Angela Walker In Conversation - Inspirational Interviews, Under-Reported News
For news lovers everywhere. Join former BBC reporter and broadcast journalist Angela Walker as she engages in thought-provoking conversations with inspirational individuals about current affairs and under-reported issues. We examine stories mainstream media don’t cover: issues of social justice and campaigns that aim to improve society and the world we live in. We look at issues around government, climate change, the environment and world around us. In this podcast, we aim to shed light on important topics that often go unnoticed, providing a platform for insightful discussions with our guests.
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Angela Walker In Conversation - Inspirational Interviews, Under-Reported News
MEDICAL NEGLIGENCE EXPOSED: The Death and Cover-Up of Robbie Powell and his Family's Fight for Justice with Will Powell and Sir Rob Behrens
What would you do if your child died as a result of medical negligence and doctors and the police colluded to cover it up?
That's what happened in the case of ten-year-old Robbie Powell.
His parents are campaigning for all healthcare professionals to be legally obligated to tell the truth following a negligent death.
They're supported by the former Parliamentary Health Service Ombudsman Sir Rob Behrens CBE says: "Mr Powell was personally traduced by doctors, by regulators by the police service, by the Crown Prosecution Service, by politicians in a way which is just unacceptable. He was patronised and he never gave up."
Robbie died from Addison's Disease. He could have been saved if doctors had carried out the necessary tests and informed the family of the risks. Instead, numerous medics failed him and spent 30 years covering it up.
In this podcast Robbie's father Will Powell and Sir Rob Behrens join me to discuss the Powell family's relentless pursuit of truth and justice and the systemic failures that have deprived his family of justice for more than 30 years.
Hi listener. I thought you might enjoy Don Anderson's podcast. Missing Pieces - NPE Life is a podcast that curates stories of and about people who find out, usually through a home DNA test, that someone in their family tree isn't who they thought. They also tell stories of adoptees who've found lost family, or are looking. The host, Don Anderson, found out in 2021 that his dad wasn't his dad. It changed his life. NPE stands for Not Parent Expected or Non Paternity Event.
https://www.angelawalkerreports.com/
The parents of a boy whose death could have been prevented are campaigning for all health care professionals to be bound by law to tell the truth. Following a negligent death, ten-year-old Robbie Powell died from Addison's disease in April 1990. He'd been seen by five doctors on seven occasions in the last 15 days of his life. His family's been campaigning ever since I'm journalist, angela Walker, and in this podcast I talk to inspirational people and discuss under-reported issues. Today I'm joined by Will Powell, robbie's father, and Sir Rob Behrens, who was the Parliamentary and Healthcare Ombudsman until March 2024. Thank you both for joining me. Rob, I know you've been supporting Will's campaign for several years and I want to hear about that in a moment. But first of all, I'll start with you, will. First of all, I'll start with you, will I mean? Losing a child is unimaginable, but even more so when that death could have been prevented. Can you take us back to?
Will Powell:what happened when Robbie first became ill. Robert was the youngest of her three sons. He was nine years old and up until then none of the family or the children had suffered any major illnesses. Robert was admitted by Amberland St Morrison Hospital in December of 89. He was critically ill. Addison's disease was suspected. The ACTH test was ordered. However, after four days he was discharged and when we asked what was wrong we were told it was gastroenteritis. We were not informed of the suspicion of Addison's or the need for the test.
Angela Walker:So it was known Addison's was a risk. A test was ordered, it wasn't carried out and ultimately that's how Robbie died.
Will Powell:Yes, had the test been done he would have been diagnosed. But what the hospital did is they put the GPs on notice of the suspicion of Addison's and the need for the ACTH test and they were instructed to refer Robbie immediately back to hospital if he became unwell. He was seen, as you said, by five GPs on seven occasions in the last 15 days of his life. He couldn't walk for days before he died.
Angela Walker:What were your thoughts at the time when your very sick son was being seen by multiple doctors who were dismissing your fears?
