Bullets 2 Bedpans
EP:18 Shannon Book: Serenading the Soul After Service
When Shannon Book swapped his Navy Corpsman uniform for a guitar, he embarked on a new mission to strike chords that resonate with the soul. In our latest episode Shannon sheds light on the stark realities of transitioning to civilian life and the often-unspoken struggles that follow.
This is part one of Shannon's story.
Nurses and Medics: This is your platform! We want to hear your stories of the good, the bad and the ugly. Send us an email at cominghomewell@gmail.com
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Special Thanks to
Artwork: Joe Weber @joeweber_tattoos
Intro/Outro/Disclaimer Credits:
Pam Barragan Host of 2200TAPS Podcast
"Racer" by Infraction https://bit.ly/41HlWTk
Music promoted by Inaudio: ...
When Shannon Book swapped his Navy Corpsman uniform for a guitar, he embarked on a new mission to strike chords that resonate with the soul. In our latest episode Shannon sheds light on the stark realities of transitioning to civilian life and the often-unspoken struggles that follow.
This is part one of Shannon's story.
Nurses and Medics: This is your platform! We want to hear your stories of the good, the bad and the ugly. Send us an email at cominghomewell@gmail.com
Do you know a health worker that needs a laugh?
B2B N.F.L.T.G. Certificate click here
Get the ammo you need to seize your day at Soldier Girl Coffee Use Code CHW10 for a 10% off at checkout!
Special Thanks to
Artwork: Joe Weber @joeweber_tattoos
Intro/Outro/Disclaimer Credits:
Pam Barragan Host of 2200TAPS Podcast
"Racer" by Infraction https://bit.ly/41HlWTk
Music promoted by Inaudio: ...
Music Holy Beards Batman.
Speaker 2:Yeah man, yeah man.
Speaker 1:Alright, hey everybody. How's it going? We got MZDTox and our good friend Shannon Book in with us today. What's up? Hello. For those that don't know Shannon, he is a prior service Navy Corbin, retired. He's an artist. He's toured the world, he's done big shows. He's literally played in front of what? 60,000 people.
Speaker 2:Yeah, something like that he's left in to sneeze at. He knows.
Speaker 3:Prince Harry, he's buddies with him.
Speaker 2:I mean, I've met him.
Speaker 1:My goodness. So what's I keep calling him Henry.
Speaker 2:It's probably bad.
Speaker 1:Don't call him that.
Speaker 2:I know, I know His brother.
Speaker 1:Just, oh, my god, thought that man, I'm all rattled. It's H. We can't get Harry. It's H Trying to make my way to meet him one of these days, that's the long term dream right.
Speaker 2:You'll get there, you'll get there.
Speaker 1:If I can get there.
Speaker 2:I promise you, you can. You could probably crawl there.
Speaker 1:You know what. That's the goal. So kind of what we wanted to talk about today was what brought Shannon into the Navy, what that time in service looked like, some of the things he dealt with. Shannon has a pretty, pretty amazing story, and both detox and I have been lucky enough to hear it and and find it absolutely worthy of sharing with everybody else and hope that it touches you in the same way that it touches us. And the beautiful thing about it is his story is not over. He's continuing to do great things and the future is looking awful great. So, that being said, shannon, thanks for coming and hanging out with us.
Speaker 2:Happy to see you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I know, you just wrapped up a little, a little shum, shum over in Nashville, right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I just did a little networking jaunt. Yeah, I just got back from Nashville doing a little networking stuff with Buddy of Mind, scotty, scotty Hastings and Jason Steiner and Jesse Cunningham they were. We were over there kind of doing networking stuff with musicians and record labels and people, things and stuff and you know. So we were over there just kind of doing the whole hey you, this is me, me, this is what's going on and why.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I was teasing Shannon. I got to see one of the pictures from his time over there and it's several dudes and they've all got these like Viking style righteous beards and I wanted to be a little shit and comment on it hashtag battle of the beards but I figured I'd be, If you could see your styling.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, well, the. The reality is is that the whole crowd, out of the whole crowd of beards, I was the, I was the minimalist.
Speaker 3:That says something, because it's an impressive little beard. That well, it's more like an extended goatee.
Speaker 2:That's exactly what it is.
Speaker 3:You know, you know my husband can't grow hair in certain spots.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, so just tell him to get pregnant. I grow a fucking pregnant.
Speaker 3:No, we're done with kids. We're trying to manage teens and tweens. We're we're past that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, pregnancy. Shut your mouth.
Speaker 3:Yeah, no him or me.
Speaker 1:no, that's the secret to growing an epic mustache.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I'm gonna tell you right now, like, like Dave Coulier put it out Don't be no more that shit. Nice yeah. So yeah, man. So thanks for having me.
Speaker 1:No, glad, glad that we could make this work. So let's, let's start from kind of the beginning, right? How old were you when you came in? Was that always the plan, something you wanted to do, or was it kind of a knee jerk reaction? What led you to the Navy and your job?
Speaker 2:Well, so I mean? I mean, I grew up in a little little podunk town in the middle of nowhere, east Bernstadt or Hazel Patch, kentucky to be more specific.
Speaker 3:Hazel Patch. That sounds like someplace you'd find, like the strawberry shortcake gang or something like that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, or the, the, the catfish lugger bunch, or yeah there's sandlot sandlot.
Speaker 3:is that where it was?
Speaker 2:Yeah, something like that. So, but you know, grew up, you know, working on tobacco fields, working in cattle. We raised our own like vegetables and pretty much killed what we ate. You know because you know we were, we were. You know we were in the middle of nowhere and we were. We were never. How do I say this? Because I want to give my parents credit. We were never destitute, we were always. We were always taken care of and we were taken care of. Well, now I will say that most of the time I helped raise my sisters because mom, dad, were working, and that's just how it was.
Speaker 3:You were an 80s kid.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like when they talk about. When they talk about like hey mom dad the commercial, hey mom dad, you know where your kids are True statement. Yep, that was me. Listen, I was four miles away on a bicycle at ten o'clock at night riding home. That was me on a gravel road, like you know. Crazy shit.
Speaker 1:All the middle of nowhere, kentucky.
Speaker 3:Yeah, but back then it was, you know, it was in that thought. You know, I mean, my mom was a little more like you. Bet we had to be in by dark or something like that. But between eight in the morning when we went out the door in noon we were gone. Just come back at lunch, live and feed, you could hear her yell. And then between noon and who knows, oh five for dinner, dark Shove some food in your mouth and we were gone again like be back by whatever, you know nine.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Flashlight tag. Oh my god.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like now, mom and dad's won't let their kids out of their yard, like, and it's like no. Well.
