Chris Twiggs: Mental Endurance and Trail Tales with Guest Host DW Burge

Ever wondered how marathoners conquer both their physical and mental battles? Join us for an illuminating conversation with Chris Twiggs, an experienced marathoner and chief training officer at Galloway Productions, accompanied by our special guest host, DW, a runDisney Icon. Together, they share invaluable tips on running, wellness, and mental health. Chris provides practical advice for athletes, while DW opens up about their transformative "whole self summer" amidst the unforgiving Texas heat, focusing on customized training, clinical anxiety therapy, and the art of cooking from scratch to improve nutrition.

Experience the raw and honest discussions on the complexities of anxiety and the paramount importance of self-care. Through personal stories, we uncover how anxiety often hides behind success and perfectionism, highlighting the necessity of therapy and aligning personal goals with genuine self-fulfillment. Chris also takes us through his awe-inspiring journey of completing the Hard Rock 100, detailing the mental and physical endurance needed for ultramarathons and the unique challenges of trail running. 

We celebrate the strides towards diversity and inclusion in the Hard Rock ultra running community, discussing initiatives like pregnancy deferral policies and acknowledging indigenous land use. Dive into the benefits of customized training with insights from Chris’s collaboration with Jeff Galloway. Plus, we get excited about the themes for the next Princess Half Marathon and share fond memories of friendships and fun moments in the running community. Whether you're a seasoned runner or just starting out, this episode is brimming with inspiration and practical insights to fuel your fitness journey.

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:01

Welcome to 3, 2, 1, go the podcast. I'm John Pelkey.

Speaker 2: 0:05

And I'm Carissa Galloway, and we're bringing you stories from start to finish to keep the everyday athlete motivated to keep moving towards the next finish. Today we are joined again by the always popular and super knowledgeable about all things running, racing and training. It is Chris Twiggs. And not only is Chris a member of the very small, perfect Disney Marathoners Club that's right he's run them all and he's the youngest person to do that. He is a very, very fast marathoner, an ultra marathoner. He's the chief training officer alongside Jeff Galloway at Galloway Productions. So excited to have Chris here. And oh, why am I talking first? Because we have a surprise it's our first 3-2-1-Go guest host. Welcome to them. I am not a princess, it's Run Disney Icon DW.

Speaker 3: 0:56

Thank you, carissa. I am so grateful for the opportunity to spend some time with you and Chris. He is not only an amazing human being, he's a great running coach and, as a client of Galloway's Customized Training, he happens to be my running coach. Chris always gives practical, easy to follow advice that keeps me on track, and I know he'll do the same for your listeners.

Speaker 2: 1:22

No pressure, Chris, but yes, he always delivers. Today, on Healthier you, we're going to talk about why runners need calcium and answer a listener question about none other than the 2025 Princess Half Marathon Weekend themes. Thank you for listening and sharing. We love seeing your IG posts. We love your emails. Thank you, Thank you, and let's do this. Three, two, one go.

Speaker 2: 1:59

I wrote this in. I wrote holy heck, DW, I'm so excited that you're here. The funny thing is, John doesn't even know that you're here. He was like so into. He said and this is like a joke in Weston and I's house right now like he's been knee. He was knee deep in packing for like literally two weeks, and that's what happens when you're 60 years old it takes you two weeks to pack and get ready to leave. So I didn't want to bog him down with the fact that he was going to have a guest host. So I don't know how he feels about this, but I'm thrilled that you are here. You are first ever like guest host full episode. Last time we saw you was springtime. Surprise. How have things been for you since we wrapped up the season?

Speaker 3: 2:39

Things have been fantastic, but if I can be honest with you, this is just you and me. No one's listening.

Speaker 2: 2:46

Nobody.

Speaker 3: 2:48

This is not my favorite time of year. I am not a summer person.

Speaker 1: 2:52

No.

Speaker 3: 2:52

The heat, the bugs it's just not my jam. The only beach I want to visit is the one outside of Epcot, on my way to get a piece of pizza from the window. So I have really decided to just double down this summer and focus on my health and my wellness and becoming the best version of me I can be.

Speaker 2: 3:15

Is that like cause? Like what was it Two years ago? We were hot girl summer, so that's like you've retained that to be like that hot girl summer, but like whole self summer.

Speaker 3: 3:23

Whole self summer. There we go Hashtag whole self summer. We're going to start trending on whatever we trend on now Instagram.

Speaker 2: 3:31

Okay, I love that because I think we do it Sometimes for the summer. We're going and we're doing and we forget about self. So what have you done for this hashtag? Whole self summer? Besides, I'm guessing, stay inside a little bit, because heat and bugs, hopefully, are not a problem inside.

Speaker 3: 3:48

Heat bugs. In Texas we also have dust storms in the summer, so you literally can't breathe outside, even though it's 110. So to work on my running, I joined Galloway Customized Training, so Chris Twiggs is my actual running coach. I am a paying client and it has just changed the way I train for races. I will actually be taking on some new challenges. My very first Ragnar, more local race. Mixing it up a little bit, I am focusing on nutrition. I am a proud member of healthier you, working on my 30-day restart, but also teaching myself how to cook, knowing exactly what's going into my food. So if I want pizza, I'm making pizza from scratch, so I know what's in the dough, I know what's going in top and I have a history of self-sabotage. So I engaged a therapist as well to make sure that I'm not only physically healthy, but I'm mentally healthy, mentally healthy.

Speaker 2: 5:01

I'm so proud of you because I think, like I always say, in Healthier you and this is not related to Healthier you, but it's like looking at what we eat or having to journal is vulnerable. It makes us feel like, oh, I didn't want to see those pieces of me, I just wanted to distract myself with shiny things and like, keep going. What have you noticed? Like, how do you feel like you've changed since you started the process? I'm guessing the therapist might be the most sort of dramatic area of change, because maybe that's something you haven't done before or hadn't done in a while. I don't know.

Speaker 3: 5:29

Well, to be transparent and share the whole story here. When I decided to do DOPE this year 2024, I was experiencing some medical issues at the time heart palpitations, gut issues, constant fatigue. The big issue was what I was perceiving as memory loss, short-term memory, I know I ran wine and dine. I can't tell you a single fact about what happened on that course, other than maybe a few interactions with the people. And so when I committed to Dopey, my husband committed me to understanding what was going on with my body and through a series of tests we learned it's nothing physical.

Speaker 3: 6:26

I was actually diagnosed with clinical anxiety, and so clinical anxiety is not I have a big presentation at work tomorrow. I'm nervous. It is a heightened and persistent anxiety that starts to affect memory, physical ability. I was what they classify as high function, meaning I could suppress it. I could get through my day. I'm extremely successful at work and at life and I'm running these races. But it has a way of taking its toll, and for me that was memory loss.

Speaker 3: 7:12

I am very fortunate it seems to be getting better with therapy. I don't need medication. I can continue to be the person I've always wanted to be. I can continue to be the person I've always wanted to be and, with the help of therapy, I'm actually better balanced. Now. I'm learning how to say no or I don't want to, or hey, I would like to do this, and so I'm actually really looking forward to next race season. I have always said that I am alive today because I found running Not just living, not with a heartbeat, but living the best life possible and the structure of Galloway, Customized Training and Chris Twiggs, the benefits of nourishing my body properly, combined with this ability to talk to somebody and learn skills that I didn't have before, I'm at a new level of joy that I didn't know was missing.

Speaker 2: 8:19

Well, I'm so, so proud of you and I'm so thankful for you sharing, because I know that is probably not easy. Maybe on one hand it feels like a little bit of a weight, but on the other hand it seems challenging. So I kind of have two questions. I'll save one for later. The other one is did your therapist or have they given you coping mechanisms or like things that you could share, like maybe two nuggets where it's like they taught me this and maybe somebody listening might be benefited by?

Speaker 3: 8:49

Absolutely so. I grew up in a world where we didn't really talk about emotions, right, so in my head I couldn't tell the difference between anxiety and depression, and because I wasn't sad, anxiety never hit my radar right. I'm highly functioning, I'm successful, I enjoy spending time with friends. There's nothing wrong. Well, anxiety shows up in different ways. Yes, there are physical triggers.

Speaker 2: 9:26

If you saw, inside out too, I'm just seeing like orange person with a big orange smile here, like popping.

Speaker 3: 9:32

I want to like pop it up on the corner there's a scene in the movie where anxiety starts to glitch out and it's a twirling tornado and Riley just literally doesn't know what to do next. It's those moments where your body just freezes up or your mind frees up. Like I said, with me it was memory loss. We did a little extra digging. Perfectionism, the need to be perfect at everything, is a sign of anxiety. You're making up or overcompensating for some sort of shame. So understanding what's at the root of that helps me deal with my anxiety. Overpreparing even as I was getting ready for this conversation with you, my gut instinct was to memorize a script, to learn every word. I think you said it best. I have the opportunity to come today and have a conversation with a friend. I don't need to prepare for that, and when you're not stressed out, trying to be perfect in every scenario, you get to enjoy the little things in life. You get to do more, and it just makes everything better.

