What if fitness could be a lifeline for cancer survivors? Meet Mena Spodobalski, a passionate physical trainer with nearly two decades of experience and a true champion for the cancer community in Reno, Nevada. Mena's journey from hosting park boot camps to owning her own gym for 12 years is nothing short of inspiring. We dive into her groundbreaking initiative, the Evoke Warriors program, which empowers cancer survivors for men and women! ! Mena opens up about her motivations and the profound impact of her work.
We underscore the importance of proactive health measures like genetic testing and regular screenings. Hear the inspiring tales of men and women who have regained vitality and confidence through this structured wellness program. We also discuss the pivotal role of a healthy lifestyle in cancer recovery, from incorporating more fruits and vegetables into your diet to reducing alcohol intake and staying physically active. Join us in celebrating the power of fitness, community, and unwavering support in the fight against cancer.
Are you loving the Test Those Breasts! Podcast? You can show your support by donating to the Test Those Breasts Nonprofit @ https://testthosebreasts.org/donate/
Thanks for listening! I would appreciate your rating and review where you listen to podcasts!
I am not a doctor and not all information in this podcast comes from qualified healthcare providers, therefore may not constitute medical advice. For personalized medical advice, you should reach out to one of the qualified healthcare providers interviewed on this podcast and/or seek medical advice from your own providers .
What if fitness could be a lifeline for cancer survivors? Meet Mena Spodobalski, a passionate physical trainer with nearly two decades of experience and a true champion for the cancer community in Reno, Nevada. Mena's journey from hosting park boot camps to owning her own gym for 12 years is nothing short of inspiring. We dive into her groundbreaking initiative, the Evoke Warriors program, which empowers cancer survivors for men and women! ! Mena opens up about her motivations and the profound impact of her work.
We underscore the importance of proactive health measures like genetic testing and regular screenings. Hear the inspiring tales of men and women who have regained vitality and confidence through this structured wellness program. We also discuss the pivotal role of a healthy lifestyle in cancer recovery, from incorporating more fruits and vegetables into your diet to reducing alcohol intake and staying physically active. Join us in celebrating the power of fitness, community, and unwavering support in the fight against cancer.
Are you loving the Test Those Breasts! Podcast? You can show your support by donating to the Test Those Breasts Nonprofit @ https://testthosebreasts.org/donate/
Thanks for listening! I would appreciate your rating and review where you listen to podcasts!
I am not a doctor and not all information in this podcast comes from qualified healthcare providers, therefore may not constitute medical advice. For personalized medical advice, you should reach out to one of the qualified healthcare providers interviewed on this podcast and/or seek medical advice from your own providers .
Speaker 1:
Hello friends, welcome back to the Test those Breasts podcast. I am your host, jamie Vaughn. I'm a retired teacher of 20 years and a breast cancer thriver turned staunch, unapologetic, loud supporter and advocate for others, bringing education and awareness through a myriad of medical experts, therapists, caregivers and other survivors. A breast cancer diagnosis is incredibly overwhelming, with the mounds of information out there, and other survivors A breast cancer diagnosis is incredibly overwhelming, with the mounds of information out there, especially on Dr Google. I get it. I'm not a doctor and I know how important it is to uncover accurate information, which is my ongoing mission through my nonprofit. The podcast includes personal stories and opinions from breast cancer survivors and professional physicians, providing the most up-to-date information. At the time of recording Evidence, research and practices are always changing, so please check the date of the recording and always refer to your medical professionals for the most up-to-date information. I hope you find this podcast a source of inspiration and support from my guests. Their contact information is in the show notes, so please feel free to reach out to them. We have an enormous breast cancer community ready to support you in so many ways. Now let's listen to the next episode of Test those Breasts. Hey, welcome back, friends to this episode of Test those Breasts.
Speaker 1:
I am your host, jamie Vaughn, and today I am so excited to have my guest, mena Spetobolsky, on my show.
Speaker 1:
I met Mena, I think, back in 2016 or 17, maybe a little, actually a little bit later, because I know that one of my friends, melissa, had breast cancer before I did, and it was probably in about 2016 or 17 that she went through your program. Mena has been a trainer, a physical trainer, since 2007, actually, with 17 years in the business, and she has started to support the cancer community here in Reno, nevada. I was able to meet Mena at Melissa's house and I was immediately drawn to her, just because of what she did for the cancer community. So, mena, thank you so much for being here. I just am so excited and we've had some tech issues here, so I'm hoping that everything goes through. It looks really good from my angle right now. So we finally made it happen. We've been talking about this day for quite some time and here we are on National Cancer Survivors Day and we are about to go to an event after this episode that we're making so welcome. How are you?
