113. Steve McCraw's Mission in Men's Ministry and the Armor of Faith

From the forge of adversity to the anvil of leadership, Steve McCraw, the inspiring force behind the Band of Outlaws, joins us to share his transformative journey. Once a metalwork professional, now a beacon of hope in men's ministry, Steve's candid tales of personal battles and the fortitude found in surrendering to a higher power resonate deeply. Our exchange traverses the four elements of self—mind, body, heart, and spirit—and unfolds the layered concepts of strength, unity, and the profound impact of empathy in the Christian faith.

Navigating the battlefield of the mind means engaging with complex emotions and grappling with responsibilities, especially in confronting the harrowing issue of male suicide rates. Steve, our 'Blacksmith', forges a narrative that places the onus on self-efficacy and the construction of one's Armor of God, rather than relying solely on external validation. The discourse extends beyond personal growth, framing our darkest challenges as the catalyst for our most significant breakthroughs, and stresses the difference between genuine confidence and the pitfall of cockiness.

Stepping into a broader expanse, we look at the ripple effects of individual actions within our communities. The joy of seeing Steve's work evolve into a nonprofit outreach ministry highlights the imperative of active participation and the collective forging of a supportive brotherhood. From discussing key concepts like atonement and spiritual understanding to unraveling the multifaceted meanings of words like peace and respect, this episode is an armory of insights for those ready to navigate life with an assured stride, armored in faith and fellowship.

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:10

What's up Warriors? Welcome back to the battlefield of the mind. I'm with Steve McCraw today. Steve, you're doing some bad ass ministry right now and I'm really excited for you to be able to get into your stuff. So we were talking I'm already caught on that Steve is going to say some very cool stuff. So get a notebook out, get ready to start taking some notes. I think we're going. Spirit side is the way this conversation looks like it's going to go, and I'm very excited to switch to that side of myself and join you. So, steve, tell the people what you do and then let's just jump back into our conversation.

Speaker 2: 0:42

Sure, sure, I. Well, mainly, my career was met. I'm a metal man, I was a metal fabrication, I do a lot of metalwork for designers all across the globe. And then, about three years ago, the only reason I joined TikTok platform is I wanted to promote my business that I was starting. And I kept hearing this voice say you remember what I called you to do when you were 19? And I was like no, I'm not doing it. I've already got my plan lined out. God, you're not going to convince me otherwise. And this went on for a couple of months, rick, and finally I surrendered to do it. So I started a ministry, a men's ministry called the Band of Outlaws, and we've we've been growing very rapidly over the last three years. We're about to start doing some, some outreach men's retreats and some some ladies retreats.

Speaker 2: 1:46

But what I was going to say whenever you we were talking beforehand was a lot of times people think that all your work, everything you do, is on the camera, and it's not. That's when the work starts, is when the camera turns off, right? And you and I talked yesterday and you're like I got this, this, this and this lined up after this show right? And I said I can't do this on Friday because I got to go get my kids, which is six hours away, and that's my time with my kids.

Speaker 2: 2:19

But the conversation we were just having was about my very first panic attack ever in my life. I'm an adrenaline junkie. I race motocross for almost 20 something years. I've broke just about every bone in my body at least once, sometimes twice. But the very first panic attack I ever had was when I had a friend, a close friend of mine, that was in a fight or flight mode and I chose to spend three days with him and I had people reaching out to me on the app to help them with different situations and I focused in on what I had to do with this guy and about that time was the time that I was like I can't be everything to everyone and it started overtaking me a little bit and I started panicking a little bit, like I can't do this by myself. I need some more men. I need some more ladies that can be willing to take those phone calls and help people out.

Speaker 1: 3:20

So what happened is when you you had overload from taking on so much damage, from not being able to unload it. Yes, yes.

Speaker 2: 3:29

I typically talk to about 4000 guys on a personal level a month, so it can be overwhelming. Now I have about six men that help me out. My admins help me out. They take on a lot of the the things that I would typically try to take on myself. But you know how it is. You can't be Superman to everybody. I'm not your Superman, like Eminem says. I can't be that guy all the time. But yeah, you're right, the work starts when the camera goes off.

Speaker 1: 4:06

It's something that people people who don't do won't understand, and I don't say it in a slight, I say it as more of a location than it is an ego. And this is just like people will watch. Like, hey man, you're going viral. Or hey man, you're doing a thing right now that like people like, or you're getting likes or views or whatever. And I remember it, like even when, like I'm sure, when you first started going viral, I remember when I went viral, they're like man, like that's, you made it, dude, you made it. Are you, are you excited? Are you like blown away? Are you like how do you do that? Are you like surprised? And I'm like I don't. I don't think you guys understand.

