Have you ever wondered about the environmental impact of disposable period products? Join me as I sit down with Ruby Raut, the Co-Founder and CEO of WUKA, a brand committed to reducing the use of these products through their innovative, sustainable period underwear. Ruby shares the inspiration that led to the creation of WUKA and discusses the challenges she faced in changing habits and perspectives around period products. Tune in for an enlightening conversation about sustainability and the ground breaking work of WUKA.
Growing up, Ruby lived in a household dominated by women. Yet, the topic of periods remained shrouded in taboos and restrictions. We discuss these cultural beliefs and the pressing need for proper education and hygiene practices in this episode. Ruby shares the personal experiences that led to the creation of WUKA, a solution that not only addresses environmental concerns but also societal taboos. Listen as we examine the need for open conversations about periods and women's health in general.
Beyond creating a sustainable product, Ruby's journey also involves navigating the business world with tenacity. She shares her experiences, from networking to securing funding for her start-up, revealing the resilience required to run a bootstrapped company. We also discuss leadership styles, the importance of fostering a positive work culture, and maintaining a healthy work-life balance. Ruby's story is a testament to the indomitable spirit of immigrant families and their drive to succeed. Be prepared to be inspired as you join us for this engaging conversation.
Your feedback is always welcome, as we strive to enhance the content's value for you. Enjoy Leadership in Colour - Voices you may not have heard from before.
Have you ever wondered about the environmental impact of disposable period products? Join me as I sit down with Ruby Raut, the Co-Founder and CEO of WUKA, a brand committed to reducing the use of these products through their innovative, sustainable period underwear. Ruby shares the inspiration that led to the creation of WUKA and discusses the challenges she faced in changing habits and perspectives around period products. Tune in for an enlightening conversation about sustainability and the ground breaking work of WUKA.
Growing up, Ruby lived in a household dominated by women. Yet, the topic of periods remained shrouded in taboos and restrictions. We discuss these cultural beliefs and the pressing need for proper education and hygiene practices in this episode. Ruby shares the personal experiences that led to the creation of WUKA, a solution that not only addresses environmental concerns but also societal taboos. Listen as we examine the need for open conversations about periods and women's health in general.
Beyond creating a sustainable product, Ruby's journey also involves navigating the business world with tenacity. She shares her experiences, from networking to securing funding for her start-up, revealing the resilience required to run a bootstrapped company. We also discuss leadership styles, the importance of fostering a positive work culture, and maintaining a healthy work-life balance. Ruby's story is a testament to the indomitable spirit of immigrant families and their drive to succeed. Be prepared to be inspired as you join us for this engaging conversation.
Your feedback is always welcome, as we strive to enhance the content's value for you. Enjoy Leadership in Colour - Voices you may not have heard from before.
I started these conversations to discuss leadership, mentorship, growth so much more voices you may not have heard from before. I hope the conversations inspire you, motivate you and give you something to think about. This leadership in colour by myself, shazik Bah, is supported and powered by MEPHAR. Welcome to Leading Shipping Colour. Super pleased to have Ruby Rout, co-founder and CEO of WUKA WakeUp and Kick-Ass, on the call today, For many reasons. One, the product is quite interesting. I didn't realise how interesting it would be when I first heard and learned about it. To be fair, ruby is super difficult to pin down. To have her on the call is quite the treat. Ruby, I don't know if I've really done you any justice there in the introduction, but why don't you introduce yourself a little bit better than what I just did?
Speaker 2:Thank you, shaz. You did perfectly well. Honestly, I'm easy to find honestly.
Speaker 2:You messaged me on Instagram and I'm there most of the time, ruby, I'm the CEO and co-founder of WUKA, like you said, stands for WakeUp Kick-Ass, because I think that's what we are In our own way. We wake up kick-ass every day. We make period underwear. Up until last month, I could have said period underwear. Now I think we are more of an absorbent apparel, so we do period underwear, swimwear, sportswear, incontinence underwear, so pretty much like an underwear that will be there from your first period to last period and beyond. I think we are more of that A period healthcare brand.
Speaker 1:There's a whole piece in there about the sustainability. It's reusable, I've got to say. I went onto the site. I saw your product range and it was not what I was expecting. I don't know what I was expecting from the product, to be fair, but it is really super slick, great designs, A fantastic looking product. I can't really say anything else apart from the fact that it just looks different from what I was expecting. When I look at period products or when I think about period products my bought for my wife or my mum in the past. Yeah, WUKER is different, it's just not what you're expecting.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they are reusable. So they were last year for two years. Multiple washable and all this kind of thing. Each pair of WUKER replaces around 200 disposable going to landfill.