Speaker 3:But when you hear stories of like I mean this happened up in our. That hasn't happened a while, but there's like five, six years ago. It's like a mom and her kid walking to the from the grocery store to the car and this kid, this deranged person, tried to kidnap the daughter. The daughter's like 11 years old and you try to not, I mean mom beat the shit out of them.
Speaker 2:but you know what's funny? I want to say this, and this is probably not going to be taken very well, so From you, shannon, we'll take it just fine. Have you guys met me? The reality is that all that stuff was happening back then.
Speaker 3:Agreed.
Speaker 2:It just wasn't publicized like it is today.
Speaker 3:Agreed. Actually, statistically, it was higher back then than it is now.
Speaker 2:Right. Right, because it was easier to get away with.
Speaker 3:Agreed.
Speaker 2:Now it's sensationalized Like all our lives the Dahmer movie. I've never seen so many people decide they're going to wear Jeffrey Dahmer glasses in my life.
Speaker 3:People are so influential People went and bought. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Glasses to emulate a cannibalistic serial killer Like that's the culture we live in.
Speaker 3:However, I'm going to turn it a little bit and say that there is a reason all that exists. If you turn it towards other things, like the military right, we have to get indoctrinated.
Speaker 2:We had, I mean we say that word and people like oh my god indoctrinated.
Speaker 3:I'm like, yeah, and the more subculture you are, the further indoctrinated you have to be, absolutely.
Speaker 2:Because some of the shit they're doing.
Speaker 3:Other people will be like you what? Or you don't even know about. There is no. You what? Because they're not going to tell you.
Speaker 2:Absolutely Well, and that's. It's funny that you bring that up, because I mean that's you're absolutely right, like, and I never thought I was perfectly fine with doing what I was doing.
Speaker 2:Which was like you know, so I, so I it's at the age of 17. I went and did it. I went into the Marine Corps recruiting office and I was like hey, I want to be a Marine. And they're like oh yeah, cool, awesome, here's the. Here's the practice PFT and here's the practice ASVAB. Oh yeah, absolutely. What do you want to be when you grow up in the Marine Corps? And I said I want to be a doctor.
Speaker 3:Didn't do your research, huh Well.
Speaker 2:The gun. He picks up his coffee cup after has just put in a freaking fresh dip in and drinking his last drink of coffee, he spits in his coffee cup, sets it back down on his desk and he goes you want to be a? What I said? I want to be a doctor for the military. He goes you don't want to be a sniper, you don't want to be a. You don't be a cop, you don't be a killer. You don't be a cool guy, a cool guy.
Speaker 3:No, I'm going to be a doctor.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm like I don't know, I want to be a doctor. He goes all right and he picks up his cup again and he spits and he sets it back down on his desk and he gets up and he walks me across the hall to the Navy and he goes hey, boats. He was talking to some second class boiler tech and he just called him a buzzing mate.
Speaker 1:He's like hey boats.
Speaker 2:This young man here wants to be a fleet Marine Force corpsman. Make it happen. What the fuck is that?
Speaker 3:I'm like is that a doctor? He goes close enough.
Speaker 2:And of course he's like yeah, yeah, you, they'll be calling you docking no time and I'm like cool.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, didn't see med school. Cool, like I'm like, I'm thinking to myself I can't wait to take the MCATs. I can't do. This is going to be awesome. This is going to be super cool. I'm going to be a doctor, I'm going to come home and I'm going to give everybody the bird.
Speaker 3:Okay, this is the people.
Speaker 1:Clinical setting. Nice white coat. This is in a field somewhere.
Speaker 3:This is the PSA for all kids that are ready to come in. Once you get the information from the recruiter, go back and ask some other people.
Speaker 2:Learn your own information. I promise you.
Speaker 3:Recruiters. There's a reason why they recruit you.
Speaker 2:You do know that they send them to sales school, right?
Speaker 3:Oh yes, it's all about the numbers. I had a friend that was a recruiter.
Speaker 2:Recruiting is sales. It's a pitch they send you to pitch school.
Speaker 3:Yeah, actually here's my short story of recruiting. When I came in, there was 13 slots open for nurses and they were I don't know. They told me there was only one left, probably just so I'd be like, you know, I gotta join. Well, at the same time, yeah, my brother's a tech school and they're using him as an example. They're just like his roommate messes the dorm room.
Speaker 3:My brother got punished. I mean, it was just like so, apparently he was probably. He was probably one of those harder guys to break down mentally and so they were just really working them right. And he called and told me one day and he's like, damn, you know, this is going on, or whatever Don Coyote over here goes walking into my recruiter's office and I just raised hell and I'm like what in the hell do you guys do? And I go on this whole tirade. I will say this is the only time I ever had power in the military, ever. And they're like what do you mean? And I, you know I tell them what's going on with my brother. I make some comment about a family member. My mom's cousin was in the military. He was like a senior ranking. He actually signed my first set of orders. Very funny, he was a chief yeah.
Speaker 3:I still have him.
Speaker 2:It's neat but he was a field grade officer, yeah.
Speaker 3:No, no, no, he's chief. Yeah, he's chief listed. Anyway, he said he was an assignments, medical assignments. So yes. So they reach out to the tech school and they tell them that I'm the niece of some colonel. They make up this. I'm like I don't know a colonel, right, and they tell them to back off him because they're trying to recruit me to come in and I'll be damn, and I didn't say a word. Yeah, yeah, yeah it's like I am the colonel now.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I swear it's the only time I ever had power in the military and they backed off him. And I remember him telling me. I didn't tell him for like a couple of years. He says man, it must be that the, you know, the, the instructors, like having a baby, he must just, it must be like easing up on him or you know, he's like, he's different. Now I'm like, oh, recruiting people, when you're coming in, they're recruiting you.
Speaker 2:Right, right, so when?
Speaker 1:did it sink in that that whole idea of doctor in the sense most people think of it wasn't going to happen?
Speaker 2:Was, it wasn't doctor.
Speaker 1:Wasn't doctor, doctor, doc was not doctor.
Speaker 2:Well probably probably the very moment that, I don't know. Like I, I thought that it was plausible, probably all the way up. Well, to be honest with you, I think it was still plausible. I think I chose a different path because it's at a certain point I was like oh yeah, I want to be a surgeon, I want to be a trauma surgeon, that's what I want to do. And then I became a Navy Corbin. And when I became a Navy Corbin, like it was you want to talk about, like okay, so you're a medic and you're a nurse, and then, like we're talking about all this stuff, like the Corbin, and if you look at lineage it's, it kind of speaks for itself, but it is totally. You just said earlier, it's like like the smaller, the more finite group of people you become, the more doctorated you become in that group of people. Navy Corbin believe that we are the best on the on the battlefield. We believe we are the best on the battlefield because that's all we focus on.
