Chelsea Pottenger | Be a Bloody Legend | Lead with Courage

Struggling with postnatal depression, Chelsea Pottenger found herself in a dark place, battling feelings of hopelessness and despair. Through a combination of self-discovery,  therapy, and the support of her friends and family, she gradually found a light at the end of the tunnel. Emerging not only as a survivor but as a mental health advocate. Chelsea transformed her experience into a mission to help others and a thriving business, using her journey to inspire and uplift others.

Chelsea and her husband joined forces to create a thriving business at EQ Minds, building a team of 'bloody legends.' This episode offers valuable insights into team building, entrepreneurship, and the joy of a positive workplace. Chelsea, a psychology postgraduate, international motivational speaker, and accredited mindfulness & meditation coach, shares heartfelt stories about overcoming self-doubt and imposter syndrome, showcasing her innovative and optimistic approach to leadership. As the author of The Mindful High Performer, Chelsea brings a wealth of practicec knowledge and real world experience to the discussion.

Our conversation delves into Chelsea's vision for revolutionising mental health support, contrasting traditional clinical settings with her dream of a holistic retreat for true healing. Emphasising the importance of supportive networks and personal well-being, Chelsea advocates for regular exercise, meditation, and quality sleep. She leaves us feeling optimistic, encouraging anyone who has ever doubted themselves to believe in their potential to overcome challenges and achieve greatness.

Social handles:
@eqminds
@chelseapottengerofficial
https://www.eqminds.com/
www.linkedin.com/in/chelseapottenger

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Thanks for joining us on the Lead with Courage podcast, bought to you by Luminate Leadership. We trust this episode has given you some insights and joy to empower you live your biggest, best life.

If you enjoyed it, we'd be grateful if you like, share and subscribe to hear our future conversations.

To find out more about the work we do Luminate Leadership connect with us:
Luminate's Website and LinkedIn and on
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Until the next episode, we hope you live and Lead with Courage!
Cherie and Andy x
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Luminate Leadership is not a licensed mental health service and is not a substitute for professional mental health advice, treatment or assessment. The advice given in this episode is general in nature, but if you’re struggling, please see a healthcare professional, or call lifeline on 13 11 14.

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:00

That's you right.

Speaker 2: 0:02

Yeah, yeah, I just hit record and now it says recording, I think, or something like that. So, chelsea Pottinger, welcome to the Lead with Courage podcast.

Speaker 3: 0:12

Thank you so much, Andy and Cherie. It's so great to be here with both of you.

Speaker 1: 0:17

Thank you. Thank you, it's great to have you here.

Speaker 2: 0:22

The first question we'd love to ask you and no doubt we've we've got a few um, but we'll thread the needle on this one, and it's one that we ask all of our guests is um, what does, when you hear lead with courage, what does lead with courage mean to you?

Speaker 3: 0:36

so for for me, I think it's people who are willing to, you know, challenge the status quo and champion new ideas, however, empower their teams to do the same. So, in this context, almost like being an original, and I think a big thing too, andy and Cherie, is understanding your intrinsic motivation to get you to your goals as well, and whether that's in work or your personal life, and making sure that that intrinsic motivation is positive and authentic. So I'm going to share a quick story. When our daughter, clara was five, we both noticed, as parents, that her pants were looking a little small and I said to her you know, darling, I think we need to get you some new pants. And she replied yeah, I'm too strong for these pants now. And in a word, I was like like, yeah, I'm too strong for these pants now. And in a word, I was like I was kind of like wow, and I was really proud.

Speaker 3: 1:29

I loved her positive language and that's a big thing, right to understand your why and adopt almost like a mantra in life that has the right tone. You know, because your brain is always listening to what you are saying like can you imagine if our teenage girls were saying that I've got to get new active tights because my legs are too strong for these tights. I mean it would turn the whole industry on its head, right where people have got more confidence and things like that. And so I think a big thing around leading with courage is that being authentic, having a positive tone of what you're truly believing in, and make sure whatever you're saying out loud, whether it's to yourself or to your teams, is that it has you know it's positive, because the brain is always listening to it yes.

Speaker 1: 2:14

I love that. How fantastic. What a proud mom moment to hear that isn't that awesome yeah, brilliant, absolutely brilliant, brilliant. Before we jumped on officially and you know I feel like a bit of a fangirl and it's a bit embarrassing, but I'm going to own it. But I've been following your work, chelsea, for years. We were laughing off air that possibly we might be hearing your voice more than most because we listen to your Insight, timer, meditation regularly, maybe your husband was wondering who might listen to you to meditate.

Speaker 3: 2:54

Is that what he said?

Speaker 1: 2:55

yeah, he said who the f listens to you on insights?

Speaker 1: 2:57

well, it's sheree and andy canning that's right, two people, two people do we are here, um, but really and we've got your book and you know, been following the work you do and we're so, so excited that you're going to be part of the Ignite conference this year I'm really mindful that there could be some people listening to the podcast that will be at the event, so we don't want to steal too much of your tips and tricks and your stories from the event, but there's so much we'd love to unpack with you today, I think, to find out a bit about your personal story which I've listened to on different conversations and in the book, but really just to hear it from you of what started you on this journey, founding EQ Minds and working in that mental health and mindfulness space, a little bit about your founder journey and your own lessons along the way.

Speaker 1: 3:46

So, if you wouldn't mind, can we jump straight into? I guess motherhood is probably a good or even earlier days, like your style, your career, where you were in life, and then, I guess, some pretty big moments becoming a mum, if you're willing to go there and share a part of that story.

Speaker 3: 4:06

Yeah, of course, and so thank you for having the platform and also allowing me the voice to be able to share these kinds of stories, because it's really important to myself to break stigmas of mental ill health out there. So I was. I'm sure a lot of people can relate to this in the corporate world. This is pre having Clara. Very long days I had a an amazing job at Johnson and Johnson, but we didn't really have healthier coping strategies back then. So at nighttime, you know, hendrix gin or some kind of booze to take the edge off the stress, in the morning, a lot of coffee to get going, triathlon training. 12-hour days, very much, you know, work hard, party hard, workout hard. That's kind of how we lived back then in our 20s pretty unsustainable pace. And then 2015 enters Clara, our beautiful bundle of joy.