Speaker 1: 4:43

I've been building this for five years underground, right, and so I equated it to if you were starting an apple orchard and you planted all your seeds and you start watering, right, and nobody gives a shit, nobody cares, there's nothing happening. And the next year, like people like, what are you doing? You still doing that apple thing. You're like still doing it. And you got a little little saplings like this big Right, no fruit Still going. You're like water and all these things all year. Next year they're a little taller, still no fruit Next year. They're taller, but still it's not enough to make it so you can really do the things. And then your fifth year of just grinding and working and everyone's like your stupid apple thing. You're still doing that. You, how much money you made on your Apple thing? None, because there's no apples yet. And then, finally, the fifth, sixth year, there's apples and everyone's like Steve, steve, you made it. You made it, there's apples, you made.

Speaker 2: 5:41

Five apples, five apples, and you're like stop it.

Speaker 1: 5:44

You said stop that, stop that. I'm not surprised that there's apples when I've been working on my apple orchard for five years. But what you don't understand is, now that there's apples, the work begins. Now I have to make cider and make donuts and get customers and take care of people and hire people for this and hire you think I made it. No, the work begins now. Now my purpose can start to happen. But you guys weren't there for the five years, the thousands of days of no apples, right? So when the apples show up, I'm not surprised. That's what I've been working on for this whole time. Now I can start doing service. Now I can start being there for people. Now I can start bringing joy into the people's lives again. Now we can have donut Donuts and cider together because there's apples, because I worked when you didn't believe.

Speaker 1: 6:42

So, Steve, you went viral. Bud, you did, you made it. You're the big time. You're like no, now I have apples. I got to do something with the apples now.

Speaker 2: 6:53

Well, you know what and that's why I preach humility a lot I think some of the strongest men out there they have to be humble about it. It doesn't come from me. I've had some help right. I've had some help from the Lord above and he's been faithful to take care of what he promised me. And what he promised me he said if you do this, I'll take care of you. I didn't want to do this, rick. I have my life planned out. I had multiple houses, I had multiple cars, that type of thing.

Speaker 2: 7:32

I was very well known in the industry and it was a struggle for me to give all that up to go into ministry work because my dad was a pastor. My dad was in the ministry. I grew up around that. I know how hard it is and so it was a struggle. But when I finally surrendered, he's never let me down. He's always taking care of me and I was going to look. I want to back up a little bit. Can we tell everybody how you said I was handsome before I got on the show? I'm just joking, yeah, you're handsome dude.

Speaker 1: 8:03

Good looking guy. I'm looking for the words dude.

Speaker 2: 8:05

That's a good looking dude right there.

Speaker 2: 8:09

You know, I still have to try to stay humble and I got to tell you, when I got the invite to come on your show, I didn't feel like I was in the category of some of the other guys that you have on the show. I didn't feel like I mean, look, you had Dwayne Noel on here, you got Danny Morrell on here. You've had all these guys and I'm going wait, what me? I called a conservative ant the other day and I said what's Rick like? When you talk to him, he goes, he goes. Oh, he's very nice to talk to, he's very invited. I said good, that's all I needed to know. All right, lowkey, just so you know I've got this, just so you get an idea of what I'm talking about.

Speaker 1: 8:46

All right, lowkey. Just so you know. I've got this. Just so you get an idea of like this is how I appreciate and value you. This next week I go to Florida. I'll be. Actually, I'm seeing conservative ant.

Speaker 2: 8:59

I'm going to go hang with him and I'm going to stay in his place.

Speaker 1: 9:02

We're going to record together and then I'm going to see Chris Burkett and Peaches, so I'll be back on the to be better podcast, which is a big show, right, and I've got Bradley this afternoon. Bradley, I've got two million.

Speaker 2: 9:17

Bradley.

Speaker 1: 9:18

Yeah, yeah, that's a big dude, that's a big dog. I'm happy.

Speaker 2: 9:29

I've always wanted to ask Brad what happened between him and Grant Cardone.

