The Who, What, When, and How of Leaving Your Legacy: Estate Planning Tips

In episode 30, we're chatting with Probate and Guardianship attorney, John Henry III. He breaks down the wills vs. trusts debate to explain how sometimes wills are the right choice and how wills and trusts can work together. Plus, he shares underrated reasons for avoiding probate, like keeping your business out of everyone's business and making sure your assets don’t get locked up in a lengthy legal process.

There's something new to learn every week, so make sure you subscribe! If you need, help hop over to https://willowwoodsolutions.com to contact Sherri Lund.


🌟 Benefits of Probate Avoidance:
1) Protect Privacy
2) Save Time
3) Maintain Control Over Assets
4) Tax Advantages


🤝 Contact John Henry III Guardianship and Probate Attorney at John B Henry III PLLC
Phone: (832) 464-5767
Instagram:   / johnbhenry.iii 
Facebook:   / johnhenrylawattorney 
Website: https://JohnHenryLaw.com 

🤝 Contact Sherri, Senior Placement Advisor and Probate Guide
📍 Website: https://WillowWoodSolutions.com 
📞 Contact: (832) 640-2997

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Disclosure: The information shared on The Probate Podcast is for educational and informational purposes only and does not constitute legal or financial advice. We strongly recommend consulting with a professional for advice specific to your situation. If you need help finding a professional, feel free to reach out to us at www.willowwoodsolutions.com/contact.

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Transcript

0:22

Hi, there my name is Sherri Lund and I want to welcome you to the Probate Podcast today. I am so excited that you're here and you're going to be glad that you're here as well. My name is Sherri Lund and I'm the founder of Willowood Solutions. I help to bridge the gap. For seniors and their families as they go from transitioning from their home into assisted care into probate and beyond. I'm not an attorney. I deal with non legal challenges. So I help with things that involve the property, personal belongings, people, and even pets. And I'm here to help with this podcast to educate to talk about things that are difficult, maybe want to be avoided. But to normalize these conversations so that we can reduce the stress when people get into their later years and into probate. So that brings me to my guest today, Mr. John Henry. He is an attorney here in Texas. He's not just in Houston, but he is able to work across the state. Thanks so much for being here, John. Thank you for having me Sherri. It's a pleasure to be here. It's an honor to have you really. So grab your pen and paper, because you're going to want to take notes. We're going to talk about some things that you're going to want to refer back to and I tell my guests all the time, John, to grab a pen and paper. Because, you can't take this stuff in all at once, right? It's like drinking from a fire hydrant. So, I'm imagining them having a little journal that they write their notes in, and then they can flip back and forth in the pages when they need to. So absolutely. So John Henry III is the Managing Attorney at the Law Office of John B. Henry III, PLLC, and he has an office here in the Houston area in Bellaire, as well as in Rockwall, Texas. John is a native Houstonian, and he has over a decade of experience in law. He practices as I mentioned, in Houston and the surrounding areas, as well as Dallas and Rockwall areas. He graduated from Notre Dame with a bachelor's degree and his law degree comes from Washington University of Law in St. Louis. John's practice focuses on elder law, special needs trusts, guardianship, probate and estate planning, estate administration. And his work involves simple to complex and modest to high net worth estates in uncontested and litigated matters. John's experience with these areas of law include work in the nonprofit arena, where he continues to volunteer for low income Texans so that they can have greater access to justice. It's important to John that his clients receive skilled care and attention, whether he's representing his clients as they navigate the emotional and complex situations around guardianship, establishing a trust for asset management and preservation, navigating the complex world of Medicaid eligibility. Or assisting clients who need a skilled professional to represent them in a probate court. John provides legal services to clients who are seeking professional legal assistance and guidance. He's a member of the state bar of Texas, has a slew of certifications, and is a member of several legal associations. Way too many for me to read off and take up all the time. Again, John, thanks so much for being here. I'm so glad to finally have you here, I've been trying for a while and our schedule is finally synced up. So I'm really glad that you're here. Thank you. So Mr. Henry, if we were meeting at an ice cream shop, because, ice cream is fun, right? We're meeting at an ice cream shop. And I said, hey, John, you seem like a nice guy. Tell me a little bit about you and you can't mention work. This is just you personally. What would you say to that? I would say you shared earlier Sherri. I am a native Texan. I have a very large family. I'm a family person. In fact, several members of my family work for me. It's a privilege. And that's related to work, but not but I love my family and I come from a very large family. On my dad's side. I've had two cousins that had about 22 children each. So that was about two generations back. So I literally, when I say I have a large family, I mean like hundreds and hundreds of cousins. And and I also come from a family that has had a record long life. So around 1999, the president recognized my great grand aunt Lil to be one of the, to be the oldest living person in