Speaker 2:A soldier medic has to focus on all of the grunt stuff and focus on all of the Corbin stuff and then it has to focus on all the personal stuff. When they train a Corbin, when we train, I say they, we, I, I was a, I was a freaking instructor of my last, like eight years or last four years. Like when we train those people, we train them to be the focus and the light on the battlefield. Like like we tell people, hey, listen, just so you know. And I believed it and I still do, I still do. When a Corbin dies on a battlefield in front of the worst and the meanest bunch of Marines, morale drops 65%, 65%. So if you die, not only have you gone, but you've, you've also you've also killed.
Speaker 2:You've also killed 65% of your team.
Speaker 3:Yeah, who did I go to Right?
Speaker 2:Right Now. That being said, and I, and again, this is this, this is not me talking trash about it because it's a necessity, it's a, it's a, it's a necessary evil.
Speaker 3:Absolutely.
Speaker 2:These things are and these are. These things are necessary evils. And like I chose to do this, I chose to do this. This is what I chose to do, so I can't be. I was at one point in my life I was the disgruntled asshole who was like, well, they don't really give a shit about me anymore, and this and that and the other. And the reality is, it's not their responsibility, it's not. Uncle Sam has a job. We'll save my opinions of how that job is being done right currently, but Uncle Sam has a job to do and that job, whether you like it or not, is to protect and serve the security of this nation.
Speaker 2:Euryd, now you want to take everything away and all. If you get all the smoke and mirrors off the fricking table in Congress and you just look at the information in front of you as to what each department is designed for, you'd realize that things are a lot less convoluted than you, than you would think. The reality is we put so much smoke and mirrors in all that garbage that people are like, well, we don't really need all those troops and we really don't need all that. Well, the reality is that we do and we need. We need some hard piped and people.
Speaker 3:We need more.
Speaker 2:We need a lot, we need some people, and I'm not talking about serial killers or psychopaths, but if you're controllable, maybe you know. But my point is is that there's there's a there's an evil necessity of security and we don't have it. We're not this we're about to learn. We're about to learn what not having security is all about.
Speaker 1:Euryd, do you Euryd? Nothing about readiness.
Speaker 3:Euryd. Yeah, do you think that part of the reason why veterans struggle and I'll say that the struggle probably starts more towards the end of the career is because they, they finally can see that light where they realize truly, I am just an asset, especially when it goes wrong, is the word that comes to mind, but it's not the right word. But when you end up in a scenario where you cannot be medically retained anymore, you're, you're broken, and now the military says hey, thanks, but you got to go, euryd.
Speaker 2:You end up in a dermal pile, euryd.
Speaker 3:Yeah, the. My example is always the Humvee. Right the Humvee. It rolls at the exact same rate all the time and either you fall off and you can get back on with some help, or you fall off and you can't. And as that veteran is seeing that Humvee go out of sight, do you think that there is when the issues kind of start?
Speaker 2:I think that that's a big part of it, but I think it's so much. Looking at my track record and this is just my humble opinion, but I think personally that it started a lot longer ago, so the whole time I don't know about you guys, I'm pretty sure there was a carrot dangled in front of me the whole time and again, necessarily evil, because the whole point is for me to buy in completely, and I think that what the problems are is that A and I'm not saying this has to change. I think that the understanding of what's going on has to be important. I agree. I think that when you're brought in under, we won't call them false pretenses, we'll call them embellishments.
Speaker 2:We'll call them embellishments and perceptions. Right, you can be, because technically you can always say to anybody you can be anything you want to be. All you got to do is work at it. Now we all know that at some point somebody is not going to be able to do that because they're either not capable mentally, physically, emotionally, spiritually, whatever or they don't have the fortitude or the desire. So all those things. It's like seeing the cake on a billboard 65 miles away and waiting until you get there so you can have a piece of cake. And then you get to the piece of cake and there ain't no damn cake left.
Speaker 3:They donate everything in the frosting Right.
Speaker 2:There's no damn cake left. And then you get out the door and you're like I just been sold a whole bunch of shit.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for a whole lot of time, for a whole lot of time.
Speaker 2:Right, you take 17 years of eating the same cookie because, by God, this cookie tastes like dirt but it's a cookie, it's going to take care of me right now. Then I'm going to expect that cookie on the way out the door to, and when the cookies not there, then I got to go make my own cookies. That's where the things change. Then I realized and this is just me looking at my perspective, you know, looking back at my perspective because I thought to myself is that this is the most prestigious thing I could have ever done, like I gave up the idea of going to be a doctor because doc was good enough to me. Doc, you, I'm going to tell you right now, you can't. Being a doctor is awesome 10 years of medical school, two years of internship, two years of residency and then your staff.
Speaker 3:Right.
Speaker 2:At that point that's a long, long, hard road up the hill to being a doctor. Right, and this is just me speaking from a Corman's perspective, when I'm doing the same work that a PA is doing in a clinical setting at the age of 19 for a bunch of for 1200 Marines we'll say 960 because it's not reinforced, We'll say 960 plus Marines A few and we're doing 44 Corman doing that same job, same exact job, for one surgeon and one chief, and they're all doing sick call for the surgeon because the surgeon's too busy doing admin stuff. But I'm seeing all the cases. I'm seeing all the cases Like people talk about well, you know, medics, all they do is Motrin, change your socks, you know, turn outboard, take a knee, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And the reality is that they don't see the other side of that coin. Like when you're coming to my office and it's 1030 at sick call and you're going hey, doc, can you take a look at something I already know? I'm looking at a penis.
Speaker 3:That's right. That's the only reason that gets said.
Speaker 2:I already know you're going to take your trousers down and go. Hey, what's this? I already know that it's 1030. If you wanted to be here at sick, call because you're sick, you want to get out of the kit. You just showed up way before 1030.
Speaker 3:That's when you're like I'm already warming the Y cell and in the Bicel, here's your Rose seven and Bicel, that's right.
Speaker 3:Well, so this you bring up a good point here, for and we have civilian audience that listened to us and civilian medical, you know, and when we started this podcast it it's geared towards military medicine, but we all know how much we do overlap in, you know, our work ethic, our sarcasm, dark humor, all that other stuff. This, right here, is where we are vastly different, vastly different. And so, shannon, can you just give a quick summary of like what you can do in a day, and I mean like the farthest end, out in a field and to an office which you basically have, office visits, you know?
Speaker 2:Sure, sure. What does that look like? I mean for on any given day? Let's just, let's, let's stay in garrison for training. Let's just talk about garrison for training. So in garrison is back at home on camp base, out, training, doing things, preparing, preparing for work. This is just your every day, all day, whatever. So a medical day? From that point, set 536 o'clock, we're on the ground or we're getting ready to do our frickin morning PT Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Speaker 1:Hashtag silver bullets.