Will Powell:Well, I believe that they'd looked at the medical records. When I found out later, only one GP out of the five on the seven occasions looked at the notes and he was aware and admitted on 11th April, six days before Robbie's death, that Addison's was suspected. He before Robbie's death the Addisons were suspected. He knew Robbie's life was at risk. He didn't tell us but did say he would refer Robbie immediately back to hospital and then failed to do so.
Angela Walker:Rob, you were the Health Ombudsman from 2017 to 2024. At what point did you hear about what happened to Robbie Powell, did you?
Sir Rob Behrens:hear about what happened to Robbie Powell. I was quite quickly informed about what had happened, first because my office had had previous undistinguished involvement in the case and secondly because Mr Powell approached me and asked to talk to me about the issue and I went to Wales to meet him and spent a day at his house talking to him and his wife and his friend Mr Herbert, to inform myself about what had happened, and I was appalled. First of all, can I just say that my office, before I joined, had done a disservice to Mr Powell by improperly treating the case and making unacceptable personal remarks about him on the notes, which is something which should never have happened and for which my predecessor apologised. But it made me determined to try and make amends as a result of that.
Angela Walker:And you supported a public inquiry. That hasn't happened, has it? Why is that?
Sir Rob Behrens:Well, I wrote and lobbied and talked to ministers of the former government and there were a lot of them that changed during my seven years in office. I campaigned with my Welsh counterpart, nick Bennett, and we jointly wrote to ministers. I met with ministers, I argued the case at the Select Committee on Public Administration and there was general sympathy for what had happened and a real respect for Mr Powell, but there was no enthusiasm to conduct a public inquiry, to conduct a public inquiry which would have brought a closure after so long, and that was unfortunate and wrong and unacceptable. And the arguments that we used about how much could be learned from this case. And you you know, if you just read about how it happened, mr Powell was personally traduced by doctors, by regulators, by the police service, by the Crown Prosecution Service, by politicians in a way which is just unacceptable. He was patronised and he never gave up and this, to me, is an inspiration of what you need to do in order to try and get justice in the world.
Sir Rob Behrens:Now, on one or two occasions we came quite close, if not to getting an inquiry, to getting the government to accept that there should be some mechanism to set up a review of difficult historical cases which should have been reviewed, and the Select Committee on Public Administration supported us on that. But ministers were determined that that shouldn't take place because they thought that that gave too much focus on things that had happened too long ago and they wrongly assumed that there was nothing to learn from the process. And, frankly, anybody who's read the file on this and turns away and argues that nothing can be learned from it, it's simply not reading the papers rigorously enough.
Angela Walker:We're talking here about the treatment of a bereaved family. We've talked about, really, what can be described as a catalogue of errors. Would you go so far to say that this was a cover-up?
Sir Rob Behrens:Well, of course there were elements of cover-up throughout the whole case, both before Robbie died and after he died, and things of great concern which actually I came across as ombudsman, though not in the same concentrated way the disappearance of documents, the refusal to give a proper account of what had happened. There clearly was an unsatisfactory that's a light word set of incidents in the way that the Crown Prosecution Service took so long to look at and handle the case. And one of the things that impresses me is that, despite the disgraceful incidents that occurred after Robbie died, there were good people who came forward to make sure that this case wasn't lost. Mr Powell's friend, mr Herbert, played a good role in supporting him. The Reverend Thomas, who gave evidence that he saw that Addison's disease had been suspected by the hospital. He stood up for Mr Powell and was disgracefully introduced by the police and other authorities. And perhaps most of all and Mr Powell will tell you about this himself there was a police officer called I think Poole was the name.
Will Powell:DCI Robert Poole from West Midlands Police.
Sir Rob Behrens:Would you like to say a bit about what he did, because it was remarkable.
Will Powell:In 1990, I complained under the NHS complaints procedure. My complaint was covered up. I appealed to the Welsh Office. I was given an appeal hearing that collapsed because of collusion between the doctors, the Welsh Office staff and the tribunal members. I had to pay £34,000 in 1992 for legal representation. The Welsh Office told me that it was a gesture of goodwill that I didn't have to pay for the doctors' legal expenses. Now at that time they were denying wrongdoing. But the parliamentary ombudsman seven years after the Welsh officer affair found them guilty of maladministration. So all my allegations that led to the collapse of the appeal in my view have been proven.