Speaker 2:So when we were talking about sustainability, any period product I think especially reusable pants are sustainable. What sets us apart is we also use incredible sustainable fabric like 10 cell model. You talk about the epitome of sustainability. We are there from packaging. Everything comes in a compostable packaging too. We make sure that pretty much every delivery goes in a letterbox size as well, so you don't miss the parcel.
Speaker 2:So we have thought of like various ways that the business of brand can be sustainable. We were the first brand to do carbon report on period pants. There was never a report done and we found out that when you compare period pants with contemporary pads and tampons, they have got five times less carbon footprint than pads and tampons. Since we started we have saved over two billion tampons and pads going to landfill, and this is like from people switching from disposable to reusable.
Speaker 2:Every year we have a day called Earth Hour where for one hour 8.30 to 9.30. And this is usually the last Sunday of last Saturday or Sunday of March we celebrate and we almost give our self-emission. Like one hour, one million tampons and pads going to landfill, and this is like a non-organic word of mouth. Tell your friends and families for one hour, 50% off kind of campaign. But also, on the long run, you are saving X amount of tampons and pads going to landfill, and this year, in 2023, we managed to do 2.2 million tampons and pads going to landfill in just one hour and it's like an incredible phenomenon. We all want to be sustainable in one way or the other, I think, but there's this horrible thing called habit and everybody's sucker for this habit kind of way, and I think that makes it very difficult because, traditionally, all we have used is like decades and decades of pads and tampons. So I think it's a mindset you know, like changing from disposable to reusable.
Speaker 1:Ruby, I'm really keen to go further into it. But to be honest, you sort of kind of stole the script there. You went far ahead. So I usually kick off the conversation with if we go back to the top as you kick off a conversation with what's the story behind your name?
Speaker 2:My name. Okay, so my full name is actually Rubina. I think it's a very Muslim name. Now my name came after my uncle went to watch Tarzan and the character name was called Ruby. So he came home they say like, oh, ruby is a nice name while my mom was pregnant. But my sister before me was called Regina, so I think my mom wanted to sound the similar kind of like Regina Rubina, so it ended up becoming Rubina. So Ruby is more like my Western name. I would say Back home everybody calls me Rubina.
Speaker 1:And it's funny because, firstly, it's funny that the name came from Tarzan that's a great story in itself and secondly, it just does feel like quite a South Asian thing to do, which is the like rhyming the names. I got told off because we didn't rhyme our kids' names. But yeah, it's just the dumb thing, isn't it?
Speaker 2:And it's very common, but my oldest sister name is Elisa, so she's got the queen's name. My mom adored her, Then Regina. I don't know again. That is Regina is also a queen name right, like in the Greek queen or something like that, and that's how I ended up getting a Tarzan's girlfriend name.
Speaker 1:Okay enough, we won't read too much into that. So let's go into your journey pre-wooker. So you know where have you come from and I understand that there was quite a journey over to the UK.
Speaker 2:It was so life started in Nepal up in the mountains. I was born in the mountains, stayed there for 10 years of my life when I was young. Then we moved to Thirai. So if you are looking at Nepal, it's divided into three parts. You have got mountains, you've got valleys and you've got the Thirais and the temperature goes from very low on the top of the mountain to very high as you go down the plains. So we were born in the mountains, then we moved my first school to the valleys, then from there we came down to the plains Very hot, very hot place.
Speaker 2:I mean last year, a couple of years ago actually, I went to Nepal and I went to my mom's town and at one day it recorded 46 degrees. It's like baking hot. We're very close to India, pretty much used to walk to India from there border in between but we have got, like the beautiful of Da Thiling as well, mixed to it. So I was quite, I think in a way I was blessed to be able to move different parts of the country. So did all my schools, my A-levels, in Nepal and then came to UK when I was 20. Looking back, 20 feels like oh my God, I was very young when I came here to leave home first, second go to first ever foreign countries, ever on my own, you know, but it was exciting. I came here to study but I guess, like in a way, my journey of work actually started when I had my first period and that was back home in Nepal and it is connected how I ended up here, I would say.
Speaker 1:So tell me, tell me about that. So how did your first period get you to the UK and London?
Speaker 2:So first period, my, both of my. So I was born in the family of other two girls and me third, all daughters no son whatsoever. Up until 11 year old I was a very tomboy Like pretty much I almost played the part of the son in the family, you know like, from doing every chores to helping out everyone. Both of my sister had the period before me. My mom had periods.
Speaker 1:And.
