Headliner Mindset

BRIGHT LIGHTS - How To Be An Authentic Artist AND Music Business Savage

• Nik Cherwink

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Bright Lights is a two-time Grammy nominated singer, songwriter, artist, producer and DJ with a long list of accolades in the music industry. From writing songs for A-list artists like Justin Bieber and Britany Spears, to singing on tracks with dance music legends like Porter Robinson, Zedd and Hardwell, she has established herself as a true power player in the scene.

Now focusing on her own artist project, she’s getting ready to drop a full-length album and carve out her place in dance music history. In this episode we talk about her decision to release an album rather than singles, the importance of teamwork and collaboration, how to find the “soul” of your art/music and much more.

Follow Bright Lights here:
https://www.instagram.com/brightlights333

Follow Nik Cherwink here:
https://www.instagram.com/nikcherwink

And visit my site to join the mailing list or book a free coaching call:
https://www.nikcherwink.com

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

It's really important to channel what you feel. And that is something that I'll be honest with you, that can't be taught. That's not taught. You either are a writer or you're not. You're either a poet or you're not, we can tighten up the technical side of what we do. of art comes from that person's life experiences and the way that they see the world. Nobody teaches you that

Nik:

What's up, everybody? Welcome to the Headliner Mindset Podcast. Today's guest is a singer, songwriter, producer, and DJ with a massive catalog of music that has earned her two Grammy nominations, over a billion streams, and shows all over the world. She has written tracks for A list pop artists like Justin Bieber, Britney Spears, and Usher, while also dominating the dance music scene by writing and performing hits with artists like Porter Robinson, Zedd, Hardwell, and many more. This is Bright Lights.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Hi.

Nik:

Welcome to the show. Welcome to the party. I'm super pumped to have you here.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Thank you. Thank you for the invite. I'm excited.

Nik:

Yeah, I think, I think y'all are in for a treat today. I think we're about to get a masterclass on, uh, music business and the artist journey, uh, cause this girl has been doing the damn thing. As you heard in the intro, you have quite the history and quite, quite the Rolodex of, uh, of experience in, in the music game. So I'm very excited to dive in with you. And. I'd really just love to start by hearing a little bit about your story. I read that you were, uh, that you started singing in the church. Cause I, I know like all the dopest singers and songwriters, that's always where they started. They all like everyone that came from the church scene, like they just fucking crush it. So you guys started pretty young. tell me a little bit about like your story and, and how you, how you came up in the music industry.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah, I think the first time I was really drawn to music was very, very young. It was like one of my first memories, you know, in church and what they call like feeling the Holy Ghost, right? Like people say that, but I don't know how I realized it at such a young age, but I really understood that that was music. Like I really understood that without music, I wouldn't have felt that I wouldn't be in that emotion, right? And so I really was from that point on just drawn to music. Um, my mom wanted me to be a singer, you know, she wanted to be a singer. And then even when she was pregnant with me, she was always playing music and um, you know, teaching me to sing as I was growing up. And then I started performing very young. Uh, I was touring by the time I was about 12, with a band and also with the choir. Uh, I did that for three or four years, almost four years, five years. The marching band was, we were the band for the number one football team in the state like year after year after year. So it was, it was like in South Carolina.

Nik:

Okay.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

it was like real tour life, you know, when you're on the road with the team that's doing that kind of those kind of wins like we were really on the road with them. So that was my first taste of touring. Then I started going out with the choir and we were touring churches all around. I would do that every summer. Um, and that was a full on tour. That was like a proper tour bus. Um, that was a heavy, heavy tour. so I did that for a few years and, uh, I eventually ended up leaving a pre med major. I was gonna be a doctor and I ended up, I ended up leaving that and going to Berkeley to pursue music. Yeah,

Nik:

Because I think that's a really interesting part of your story. That, um, You know, there's a lot of people that go to a four year school thinking like, this is what I'm supposed to do. Cause we're very socially programmed to, you know, go to college, get a degree and go down that path. So like, what was the moment where you actually made that decision? Like, what was it that actually got you to be, you know, to take a, a very courageous stand and say, Hey, I'm going to, I'm going to actually go for something else. That's a

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah, I, I produced my first record. Yeah, I produced my first song. I was always writing. I've been writing since I was about eight or nine. But to actually have a recording. My first, the first recording was on ADAT. It was like at the transition of analog to digital. So my first, uh, my first record was on ADAT. And my second record was Pro Tools. but yeah, producing my own record. Uh, I remember my friends saying, Oh my God, I can hear this on the radio. This is crazy. And so I thought, wow, like maybe I could actually make a living. off of music. It was never really a reality to me because I come from the middle of nowhere, like where that's just not even a thought in your head. Even if you do music, even if you're good at it, it's not a thought of like, Oh, I could maybe do that for work,

Nik:

Yeah. And you think part of that was having somebody else hear it and kind of getting that feedback from somebody?

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Oh, definitely.

Nik:

up your eyes? Yeah.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Definitely. Yeah, yeah,

Nik:

for all you that are sitting on your tracks and not putting them out,

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Put them out!

Nik:

Put those

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Put them out.

Nik:

get some of that feedback. Get some of that validation. Let's, let's, let's do it. That's really, that's cool. I'm, I'm, I'm happy to hear that. So you said fuck it. I'm out pre med. I'm gonna go to Berkeley instead.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

it was, it was still a hard choice because I went from having a full scholarship. I was on a full academic ride to no scholarship. So, you know, from getting 40, 000 a year to paying 40, 000 a year. It was a big choice and people thought I was crazy. People thought I had lost my mind.