Speaker 2:
Thank you. I am great it's a beautiful day today and I'm super excited to be here with you and to go do a little groovy 80s for Cancer Survivors Day today. I think it's gonna be a fun day.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, I think it's gonna be really fun too and I'm halfway dressed 80s right now. I have a couple more things to do with my hair and a few other things, but we have New Wave Cra that's going to be playing. It's a local Reno band and they are an awesome eighties band. But anyway, I really would love to bring to my audience who Mena is and how you support the cancer community. I would love just for you to share who you are, what you do, what you represent, what you value, anything you'd like to share.
Speaker 2:
Okay, so I am a mother of two. I have two grown boys and have been married to my husband for 32 years. Next month, I have now been in fitness for almost 18 years, started in the park. I would take parents after they dropped off their kids. We would all walk over to the park near our school and do a boot camp, and that's kind of how I started in the fitness industry. From there, I started teaching at Gold's Gym and then I had an opportunity to go to a private gym where I started a 30-day body challenge that we still do to this day, and from there I was able to buy the gym and have owned it now. I've been a small business owner now for 12 years this month and I love what I do.
Speaker 2:
I had an opportunity in 2016 to train breast cancer survivors for six months and then we would teach them clean eating, exercise, community, and then at the end of the six months, we would put them at an NPC bikini show where they would strut their stuff and they would show. You know what they were able to accomplish in six months. From that kind of evolved into something a little different. I stepped away from that in 2020, which is kind of odd. I think the timing of that was perfect, obviously, with gyms shutting down and trying to just survive and keep my business alive, so I think the timing of that came along really well During that 2020 madness. One thing that I found at the end of that year was that I was really missing working with cancer survivors and just the joy that I find from being surrounded by these people who have so much tenacity and dedication and focus to live well and be as healthy as they can tenacity and dedication and focus to live well and be as healthy as they can. So I had a young lady who had a sarcoma and she had been balanced since she was 19. In 2019, I did a TED Talk on breast cancer to bikini and she had seen that and reached out and had said hey, I know I can't do your program because it's not breast cancer, but will you help me? I'm tired of being sick. I'm tired of being tired, and that's kind of what brought the wheels kind of rolling about doing a program for all types of cancer. And so Evoke Warriors was born.
Speaker 2:
Evoke Warriors helps men and women who have gotten any type of cancer diagnosis, whether it's breast cancer, lung cancer, bone cancer, brain cancer, you name it. We will accept them into our program. The program runs March to September and we just teach them fitness, how to lift properly. We show them that they can do things that they thought they couldn't do, or even things that they were like, oh I could do all of this before my cancer, but I'm never going to be able to do it again. Our mission is to show them that they can at least do some version of what they were able to do prior, and we offer wellness.
Speaker 2:
I have an amazing partner Her name is Madeline Hardacre who helps with nutrition. She's a lifestyle coach. She helps them, you know, battling all the things that happens up here that comes along with cancer. And then, of course, the biggest thing that comes out of the program is community. It's the being surrounded with other people who have also gotten a cancer diagnosis, understand what you're going through, who know what anxiety is and that it's a real thing, that chemo brain is a real thing. It's being surrounded by these people who understand and know what you're going through. They really find these bonds and connections that they just didn't expect to happen. But is a beautiful surprise and a wonderful thing that comes out of it.
Speaker 1:
I love the fact that you collaborate with the cancer community, like Cancer Community Clubhouse and Nevada Cancer Coalition.
Speaker 1:
I found that when I connected myself to the cancer community whatever that may look like I was able to move through cancer much better, and especially in my survivorship, and I have seen people go through your program.
Speaker 1:
I know the first program that you were involved with. I knew several people who went through that and did the bikini competition. It sticks out really, really vividly for me because I attended the bikini competition on the night that Melissa was there and a couple other people I know, and it was literally the night before my mother died, and so it sticks out very vividly to me and it was very impactful for me to watch that and so I'll just never forget that and I was like, okay, this program is fantastic and it just lends to so much support for the cancer community and I love the fact that you are including all cancers. Right now, I have a few friends who are in the program Currently. I'm already watching your Instagram videos and I'm seeing them in the video. It just makes me so happy that they were able to do that and I need to do that sometimes.