Speaker 2:I knew this because every time they had periods they never went to kitchen or went to temple or went to any kind of ceremony, things that we were celebrating. So it was nothing new for me. But when I had my first period I used to live quite closer to my aunt's house and my first period my auntie says to my mom like okay, she's got her first period she has. She cannot stay at home because she cannot see her father or go out to school, those kind of things. So my mom basically said like okay, she cut her old sorry, cut into small pieces and made a like a stack of eight, nine pads for me and said like these are your pads. During a period you put it in the underwear and you wear them, but the first period you have to go and stay at your aunt's house. And in my aunt's house there were two other girls just a couple of years younger than me. So I was like, yes, this is the best time ever. Like you can go and have a slump party at your cousin's house, you know when they're. But my aunt goes like okay, this is your room, this is a bed, to show me on the floor a cup, bowl and a plate. I think those were all fine.
Speaker 2:Often I used to get really upset by the fact that they would not even pass me the food on the hand, but they would pass me on the floor. It's like very, if you, if you know much about Asian culture, it's very. We are very driven by caste system, right, and then when the lower caste is like something that you don't hand off, you don't offer food by your hand, you often push it down on the floor and it was almost treated like that. In seven days I was like almost suffocating. I could not get out of the room, didn't go to school. Pretty much I used to just watch people play outside in front of the window. When back home and I told mom like this is the worst thing ever, like don't, ever, ever, please do this to me, so she goes like that's alright, it's the first time, so you don't have to do it anymore. But going forward every four days you can't do this, this and that, that was like going to kitchen, even pouring yourself a water was not allowed, you know. So I think that was like the quite extreme taboos around periods that I noticed. Then came the challenges around schools and I think that just exacerbates the whole problem into next level.
Speaker 2:We didn't have toilet, we had a. We had a one common toilet like almost like a canal in front of you and everybody's squatting. We, when you have your period, you either squat in front of them or just don't go to toilet. When you pull your underwear down, the pad is literally falling on the ground. You can't even put it back on again. You didn't carry the spare to change. There was like nothing provision provided on it. So slowly pretty much all of my friends stopped and I stopped going to school, especially the four days. Just make up any excuse. That's what we would say like wearing severe pain, those kind of thing.
Speaker 2:Then slowly everybody started giving up sports and just became one of those things you know like almost a burden of being a woman, a girl. So then I started like watching quite a lot of like TV adverts. Especially India being close, we used to watch quite a lot of Indian channel and used to see like different kind of pads that was advertised, and one was like a brand called whisper. I mean, I hate that name. It's just creates this culture of discreteness you know like and that we should be ashamed and not talk about it. And my first pocket money, I think I went to one of the pharmacy to buy some pad and basically he wrapped it in four newspaper, then in a black plastic bag, and he gave it to me as if like I was smuggling something, took it home, used one. Then I saw the real problem. We did not have any bin, so pretty much I had to burn that pad after I use it. So that almost stopped me from using any disposable but like reusable as well.
Speaker 2:There was quite a lot of taboos. I remember one particular thing that my mom said was like when washing the rags make sure that you hide it under a towel, because if somebody finds your rags they will do like voodoo kind of thing on you and you'll be infertile. So when, when you are so young and somebody tells you that such a strong story around it, it almost gets ingrained in your head. You know, like, and that's one of the reasons why quite a lot of people actually don't dry their clothes properly, and there's nothing wrong with reusable product, nothing wrong with the reusable rags, you know it's, it's how would you maintain the hygiene around it? That is the.
Speaker 2:That is the, I think, the education that is lacking. But yeah, I still like, vividly remember, like, quite a few things that I used to do to make sure that the pad stayed was like. One of those were like putting a safety pin in the front and back of the underwear so it stayed in Obviously very dangerous thing to do. Then I quickly moved into wearing multiple underwears, to wearing slack shorts, just so that it stayed in one place, and I think that had always been back in my mind. So when I started WUKA, it was basically the same concept taking that sorry wrap, taking that safety pin, making sure that it stayed in the underwear. That's the journey of it. But I just, I think, came from a slightly different direction when I learned about sustainability.
Speaker 1:It's quite a story. Where's the part of the story that brings you to London?
Speaker 2:London. London came to 2010. And London was about, I would say, finding opportunity. Grew up in a very poor family, so my dad pretty much earned $100, three daughters to go to school, feed, everything right. So I think I just was like quite since very young I was like one of those girls who always wanted my mom to be happy and satisfied and have some money so that she can spend life a little bit better than you know like when she had. So it came to UK in search of opportunity Quickly.
Speaker 2:The college that I came one year I finished the education, then I had to extend my visa and the second college that I joined actually got shut down so lost some money in there. Pretty much at one point became a homeless person. But I had to say like I found this great family in the lights of all of this, when I was doing an all pair job, who literally gave me a place to stay, food to eat and said, like, do three days of work for us and then rest of the days you can go find something else to do. And I think had there not been there, I would have gone home.