Nik:

Yeah, and you know, you got to be a little fucking crazy right and that's that's so so rad though Like it takes it takes a lot of courage like to follow your heart to take that leap of faith To ultimately believe in yourself that much right? Like I'm literally gonna put my money where my mouth is, right?

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

it was really in my heart. It was really in my heart to do it. And I remember my dad sat down with me when I made that decision. And he was asking me all these questions to make sure. that that decision was really in my heart and it wasn't something that I wanted to do for money or fame or anything like that he he wanted to make sure this was really a heart thing

Nik:

Yeah, it's, it's making me just think about, you know, how many songs and big songs you've created since then, how many like millions and millions of people have heard those songs, how many people have danced to those songs and cried to those songs and made love to those songs. So, you know, it's like, like if you didn't make that decision, you know, none of those songs would have been born. None of those songs would have been, channeled through your vessel and brought down from the universe and fucking born into this world, you know So that's uh, that's a wild thing to think about, you know, Wayne Wayne Dyer has one of my favorite quotes He says don't die with your music still inside you alright

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

your art inside you Yeah.

Nik:

beautiful So you went to Berklee College of Music one of the best, institutions for for music out there How was that experience for you?

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Uh, it was good. Um, I didn't know music theory. Uh, so Berklee taught me music theory. I didn't even know like what a major and minor scale was before I went to Berklee. And everything was like by ear. I didn't even know what a major or minor scale was when I first got to Berklee. It also really taught me how to lead a band. Because think about it, when I was touring and playing all those years, I wasn't leading. I wasn't like the lead, there was no lead singer, you know, so it really taught me how to be able to hop on stage with any musicians and be able to perform and have a impromptu show and just jam and yeah, just how to communicate with musicians. I think those were the two best things that Berklee taught me.

Nik:

cool. So were you in, did you have bands like outside of school? Were you

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Oh, yeah, I had a ton of bands. I had like a rock band that was kind of like evanescence. I had a, I had a hip hop band. I was always a rapper too. So I had a hip hop band. It was like a jazz hip hop band.

Nik:

Side note real quick. I'm gonna throw this out there because I have this little Like I play the guitar and I just kind of fuck around. But like I, you know, I can, I can, I can shred. I can, I can throw down,

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

I saw you.

Nik:

a, part of me that I'm like, man, I kind of want to start a band and like, I love metal, but I really love like female vocals and like the contrast of like

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm hmm.

Nik:

like light vocals and

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah. Mm

Nik:

So just throwing this out there, any, uh, any female singers that are listening, if you want to join my band, I'm going to start a fucking band. And I want to have a girl that's, uh, that's fronting it. So that's super, super, cool that you did that.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah, yeah, I love those kind of bands like Paramore or just like female fronted rock bands Did you see the No Doubt Coachella performance this

Nik:

saw, I saw some clips of it. Yeah,

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

they were crushing it. I just I love to see that

Nik:

Yeah. Yeah. And so what was your introduction really into the music industry post college? what happened from there and how'd you really establish yourself as a songwriter and artist?

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

My last year at Berklee I ended up getting cast on a reality show With Missy Elliott where we were touring around the country on tour with her and dancing and singing and rapping and performing. I was like one of the first few people kicked off, but, but that was, but that was my, introduction to being a professional writer, a professional, like I was making money at that point. that was the first time I had to register with ASCAP and BMI and, learn about publishing and all that kind of stuff. So I had one more year at Berkeley, but because I already had started as a professional artist, it kind of, I kind of like lost steam and I never graduated. and then I moved to New York. I was always an artist. I've always been an artist, but I couldn't get a record deal. So I was like, well, let me try to, write for other artists, beef up my pen, and then, you know, we'll see what happens. And then, I spent about four years writing without making a dime, you know, really struggling. And then one day I had a meeting that led to another meeting, another meeting, another meeting, and I came up very, very fast. I went from no one knows your songs to everybody that I grew up listening to was singing my songs.

Nik:

And I really want to highlight that right there. Of just putting in the work, putting in the hours and getting no return for a long time. You

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah. four years,

Nik:

any money, right? and then you had your moment, but like how many people are willing to work for free and not make any money and keep showing up and keep putting in the fucking time, you know, a lot of us are so anxious for it to happen quickly. And a lot of people throw in the towel way too early, you know,

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

I mean, this is something, this is something I still deal with. I still deal with it. Like I just dropped a podcast, right? Episode one this week. Episode one didn't hit the way I wanted it to hit. So what's the first thought in my head? It's like, Oh, did I make the wrong? Did I make the right decision? Should I cancel the podcast? You know, and a lot of times we pull back. When really we should see something through and really we should just develop that, you know, instead of letting a few, you were saying, drop your music and see what people say. Even if people say this is trash, that's okay,

Nik:

Yeah.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

you know, because you're developing. and even somebody like me who's developed as a songwriter, I'm still developing other crafts and other things that play into my business.

Nik:

Yeah. So well said. And. I some clips from your podcast as well. Make it make sense.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Nik:

let's give a shout out to the podcast. Everybody go follow this. what's it all about?

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

it's super niche. Like today I was like, damn, is it too niche?