Speaker 2:Right, right, right, passing out right Exactly Facts and stuff. Oh, there's another down marine doc, get the frickin safety truck up here, okay.
Speaker 1:Right on.
Speaker 2:Right. So, that being said, pt's over, you go take a shower, you get your breakfast and you come back to frickin sick call. Sick call starts at 7am in the morning. 7am in the morning 7 to 730, depending on where you're at and who you are and what branch of service you're at Right. So, 730 in the morning, let's say 730 in the morning to 1030. Tuesday 7 to 10. All right, so we'll say 7, 7 to 10.
Speaker 2:All right, you get in there, you start doing your frickin, you start, you know, getting prepped up for sick call. Sick call comes in. You've got you start out with like maybe two Marines and then you've got a bunch of corpsmen out with all the rest of the battalion. You've got four companies. You've got corpsmen, with each one of those companies doing training operations. So let's just say you do sick call, everybody's doing sick call right now Got maybe maybe 10 people in house. The doctor's in his office signing records because he's got to go through all his Q and A for the next day. All right, I'm seeing things like anything from Musculoskeletal injuries to to infectious disease, to cardiac problems, to STDs.
Speaker 2:Lots of that A lot of that, a lot of that, so and then, so, so. But I'm I'm seeing all these things and I'm doing everything from like I'm writing a consult up for frickin an MRI or an EEG or an EKG, and I'm writing these consults up and I take it over the doctor and I'm like here's what I got, doc. He's like oh, so did you. And I'm like yeah, everything, blah, blah, blah, here's all written down.
Speaker 1:And then the consult.
Speaker 2:Right and he'll sign the consult. He'll sign my note and I'll send the dude off to radiology Period Doctor 19, 20, 21 year old kids. Right. I'm working on his license legal and legitimate medicine under the supervision of certain people. Right, However. Comma.
Speaker 3:But you're still doing it.
Speaker 2:Still doing it.
Speaker 3:Now if you walked over to a like, say, you do in your stuff, and you got right out of the military and walked over to a hospital civilian, what would you be relegated to?
Speaker 2:Janitor.
Speaker 3:Whoa yeah, You'd be emptying Foley bags taking blood pressure.
Speaker 2:You can't even be a CNA unless you challenge the board.
Speaker 3:So I'll tell you real quickly that my husband it was a paramedic and it was very hard. He moonlighted while he was working and he I know as he was a medic, he was a paramedic on the outside, but still the difference in limited.
Speaker 2:he was really hard oh yeah, it was really hard, yeah he struggled with that part because he was capable.
Speaker 1:So go ahead, emcee. That's not. That's not even what he was doing in theater.
Speaker 2:I mean right, no, yeah listen, this is, this is, this is in garrison. And let's say, let's talk about a training evolution. Like we go out with a whole company and you've got like four, you got four, you got four docks with a whole company, four, maybe six, let's say you've got six in a company. Let's say a weapons company is about 186 men and you go out for three to four days and you're there, you're the only person taking care of all the snipples, the, the cuts, the, the bleeds, the, the runs, the, the, the bathroom situations, the wash up stations, all like. You've got to be a preventive medicine technician, you've got to be a surgeon, you've got to be an internal medicine guy, you've got to be an empath, you've got to be. You've got to be mom, dad, sister, brother, the cousin, uncle.
Speaker 3:You've got to be the pastor, and then that's what doc brings to the freaking field right in a training evolution for five days and then add to deployment and going out in past the fob, or you know out there, out there, or they're coming back from out there, out there and you're handling whatever comes in.
Speaker 2:That well, the way to speak to that like, when you like, it's man I. I. Yes, being a, being a paramedic and an EMT sucks, but at least you don't know the people you're working on yeah, that's a pretty profound statement right there it sucks, it sucks, it sucks, putting your friend in a fucking bag yeah, yeah you do it more than once, it's even worse only imagine some of the challenges that might come up in that.
Speaker 2:In that scenario, you you when you come out, when you come out of a bad situation and you're peeling your friend off of your flak jacket bad fucking day yeah, yeah, yeah, it's already. It's already like, because what I used to and this is bad, this is horrible I used to tell them. I said, listen, you're the guy that's supposed to go tell st Peter. They can't have it. I don't tell them the other part. Be prepared for st Peter to tell you to kiss his ass yeah, you gotta give hope.
Speaker 2:That's a fact, and you had there's. That's the other part of it. Yeah, you gotta give.
Speaker 2:You gotta give hope, even if it means lying through your teeth yeah, if people don't kind of get that part, because there's a mental component to hope, you know if you're sitting in the middle of a freaking a like an area of operation and you've got your heart on, you've got your hand literally wrapped around somebody's aorta in his abdomen and you're going hey man, no, no, no, hey, it's cool like you can tell your wife your own stuff. It's all good. You already know.
Speaker 1:You already know where that's gonna go yeah you gotta give everybody.
Speaker 2:It's crazy, people don't understand that. You gotta give everybody around you hope you gotta give. You gotta give him hope. You gotta give the Marines around you hope to let them know that you're there and you're gonna do everything you can, no matter how painful it is yeah that's real.
Speaker 1:I think that's what makes the navy corpsman so special, though is and this isn't something I understood until I saw it firsthand the Marines, their patience, fucking love and respect them to no end. Oh yeah, and I had heard that I'm like yeah, sure, sure, yeah, all of our patients like us. No, it is absolutely different. I mean, I think about like it's it's.
Speaker 2:You know, there's a bond between Marines and and and corpsman that most people will never understand. 90% of, first of all, 90% of the time when you say, when people are like, hey, so what'd you do in the service? And I was like I'm a corpsman, they're like what bad ass.
Speaker 2:I'm like your marine, you sure the hell right well, oh, yeah, absolutely if you're well there, I've listened listen. Just because you're, you wear the title marine doesn't mean you're awesome, trust me that goes in any service. You can name any of them the fact, and that's the same same, it's, it's exactly right.
Speaker 3:We got our garden variety, everything we'd be like I promise you, promise you.
Speaker 2:Just because you have the title veteran after your name does not mean that you're awesome.
Speaker 3:Right period but nine times out of ten.
Speaker 2:Most people have no idea what the hell a navy corpsman is. You know like what is that? So that's supposed to. I just tell them I made ice cream oh, my god work what you do in the service.
Speaker 2:I made ice cream because it's easier than telling the truth, and if I, and if I, you know, and if I'm like, well, it's kind of like, kind of like being a medic, but it's not at all being like being like a medic, it's like being a pa. It's like being a pa and being thrust into a position to where you have to learn how to keep yourself alive and keep everybody else alive, and then incorporate that empathetic empathetic side, that pastoral side, all those other things you you mentioned.