Speaker 2:And I think this is the story of pretty much every immigrant who come here. It's like if you don't have the job, pretty much there's nothing for us here. Families away. But they came as a family into my life and I'm so glad we are still in close touch with each other and we chat. The kids have grown up, gone to university now, so like time has moved on quite a bit. And then when I met Dave then he said me you need to go back to study, kind of way, and did environmental science and that changed my life.
Speaker 1:Dave's your other half.
Speaker 2:There's my other half, yeah. Okay, my other half co founder, partner in crime, everything.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:All right.
Speaker 1:So so you went back and you did your studies, competed with them and then set up WCAG straight away.
Speaker 2:No, no. So did environmental science through Open University two years. Then it took me an entire year and a four months to actually find a job. I genuinely thought like graduating in you from British University would land me a desk job easily. You know like. This was 2017, right, sustainability was just creeping in into businesses and things Like people are talking about CSR, esg at that time, but yet nobody knew what it was, how to do it. So I think for a year I did three volunteer work at different charities. Then I used to run a pop-up kitchen selling Nepalese vegan food which I love, by the way cooking for others and I think in the midst of it.
Speaker 2:Then an opportunity came from St Spree's to a million pound project given to 50 community groups who are doing something to fight food waste. Obviously, when I was learning about the waste kind of thing, food waste was like a massive topic at that time. So I proposed a proposal, almost like a small project called food waste ninjas, teaching kids about where the food comes from, why food waste is bad for the environment. Went to one of the charities asking if they could be the bank for me and the fund can come to them and then they can deploy it on me and maybe perhaps hire other people as well. Went to the meeting and they go like, no, sorry, you can't do it because it's so hard to get into school and I guarantee you won't be able to get into school. They go like that to me, rejected me, like completely.
Speaker 2:So I literally came home and I said like, okay, what does it take to set up a community group? You know like, and all you need is like a treasury and a chairperson and pretty much that's it. You know like three people team can open. So I messaged a couple of my friends. I said like, could you be a treasury and could you be a chairperson? And let's open this and I would like to run this project and perhaps, like, if you wanted a part-time job, I would be more than happy to put you in there as well. So, within a week, set up that send a 500 page project, got 36k in less than two months and that was it Like. That was the beginning of like, I think, believing in myself that okay, if people don't give me a job, I can actually go and make myself a job.
Speaker 1:Wow, that's quite inspirational. So where does that come from? Where does that spirit come from?
Speaker 2:I've never been afraid to ask for things and I think that comes from more from my mom. Like. My mom is like an absolute powerhouse and growing up she has this open door policy in our home that if anybody comes and it's need of help, we are there, regardless whether we have enough or not, we will share it, but be there for somebody to help, because sometimes, when we will be coming in need, there will be people around us. You know, like who will be able to help, and my mom is one of those person I don't know.
Speaker 2:In the poly culture, like pretty much once a year during the full moon night, there is this guy who comes and plays this, do you know, like a shell. You make a sound through a shell kind of way. He comes around blowing that, taking the bad spirit out from the house, and my mom used to live all the doors and windows open while we are fast asleep at two o'clock, three o'clock at night, this guy used to walk into the house blowing this thing right, trying to take this, and the next day morning he used to come back and just say hello and all this kind of thing, and she used to leave the door open for those people you know, like how crazy is that? I can't even think now leaving the whole door open for some random people to walk into your home while you are fast asleep. So I guess, yeah, I think quite a lot of things comes from her.
Speaker 2:Like she's a tough woman, like I've never seen anybody like my mom, and she always say, like there's a saying like if I say in Nepali, it's like if you speak up, you'll even sell the flowers, but if you don't speak up, you might have the greatest of the rice and you can't even sell those rice, kind of way, because rice is obviously seen as like the higher form of food, kind of way, whereas flour is different. So that's what I said you go and ask and you ask, knock the door and see. You know where that lands you. The worst thing you can get is no right, and then hopefully that inspires you to go into something else.
Speaker 1:That's quite a nice way to live, right, that you just go for it, and I can see that. I mean, it seems to be really evident in the name as well, I'm assuming. I mean, where did the name Wuka come from?