Nik:

No, niche is, niche is good. Niche is

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

But I made it because it's something that I wish was out when I was coming up, right? Like, there's not a lot of professional artists, writers, or producers who will get on a platform publicly and talk about their own stories and their own experiences and shout out how much money they spent, how much money they made, what that deal looked like. You know, and so I, I did it to share my own personal story, but also to create conversations in the music business about common practices and things that we all see that maybe need to change or maybe something that worked that, hey, you could try that too, you know? So I wanted it to create conversations more than anything, but, but it's very, it's detailed. It's very detailed, you know, it's it's mostly for people who are in the business or want to be in the business Mm

Nik:

You know, my podcast is not the biggest podcast in the world. I've been doing it for a year now, which is incredible. What I will say is the people that are listening, the fans, the followers, They're so fucking dope and they're so engaged and they're so loyal and everybody that's listening right now. I fucking love you I appreciate all the dms and the messages and the love and the sharing, you know what I mean? like we're building our little community over here It sounds like a hundred percent, you know, right up Everybody's alley. You want to learn about the music business. You want to learn about deals. You want to learn about money and, and, and some of these behind the doors conversations, you know, that not everybody, uh, always shares. It sounds like a, an amazing, you know, uh, platform and discussion that, that you're curating. So everybody go check that out. Make it make sense. keep going with it. Just keep doing it.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Thank you. I was thinking,

Nik:

out.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

I was thinking about you this week cause you reached out to me about this podcast and I was like, man, I wonder what his experience was in the beginning, like the first couple episodes. And like, it's, it's kind of hard to get your bearing sometimes, like we're here recording camera to camera, right? Like I'm at my house. You're at your place. The way we recorded was in a studio.

Nik:

Yeah.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

now I'm like, is it does it connect more if I'm looking at if people are looking at the camera, right? How we're doing it right now. So there's a lot of questions and things. I'm working out,

Nik:

for sure. For sure. And there's no one right way to do it. I would, I would love to do these in person if I could, you know, but I'm, I'm, I'm in Austin. A lot of people are in, not in Austin

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Nik:

you know, we, it's like gotta make do with what you have.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

But honestly, I think it, I think it might work better because we are face to the camera. Like if you go and look at my first episode, I'm like, I'm a little bit disconnected from the audience. And here we're like, we're right here. So I like this. Yeah.

Nik:

Good. Good. Well, everyone go check that out. I'm very excited to, to listen to it as well. And, um, sounds like, you know, it, the, the, it's so important. Like being niche is important because it's like, that's some shit that doesn't exist and

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm hmm.

Nik:

about it, you

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Nik:

what I'm, I'm finding. I love about these conversations as well too, is like, there's, there's just not a lot of this stuff out there. So, we need more of it. The more, the merrier, the merrier. Let's bring it, let's bring that, bring it and, and, and add the value. You know, that's what it's all about. so you, you had this moment, you were grinded for four years and what happened then it started to pop off. What started to happen for you?

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Uh, so my whole career started from a message on Myspace. Like, just a cold, yeah, just a cold email, a cold call, like whatever you want to call it. Like,

Nik:

I call it shooting your shot.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Exactly, shooting your shot. Yeah, so I reached out to the VP of A& R at Island Def Jam at the time, who had just, A& R ed the Speakerboxx Love Below album, OutKast, latest Avril Lavigne project, signed Avril back in the day, An artist curly that I really loved that was very unique and and original And then uh another artist that nobody knew at the time, but that I really loved was lady gaga And he had signed her to island def jam This was before her deal with jimmy before just dance before the the album even existed Yeah, so he signed her first and I really loved his ear and his eye for talent And I said that in my email. I love the kind of artists you're signing. I love the way you develop. Here's a couple songs. I think I sent three songs like demos. Maybe I could come help write for some of your artists and he emailed me back right away and said I love what you sent me. Can you take a meeting? And I was freaking out. I was like, holy crap.

Nik:

Yo, you guys, I've said this many times. Shoot your fucking shot. You have nothing to lose put yourself out there But I also like what like your approach though too because a lot of times people are shooting their shot But they're just like copying pasting

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Nah, you gotta be smart about

Nik:

yeah, you gotta have it. You gotta like I love like you actually Knew who you were talking to. You were

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm hmm.

Nik:

a fan, you, you know, you, you told them specifically what it was about them that

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm hmm.

Nik:

funny. I just, I literally just yesterday, I shot my shot with the manager of one of my favorite bands. And I was like, yo, this is why I want you on the podcast specifically. And like what you did with the band and the branding that you had around the last two albums. You know, it was very specific. And so I think that's a great, a great point. And yeah, it worked for you.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So, uh, so, you know, from there, I sort of became, quickly became known as, like, a really great writer. And I went from, you know, Island Def Jam to Atlantic to Interscope to every major label who wanted records from me. And so it was a, it was a very surreal time because, you know, I grew up listening to Usher and Britney Spears and Beyonce and you know, all of these kind of artists. And these were the artists that. Wanted to record my records or wanted to get in the studio And so that was I don't know. It was very very surreal

Nik:

Dang. How did you handle going from zero to a hundred?

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

By the seat of my pants

Nik:

Mm-Hmm.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah, I luckily I had a great management team At the time when you come up so fast like that. It's not difficult to get a team You know, like people can smell the money in the air and it's like, Hey, this is going to go like this. This writer is going to go. And luckily, um, the people that approached me and the people I was connected with were really good hearted humans, like with a vision for what I was doing. and a respect for the integrity of the art as well. So, I got really lucky and blessed that the songwriting side of what I was doing was so well protected.

