Ep. 114 Today's Peep with Micky Dolenz of the Monkees Pt. 2, Visiting Sydney in '68, Crest Theater Appearance, New Book "I'm Told I Had a Good Time," REM Song Covers with Christian Nesmith, and Behind the Scenes of "Head" and Frank Zappa

What if we told you that the Monkees were even hotter than the Beatles when they visited Sydney in 1968? Join us on Pats Peeps 114, where the legendary Mickey Dolenz returns to share captivating stories about his career and exciting insights into his recent projects. Hear all about his upcoming appearance at the Crest Theater in Sacramento, his new book "I Had a Good Time," and his innovative renditions of REM songs produced alongside Christian Nesmith. Dive into the profound influence the Monkees had on bands like REM and the trials and triumphs of covering iconic hits.

Mickey also takes us behind the scenes of the 1968 satirical film "Head," working with luminaries like Frank Zappa and Jack Nicholson. We explore his fascinating transition from acting to directing, and his stint in Harry Nilsson's musical "The Point" in England. Relive delightful musical moments, including Mickey's stellar performance on "Going Down" from the Monkees' album "Pisces, Aquarius, Capricorn & Jones Ltd." Ending on a high note, we look forward to the next episode, Pat's Peeps Number 115. Don't miss this enthralling conversation with a true icon of music history!

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:03

Welcome back to the Pats Peeps podcast. I'm just going to jump right on in on this Tuesday, the 16th of July 2024. It's hot outside as I stare out my studio windows, my beautiful studio in the foothills. I am so honored here on Pats Peeps 114 that we have Mickey Dolenz back on for part two. Mickey, thank you so much for giving us some more of your time today. How are you, sir?

Speaker 2: 0:27

No problem, I'm good. How are you?

Speaker 1: 0:30

I am really, really good. It's a pleasure to talk to you. I know you're a very busy guy and I just I have, so I've whittled down my questions to some things that I think you know. I'm hoping that you haven't talked about. You know, over and over and over. I really try to look through some, really some gems. I want to start by telling everyone that, mickey Dolenz, we're so excited to have you coming to Sacramento, mickey, on July 31st, coming to the beautiful Crest Theater. You've got a new book out. I'm told I had a good time, which is just awesome. You played the Troubadour in LA. Recently You're premiering your Glorious Corner show Make-A-Wish Benefit. Can I just tell you I love your REM song Leaving New York.

Speaker 2: 1:15

I love what you did with the REM stuff. Well, thank you. I'm very, very proud of that and I'm also have to give credit where credit is due and that would be to my good friend and, of course, almost like a son, Christian Nesmith, mike Nesmith's son. He was very, very instrumental in helping well, not helping, I was the one helping Christian was very instrumental in well, he was the producer, of course, and he is so good at coming up with innovative ways of reimagining it's the only way I can kind of put it Reimagining songs material.

Speaker 2: 2:08

He did it in an album that we did together called Dolan Sings Nesmith, which was to me incredible that he could reimagine songs from his father that he must have heard in the crib, and yet he came up. I don't know if you had a chance to hear that album, it was. It was wonderful. He came up with these ways of these arrangements and grooves and you know it's the same song, but definitely not your, your karaoke cover, but definitely not your karaoke cover. They had really their own very unique personality to them and they did an incredible job on those REM tunes.

Speaker 1: 2:55

I highly recommend that. If anyone has not heard Mickey's REM stuff, I tell you what I have. I mean leaving New York Radio Free Europe is so beautiful. You do shiny, happy people, mickey, and to me it almost sounds like there's a little tinge of the monkeys in that, a little bit of that influence in there.

Speaker 2: 3:21

Well, that's actually. Michael Stipe actually made a point long, long, long ago and one of the reasons we included the song and we did REM they said Michael said the monkeys were a huge influence on early REM and on him. And when I met him he reiterated it and yes, Smiley, the monkeys, absolutely well the monkey music, that kind of. And when I met him he reiterated it and, yes, Smiley, the Monkees, absolutely Well the Monkee music, that kind of gangly guitar, groovy thing absolutely influenced Michael. But I've known that for years and years and, of course, incredibly flattered by it too. Yeah, it's true, he said he was strongly influenced.

Speaker 1: 4:13

So, mickey, obviously everyone knows you did the lead vocals on many of the songs Last Train to Clarksville, pleasant Valley Sunday. I'm a Believer. What do you think when you hear a band like Smash Mouth redoing some of the Monkees tunes? What do you think of their versions?