Will Powell:I went to the police in 1994. I went to Dubbett Powers Police. What I didn't know was they actually retained the GPs as police surgeons, the two criminal investigations between 1994 and 2000, claiming, supported by the CPS, that there was no evidence of crimes. Yet we had given them irrefutable evidence. As a consequence of me making formal complaints against the Chief Constable of David Powers Police and the Deputy Chief Constable, they called in the late DCI Robert Poole from West Midlands. What an amazing man. Sorry, I get emotional because he'd done so much for the family. He investigated Robbie's death thoroughly. He set out 35 criminal charges. It went to the CPS in York In 2003,. It was confirmed that there was sufficient evidence to prosecute two doctors and a secretary for forgery and attempting to pervert the course of justice. But the passage of time now prevented prosecutions and David Power's police, who were found institutionally incompetent, had given the doctors, with the support of the CPS, a letter of immunity.
Angela Walker:That must have been so frustrating Will.
Will Powell:Well, it's been difficult. All the way through I've been shut doors. I fought them. I'll fight them till I die. If I don't get justice for Robbie, then so be it.
Angela Walker:It must be so exhausting. You know to be fighting against the system in this way, and I know that you've pursued so many avenues. You know you were up against the health care system, the police. You know, rob. What does this sequence of events tell us about the mechanisms for dealing with historical wrongs, like in the case of the death of Robbie Powell?
Sir Rob Behrens:Yeah, what they show is that they don't work and that there needs to be substantial reform to address things so that they never happen in the way that they did happen. So, fundamentally, we have a situation where documents disappeared, clinicians lied, no account was given to the family about what had happened and, ultimately, there was no real clarity about whether people are required to give an account of candour to families. And we're still fighting for that. So you know, as we speak, the Department of Health is reviewing the duty of candour as it currently exists in its unacceptable form, when really this should have been addressed many years ago as a result of seeing how inadequate the legislation has been. It's not to say it was wrong to introduce it after 2014, but it simply isn't powerful enough. It doesn't work. It doesn't give incentives to individuals to tell the truth about what had happened, and the penalties at the moment for not disclosing are laughable in terms of a deterrent. So you know, the duty of candor doesn't work. We don't have an effective whistleblowing system to allow people to explain what is really happening, and whistleblowers get cut off at the knees when they try to do that.
Sir Rob Behrens:And thirdly and this is very relevant if you look at the way in which Mr Powell has been traduced and patronised through this long period. I mean, straight after Robbie died, when there was an initial court hearing, he was treated absolutely disgracefully for trying to ask questions which any reasonable person would ask, and we are still struggling with this issue. We're struggling with a culture which, in many respects, despite the excellence of many people in the health service and their professionalism, the culture is toxic, unacceptable and abusive to individuals, not only to patients, but to their families, and also, sadly, to people who work in the health system, who are equally produced by people in senior management and senior clinicians in a way which means that the system doesn't work properly. All of this is reflected in the experience that Mr Powell has had, and that's why I'm still convinced that there's merit in having an inquiry to look at this, because it illustrates what goes wrong, and it still goes wrong.
Will Powell:May I say something here, angela, please do? In 1996, my wife and I were suing the five GPs and West Lombokan Health Authority for the negligence of Robbie and for causing his death. We were also suing them for the psychological damage they had caused us because of the cover-up and the post-death events. Now we can settle the case out of court. It was estimated at £300,000. That was £5,000 statutory payment for Robbie's death. The rest was the psychological damage caused to my wife and the psychological damage caused by me, which was post-traumatic stress disorder which meant I didn't work for 25 years. We refused to settle out of court and as a consequence the GPPs made an application to the court claiming they had no legal obligation to tell us the truth. So Mr Powell's claim cannot be made against us and in 1996 at the High Court in Cardiff the judge ruled that doctors do not have a legal obligation to tell the truth over the negligent circumstances of a child's death and I took that case to the Court of Appeal.