the United States. Wow. So she lived to be almost 109 years old, and I've had multiple members of my family live to be over a hundred. So when I think about life, I think about people who are both old and young, disabled and able. And I just, I, my life is a lot about family just because I have a lot. A lot of it. But I'm also, you mentioned an ice cream shop, so if you are at the ice cream shop, I may have also made the ice cream. I'm a baker. I make ice cream from scratch. I'll be making, a brown butter sweet potato pound cake with butter pecan ice cream. I want a piece of that . That sounds amazing. Sounds amazing. Yes, that's the British breaking show kind of thing, right? Yeah. I love that. Yeah. I love the British breaking show. I know. It's great. It's fun. Okay. So you're an attorney in Texas. I can't just say Houston, right? Because you're licensed in the state and you practice in the state. So tell us a little bit about how you got into this field and law is a big field. So how did you choose the niche? Mitch is that you chose. I ended up interning my first year of law school at Legal Aid, the Land of Legal Aid Foundation in East St. Louis, which is in Illinois, on the other side of the river. And I ended up working for a family law attorney, and I knew at that point, didn't want to do family law, would never do it again. The attorney was great. He was a former appellate attorney for the Family Law Division of Legal Aid. In Illinois but then I also interned for the elder law section and the unique thing about land of Lincoln was that and still is that in the elder law unit? There was they did wills. They also had an ombudsman program that operated out of the legal aid. And in seeing the Elder Law Unit, what it meant to serve people who needed your help, wanted to have your help, or waiting, literally waiting for you, and sometimes a month, I knew that's where I was supposed to be, because it reminded me of my family, people who were young and old in various states of need, and that it embraced, I think, a part of society that, Still to some day, this day is neglected. And that just resonated with me. I wanted to develop and be part of a career path that use tools to assist the most vulnerable in our society. And elder law definitely does that. Yeah, that's 1 of the things that I appreciate most about you, John. Now, that cake could make a difference tasting that cake might take it up a notch, but but no, seriously, can you explain what an ombudsman is, for people that don't know that? Absolutely. An ombudsman is someone licensed or certified by the state to go into a skilled nursing facilities. Now, it could vary from state to state. Some will go into intermediate care facilities that have people who have intellectual and developmental disabilities, but generally, you will be going into nursing homes and advocating for residents. You literally go through the facility and you're walking and looking through the rooms beyond. Maybe particular people you have appointments with, and that ombudsman is that advocate for that resident and what the resident wants. And sometimes you intervene with the family or against the family. Um, But it very much is an advocate, and often ombudsmen are very knowledgeable and skilled people. It's really a point of privilege to serve as one, and I served as one in law school until I graduated. And so it definitely, again, I'm one, I'd like to explain to people about my resume and who I am. I am one of those people. I am one of the people who will go enter the nursing home and advocate people all along the way. It is something that we definitely need. We do have on the elder law side, a crisis of housing and residential facility. So, The ombudsman program plays a vital role in preserving I think dignity. Yes. I agree, and is this something that would be for patients who don't have family in town, or would they also have family in town? Would you serve both? You're focused on the resident, but it could be for people who do and don't have family. I think one of the things, and we talked about this earlier before we started the recording, I'm the lawyer, one of the lawyers that people get to know in my area of practice doing elder law and trust in the states, death and disability and aging find everyone who's fortunate. To some regard in some of those areas, and so it could be people who have family or not, even people with family don't always know how to advocate, they don't know what residents rights are. They don't know what it means to have an aging condition. And so sometimes it as an ombudsman, you're just educating people. And that's a really important component to the role. Thanks so much for going into that. So let's talk about trusts I hear a lot about trust and wills. Can you explain what a trust is and how they differ from what someone might consider a traditional will? Absolutely. So what a trust is, I'm going to just make it simple and plain. Sherri, I'm going to give you that sweet potato pound cake for the benefit of my sister. I want you to hold it and only give it to her until she turns the age of 30. That's a trust. Now, it's an important that would be what's called an oral trust. Generally, when we're doing a state planning, we're not doing things orally or by the words that we say, but it is the person giving the property to someone else that is ministered for the benefit of someone else. Now, that could be you creating a trust for your own benefit or for the benefit of someone else. The trustee is the person who holds and manages property or the benefit of the beneficiary. Person who benefits from the trust and so there could be different reasons why you form trust. Some are tax planning. Some are from Medicaid purposes. If you're going into that nursing home, and let's say you are over that you're in a