Speaker 2: 10:59

So good, so you would obviously recommend therapy Now, do you do it online? Do you go to someone? What's your preference?

Speaker 3: 11:07

I've been working with somebody online. It allowed me to find a therapist who I identify with, who I'm comfortable with. Everybody needs to figure out what's right for them, though.

Speaker 2: 11:23

It's so interesting to say about memory loss because I, when I had Claire, it's extremely like high stress situation, like I just had had to at seven months pregnant. The company that I worked for was a very small company. They were like we're closing the company or you're buying it, so obviously, like I had to buy it, because you can't go get a job at seven months pregnant. Like I just blah, blah, blah, blah. So I was dealing with that and then I I'd never had a kid before. I didn't know what you're supposed to do. I was my ex-husband's. There's a whole barrel of worms there. But my point is that, like she was born in May, I'm sure I had postpartum depression that nobody ever addressed, but I struggle to remember her first Christmas. Like all I can see in my mind is like a picture that we've taken. Most of the other stuff like I don't remember. So I I kind of can sympathize with you on that, where it's like then you feel more guilty that you don't remember it Cause, like, was I not present enough? What did I do wrong? Like this was supposed to be a good thing and I don't even remember it. Then you're just, you just become Riley, you glitch out.

Speaker 2: 12:17

Um, so I understand a little bit what you're saying and I never took the time to seek help, so I think it's good that you did, and I think that maybe we all like we have to have annual physicals. Why don't we have to have annual like there? Why is there no biomarkers that we can do for that? Because I think our society as a whole would feel much better in a way. I just it's like kind of like how I approach healthier you. If I understand why to eat something, I'll do it. If I understand why, I feel, some way I might be more graceful with myself or I might approach other people differently, with more empathy.

Speaker 3: 12:51

A hundred percent. And I will tell you, it was actually Katie Merrick, one of the Galloway Pacers whose day job is therapy, who really sort of held my hand without knowing what I was going through and giving me these little nuggets of why are you training to be faster? To impress somebody? Train to impress yourself. Hey. Why are you getting skinnier? So that other people don't mock the fat runner? Why don't you get healthier?

Speaker 3: 13:31

Because that'll make you a better person, and so same thing with the therapy right. Why don't you take the time to take care of yourself so that, in turn, you can be that mentor on the course that you want to be and instead of just spitting out canned lines of you can do this?

Speaker 2: 13:54

Well, now that's Jeff's. I mean, don't step on, you can do it. That's Jeff Galloway.

Speaker 3: 13:59

I'm just kidding the difference with Jeff, though, is it's sincere right. Yes, he's talked about his ability to talk from the heart. I was finding myself regurgitating phrases that even I wasn't believing in the moment, but now I'm running for me. I'm planning for costumes right for me. I'm planning for costumes right Next season. I'm going to wear some of the most elaborate crazy things I've ever worn because I want to, and there are races where I've already decided. I'm going to wear booty shorts and a concert t-shirt because I want to.

Speaker 3: 14:42

And if that doesn't meet someone else's expectation, I'm okay with that. If my time doesn't meet someone else's expectation, I'm fine with that. You're going to see races next year where I am sprinting to the finish trying to get a PR. Finish, trying to get a PR. You're going to see races next year where I'm in La La Land like twirling around, singing and dancing, because that's what's right for me that day and I think that's where the joy is coming from is doing what's best for me and knowing that other people will be okay.

Speaker 2: 15:24

Well, you seem I can see even you saying that your face kind of transformed, your kind of demeanor relaxed, and you seem to take on like a very joyful aura. And I will say we will not be angry that you don't stop at the finish, which you just sprung by Like we will be okay. So don't worry, why did you stop? He doesn't like us anymore. Oh, we're all going to get fired, matt Pablo's taking over, like that's what you will not. I can't speak for Riley. He's very sensitive. I cannot speak for Riley, but do you think he's mad that I asked you to co-host and not him? I just thought about that.

Speaker 3: 15:57

I hope not. He's already got that whole.

Speaker 2: 16:00

Matt Pablo, I, I know and do you know what I wanted to say to you? I just I'm glad I didn't write this down. So, pelkey running club we love, right, but they made the shirt with the pendant and I was like, wait a minute, dw had a Riley run club like varsity vibe first. Um, I just wanted to acknowledge that. Have you seen the shirt that's like a pendant that says Pelkey run club in a very like varsity ish. You have not seen that.

Speaker 2: 16:22

I've seen the Carissa and Riley no there is one that is a pendant and it just reminded me of the one you made and I was like, are we not giving DW credit Because he had the varsity vibe for Riley first? But we can share it. It looks great. It's a great shirt. They sent it to me. I love it, everybody loves it. But I did think of you.

Speaker 3: 16:45

I'll find the picture later. You know what? I will just have to step up my game next season show.

Speaker 2: 16:48

Riley, that love. He's fine. He's got an art exhibit. He's chilling. Oh, he's good, he's great.

Speaker 3: 16:55

Tracy's literally starting her own run club by running Disneyland.

Speaker 2: 17:00

And she was voted second best bartender in Winter Garden, so John moved to Italy. I've never been voted second best bartender in Winter Garden, so John moved to Italy.

Speaker 3: 17:06

I've never been voted second best any.

Speaker 2: 17:10

And it sounds almost like a dig, but it's really not.

Speaker 3: 17:14

That's hard work. It really is. It's not like her real job. So there you go. Go for it, Tracy. I'm a big fan.

Speaker 2: 17:23

All right, thank you, dw. You have survived the chat. Go for it, tracy. Yes, I'm a big fan. All right, Thank you, dw. You have survived the chat you have done splendidly, and let's shout out some sponsors and get on to Chris.

Speaker 1: 17:32

Today's the perfect day and really every day is the perfect day to shout out to our good friend Sarah Akers that runs on magic, because if you're going to plan some travel Carissa, don't do it on your own. Just look at me, folks, you need some help. Sarah's there to help.

Speaker 2: 17:46

She is. So if you're listening to this and you're thinking, okay, I want to try Disney Cruise. Which one works for me? Which one works for my family? When are they more affordable? How do I even know where to start? Guess what? Sarah Akers is here for you. Head over to specials there. She can answer your questions. She's a run Disney lover, she's a Swifty, she's a travel lover and she will set you up for an amazing Disney cruise. Or it's okay if it's another cruise line. That's fine too. Sarah Akers has got you. So thank you to Sarah Akers Runs on Magic Travel for sponsoring and keeping us on the move.

Speaker 3: 18:19

Okay, civilians, it's time for the goods. Let's get on to the interview. Okay, civilians, it's time for the goods. Let's get on to the interview. And welcome to 321 Go the podcast, the amazing Chris Twiggs. When I introduce you or when I talk about you to other people, the phrase is always he's not just a great running coach, he's an amazing human being, and you're starting to lay that groundwork and show other people the side of Chris Twiggs I get to see. Coach Twiggs, won't you tell the listeners how are you and, most importantly, where are you?

Speaker 4: 18:57

I absolutely will. Thank you, dw and Carissa. I am in Ouray, colorado, and I am better than I deserve. I am in Ouray, colorado, and I am better than I deserve. I am in an amazing, beautiful mountain town, an old mining town here in the San Juan Mountains of southwest Colorado. This is a town that I ran through just a couple of days ago, but I actually get to stay here and hang out in my in-laws house, which is way better than a hotel.

Speaker 2: 19:26

Yeah, I mean it's free right For good portions of the summer. Yeah, that's even better.

Speaker 4: 19:32

It's fantastic. No, it's beautiful. I mean just one of the most amazing places in the world and my favorite place to be in the summer.

Speaker 2: 19:45

Well, I appreciate you knowing exactly what we were going to ask you first, and then you like not spilling it in your opening statement, so, like, let us build up to this question of oh my gosh, chris Twiggs, you just finished your hard rock 100, maybe the 17th or some very large, very large number. So, before you tell us all about it, people who do not know what that means, you were not at the hard rock Casino gambling for 100 hours. It was very, very different.

Speaker 4: 20:10

That would be a totally different Hard Rock 100. I think it would be easy to drop $100 or maybe even $100,000 at the Hard Rock Casino, know? Um, yeah, no, the hard rock 100 is a 100 mile run that traverses the san juan mountains in southwest colorado. It starts and finishes in silverton, colorado, and it runs through telluride, uray and lake city and then finishes back in silverton, and actually this year it was a clockwise run, so I went through those cities in that order. Uh, on the odd years it's a counter clockwise run. I have now um eight counterclockwise finishes and not and nine clockwise finishes. That adds up to 17, doesn't it? Yeah and um, and so, yeah, that was my 17th time completing this event and climbs 33,000 feet, and that's the equivalent of running 100 miles from sea level to the top of Mount Everest and back, with an average elevation of over two miles above sea level, which is a little challenging being a Floridian, but it's one of my favorite things to do, or I wouldn't be doing it 17 times.