Speaker 3: 5:03

And after, after giving birth to Clara, and something really ironic happened and the reason why I say ironic to people is because usually I'm a really optimistic person by nature. So when this happened nine weeks post-birth, it just completely like shocked our whole family. And that is after giving birth to Clara. Nine weeks later, I end up in a psychiatric hospital at a mums and bubs unit in Sydney, fighting for my life. I was so unwell, sheree and Andy, I had terrible suicidal ideation of suffering something severe called postnatal depression, and the safest place I could actually be was laying in a hospital bed, and I hadn't really witnessed mental ill health before that in terms of I hadn't seen it through such a dark lens before. And when you're laying in a hospital bed, you always start having a lot of moments to think about things, and I had a couple of choices to be made when I left that unit, which was a five-week stay. And these are the choices I had, because I almost feel like when you do face adversity in life, you get to a fork in the road, almost like these sliding door moments, if you will. And so the two choices I had was one do I turn back you know that pre-mental illness, that fast-paced lifestyle living in Sydney or do I learn and I grow from the gift that the universe has kind of just served up for me? And so, at the end of the five weeks day, my weapon of a psychiatrist I love her so much I sent her a thank you card every year on the day I was admitted to say thank you for saving my life. And she said to me at the end of the five weeks day Chels, you have such a weird fascination with your brain and you are such a lovely person. She's like you're making smoothies for everyone in here in the morning. It's like you've got your friends coming in every day and she's like, and you've walked through issues of very clinically unwell patient, I think you'd make a really good psychologist. And I thought, yeah, all right, good psychologist. And uh, I thought, yeah, all right, I'll do that.

Speaker 3: 7:09

So I left sydney. That was nine years ago now. I moved to a small town on the south coast in new south wales to live a calmer, more peaceful lifestyle. I went back to university uh, just finished my post-grad psychology degree. Congratulations, oh, thank you. I cannot tell you how much headspace has been freed inside my mind. It is a really long journey to become a clinical psychologist. For those of you that are listening, I still need to go on and do my master's and PhD if I want to do that.

Speaker 3: 7:34

But the mission was then born, to be honest, and that was this I didn't want anyone who's listening to this podcast right now, or anyone you know across our beautiful country, to end up where I had, which was in a psychiatric hospital. I didn't want that for people, so I thought, well, I need to be the change. I'm going to as much as I can try and empower and educate people to take care of their mental well-being for the rest of my life, and so we founded a company called eqs and that was back in 2016, and to date, we've trained about two million people across the world, and it's uh, yeah, it's. It gives me so much joy, to be honest, to do what we do. I feel every day I just make one small little change for someone to help them live a more mentally well life. I mean, what an awesome day that looks like.

Speaker 1: 8:28

It's so incredible I truly, truly feel with so much passion about. Isn't it incredible when people have a trauma and they have such heavy experiences that then they literally turn in to make a difference in other people's worlds? To me it's just magic and if people can find their purpose and I guess that legacy and the things that light them up in their work, whether it's in the service of others, whatever it is, I think that is so precious in the world. And to see that you've come from literally five weeks, as you said, where it's life-saving and I've heard you speak about the story in greater depth, of really the depths that you were in and the edge that you were at, I suppose metaphorically, but literally and wow, it's incredibly admirable.

Speaker 1: 9:22

Yeah, as I said, I don't want to be sitting here fangirling, but honestly I sit here and think it's so powerful. You know, we had a. We had a very different experience, but our daughter was born at 25 weeks and spent three months in the NICU three and a bit months in the NICU. And it's those moments, isn't it? When you come out and you go, you find, you find the drive, the passion, the motivation and that purpose really. And, yeah, it's incredibly powerful and bravo to you because you can easily push back and go. No, no, it's too hard or I'll go back to what is comfortable or what I used to know, but yeah, the impact you're having, you and your whole team, it's really phenomenal.

Speaker 3: 10:05

Thank you, shereen. Angie, and that would have been a really tough, challenging time. I can imagine having your daughter at 25 weeks, so for you to get through that and come out the other side as well, I mean that's huge.

Speaker 1: 10:18

And I don't mean, I really didn't mean to be like, oh, we've had this too, but you know, I think it's like those moments for people where you go it wasn't what you'd planned, it isn't ideal at all, it wasn't a highlight, but then the optimism and that, the blessing that it gives you, I absolutely love that. Can you tell us? Actually, I'd love to know how did you get your first? What was your first deal? When did you go from I'm going to study psychology to then speaking, because you're one of the most sought after speakers now and I see you absolutely everywhere with the most incredible brands. You are just so in demand, for a good reason. And so where did that start?

Speaker 3: 10:56

Oh, thank you Cherie and Andy. It didn't start where it looks like it started on LinkedIn, that's for sure.

Speaker 1: 11:03

Does it ever, chelsea does?

Speaker 3: 11:04

it ever, never. And no one sees that. First year, you know that first year I didn't make a dollar right. The first six months I was training like I'm learning these things and I was doing my mindfulness training and I'm like, oh my gosh, imagine if the corporate world knew what I now know. Or imagine if I can help out Gerongong Rotary Club and the nursing home, and how amazing. And my husband's just there going. Yeah, this is a cute hobby and he's just as all good husbands do.

Speaker 2: 11:36

You know, we're going to test and refine.

Speaker 3: 11:38

Yes, and being ex-finance Andy, like in banking Jay was he? You know he's very much about data and he's like percentage of this can fail Chelsea. Like what's the percentage of this is going to fail this business. And I'm like 0%, 0. And he's like no one says 0% and I'm like this cannot fail. I'm like the flame inside of my body, I'm like I am going to work until this thing succeeds.

Speaker 3: 12:06

And he could just see how happy I was with just like doing free sessions with the hospitals. And you know, I started off doing free sessions up here in Djerringong to the Rotary Club and it was just so beautiful, right, like I was A, I was practicing my content B, I was just so happy because I was sharing these tools and having this social impact in our community. And then I'd see, you know, bob, at the ocean pool the next day. Oh, good day, chels, I'm doing that gratitude practice in the morning and not checking my phone. Jeez, I feel happy, thanks to you, and I'm just, I was just beaming, you know, going. Oh, that's so cool, bob, I'm so proud of you.

Speaker 3: 12:47

And anyway, so fast forward a few more months and I'm getting some of my head around this kind of stuff and one of my very good friends was working at eBay and I kept talking to her about what I was learning about and she was watching me just meditate every day, like, and I was talking to her about all these kinds of things I was doing for my own health and, uh, and I'd spent a couple of months at the Nantin temple learning about meditation and I was just on a bit of a bit of a journey, to be honest and really to to help myself as well. And she's like, chas, you know what? I think eBay is pretty progressive. Like you've been doing this for six months, you know, volunteering your time, and why don't you catch the train up and have a coffee with the HR director at eBay? I'm like, yeah, that would be amazing.

Speaker 3: 13:33

And so you know, no one sees these days either. Right, like you get up 5am, you catch the train, you're just so excited. It's two and a half hours up to Sydney. Up, you go for one coffee, excuse me guys. Hours up to sydney. Up, you go for one coffee, excuse me guys you're right, I'm gonna have to cut that bit out.

Speaker 3: 13:53

Hold on, no, we will no worries you get what you gotta do you okay sorry, I'm totally okay. I just went down. The just went um down the wrong way.

Speaker 2: 14:08

Hold on a sec, okay did I mention before we were about 10 more seconds hold on.

Speaker 1: 14:22

No, you say. You're telling that we're live. Yeah, way to make Chelsea laugh. And no, we're not live?