state called an income cap state, like Texas, then you will need what's called a qualified income trust. Formerly called a Miller's trust. Maybe you are an individual who's leaving property to minors and you don't want them to have it until they've reached an appropriate age. That would be a reason to have that trustee hold that property and put those terms on it that are clear when and how the minors get it or someone maybe who has a chemical. Or alcohol dependency, right? And you want to say they're not disabled, perhaps per the social security regulations, but they are not able to manage that prudently. And so that's another reason why you might have a trust, right? Thanks for explaining it like that, except I would, that would be really hard for me to hang on to that cake for your sister. Okay, we're going to get off the cake. Can you can a trust help a family avoid probate? So it can and I think that's the best way of explaining it. So another way of explaining what trust do is what a trust is what you put into it. And I like to use the analogy of a bucket. A trust is a bucket that can hold property or own it. So what you put into it, the trust will own. The issue that we have sometimes is sometimes we do not fund or put into the bucket everything we own. And so probate would then come around because it has not been put into a trust or it's a bank account that you have in designated to go to someone when they die. Then probate will come in to catch all of those things and say, Who gets what? And that is part of what a will does. So your will could say in the probate process, I want it to go to my trust. That's what we call a pour over will. So probate goes into that trust bucket and dumps it all in. Now, sometimes you don't do a portal, so then you'll just designate your beneficiaries and it goes according to the will. So there are options to what we like to call coordination. And sometimes it's a humanity part, right? We don't get to everything. And so sometimes and Sherri you know, this very well with what you do, there are pieces that are left over that we're trying our hardest to make them work. According to what people would have wanted to have happen. Sometimes we run out of time. Sometimes we have good intentions and maybe fear hold us back or whatever. But sometimes we just forget and you mentioned property. When I hear property, I think real estate, but that's not the only thing that goes into a trust. What are some other things that someone might need to direct towards the trust? So other than real estate, it could be mineral interests. It could be the cash in your bank accounts. It could be stocks and bonds can go into a trust. It could be annuities that maybe you got from work or ones that you set up in retirement. And really the things that could go into a trust are pretty much limitless. A trust can act like you can so it can own the same types of things, generally speaking, that an individual can. Now why you would put some things into the trust and not would just depend on your goal. Sometimes we say I want these people to get their things and trust these other people I feel comfortable. That they will handle their inheritance appropriately, and I'm going to put P. O. D. on my bank account or on that retirement account and say they get their share directly. Now, for 1 of the major reasons in elder law, if someone's in need of care. Sometimes we're putting things into a trust just to make sure that whatever that financial benefit that someone may get from that inheritance, it has the option of not being counted for public benefits reasons. And you get the discretion to spend that money over time, right? I'm thinking of special needs children, things like exactly that. Having something come to them from an inheritance could knock them out of those potential benefits. Is that correct? That's absolutely right because we're talking about means tested benefits. There are benefits that aren't means tested, meaning it doesn't matter what you own, what you have, what you come into, but there are ones that are means tested. And typically, with special needs planning, we're looking at things like SSI or Supplemental Security Income and Medicaid that count your assets and your income that are yours. Now, if it comes to you by way of a special needs trust their special federal rules and regulations that don't count that income and assets as a person that's on benefits, or maybe it counted only as income when it's distributed, which is more favorable, depending on what it is. And so it's all that flexibility that really trust can offer, but to go back to what you said, ask earlier about Canada boy probate it can, but sometimes we don't get to it. Or sometimes we purposely say part of this. I want to go through probate. And so it's a, that could be a intentional planning technique. Yeah, that's really interesting, John, because I talked to several attorney. I talked to a lot of attorneys and some of them are like pro trust, like everybody needs a trust. And then I talked to other people and they're like maybe not. You're maybe the first person that has said maybe both. That's pretty interesting to me. Yeah. And I've heard. Even in my own personal experience in drafting our estate plan, the attorney would say depends on what you want, or it depends on what your goals are. But if that's the 1st time for you to sit in that seat. We don't know what we want. We don't know what's possible. We don't know. We don't even we don't know what we don't know. I think that's 1 of the things that's so helpful with these episodes is that it gives people that want to listen to them and opportunity to hear different things. So that when we go, when they go to talk to someone like yourself, they have a little more educated mindset, and then they've got some real questions