Speaker 3: 21:28

So, coach, I'm going to channel my inner John Pilkey here for a moment. Why would you do that? Okay, so let me rephrase the question, because you control my running schedule. We all have our reasons for taking on these physical challenges, right? Whether it's our first 5k, our 10th dopey or 17th hard rock 100. What is it that motivates you to keep coming back and taking on this physical challenge?

Speaker 4: 22:06

It's an excellent question, I will say I started coming to Uray after my first child was born, who's 26 years old now and who paced me over 30 miles. He ran with me over 30 miles of the run this past weekend and I had heard about Ouray because my wife's great-grandmother was actually born at a mine just outside of town that the Hard Rock runs past. So I'd heard about the town, but I hadn't been here until he was born and when I came out I fell in love. This is truly an amazing, amazing place and I'm very happy to say that in those 26 years it hasn't changed all that much. It's still this small town. There's not a Walmart in town, there's not a McDonald's in town. They don't even have home delivery of mail. Every resident walks down to the post office and bumps into each other in the post office picking up the mail. It's just a wonderful town and these mountains are gorgeous.

Speaker 4: 23:04

This morning I I woke up and walked out of. My mother-in-law gasped when she looked out the front window and I looked to see what it was and there was this magnificent rainbow over the mountains just across the valley from us. It was gorgeous, so I fell in love when I came out here with the location and I then I heard about this run, the hard rock hundred, and I had never run a hundred miles before. I didn't know if I could run a hundred miles and uh, but I loved to hike and I loved to run and I loved the concept of of doing this tour of the San Juan mountains and seeing all these amazing places and the wildlife and all of this stuff. And so I did a. I took a about a four year journey to get myself trained up to the point that I could do hard rock. I ran my first 50 K trail run in Florida and then I ran a 50 mile um mountainous race in Vermont and then I ran a hundred mile race for the first time and then the next year I ran a hundred miler. That would qualify me for hard rock, because you have to qualify to do this. They won't let first time. You know it can't be your first hundred miler and there are only certain races that are on the qualifying list. So after I finally did all of that, then I entered hard rock and at at each step, at each stage, I was trying something brand new. I was challenging myself in a way I'd never been challenged before and I honestly did not know if I would be able to finish it, but I did.

Speaker 4: 24:39

When I did my first 100 miler, I honestly didn't know, and I like to tell people that if you have a goal and your goal is to do something that you've already done, it's not really a goal, it's just a task right? A goal needs to be something that requires more of you than what you have put out before. That could be going farther than you've gone. It can be a more challenging event. It can be going faster than you've gone. You know it could be. It could also be matching Now I'm getting older. It could be matching what I've done before now at an older age.

Speaker 4: 25:16

So, fortunately, I was able to get through all of those obstacles and complete my first hard rock, and what happened along the way is that I became a part of the ultra running community and then, more than that, I became part of the hard rock family, and it's really an amazing group of men and women that have put on this race and come back year after year, and some of them used to run it but don't anymore, but they still come back to the San Juans to volunteer and to help put on the event and lead hikes and work the aid stations, and I just got more and more involved.

Speaker 4: 25:57

And and now here I am. My first hard rock was in 2005. There were two years that the race was canceled along the way and then I didn't get in last year because it is a lottery and so I'm not guaranteed. But I've been coming out here and doing the event since 2005. And now I'm on the board for Hard Rock and I'm the one leading the orientation hikes to help the new runners and the crew members and the families learn the trails that we go on. And it's just now a part of who I am. So why? Because it's part of me now and I'm part of it in a way that I wouldn't want to change.

Speaker 3: 26:38

So you said something that was really beautiful, especially as we are facing a brand new race season in a couple weeks. Right, A goal without more is just a task. You're doing it to do it again. What was your more this time?

Speaker 4: 26:58

I think my more this time was to do it completely with my family. I mentioned that my oldest son went more than 30 miles with me. It's a normal thing it's not required, but it's a normal part of ultra running to have a pacer, which is not a pacer in the Disney sense or in the marathon or half marathon sense where we're leading a particular pace carrying a flag. A pacer in ultra running is a companion for an individual runner who stays with that runner for a section of the run. And so for hard rock, runners under 60 have to go the first 42 miles, regardless of which direction we're going, have to go about the first 42 miles on our own, and then we can pick up a pacer, and we can have one pacer at a time, but we can change pacers at different spots along the way, and it had always been my dream that someday my pacers would just be my family members. And remember my first hard rock was in 2005. So in 2005, my oldest would have been six years old, and then the next one would have been four or five, and then my daughter would have been three or four years old, and so these were little kids when I started, but I always wanted to have a hard rock when it could just be my family, and so this year my wife ran with me from Uray to an aid station called Animus Forks, which is up and over the longest climb in the direction that we went this year, and it's a section of trail that she grew up hiking on in the summers, so she knows it very, very well. She was at night this is this is the night section and Friday night, and then she handed off to Wesley, who's our 26 year old son, and he went over 30 miles with me, uh, all all day Saturday. He went from sunrise to sunset. He actually finished his section at midnight Saturday night and then, uh, my younger son, uh, brendan, who's 24, got to do the last 10 miles with me and, um, that was that was the more was to do it that way, and it wasn't fast, it was actually. This was my slowest hard rock of my 17 finishes, um, but it was.

Speaker 4: 29:20

I was never panicked, I was never worried about being able to finish it. We have 48 hours to do it and I finished just under uh 47. So I still had a little bit of a buffer, but I was never panicked. It was a beautiful time, um, and it was very special to be able to do that with them. And then, of course, I had my in-laws and my parents, um and my daughter-in-law, who were all traveling from aid station to aid station so that when I came in, they made sure that I had what I needed change of shoes, change of clothes, that I was eating and drinking and all of those things. So the only one who wasn't a part of it was our daughter, who the Army has nastily stationed in South Korea right now, so she couldn't be here, but she's been here and crew crude for me in the past and I got text messages from her occasionally along the way when I had connectivity.

Speaker 2: 30:05

All right. So I think I'm just imagining our listeners listening to this going wait 100 miles, and it's really. It's not 100 miles, is it Chris?

Speaker 4: 30:13

It's 102.5 miles.

Speaker 2: 30:15

So why do you call it the Hard Rock 100?

Speaker 4: 30:17

I know because it makes it fits on the shirt way better than the Hard Rock 100. I know because it fits on the shirt way better than the Hard Rock 102.5.

Speaker 2: 30:22

But if I'm doing it, I want credit for every single step.

Speaker 4: 30:25

I know, I know Well.

Speaker 4: 30:27

I actually am a little sad about the 2.5 because I know people who finished this year within an hour.

Speaker 4: 30:39

There were four people who left the last aid station, who did not complete the event under 48 hours, and had it only been 100 miles they would have finished, or at least three of them would have finished.

Speaker 4: 30:50

One of them had to get evacuated, actually from the top of the last climb. So I feel bad that there's the extra 2.5 because that represents about an hour, maybe even more than an hour, out there on the course. But as the race has grown and we've done more things in the mountains, hard Rock has also tried with the Bureau of Land Management and the Forest Service out here in Colorado to stay as much as possible on system trails so that we're not creating our own trail and our own erosion paths, and so there are a couple of spots where traditionally Hard Rock had been going that made it 100 miles that were not on system trails, and so in the negotiations with the Bureau of Land Management we had to over the last couple of years we had to extend the course so that we could stay on the system trails, and so it added the 2.5 miles.

Speaker 2: 31:53

I mean I'm sure that feels good when you look at the watch and it says 100 and you're like, well, fantastic, let's keep going.

Speaker 4: 31:59

I should be done by now. Well it's. You know, it's like we tell people running a marathon.

Speaker 1: 32:03

When your watch says 26.2 or 13.1,.

Speaker 4: 32:07

you don't get to stop and get credit for it. You actually got across the finish line. So in the case of hard rock, there's no finish line, there's actually a rock, and we run into the finishing shoot and then we kiss the rock, and that's when our time, our time, stops. Nice All right.

Speaker 2: 32:25

So we do want to dive into training stuff, but I just have a few more questions, because I don't think people that are true Disney runners and haven't ventured in the world of trail really kind of understand this. Because you're saying you know 48 hours. You're saying an hour to go 2.5 miles for you. How do you pace yourself? Are you run, walk? Running is because the trail is so difficult. A lot of times you are just simply walking. Are you sleeping? How do you see at night, like all of the things that people are probably trying to visualize there's this is not a road that's nice and neat, um, um, that you're going on, it's. It's much more difficult.