Speaker 1:This isn't just clinical, this is whole person this is person, this is personal and personal right.
Speaker 2:Person and personal it's personal, like you know, and it sucks, because what I get to watch, what I get to watch people that I know have been saved from some freaking heinous stuff and watch them get out and, you know, start out off like, oh yeah, this is amazing, we're gonna be doing these cool things and this, that and the other, and then they end up in a box yeah.
Speaker 2:I still hold accountability for that, because I spend a better part of four to five years with these people, at a time like you've been over to their house, you've you've, you've helped raise, you've babysitted their children, you've watched their dogs, you've gone to. You know, I don't even know what the fuck it's called gender reveals and all this other stuff.
Speaker 1:They're not just all work.
Speaker 2:That is a legitimate relationship backed with love and experience yes, I mean, and then you, and then you make staff in co and then you're like oh yeah, it's just a number, because that's what you have to at that point. At that point, corporal, I need five men. I don't give a shit who it is, I need five men and I need them over here right now right what do you need?
Speaker 2:just just get me people like I don't care, like I'm not gonna put them in harm's way, but I need it, I need it now. So that's so. There is a shift in every position, like I don't give a shit who you are. From the matter of fact that when I was at E1, the shift to E2 felt like a small clutch grind, but I felt it and I was like oh, e2 man, like I got a little more, a lot, not a lot, a little more responsibility right a little more responsibility, a little more pride, a little more and when you're like 19 or 20, that's that's.
Speaker 3:That's a little bit that you feel. That I mean that's, you know, as we kind of time you make E3.
Speaker 2:It's time to be putting on your big boy pants, because it's time to make in co yeah, shannon, whatever meets the road, yeah what led she you did?
Speaker 3:did you medically retired or do you retire retire? Oh, I was medically retired at 17 17 years medically retired and then when you transitioned out just kind of, because that's always an issue for people is that they transition's rough. I mean I went through it?
Speaker 2:yeah, absolutely, let me ask you this did when you went through it, did was it was it, was it your expectations?
Speaker 3:well of myself, right, because what I mean I go out during was it? Of yourself and or like for me, like the expectation wasn't just of myself, it was of what I was promised well, I can't say that necessarily for me, but I'll say that I got out during COVID, so expectations were really low who's she? Well played, yeah there weren't much, we were just happy. It was a year later before I got my retirement certificate.
Speaker 3:So if that kind of tells you where we were at, yeah, so yeah, absolutely but what it had to be wiped down with alcohol yeah, oh god, yeah, right, but what happened when you transitioned? We all went through something right. I got a story, mz is going through it now. You know, we all have got our own journey in that. What was it for you and led you over to finally, music? So how did all that? Because here you are doing medical and now you're strumming a guitar.
Speaker 2:Well, I mean, I've been into music most of my life. Like the first time I ever played any music was in fifth grade. Like they asked if anybody wanted to go over to the band room, and you know, pick an instrument and be a part of the school band.
Speaker 3:Did you play the tuba?
Speaker 2:Oh no, no, I played one of the most sexiest instruments on the planet Saxophone.
Speaker 3:Saxophone. I knew it.
Speaker 2:I mean, I'm not going to tell you it's not sexy, especially in Louisiana, but like, saxophone is always sexier. Anyway, long story short, so I started. That's where I started. I started there. I started learning to read music. My grandfather told me he's like hey man, you know, here's the deal. He gave me a bold boots Randolph's greatest hits cassette and most people don't even know who boots Randolph is.
Speaker 3:Jazz correct Huh Jazz.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he's like one of the most influential jazz saxophonists ever. And he did, he did a, he did a. Greatest hits of covers, and they were awesome.
Speaker 1:You know what I?
Speaker 2:mean. So like, and to hear to hear boots Randolph play the entertainer on a saxophone was flip and awesome, you know. And so that's. My grandfather was like, if you learn how to play this, I'll buy your own saxophone. Like because we rented we rented my saxophone. You know what I mean. And so I'm like, oh done Too easy. I mean, and it wasn't because I spent years outside listening to freaking cassettes and rock and roll stations and playing the saxophone along with it, you know, and like the song and the lost boys were the big dudes playing the saxophone on the on the dock, you know what I mean. Like that was like, that was part of my inspiration, and my cousins played guitar and drums and my uncle was in a rock band, and so I was like I'm doing that shit too because it's just cool.
Speaker 1:And I was already artistic.
Speaker 2:I was already drawing and stuff like that. So, like I liked art, art was awesome to me and I love science, which was weird.
Speaker 1:No, no, no. Actually it kind of makes sense from the dock standpoint. I get it. They correlate science.
Speaker 3:You're right, yes.
Speaker 2:And art.
Speaker 3:Most people don't realize that Most people don't realize that Use a lot similar parts of the brain, yep.
Speaker 2:Yes, right, and and that's generally and it's crazy, lee that's generally how, like, you get cross interaction from both parts of your brain. You get, you know, you get brain.
Speaker 2:Right and left side, yeah, yeah, yeah, when you're both, when you're using both sides of your brain, anyway. So that's how I got into music and music just followed me. I played, I played a lot of. When I joined, I was out in San Diego for most of my, you know, early career, my first year, and so I was in downtown San Diego, like you know, oh, you know Ocean Beach, pb, mission Beach, and we would go down to Rosarita and sit on the beach and do stupid stuff and play guitar and sing songs and all the grunge, and I can't tell you how many coffee houses I played in freaking San Diego, you know, but it was a hobby thing, it was just a hobby thing and I, you know, did I want to get picked up for it? Absolutely. But I had an active duty career that I was dealing with. Yeah, I signed a contract, so it wouldn't have mattered, like all that, like, oh, yeah, I was like, oh, maybe one day they could buy out my contract.
Speaker 3:When you look back, do you think that? Do you think that music really helped you process a lot of stuff that was going on as you move through your military?
Speaker 2:Absolutely, absolutely. So this last year, this last fall, I got to go do this thing called Highway Gordy Gordy's Highway 30, texas Edition thing, where I was with an organization called Rock the Troops, oh yeah, and so, and what they do is they take veterans out to do songwriting retreats and they might help them get through some stuff and write a song about it and help them perform it or whatever. And you know it's pretty cool and I was out there and I got to go and I got to meet somebody who you know I would otherwise I mean, I know a lot of celebrities but I would have never otherwise got to meet Aaron Lewis from Stained.
Speaker 3:Wow.
Speaker 2:And I walked up to Aaron and I was like, hey man, I just want you to know, because in Fallujah I had a Discman and I had one disc, because it was all that was on the shelf. I bought a Discman and one disc.
Speaker 3:You just ate it yourself.