Nik:

Yeah. Yeah. So having a good team around you is, is really key.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

It was everything.

Nik:

Yeah. Smart. And were you also establishing yourself as an artist at that point as well? Or were you just purely songwriting?

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

I was trying to. I mean, I'm still establishing myself as an artist, if we're being honest. you know, I left the pop world and went into dance and I featured on all of these, DJs records, but those were their records, you know, I wrote and I sang on them, but as we know, in the dance world, like producers, DJs kind of run the dance world.

Nik:

Yeah.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

And they get all the looks and the opportunities and things like that. and they're looked at as the artist. To be fair, just because you're a singer doesn't mean you're an artist. Just because you're a producer does not mean you're an artist. You know, an artist is someone who has something to say. And I've always had a very unique perspective. And something cool to say that, you know, isn't really said in the way that I say it, you know, and so I am now moving into having records of my own solo records where I'm, where I'm standing on my own as a writer, singer, producer, and that is really, really hard, you know, but it's something that's in my heart to do. It's something I feel like I have to do. I don't have a choice in that. If I made no money for 10 years, I would still do that because I'm an artist, like for real. You know, and so I think that's the question that you need to ask in your head. If you're going to do something, what art related. If you're going to do something art related, would you do it for free? At 60 years old, would you be down to teach that? You know, is it really a passion? And, and if the answer is yes, then you have to pursue that.

Nik:

Yeah. Beautifully said. You know, I had a really good conversation. I saw you did a track with Colleena Xanders.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

did. That's my boo.

Nik:

yeah, yeah. Colleena is the homie. I fucking

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

I love her. Yeah. Yeah.

Nik:

I, I had her on the podcast, uh, a couple months ago

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

she came on

Nik:

Yeah, and that was a part of it was I did want to talk to her and I've talked to a few other, you know, singers as well that come from coming from the featured artist space,

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm

Nik:

being the featured vocalist, and the common sort of trap of being stuck there. Yeah, these guys go off and make 20 or 30 or 50 grand a night, off of, using a song that you wrote and that your vocals are on. Right. And so it's a very like, common challenge for a lot of singers and songwriters. It's like, Hey, like I just got paid like a couple grand for this song and I'm not living off of it, but this. Artists is making millions of dollars traveling the world,

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

hmm, yeah.

Nik:

or a lot, you know, a lot of, a lot of, singers and songwriters really wanting to establish their brand as the artist and putting out their own tracks. And so I noticed that, you know, with you as well, I saw the last like four or five songs that you put out were all like solo songs and you've got some very cohesive branding around it. And it seems like you're, you're really like, planning your flag in the ground and establishing like your identity for your artist project now

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah, it's, uh, it's so much fun to, to do this and to, uh, I'm putting out my full album this year. Making an album is such a labor of love, like it's the hardest thing I've ever done, but it's the most fulfilling thing I've ever done. I have actually one week to deliver the album to the distributor. I'm shooting. I'm shooting the cover tomorrow. So yes, so we're like really at the last minute. Final, whatever changes you make now, that's it, you know, and wherever it is in a week, I let it go. And once it's out, it's out and it's no longer mine. It's, it's the world's, the world's songs and it's everybody else's music at which point it's out.

Nik:

and what made you decide to want to do an album rather than just singles

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Because very few artists can do an album. You gotta be, you gotta be really seasoned. To do an album like you got to really make records You know and and like if you ask the one thing that I do somebody's like, oh, what do you do? Oh, I make records I'm a producer Like I i've always been a producer even when I was known mostly known for songwriting You know, I I make records and so I wanted to make an album because so few people especially in dance So few people can make an album. It's difficult. It is not easy to make a body of work that's cohesive, that can be listened to from top to bottom, that's classic, that can be played 10, 20, 30 years from now. And that was my goal going into this is just to make a body of art that speaks, you know, and makes people feel something.

Nik:

All right you guys, I gotta jump in here real quick just to share some very exciting news. But we are about to host our 2nd annual. Cult creatives build a brand workshop. If you've been listening to the podcast for a while, you've definitely heard me talk about the cult creatives. It's a branding and marketing agency that works specifically with artists run by one of my best friends, Chris White. We held a workshop last year where we spent three days working with a group of artists to develop their brands, to really figure out who are you as an artist? What are you trying to say? What's your identity? How are you? Unique and different and separating yourself from the rest of the other thousands and thousands of people that are doing this, but then also help them actually build the brand. So creating their logos, doing a whole day of photoshoots. So everybody is walking away with super high level photoshoots. Brands created by a very high level agency that look professional that instantly separate you from the pack My favorite part about the workshop though was seeing all of the relationships that were developed I've seen people working together now doing collaborations a lot of friendships were made So just getting in the room and spending three days with some other driven ambitious, hungry artists. Developing those relationships is so important and it's so much fun. And this year I'm excited because I'm actually going to be a lot more involved in the actual programming. So I'm going to be doing some headliner mindset. Workshops exercises like we're gonna emphasize that side of it a lot more as well Just like what does it actually take not just from building the brand and the marketing? But like who you have to be as a person the kind of mindset that you have so I'm gonna come in there I'm gonna work my magic get everybody fucking fired up. I'm really excited about it This is happening in Los Angeles for three days, June 28th, 29th and 30th of Friday Saturday and Sunday if you're gonna be in LA or even if you're not you should fly out for this shit. It's gonna be incredible=Also, we do have special guests that are coming in every day So we have some really big really cool artists that are gonna be guest speakers on all three days It's going to be a party y'all. If you're interested, send me a DM on Instagram, I'll get you on the waiting list and I'll send you all the info once we get our site up, but it's going down in LA baby, I hope to see you there. you're a really fun guest to, have come on because you're somebody that I saw you make a post on Instagram about, um, you know, Basically, you had posted, I think, a teaser for a music video that you were putting out for one of these songs. And it was, it looked so dope. And I was like, yo, I thought this was the new Dune movie. I thought this was like a trailer for the fucking new Dune movie. I was like, this is sick. And I was like, what? I was like, yo, I gotta get you on the podcast. Cause you were talking about how you made your own music. Artwork and video, you know, you made a whole post about how you made this whole music video for like 200 bucks. Uh, so I'd, I'd love to, well, well, first let me ask this question. it seems like there is a balance of doing a lot yourself, but also not doing it all yourself too. Like you also to put out an album, you need a team