that they can ask you. So give us some reasons why somebody might want a trust over a will you did that a little bit. Is there anything that you would add to what you said previously? It could be another reason why you might do it. In addition to the special needs trust scenario, where you have the, maybe a child who is intellectually or develop any disabled or just disabled, they may have no intellectual, it's just physically they are disabled. It may prevent them from work. It's also the issue of spousal planning. There are special rules in Medicaid where you cannot do a what's called a living trust. You have to do what's called a testamentary trust. A living trust is one you create during your lifetime. And then a testamentary trust is one that's created through your last will and testament. And so sometimes we know in a planning case when spouses come in and one may likely pass soon, but the other may also need care. If we want to get those marital assets That you may get from that spouse who's soon to pass and the other one who needs care, then we may find a testamentary special needs trust in order to protect or shield those assets from Medicaid's counting. So there's a lot of different ways you could use trust and sometimes we're creating a living trust and sometimes we're just creating 1 under a will. And so that's. One of those things as a state planning attorney, I'm going through and saying, how can we use a trust? And so the other encouragement I would give people is don't think that a trust. Is it for you? Sometimes people will come and say, oh I'd love to do a special needs trust. But, I don't have millions of dollars. Remember what I said, you can do it through a will. There's some coordination of assets that it would take some instructions from your lawyer on how you do it, but we could create a special needs trust through the will, and that would be at a lower relative cost than creating a living trust that you create now and put things into and all that other stuff. So just come in, like you said, Sherri, with an open mind to what is available and your lawyer should be there to give you those options and help figure out what would be best for you based on your goals. Yeah and I don't, I think part of it is an educational thing. And that's another reason why I'm a teacher at heart. And so here we are trying to trying to get people educated and, there's there's a stigma around attorneys. Yeah. Yeah. They charge a lot, they charge by the minute they, you know they're gonna take all of our money, whatever. But there really is a benefit in all the cards on the table and saying, this is where we're at, because you can help them best when they are fully transparent with you. It's not the little bit that they that they might put out in making this plan will far be offset in doing a plan. That's correct. So that there's not a problem down the road for them or for the people that they're leaving their things to it just backfires a lot, doesn't it? And so just a little bit of, so I just want to dispel that fear. And I would also say talking to different attorneys, some of them are more forceful and more like type a personalities and some are more laid back. I mean, It helps to find somebody that you feel like that you can be honest and transparent with and because you're sharing all your stuff with them. Can you tell can you tell me why I would want to avoid probate? So you might want to avoid probate because you want to keep what inheritance or gifts that you give to people private. That is important and that's not just for people who have larger estate sometimes especially in the special needs trust context where you may some people will make what we call disproportionate or not the same amount of gifts because they want to get more to the child who has special needs. And so sometimes people don't want the rest of the family to know. Okay. The child so and so is caring for did actually get more than the other kids and they got a lot more and you don't want them to know that. Another reason may be, that from time perspective, it does take time. Probate in Texas is not lengthy generally speaking, but it does take time to go through the probate process. So trust can save on efficiency. And another reason why you might want to avoid probate is because there's things going on with your assets, it could be from real estate or different investments or different things like that, that you don't want to have a gap in time where someone cannot do something that is to the benefit of keeping everything you have going. Right and that's a really important part, especially if you have a spouse was disabled, or you own a business. Or you have a spouse that maybe doesn't have the same resources you have. Sometimes we keep things in our own name and your spouse doesn't have the type of cash available to, to pay for the living, their living expenses. And so they might have to wait through probate process to get some of those funds, and another reason could be that you're coordinating for tax purposes. If you have a higher net worth estate, and you may be doing now what really you could not achieve for certain reason, tax purposes through a probate process. So you mentioned that family members could check and see whether it's private or not, and different people can see what was given. Where do they see that stuff? Like how I thought the relationship with you was confidential. That's a very good question. When things go through the probate court in Texas, generally, those files are considered open public records. We have an open courts provision, meaning what's filed in court. Everybody can see. It would just take them knowing your name and looking it up in the county where he passed away. If you pass away without a will. There's something called an heirship meaning the