Speaker 2:
So, yes, I think you need to apply next year. I mean you better just jump in. It's scary. You know everyone's always really afraid and you know, when they come in for their interview, it's like I was so nervous and and they are I mean some of them you can see them shaking or they're just nervous and I'm like you are just about to embark on something that's going to change your life. I just want you to embrace it and just dive in.
Speaker 2:
You know like, take all the knowledge, learn all the things so that when the program is over, you have all these tools. Whether it's something that comes along that stops you in your tracks with fear, you'll know how to handle that. If you have been having some fun and you've put on a few pounds and you're like I've got to get this off, you'll know how to do that. You'll know how to exercise properly. Whether you decide to stay in our alumni program or you decide to do things on your own, you will have the knowledge and the tools to do that so that, whether your cancer comes back because I know that that fear is always there or whether you are able to live another 20 years healthy, strong, be there for your grandbabies whatever life throws at you, you're going to have the tools to hit it head on.
Speaker 1:
Right, and two, you'll have that community of amazing friends that you made along the way. And being Cancer Survivors Day National Cancer Survivors Day I have been thinking so deeply about all of the friends that I have made along the way. I remember when I was first diagnosed almost two years ago, I had a friend of mine who had breast cancer before and she said Jamie, oh my gosh, she is, you're about to embark on the sisterhood of all sisterhoods, and it is so true. I've got friends from all around the United States and even the world. Most I have never met actually in person, but being in the community and doing things like the programs that you have going on just makes those silver linings a lot brighter. You know for a trauma that we never asked to go through, and so I appreciate your having this program. I am a little curious what inspired you to work with cancer patients in particular?
Speaker 2:
When I first became part of Breast Cancer to Bikini, it came right after my mom had also been diagnosed with breast cancer and my mom was this strong, faithful woman. We were born in Africa. She took us out of a war-torn zone it was during a civil war and we left that country to America not speaking a word of English, and my parents never took a handout. She was this strong, powerful woman who was like we're just going to make life here, and so I saw this woman who had all this strength and power just literally be brought to her knees when she got her diagnosis and it really like it just affected me so deeply because I was like what the heck is happening to my mother? You know, and cancer kind of ran through all the women's side of my mom's family. I have several aunts who've had breast cancer. I had a cousin who, before she was even 35, had breast cancer stage four. She's doing great, but you know, it was just like what the heck? So it's always been in my mind. My mother in law also had breast cancer when my kids were little and we had just gotten married, and so it's been in my family and it's been kind of something that I've been in, but a little bit from the outside, like watching it happen.
Speaker 2:
And when, in 2016, when somebody reached out to me and said, hey, I want to do this program, I want you to help, do you think you could pull this off? I was like I know nothing about breast cancer fitness. I don't know, even know where to begin. But yes, I'll figure it out. I'll read all I need to read, I'll make this happen. And once I was in it and I saw the impact that it was having on these women, the confidence that they were gaining, the camaraderie watching someone come in. I had Anne-Marie one time. She walked into the gym and she was like shaking and she was like I'm here to find out about breast cancer to bikini I have literally pulled into your parking lot and left three times. I've been sitting in my car for 25 minutes.
Speaker 2:
I finally got the courage to come in here and I'm like I just gave her a hug. I'm like, girl you do not have, this is going to be the most amazing thing you're going to do. It's going to change your life and it did. I saw this woman who was nervous and scared and lacked confidence to all these things in the gym that she didn't think she could do, and walk on stage in a bikini which is so dang scary, with so much pride and confidence that I was like, yes, this is why I'm doing this, this is why I love it so much, and I just really feel that God has put me in this place at this time, doing this, because this is what I was meant to do and I'll do it for as long as I can.
Speaker 1:
I love it, I love it, and you've made really good friends along the way, which is really cool.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, it's like you said about the sisterhood. You know you, I've met so many amazing human beings that I never would have met, and maybe not ever even crossed their path, had I not done Evoke Warriors and Breast Cancer Bikini.