Speaker 2:I did. I know I know I did. This is in 2004. Discman and so I bought Stained. Break the Cycle at the BS.
Speaker 2:And all I did was listen to Stained Break the Cycle over and, over and over and over, and then I brought a guitar so I started learning. I started learning their music. That was where I started like I started. I started getting really heavy in the music because at that point in 2004, I was already seeing some horrible shit, like I had already done my first deployment in Fallujah and seen some fucking hate and shit.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:But in Fallujah it was, there was a lot of really ugly stuff, you know.
Speaker 3:When you have music to come back. You know, I've seen. You know, when my husband deployed they would do. I mean the civilian community that's listening. Music is critical to the military world. I mean when they're flying their combat missions. Let me tell you they got some music cranking, you know.
Speaker 2:You don't think that we'll put a boot in your ass. Wasn't ringing through Fallujah in 90% of the time Right. Right, and then they had a DC Thunderstruck.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah.
Speaker 2:Like Syops was playing that shit on the loudspeaker forever.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:They were doing that during OIF1 through Al-Nazariya, I remember.
Speaker 3:I mean it's all through our culture, right, I mean it's just everywhere. I remember some of my buddies were OTS instructors and they said before they'd go into the students they'd go watch Full Metal Jacket and then bang out to the soundtrack and then they'd go in right adrenaline pumping kind of stuff.
Speaker 2:Yeah well, I'll tell you, we used to do stupid shit. We used to smack each other in the face before we go into secret.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it doesn't shock me.
Speaker 2:If there was something like you need to bring some intensity, we'd have our like co-instructor smack us in the face like stupid shit.
Speaker 3:Yeah, but what are you doing, right? You're trying to prop.
Speaker 2:I mean, you're trying to prop for things that are normal, Like you don't do it every day in life, but as an active duty member who should be getting ready to go to war, you should live in post-traumatic stress.
Speaker 3:That a very good Survival Statement. Yes.
Speaker 2:That's what keeps you alive on the battlefield.
Speaker 3:That's right.
Speaker 2:PTS is what keeps you alive. There is nothing. Here's what I don't understand. I need people to understand that PTS is not a fucking disability.
Speaker 3:It's a survival.
Speaker 2:It's an added plus. Stop playing cating it to be this thing to where, oh my God, it's destroying my. No, put it in its box, you and me. It has a place. It has a place just like everything else in your life. When you did something, your dad if your dad ever had to beat your mom, your mom was being beaten by your dad. At some point, you decided that you were going to step up and say no, you're not doing this again, or you just watched it happen. That's PTS. That's what that is. Stop it or just let it go on. Choose a decision.
Speaker 3:Right. And then what people don't understand is that we train you the skill set and then when you come home it's a struggle to shut it off because you have been trained a certain way, and that is the problem.
Speaker 2:When you're never told that you need to turn it off.
Speaker 3:Right and you don't know how to, and that's what starts interfering with things, like your wife is now saying why is the loaded hot block under the pillow? So that's where.
Speaker 2:When I got back from Fallujah I was in a freak. I was staying with my buddy, tom Matula, in Chula Vista and I promised you he gave me one of the little spare bedrooms in his house A huge beautiful house in Chula Vista and I had a very nice guest room that I was staying in. I would go to sleep with an open K-Bar under my pillow.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I had nicks and stuff all over my hands. I'd have to watch the pillow and peroxide once a week Because there were freaking nicks and blood cuts and shit from cutting myself in my own fucking. I woke up one morning out of a nightmare, night terror, whatever you want to call it. Woke up standing in front of the door waiting for it to open, with my K-Bar in my hand.
Speaker 3:And that's where it becomes the issue, when the sleep is not happening and all that.
Speaker 1:Do you think it's fair to say PTSD, we know happens. It's not a secret. We created it. But it's each individual's job responsibility. They hold the ownership to do something with it. It's not your fault necessarily that it happened, but it is your job to do something with it, to manage it. Yeah.
Speaker 2:It is my responsibility every day to get up and go. You know what? Not today, man, not today. Today you're going to be a good dude. Do what God asks you to do. Today, you're going to put God first and you're going to put people. Instead of focusing on what I could literally be giving up on, I'm going to focus on what I can do.
Speaker 3:That's a good segue into Really your, your transition. So you got out right, so you had music, thank goodness. But Was it working at that time like what happened?
Speaker 2:No, when I, when I retired after I medically retired, like Like music was a part of it I started, we started this little band called slack noise and and jacksville, north carolina, and we were playing all over North carolina, emerald isle and all that stuff, and playing in Fayetteville and all around north carolina and we were doing some cool stuff and it was an all military band and you know we were having a good time and it. You know I had a lot of angry music, man and I, when I say angry music, I had a lot of angry music Like I would take tool and I would turn it up two notches like death metal.
Speaker 2:It was well you could guarantee that. When you heard something I wrote, it was angry.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:It was angry therapeutic, though.
Speaker 3:I mean you're getting it out. Well, yeah, honestly.
Speaker 2:Yes and no, because, on top of it, what was I doing? Medicating, I was medicating. And not only that, I was already clinically medicated. I was clinically medicated. I was on 14 drugs a day for four years.
Speaker 3:Yep, nobody. Nobody went through and you know.
Speaker 2:I was on like six different mood stabilizers and, and and benzo diazepines and I was on like a bunch of migraine medication doing all kinds of stupid trash for that I was doing like and all of these things were causing the problem and self medicating. Oh and well that, and I was drinking a shit ton of alcohol because that helps medication.
Speaker 2:I listen, I'm the asshole. I'm that. I'm that douchebag. This is not my proudest moments, none of my proudest moments, but I'm that douchebag that would walk in the bar and go. Which one you motherfuckers want to knock my block off? Oh yeah, the bar I would take a shot of jay. I would take a shot of james in a drink, a half of pbr, and I'm just looking for trouble. Which one you motherfuckers want to knock my block off.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you gotta get, you want to get it out, but you're getting it out deconstructively Well and what I really wanted somebody to do was knock my head off my shoulders.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I didn't want to carry my head anymore, because I was tired of carrying what was in it.
Speaker 3:You, you made a comment in the beginning, we were talking about this and, and I think the pre before we really got going here and you said you know, I, I just I was drinking to try to get to sleep, try to Call my nerves or whatever, and it didn't work. So I stopped and I I smiled because this was something that I I fought a lot in the military the stigma of like People with PTSD or alcoholics. That is not a proper blanket statement. The alcoholism is, is a disease and there are some people that drink and find out they have that link and they become alcoholics. And there are people that are drinking and both are trying to cope and then the other person says this isn't working and puts the bottom down the mechanism is that?