Speaker 3: 14:29

Yeah, are we live? No, not at all.

Speaker 1: 14:33

No and I think we're going to have to edit out my fangirling and I'm going to have to replace maybe some more sophisticated entry, but anyway, I don't think so.

Speaker 2: 14:43

No, I'm only joking, that's me.

Speaker 1: 14:45

I'm just telling the truth. Being myself, I was going to mention my favorite.

Speaker 2: 14:48

Uh meditation from chelsea is like the detachment from overthinking only because it gets to the point where you visualize standing on a beach with the weights hitting your feet and I always have a spot on the gold coast that I picture myself at. But then I decided that that would be too fanboying or fanbullying from the boy, so then I left that part out, but I feel like I've.

Speaker 1: 15:11

I feel, like I've listened to some of those so many times, that even in some of the work we do, where there's some, quite there's some similarities, it's not the same there's some similarities and I'll say I'll say a phrase and I'm like I'm pretty sure that that was like what's the first thing we do when we open our phones and we're recycling the hurt of the world. And I'll say a phrase and I'm like I'm pretty sure that that was like what's the first thing we do when we open our phones and we're recycling the hurt of the world. I'm like I think Chelsea says that on one of the meditations.

Speaker 1: 15:35

Oh, you know, it's just that's how many times it is in my head, Anyway it's a wonderful thing.

Speaker 3: 15:40

That is so nice, thank you, I'll pick it back up. Yeah, yeah, go for it, thanks. So my girlfriend said maybe you should come up to eBay in Sydney have a coffee. And with our HR director, I'm like, yeah, that sounds amazing. And you know how it is when you first set up a company. I mean, you will travel two and a half hours on a train for one coffee date. Right, you're just so excited. And so I went up there and I was explaining to eBay what I was up to and they're like we really like the sound of this, why don't you come in and deliver one session and we'll pay you? And I'm like what You'll pay me? This is amazing. And so then I get home and Clara and I are doing a happy dance and Jay's like this is amazing. And so I go and do this one session and they love it.

Speaker 3: 16:28

And they're like can you come back in and do like another seven of those kinds of sessions? And I'm like, yes, I can. Then I get home and you're like, coming up with the content, practising all the content, rehearsing before you've got to go back up again and deliver another workshop. And they had such a great response culturally uh, that I they're still a client of ours eight years later, so we still work all the time. And then, just as serendipitous, you know, happenstance goes on in life uh, the gm goes to uber and they said you know, we love what you did at ebay, we now come across to Uber and do it with us here. And then I did a post on LinkedIn and Westpac saw it and they picked us up. And so they're like can you come into Westpac and do what you're doing?

Speaker 3: 17:15

And then it kind of just went from there. You know, like it's and I was really that first three years it was just me and my beautiful VA from the Philippines. I hired her in on year two because I was just doing everything right like social media, invoicing HR, taking in the phone calls, doing the briefing calls, creating the content, delivering the content, like everything in the company creating the content, delivering the content, like everything in the job in the company. And so I hired Michelle, our beautiful VA, from the Philippines, and she was brilliant, and she stayed on board for two years until I empowered her to set up her own VA uh company from the Philippines. And then we started hiring local talent uh, in terms of from the university. And so the company kept growing and I kept going, wow, I've got a lot going on. How am I going to manage this by myself? I really need a really great general manager and a few more people in the company. Some marketing people, some strategy people would be great.

Speaker 3: 18:22

And so then I kept tapping my husband on the shoulder. I'm like, hey, you could surf every day if you come and join EQ Minds, and uh, and I just kept telling, like just trying to sell him, like just this, you know this beautiful dream and you know you'll be at home more with me and Clara maybe ship's passing I'll pay you the same salary as what the bank is paying you. Why don't we try this out? And I think the thing that got him across the line was you know, why don't you take a sabbatical for 12 months? And he was very well respected in the company that he was at and I said take a sabbatical and if you don't love it, you can always just go back right to the job. And so he started with with me and then in a few weeks this is like this is just game changing, and he's never felt fitter or healthier or happier, because everything we learn right is for the vessel mental, physical health and growth, mindset stuff and and uh, so he joined, uh, four years ago and he's still in the company and we're still married, which is a win, it's a miracle. It's a miracle, yeah.

Speaker 3: 19:33

And then you know, obviously, with all businesses right, you've got pivots and you've got learning moments, and one of the big things that Jay always, I guess, compliments me about is that I've got I'm not afraid to experiment and I'm not afraid to fail at things and course correct and I'm very much the creative innovator and he's like the executor of ideas, which is really an important blend and mix. And then, as we're defining kind of success of the company um, not just by financial metrics but by the positive impact that we're having on others I was like, wow, the more I help out, the more successful I become, as I can make me feel really great as well. Um, but the real accolade was how do we scale this where it's not just me speaking? We've got other people out there who are experts right in our spaces, who can also be serving like best serve the clients and the community, and so building this sort of business. It's definitely not a straight line, right, it's greedy. You've got to be adaptable. There's a whole lot of heart. Sometimes there's tears, but when you know what the vision is and you're staying open to growth and committing to lifting your team up, extraordinary things happen and I'm very blessed I've got a team of 12 and I'm very blessed that they're fantastic.

Speaker 3: 21:02

Like the culture's amazing. They bring the vision to life. But they're fantastic. Like the culture's amazing. They bring the vision to life. But they're just legends. Like that's actually one of our core values at the company is be a bloody legend because we couldn't have, don't be a dickhead, hr wouldn't let us have that. So be a bloody legend and that's kind of one of our core values. And it's true, right, like you want people who turn up, who are fun and they're reliable and trustworthy and they've got each other's back and yeah, it's been. It's been a really awesome journey so far wow, that's incredible.

Speaker 1: 21:39

And how long have you had um? You said how long has j Jay been in the business for. Now he's been in the business for four years, four, and it's seven years old.

Speaker 3: 21:48

It's coming into nine years old.

Speaker 1: 21:51

Nine sorry, eight years sorry, when.

Speaker 3: 21:54

I was nine. I started at yeah when she was six months old. Yeah, yeah amazing, amazing.

Speaker 1: 21:59

And so, with your team, I'm really curious because I think, whether it's speaking, whether it's other personal services or skills, where the founder is the person with the, I guess that IP, or that the brand, has been the founder's brand in the beginning and you want it to be something bigger than yourself. How did you go about finding the people to join you? As far as other speakers and presenters, people to join you.

Speaker 3: 22:27

As far as other speakers and and presenters, yeah, it's a good question and, as you know, having a business yourself, your people yeah, everything, and you really want to hire slow fire, fast, like it's just.

Speaker 3: 22:38

You have to get that right mix within the, within the team. So I feel like our team is phenomenal now, like we've had to do a little bit of um, you know, adjusting throughout that the journey as well, uh. But when, when we're looking for talent, uh, we're looking for a few things like someone who's got a different skill set to what we all do. So, for example, we hired ashley, who's a brilliant nutrition speaker. She does fuel up and physical workshops and she looks after the sleep component of our workshops and she's she's based in Melbourne. And then we've got Rob, who's over in Perth, who does, you know, psych, safety and leadership, training and resilience.