Speaker 1:
I worked next door. I was a teacher next door to Melissa Prine and I remember her going through the whole program and every day she would show up with her meals and lots of things that I love to eat. I was raised in a family who taught us all about nutrition. Like we had all the gardens that was. Our chore was to water the garden and water what we eat. It really was fascinating watching her go through all of that and then coming to fruition, going to the event and watching all of those amazing ladies on the stage and having that happen in such a short period of time. In retrospect it wasn't really that long of a period of time. So, because your family, your mom and some of your other family members had breast cancer, what do you know about yourself? Are you someone who went and got genetic testing and how did that play out?
Speaker 2:
So it was funny because as soon as I found out about my mother, I went to my doctor right away and I was like you know, we have aunts, I have cousins, all these people that have breast cancer around me, and I just I need to know what's going on. And because my mom was never told to get the genetic testing, they said that I didn't need it. So I just went to a regiment where I would get a mammogram and then six months later I would get an sinusomiasis testing. And I did that for years. About two years ago, when another aunt actually ended up dying of breast cancer, I was like I'm getting the testing done, I'll pay for it myself, and it actually turned out that we do not have any type of connection. There's no genetics connected in all of us. So my regimen is to go every six months and get tested. Good for you.
Speaker 2:
I'm actually a little psychotic about it.
Speaker 2:
I'm surrounded by cancer yes, you are, and so I try not to let it put fear and rule my life, like I don't want to be that person who's like I have a headache, I think I might have a brain tumor or I have, you know, because I know that that can be real, but I tumor or I have you know cause. I know that that can be real. But I do my regular self exams. I go in and get my tests done every six months. So I am not of the thought that I don't want to know. I want to find that shit as soon as I can yeah, exactly, there's something about it right away, and I tell my friends and my clients. I've had many clients come to me and say hey, I haven't seen a doctor in five years. I saw your post or I saw the story about you know who, and I made an appointment and I went and got my mammogram and I'm taking better care of myself and I'm like if we can inspire one person to do that, that's huge.
Speaker 1:
It is. It is huge. And I don't know if you know the background of my podcast. I actually started it almost one year ago today, on June 11, which was the one year anniversary of the podcast. I actually started it almost one year ago today, on June 11, which was the one year anniversary of the diagnosis. I named it Test those Breasts so that I could inspire people who've never even been diagnosed before, Because when I was hit with breast cancer, I was pretty overwhelmed and I knew a lot about breast cancer.
Speaker 1:
I mean, I, you know, I had Melissa by that was working right next door to me. I knew other people with breast cancer. I've always gone in and gotten my mammograms and ultrasounds. I have dense breast tissue, or I did anyway and so I always listened to my body. It was always keeping myself up to date.
Speaker 1:
But there was so much I didn't know and including breast, the visual of your breasts, you know, like I didn't know that if you had an indentation or anything else that you were seeing, and so I really wanted to start something where I was not only having an audience of people who have been diagnosed, but people who have never been diagnosed, so that they have it's on their radar, and I've said this in several of my episodes that I've actually had people say well, why are you targeting people who've never been diagnosed, Even people who are younger, like in their 20s and 30s? It's not even on their radar. And I always come back with that's why I want it to be on the radar, not to be a hypochondriac or be fearful of it or anything like that, but to have it on the radar. Not to be a hypochondriac or be fearful of it or anything like that, but to have it on the radar. Know what to look for you, being surrounded by so many people that have had breast cancer, you know a lot more than I did before. I even had breast cancer, I'm sure.
Speaker 1:
So that's why and my thing is is that if I can inspire one person to go and get that mammogram which I know that I've inspired more than that, because they reach out to me and say hey, I'm in Australia and I ran across your podcast. I just wanted to let you know that my sister in India just was diagnosed with breast cancer. She's 32 years old and your podcast has helped us understand a lot more, and so I know that it's making an impact and I love working with people and collaborating with people like you, because I want to be able to bring those resources to the audience, regardless of whether they live in Reno or other communities. So my question is is that do you know of other communities, of people who are doing things like you're doing? Because people are going to listen to this and say, my gosh, I need to find something like that in my community. How do we go about helping them find those people?