Speaker 2:you're absolutely right. The mechanism is the same. Right, the mechanism is always the same, and I don't give a shit if it's heroin, alcohol, sex work, it doesn't matter, the mechanism is always the same. Coping the difference.
Speaker 1:Substance is the side effect of the disease itself.
Speaker 2:Exactly Well. So so we're talking about alcoholism or addiction versus self medication and, right, like like most people are like, oh you know, if you talk about and hear me, I'm a huge fan of the program because it works for a lot of people. It's not necessary for everybody and I may or may not have been talked about like hey man, you should probably look into, you should look into freaking mr. You know bill w and I'm like I've looked into bill w, like I didn't need bill w to quit drinking.
Speaker 3:What's bill w? I don't know that one. Hey, hey, oh, oh.
Speaker 2:Hey, I was like you know so right w was part of the part of the solution.
Speaker 3:And and that doesn't work for everybody. I know people that they found other methods.
Speaker 2:It doesn't work until it works.
Speaker 3:Right, I mean that's the deal. It's a good program.
Speaker 2:Listen, I'll be honest with you. It's amazing program. It really is.
Speaker 3:Um but you're not an alcoholic either.
Speaker 2:Correct. Not only that, though, but here's the other side of that coin. There are addictive personalities in the narrow note. That's clinically proof. Now, if, if I am, I have a bar in my house there's a bar with more whiskey and bourbon, then I could get rid of in a week. I have bottles of beautiful Italian wines In here and some amazing ports From the green from the green, freaking green, runnery, you know, and those seasonal ports are amazing. I'm not white knuckle and for shit, right Like I don't care. I made a decision. I made a decision because my life was going backwards. I was self-medicating, I was jacking up myself, I was falling away from god, I was doing all these stupid things, and I made a decision in a jail cell. I made a decision at two o'clock in the morning in a jail cell that I couldn't do this anymore.
Speaker 1:Rock bottom.
Speaker 2:That was my fourth DUI. That was my prison DUI Right here in Texas. When they tell you you can't afford a DUI in Texas, they're not fucking with you.
Speaker 3:How long do you, how long were you in jail for?
Speaker 2:I was only in jail for like 23 hours, 22 hours.
Speaker 1:That's a dry out, I think they say like the average DUI costs anywhere between 10 and 22 000 from start to finish.
Speaker 2:But I promise you even that here in the state of Texas, like you're gonna pay at least 20.
Speaker 3:You still have your license after four.
Speaker 2:And only by the grace of god, and I don't want to tell you why. Because veterans court and I promise you if it, oh, we know veteran treatment court very well, I work with them, mm-hmm amazing. Yeah, I told, I told Georgetown that I'd be happy to work with him.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, that's a great program.
Speaker 2:Whatever it is, I'm all about it. So. But you know, the only reason again, all all of that is there, by the grace of god, and I say it all, flip in time.
Speaker 3:There, by the grace of god, go I, because I promise you, if it's up to me, I'm gonna screw it up so when you, when you got out of there, so you there, it was Jail cell, like all right, we're done, and that was a flip. Yep then what?
Speaker 2:um, I, it was just I. I had to. I had to Just because, like I was sitting in the jail cell and I had said I quit. That was, that was the probably the lowest point in my life, because I just got out of that jail cell and my next court appearance this was during covet. My next court appearance was going to be a year later and the probability of me going to prison was very real who. So I waited a whole year to find out whether I was going to prison or not.
Speaker 1:Had that lingering over your head.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah. And then I walk into a court room and and I'm gonna tell you right now If it weren't for the sweet words of judge barker and her, her staff, look at me and telling me that I had another opportunity To put myself straight, it would have been a bad day Because I'd spent a whole year waiting to go to prison. I went to court Knowing that my probability was going to be a prison sentence for at least a year and a minimum 40 ui's across the united states. A minimum, that's a minimum of a year in a prison and in my head it was either I'm either gonna own it or I'm gonna die in it.
Speaker 2:That's where I was at. I mean, they're gonna own that prison. I'm gonna die it one of the two, so I it's time to put in the work. At that point it wasn't just about music, it was about it was about therapy. It was about it's about being real with myself. It was about connecting with god and connecting with the people that I, that I've known and and Re-indressing things that I've caused and the hurt that I've created, and and trying to reconnect the people that I've destroyed or hurt. Broken bridges, burnt, burnt bridges all those things it was time for me to put in the real work of being a grown ass man and owning my own shit.
Speaker 2:Time to heal? Yeah well, everybody can heal the hard part about it, and I say this all the fucking time. Man, it's simple math. Get rid of the fucking smoke in the room and look at the fucking skeleton on the floor. Put it back together when you're done, trying to play with the smoke. And why is this smoking here? Who gives a shit? Get rid of it. Well, why are we creating this smoke? Well, because I don't know Fucking. We'll figure that out later. But you can't create like we create bigger problems in our own head for every situation that we're in. Then it has to be guilty, guilty, like it doesn't have to be so convoluted. Look at the facts. At the end of the day, we're putting freaking garbage in the middle of a freaking truck that doesn't need to be picked up. It's trash bags full of air. Get rid of the trash bags full of air and see what the real problem is, and then fix the real problem.
Speaker 2:No, but, I, gotta get to it, I've got to recognize it and I've got to really put in the damn work.
Speaker 1:Which require us first to identify it, own it and then show up for yourself consistently. Look what were you saying.
Speaker 3:Look in the mirror.
Speaker 2:That's it. That's it. That's the hardest thing I've ever done. In my life. I've done some real intense and hard shit. The hardest thing I've ever done was looking the mirror.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's a hard one. It is the.
Speaker 2:I think it is the hardest thing anybody my kids will never understand how hard I didn't want to screw my kids up. I didn't want to screw because I was. I was not okay, I was not okay and I, I let, I let. I didn't even so much as raise a finger to fight to save my kids. I just let her have them and I let her do whatever she wanted with it. I don't have a relationship with my kids because I wasn't in a good place to have a relationship with my kids and when I was Like they've already kind of Merrick, no dad whatever.
Speaker 1:So now, how old? How old were they around that point?
Speaker 2:What when I was jacked up? Oh, one was probably maybe seven, claire was probably like two, three.
Speaker 3:How old are they now?
Speaker 2:Well, he's what he's 21, There'll be 22 this year, and she is. Is she's 15, 16,?
Speaker 3:you know if I, if I could say anything to that, just the what I have seen, and by no mean an expert in this, but what I've worked with a lot of veterans out of bed in that situation and the one thing I have seen is as the kids get older, they kind of develop that whole frontal brain. I think it's step back, that there is healing, that happens and and I don't think it has to be the end of the road.