Speaker 3: 23:20

And then you have Jay, my husband, who is kind of like his wheelhouse is performance. You know that, high performance, mindset, discipline, accountability, productivity that's kind of his wheelhouse. And then me mental health, mindfulness, resilience that kind of wheelhouse is mine. And so, when we're looking for other people, which we are looking for, someone in Brisbane at the moment is someone who will complement the business as a different I guess different things that they talk about, that they are awesome humans, you know. I think that being a good person is very like there's not enough weight on that. You know you want someone who is reliable, will turn up, has got the drive and also is just a really good person, and so things that I always look at when I'm in the hiring process is taking them. It's almost like you're dating them right and I sit there yeah would I marry you like?

Speaker 3: 24:14

that's the kind of thought that I'm thinking when I'm when I'm kind of interviewing, in terms of when we had a cafe, did they just say thank you right to the waiter?

Speaker 3: 24:22

yeah their friends and their flatmates, what's your relationship like with them, what's your relationship like with your parents? And you know, and things will be revealed because you have the same stripes in your home life as what you do in your work life and people will leave little clues along the way, and that's something that I had to get a lot street smarter about, because I trust everyone. You know, that's one of my character flaws whereas my husband you've got to prove his trust right, you've got to earn his trust.

Speaker 3: 24:52

I'm like, oh, my God they're amazing, and so I've got to be street smarter, to be honest with my own process now.

Speaker 1: 25:02

Yeah, that really resonates with me, I think, the trusting side of things for me. I'm a automatic truster and then it's. You may break the trust, but trust is always granted as a as a given or a positive assumption. But it's so interesting, isn't it? What I love, what you're saying about those things, that when we um are aware of the traits or the behaviours from people when they don't think they're on, when they're not being interviewed, or, you know, when they think it's unofficial, what are those behaviours? Because, yeah, they don't lie.

Speaker 3: 25:32

Yeah, they don't lie, and sometimes we'll take them out for dinners and drinks, you know, because when people drink alcohol, then their kind of characters will also come out as well. So you're just kind of witnessing what's going on. And uh, and again, because our, our company's so small still, right, we've got 12 people. You can't hide in the company, you cannot social loaf. There's not enough fat in our business to hide, and so we will see that and it's so. I don't want to disrupt the ship. We have such a phenomenal beautiful team and so they have to be a bloody legend, to be honest. Yeah, come into that stables, yeah I love that.

Speaker 1: 26:12

What are your other core values for eq minds?

Speaker 3: 26:16

uh, so curious mind, right, right, growth mindset. We love that. I think learning in life is just everything like asking questions all the time. So that's another one. Another one is fun. I feel like a lot of the time in life we've forgotten the art of having joy and a short period of time, right, and so we really bring that element into our sessions too. So science-based, practical fun is kind of our trifecta as speakers, and so we'll take the team away for a couple of sites a year, and we just took them to melbourne, actually, and we did a day of stand-up comedy training with nida and like we went to a smash room and then we went out for to lucy loo in mel Melbourne for dinner and just had a fun couple of days together. And then the team's always vibing and we've got a hilarious whatsapp chat where we just send each other funny gifs, or we're having a kombucha challenge and it's just a really good vibe.

Speaker 3: 27:12

Um, and then the fourth one is reliability and trust. You know, and that's a big thing, right, as a, as a founder of a business, you have to be able to trust, because what you're doing is empowering all these other people to represent your brand, and so you need to be able to have people that are trustworthy and reliable. Um, you don't want, you know, I don't know someone going rogue in I don't know in adelaide who uh, you know who knows they're out there sunning their arsehole and then talking about it in a workshop saying this is really good for your mental health. I mean, that would not be okay.

Speaker 2: 27:46

All right, okay, let me write that down. Sunning of the arsehole yeah good, oh gosh, that would be very random if that was coming through in our content.

Speaker 3: 28:00

I'm like that'd be.

Speaker 2: 28:02

I think you'd be famous for different reasons, um, but you know, also, each to their own right, uh, it's so.

Speaker 2: 28:09

I resonate with so much of what you just said, largely because I look at you and I kind of just think, oh, I might as well be talking to two cheries on this call, and the small amount of correspondence I've had with Jay, I'm like, oh, he might as well be talking to Andy, and it's something that you said kind of around like that founder journey, and that you know kind of pilot light, that ember, that flame that just can't be turned off, and it's like, well, this, just this is going to work, this is what I'm meant to be doing, like I have to do this. I, I, I resonate from hearing that from from my wife, um, my beautiful wife, in so many ways, because there are lots of times where I'm like what about this and what about this, and how long are we going to do this? And what about if you just did it for you? And you know like we went through all of that and what it comes down to is that the founders, you two on the call, you're just built differently.

Speaker 3: 29:05

Or maybe I'm built differently.

Speaker 2: 29:07

I'm definitely built differently and I think that you know that's that thing. That kind of drives it when the nights are pretty dark and you know it's like no, I'm meant to be doing this and it is going to work. I just have to make it work.

Speaker 3: 29:20

Yeah, it's true and I think you're spot on, andy, and Jay says that all the time is like founders or entrepreneurs. They're just a different build because you have to have that unwavering belief and passion that your thing will not fail, because it is the thing that gets you through the dark days. It is the thing that gets you through the dark days. It is the thing that wakes you up at 2am with innovation and you journal down a great idea and it doesn't feel like work to that founder if they're on course and on true passion and whereas someone else will be like I don't have capacity, like what do you mean? You can't earn money for the first year? Like I don't have, I can't do that. Like I can't take that.

Speaker 2: 29:59

And the other thing is risk appetite, uh, a lot of founders.

Speaker 1: 30:01

They take risk, uh, and they back themselves, yeah, yeah, it's. It's really interesting that one of the questions that I wanted to speak to you about is kind of linked in here around imposter syndrome, because, um, for so often, when we're talking, in particular, with females not only, but in particular females you know, this conversation around imposter syndrome comes up, and you were in a very different role before you started on this journey. Has that ever been a thing for you? Has that been a real life experience for you, imposter syndrome and if so, can you share a little bit about it? How do you deal with it? Because I feel like it's very common for so many people.

Speaker 3: 30:36

Yeah, it's so true, and I think that's a human trait right Like the famous imposter syndrome, and it often will go hand in hand with perfectionism as well. You know, where we're constantly comparing ourselves to others or setting really unrealistic expectations for ourselves, whether that's at work or at home or with a group of friends and we run the risk, I suppose, of falling short. And that's kind of where you need to really dial back the negative self-talk and revisit that ability to show yourself some love and respect. And you know, in my personal situation, when I first started stepping onto stages and you know people don't see the hours that I put in in terms of I've got speaker coaches, I've got comedians that train me, I film every day. We are constantly refining our content every single time. We deliver it. We're like we're up there on stage going okay, that person checked their watch or their phone, I'm okay with one person doing that, but if five people do that in an audience room of 500, I'm not okay with that. I need to change the content or that joke's not landing, and so the practice right is in the gym all the time. The reward is the delivery on the stage. That's kind of like the cookie jar, the cookie jar moment, I suppose.