Speaker 2:Wuka actually comes from Pinterest, not that far away. So I think we were well, basically I was sitting and I was looking. When we started the underwear we were like okay, we got to give a brand name. So I went to Pinterest and like looking for inspirational quotes like now and then to post on LinkedIn and I come across this poster called Wake Up Kickass, repeat and like these are like cute poster frames and I was like wake up kickass sounds good. And in the beginning it started with like wake up kickass and we had put a period like a dot at the end of the sentence kind of way, and then slowly it evolved to be just becoming wake up kickass. Then we thought okay, that's too long for a website, so take an abbreviation kind of way. And most of like, great brands are like four letter words brands, right, you look at Nike and Phila and Puma and all this kind of thing. Four letter words, easy to remember, easy to type. So we settled at Wuka.
Speaker 1:I need to rethink the leadership in colour browning. I might get back onto Pinterest and Instagram see if I can see. That's brilliant. I love the ease of that because people can spend a lot of time coming up with a brand name. So the reason why I bring that up is because when we caught up last time, we were talking about sort of networking and funding and looking for funding and the fact that you've not actually had any sort of formal jobs right. So I don't know how you feel in those environments asking for funding or explaining the products to people who may or may not have considered it.
Speaker 2:You know, funny, you asked me that because I haven't yet asked money to anyone. Like I think the one time I asked money was when I did the Kickstarter for Wuka. That was five years ago. That was based on. In three months time I'll send you some pens.
Speaker 2:I hope you like my story and you, and I think in a some way, like I am quite scared of like going for my first round of investment and having to justify it. I think now at least I can quite confidently say, like you know, like Wuka served over 500,000 women's period and all this kind of thing and saved X amount of time for the past. I think it would always be a difficult kind of thing, but you know I came all the way from Nepal, all the way to here, started a business, so I think I don't think anything would phase me to ask for it. You know, again, what's the worst they can do Say no, that's it, that's it number one. And I do hear quite a lot that people have to go knock quite a few doors, kiss a lot of frogs before you get the right words.
Speaker 2:So we are still bootstrapped since day one and very proud as well that fact that we own the company for ourselves. You know, and I think once people start getting investment, one of the things they say they missed that autonomy about, like you can make the decision instantly, like this, you know, whereas when you have other investors come on board, then that's another extra layer of discussion to be done before any action can happen. So in a way we are very lean. We do pretty much quite a lot of campaign within a week. Right now if you're going to Westfield in Stratford you will see our DC period campaign shining and very proud of that.
Speaker 1:This is the billboard that you're talking about.
Speaker 2:Yes, it's a billboard.
Speaker 1:I saw the post actually, so I might be wrong, but are you on the billboard?
Speaker 2:I am yes, it was so. So I've never become a bride in a way like a Desi bride. When I married Dave, we did the traditional register office.
Speaker 1:So civil ceremony.
Speaker 2:Civil ceremony yeah, with only like seven, eight people around us, so this was like me, fully dressed up as a bride. I don't think I would want to be again, though, but yeah, there's a lot of makeup.
Speaker 1:Did you enjoy the experience?
Speaker 2:I did In a way, the women who came around. They literally made me feel like as if it was my wedding. We had incredible influencer to people who are making a massive change within Asian culture. We had Seaman and she's like the sexual and wellness like almost guru. So little gets spoken about like sexual well-being within Asian culture and I think she was. She's incredible. Then we had Levina Ameta, who got the MB for doing a pee with her mother-in-law during the lockdown to shiny danda, incredible activist, disabled activist. So it was such a great crew and everybody was like like had there been a bride, a groom on the other side coming, that could be a wedding.
Speaker 1:Had you thought about it, had you thought about inviting the other half down and be doing a little photo shoot?
Speaker 2:I just send him a picture and he goes like, oh wow, that's all I got. Maybe he was more shocked by like the amount of makeup and like full on dress than anything else. And he has never received me like full makeup yet and I don't know, I don't do that as well.
Speaker 1:I think oh, wow is the perfect response. The thing that I wanted to ask you about is your leadership style within the organization. For reference, I met a member of your team and you know she, you know she and I. We spoke a little bit about, about you and what sort of character you are. There was only positive things said for disclosure, but I'm keen to hear a little bit about your leadership style, especially seeming that it feels like you're kind of going with your guts. You're not going with book or a formula or the academic route or a business school route of building the business, the organization, and then building a team. I get the feeling, you know, especially when you mentioned bootstrap. It's a lot more sort of like we need something, we need someone to go for it. Is that fair?
Speaker 2:It is. It is Like you said. I've never worked prior to this job, I've never done a desk job period kind of like, and I still I think I still am struggling like having more and more people come in and putting that structure in place, Because I've never seen a structure, Nobody's taught me how to do it, I don't have a framework to follow. So all this year, like it has been, like I want to treat people like how I like to be treated by myself, right, Like how people treat me kind of way, and I think that has always been my head. Like if I'm not well, I go and lie down in the sofa and I would like my team member to do the same thing as well If they're not well in the office, in the open. I think a couple of things that I have adopted is like that open door policy from my mom kind of way, and it has always been the same. I love when team we work together in the office.