Speaker 2: 4:26

Well, I thought that version of Smash Mouth redoing some of the Monkees tunes. What do you think of their versions? Well, I thought that version of Smash Mouth was great, yeah me too.

Speaker 2: 4:30

It was really good. I thought it was really good. I mean, it's a tough song to cover because it's so iconic the original recording. It's very tough to cover songs like that that are so iconic. I've tried recording. It's very tough to cover songs that like that that are so, so iconic. You know, I've tried. You know covering. Well, I did cover a couple of Beatle tunes but I did flip them around a little bit on an album I did called Remember. It's very, very difficult and you, a lot of people try, but I don't think it's any surprise or coincidence. Very few people have managed to cover Beatle tunes successfully and had hits. The only one that immediately comes to mind, really, I would say would be Joe Cocker, sure, if you remember back in the 70s, but I can't even think of anybody recently that's had a major kind of hit with a Beatle tune. I mean, maybe you can remember something, but very difficult to do, it's just so iconic.

Speaker 1: 5:43

I don't know if I can think of a lot of hits you know Aerosmith did. Oh, everybody's covered yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: 5:50

Oh no, everybody has covered them. Yeah, by the millions. I mean, yesterday is one of the most covered songs in the world. But I meant yeah, I meant having a hit.

Speaker 1: 6:04

Yeah, not many Having it actually chart, you know.

Speaker 1: 6:07

Speaking of the Beatles, we're talking to Mickey Dolenz. I am so fascinated, mickey, I want to take you back to September 16th 1968. And, mickey, this to me is so compelling when I watch this. You're arriving in Sydney. Uh, you're in Sydney, australia, and there's a commentator. He's talking about how, at the moment you are, even the monkeys are even more popular than the Beatles in his estimation. You guys go over there, you're loaded into these cars, like maybe an old limousine or whatever. I see Peter Tork. He's pointing at something and you guys all look. I always wish I knew what you were looking at back then. But at one point you're holding a press conference and during this press conference these ladies come screaming onto the stage hysterically trying to get to you. They're screaming Mickey, mickey, and you got people holding them back. Do you have a recollection of that day? And women literally going so crazy over you that they would just rush that stage and rush the press conference tables.

Speaker 2: 7:07

Absolutely not Nothing at all, but I'm told I had a good time. No, I don't remember much at all. I mean, first of all, come on, it was what now, 60 years ago or something, there's that. But but also, um, you know the the way I looked at it. I don't remember if we talked about this before um, in in the case of of us, the monkeys, or in any other, uh, the beetles or whoever.

Speaker 2: 7:43

Uh, when you have that kind of attention and that kind of success and stuff, it's real tough to keep up. The way I look at it is that your brain kind of shuts down at a certain point because it just can't take in any more data. It's like you know your computer going memory's full shut down, shut down, memory's full shut down and you know your RAM is full and the thing just starts to slow down and then stops. That is kind of how I look at it. You see it happen in people today, young groups or performers that are in the eye of the hurricane. That's the way I describe it. You end up in the eye of this hurricane where all this stuff is going on around you, but you just shut it off and close your eyes and just kind of work your way through it. That's the only way I can describe it, but that's certainly the way it was for me. And you see it like I say.

Speaker 2: 8:58

You see it in kids today, young people especially, who all of a sudden hit this huge success rate and they look like they have this, look in their eyes kind of like a doe caught in the headlights of a car, and it's just like I say. It's because your brain, we were filming the show 10, 12 hours a day. We were then rehearsing for touring and then going in the studio at night and recording until midnight and then press and interviews and photo sessions, and then right back, right around again to filming the show and then touring and one nighters, and you know, and your brain just the way I look at it is your brain just shuts down, says goodbye, no, thank you. Yeah, right, do you have when?

Speaker 1: 9:50

you look back I mean, do you have? When you look back, I mean, do you have experiences? Uh, for instance, let's say, because I am very curious, I want to talk about someone who I admire and I've always he's always been one of my favorite artists of all time. Uh, frank zappa, you do this movie head, which was a movie in 68, a satirical sort of a musical adventure. Jack nicholson, of all people is, says he can write a movie about anything. I can write a movie about anything. They say. Well, why don't you write one about with the monkeys called Head? Bob Rafelson directs this saying and, as far as I know, the rumor has it, there may have been some special vitamins taken during the making of the writing of this movie by Jack and by Bob. I'm not sure, but they've mentioned that. But you work with Frank in the movie and you work with people like Terry Garr, sonny Liston, annette Funicello, dennis Hopper. What are your recollections of making that movie?