court will determine who the heirs are and who gets what in that application. You have to summarize what the deceased person's assets are. You have to file an inventory. Sometimes you can file an affidavit instead of filing that inventory, but the inventory would list what assets there are, what values there are and where it's located. So there's a lot of things that go into what you might have to disclose in court. Now, does that mean you should generally be feel fearful? Should most people really not? It's probably not a reason to put something in trust just because people may know, but then that's the other part of the state planning process, right? There's the trust bucket. There could be the bank account bucket where maybe you have that agreement with the bank that this goes to someone. P. O. D. So that's something no 1 in the probate court would likely ever see. When you start coordinating and think about how all your moving parts go together, that's where sometimes trusts are oversold. That concern about privacy or other things, if you're coordinated your assets to go to other places, otherwise, and there may not be a lot that people would find out in. In right. Okay. And so some of our listeners may not know what is. So that's payment on death. Is that correct? That's right. Pay on death beneficiary. Someone who receives an account's assets after the death of the account holder. And property can be transfer on death. I've heard TOD for that. That's right. So we were one of the latter states to adopt a transfer on debt deed. So you can put a designation on your property. That a beneficiary can receive it after your death, they would just file an affidavit and another document, some documents in the deed records and that the title transfers to them free and clear. And there are reasons why you might want that simplicity. And that would avoid the need for a trust. What would trust allow an individual to do that a will would not? So the trust, what it would allow you to do that maybe a will wouldn't, it would be that ongoing management piece. Like I said, you may be able to keep assets in the same way you had it while you were living. Sometimes in probate, you have to liquidate certain things to pay costs. Sometimes it's the law requires for things to be divided in a way that will require accounts or property to be liquidated. So a trust may give more flexibility and it takes a kind of out of the realm of potential court involvement. And in Texas, we have a process when you probate call independent administration. And There's very limited court involvement in it, but again, that trust can give that ongoing management piece where, when you have a will, you have to get the court involved, start collecting and doing different things. And depending on who your beneficiaries are and if you did your will correctly, because that's another part. Sometimes people even people who've gone through and gotten trust done, they're going and doing their own wills. And so that's not for me to speak against. That's you're right. As a Texan, you can do your own will. But there may be things that you put into it that won't allow for that ease of administration that the court is going to apply the law to. The trust can give you security in that way to that things have been set up and will continue to be managed. And you don't have to have court look at it and say, oh is this part right? And do we want to have other things modified? So I hope that answers that question. There's a lot that could go into it. Yeah. Yeah, I think it does. And then also thinking when there's a, when there's a will, most people are familiar with the term executor that the executor carries out what's written in the will, they don't get their own decisions and they're supposed to carry out what's in the will. And then for a trust, it's the trustee. Is that correct? That's absolutely right. The trustee. And so the person who creates the trust, gets to choose who the trustee is. Yes, that's right. Does it have to be a family member or does it have to be an attorney or? Are there rules around the trustee? So generally speaking, you have the right to choose who you want as a trustee. It could be a family member. It could be a bank that offers trust services. It could be an attorney. If you chose that, I think the biggest thing is to choose someone you trust and know someone that's qualified. And it really will depend on what you want them to do. Sometimes people want to put. More complicated things and to trust real estate or other financial managed assets. And you have to think is the person I'm naming as trustee. I may trust them, but are they capable of doing this particular thing? Now, that doesn't mean they couldn't be someone who advises the trustee that's called a trusted advisor. They could have a role in the trust. Maybe they're just not the trustee, but maybe they advise the trustee on how things could would be done according to what you convey to them your wishes are. And a trust can be going on for a long time where an executor would be when the judge says probate is done, then the executor. Is done with that role. That's absolutely right, so we trust can go on for a much longer time. And there's been recent laws that have changed on how long that can be. We call it the rule against perpetuities. I am absolutely a trust and estates nerd, so I'm not going to go deep off into that 1, but generally speaking we have updated our rule against perpetuities or how long something can be in trust to be up to 300 years. And if it's real estate, it can. Can be in trust for up to 100 years. So that's why it's important when you're looking at planning and doing especially things, keeping things in trust. Why? You want to talk to a lawyer? Like you said earlier sharing because sometimes people say, I want this