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

of course, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Nik:

I'm, first, I'd be curious to kind of hear about the team. Who else like is helping you in creating the the brand and the project and the album, you know Cuz that's a

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah, I'm so glad I'm so glad you asked about that because I love to give the team shine. I think it's really important to talk about the people, you know, because the artists project really is a collective of people right at the end of the day.

Nik:

should be because also I think a lot of people, especially the more like bit, you know, bedroom producers are just like, I got to make everything by myself because I can. Right?

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

That's a lie. Like, no, none of these people are making this on their own. Like, think about your favorite producer, your favorite artist. None of that is made on their own. Even if you look at the, even if you look at the credits and it only says their name, I can almost not, 98 percent guarantee somebody else was involved in

Nik:

Yeah, yeah, usually like five or six people, you know, all of our, all of our favorite songs. It was not one, person

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm hmm.

Nik:

on their laptop, you know, nine times out of 10, there's a, there's a fucking team happening behind

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah, and the cool thing about collaboration is you have so many different perspectives. Everybody comes from a different walk of life, a different class structure, a different race, a different, like everybody has different perspectives. So when you bring all of that into a piece of art, It makes it really special and really unique. And, you know, we're lucky as artists to be able to be the face of, of things like that. And my, uh, co producer is probably the closest to me. His name's Niko Mansika Aho. And he is from Finland. We call him The Finisher. Because he has a very, very special and rare talent that you can bring a song to him that is, you know, written and pretty fleshed out. And he can take it from an eight or a nine to a straight 10, 11, you know, and that's a very rare talent. And that's something that's hard to find in this business.

Nik:

That's the hardest part. Is that

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

That finishing the I was talking to I was texting Blau about this earlier because we're we're both struggling to finish. I'm struggling to finish my album. And, uh, and we were saying like the the last 5 percent of a record takes 95 percent of the time,

Nik:

Straight up.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

you know, and so I'm so grateful to have Nico. He's such a good sound designer. So a lot of times I'll come with a bass line that's really dope, but he just makes it sound better and makes it fit in the pocket of the mix better.

Nik:

Yeah. And you know, this is something that people don't, they just, they just don't get it. They don't realize it. So I really want to hammer home this point.'cause you know, I used to work at iCONN Collective

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Oh, you did?

Nik:

I worked at iCONN Collective for a long time. That's

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Oh, I didn't know that.

Nik:

Yeah. I was, I was, so I was, uh, I was the industry advisor. So basically I was the face, anything having to do with the industry. I was like the bridge between the music industry and the school and the students. So, so I was, I was talking to managers all the time and industry people that are looking for producers, they're looking for talent. So I was doing a lot of dot connecting and every, you know, Everybody looks up to Skrillex by all means. He's the fucking man. Incredible producer,

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm hmm.

Nik:

We weren't even sending people over to Skrillex, the studio to, to work on music with him, to help him,

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm hmm. Yeah.

Nik:

the, the God of music production is doing everything by himself. It's like, no, like all these dudes, they got, they got teams, you know?

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

And it's nothing in is taking nothing away from that person. Like I've been in the studio with Sonny. He's one of the most talented producers that I have ever seen in my life like on it on a whole other level, but the best producers in the world understand that they got to keep their ear to the streets. And then and the new talent the bubbling the developing talent, that's where the real grit is That's where you know You got to keep tso is a prime example of that tso always keeps like up and coming like new talent on his On his radar and in his you know work

Nik:

It's a paradigm shift around how you see yourself as a producer, you know, back to a lot of like, I just call it the bedroom producer, the bedroom producer that sees themselves as I have Ableton and all these sounds. And so I have to do everything. And there, and there's also even this feeling of like, I have to do everything. Like people feel like I've talked to so many people that feel like, Oh, if I don't, Create all my own sounds and I don't do everything myself Then like I'm not, you know, like like there's this weird mental block in there and really it's all coming from fucking ego Like if you have to do all of it by yourself because so you can say that you did you're making it all about you You're not making about the song.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm hmm.

Nik:

it about actually making the best music possible. So

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

You know what Frankie Knuckles said? As soon as the music becomes about you, you lost. It's gotta stay about the music.

Nik:

Yeah,

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Like as soon as, as soon as it's about you, it's over.

Nik:

and that's where I want to plant the seed for everybody is to start how you see yourself as a producer even looking at like a more traditional. definition or role of a producer, you know, Quincy Jones, he wasn't playing all the instruments by himself.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm hmm.