Speaker 2: 10:49

and in particular Frank, since I'm a Frank fan. Well, frank was a fan and he'd already been on the TV show. He did a bit with Mike In the second season. We had these bits at the end of the show where each one of us invited a guest star to perform live, and Mike chose Frank Zappa and I chose Tim Buckley, for instance, and we would introduce each one of these people and Davey had Charlie Smalls, who wrote the Wiz, who is unknown, but Frank Zappa of course wasn't. Charlie Smalls who wrote the Wiz, who is unknown at the time, but Fred Zapp of course wasn't, but he was a fan. I think he got it. He got what the Monkees was all about and what it wasn't. And as we discussed, I think the Monkees was not a group, it was not a band in any way, the classic sense of that, and so he got it.

Speaker 2: 11:56

And after the monkeys and everything broke up not broke up, because the band was never a band to begin with, but when the show went off the air it was canceled.

Speaker 2: 12:07

We all went on our merry ways, as the cast of any show would, and you know. So we hung out a little bit and Davey and I worked a little bit together, but there was no band because there was no monkey business, there was no monkey office, no monkey management. But Frank Zappa lived down the street from me so I'd bump into him every once in a while and at one point I remember him calling and saying listen, I'm starting a new group, a new band called the Mothers of Invention and I want you to be the drummer. Oh, and I was like, oh my God, incredibly flattered of, of course, but scared to death because you know, frankly, there's no way I would have been able to cut that stuff as a drummer.

Speaker 2: 13:05

I wasn't a studio drummer, but I called the record company anyway and told them what happened. And Frank Zappa had said but you have to get a release from your record company because we're going to record. And my record company at the time just said no, no way, we're not going to let you out of your contract because the monkey stuff was still selling. But yeah, frank was a fan, I just bumped into Dweezil, the other day.

Speaker 1: 13:40

He's a good guy. Dweezil's a great guy. He honors his father. I've seen him four or five times in concert. I've introduced his band numerous times. He's come on my show. He's just a great guy. There's incredible talent. He is an incredibly talented musician. You know that music is very, very complex. That frank does no boy. You know so for him to be able to do what he does.

Speaker 1: 14:05

You know, mickey, there's a bunch of us who feel like you should have I don't know what it is. We feel like you should have been on after the monkeys, like been a huge star in comedies because you just were so, absolutely natural. I've got a couple of listeners. When I played some of this interview on my radio show, my actual radio show they were saying, yeah, you know, mickey always had this thing. We think that this man should like be this big star who should have this big film career. And I agree there was something about you that was very special, very funny, the way you just conducted yourself. And did you ever I mean, how did? Was that an aspiration of yours? Did you ever think about that?

Speaker 2: 14:45

no, I'll tell you what happened. Um, I've told this story before. You know, by the time of the monkeys I'd already been in the business for 10 years or more. Actually, my parents were in the business, as you may know, and so I'd already been in the business for 10 years. From circus boy, I had my own series, you know, as you know. And so, um, you know, after the monkeys, frankly, I wanted to move on we we all kind of did, but I didn't want to move on in acting cause I kind of been there, done that. Um, I wanted to direct, and so that's kind of what I set my sights on and I was focused on that. I started a production company. I don't even think at that point I even had an acting agent, so there wasn't anybody out there looking for stuff for me. But I was focused on directing and I started this little company and my partners and friends did a couple of commercials, a little documentary, some other stuff.

Speaker 2: 16:10

And then I did get a chance, an offer, to go to England where my friend Harry Nilsson had a musical on the stage in London called the Point, and Harry was my dearest friend at the time and he asked me would you go over there and star, co-star in this musical over the Christmas um pantomime season in England there's this thing called pantomime, which you probably heard of um and I was very flattered and I loved his. I knew the point, of course, because we were so close, and so I said absolutely, I had just, frankly, gotten divorced, I had no ties to LA and I was selling my house and I said great. So I packed up some stuff for three months and moved to England for three months to do this musical play and it was great, very successful, I had a great time. And while I was there I bumped into an agent for directors, a literary agent that handles writers and directors, and I was like, wow, you know, funny, you know meeting you, I really want to get into directing.