Speaker 4: 33:01

Yeah, it is, and there are, uh, there are bears not country bears and no, they don't play banjos.

Speaker 4: 33:09

But if they did yeah well, and it's not uncommon for ultra runners to hallucinate, especially an event that goes. That goes 48 hours, so um hours. So let me see if I can hit all of those things. As far as the run-walk is concerned, I absolutely take advantage of run-walk when I can. However, these are mountains, these are not hills. These are not overpasses. These are actual mountains. In some cases the lowest point here in the Hard Rock course is at 7,800 feet above sea. Ludovic, the male champion, both broke the course record here at Hard Rock. I promise you they were not running up the mountains. A friend of mine is a race photographer for for trail runs and he's got a lot of pictures of the front runners who are walking with hiking poles up the mountains. So it's absolutely hiking or power walking up the mountains, going down. It's running when you can.

Speaker 4: 34:29

It was a very dry. It was a very strange year. This year, actually, at Hard Rock there was a lot of wet marshy areas up high where snow had melted recently and there was some snow that we had to go across. And remember we're talking on July 15th and I was on snow yesterday, so there's. But where the snow is melted it gets really marshy and so that's slippery in its own way, but it was still dry the week before the run. So coming down the steep mountain trails and these are not paved trails, these are dirt and rock trails when there's no moisture on the ground, it's very slippery, it's like running on marbles, and so it's hard to keep your footing and dangerous to run for long periods of time on that. In fact, my younger son, brendan, fell when he was pacing me on a Jeep road. We'd actually gotten off the last well, next to the last trail, and we were on a Jeep road transitioning to the final trail and he slipped and I think he broke his wrist.

Speaker 2: 35:29

We won't know for sure until he gets yeah, he's still just chilling with like a bum wrist.

Speaker 4: 35:35

Yeah, I mean, he's on his way home now. He's on his flight home to Florida now. How?

Speaker 2: 35:41

far did he have to run after this?

Speaker 4: 35:44

We had about four miles to go, so it wasn't that bad. He's a tough kid, I raise tough kids, so it's slippery, right, it's hard to run. If that's the stuff that's happening Now, where it is a little bit flat or less of a steep incline, then yeah, you run, you run, walk when you can. I try, believe it or not, I try, for a 10 second run, 10 second walk, which I know seems super, super short and super conservative.

Speaker 2: 36:16

Seems like Jeff's style.

Speaker 4: 36:17

But yeah, well, I mean, who did I learn? Learned this from right, but it works. It absolutely works Because having that chance, I think that if we know for a fact that with a one minute walk break, people tend to slow down significantly toward the end of that minute, and I think that a 30 second walk break is perfect for a marathon, half marathon, even a 50k would be perfect for me there, and even when I ran the Keys 100 last year, which is on a road in Florida, I did 30-second walk breaks when I could. But out here, 10 and 10 is really good. Having the quick changeover, I worried that if I were to walk for more than 30 seconds I would get. Next thing I knew I would have walked for 30 minutes and, um, and that's not what I want to do. So that's what I do.

Speaker 4: 37:05

As far as the run walk is concerned, um, how do you see at night when I started doing all this, I would carry a flashlight and uh, over the last decade or so, hiking poles have become way, way more popular. Um, they started in the European running mountain running they were using trekking poles. The first ones, I think, started just using ski poles and they've become more popular here in the States, and now pretty much everybody is using them in these races, including the winners, and so when you see the people that are setting course records using them, you realize, okay, this is not a crutch, this is not a bad thing. So when I transitioned to using trekking poles, I obviously couldn't use a flashlight. I can't hold a flashlight and poles at the same time.

Speaker 4: 37:53

So I wear a headlamp at night, and there's some amazing companies that make great headlamps. Some of them are a little obnoxious. It amazing companies that make great headlamps. Some of them are a little obnoxious. It looks like a freight train coming at you. So I don't I don't tend to go for the brightest one that I can find, but they all these, the LED technology, it'll last the whole night.

Speaker 4: 38:12

You don't have to worry about changing batteries or anything. So that's how I see at night. And there are course markers out there. But more importantly these days, even more important than the course markers that the people put out, is having a GPS, the GPX file that you can download onto a GPS watch, and some of the watches now that Koros makes, that Garmin make, that Suunto make, they all will last for 48 hours and so you can have a GPS track that shows you around and if you get off course just a little bit, it beeps at you and tells you you're off course a little bit and you can correct. So it keeps people safe out there. Most importantly, so that we don't wander off and get eaten by a bear.

Speaker 3: 38:57

So I wish your son the best as someone who did break their wrist once. Um, I did not run four miles immediately afterwards, uh, but you learned very quickly how much you actually use your wrist, versus just your hands or your fingers. But you said part of the reason your family ran with you was to make sure that you ate, to make sure that you drank.

Speaker 4: 39:22

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 39:23

How do you fuel and hydrate on a hundred mile run, and do you have to carry that with you? Or is that one of the advantages of having your family step in, that they get to bring a portion of that with them?

Speaker 4: 39:38

Yeah, so that's a fantastic question and the nutrition side is very complicated. To dial in, in fact, a past champion of hard rock, francois Dehaene, who was expected to win this year he was really the favorite. He ended up dropping out about 58 miles in because he couldn't keep any food down. Um, so even even the pros have a hard time getting that nutrition right. Um, some of the nutrition that is offered out here is similar to what you would see in any marathon or half marathon Goo, uh was.

Speaker 4: 40:15

There were lots of goo packets out there at the aid stations. Um, tailwind was the on course nutrition, but some runners use scratch or even old-fashioned gatorade. Um, there are aid stations along the way, several. I think there were 14 different aid stations, and these aid stations range from uh, there's one that's just it's's at a 13,000 foot mountain pass between your air and telluride. It's a tiny little area about the size of a standard bathroom, really Not much bigger than that, but they had pierogies up there, they had coke, they had tailwind, they actually had what they called a Mexican sports drink, which was tequila.

Speaker 4: 41:05

That was, I will, what was that what, yeah, tequila at the top of the pass. It's a tradition at that aid station. I will say everything that I did eat during hard rock this year. Stay down, except for the tequila.

Speaker 2: 41:20

You took the tequila.

Speaker 4: 41:22

You know it was a tradition, but it was too much. It turned out to be too much at the time. Yeah, a sip would have been fine. It was like a full-on ounce and a half shot. Not what anybody needs at 13,000 feet, much less when they've already run 40 miles.

Speaker 2: 41:37

I mean, at least they could have done what's given you the lime and the salt for some electrolytes?

Speaker 4: 41:41

Would have been better, right, exactly. So I had offered to me all sorts of things they had I'm a vegetarian, pescatarian actually, but they had for meat eaters, they had brisket, they had chicken wings, I mean, they had all sorts of things at different aid stations. They also had, um, they had quesadillas. Some of the aid stations lots of fruit. Uh, I saw, I saw watermelon and cantaloupe. Um, I, I like pierogies. Uh, they're, they tend to be pretty bland and they stay down pretty well. Um, so, and my, my mother-in-law made some for me and so she had them at a couple of the aid stations. Um, and so that was, that was good. Um, so the answer is there's plenty of food on the course that we can, that we can get and that we can eat.

Speaker 4: 42:31

Um, I ended up this year eating less food than ever before and I went with a product that I had tried during hard rock and it had worked for me, and it's a product by hammer nutrition called perpetuum solids and it looks like a giant aspirin, like, if you get it gave an aspirin to a horse. This is what it looks like and it tastes like chalk, but, uh, it stayed down and I I'd have to count up how many of them I had, but I tried to eat one of those per mile and they're not a lot of calories, only about 30 to 33 calories per piece. Um, but those stayed down and they gave me some nutrition. I basically just did the whole thing on those and water and a little bit of tequila and yeah, but not much because, like I said, that came back up.

Speaker 2: 43:27

You're so multicultural, pierogies, tequila, you're just really, you know well.

Speaker 4: 43:32

It's. You know, I'm trying to be a modern gentleman, A renaissance man.

Speaker 2: 43:35

Does this product have electrolytes? I'm assuming your big chalk aspirin had electrolytes.

Speaker 4: 43:47

You know, I honestly don't know Carissa and I had intended to drink the Tailwind. I have used Tailwind at a lot of races. I had intended for Tailwind to be my electrolyte and I didn't start with it. I didn't have any at the start, so I did the first 10 miles or so with two bottles of water on my. We were a hydration vest, so I had two bottles of water, um, so I did it with that and I was eating the Perpetuum. I will say that eating the Perpetuum solids caused me to drink a lot more water than I usually did, so I was way better hydrated than usual, because you know they're dry, and so I had to take water with them.