Speaker 3: 31:52

Uh, but when I first did it. When I first started stepping out onto stages like bigger stages, you know, not the the smaller eBay workshop rooms, like the bigger events I had super jarring moments of self-doubt. Things like why would anyone listen to me, what I had to say? What if I completely vomit out here? Am I really an expert? You know that negative self-talk loves to creep in and whisper. You know, almost like these sweet nothings in your in your ear about being an imposter and um I I think it's really important to become aware of these harmful narratives in your head and you can sort of begin to consciously almost talk back to it. So, for example, with my you know my negative self-talk at the start when I first started keynote speaking, things like people want to listen to what I have to say because humans need connection, hope and guidance and I've got a very personal mental health story that I'll hopefully connect this in.

Speaker 3: 32:50

I won't bomb my speech because I have been practising this for six months before I get the green light for my coaches to say you are now good to go up onto a stage, and I will not go up unless I'm super fully prepared because it's the value of time for someone right like I'm very respectful people's time and also the investment financially from the client.

Speaker 3: 33:10

So I want to make sure the experience is amazing and while expert right is a big word, I'm qualified, I feel right because I feel right because I've lived through a severe mental health crisis and then I've educated myself and I'm completely immersed in this space every single day, and so sometimes you know what we need to do is just call bullshit on the voice inside your head telling you that you're not enough, and then being able to switch those negative thoughts to focus on the good is a really powerful and it's a really proven strategy to to maintain that right for the rest of your life. Um, two other quick things here. One of them is not allowed to feel better about yourself if you feel like you are an imposter is to show loving, kindness, compassion towards others. You know, I know that probably sounds a bit counterintuitive, to be honest, but when you start shifting the focus um from you as a person and you start thinking about somebody else, your brain creates almost like an algorithm that looks out for things to appreciate, and so when I start feeling like imposter syndrome, before I go on a stage, I'll say things like this isn't about you, right, this is about the people in the room, and if you can positively impact one person here, that would be such a successful day. You're just kind of the vessel that's giving the education out and take the focus off you, because it's not about you, it's about the people here in the room. And then the third thing is, um, verbal persuasion yeah, from somebody else. So, for example, like andy, I heard you pumping up sheree a few times on the podcast, which is so beautiful and so so important. Keep doing it, mate.

Speaker 3: 34:56

Um, but when someone you respect, right or admires tells you that you have the power to succeed and thrive, it will completely influence your self-efficacy in this life. And so if you are feeling like you've got imposter syndrome, like maybe, like, oh, do I want to step out and create my own business or should I go for that promotion work or should I ask that person out on a date? Um, do you have a friend or a colleague or someone in your family who you turn to right when you need someone to pump up your tyres? And maybe it's a whole group of people, right, who are your cheer squad. But it feels pretty wonderful to have people there for you who believe in you and see your potential, even when sometimes you can't see it yourself.

Speaker 3: 35:39

And you know, when I decided to leave the corporate world, that's a big move right. I was on a very comfortable salary. I really enjoyed my company, johnson Johnson, had lots of good friends there. But when I decided to leave to study psychology and set up this mental health company with this mission right to empower and educate and create healthier workforces, I was terrified right for so many reasons, like what would happen to my income. I was worried about losing my identity right as a goal-setting sort of target meeting, um corporate person and I was also worried about um you know, failing a little bit too right.

Speaker 3: 36:17

What happens if I can't help anyone? Or and then, you know, into my cheer squad, my husband?

Speaker 3: 36:24

jay who assured me that we would be, would be strategic enough, financially right, and he would. He would back me. Yeah, he'd like babe, I've got you, um, you don't even you don't have to go back to work if you don't want to, um, but I, I've got you and I'll back you as and let's work as a team, um, where you can take time off to retrain and not worry about, you know, loss of income and then work. Colleagues and friends were iterating, reiterating to me we are not going anywhere and we cannot wait to see you thrive in this space of mental health advocacy. And most of my mentors I've got three of them uh, they helped me sort of point out the reasons why my message would resonate with so many people, and so I think that's a really important thing.

Speaker 3: 37:08

Have a few people in your cheer squad. Maybe it's your mom, maybe it's your best mate, maybe you do go and ask someone to be your mentor, maybe it's your partner. You know someone who your sports coach, right, someone who has got your back and never share your ideas with small-minded people yeah, because they're going to chip them down. So you want to have people who are realistic. However, have got a positive that they can see it with you. Share your ideas with them.

Speaker 1: 37:36

That's beautiful, thank you. It's so important. The the small-minded you know, sharing the ideas, the risk of that. I remember being um in a team and we had there was a phrase called uh, defy the dream snatchers. You know, those people who want to tear you down and pull your dream away from what you want to achieve. Defy them, show them what is possible, and I love those, chelsea. Thank you so, so much.

Speaker 3: 38:02

That's okay and yeah, you got to stay away from the anchors right in your life. I mean, life is so precious and short, like think about the aftertaste when you've had a social interaction. What is your aftertaste when you leave that event or you leave that social cat? Are you feeling fulfilled? Are you feeling joyful? Are you feeling like positive? Are you energized? Why are you feeling flat and drained? And just be really mindful of that stuff, because the people we do surround ourselves with they're just so influential on our happiness and a lot of things in this life.

Speaker 1: 38:39

It's so, so true, and it's that observer mind. Isn't it Actually paying attention to how you're feeling after that event or in the moment? And after the moment With, you're going and you're speaking to thousands and thousands of people about wellbeing strategies for you? Now, obviously, there's been probably a lot of involvement over the years. What are your non-negotiables for Chelsea and your wellbeing?

Speaker 3: 39:04

Yeah, I've got a fair few. The overarching role of health for me and my husband and our daughter, clara, in our life, with everything, is that this thing, thing, this vessel that we have right, our body and brain. It's not a rental right? This is like this one vessel and this is it. Your, your mind and your body is it. And so 90 of the time we train right like we work out in terms of exercise, there's a big part of our life, but always moving our body and that's a non-negotiable. Every day we carve into the calendar, but we're actively moving. It doesn't need to be pounding the pavement, but we'll take clara on the journey too, right, she'll come to the gym with us or ride our bicycles or go horse riding or surf. Because of role modelling, we want Clara, through osmosis, to know hey, fitness and movement is really, really important in our life as a family Two. I meditate every day without fail. I think you know 10 minutes for me of meditation daily. It just makes me come to my force and I love it.