Speaker 2:
I guess so, from my understanding because I've had people reach out to me from all over the country a couple of people as far as Saudi Arabia asking for a program like this, and I don't believe that there's anything else like Evoke Warriors out there but this is what I tell people when they're trying to find something similar you may not find a program that is developed specifically to help breast cancer or cancer survivors, but what you can do is find a community of like-minded people who are trying to live well, exercise, move their body and be very conscious of their health. So find yourself a trainer or a group fitness class where you can go and lift weights, because that is very important, especially for women as we age. We lose a lot of muscle mass as we age. It's important that we are battling that so that we're eating enough protein to maintain muscle, that we're lifting weights it doesn't have to be heavy weights, it doesn't have to be a lot, but you do need to lift weights two to three times a week. That's really important and that you're making mindful decisions about the things that you're putting into your body.
Speaker 2:
Eat more fruits and vegetables. No one is getting fat from fruits and vegetables. I hate it when people are like, oh, I can't eat a banana or an apple because it's gonna make me. No, you're not getting fat or putting on weight because you're eating bananas and apples. Okay, you're probably putting on weight from the pizza, the burgers, the cookies, the Starbucks, those things, the alcohol, the alcohol. Alcohol is very much linked to a variety of cancers and other long-term illnesses. So make that a treat, make that, you know, a once a week thing, or maybe only when you go out. Let's not make that the center of our lives and the center of our celebrations, because Americans are very centered around food and alcohol to be celebratory, right, and we really need to shift that. We're celebrating your scan being clear let's go for a walk, let's go for a hike, let's go swimming, let's go up to the beach. Why is it? Let's go out for a drink. You're literally being counterproductive with your health.
Speaker 2:
So it's really important to just be intuitive and to know and be conscious of what you're putting into your body. Oh, today I haven't had one piece of fruit, so my snack is going to be an apple today, versus choosing processed foods and eating cheeses out of a box, you know. So just being mindful of those things, being mindful that you're getting 30 minutes of movement a day. I prefer 60. I would love that everyone is moving 60 minutes a day, hitting those 10,000, 12,000 steps. But if 30 minutes is all you've got, then 30 minutes is what you're going to put out there.
Speaker 2:
Go for a walk on your lunchtime, you know, put in 10 minutes. Go for another 20 minutes after dinner at home. So just really being mindful of your movement and what you're putting into your body and then finding yourself a community of like minded people who are have those same goals will give you in the end, a long-term, better opportunity of not having your cancer return, because studies out there show that if you're eating well and you're exercising, that's one of the biggest things you can do to avoid a reoccurrence and possibly not having cancer come at you again. So there may not be a program like us out there, but I do believe that you can do things to get the benefits of the program.
Speaker 1:
Or how about start something? Reach out to your physical fitness instructor and say, hey, let's start something maybe in your community, why not? Right, Absolutely. People can always reach out to your program and learn from you to be able to emulate that in their own community. You know the whole idea of research out there, of cutting back on alcohol and making sure that you're exercising. If that's not motivation enough, that there's research out there that helps cancer not come back, or just reminding ourselves that every time we do something physical, how that helps our endorphins and how that makes us feel so much better, Like my husband's walking the dogs right now. I usually am walking with him and I will do something for myself later, but you know, it just always makes me feel so much better after I'm finished. It's like okay, I'm stronger.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, it feels great, it does, it does, and I love watching people do that for themselves.
Speaker 2:
Yes, I love that too. Yesterday we had we have a once a month book club to the paving the path to wellness book which we use in our program for all of our survivors, and we had book club yesterday and one of the warriors that led it said two things that really impacted me. One was if you're going to get cancer and you get to be in this program, at least you have this program and at least you have this community and this sisterhood, this brotherhood that will never be taken from them, because forever now they have these bonds and they can reach out to us and they're I mean, I've seen it for the last nine years. You know that people are connected and they still reach out to each other. Melissa's group and our group still celebrate birthdays, we celebrate graduations, we help them move. I mean we're still like very much connected and I see that with all my warriors through the years that they're still having lunches and they're still celebrating things and they're still reaching out to one another when they're like, okay, my scans are coming up this week, I just need a lot of prayers and a lot of good vibes. So you're always going to have that. And so she said that that was one of the biggest takeaways. Just going into week 11 of the program, we haven't even been in 24 weeks and they're already bonded, which is so exciting. I love it.
