just an addict. Yeah. And I don't have a problem with calling myself that, but a lot of people don't like to say that because it is a stigmatized word. But yeah, that's who I am through and through. And any regrets? Tons. But also, they led me to where I am now. The biggest regrets are definitely drunk driving.

It makes me like sick to think about how many times I got in the car, just wasted. Not thinking of anybody but myself and not really even thinking of yourself. I'm not thinking of myself either. Not thinking of any consequence, but what scares me the most is I could have killed. Somebody else, not just myself.

And there were actually times when I would wake up and literally turn on the news to see if I like was on the news, wanted for murder. Yeah. Because I was like, how the fuck did I get home? Yeah. There were times when I would look at my car and. It was messed up. And I was like, cool. Like I hit something.

Like what? Yeah. And you didn't even remember it. You didn't say it. Yeah. Didn't even remember. So like that is one of my biggest regrets. And then also just like putting myself in clearly crazy, dangerous situations like going home with people I shouldn't have gone home with. Just really crazy stuff that like, sorry, there's a bug somewhere.

That yeah, I would wake up sometimes in people's beds naked, like not remembering what happened and like a lot of sexual abuse situations and just situations that I put myself in. Clearly at the time I was probably consensual, but like afterwards I'm like, I wouldn't have done that if I wasn't drinking.

So like a lot of re regrets there and just, Yeah, just so much time and money wasted. And then like the rock bottom, a lot of people don't have rock bottoms, but I definitely did. I had been in a very toxic relationship. There was a lot of substance. Abuse going on, a lot of like mental illness stuff happening.

And I luckily got out of that situation and It propelled me into a deeper depression though, because then I was like, out of it, I didn't know what to do. I was lost. Yeah. And so I started drinking more and then I started smoking weed again a lot more. And that just led me to make more mistakes and it was just, it was getting crazy viral.

Yeah, it was a big spiral. And then I ended up going to a trip to New York City with my friend. He was my friend for over 10 years. I met him in college at Coastal Carolina and anytime we got together, like it was a party, like we were gonna rage like he was. Crazy. And it was just, I always thought I was having a good time with him.

Looking back on it, we were just stupid and insane. But that was the trip that literally I was like, I can't do this to myself anymore. I blacked out like that whole time. Like I honestly don't remember any of that trip. I, he left me there stranded in New York City, like left on the plane without me.

So my best friend, Caitlin, got me up. Plane ticket back to Charlotte. And on that plane I drank more cuz I wanted to just forget what happened in New York City cuz I didn't really know what happened. Yeah. And you were probably feeling like complete shit. So you're like hair of the dog. Yeah, felt awful, felt disgusting, didn't shower, like I was just, oh, I was gross.

And the guy next to me, I felt so bad for him. I was talking his ear off about nonsense and I could like, I could tell, on his face like, Shannon, shut up. What are you doing? Yeah, just kept going. I was like, whatever. Drank so much Prosecco. Like I was like got home, FaceTimed my aunt, FaceTimed my mom, having a great time.

And then that night I was like, what? I was drunk again and I was like, why am I doing this again to myself after I just had a terrible time in New York City. Like I was at that point drinking like probably four to five times a week. Yeah. And it was like, Normal. Like I could take down a bottle of Prosecco easy.

Like nothing. Nothing like, yeah, two bottles a night, I could do it. So yeah, I woke up the next day and I had like bruises all over my body from New York City felt like shit again. My eyes, they just looked dead. There was no sparkle. And I wasn't happy. I was like, none of what I'm doing in my life is making me happy.

Like every single situation that I've ever had that was negative alcohol was involved. Yeah. And I was like, it's just time. And like my dad, when I was little, he had addiction problems and that's what he eventually passed away from at a very young age when he was 32. And so I always thought if I don't.

Do this now. Like I'm literally gonna end up like him. Yeah. And I didn't wanna die. And so that's when I was like, I have to do it. Yeah. And I don't care what other people are gonna think. I don't care if I'm never gonna hang out with anybody ever again. I have to do this. Yeah.