to remain in trust and that's people various kinds of means it could be someone who has a few hundred dollars up to people who have several hundred million. Sometimes they're doing their own trust, but then they don't know all these legal requirements that will apply and may force things to come out of trust. So as I mentioned earlier, one of my goals with the Probate Podcast is to educate people and then to help them through the senior transition process, getting into assisted care if they need that, dealing with the property and so on. How do you see or how do you see what I do as a compliment to what you do for families? You, you asked that question and I think it's an awesome question. I think it's so important. I think when we go through the probate process, a lot of times people think about, I have to do it and I have to do everything and I have to make sure. And yes, if you're the executor or the trustee, you do have certain. Oversight that you have to have, but you don't have to do it alone. Sometimes you do need the estate service to come in and inventory, especially sometimes we have people who are hoarders, or maybe they were business owners, and they own three different businesses and maybe didn't keep the best records. I know you've dealt with that one, Sherri. And you have to go in and figure it all out. And if you were just doing it on your own. Those requirements about managing things prudently, efficiently and timely. You may not be able to do it because you can't even find the documents that tell you what to do next in the business. That's related to the trust or the estate. What you do is invaluable because it helps us organize information that we then know. What's in the estate? Did they put everything in the bucket? Are there other buckets related to the trust or the probate? Okay, now we can start putting things in because we know where it is. That organization, that selling process, having other people involved, it can be invaluable and absolutely critical. Yeah, and I think a lot of people have the misconception that's what they're paying the attorney for, is that the attorney will do that for me and the attorneys always laugh when I say that. Yeah, because it's not. Executors can or trustees can delegate. That's okay. There's certain things that they have to sign off on and be responsible for. But they don't have to do it all. And yeah, that's my soapbox. It goes on for a long time. And And I think that's the other if I could just stop right there and say, that's the other big part about being a trustee that I see in doing, like you said, on my resume. I do planning and the other side of administration, sometimes contest is that people it is a journey when you're a trustee and you have to build systems of support. People who do the bookkeeping, the accounting, the state maintenance. And so that is really important to put those helpful people in place. For sure. We've mentioned things a couple of times, and we were talking before the recording started. 1 of the things that differentiates you from other estate planning elder law attorneys is that you do both the transactional part where you sit down and help people plan, but you also do the litigation. You go to court to argue for people when that's necessary. But you are such a nice, easygoing guy, baker like you, , you're such an easy guy to talk to and it's hard to imagine you going toe to toe with somebody, but yet you're pretty passionate about that. You were, when we talked about it earlier. Can you talk a little bit about that for our audience? Absolutely. As we talked about earlier, sometimes lawyers don't do everything that could be from doing this state inventory of physical items to sometimes litigation. There are lawyers who will specialize and only do 1 part or just limit their practice to that. I am 1 of, I think it's maybe 21 attorneys now. Out of the 100, approximately 108, 000 attorneys in Texas that hold I'm board certified in state planning and probate law and elder law. So I'm 1 of a very small number of people that do both and ones that do litigation, probably 1 or 2. And so I do focus on kind of breath, when you going back to my experience and being an ombudsman. And seeing the need that people have, sometimes it is the trust, but sometimes it's litigating it. And that means sometimes we need to clarify what the terms are of a trust. Sometimes it's because people haven't done what they're supposed to do. And we need the judge to give them a on the hands. And sometimes we need to change who the trustee is because the trust needs to continue on for different reasons. And so litigation could be necessary. And for me, I view it as a continuum that I want to be able to help clients as comprehensively as I can. I talked to someone recently, and they started out with someone who was a probate attorney and estate planner, but they did not do litigation and unfortunately, their case needed to go to court for some contested issues. So they ended up having to change attorneys midstream, which means you have to tell the story all over again, and, bring them up to date where they were before. And that's 1 of the things that I think is unique about you is that you have that continuity of care if that's needed and, hopefully it's not, but if it is, that's 1 of the things that you do and I don't know with elder care elder law. There's just so much emotion and stress. And when you add in the Medicaid and the need for care and the cost of care there's just a lot around that. That whole season, right? It's a really and then who the children or the spouse that's involved in that. It's also trying to make the soccer games and they still get sick and they still have promotions that they're trying to make. Life goes on even though this issue is lingering and so it's a big deal. I'm all