Nik:

mean? He was arranging music for Michael Jackson hits, but he had a team of team of people making the music. Rick Rubin doesn't touch shit, but he's sitting there producing records. You know, he,

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

he's, amazing.

Nik:

not in there in Ableton, you know what I mean? Like doing sound design and

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

I'm going to see a producer like that right now. Right after we get out of this interview. I'm going to see a producer and sit down with the album. This producer, he doesn't touch anything. But he's an incredible ear. He has so much talent. Some of the best tastes like he just knows good music and knows the market really well And so it's always cool to sit with producers like that There's so many different kinds of producers and they're all necessary. They're all valuable

Nik:

Yeah and It's almost like The goal should be not like how can I make the best music possible? But how can I help you? this music be the best possible, right? And, and, just to plant that, seed with how producers are seeing themselves, it's like, start to see yourself as the Tiesto who has three other people, that he's working with, you know, like start to see yourself, like set that as a goal for yourself that like, yeah, you can do everything by yourself, but go be a Sonny or go be a Tiesto or go be a Rick Rubin where like they actually are You know, it's, it's like becoming like a, uh, a manager rather than an employee. You know, like you're, you know, when you're running a business, you go from, you know, being an employee, doing all the work to now being like, no, I, I manage teams of people to, so that this whole company can win.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

No, you nailed it. You just nailed it that those are the greatest like if we think about the biggest DJs right now, Tiesto, Steve Aoki, we could go down the whole list. They are incredible managers, incredible managers, you know, and they and their artists to like, there's those guys are stars, you know, and not everybody can be a star.

Nik:

Yeah.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Right? Think about it. Like, there's a lot of people behind the scenes and people who work on music that you put them in front of the stage and it's not the move. You know? Everybody has their place. And just because you don't get to sit up and shine with your face out and your name everywhere, it doesn't mean that what you do isn't incredibly valuable. And I, that's That's the narrative that I kind of want to change. You know, that's the reason that I post on my Instagram with me and Nico and talking about how Nico is valuable to me and why we work together and what he brings to the table because I, I want people to see like, Hey, it's okay to like show your process and your team and like, this isn't a one person event. None of it is.

Nik:

yeah, we need to peel that curtain back and show the reality of like what's actually happening. Like, yeah, it's, it is, it is about collaboration. It is about teamwork.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah, totally.

Nik:

so I, love that. Shout out, Nico,

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Nico Masika Aho! The finisher! I know!

Nik:

Uh, we all need a Nico. Everybody go find yourself a Nico. He sounds like a badass. you've got Nico. Are there other people also helping you with

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Of course!

Nik:

picture, launch of this, next generation of your brand and artistry?

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

So that's what, that's what's happening now, right? So, a lot of times, you don't really look for managers, you don't look for agents, it's more so those kind of things find you. Right? It's the same with, in my opinion, it's the same for like publicity and PR. Like, interviews come to you and find you when the time is right. And, and that's what I've found. So recently, I've been getting a lot of, publishers reaching out to say, hey, like this catalog you're building is actually really cool. Like, are you looking for a deal? And the good news is I'm a completely free agent which most artists cannot say so I don't have a manager. I don't have a publisher. I don't have a label and so although that puts a lot of things on my own shoulders It's also a very freeing feeling that i'm kind of able to build a team as I move forward I'm able to build a really cool team Um, i've had teams in the past but they weren't really able to travel with me to, through the solo artist route.

Nik:

So what are you looking for now that you've been in the game for a bit more when it comes to a team? What are some of the, I guess, the qualities and characteristics that are going to catch your eye and make you say yes?

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

The main thing that I look for is somebody that culturally lives in the dance world because that's where I exist. That's my root. as an artist. somebody who culturally lives in the dance world, but that also knows how to cross records over. But that also knows how to, you know, propel commercial music because at the end of the day, I do make hits. Every now and again, I will have a hit, you know, and I need somebody who can really spearhead that. And set those plays up. Hits don't happen on their own. You know, a hit is even more rare today. than it used to be because the market is so saturated with artists and records, but you can still have especially culturally significant records, but they have to be teed up properly. and that's, I think, You know what I struggle with the most on my own Is I make not only do I make all the music but i'm over here doing playlist pitches and you know Reaching out to amazon music and spotify. Hey, here's my new record So it would be nice to I look forward to a time when I have a team to handle all of that but like I said, i'm very patient i've been down this road before where you're developing So And so, uh, you know, I'm just anxious and, and excited to release the album, whether I have a team or not, whether it gets a million streams or not, I don't care. It's just about getting the art out into the world, you know, seeing, seeing who it affects, who it helps and impacts, who loves it, and just finding your team, finding your community.

Nik:

Well, I'm personally so pumped for it because what I've heard so far has been fire.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

ha ha, thank

Nik:

yeah, she's making like, like, techno bangers

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Ha ha

Nik:

incredible vocals on them. Like, it's, this is, yeah, this is, yeah. This is not your, uh, you know, little fluffy mainstream, you know, main stage shit. She's bringing some fire and

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah, yeah.