Speaker 2: 17:46

I was remarried to an English girl so I could work in England. And she said do you have any film? And I said yeah, because I directed an episode of the Monkees and these commercials and all this stuff. And I said yeah, and I actually had somebody pack it up in Los Angeles and send it over and had somebody pack it up in Los Angeles and send it over and and you know she looked and stuff and sent me around to the TV and film companies in London at the time this is in the mid 70s, mid, you know, 75, 89 and I landed a gig excuse me, I landed a gig at the BBC directing a little drama play and it came out great and everybody liked it.

Speaker 2: 18:48

And then my agent sent me over to London Weekend Television where I met the head of comedy and I had the other Monkey episode and I had this little BBC thing and this executive said I'm trying to develop a series here actually called Metal Mickey a total coincidence and it's a sitcom, a family sitcom, you know, and would you be interested in developing, producing and directing it? I said yeah, and I did, and the short story the cuts of the chase. I went to England for three months to do the play. I stayed 15 years and I didn't, I didn't hardly do any singing, no acting, nothing. I was a quite successful television, film and film producer and director Mickey, I know, oh go ahead.

Speaker 2: 20:01

That's why I wasn't in LA doing comedy.

Speaker 1: 20:04

Well, I mean, yes, that's an excellent reason. Congratulations in your accomplishments there. I know I'm at my 20-minute limit here and since I am at the 20 minutes and I know you are a very busy guy as we go out today, mickey and I want to again thank you for your time. I'm going to end it this way because I know you have to get going. You're a very gracious man Mickey.

Speaker 1: 20:26

It is a pleasure, honest to God, to talk to you. I want you to know that I have every Monkees 45 original version promo DJ copy Wow, it's never been played, never been on a turntable, every single one, complete mint condition, including. If I may, if you have 10 seconds to tell me about the flip side of Daydream Believer, which I'm going to play going out, going down with your most incredible vocals.

Speaker 2: 20:53

Well, thank you. Yeah, that was a very cool song, real quickly. The story behind it is I always wanted to do a song that Moe's Allison if you know that name made famous called parchment farm. Uh, it's just three chords and a cool groove. And so we were in the studio messing around and I said I've always wanted to do this song by mozallison and these three chords not to cover, we're not going to. Not to cover necessarily. Well, no, my original idea was to cover necessarily. Well, no, my original idea was to cover Parks and Farms.

Speaker 2: 21:34

And we did this track Again, it's just three chords back and forth. And we finished it and it was Mike Nesmith actually, and I do remember this. He said you know, this track is really good, we all love Moe's Allison, but why should we cover a Moe's Allison tune? Why don't we get somebody to write some lyrics for this groovy track and a melody? Because it didn't have a melody or lyrics or nothing. It was just these chords, chord patterns. And I said, yeah, great, fine. So we went to Diane Hildebrand and she wrote the lyrics, and I remember when I went in to routine it with her against the track, but learn the song, and you know, and the track started, started and, if you remember right, yes, and it's going like that, but I have the lyrics in my hand. I'm going down the river with a saturated liver and she said mickey, mickey, stop Mickey, it's twice as fast. And I'm like what? And the rest is this Thanks so much for your time again, pat.

Speaker 1: 23:01

Mickey, thank you for your time. God bless and good luck on your show. We'll see you on the 31st. All right, thank you so much. You're welcome. Thank you, mickey Dolenz, let's play that song, shall we?

Speaker 2: 23:22

The song we were just talking about? Here you go, going down. I do believe she meant it when she told me to forget it, and I bet you will forget it when you find me in the morning, wet and drowned and the wood gets round. I'm going down, I'm going down, I'm coming up for air. It's pretty stuff under there.

Speaker 1: 23:39

Like I said, I didn't care, but I forgot to leave a note and it's so hard to stay afloat. I'm soaking wet without a boat and I knew I should have taken off my shoes.

Speaker 2: 23:46

It's front page news Going down.

Speaker 1: 23:51

Going down. I had a really great time with Mickey. You know I'm going to guess, but I think he had a good time too. Help, help, help, help, help, help, help, help help Really makes me happy when he started off saying that he likes to talk to people who know their stuff. That's a high compliment, I tell you.

Speaker 2: 24:15

I wish that I could see the way to shop. I don't want no more going down.

Speaker 1: 24:23

I'm going down From Pisces, aquarius, capricorn and Jones' limited album, the Monkees, mickey on vocals, going down For Sherry Sherry. I meant to say that to him, sherry Sherry brought that one up and turned me on to this, thank you. Thanks to everyone. That shall conclude Pat's Peeps Number 114. See you for 115. See you on the radio.