Speaker 4: 44:26

And I got into the first aid station and I asked them to fill one of my bottles with tailwind. And it was at the orange flavor and for some reason maybe it was because of the flavor of the solid that I had been eating, but the tailwind just didn't taste right to me, and so from then on I just got water in my bottles. Now I did drink, uh, old school Jeff Galloway style. I drank flat Coke at all of the aid station pretty much every aid station and then also a little bit of a Jeff Galloway style. At one of the aid stations my mother-in-law had for me an athletic brewing company beer, so non-alcoholic beer, and that was fantastic. It was about 26 or 27 miles in. That was fantastic as well.

Speaker 3: 45:05

So, chris, I do have one more question about Hard Rock, and then we'd like to transition to Galloway Customized, which I know a little bit more about now, but you actually sit on a board for Hard Rock 100 that focuses on inclusion and diversity at the race, clearly a topic very important to me. Can you tell us a little bit more what that means at that event?

Speaker 4: 45:41

Yes, I would be thrilled to no-transcript. When I look at hard rock finishers, they tend to look a lot like me. They're overwhelmingly male, overwhelmingly white, and that's not the world that we live in. And there have been.

Speaker 4: 46:18

Prior to me being on the board, there had been some really good movement to make sure that women were well represented, or at least better represented, at Hard Rock, but that's only part of it, right, that's, that's a small part. It's a good step, but it's part of it. So I I, in my personal statement, I said that I really wanted to. So I, in my personal statement, I said that I really wanted to. I didn't have the answer, but I wanted to see what we could do to create a more diverse Hard Rock. Now that, because you have to qualify for Hard Rock, it really needs to start with the races that are qualifiers. We need to make sure that the qualifying races are, as as possible, are open and inclusive, and sometimes that means we also have to seek out geographical diversity. Right? If you don't have a hard rock qualifier on your continent, it's going to be hard for people that live near you and look like you to get into this event. But we know people are interested. We know this is a popular event. There are over 3,000 people trying to get one of the 146 spots in this race every year. So that was what I wrote in my statement, and I was fortunate enough to be elected onto the board. And also with me this year as a new board member is Stephanie Case, who is an amazing ultra runner and happens to be a UN human rights attorney who had been working in Gaza. She's a freaking rock star, you know, and so she and I and previously a current board member, but who was already on the board, megan Hicks, who is the managing editor of I Run Far, which is a media company that follows ultra running.

Speaker 4: 48:06

The three of us have formed the inclusivity committee, and our first action, which I'm so excited about, was to create a concrete pregnancy and parenthood deferral policy, because there were women who got into hard rock and then found that they were pregnant and were not able to run hard rock, and they there was no concrete policy. They weren't sure were they allowed to defer to the following year? Were they just out of luck or what? And so some women just withdrew from the race because they were pregnant, and then some would contact the run director and inquire and they were given a deferral. But it really needed to be concrete, and so we drafted a policy that not only allows for women who become pregnant after the lottery, but who are are pregnant when the lottery takes place all the way up until race day, or have had a child within the previous six months and know that they have to provide care for the child. They're not going to be able to run. And then, I think, even better than that, this also covers adoption, this also covers surrogacy and this also covers partners. So if your partner falls under the category that to be covered with a deferral you get, you could defer as well, because we don't expect just one parent to be caring for those children, um. So it was the right thing to do and we were delighted that the board agreed once we presented it to them. So that was our first initiative. We just had a board meeting last week where we gave a report to the board and we're going to be looking at coming up with concrete policies on transgender and non-binary, because we've had a lot of inquiries from people about that and we need to make sure that, um, that we have have a clear and accepting and inclusive policy for that? Um.

Speaker 4: 50:03

The other thing that we're looking at is a land use acknowledgement. This is in Southwest Colorado. Um, you know these were native lands and we need to make sure that, um, that that's acknowledged. Uh, hard rock is named for the, the miners who came here and um and did hard rock mining, which means blasting and drilling into these mountains to get these natural resources. And, um, and the trails that we use we've recognized as trails that the miners used to get to these four mining towns here, but the reality is those trails existed because of the indigenous people who were here before them and hunted and farmed in this area primarily the youths and so we need to make sure that that is acknowledged on our website and that we acknowledge that at Hard Rock in our runners briefing and unfortunately we're not able to come to terms on the wording for that this year prior to the run, but we have a board retreat planned for october and we have some very good help from some folks that are here in the area that are connected in the indigenous community and they're helping us with that, including a woman, perfidia, who, uh, who designed the finisher's hat for, uh, for hard rock this year it's got finisher on the back and this beautiful um, you know, mountain and floral pattern and um, so she's been helping us with that.

Speaker 4: 51:29

So I'm really proud of our work with um, with the board, and specifically, uh, you know, stephanie and megan. I've told them, you know, I, I want to see more and more diverse culture here at Hard Rock. I am not, I'm not the voice for, for any of that. I am, you know, cisgender, white male married to a woman. I mean, I'm as bland as it gets, right, I can't speak for anyone else, but I will absolutely magnify those voices and that's what I'm here to do.

Speaker 3: 52:08

So, with all due respect, coach, you are the exact opposite of planned and Carissa can confirm this. When I introduce you or when I talk about you to other people, the phrase is always he's not just a great running coach, he's an amazing human being. And you're starting to lay that groundwork and show other people the side of Chris Twiggs I get to see.

Speaker 4: 52:33

Oh, thank you.

Speaker 2: 52:36

We are always aiming to get you to that next finish line and we've created an exciting opportunity for you guys, coming up with Galloway customized training. It's called Customize Plus and what you get is an exclusive opportunity to get six months of customized training led by Galloway's chief training officer, chris Twiggs, and six months of healthier you the live chats led with me, along with joining our nutrition summer shake up for 30 days of challenges. Check the show notes for more information on how to sign up. And here's Chris with a little more about Customize.

Speaker 4: 53:13

Hi, I'm Chris Twiggs, chief training officer at Galloway Training Programs and coach of Galloway Customized Training. When Jeff Galloway and I put together Customized Training, our goal was to offer the best value in professional coaching for runners and walkers. Starting from a questionnaire to determine your current fitness goals and commitments to family and work, I build a schedule that's perfect for you, but it doesn't end there. Each week, with your feedback, I adjust your plan to help you reach your goals and I introduce you to a worldwide family of customized runners and walkers who are cheering you on. I look forward to working with you and to being your coach and your biggest fan as we run, walk, run with Galloway Customized Training.

Speaker 2: 53:51

All right, you have four more real questions and one more not a hard question. So we're going to get to those. But I want to know you had on your hard rock hat. Dw made you put on your coaching hat. If I put on your athlete hat, what's the worst training mistake that you have ever made, coach?

Speaker 4: 54:25

year, and I was trying for a fast time, and so I was wearing the most minimalist shoe that I could get super, super lightweight. They were basically bedroom slippers with laces and I wore those, thinking this is, this is what I'm going to need. And I think, six miles into the marathon, I realized this is a horrible mistake, and so I was not running with a phone. I got to a water station and I borrowed a phone from a volunteer to call my wife we were staying at the Polynesian and I asked her please go get my hokas, my super thick, cushy shoes, and bring them out out to the road. And so when I got to her, I changed my shoes and I I plotted my way to a slower marathon finish than I wanted to. So that was and and I had.

Speaker 4: 55:19

I was fortunate enough to have a friend who owned a running store Well, there's Jeff Galloway, but but a different friend that owned a running store local to me, and I was running with him and I told him about this silly thing that I'd done, and he said well, you know, when your body hits the ground, your foot hits the ground, it's hitting with a multiple of your body weight, and that that shock has got to be absorbed somewhere, and it's either going to be absorbed by the technology of the shoe or it's going to be absorbed by your body, by your legs, by your feet.

Speaker 4: 55:48

And if you're doing a short race, you can kind of get away with it. You know track race, you can kind of get away with it. You're doing a marathon, you might not be able to get away with that. You might need a little bit more technology, a little bit more cushioning in there. And so I transitioned to doing my runs, my races, in a more cushioned shoe. And now we see all these super shoes are like it's yeah, they've got the little, the plates and stuff like that. But we're finding out it's actually the foam that is doing the work and it's making these records possible, the cushioning that's really causing that.

Speaker 2: 56:20

Quick question to follow up on that Do you run marathons in the carbon plate shoes like a Metaspeed or an AlphaFly?

Speaker 4: 56:27

I have.

Speaker 2: 56:27

I don't always but I have.

Speaker 4: 56:30

I do Often I will when I'm pacing, just because I'm not trying to go faster when I'm pacing, it's just giving you a better bounce back. Right, it makes me a little bit, yeah, it makes me a little bit peppier, and I need to feel fresh throughout the marathon. If I'm pacing, so yeah, I do for that, but most of them I don't. But if I'm pacing I typically do. And then if I'm going for a Boston qualifier or something like that, why not give myself the best advantage I can?