about reducing stress for the family members if we can and streamlining it and making it less stressful if possible. Getting back to the trust, this is something that I really wanted to ask you. Professionals, I hear it all the time, people say let me get this right the trust needs to be properly funded. And and when I heard that for the longest time, because they would say it I was supposed to know what that means to me when I first heard it. It meant I need to add more money to this. Just meeting an attorney and setting up a trust. Maybe they keep telling me I need 1. I pay for the trust, but then I need to keep funding it. Like, why do they use terms like that? John, can you tell us what funding a trust means? Yes, so I'm going to answer that 1st question. I think lawyers can be bad about saying what's going in the gumbo or the sauce and we defer to legal terminology or jargon. But all funding is I said, that analogy of the bucket is putting it in the bucket. Sometimes that's doing a deed, so the house goes in the trust. And that bucket sometimes is changing the owner of the account to be the trustee of your trust that puts it in the bucket. Sometimes it's what we call an assignment or signing over property to the trustee and that puts it in the bucket. And so it's not something necessarily, because sometimes you've done it all. There's nothing else to fund. You put it in the bucket. And that puts it in the ownership of the trust, and then the terms of the trust will say what happens in the future, so funding can be a little confusing because it's is there something more I got to do other than right? But no, it's just making sure. As I understand it, then if I was going to buy a house, I would not buy it under Sherri Lund. I would buy it under the name of the trust. So almost like a business. If a business was going to buy some property, I would use the business name, not my personal name. So if I have a trust, I give it a name and that name goes on the car. If I buy a car or an RV or any kind of property like that, that I would be purchasing or a bank account. That's absolutely right. You're just going to put the trustee of the trust because that's the person who manages it and has the right to sign off on what happens with it. So it would be. Now, there's certain things you wouldn't want to put in trust because it may have adverse or may have bad consequences in doing that. That could be like your retirement account. Generally you don't want to do that because they're that can trigger tax consequences from putting it into a trust during your lifetime. And so that's something that the lawyer will help you go through and say if you do it this way and put it in trust, maybe there's this tax consequence. Or if you have things in the business entity, don't take it out of the business entity and put it into the trust. Maybe we'll assign the interest from the business to the trust so that you still get the protections of the business. From my... That's the reason why you talk to the professional, because, all this stuff. What is your process? Like, when you, when someone comes. To see you for the very 1st time, do you have a consultation? Do you do it in your office or over zoom? What's that? So we do both. So we generally will set up the consultation before the consultation. I do want to see complete an intake questionnaire that lets me know who are the people in your life. What kind of assets do you have, or income do you have? Do you have, it'll ask, is anyone in your family disabled or could be disabled? Are they receiving care? So all those little pieces I'm asking for, because from the very beginning, I want to have an idea of what may until you tell me, until we meet, I want to be thinking about what types of tools I can use that would likely be helpful. What, okay. What you convey, because there's also a section in our form that says, what are your goals? It lets me do some pre planning and think about, okay, so let me talk about trust and this kind of trust. To see, do they want to do that kind of trust and maybe it's 1, they create during their lifetime, or 1 through the will when they pass away. Right. In your experience, what's the hardest thing that you think people have to overcome in order to agree to doing an estate plan? I think there's two things that I've seen a lot more of lately. Sometimes it is, who am I going to give my stuff to? We are having generally as a society and culture people, smaller families. And so some people, a lot of people are coming into me and they coming to me and they only had One child and that child's passed away and they're like, I'm like, I don't know. I'm like, Hey, but you want to do a will who are the beneficiaries going to be? You want to do a trial? Who's going to get it? So that is part of the journey is figuring out who's going to receive it. And it could be because of a limited family situation. And what I often tell people that will help go through that process is what is the legacy? What do you want someone to receive? That puts it in a different mind frame of I have a car. I have an account. I have time and I have a business. It's what is the legacy I want to leave and the legacy is not just the financial piece, but the statement about who you are and the statement of love, the statement of respect, the statement of community. And so that puts it and gives it a more narrow focus. Like, okay, well, If it's about community, maybe I want to leave it to a charity that provides for the homeless, or maybe I want to give it to this child or grandchild that does things that are philanthropic or so that can be it just figuring out the beneficiary. And sometimes it's like you said, there's so many unknowns when you've never done a will. You've never been through probate. It's a comfort level. I don't know a lot of