Speaker 2:
And then the other thing she said was that there are times when, prior to the program, that she really was in a hole of depression, which comes with cancer and the diagnosis as well, and many times when she didn't want to leave her house, many times when she didn't want to even get out of bed. And she says that that has completely changed. She's looking forward to going to the gym, she looks forward to getting up and going for a walk every day. She works from home and she still loves that, because she loves being home with her dog, but she's walking her dog more. She just feels more alive. She goes. For the first time since my diagnosis. I feel alive, I feel like I'm thriving and that I'm giving back to this world and I'm taking all the good things from it. What more could you ask for? That is so amazing that someone is feeling like that and they all agreed with her that that was something that they really were so excited about is that it's literally made them feel like they're alive again.
Speaker 1:
Right and it's so impactful. There are two things that I'm thinking of while you're telling me this. I have watched and I was in a deep dark hole when I was first diagnosed. I will be the first to admit that I really had a hard time grasping the understanding that there would be a world where and Natalie Stevenson actually drove this home, natalie from Cancer Community Clubhouse that we can have two worlds, like she's, you know, with the metastatic people who have metastatic cancer too, and also people who don't, who are in their survivorship.
Speaker 1:
You can have two worlds. You can have a world of you're kind of fearful, you have scan, scans, iety, you're going to doctor's appointments still every once in a while, like I am, but you can also have this world of positive self-development, friendships, community happiness. Those two worlds can exist together and I have friends of mine who are stuck in this hole, even in their survivorship. They're just stuck. They're very depressed because, as we know, with cancer diagnoses sometimes there's some cascading things that happen beyond the breast cancer or whatever cancer you're dealing with, and they're stuck and all I want to tell them is reach out to the cancer community, reach out to the people who are helping for cancer patients because oncologists and radiologists and surgeons they can only do so much right. They can save your life with medicine and surgeries and whatever.
Speaker 1:
but there's this whole other side to cancer and it's the rest of the holistic care that you need, and so your program is a piece of that puzzle, and I just feel like I want to reach out to these people and say move over here, go meet these people and give yourself the gift of light while you're dealing with this other shitty stuff, right? And so, yeah, I love it so much. Well, mena, I just really appreciate your being on here to share with us what you do for our community, and it is greatly appreciated. I have seen it. I've seen people go through the program and I know how much it has impacted their lives, and I feel really honored that I get to know you and I get to see you today later.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, we're going to have a lot of fun. I'm going to have a table with my podcast, which is now a nonprofit, and so you know I'll be able to share that with the rest of the community. And so you've given us so much advice. But if there's anything else you would like to leave us with before we disconnect today, what would you like to say?
Speaker 2:
I would love to just say to anyone who has received that cancer diagnosis that it doesn't mean that your life is over and you really want to just have a moment and sit down and think about which way you're going to tackle this horrible disease. Right, there's so many ways, like you said, that you can just shut yourself off and go through the motions and just try to just survive every day right. But you can also look at it as a challenge that you are going to face head on. You're going to surround yourself with all the resources that are out there to help you thrive in the situation and come out on the other side.
Speaker 2:
Whichever way this may go, live big, because I've seen a lot of people lose their battle, and that is the shittiest part of this job is being in that part and getting connected to people and falling in love with them and then seeing the cancer take them from this world. But I've seen a lot of them literally live and thrive to the bitter end. And why not do it that way? Why not reach that mountaintop and be glorious and be like I battled as hard as I could and I loved my family so hard and I'm leaving a legacy of strength and courage and bravery and resilience. You can choose which way you want to go and I hope that you will choose to be surrounded by a cancer community who is going to support and lift you up and help you come out of those dark moments.
Speaker 1:
I love that. I love your inspiration. I love how you celebrate both the ones we have lost and the ones who are still living. You openly celebrate all of them and that just brings tears to my eyes, you know. Just thank you for doing that. Appreciate that Well, mena, I will see you later and I'm excited to celebrate Absolutely and to my audience.
Speaker 1:
I really appreciate your joining us again on this episode of Test those Breasts. As always, please go to your favorite platform and rate and review this podcast. It really does help and I appreciate all of you. And until next time, we'll see you on the next episode of Test those Breasts. Bye for now, friends. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of Test those Breasts. I hope you got some great much needed information that will help you with your journey. As always, I am open to guests to add value to my show and I'm also open to being a guest on other podcasts where I can add value, so please reach out if you'd like to collaborate. My contact information is in the show notes and, as a reminder, rating, reviewing and sharing this podcast will truly help build a bigger audience all over the world. I thank you for your efforts. I look forward to sharing my next episode of Test those Breasts breaths.