Speaker 2: 56:58

We're having that debate internally with me because you get to that rate of a zone of diminishing returns, because at a half great for me, great time, when we're going to my full and we're talking four plus hours, is the lack of cushioning, lack of stability going to catch up with me. And I don't necessarily want to do a long run in them to test that out. I'll do my mile repeats in them and I'll feel like a superstar. But is that? You know what that's? We're having that debate internally.

Speaker 4: 57:24

I would say, if you do your cause, you'll top out at 14 mile repeats. I would say, if you're able to do 14 mile repeats in them and they feel great all the way through, those the shoes that you want to race in Cause they do make a difference to me.

Speaker 2: 57:37

They make a humongous difference to me.

Speaker 4: 57:38

They really do, but they make a different difference to different people. Yes, and different brands. The studies show that there are people that are responders to certain shoes and not to others, and it's really a problem for elites who are sponsored athletes, because what if you are sponsored by Nike but you don't really? Your body doesn't really respond well to the Alpha Fly or the Vaporfly. It actually responds better to the Brooks shoe. You're in a position where you kind of have to call up Brooks and beg them.

Speaker 4: 58:10

Can you take me on, get me out of my contract with Nike, because this tends to be a better shoe or whatever it is. So different people respond differently to different shoes. I would really recommend people, if you happen to be around a specialty running store that has a come try the super shoe out type of night or afternoon or weekend or something like that, go and try out whichever shoes they're offering so that you can learn which one tends to work better for you. Or if your store happens to allow you to return shoes after a week or so, take them and run, preferably on an indoor track or a treadmill, so you're not messing up the shoe and try them out for a little bit, because you may find, unfortunately, that particular shoe that everybody is raving over just doesn't work for you over, just doesn't work for you.

Speaker 3: 58:59

So, coach, one more Run Disney specific question for you. You have participated in these weekends as a vendor at the Jeff Galloway booth, as a coach, with athletes competing, even as a participant. What is your favorite core memory? So think inside out, we're holding the ball. What is that memory and how does it motivate you to keep?

Speaker 4: 59:26

coming back, my favorite run, disney core memory. Yeah, um, I think it was the first time that my first child ran the disney marathon. Um, it was the year of I won't say blizzard, but by golly it was practically a blizzard at at Disney. It was so cold and, um, he ran in a some sort of a wig type of costume and, um, but it was, it was the most wonderful, beautiful thing. Run Disney is like. I mean, I talked at the beginning of this about a hard rock family and what it means to me, but run Disney is that as well. I mean, I've been doing run Disney before. It was run Disney. Right, the first Disney marathon. Run Disney didn't exist. It was, you know, god bless him. It was. It was John Hughes and track shack out there putting up the stuff and making it happen from the beginning and and so going back to that weekend and then all the other race weekends that they've come up with since then. For how many years is it now? 32 years.

Speaker 2: 1:00:36

You tell us you're the perfect one.

Speaker 4: 1:00:39

Yeah, but I'm old two years. You tell us you're the perfect one. Yeah, but I'm old, um, so, uh, but, but, but the so to me, but what was? This is the reason that is the core memory is that was the first time that, um, that I, my wife and I ran the first run. Disney ran the first disney marathon together, so we entered into that disney running family together. She's the one that got me into it. She signed me up for the. I'd never run a marathon before that and but that half marathon was when we introduced our son into that family, and so that's why that's the most special moment for me. And all three of my kids have now run races at Disney. My daughter, who will tell you, she's more of a swimmer than a runner, she ran the princess half with her mom, with my wife one year, and both of my boys have run as pacers for the Disney races. But, yeah, that's it for me.

Speaker 2: 1:01:33

I think all of us that listen to this podcast because you all have probably have some connection to run Disney. We all have an island of our personality that like is run Disney, and that's kind of cool to visualize what everybody's different little island would look like. Well, congratulations, chris. You have made it to our closing questions, which we have altered a little bit for you because we know you've done some of them before, but this one I still think is an important one because people are getting into training for you. When it's a hard place in a run hard place and a hard rock, how do you mentally work yourself through that?

Speaker 4: 1:02:12

I love. I love something that my father says and it's nothing original to him. I don't know who said it first, and it's actually something that, during hard rock, my son Brendan, said to me, which is there will come a day when I can't do this, but today is not that day.

Speaker 2: 1:02:36

That's a good one. I like that one. Yeah, I don't know who said it first.

Speaker 1: 1:02:39

There's someone out there that said it first, that didn't do a good job of trademarking it.

Speaker 2: 1:02:42

putting it on a shirt, Forrest Gump nailed the bumper sticker. This human didn't.

Speaker 4: 1:02:49

Yeah, yeah, but no, that's what that's, that's that's what motivates me. You know, it's a. It's a privilege to get to run, but everybody can do it. It's a privilege to get to participate in races. Not everybody gets to do it and we need to be, we need to be happy and we need to be glad and we need to be humble about our, our opportunities.

Speaker 3: 1:03:11

And it is a privilege to get to run with you. And it is a privilege to get to run with you and I am not trying to butter you up before you answer this next question, um, but keeping with the twists uh, is there a moment where an athlete that you coached truly made you proud? What is that moment and why does it stand out?

Speaker 4: 1:03:32

oh, by golly all the time, all the time, it happens. Um, if I had to, if I had to think of, uh, of just one, um. This weekend, this weekend, um, one of our customized folks came here to colorado and volunteered at hard rock. I mean, this wasn't a running accomplishment, but but what made me proud is he's giving back to the running community.

Speaker 4: 1:04:01

We so often take for granted all of the volunteers and the organizations that put on these races and put on these events, that that we live for Right, and we can be crass about it and we can say, oh my gosh, disney's got so much money that they don't need my thanks, they don't need my help. But this, you know, maybe that's true for Disney, maybe, so okay, but just about every other event out there, they need volunteers, they need people to help, they need people to pack the goodie bags, they need people to to pack the goodie bags and they need people to hand out the water at the water stops and they need people to hand out the medals at the finish line. And when, when runners participate in the community not as runners but as volunteers, that that really makes me proud. That really makes me feel like this is not. They realize this is not just about them. They realize this is about all of us, and that's something that makes me really, really proud, and I think you I know that wasn't exactly what you're looking for, but-.

Speaker 2: 1:05:07

No, I think it was perfect, because we don't get that nudge enough. I don't think we talk about that need and that gratitude for the volunteers enough.

Speaker 4: 1:05:17

But you volunteered at hard rock last year when you didn't get in, is that, did I remember that correctly? So it was such an honor and and that particular aid station made their own. The race gives volunteer shirts to the volunteers, but that particular aid station decided to do to do their own volunteer shirts just for that aid station this year, and so I asked if I could buy one of their volunteer shirts for that aid station and run in it. And that was because I still feel a part of that particular aid station and if I don't get in next year that's where I'll spend. Hard Rock weekend is helping those runners get through Animus Forks aid station, which is an old ghost town between here and Lake City. All right?

Speaker 2: 1:05:54

Well, thank you so much for giving you so much of your time right after this big race. Last question this should be an easy one. People want to keep up with you. People want to do customized training with you. Give us all the details of how to stay in touch with the chief training officer.

Speaker 4: 1:06:08

Well, the best way is just chris at jeffgallowaycom. You can email me and I'm really really happy to answer any questions you have and, if customized is right for you, get you signed up. You can go to jeffgallowaycom and you can find links and you can find out more about customized. There's no long-term commitment. You can sign up for just a month of customized. If you sign up for a month, I write your entire schedule. Let's say you've got a race that's two years out. I will write you a two year schedule, even if you just plan on being a member for a month. But you get a better deal if you sign up for a year. And if you do sign up for a month, you can keep renewing as long as you want. So you can go on there and you can find out more about that. I'm at Chris Twiggs on Instagram. You're going to find a combination.

Speaker 2: 1:06:53

I know what you're going to say.

Speaker 4: 1:06:56

You're going to find a combination of uh, of, of running content and um rum content.

Speaker 4: 1:07:05

I had, um, I think, the last picture on there while we're speaking. So this was my 17th hard rock, 17th Hard Rock, and so I acquired a bottle of Appleton 17-year Jamaican rum, which they call the Legend, which I felt like was appropriate for the occasion. So I made a Mai Tai with that last night and I've got a little picture of that on there. So, yeah, so it's not all. My Instagram life is not exactly the same as my coaching life but it's my life, it's real life.

Speaker 2: 1:07:35

Well, thank you again so much for taking your time. We will see you at Disneyland in September, correct? Yes, yes, I'm so looking forward.

Speaker 4: 1:07:42

My wife will be out there as well. She's never been to Disneyland, so I'm looking forward to her. I'm a little on the fence. I haven't quite decided what pace group I'm going to be leading. I typically lead the fastest pace group, but I just ran 100 miles in the mountains and so I'm not.