Yeah. That's so happy. That's how it all happened. It's amazing and it's so inspiring and you're so real. Like I already, in my head, I'm like, I wanna do a solo podcast, really just talking about this subject because it has so many layers. It has so many levels, and. And a lot of people wouldn't admit that, like they would regularly black out or go home with strangers that they, would wake up the next morning.

And so thank you number one, just for being so open and honest about it, because hopefully this will help people, oh yeah, it's just, yeah. And so we already did the, How long had alcohol been a part of your life? A very long time. And yeah, you had tried to quit before. You said like in college, you'd have these little spells of Hey, I wanna, while I'm on this medication so I can't be drinking on this, or I wanna work out, and obviously I'm not gonna hop up outta bed the next morning to work out if I'm super hungover.

And so what I wanna touch on next is, What has changed or how has your life changed now? You are three years into this. You, I'm sure, have seen so many amazing positive changes in your life, and so what are some of those that you can chat about? Yeah. Oh man. Change is abundant, like literally.

Everything, every aspect of my life has changed. And I'll just start off with the physical changes. It's incredible. So when I was drinking, like I had terrible heartburn, I had acid reflux. I was literally taking a neol every single day for that reason. Completely gone after I stopped drinking, gone just.

It doesn't even exist anymore unless I eat like too much pizza or something, but other than that, gone, don't have to take a pill every day for that. My weight was always fluctuating. I would always be like one 20 to all the weight to my heaviest, which was one 40. And I was just like blown up.

I was always bloated. My cheeks were always like, really? Chunky. I always had a lot of gut issues. Yeah. Yeah. I always had gut issues, like just not okay with my stomach, not going to the bathroom regularly. Just not good, not healthy. I was told I had high cholesterol when I was 26 and I was like, huh.

I was like, does that even happen to 26 year olds? What do you mean? They're like what are your hobbies? I was like, what do you mean? I drink, I don't exercise. I eat really shitty food and I drink all the time. You're saying that's not normal? Yeah, so all of those like completely changed.

My complexion got better. My eyes came back. I look actually happy in my eyes. My weight has stayed the same now. I'm a normal weight for my height and my age. I have more motivation to stay healthy since I feel so good and I look better. I just have the motivation to keep that going. So I do more exercising.

I walk more and it's not like I'm like a huge, cardio buff or I'm moving the dream every day. I just do things that like, make me feel good. So you move your body? Yeah, I move my body. Yeah, I take lots of walks, I do a lot of yoga. And then some days I give myself the opportunity to rest cuz we all need rest too.

And my gratitude has. Been exponential. Like I am so grateful for everything in my life now. I didn't even know that like gratitude was a thing when I was drinking, cuz I was always just like sad or hungover or blaming my problems on someone else or oh, it's their fault that this happened to me.

Yeah. When really everything was my fault. So yeah, my gratitude, I just make sure to like, Not even. Sometimes I do write it down. I have a gratitude list, but not even if I don't write it down, like just mentally take it in. Sometimes, like especially on my walks, like I'm like, you know what? I'm grateful for these trees surrounding me that give me the freaking oxygen to breathe and the paper.

Yeah, to journal my thoughts. Like it's just like little things that I never noticed before, cuz I was. Never present at all in any moment. Cause I was masking every emotion that I had. I just, yeah. I don't take anything for granted anymore, awesome. And the mental effects are just, I've always suffered from anxiety.

Especially in my early twenties, that's when it started. And I always thought that drinking helped my anxiety, which of course it helps for a little bit. The night you don't feel anything anymore. Yeah. But then it's just tenfold the next day. Especially hungover, we call it anxiety because it's, oh yeah.

You wanna freaking kill yourself. You really do. The hangover. Anxiety is the word. Oh my gosh. It's awful. Without a doubt. Yeah. Like hand Xanax. Immediately. Yeah. That's how I felt and I would take it cuz I was like, I can't deal with this. You can't live with the consequences of my actions.