Speaker 3: 40:22

I think it recharges my brain on every level I've seen the science behind it, I'm convinced of it, so I've got that into into the calendar every day. Another non-negotiable is my sleep. I'm fastidious about protecting my sleep. My sleep hiding is so dialed in. I actually don't even sleep in the same room as Jay, my husband.

Speaker 1: 40:39

Don't you no Separate rooms because it's not giving you quality sleep.

Speaker 3: 40:44

That's it. Yeah, and I know that's a bit of a taboo, right, people don't really talk about that. And again, people who are listening each to their own. I'm just sharing you what I do, but my husband's about six foot five and I'm 5'11, and so that's a lot of human being. First of all, in one king-sized bed, and Jason always a bit, and I fidget around, and when you've been married to someone for like nearly 20 years, you're like you know what, mate, I've seen your face a lot leave him there.

Speaker 3: 41:14

Yeah, and we love each other so's intimate and and he's just, he's a magnificent human and we just adore each other. Uh, but we just sleep in separate rooms. It allows me to get a good eight hours and that's a really big thing for my mental health. I've got a fragmented sleep gene, which means if I get fragmented sleep, like clara wakes me up a few times, or the puppy dog used to my mental ill health goes in about three days, and so I've got to really honor my sleep. I need about eight hours a night. It's a big, bigger thing for my life.

Speaker 3: 41:45

Uh, you can hear like common pillars, right, like nutrition, sleep, some kind of stress management tool, relationships. My biggest investment is my friendships and connection, and so I always schedule in every six weeks I take a holiday. Now I know that sounds really luxurious. It doesn't need to be going overseas, uh, it could just be three days off the grid camping somewhere, and that'll be with really good friends or with my family and feeling these moments of joy. And two weeks before we take the break we get this thing called anticipatory joy, which is like a serotonin release, right, because you're thinking about going on a holiday or a break, so you just sound really happy, right, you speak to anyone going on a holiday? How?

Speaker 2: 42:31

do they sound?

Speaker 3: 42:32

They sound like super upbeat, right, and it's very annoying for the people who don't have a holiday coming up because they sound really chipper and we don't have anything booked. So so it's a big thing in our life. In january we book in. Every six weeks we take a break and I'll do independent holidays away from jay and clara and go some girlfriends somewhere. He'll do the same with his mates every couple of times. We'll go away as a family unit. Jane, I'll have a date holiday but we might go hiking in tassie. So we've got lots of different kinds of things going on.

Speaker 3: 43:02

But my biggest dial-ups for my happiness is connection and memories with the people that I really love in this life, that we're kind of, you know, walking this journey together, and so there's a few things that I that I do. You know there's I mean, there's so so many more like my morning routines, super dowdy and you know, but it's there's kind of some overarching things that I really feel like. The number one thing to me, anyway, is sleep. I think that's like the elixir of life, and for people who aren't sleeping well, it can be pretty torturous, um. So if you can optimize sleep, everything else kind of falls into alignment the next day.

Speaker 1: 43:44

So true, these are beautiful. Just a side note is anyone else getting really bad feedback in that sound, or is it just what am I hearing it? Excuse me, I'm okay here. Okay, okay, there's, uh, we're we're.

Speaker 2: 44:01

I'm in the office right now. We're next to a jeweler, um. So there there was maybe some footsteps or some banging, but nothing.

Speaker 1: 44:09

Nothing like we're used to, um okay, if you guys aren't, I'm just, I just hope that the audio got all that because that was amazing I think it was.

Speaker 2: 44:17

It was a little crackly, but not too bad oh no.

Speaker 3: 44:22

Can your tech platform remove the noise?

Speaker 2: 44:26

Yeah, yeah, it can.

Speaker 1: 44:28

We can do some manipulating and send it to our oh it sounds like to me, like someone standing at the door talking Andy and like noise. So if you guys aren't hearing that, then that's good, because I was like I didn't want to, I didn't want to lose what was going on there, because that was um really incredible. Sorry, we'll come back, obviously. Edit that part out, I have a question for chelsea actually.

Speaker 2: 44:51

Um, I'd love to know what are you most proud of? I feel like you've achieved a lot and and you, you know maybe say you've got a long way to go as well. And you're not done yet, and nor should you be, but what to date, for where you are right now, what are you most proud of?

Speaker 3: 45:09

work or personal life?

Speaker 3: 45:12

I'll take that question wherever you want to go I feel like one of the things that I'm most proud of is the relationship I have with not just my own family, like with jay and clara, because who you marry, more importantly, who you actually have children with, is going to be the biggest decision you ever make in this life. That is going to be the biggest indicator, I think, of happiness because that person is going to be in your life for the rest of your life and I feel like I'm very proud that I chose well in that space. You know I, uh, I definitely punched up. You know, like I um, like Jay was super hot when he was 18 and I locked him in really young. But hotness was such a thing when you're 18. But it's the values that come on behind the scenes. That is just unreal. That I was kind of looking at when I was going to get married to him, and so I'm very proud of our really lovely connected family. Despite, you know, growing a business and having a lot of things on, I feel like we're very mindful of like downing tools. You know, before Clara gets home, we take her a lot on the road with us. I mean, we're going to Portugal next year for four months and she's coming to live in Portugal to get cultural immersion and we'll work from there. So I'm really proud of that.

Speaker 3: 46:31

And probably to piggyback off that and go a little bit further is that I'm very proud of the relationship I have with my family, not just on my side, my mom and dad I'm very blessed they're still alive and my sister and brother. We are super tight so I see them. They live up at the sunshine coast, but part of our marriage agreement of me living south coast near jay's family is that I fly up and see my family every four to six weeks because they mean a lot to me, and then also Jay's family on this side. It's just it's. They're so far from dysfunction it's not even funny like they're just so normal and awesome, and so I feel like I'm really proud.

Speaker 3: 47:08

Proud of that, uh to that. I've invested strongly in those relationships and my friendships. Um, and because when the going gets tough, then they're not just the people who are like fair weather, friends, right where the the times are good and they turn up for all the good times and you know you're loving your life and you're partying on the harbor and people are around and you've got quantity. They're the people that that turn up in the dark times, right, that will almost like illuminate a torch for you and and help you shine the way through the darkness. And and the people that I'm thinking of, the people that turned up for me in the hospital unit every day, and they're just a beautiful group of friends, and so that's what I'm proud of. I'm proud of our very strong connections, and it just makes me super happy too.

Speaker 1: 47:59

Yeah, that's so beautiful, so beautiful. I've never asked anyone this question in regards to postnatal depression and I'm curious to know, years down the track with Clara, and I'm curious to know, years down the track with Clara, how did those early days experience impact the relationship for the?

Speaker 3: 48:18

two of you? That's a great question, Cherie. I was petrified that this was going to affect Clara like petrified. It was part of the reason why I didn't sort of talk about it quick enough. You know, I was kind of in denial and telling everyone I was doing okay and then just kept sleeping every day and I just thought one day I'm going to snap out of it.