Speaker 4: 1:08:02

I will not lead that pace group unless I know I'm going to be fine leading that pace group. So I potentially I may slip back to a little bit slower pace group. So we will see. But I will definitely be there in the booth. Please come up and hang out and ask your questions and talk with me and if, like DW, you have questions about what pace group you can be in, I'll ask you a few questions and I'll put you where I think you will be best served.

Speaker 3: 1:08:27

I'm just saying, coach, I'm not trying to sway you, but 14 minute miles, it's a great pace in Anaheim.

Speaker 4: 1:08:38

I believe it as long as there's no bottleneck at the water stops.

Speaker 2: 1:08:41

Well, that's a question for another time on 321 Go the Podcast. All right, thank you, chris, we appreciate your time.

Speaker 1: 1:08:49

My pleasure, anytime, all right athletes, here's the drill Time to shape up your diet Carissa give them the goods, all right.

Speaker 2: 1:08:57

So I wanted to address something that I actually thought about with Claire the other day. I was just kind of thinking about her gymnastics is ramping up. She's doing like scary skills now, things that like I was never like, oh, every time she did something before, but now we're flipping off the bars and we're doing back handsprings on beams. I was like, oh, it's like one night in the middle of the night, um, I was like she didn't have calcium, like this is. There was a meme I shared a couple of weeks ago. It was like this, like letter of a mom to a kid, and it was like you said, if I ever thought about you and you were is like in that vein and I want to like I need to make sure Claire's getting enough calcium. And then I was like I need to make sure all of you listening are getting enough calcium, because it's important for runners, because strong bones is going to help prevent stress, fractures and other bone related injuries. Women, if you are over 50, make sure, make sure, make sure, make sure you're really getting enough.

Speaker 2: 1:09:52

Calcium is also an electrolyte. It helps with the proper functioning of muscles, including the heart, so we want it to be there in our body. Nerve transmission it helps transmit nerve impulses, which is necessary again for muscle contraction. Helps with blood clotting, which will help with any minor injuries you have. Electrolyte balance helps maintain the balance of fluids in the body. So five good sources of calcium, and I know a lot of. You know the top one right, like if I say, get more calcium, dw, what are you going to go grab first?

Speaker 3: 1:10:23

Milk does the body good.

Speaker 2: 1:10:25

Milk does so. Milk, cheese, yogurt, all those good things. But what if you're me and you don't eat dairy Soy milk? Fortified milks with calcium are important, and the thing that I've added in with Claire is fortified orange juice. So that's what I use for my athletic greens in the morning. So for me, that's 25% of my daily calcium. For her, because she's tiny, it's even more so if you are not a milk lover. But if you're an athletic greens user or you make smoothies on the daily, think about adding in fortified orange juice as part of that. What about cereals? Cereals can be fortified with calcium, leafy green vegetables. So the broccoli that I beg of all of you to eat more of. That's going to help you have calcium. How about sardines? Are you a sardine eater?

Speaker 3: 1:11:14

So I am definitely allergic to.

Speaker 2: 1:11:17

That's right, we've had this. I know this about you. Well, I'm not either. No, I'm not either, but I wish I was because they're so good for you, for omega threes and calcium, and you know another weird reason why they're good for you. We talk about the food chain and we think about like our diets and there's so much processed stuff and pollutants in the environment. Right, okay, stick with me on this one. So a lot of us are eating tuna. Which? How big is a tuna? When the fisherman catches it, enormous.

Speaker 2: 1:11:48

They're massive Right. Okay, so the tuna is eating the fish that's three feet and the three foot long fish is eating the fish that's two feet and the two foot long fish is eating. Well, the sardine is the smallest fish, so it has the least amount of other contaminants in its body because it's not eating the fish that ate the fish that ate the fish that ate the fish that ate the fish, so it's actually a great source of so much. I will not it's a hard pass on sardines, but if you are eating sardines, would you please take a picture and tag me in it so I can prove that somebody out there is eating sardines? But then nuts and seeds. Almonds are going to be one of your highest nuts. So you are a nut fan, I know that. How do almonds rank on your nut ranking scale? Top three nuts in order.

Speaker 3: 1:12:33

I wanted to walk my pantry right now.

Speaker 2: 1:12:37

Yep.

Speaker 3: 1:12:37

Pull out five different types of nuts, but the two biggest bags almonds number one, pistachios number two.

Speaker 2: 1:12:45

Good, well, then there you go. And then chia seeds throw those in. Anytime you're doing an oatmeal, anytime you're doing a smoothie, grab a little chia seeds, sesame seeds too. You're probably not going to get enough of them, but if we're continually sprinkling them on, it's not a bad thing. You have been in Healthier you. I don't need you to give like a, I don't want you to give a testimonial, but like have you enjoyed it so far?

Speaker 3: 1:13:09

I have actually loved my time with Healthier you.

Speaker 2: 1:13:15

I didn't tell him to say this y'all and I didn't tell him I was going to ask him and I actually said to myself not but then I did.

Speaker 3: 1:13:20

It's fine, bring it on. So public disclosure. I am a paying client of Healthier you. Right, carissa, didn't pass the stack of dollar bills across the table. This is my honest opinion. Pass the stack of dollar bills across the table. This is my honest opinion.

Speaker 3: 1:13:37

What I love most about Healthier you is, first and foremost, there is a why behind everything you tell us to do. It's not like some of those meal programs where they eat this and everything's fine. Well, why am I eating? Why do I need kale? Why do I need almonds? You explain the science in a way that is easy to grasp.

Speaker 3: 1:14:02

The second piece that I really love about Healthier you is nothing is off the table. You give us the skills to understand that if I want pizza for dinner, I can have pizza for dinner. We're going to discuss portion control and maybe having that pizza with a kale salad and what does our snack look like, so that we don't feel the need to eat the whole pizza three hours later. It's very manageable. I recently went to Europe for a week and I was so afraid of will I be able to sustain these lessons when I don't have access to a kitchen, when most of my meals are going to be eaten at restaurants. It is the knowledge behind what to choose and how much to eat Protein. It should be the size of your palm If you get a piece of chicken, parmesan and it is the size of your face, cut it down Right.

Speaker 3: 1:15:11

Those are things I can take with me anywhere.

Speaker 2: 1:15:15

Well, I appreciate you saying that and that is what I strove for. The other thing I'll say about you and about why Health Through you may be a program that I designed that maybe does work for some. If you don't come at it with a mindset of being ready to change, it's not going to be most beneficial for you. So I think you also came to it at a time when you were open and ready to work on that, because it does take work, I think, to make the kind of changes that I'm hoping people make, instead of just, oh well, I ate this meal that they told me to eat. For a month I lost three pounds now and then I stopped and I gained it back, like, hopefully there are nuggets that people take away and that stick with them for longer.

Speaker 3: 1:15:53

So and I've done those meal programs and, yes, I lost a lot of weight. But I'll tell you, the past several weeks with Healthier you, I haven't even looked at a scale. I know you tell us to but I've chosen not to. But I know that my clothes fit better, I know that I sleep better, I know that my mood has been better and when I run my belly doesn't bounce the way my belly used to bounce. And so whatever number that scale tells me I am doesn't matter, because the way I feel, the way I look, the way I carry myself has improved, and I do attribute that to healthier you.

Speaker 2: 1:16:34

Well, thank you, and I did not intend for this to be like an endorsement, but I sometimes I think we always talk about it and I just wanted to have somebody to hear some other point of view. I am a fan of well, not a fan of weighing myself. I hate weighing myself, but like, I think that there's a place for it to know progress. But I also overwhelmingly say like, if you feel better, if you're close, fit, better, then keep doing what you're doing. And then, by God, if you're going to weigh yourself, don't do it at night, Weston, why? I mean no, Even if I get up and drink water like oh well, now I've got to wait till tomorrow. For those of you that are interested in Healthier you, if you're listening to this in the summer of 2024, we do have our summer shakeup challenge going on. You can join that. I use in code SUMMER at the seminar page or podcast will save you money off the 12-week Healthier you course.

Speaker 1: 1:17:15

Athletes, listen up. It's mail call time. Announcer free present.

Speaker 2: 1:17:22

Thanks, Sarge. Today's question is from Kim via our 321GO podcast at gmailcom address and she wants to know very timely she's asking us, right after the message was dropped, what we think about the princess themes, and I'm going to let DW go first because I want to know what they think.

Speaker 3: 1:17:43

So let's frame this conversation.

Speaker 2: 1:17:47

I don't want to frame it, because I know what you're going to say.

Speaker 3: 1:17:51

On Instagram I go by. I am not a princess. I chose that handle after my very first princess half marathon. I didn't get the vibe. The theme was cinderella.

Speaker 2: 1:18:06

That was it that was the theme cinderella, but you're saying that to someone who was be careful. I was friends with cinderella, so that's a that's a theme for me. Actually she's there, the older princesses their Be careful.