I literally can't deal with them, so I have to take a pill to deal with it. Yeah. So let's start up another addiction. Why not? Yeah. So it's just like a vicious cycle. Seriously. So mentally I am on another stigmatized thing is antidepressants or medication that help you, but I am on one and it's helped me immensely.

Also with therapy. So both of them combined have like literally changed my life. And yeah, I like hardly have panic attacks anymore. And when I do, I can count on one hand how many a year? When it used to be like a monthly if not daily thing. Yeah. So yeah, both mental and physical changes are like insane.

I could go on forever about it cuz it's just like everything got better once al once I took alcohol outta my life. And it's, I wanna bring up the point, a couple things you said, actually, like how it used to be everything was everyone else's fault. And it makes sense because it's like you're not even taking responsibility for your own life, let alone.

Things that are happening to you or whatever. And so when you're in that mindset and it is, and you're just not clearheaded, you're just like foggy brain, foggy head all the time. I remember when I did go a year without just touching alcohol because I was doing my I V F and stuff. It was like, holy crap, my mental capacity and capability.

I was like, I have been dumbing myself down for so long. Like it is insane the thoughts that I'm thinking and like the deep. Stuff that like is going through my brain and it was almost like too much sometimes. Cause I was like how am I like thinking this clearly and this quickly and like all of these different things.

I was pregnant with Ila. It was like right when I got pregnant with Ila. All this stuff started happening. Alcohol had been outta my life for over a year at that point. And it was like, wow. And it really does. For people who maybe have tried to quit and then, they like quit for a week or like a month, I truly believe it takes several months to, it does really feel like how you're gonna feel without it in your life.

You really gotta give it give it three to four months to just, yeah, I'd say at least like 90 days. Like that three month mark is when I really started to see like the physical effects, like my face and like the weight and like everything. And then, yeah. And your mind is like, Readjusting the whole time.

So you really do need to give it like time. Yeah. Because you're so emotional too in those first three months. Like it's just like all the waves of everything coming at you, like things that you haven't felt for years, allow yourself. Yeah, you've been pushing it down with the alcohol, so it's all coming out.

So yeah, you definitely, you're right. I would give it at least like three to six months to see the actual true effects that it can give someone. Yeah. And then I wanted to ask you, cuz we talked about like, how it was just such a normal thing and in your family and in your group, your circle of friends, your social circle how did people, for you personally, how did people respond when you just made this like, this is known, this is what I'm doing, I'm cutting this out.

Like how was it perceived from people? I had there were a couple different reactions. So the people who were like closest to me were obviously like in super big support of it cuz they had known like how I felt for a long time. And I was sad, like I wasn't my. Myself anymore. And I had always said yeah, I drink too much.

I really wish I could quit, blah, blah, blah. So the people who, like I had already expressed those feelings too, like they were very like proud of me and happy and were just in support of it. And then there were some people who. Quite sadly, we're like, okay, like sure, you always say that you're gonna do that and then we'll see you at the bar in a couple weeks.

Like a boy who cried wolf scenario type situation. Yeah. Which like, I don't blame them because I had many times before I being like, I'm 20 bang pain. But those people, most of them, like they were my party friends, so a lot of them, like I don't even talk to them anymore. I don't even remember who they honestly were.

. Yeah. But for the most part, like I had tons of support. And that's like a huge thing when becoming sober or when trying to quit anything. Like you need a community, you need a support system. Even if like you don't have friends or family who are gonna support you, or you just don't have friends and family in general, like you can find a community, you can find someone like even therapy, like someone to just bounce. Ideas off of, or like thoughts or a journal, like a journal helped me get all of my feelings out if I didn't have anyone to talk to or if, I was unhealthily, self isolating myself. Cuz I did get sober during covid, so it was like, Crazy.

Yeah. But yeah, community is like such a big thing. And luckily I had a really strong support system behind me, especially like my sister. She's always been supportive of me and like this, she always says, the day before I got sober, I literally told her, I was just like, this is just who I am. Like, I have to stay this way because this is who I am.