Speaker 1: 9:31

Oh man, I mean, we can ask you that I didn't get too much into him. I just I like, I agree with, I like, I just like his style for his approach on his, which is I've only seen a few of his podcasts but I'm excited to hang with him. But my point is still is like it's not about viewers, it's not about followers, it's not about likes and subscribes, it's about caliber and do that, I'm honored to hang with you. Like I said. Like I said hey, if you got Friday, I'll spend even longer with you. Like it's like I'm honored to hang with you. So it's not about what other people think, it's about what we're called to do and it's an honor man, I'm happy to have you with me. And like, yeah, dude, listen, the humility of it, I'm a strong, handsome leader, I get it and I can recognize another one Right.

Speaker 2: 10:24

Well, thank you I appreciate that, like I said, I'm not here. I'm not here for the clout, I'm not here for the, for the accolades, and, like you said, going viral means nothing really to me. I just want the message that I'm putting out there to be heard, because I think if you apply, a lot of people know what they should be doing, but you have to apply it right, you have to apply it and the application.

Speaker 1: 10:53

There's four elements. Right, there's four. There's four elements and you speak in a couple of different of them as your strong side, the. There's a yin-yang of mind, heart, body, soul.

Speaker 2: 11:06

There's a yin-yang to it.

Speaker 1: 11:08

So heart and spirit, those are on one side. Mind and body are on the other. It's a logic tactics and then action and doing, and then you've got the feeling and the emotion and the passion, and then you've got your spirit, which is the connector for everything. It's the connection and the purpose. And when people are not training all four sides, you start with your strong side and you start working into your other ones. And this is where, like you said, you are more body. If anything, you're like I fucking do, I'm going to go jump shit, I'm going to go build things, I'm going to go do stuff that your your body side strong, I'm going to make it happen.

Speaker 2: 11:47

And I'm like, I'm going to spirit side.

Speaker 1: 11:50

I believe you. I believe you, but you keep saying a word that, um, if you're mind and body side, you keep saying this word. That is a bad word. You keep saying when I surrender, when I surrendered Now for for logic guys and for action guys, surrender means quitting failure, you lose.

Speaker 2: 12:12

Sure, sure, you know, and that's something I've had to teach on before surrender to me, when you surrender to the king of kings which I'm a man of faith and I'm very strong in my face, um, surrender has always been looked at by um a man in society. It's always been pushed on me and that's a bad thing. You quit, right, uh. But when you allow that, um, that connection between your heavenly father and your spirit, and you do what he, he, has called you to do, when you do those things and you become very mighty because there's nothing that can hold you back, um, uh. So that connection is important. That connection, uh, with your, your mind, body and spirit, uh, is very important. So I don't look at surrender as a bad word. I look at quitting as a bad word, but I look at, um, failure. Failure is just another, another reason to get back up and start again, right? I mean, you said you've been building this for five years. It didn't happen overnight, right, you probably failed a few times. You probably gave the wrong advice a few times.

Speaker 1: 13:20

Well, I tell everybody, no matter what it is, when I teach, uh, corporations and business, when I do, like the big speeches, um, when I change people from, like you know, 99% thinking to the 1% thinking, I'm like you have to look at these very different. It's not because, um, you know, I have more eyes or more feet, or more hands or more ears or something. No, it's just the way that we view a situation is different. One person will see obstacles and impossible. Another person sees opportunity, in a way to build a dream. And I'm like you know, my one of my buddies says, uh, you see a mousetrap, I see free cheese in the challenge, you know. And so it's like it's just the way we see it is going to be different. And so when I learned surrender, I remember I'm with. I'm with you. It's a bad thing. Surrender is bad. I didn't understand heart side because my heart side was repressed as a man. We have to suppress our feelings. Push your feelings down, push your feelings.

Speaker 2: 14:12

So it's society teaches us.

Speaker 1: 14:14

Correct. And so I fell in because, you know, we had abusive upbringing, I had abandonment, I mean, I had the list, and so I had to overcome a lot of curses in order to be where I'm at. I had to beat a lot of demons back and this makes me qualified because I have killed, I have fought, I have beaten them and I will show you how. There are tactics to it. And I didn't understand until I did the surrender element. Surrender was bad. In fact, I would use this book as a weapon. I would pull up with this book. I would go at you. You did the Lord's prayer today. Did you read what Jesus said, literally right before you said the Lord's prayer? Right, come on, gentile, let's go ahead. You know, like I would use this book as a weapon, right? And so there's a big disconnect for me with religion to God, and I think a lot of people run into religion and God is not the same. Right Now for me to surrender.