Will Powell:Now my wife was paid £80,000 compensation and it was an admission of Robbie's death by Westle Morgan Health Authority, westle Morgan Health Authority. That £80,000 was kept by the court pending the appeal against the High Court judgment. Because the Court of Appeal supported the High Court, they took the £80,000 from Deanne, so we ended up with no compensation whatsoever. I hadn't worked for six years, I'd remortgaged my house, we'd spent £32,000 plus on legal fees. We were all bankrupt. And we choose to expose the absence of a duty of candour rather than accept money for Robbie's death, because it's never been about money. It's just been about truth and appropriate accountability never been about money.
Angela Walker:It's just been about truth and appropriate accountability. How can it be that medics are not under a legal obligation to explain the causes of the death of a child if they are aware of what those causes are? That's what you're fighting for here, really isn't it Will.
Will Powell:It is. But when I went to the European Court of Human Rights, it summed it up quite clearly Doctors do not have to tell parents the truth about the negligent death of their child or refrain from falsifying medical records. There's not a case in this country, angela, where there's been 35 charges against doctors and they've walked free. There's been cover-up after cover-up, and it's an embarrassment to the state that all these allegations were made 34 years ago and were ignored, and this is the biggest problem I have. But there's one thing I'd like to say the post office scandal has helped me and others immensely because it exposed exactly what we've been suffering for decades.
Angela Walker:It's interesting that you mentioned the post office scandal. I did a lot of work on the infected blood scandal, you know, and people were silenced by medical professionals for years and years and still victims and their families are waiting for compensation payments. Rob, do you think, with this new government now, that there is some hope that Will and his family will get a public inquiry or that we'll see a duty of candour made law, or that?
Sir Rob Behrens:we'll see a duty of candour made law. Well, I've been around long enough to know that you shouldn't put all your eggs in one basket and that new governments have good intentions which are quite often not delivered. I have some respect for the new health secretary. I believe that he's determined to address some of the issues, and there is talk and planning for legislation around the Hillsborough law which would do something not everything to address some of these issues, but there are structural issues that really do need to be addressed. You can't change the culture unless you have regulators who are themselves aware of how to behave properly and how to treat people properly, and we've seen in the last six months even that very significant regulators in the health service have been brought to task because they have failed to do their job properly in terms of looking at what's happening in hospitals and in the health service and in terms of making effective judgments about how to do things better. If you don't have effective regulation, if you don't have a joined-up system where different parts of the system talk to each other and learn from how things go wrong, then it's never going to change. And one of the frustrations that I have is that in the letters that I wrote to ministers about this issue and I wasn't Joe Public, I was a Parliamentary and Health Service Ombudsman it would take six months before I got a reply. So there was no enthusiasm to address this issue, and I hope that the new government, which does understand that there are significant issues in the health service to be addressed, will have a different attitude to the lived experience which goes on, which Mr Powell represents, along with thousands of other people.
Sir Rob Behrens:I mean, we're not just talking about him.
Sir Rob Behrens:There are around 11,000 avoidable deaths in the health service every year, with billions of pounds of compensation being paid to people who want to litigate because of the way in which their loved ones have been treated.
Sir Rob Behrens:So there is a really big issue here and it's not going away and it does need urgent treatment. And one of the things I would just like to finish by saying is that why was the post office, why were those people so successful in bringing public attention to this? In part, it was because of the way in which they were able to bring social media and television to support their views, to make it a public case. Now, for one reason or another, through no fault of his, mr Powell has not been able to do that, to persuade television that this is something that should be looked at. And we do need to realise that it's not just public inquiries sometimes not even public inquiries at all that make changes. It's the popular view and podcasters like you and journalists like you, who do have a powerful influence to try and change things in a way that they need to be changed.
Will Powell:Can.
Will Powell:I come in here with a bit please, angela, because there's something really important I'd like to share with both of you.
Will Powell:Recently, my Assembly member for the Welsh Assembly, a Conservative, a man called James Evans very nice man. He'd written to the Secretary of State for Wales prior to the election requesting that we have a meeting. The then Secretary of State didn't respond other than saying we'll deal with this matter after the election. Well, after the election it changed from Conservative to Labour, as you will know. So we contacted the new Labour Secretary of State for Wales, jo Stephens. She initially attempted to pass this on, because health in Wales is devolved to the National Assembly, but we argued that what happened at the Welsh office in 1992 is about the administration of that office and, because there were allegations of dishonesty and corruption, that that's a matter that should be addressed. The positive news is the Secretary of State for Wales has now agreed to meet me and I'm hoping to be accompanied by Dr Michael Powers, kc, who's been involved in Robbie's case for over 30 years and represented me at the Welsh Office Appeal.