Speaker 2:I know people think about room art working and all this kind of thing. When you are a startup company, you want people to almost embody what the brand is and feel it. Where I'm coming from, what we are trying to achieve and I think nothing gets better than when you are in the room headbutting and trying to figure out how to solve things. So I think culture definitely has evolved over the time. Then Dave's come in, who comes from more slightly organized framework kind of background, and I think they are like a plus and minus to it. I'm very lean, so you think of something pretty much at the end of the day you can make it happen and we all have that potential to make it happen. I'm very that mindset. But then sometimes structure is good because it gives you more like priority. Ok, sometimes we can just blow things with the wind but like might not be the top priority for that kind of thing or can wait for our next thing.
Speaker 2:So I don't know if I'm like a great leader, but I'm definitely somebody who you can come and talk to at any time and yeah just, I think it's more about like treat people like how you want other people to treat you, and I think there's never like this hierarchy thing as well in WUCA. Like everybody is pretty much equal. Everybody's effort is seen and rewarded and celebrated among the whole team. We are a small team, like we are a 17 people team. One thing that I noticed downstairs that we've got a warehouse team of five and lately when somebody sneezes, nobody says bless you, everybody says love you kind of way, and it's become like one of those kind of things and then they come upstairs and then they create this little ripple effect and everybody goes around like say love you, love you to each other. We are also quite like female centric within the workplace, naturally, because obviously we talk about periods day in, day out, but we've created this culture that men can bring their experience from their partner of how they're going through as well within the workplace.
Speaker 1:So yeah.
Speaker 2:I think I might. I might need a few trainings, though I would. I wouldn't completely ignore like, like this is the way I want to run it. I think structure is good in some ways, but having that mindset of that lean, being lean and being able to do things and, like you know, taking in charge whether that's your lane or not, and giving that autonomy, I think it's such a nice thing to do and yeah, when I met Priya, she used to basically message me and DM me on pretty much every post that I used to make on LinkedIn and I said, OK, fine, I will meet you and have a chat.
Speaker 2:The minute I had a conversation with her and I was like, oh my God, there's another me like you know, who thinks like me, who talks like me. Like this is insane, Like how is this possible? So we bought her an interview, Then she got married, Then she joined us.
Speaker 1:So yeah, and just for the audience who don't know Priya, so Priya is our brand director for Luca.
Speaker 2:She joined us just under a year, but she was the brain behind the DC period campaign.
Speaker 1:And I know Pia, so that's definitely a fantastic hire and, you know, I'm sure that's a testimony to all the great talent you've got over there. There's a question, though, which is have you got it wrong?
Speaker 2:Have I got it wrong? Quite a lot of time. Quite a lot of times. My first wrong was my first packaging order. Decided to make five thousand of it, forgot to do the last proof check and the size was completely off. So stayed with me for the next two and a half years, all the packaging, till we got rid of it. So that went wrong. Quite a few hirings went wrong. Initially went with gut, but then didn't see the culture fit and that was a hard one.
Speaker 2:And I think when you are doing the interview, when you are hiring, when you are putting your heart and soul, everything into it, it almost becomes a very personal kind of way. And letting somebody go or having to let them let go of things, it's like, oh my God, we have to start from square one again. Can we make it work? And you are constantly trying to be like is there a way that I can make it work so that I don't have to go back to square one? And over the time I met quite a lot of CEO and one thing they out told me is like, if any time in your heart and in your mind you think like, oh, wish they were gone, let them go, like don't think twice, don't try to make it work because it's just not the right fit. So I think last five years I have found that OK. If my guts ever tells something is wrong, like I think I should prepare for it.
Speaker 2:And yeah, quite a bit of gone wrong, my God. I have spent thousands of thousands of pounds on, basically I got scammed and being able to trust. Like the company came and said that they'll do a TV ad for us. They will only charge the TV ad. The TV ad is for free and please, if anybody is listening to this, if you are a new business, a couple of things that you will get is like, as soon as you register for as a new business, you will start getting like loads of fake invoices asking you to pay. Please do check your invoices. That. We used to get pretty much like five invoices every day in the beginning to people trying to scam you. Then this company restart to us saying that they would like to. They will do a free TV ad, but they will only charge you for the making the ad budget kind of thing, and that was like 15, 20 grand. You know like just and and nothing works. They don't understand who you are where you come from.