Speaker 3: 48:37

You know, and I just never did and I just got so clinically unwell and I remember in the hospital and because when you have significant depression or end anxiety, you're having these out-of-body experiences like I just I couldn't even you know relate to this there's obviously some baby bonding issues going on.

Speaker 3: 49:00

I she kind of looked like a stranger right in my arms. That's really hard to comprehend if there's parents listening, but when you're in it, like when your mind is so clinically unwell, that's kind of what I was experiencing and I was crying to my psychiatrist and I'm like is this going to stuff her up? Like you know, like I know how important attachment theory is going to, like I know how important this period of time is, and she's like absolutely not. And she's like all you're going to do is you're going to fake it till you make it. And she said you've got you know going to do, is you're going to fake it till you make it? And she said you've got you know the first few years of their life where mirror neurons are firing. And she said she has Jay and your beautiful family as attachment right and she can't tell when you're smiling whether it's a fake smile or a real smile at this stage, when she's nine weeks old.

Speaker 3: 49:47

And so what I'm going to ask you to do is, every day you're going to sing to her and you're going to give her baby massages with baby oil. And she said and you're just going to fake it right until you get through it, and while that was happening as well, they're getting my medication right.

Speaker 3: 50:04

And so I remember like two weeks in of my hospital stay they had nailed my medication and I just remember like doing this bicycle legs with Clara and singing to her, and then like doing the Eskimo kiss with her nose and I'm like I will die for this kid, and this huge emotion of love came over me and I'm like, ah, that's what people talk about. And then from then on, she is like my best mate, like she, which I'll make sure that I become her guiding parent rather than her best mate, because we're not meant to be our kids' best mates.

Speaker 3: 50:46

Thanks, Lael Stone, yeah that's right, we're there to guide them. Thank you, lael. Yeah, that's right, we're there to guide them. Thank you, lao uh, but she is like the sweetest, kindest, happiest um nature loving, animal loving. I mean, I couldn't get a closer relationship with a kid even if I tried, and so I think that's a nice hope optimism story for people who are listening.

Speaker 3: 51:08

If you are going through postnatal, perinatal, if you have experienced it, you're gonna be okay you know I think it's a real hard thing to be in the trench and then as soon as you recover that's why you get on top quickly, right, so you can recover quicker and you don't get to the depths of where I did, um. But yeah, that that's a good question, cherie. No one's ever asked me that before.

Speaker 1: 51:36

Really. Oh well, thank you for answering it. Yeah, thank you. Thank you. What's when we look at the future for EQ Minds, for Chelsea, for your whole family, from a work perspective? Where would you like to see what's your vision for yourself and for the business from a work perspective? You know, five, ten plus years into the future?

Speaker 3: 52:01

Yeah, it's exciting. It's funny because I can see it, you know, I see it in my mind, you know, all the time, and so the EQ Minds brand will continue to grow. It has to, you know. It has to because there's only you know so much you can do, and so that will keep scaling up so we can keep making more social impact on people. We have a different business coming out next year which I can't talk about at the moment. That's kind of exciting and it was always. Every time you make a business decision, it is always with the mission involved power and educate people to take care of their mental well-being. If it does not fall into that bracket, we will not touch it, and that's that's really good right for our um, I guess our compass, right, okay, where?

Speaker 3: 52:50

are we heading and everybody's, because you get so many exciting ideas and you get so many great opportunities thrown your way and you're like that's a square peg jamming into a round hole. That's not going to work right, and so everything we're like that's how Jay and I make our business decisions. Is that aligned to our mission? Yes, great, let's invest some time, money and resources to that. But my most exciting thing for the company which is, I'm hoping, three of the way is investing into mental health hospitals and it's not like your typical psychiatric hospital.

Speaker 3: 53:27

They will have psychiatrists and psychologists on site, but ideally, what I visual, visualize is to have it almost like a retreat, right where you come. They have beautiful food, they actually have decent hospital beds, you've got pillows. It might not even be called a hospital. Maybe it's a retreat who knows?

Speaker 3: 53:44

we've got mental ill health and they come in and the help our hospital system is so it's just there's, there's's just there's no beds. There's no beds in the psychiatric space. It's really hard getting to see a psychologist and psychiatrist. There's hardly any resources there when you get in. It's kind of hospitals are bizarre, like I loved where I was at St John of God. I'm so grateful to them and I'm not throwing shade at them.

Speaker 3: 54:11

However, there is some room for improvement, of disruption in terms of, like organic food. You know what we eat affects our mental health. Natural light why do we not have our hospital like our rooms looking out onto, you know, mountains? We have horses on site for equine therapy. Uh, can we have like decent pillows so we can clock a good sleep? Um, you know, like things like that that. We know that, uh, very beneficial for people's mental health. You know medication is only one tool in the toolkit. Economy of behavior therapy is another tool in the toolkit. However, so is nutrition, sleep, hygiene, learning, mindfulness. You know all these things that you can bring in um really help humans. They don't relapse as well. So that's, that's the end dream, right? Wow, brilliant. And then, when I'm 95, maybe turning them over into assisted dying hospitals so I can go out a really big bang, in like a really beautiful space. I love that. I love that.

Speaker 1: 55:13

Oh, that's that's incredible the way that you're just describing that. I'm just seeing it like yep, that's going to be happening. I don't know when you've got it in your timeline, but I have no doubt that that will be. You get the right investors and the right piece of land and get that started and yeah, wow, that's incredible.

Speaker 3: 55:36

Yeah, I can already see that, like I'm really hoping the first one's down here where we live, at Rose Valley, because it got beautiful. We've got the rolling hills, you've got the horses and cows in the paddock that meet the ocean, and it's only an hour and 40 from Sydney and I'm like that would be amazing. Right like it's, it's needed. It's needed and it's that whole thing. If you can't see the change, you'd be the change and you disrupt what's currently there. But obviously, with that requires a lot of private investment. So we need to get to that stage to unlock that yeah, yes, yeah, incredible.

Speaker 1: 56:06

That is incredible and, as you say, so needed, so needed, because old ways of doing things isn't necessarily going to meet the modern way we need to address life as it is now.

Speaker 3: 56:19

That is so true.

Speaker 1: 56:21

That's incredible, chelsea. If there was one request or one wish, if you could grant a wish to workplaces and leaders around how they can have a positive impact on the mental wellbeing of their people, what would that be? What would that one thing you wish that all workplaces could do or would adopt, other than getting you guys in to speak, of course? But in addition to that, yeah, what would one change policy way of being look like?

Speaker 3: 56:52

Can you imagine if I said that, like that would be so narcissistic. Whatever means is ekima. Can you imagine it's like if I'm meditating I'd be like what a wanker.

Speaker 1: 57:02

Oh so you don't, you don't listen definitely not totally kidding, only kidding. No, yeah, what would one thing outside of, uh, other options, of course? No, as if you would say that can you imagine you'd be like who was that lady? Who does she think she is? Um no, what would one thing be?