stuff. I'm gonna have to be admitted, but my ego aside to say, I don't know. And that's okay. Any lawyer that you use to help you do your estate plan should be one that you feel comfortable saying, I don't know. Can you tell me what it means? Can you tell me another time? Can you tell me for the third time? Can you put it.. Do you have any helpful materials that help explain it in a different way? Don't be afraid to ask. I think that's the biggest part is put all the fears of, I don't know, aside to say I'm going to empower myself to do my will or trust this year. Love that. And I think that's another reason why this video, I chose to do a video podcast so people can see you. And my other guests, they can hear your mannerisms, they can see your smile, some people are intimidating to be around. And if that person is intimidating to you, then that's a no for you, find someone that you feel comfortable asking questions to, because this is important and it's a topic that you don't know a whole lot about. You don't do as often as the attorney does. So, John, what do you enjoy about your work? I think what I love the most. Is that families and individuals are empowered by what I do. I've recently had a client who I helped explain her special needs trust to her and she has a corporate or bank that serving as a trustee. And she's been fighting to trying to get more money out of her trust to help her live her life. She has a job. She's an awesome individual and an artist. And she tried for years till she came to me and I was helping her do some other estate planning, but she talked to me about that trust that was set up for her as a result of an accident. And after I told her how things worked and explained in detail and the things that she could be talking to about her trustee, she called me a couple of days later and said, you know what, I feel good now. I know that I can, I have tools and I know how this is supposed to work. That is why I do what I do. That's why I love what I do because there are tools that families will have and understand that they can use to help better their lives. Someone is listening and they're on the fence about whether they should call somebody. Is it too early? Mom's got early diagnosis. Maybe I'm not old enough. Maybe I don't have enough money. For whatever reason, they're on the fence about setting up an estate plan or a trust, whatever it might be. What would you say to them to encourage them? I think everyone needs basic estate planning. That's Will's powers of attorney. What happens with my property when I pass? What happens if I'm disabled? And I can't manage my own money or finance. So I'm answering that 1st question. Everybody needs to do it. It's a question of getting over those other hurdles of why we're saying we're not going to do it yet. And is it too soon? It's never too soon. I love for people to come to me early. I love for them to just chat with me other lawyers that way that are estate planners. I would rather tell you come back in a year come back in 5 years. Often I'm telling them other things that are helpful in the interim of that. But it's hard to plan when things have transpired that don't allow you to do everything possible. I want to have as many options on the table as possible to help you. Achieve your goals, so if you're concerned about price, don't be afraid to call and ask the lawyer. How much does it cost? You would do it. Otherwise. I think we all shot shot that way. I wonder how much cost now is cost. The only factor. No, of course, someone with the experience and the value they give you. Along with the other things they know. Yes, that is a factor, but the factor that may be keeping you as cost call to find out. Don't be afraid to just find out how much does it cost to do a simple estate plant. Don't be afraid to call a few lawyers. I tell people that who call my firm and our firm intake person in the onboarding department. She's she says, same thing. Don't be afraid. Why wouldn't you do it? Why wouldn't you ask the question? Thank you for that. And where can people find you? So you can find us at johnhenrylaw. com. That's our website. You can find us on Facebook, on Instagram, on LinkedIn. We have social media posts going over different content, different topics, and as of next year, I'll have my own podcast. I'll probably ask you share to be part of it. And so that in that podcast, I'll be going over topics that are just about this about what I do and speaking in a very plain way about what trusts are, what are. What is coordinating assets? What's funding? I'm going to get into the weeds of what it is, but in a way that helps people understand and start disarming that fear of, okay, they're talking about funding, but I don't know what it is. I don't know. I know I might need a trust, but I don't, let me just do that later. So it's unpacking. So I want you to be listening to this podcast because it's going to help you boost your knowledge on what these things are. What wealth planning is and how you achieve those goals. So you will also find me in our podcast next year as well. That's awesome. I'm so glad to hear that. Okay. That wraps up our episode for today. Thank you, John, again, for your generous giving of your time to be here and all your insights. That was so helpful. And thank you to my guests for listening in and joining John and I on this conversation. John and I both want you to know that you're not alone on this journey that there are people and resources here available for you. We're here to help and so if it's not as personally, we have networks of people that we can connect you with. So please don't white knuckle this. You can reach out and find some help and John and I are here for you. With that, we're going to end today's episode again. Thank you for coming and we'll see you next time.