Angela Walker:I wish you every success in that meeting and I hope you get some answers and I hope you get your public inquiry, although the CPS covered up and they didn't prosecute and they investigated my complaints in 2003.
Will Powell:I alleged it was a cover-up of my complaints. Well, eventually I was told that the case is closed and that they will not be responding. This is the Director of Public Prosecutions will not be responding to any further correspondence from me. That was 2003. In 2013, my former MP had an adjournment debate and, to cut a long story short, that resulted in the Director of Public Prosecutions, on the 9th of October 2014, setting up a legal review into Robbie's case. That legal review took nine years and four months. It confirmed exactly what the CPS had said in 2003, that the doctors can't be prosecuted, although there's sufficient evidence to do so because of the passage of time and the immunity letter. However, they were critical of the CPS's handling of Robbie's case and had the police, david Powys' police and the CPS not failed Robbie between 1994 and 2000. These people would have faced criminal charges.
Angela Walker:So, rob, how can it be right that, because of the passage of time, people aren't held to account, especially when there's such a large passage of time, because the people that should have been held to account were stalling the process?
Sir Rob Behrens:Yeah, well, I mean, it is a principle of effective administration that you shouldn't take too long to look at issues, and so most regulatory bodies will have a time limit on what they would look at issues, and so most regulatory bodies will have a time limit on what they would look at. In this case, there was a deliberate attempt to, as Mr Powell says, cover it up and to hope that it would go away, and that cannot be acceptable under any circumstances. And that cannot be acceptable under any circumstances. And it is shameful for British public administration to have a Crown Prosecution Service that takes so long to come to an effective conclusion to issues that should have been resolved much earlier. And frankly I think this is true If Mr Poole had not passed on his papers before he died, it's quite likely that this would have gone away, because Mr Powell would not have had the evidence that he was able to make his case compelling and he wouldn't have been as successful as he's been.
Sir Rob Behrens:And the last point is this that Mr Powell's life has been turned upside down and his wife by what's happened. But it is to his great honour that his son will always be remembered for this case, and it is a great tribute to him that that has happened, because you know what a wonderful uh son to have had uh and but what wonderful parents the son uh had to uh to fight this long uh and so hard and so uh brilliantly. And we don't talk enough about that. And so brilliant and we don't talk enough about that.
Angela Walker:Well, you've been campaigning for your son, for justice. There can't be justice but for answers for Robbie how has that affected you Well?
Will Powell:it's affected your whole life. It affected my other two sons, one who's died since in 41. I believe he died of medical negligence and I won't go into that though, but we've lost him. He left four children behind him. It's devastated our lives. You're never the same in any person in a household. When a child has died, we understand fully how it affects the parents, the siblings, the general family, and it's it's the thing about. It is we all make mistakes in life and that can't be helped. But when a child dies or an adult dies and there's errors that have been made that shouldn't have been made, we should be told the truth, and I think on many occasions we would understand, possibly, why mistakes were made. But to lie, cover up and falsify records is unacceptable, and these people need to be prosecuted if that's what they try to do.
Angela Walker:My heart goes out to you and your wife and your whole family and I really hope that with this podcast we can help raise a bit of awareness about what happened and I hope people watching and listening will share this podcast so we can reach more people and try and get some answers for you. Will Powell, Rob Berens, thank you both so much for joining me. Thank you both, veryens. Thank you both so much for joining me.
Will Powell:Thank you both very much and thank you, Mr Berens, for giving us the time here today You've been listening to Angela Walker in Conversation.
Angela Walker:Don't forget to subscribe to this podcast. Please rate it and share it with others, and do check out other episodes of this Human Interest podcast and you can contact me through my website, angelawalkerreports. Walker reports comm. Until next time, take care.