Nik:

and some grit with this shit.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

You know what's tough is, what's tough is that I've developed, uh, so much as a producer. The album was written and kind of produced like a year ago. So a lot of, that's why I'm having such a hard time letting it go right now. Because I've developed so much and I'm just like, man, if I could just go back in and touch that song. And then, and then today. Today I had to tell myself yo, let that go Let it go. You already made that Release the album stop trying to pick apart stuff

Nik:

When I love that, we call it even calling it a release, right? Because as an artist, you got to keep your, creative channel open to be able to receive new creative energy on a regular basis. And if you are just creating and creating and creating, but never releasing, it's like you get, you get constipated, you know, you get blocked up.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

That's one of the reasons I stopped being a songwriter

Nik:

Mm.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

You know how many songs songwriters write that sit around and never see the light of day? That's why, that's one of the many reasons that I left that field of work. Like, you know, a professional songwriter. I would write, I would write a hundred songs and the world would hear four or five of them.

Nik:

Damn.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Now the songs the four or five were very successful and they you know made a lot of money but you know If when you're a real artist The money it doesn't matter the money. It matters that your soul Is you know what you feel needs to be out is out And so yeah, that's why I sort of left

Nik:

I love that. I love that. I want to go back real quick to, you know, on the one hand you've got your, your, your co producer, you know, you've got your people helping you on helping you with the album and the project. Uh, you're also doing so much of it yourself. And that was what, you know, originally kind of piqued my interest. When I saw, I'm like, damn, you just made this whole music video yourself. I'd love for you to share a little bit about the, uh, because your, your, your brand is, is incredible. You know, as we know, it's not just about the music, right. Your artist project is about telling a story.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm hmm. Mm

Nik:

you know, the, it's, it's the artwork. It's the videos, it's the message, the narrative, the story, it's all the other stuff. Uh, you've done a really great job of creating. The brand and creating the story. Can you share about like, what are some of the tools that you're using and tapping into? Because we do have, uh, you know, as much as we want, you know, to, to collaborate and have, you know, outsource stuff to other people. There's also a lot that we can be doing on our own. It seems like you're, uh, not only really crushing it in the actual, creative direction, but I might even guess having a little bit of fun with it too.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm hmm. Yeah, absolutely.

Nik:

what, are, what are some of the, tools that you're using and what are some tips that you would give to artists that, you know, they're sitting on music, but now they got to figure out like, what do I put out with this music to actually make it look cool?

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Right, because music without visuals today is, what are you doing with that? Like, it doesn't even make sense. So, you know, you get this incredible song done, and then you're like, whoop. I, and, you know, a music video will cost, a cheap music video will cost you 1, 500, 2, 000. 2, 000. That's still quite expensive, especially when we're looking at streaming rates and what we actually make off of these records. You need 500, 000 streams just to recoup a cheap music video. You know, not a lot of new artists can do 500, 000 streams, a million streams. You know, so I, I'm always thinking in terms of a business. You know, I'm trying to make money off my music. I'm trying to find a way to survive off of my art. And that's the hardest part, honestly. That's the hardest part. So, recently I started making my own music videos. Uh, I've been using Artlist a lot, which I really love. They have some amazing footage. And what I found is that I love to edit. I did not expect that I would love to edit as much as I do, but it has changed my whole perspective on the way that I make music.

Nik:

Oh, wow.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah, so the, the, you know, I've always been a very visual writer, so when I'm writing I'm always seeing things in my head. But now, I'm seeing transitions in my head. I'm seeing like, oh, and that could be at this location or that could be edited in this way. That could be green screen. That could be, you know, so, um, even today I'm thinking about putting another song on the album very last minute. And the first thing in my head was like, what would the video be, you know, and how can I do it affordably? And that's the hardest part. So, you know, I edit in iMovie. It's like working in GarageBand, you know. It's

Nik:

I've like, I haven't done too much like proper video editing. but you know, I just even just making my clips and I make,

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm hmm.

Nik:

for my programs and stuff. And it's like, Oh, this isn't that hard. You just drag shit in and do a little splice right here. And I'm like, Oh, like if I could figure it out, like anybody that knows how to use Ableton can figure this shit

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

totally. So, I'm at the point now where I've learned enough where it's starting to box me in. I need to move to premiere or one of the other, platforms where I can have more options. It's like moving from a controller to CDJs, you know, eventually, eventually you get to a point where you're like, man, there's possibilities that I want to do that. This just doesn't allow.

Nik:

Yeah.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

So Artlist. io, that's where you can download, like, stock footage, yeah, it's like, it's like 30 bucks a month. and it gives me professional footage, especially for like visualizers and stuff like that. I will say it's very difficult to make a full video out of that. I'm shocked that I was able to do what I did for Bound. And if I didn't have that idea about rotoscoping the mirror and connecting two different worlds, there's no way I would have had enough footage for that. It was just a super creative decision that allowed me to do it like that.

Nik:

Yeah, you guys definitely go check out her music video for Bound. This was the thing that caught my eye. I was like, yo, this is, this is fire. It

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

No, people thought I had spent like 50k and I was like, I got to do an explanation video. I can't have people out here thinking I'm spending 50k on a video.

Nik:

dope and honestly, I mean, it's just, I think it's just going to get more accessible as well. You know, just the role of, uh, of, of being a creator is

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm hmm. Yeah.

Nik:

to these tools and with all the AI stuff that's coming out, like it's just going to exponentially increase. So it's, it's cool that you're tapping into it And

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Most of my cover art is made in mid journey. Um, now I use a lot, I do a lot of editing. As you can see, the covers actually look like me that the mid journey's not looking like me. you know, so there's a lot of art that goes into that. I pull a lot of pieces and backgrounds and, clothes from Midjourney and I put all that together for the album covers and for the single covers.

Nik:

So, yeah, you're killing it. You're just fucking killing it. I'm so blown away. I really, I really love

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Thank you.