I don't know any other like way to be. And she's Are you honestly listening to yourself? Did you just hear what you said? You said you, you are this way. Yeah, you're not a drink. Like you don't have to drink, like you can be someone else. There's a better version of you. Yeah.

There's someone like you can become anything you don't have to say this like drunk person that you think that you are. Like, I always thought I had to have the alcohol to like, Be fun or be funny and cool and like the Shannon that everyone knew, but really I'm like way funnier without alcohol.

I was so dumb and loud and thought I was funny, but like looking back, I was like, Ew, no, you're the most annoying person. Not funny at all. Yeah. Can't even put a sentence together. Okay. You're not funny. You're cracking yourself up, but not really. You're the only one who thinks you're funny, Shannon. Oh, yeah.

Yeah, I did have a lot of that support. They were of course, you're always gonna be those people who are like, nah. Yeah. Or Ask the really like rude and dumb questions. Like when I say, oh, I don't drink, or no, like when someone offers me a drink and I'm like, oh no, like I don't drink. Or like even say, even not saying I don't drink, but saying no to an alcohol beverage.

People are like, huh? Like they get so confused and. Yeah. I would just say to those people like, don't do that. Yeah. It's really rude. Yeah. When people ask me why, like, why don't you drink? Huh? Like what? And they act surprised. I don't get mad anymore because I used to be that person.

Like I used to be like, huh, you don't drink. Like what a loser town. Yeah. But yeah, it's a very, yeah, it's huh? It's a very personal thing and a lot of people don't wanna tell you why they don't drink, and sometimes there's not even a reason. They just don't freaking drink. So just say, okay, cool.

And offer them another beverage, like a water or a soda or a mocktail or something. You don't need to know why they're not drinking. They're just not drinking. Yeah. And then another one that I get is what do you do for fun? And I'm like, what are you doing for fun? Yeah. How about we reverse that question because it's gonna be hard for you to tell me.

Yeah. You're like, actually you're gonna be like, are, do this? Yeah. Are you having fun? Tell me how you feel tomorrow, buddy. Yeah. Call me tomorrow. Oh, you won't be able to, you'll feel like death. Exactly. And for anyone, cuz I just wanted to. Give you the opportunity to give your club a shout out for anyone who is local to Charlotte, cuz I know that they have been awesome.

Like just an awesome support system to have during this journey for you. The Counterculture Club, right? Yes. I actually have their pen right here, counter. Yay. Yeah, they are awesome. It's it's not more, it's more of a social club than like a treatment, like AA or something like that. But it's just to be able to meet people and do things without alcohol involved.

Some people in the club like aren't completely sober. They're just like, Sober curious, or they only drink like sometimes. But when you're at the events in Counterculture Club, you cannot drink. Like you're not, that's the point of the club. Like we're doing activities and showing people that you can have fun without drinking.

A lot of the people are like sober though in the group. There's people who have been sober for 10 years in the group, so it's like really cool. To just be able to talk to those people and get their take on stuff and just be able to have like-minded people around and not be surrounded by, the normal cultural drinking crew.

Yeah. That's awesome. Girl, I love you. I love you. Thank you so much for this, and yes, everyone you can. Fine. Shannon, on Facebook if you have any questions, Shannon Morris, I'll also put her information on in the show notes. And we'll put the information for Counterculture Club as well if you guys wanna check them out.

And this was amazing. I feel like we have more to talk about, so we may do like a part two to this. Yeah, I do just wanna say if you are questioning yourself, there probably is a reason for it. So definitely just trust your gut, give yourself grace. Definitely start a routine, like a routine is what I like live for now.

It just keeps you on track, especially like mentally, so your thoughts aren't just like going crazy. And again, like a support system, find a community and yeah, just talk it out. Yay. I love you so much. I love you so much. Thank you for having me. Yes. Thank you for doing this. I am. Yeah, of course.

All right. Thanks everybody. Hi.