Speaker 1: 1:18:13

I was friends with Cinderella. I love her personally.

Speaker 2: 1:18:15

That's a theme for me, Actually the older princesses, their character was built. It's not very deep.

Speaker 3: 1:18:21

Right, it was just sort of here's a princess in a blue dress.

Speaker 2: 1:18:25

Oh, that's wonderful DW.

Speaker 3: 1:18:26

I have learned to love Princess Half Marathon weekend, so I was really interested to see what the themes were going to be this year. If I am being honest, I am obsessed with the themes for next year's half marathon. If you have only seen the graphics. The graphics are amazing. They are the princess and the villain counterpart. If you go on to the Run Disney website and actually read the description of each of the three races, it is not only the princess taking on the villain, but it's quite frequently the villain's sidekick is getting involved as well, and I have seen what Mark Pereira has done with some of these themes in the past.

Speaker 3: 1:19:20

I cannot wait to see what he has in store for us on the course.

Speaker 2: 1:19:24

I want to text him and get him back on to see what he can like, if he would. You know, it's a hard line for him to like because he wants to, because he's such good friends with John, like, I want to make sure that he doesn't get in trouble. But to him, to give a little insight, I just I want to be like, I want to be the queen. I need to be the queen, um, because that was the first person I was friends with, uh, in my college program. I was I don't know how to say this like in covert. In covert, my stature was too large to be friends with the royal people at that time and I was friends with the queen. However, the queen doesn't do a lot. There's not a lot of places for the queen to be in Walt Disney World. So I eventually shrunk and thus was able to be friends with a more royal population. Do you understand what?

Speaker 3: 1:20:19

I was saying I know exactly what you mean. So it's going to be a queen off, because I have already decided I am running the half as the queen.

Speaker 2: 1:20:31

The queen, not Maleficent. Maleficent is my favorite villain, if we're taking personal. I grew up loving Maleficent. Terrified, but found something alluring and sexy about it. I don't even know if it was a man or a woman, I don't know. It was confidence. I loved her confidence. Is that wrong? Is that?

Speaker 3: 1:20:51

weird. That's the queen If you have ever gone to disneyland yes anybody going out to run halloween. Half the queen hangs out by the wishing well and just walks around disneyland is so much better I'm gonna play john whatever, um, but I agree secretly. But the queen at disneyland is in this non-disney bubble. She almost gets to be what cruella is at disney world I agree with you where the rules don't quite apply to her. So she will come up to you, look you in the face, call, call you a peasant and walk on by.

Speaker 2: 1:21:34

And still in character, like she's not breaking character, she's not outside of the movie, but like, yes, they have a lot of fun there.

Speaker 3: 1:21:43

She gives me life, and so the fact that I kind of wanted to show up Princess Half Marathon anyways as a villain.

Speaker 2: 1:21:52

now I get to do it and be on theme so you're gonna be like purple robe queen, not spectro queen, because queen used to be in spectro and had lights just something planned, maybe a little more modern, little more sexy, because it's well, it's blue eyeshadow if it's spectro and it's purple eyeshadow if it's's day, just if you were.

Speaker 3: 1:22:13

I did not know that.

Speaker 2: 1:22:15

That's why I'm here, to tell you.

Speaker 1: 1:22:17

I'm here, and I don't know if you want to do the spirit gum and then the eyebrow.

Speaker 2: 1:22:19

I don't, but you better start practicing the eyebrows, Depending on how deep you're. You still have to write a half marathon, Isn't that funny? We're talking about this Like it's a freaking party that you pop up at and like get you know, you have, there's still a half marathon and I'm like oh your eyeshadow, oh your eyebrows. We've talked about this. Though I'm a planner, I know Well, I'm just concerned, you don't have a springtime surprise, yet it's stressing me out.

Speaker 2: 1:22:43

I don't have any hints I can give you on that one. I'm not. It's probably why people don't give me hints, cause, as you know, I'm not amazing with them.

Speaker 3: 1:23:00

I hope that there's some villain love in there, but I don't mind being the princess either it's fun. It's like every girl's dream, so I like it. No, I to take it back to the original question, I really am impressed and thrilled and genuinely excited to see how this unfolds next year.

Speaker 2: 1:23:13

It'll be fun. They've given it more intrigue, like they've made it more dramatic, so I like that. And then how do we move forward from this in the future with this excitement? And then where will springtime go? I don't.

Speaker 3: 1:23:23

You never know, I know Last year was really good those themes last year.

Speaker 2: 1:23:28

At first I was like, eh, I don't know, but just the up day was such a fun, fun day, like, I guess, tinkerbell, nothing against Tinkerbell. I'm just not a Tinkerbell person, I think. Like I don't identify, I don't know, I'm not a.

Speaker 3: 1:23:43

That was my first run, disney. I know you, I know and I love that for you and I love that.

Speaker 2: 1:23:50

I love Peter, I love Wendy, I just, I'm just.

Speaker 3: 1:23:55

See, I wasn't looking forward to Up, because I knew everyone on that course was either going to be dressed as Russell or Kevin.

Speaker 2: 1:24:06

And what's wrong with thousands of Kevins?

Speaker 3: 1:24:10

It wasn't what I was looking forward to, but when it was what I got, I loved it so much because you could just run up to people and be like Kevin's a girl.

Speaker 2: 1:24:28

It was. I was ridiculous. I mean, I've said this before. I like themes where we all like understand the. You know what I mean. That's. That's my not issue. But like with marathon, I like there's not a focus. It's always Pluto's. That's my not issue. But like with marathon, I like there's not a focus, it's always Pluto. And then there's this and this. There is a focus. But I like a hardcore like this is up, there's seven characters and you don't have to be any of them you don't have to be any of them.

Speaker 3: 1:24:45

There's probably there was, which is great.

Speaker 2: 1:24:56

Like you be you, but I enjoy that, so you're not a fan of the random scary clown that looks like it's going to kill you. No, I'm not a fan of Ronald McDonald with Bill, is it Bill? Well, and then at the 4th of July we had creepy cat in the hat, which I was thinking it was creepy. And then we were with two, a three-year-old and a four-year-old, and they kept being like where's cat in the hat? We want to see him again. That was their highlight. So I guess the guys and to bring it full circle, he's a regular at Pilar's, where Tracy Wu was the second best bartender in Wintergarden Cat in the Hat guy is.

Speaker 3: 1:25:21

I feel like we should break out into Circle of Life now. But we're going to save that for Broadway karaoke episodes.

Speaker 2: 1:25:28

I've heard a lot of people are wanting. I mean not a night, it's a party. Dw, it's a Broadway, it's a what's the word? Fictional, but could someday be real Broadway karaoke party that we would like to have.

Speaker 3: 1:25:43

Run out the clubhouse. I'm there.

Speaker 2: 1:25:45

Anybody still listening to this episode is going to get a little treat. So this kind of happened. The Monday after Brittany Charbonneau won Dopey, we all went on a VIP tour. And then Brittany, my husband his name is Weston her husband Justin, who we call Just Ben, and John and Jodi went to Epcot and we all know what happens at Epcot. So we shot and I have it on my phone, but I'm not allowed to show anybody everybody's fake Broadway audition because it was when Disney does Broadway. So I have videos of John, jodi and Brittany.

Speaker 2: 1:26:22

You and I didn't do it right. Weston and Justin didn't do it Like hi, my name is John Pelkey. I'm auditioning for the role of blah blah blah, and then they sing and then Jodi does what. It's hysterical. So, like it, I didn't sing because I don't sing. Um, I would be more of like a rapper, hamilton type, but like it's. There's been a touch of this before and it was like I would just want everybody to come in and to do their piece, do their audition, but like in one of the things, like somebody's doing it and they're like who's your agent? Like yelling in the background, like side side, and then, like I think Jodi starts singing and John's like that's what you're singing. No, like it's like hysterical.

Speaker 3: 1:27:01

I feel like John and Jodi have an unfair advantage.

Speaker 2: 1:27:05

And Brittany. Brittany has been trained in New York City like singing, so like, yeah, they can actually sing and they're performers. So that's why Weston and I didn't sing. We were not singers.

Speaker 3: 1:27:15

But I won't go up against them either.

Speaker 2: 1:27:18

But it's not a competition, it's just about shenanigans. Well, I'm good at shenanigans In the best way I mean. At my wedding, my friend Megan I know you're still listening I sang a big, big amount of Hamilton at the after party, like her and I both did, to the point where, like, everybody else was still asleep and we were like you know, how you're that, but like no, no, I want to do one more, one more. That was that night, so it's there it's. We'll just have to someday plan it, so make it happen.

Speaker 2: 1:27:45

Okay. Well, thank you for joining us. Thank you, Weston, for editing. There's only one thing left to say, and that's see you real soon.

Speaker 1: 1:27:55

Bye-bye. Bye-bye Three, two, one go.