Speaker 2:Then just yeah, and that never went on air Well, so that was like money down the drain. You'll get quite a lot of agency trying to pitch you in terms of advertising on Tube and this, and that. Just just be mindful. I would say, but yeah, I've done quite a lot of wrong things. A lot of things are quite wrong, yeah.
Speaker 1:All right, so quite a few learnings. So it feels like you've sort of lived a real life MBA in a way.
Speaker 2:Literally day in, day out, everything I mean. Today I went to like networking kind of thing. You know, like I feel like every day it feels like quite harder and harder and like going and pitching Am I selling again? Like you almost become like a salesperson every time you go somewhere and then I hope people don't mind me like all the time pitching and they love it, but honestly they do. We just like I think inside consciousness kind of way, like I think sometimes I should just be me and then talk about myself, but then obviously they want to hear about what you do and and then the conversation goes slightly different to having periods and what not. So yeah, but yeah, it is I think for any entrepreneur who are thinking of starting a business to treat that as your MBA. You learn everything on the job. Actually, recently I've been asked from Cambridge to come and do in-house residential entrepreneur lecture kind of things.
Speaker 2:So very feel humbled you know, like to share all the mistakes and learnings, but also wins, with everyone. But yeah, it is. It is an MBA.
Speaker 1:And congratulations on that offer.
Speaker 2:Are you going to do it?
Speaker 1:Are you going to take part in the? Are you still deciding?
Speaker 2:I'm deciding I think I might. I would like to do a couple of hackathons or like lean start of machine. So just go on Friday and then work all weekend and hopefully they will come up with some business plan or business idea or even start a business by Monday. So, I love, I love that you know like I'm very like, go get her now. It's the moment of now, the power of now. It's like now or never kind of person. So yeah, let's see.
Speaker 1:Let me ask you something about work-life balance, because I wonder. We only spoken a couple of times, but I add that thought looming over my head and for context, the last time we spoke, you casually mentioned that you know when we were out with Charles and what you meant was King Charles, because Charles, or AKA Charlie Boy to Ruby, is your first name. Basis there was. There was a few other things, I think you. You know, you've sort of got a fantastic partnership with M&S. I believe you've got a partnership with China, for there's something always going on. Before we started recording, you were talking to me about this event on the weekend where you're supporting the Nepalese community for some other celebration and they end up being you doing a speech. It just feels like you're always on. Is that fair?
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, a couple of weeks ago we celebrated 10 year anniversary between me and Dave and we invited a few of her friends and some team members as well and we said, ok, let's make a story from starting from one person to the end. All you have to do is say one sentence about us, and some of them have known us for like 10, 10 years, you know like so, and all they could say was about us and Wuka, and pretty much your identity becomes, has become Wuka now Like I am no more me. You know, like work life balance If you are a driven person, there's nothing such as work life balance, you know, because you are constantly looking out to do more than what you can offer and that takes time and that takes energy and people enjoy that Like. I think over the time I have learned to live on stress and I enjoy living on stress. You know, like, like that adrenaline, I think the day that I've got nothing to do, I actually panic, like I've got nothing to do moment. You know and I think this is the case for like quite a lot of entrepreneur I see is like we kind of sit still. You know, like it has to be continuous momentum going on and I think, as a brand, we could have just focused on selling period underwear and that's it. But we do more than that. You know, we campaign to remove the VAT on period pants. We have started a campaign to remove the word Well, asking the brand big brands to remove the word discrete from the packaging. You know like, because we really feel like every little thing that we do can make a significant impact because we have the community behind us.
Speaker 2:And meeting Charles was like one of those things. Like we got Queen's Award 2022. And now I mean, I even asked him, you know like, this is typical me and me team for and they gave us like 90 seconds to pitch or say anything. And I say like would you like to be like because ambassador and help us remove the VAT on period pants? And he goes like might not be my lane, but I can always introduce to somebody, kind of way. So he introduced me to the hit charity called In Kind Direct.
Speaker 2:I said like I don't know, not related to charity, not related to charity, I just want the VAT to be removed and put your face in that. Well, look, one of those things. Like I always ask the worst. You can say goodnight. It's no work-life balance whatsoever. There's no such thing. I think if you are an entrepreneur, if you are an ambitious person, you can always enjoy and have fun in what you're doing, and I think that's what I love. Is like I don't treat it as a job, it's just like one of these things, like, as I say, it has become my identity. So, radler, where are we with pride?
Speaker 1:Two things there. So one is you're sticking with Cordingham Charles. You're not giving him the title of King Charles. That's fine. Clearly you're within the circle of trust. It doesn't feel like there's an imbalance in your work-life. It feels like you've got a passion here and what it is that you want to deliver. There is a real sort of path that you're trying to pave the way and drive forward on. Does that resonate with you?