Nik:

You know, you had made another post that really caught my eye about how I'll pull up the quote actually. I wrote this down. You said that if you don't have a great song in an hour Pull up another track.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm-Hmm.

Nik:

you were talking to somebody in the studio about how you have to really find the heart and soul of a song. At the beginning, like quickly. And, uh, I thought that was really interesting, because you've, you've, you've written so many hits. You've written songs that have gone on to, you know, be, you know, massive. And I'm curious just about like your creative process for when it comes to writing songs. Like I really love that idea of like finding, finding the soul of a song,

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm-Hmm.

Nik:

how do you find the soul of a song?

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

You stop overthinking about what you wanna do. You, you go in and you just, you think about life and like where you are and what you feel like today and what mood you wanna evoke. You know, and songwriting is chords, melody, lyrics. That's all songwriting is. It's not a track. Songwriting is not drums. You know, songwriting is lyric, melody, chords. So, you know, you don't always have to have chords. It could be a bass line. Bass line is a lot of times a melody. It could be a synth lead. You know, but something that really speaks. It's really important to channel what you feel. And that is something that I'll be honest with you, that can't be taught. That's not taught. You either are a writer or you're not. You're either a poet or you're not, we can tighten up the technical side of what we do. of art comes from that person's life experiences and the way that they see the world. Nobody teaches you that

Nik:

Yeah. Yeah, and I think that's why it's important to, like, you gotta be tapped into yourself,

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm hmm. Totally.

Nik:

you gotta be tapped into your own emotions and your own feelings and spend time In your thoughts, you know, like I'm real big on morning pages. I think that's one of the best tools that any artist can do is sit down and write three pages of stream of consciousness writing every morning and

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Oh, that's what you do every morning

Nik:

yeah, I mean, I, I'm not doing it right now. I'll do it sometimes, but I have like people in my program, you know, that's like stuff that I, it comes from the book, the artist's way, Julia Cameron's

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah

Nik:

just sitting down and just journal writing every single morning. First thing you do right when

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Oh, wow, that's so

Nik:

out of, coming out of that kind of, you know, dream state, you're

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm hmm.

Nik:

yet and you just start writing, but you know, there's, there's been countless artists and, you know, uh, screenwriters, directors that like they credit the idea for their movie or their book or their song or their album that like coming from doing the morning pages. So just, yeah, it's a great way to just really. Take a deep dive into yourself on a daily basis. So you actually know, usually we're so disconnected, right? We're just scrolling and watching

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Totally. Totally.

Nik:

being busy, busy, busy. So it's like, well, if you're not actually in tune with yourself, then what are you going to write

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah. You're the most, uh, you're the most attached to your subconscious in the morning. Like when you first wake up. Yeah. I noticed that too. Even when whatever the first thing I do every day is the most important thing that I do every day. I always make the first thing the most important thing. You know, what's the most important thing I'm gonna do today? This is it, right here in front of me. And it usually gets done rather quickly, and with a lot of, like, soul and, like, heart to it.

Nik:

Yeah. Yeah. And you mean just like whatever's like your kind of big task or

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Mm hmm.

Nik:

thing that you need to get

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah, I usually have a list of it's like a to do list, a rotating to do list of things. Yeah, of things that need to get done for the album for certain releases. you know, all kinds of stuff. And so I always prioritize it and they're all the tasks are always like moving up or around and so Whatever is the most important thing for me to get done that week that's at the top of my list every day that I wake up

Nik:

Yeah, solid, solid. any final words of wisdom or encouragement for the artists that are listening right now?

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

I mean the only thing I can say is You know The it's so cliche too. It's like the never giving up thing. Is really what it comes down to, you know, a lot of times as artists, we sit and we listen to things that are on the radio or on, you know, your favorite playlist. And you're like, geez, how did this even get here? How did this person even get that? Like with this song and this trash and this, like, we always have, we all have those thoughts, right? Of like, Jesus, how did this get here? It got there because that person didn't give up. Like that's why it got there, you know, so it's like anything is possible. It really is and if I could say one thing it's like Be unique Don't be afraid to do it different because What sets you apart? It's gonna make it hard for you in the beginning being unique, but in the long haul Being unique will give you a longer career. You'll be more respected. You'll be a pioneer, you know, and I think I posted this yesterday. If the path in front of you is clear, you're probably on somebody else's,

Nik:

Ooh, that's a good one. That's a banger

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Yeah, I can't remember what it's not mine. I can't remember where I saw it. But yeah, I just it always comes back to me because as an artist myself, I feel like I'm always like, you know, weed whacking and trying to cut down a path because there is no one like me. And as frustrating as that is, there's also some peace in that.

Nik:

that's what we call being on your hero's journey, right? It's like you have that fork in the road and you're either going down the paved path that's already been laid out or you're going off into the fuckin wilderness, you're going off into the jungle and you just have a little flashlight and a machete and it's you by yourself and you just gotta fuckin hack away and pave your own path and that's what, you know, that's the artist's path, like the true artist's path,

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

for sure.

Nik:

Yeah, I love that. Well, thank you so much for coming on to, uh, hang out with us today. I'm so excited for your album. Uh, congrats. You're right there at the finish line.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Oh my gosh.

Nik:

out her podcast, make it make sense. And, uh, yeah, very, very happy to connect with you. Thanks for coming on.

Heather Bright / Bright Lights:

Awesome. Thank you so much, Nick. It was a pleasure.

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Nik Cherwink

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