Speaker 2:So well, and you know I'm in a place like you know, I called them all all of the last three months of last year. I mean like hey, just want to see what you wanted for Christmas and this and that, and yeah, they're trying to get a hold of you, trying to talk to you, and I'm still trying to text them. That's good though it goes a long way.
Speaker 2:I haven't had any response and I Listen, man, at the end of the day, like that's what I'm trying to tell you, like the hardest thing I've ever done was take the very serious look at myself. Yeah, I have to own what I've done now to those kids thinking of that when I was doing, what I was doing Was saving them. I've never been a part of their life.
Speaker 3:Yeah, afraid of hurting them.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I was. I was afraid of taking their childhood away. Yeah, that's what I was, that's what I was afraid of. I was afraid that I was going to really jack up my kids, because I was not. I was not mentally and emotionally stable to Did that channel into your music.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah.
Speaker 3:What so, speaking of that, it reminds me of the you just released right, a song that seems to be quite popular.
Speaker 2:You talking about, dear Mom?
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:One.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I yeah. So, dear Mom, like I was asked about, dear Mom man, that was tough and even then, like I was, I was, I was doing all kinds of therapy I was doing. I was probably doing like eight hours of therapy a week.
Speaker 3:That's intense.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like there was two group sessions a week. There was there was three like personal sessions, four personal personal sessions and it was. It was a lot. And then I got out and then the VA only wanted to see me once every fucking three months and they wanted to do exposure therapy. Well, we'll talk about take this, go this, go take this. This recording is the worst moment of your life. Take it home and be by yourself with it and then turn it on and listen to it over and over and over again.
Speaker 1:So reason that needs to be done in inpatient setting.
Speaker 3:CPT. I'll tell you Do. I believe there's a place for talk therapy apps. A frickin' Lutely I do.
Speaker 2:Do you do? I believe I mean supported.
Speaker 3:Right. Do I believe that you should just like everybody can do it? No, not everybody can and some will never be able to. But are there enough other modalities to help them process without talk therapy?
Speaker 2:Yeah, you're right, right, absolutely. So I wrote a song called Frustrated, and it was back around that whole period of time, because and frustrated was like I realized that everybody wanted to help me. I didn't know what the fuck I needed, like people were just throwing stuff at me, like, hey, you should try this, you should try this, you should come to church, you should do that. And I'm thinking in myself like if I go to church, the church is going to burn down, like I don't need to walk into a church man, because, like, god is already forsaken me. And the reality is is none of that was true, but in my head that was what was going on, right, you know, because I'm not worthy of God's love, and at the end of the day, that's not true.
Speaker 2:But what I will say is, at the time it was so overwhelming when people are just like, hey, you should try this, you should, you should take, you should take. Well, butchering, you should try this, you should do that, you should take. We're going to put you on a flexor 300 milligrams of like. That's like putting you on an anti aircraft gun 300 milligrams of effects.
Speaker 3:Or that was a zombie and try to come off it.
Speaker 2:Oh, it's horrible. I did, yeah, I went freaking. I went freaking cold turkey, oh people go insane.
Speaker 3:I'm one of my friends. If she was straight to a hospital, yeah, I had a friend that was on, I think, well, butron. And if she was an hour late, she started feeling off.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, I mean, that starts to crawl detox on.
Speaker 3:that is nasty and nobody, nobody seems to tell anybody that. Oh it's horrible yeah.
Speaker 2:There's just. Those things are like listen, I agree that there is a there's a place and a time for those things, but at the end of the day, it's just another narcotic.
Speaker 3:But it should always be. It should always be that when you start this, it is to help you kind of get to the end of it. Yeah, get back in control to be able to heal some of this, to be able to talk through some of it, because you're so inflamed you cannot have that discussion and then be able to you know wean off that.
Speaker 2:As you were like we're going to put you on lithium. I'm like you're not putting me on battery acid.
Speaker 3:Oh damn, hello tart of dyskinesia.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you're not putting me on battery acid, like I know enough about medicine to tell you to kiss my ass. That's nasty.
Speaker 3:But glad, and here's a good point you're going to. You're making Shannon, you guys can advocate for yourselves.
Speaker 2:Yes, absolutely you can, and you know, I tell you let me tell you this, like I want to say, and sorry to interrupt you but, I, want to. I want to tag on to what you just said. Just because a doctor tells you something doesn't mean you have to follow that. That's what a second and a third opinion Thank you.
Speaker 3:That's the important part. Don't go to Dr Google and say well, they say no Well you go.
Speaker 2:How many people go to WebMD right now? Merk? But at the same time or hey, I spent a night in a holiday and Express last night.
Speaker 3:I know what I'm doing, Like shut up.
Speaker 2:Like my girlfriend, like I love her to death. But she's like, oh, I watched Grey's Anatomy. I have a screen Grey's Anatomy.
Speaker 3:I'm like no, no, because doctors are actually starting IVs and stuff.
Speaker 2:That's not real, oh no, I mean, I mean, I mean, they can't. There are some, some doctors like like you know, there are some doctors that can, but like well, yeah, it's not what they do every day.
Speaker 3:Those are the guys are. Those are like unicorns, yeah right.
Speaker 2:Those guys and gals are like unicorns because they, like those guys, came from where we are.
Speaker 3:Right, Right. So so yeah, how, how long you been retired?
Speaker 2:Since February of 27th of 2010.
Speaker 3:2010. So 14 years, nice, all right, you guys. So we need to. I've decided. I'm making a command decision here.
Speaker 2:We're going part two because, nurses always thinking they got the rights to tell us what to do. I mean they do.
Speaker 3:Yeah, listen, though, don't you?
Speaker 2:No comment. Kind of Kind of.
Speaker 3:Well, you, you do the. You know what y'all do. Yes, ma'am, yes sir. There's nothing more fucking annoying than when you're talking to them and all of a sudden I know because I have a husband that does this to me he just click and they look and they're all perfectly sitting there, blank face, looking at you. Yes, ma'am.
Speaker 1:Yes, ma'am, yes, ma'am, fuckers as that senior in CO's. Don't do this, don't die.
Speaker 3:It's a little thing that y'all just oh, my kids do it too. You know my son, you're like, yes, ma'am, I'm like shut up, Turds, Super annoying. All right, so we're wrapping this up and we're going to do a part two, Shannon, because a lot of good conversation and and I don't think- we should really. You are long winded as shit I'll give you that I'll win that too.
Speaker 3:So all right. So, everybody here, you just be listening, because there's going to be a part two coming out, and you know we put it out every two weeks, so you're going to have to listen to this one and then you're going to have to wait two weeks and listen to part two as Shannon. So yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you have that time seeing that channel.
Speaker 2:That's all right what she said.
Speaker 3:So it's detox and MZ here and we are going to peace out for now and then you're going to see us all with Shannon in part two.
Speaker 2:Just cus.