Speaker 3: 57:25

one thing would be, I think, with leaders is that in companies right, it always starts at the top right, the leadership team.

Speaker 3: 57:35

And that's kind of where the culture starts, and it needs to be accountable and really invested right by the leadership team in terms of them looking after themselves first, so then they can look after other people and they role model that behaviour. And so if there's leaders out there who say, for example, they're like Sheree, I really care about my team, I care about their mental health this is really important work for me Yet they are peppering their team at 2am with emails or sending them work emails on the weekend. That is complete cognitive dissonance. All right, they're saying one thing and behaving in a different way, and so they really need to one own it themselves. You know, like this whole accountability piece of again back to that one one body, one vessel thing. You know I think about this a lot.

Speaker 3: 58:31

In in the finance sector, people invest, and you know we invest too in a property and shares and and, but it's a very big thing. Right in in the cities of like, okay, investment's really important and and we've been told that for a very long time with superannuation and and. Then I always think, okay, that's fine, because people individuals need to obviously financially or commercially, take themselves to the end. However, why aren't people got the same tenacity or the same passion, or to invest into their body. You know, and this is the, the very last, this is the thing that's going to take them to their very last breath like this should be our super right, you know.

Speaker 3: 59:14

And so I think the one wish if leaders could take account, like, take stock of their own health and wellbeing and then role model that behaviour to your teams, that would be glorious, right. I think that would just be so great, because the troops are always watching you and if you're saying one thing and doing another man, it's really, really tough, because that person will think that they can't get into a more executive position unless they're flogging themselves on weekends and in the middle of the night. And we want them for longevity, right, like we want people to stay at companies. We don't want them to burn out and it's really expensive to get good talent back into your company, and so I just think that's an ownership piece, an accountability piece, and same with all individuals who are listening.

Speaker 3: 1:00:03

You know there's a lot of people who point out the reasons why they can't do something and blame other people. But when you're pointing out and blaming someone else, you, you know, with the one finger you got four fingers pointing back at you and at some point you have to own your own shit right and just go. You know what? I don't feel like this anymore. I'm sick of being tired and wired. I'm sick of like not feeling great. You know, just just start right.

Speaker 1: 1:00:29

Just start the small, simplest step to um, get yourself back into into living a really energized, uh, happier happier life yeah, brilliant if we could see more of that in multiple workplaces, it really really makes a difference in the world. It truly will. We, we, um, I had a workshop today and, just speaking to what you just said, it was incredible One of the takeaways from a new person in a team. She said, oh, we were talking about emails, exactly as you just said and around, just considering when we work flexibly but consider using schedule send instead of, you know, sending someone in the middle of the night. So we're not saying not to work when it's right for you, but just consider that. And she said, oh, I just, it was almost this sense of relief. She's like thank you for giving me permission that I don't have to respond to everything on a weekend.

Speaker 1: 1:01:23

Because I just hadn't stopped looking at my work phone and it was a really, it really just hit me because she was this really young, new to the company, vibrant, young woman. But it was like wow, is that what we're setting people up to believe? That this is how success must look is to be always on, but just to have that conversation around. It doesn't need to be this way. Yeah, the more that we can remind ourselves, as leaders and as communicators to be responsible for what we're sending, because then, yeah, the response of people are coming back with that sense of obligation, like we're actually we're contributing to it unintentionally mostly, but yeah, it's so powerful yeah, that's so true and that's such a great point that you just made there, sheree, is that some people's chronological clock.

Speaker 3: 1:02:10

They are night owls and they do their best work at night time and that's totally okay, right to honor that. But it's also then, yeah, that using that schedule platform yeah inbox drop or yeah, so it's. I think that's so, so important. It's also like having your own boundaries, but I don't even just I don't even check socials or anything on the weekend, like I'm so off the grid, I just totally unplug. Same with on the holidays I just unplug for the whole week.

Speaker 3: 1:02:36

I'm like I'm going offline, it's so awesome because then the people that I'm actually with they get a really mindful version of me, because I'm not constantly on my phone or you know, and I'm actually really enjoying the moment. And then I get excited when I get back because I haven't been on the whole time.

Speaker 1: 1:02:55

I think that's so important to hear from you, especially because you've got an incredible both the company and you personally like a big following on social media. You're very present and you've got your, I think, very authentic view of who you are or what we see. From what I can see, you know, there's lots of insights and just the fact that, yeah, you have those boundaries but can still maintain that, I guess, public presence, if you like, and that social interaction, because I feel like so many people might have this they're in the trap that they have to be on that all the time as well to have that presence. But, yeah, it feels like you've got quite a good balance.

Speaker 3: 1:03:33

Yeah, thanks, Cherie, and yeah, we will not post on the weekends. We just don't post on the weekends Because of that. My whole team's taking a break. I encourage them all to take a break every six weeks if they can, for longevity and also to enjoy the journey.

Speaker 1: 1:03:49

Yes.

Speaker 3: 1:03:50

Have a good time while you're here. I mean, you know what retirement isn't a guarantee. You getting to 85, that is not a guarantee. We had some really tragic situations going this year with some of our friends and we're only 43 right and we lost three friends this year and we're like hang on, my goodness so they didn't make it to 85 when you unlock all your super and enjoy no, just enjoy your life now, right, work hard when you're here, sprint for those periods of time.

Speaker 3: 1:04:16

Go, take a proper break, enjoy yourself, hang out with legends, be a good person. Goodness is really yeah, people just need to be good people.

Speaker 1: 1:04:26

Yes, it's an underrated value or characteristic often, isn't it? That is awesome. It really is Well saying that we're on the eve of a long weekend. Are you taking Friday off the ANZAC a few days? Four-day weekend for some.

Speaker 3: 1:04:42

Well, actually I won't be because I've got a session on Friday. However, don't worry, I was just in Bali three weeks ago and I'm going to the UK in four weeks with our daughter, clara. So we've got, I've got things. I'm I'm gonna be okay, like yeah you'll be fine.

Speaker 1: 1:04:58

I'm not feeling too sorry for you in this moment when I heard the four months sabbatical, but for many, yeah, I think it's so important to have this break you know for everyone to have breaks and thank you so much for your time today. Um, I am truly so excited to have you come up to Brisbane be at Ignite with us this year, and I know that our community are just going to love hearing from you in person and it's a delight to hear something other than your voice for a six or nine-minute meditation.

Speaker 3: 1:05:31

Thank you so much, shereen and Andy, for all that you do and the beautiful social impact that you're having with your company and what you do for your work as well, and I'm so thrilled to see you and see your community up in Brisbane as well. So thanks for inviting me in.

Speaker 1: 1:05:49

Thanks so much Beautiful.

Speaker 2: 1:05:51

Thank you and ciao for now. Oh, amazing, chelsea, beautiful.

Speaker 1: 1:05:53

thank you and um ciao for now. Oh, amazing, chelsea, thank you. End recording. I've just