Speaker 2:And I think this is the balance that I've found right. That's my work-life balance. It's like I found a purpose, that every time I go and speak I can improve somebody's life better, or somebody's period better, or, like you know, their daughter can go back to doing gymnastics and sports and they don't have to quit it, or they can enjoy the holiday Like or bare minimum, at least be brave to go and talk to their friends' families about periods, and if they are suffering, then they are out to the GP and talking about it, and I think that is the thing that really drives me. It's like I generally don't want people to be quiet, suffer in silence when it comes to their health, and I think women do that quite a lot.
Speaker 2:We are absolutely famous for tolerant level and we feel like even this tiny little pain is like oh, it's gonna be fine. You know, it's one of those cramps kind of thing, and I think it's not okay and we should seek help and we should go and talk to people. In a way we do, we do. We do definitely more than men. We do talk about ourselves within our circle more than men, and I think that's why one of the reasons that women live slightly longer than it is because we go and talk to people and all this kind of thing, but I think that can be improved more. So, yeah, I think, yeah, you are right. I think that is a nice way to put it. It's like I've found a balance work-life balance in the purpose of work that I'm doing.
Speaker 1:I just got one final question. What advice would you give to yourself, say, 10, 15 years ago? I want to say the start of your career by I don't know at which point you would call the start of your career? Would that be the launch of? Would it be working in one of those charities?
Speaker 2:It's such a difficult one because had I not gone through all of that, I don't think I'd be in the place that I am at the moment. Be brave enough. Have I not seen my mom struggle when we were growing up, to like living in poverty, to her only ambition being like we are able to speak English so that we can go and live our life anywhere in the world, or, if we get married, being independent enough that I don't have to ask my partner for any help or support, those kind of things. I think those are the things that really have shaped me over time. It's like because I've seen my mom being almost helpless growing up, you know, and I never want me to be like that, and I think those are the things that have shaped.
Speaker 2:And any advice to any young person I would say is like one thing be brave, take that leap, take that like if your guts tell you something, if you want to do something, be brave and do it. Like whether that is your first somersault or first, like speaking up in front of crowd. Like be brave and ask Honestly. There's quite a lot of the time that I see like everybody becomes like almost like submissive. And be quiet, like, if you want to stand out in crowd, if you want to go and make any change, you just have to be brave and speak out.
Speaker 1:I like that. I like that a lot. There's a few things I'm taking away from this conversation today. I think it's you know, never be afraid to ask for things. It's work-life balance is less of a conversation when you've found your purpose. It's the fact that if you want to get in a royal circle, then speak to Ruby. But I think there's something else about growing up with a bit of a struggle and the strength that that gives you.
Speaker 1:There's this interview between Trevor Noah and Jerry Seinfeld, and Trevor Noah is saying to Jerry Seinfeld about, you know, his work ethic. He was sort of doing the comedy circuit and then going on telling us and Jerry said you know where did that come from? And he said well, I was poor and that, whilst it's a bit of a punchline, I think says a lot right. When you've got a bit of a struggle growing up and it's only something I can relate to you definitely do have something else in you, some other strength, and your phrase be brave and do it I think is the perfect description of this conversation. I don't know if that makes sense to you.
Speaker 2:It does. It does and you're right. Like, especially if you come from a very immigrant background and you have seen your parents struggle, I think that is quite visible within the family and you want the next generation to be a little bit better, right, like I don't know if your parents were born and brought up over here, or grandparents, but like they're always thinking ahead, like, ok, how can I make a life better for somebody else, kind of way, and I think that's where it goes. Like I wanted my mom to be happy and you know like, next time, never think of like putting her hands forward and ask for help for it, even my dad, kind of way, like how can I make her independent? And I think that has been like my path and it's tenacity, I think.
Speaker 2:So you know, like, and then, and I think one thing that really didn't phase me when I was coming here was like I and I still don't see is like this, this person of color. I don't see myself as a person. I'm like, like in my head I have got this like mindset, like I'm pretty much as equal as everybody else that I see in the road and I want to be treated like one and I will treat everybody like one and sometimes, if we get bogged down into, like the cultural thing that is happening, but like sometimes you have to rise above it and in the beginning I think the whole ignorance is this was a good thing for me because, honestly, everything went over my head and I didn't I didn't see anything that was like stopping me.
Speaker 1:That's brilliant, thank you. Thank you so much for your time, ruby. Like I said before, you're I mean once you're saying you're easy to pin down I think that you're you're working 24, seven and and you're not that easy to pin down. But it's been a great conversation and I really appreciate you sharing your story.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much.