Speaker 1: 15:08

I almost want to hear your story because I was in bed. I did all the psychology, I did all of the philosophy, I had all of my issues diagnosed, labeled in their own perspective, little Tupperware bends with the correct label of diagnosis and problem. I had all of them stacked very neatly and here I am in a room full of these organized diagnosis issues. I can't get rid of them. Right, I did all the logic, I do the work. What am I missing? And it was when I was like, oh God, I know we've had some arguments, I disagree with a lot of things, but I don't get it. And you know what I'm done. I'm done trying to think I'm supposed to be the one who gets it all. I don't, I don't get it. So you know what I surrender, man, I surrender. And that was when God told me your mountain to you is less than a grain of sand to me, right? And I was like okay, he's like so give me your grain of sand, go do it. I was like whatever, man.

Speaker 2: 16:14

Okay, you've been hanging on to it so tightly, haven't you?

Speaker 1: 16:17

Well, that was all I had. That was the mountain I lived on Right. So it was crazy when I said, all right, god, all right, I'm going to surrender, I'm going to let it go, that's yours, I'll give it to you, give it to God and Steve, I think I can't wait to hear your story on this. It was like you were standing on my chest and just like stepped off and I was like like, oh my God, that's the first time I've taken a breath in like 30 years.

Speaker 1: 16:43

Right, and I remember. I remember even fighting through my own race to acceptance of denial, bargaining, anger, sadness of going no way. The answer cannot be surrendered, that's impossible, this cannot be correct.

Speaker 2: 17:00

Right.

Speaker 1: 17:01

And it was.

Speaker 2: 17:01

So it is correct, and I'll tell you that I had a guy one time send me a letter that said, Steve, you'd live like a free man no-transcript, and I really had to think about what he meant there. What he meant, though, is my actions, the way I carry myself. I'm happier than I've ever been in my life. I may not have as much as I've ever had in my life, but it ain't about that. It's about that surrender first, and when you totally surrender to doing what you wanna do, to what God wants you to do, he's gonna bring the increase. We talked about fruit. The proof is in the pudding, you know, and so, when you totally surrender, you will become a free man.

Speaker 2: 17:48

The band of outlaws people always ask me why I named the band of outlaws as a ministry. Well, most of our guys look pretty burly, pretty scraggly. Just some of them have been in MC organizations truckers, you name it. Guys, you probably wouldn't want to meet on the alley somewhere, but to me, it all revolves around what the Bible says about Romans 12, too Be not conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. We gotta change the way we think so if we're not to be conformed to this world. It sounds like an outlaw to me, right, Outlaws don't conform.

Speaker 2: 18:30

Outlaws do what they're supposed to do or what they feel in their heart to do, versus conforming to what everybody else is doing. And I think so many times guys get in this rut where they go well, I've gotta have this job or I've gotta put on this expectation, and don't you dare cry about something that you're emotional about or just suck it up. You gotta change the way you think, and that's where it comes from. We talked about mind, body and soul. This guy can affect this guy If you're not careful. I feel like the mind is the devil's playground. One of the best I wanna hear more.

Speaker 1: 19:09

Why do you think the mind is the devil's playground?

Speaker 2: 19:13

Because those thoughts of not being worth it, those thoughts of I've gotta perform, and they really affect your outer actions, right? So, rick, you said, man, I'm glad to hang out with you, but I may not feel like I'm even worthy to be on your show, right? But that's just the devil messing with me.

Speaker 1: 19:34

I don't know if that's the devil man. So I think curses are different when I train people on doubt, that worthiness is a doubt curse and so if you understand how it works, it's very, very defeatable. But I don't think that doubt is the devil. I think it's just something that was planted, that we nurture.

Speaker 2: 19:55

Right.

Speaker 1: 19:57

And so I don't think you're under attack. I think it's just somebody put a belief in there and then you just take care of it.

Speaker 2: 20:02

Or sometimes it's a belief you have for yourself.

Speaker 1: 20:05

That's what I mean is that's your belief. There's nobody around anymore, like whoever put that. You're not good enough there. They're not by you anymore, so you're not under attack. That's just you taking care of an old belief system, right so?

Speaker 2: 20:19

I don't think that's the devil. Prince gave one of the greatest quotes I've ever heard, the little dude from Minnesota. He said the mind is the battlefield. And that's what I've. The very first thing I thought of when you approached me about this show is the battlefield of the mind. That's the first quote I thought of. Prince said the mind's a battlefield and the heart or the soul is the prize. And so if we change the way we think or what we input into our minds, it can have a direct or indirect effect on our soul. And I just thought that was brilliant. Here this artist is saying that be careful what you think about.

Speaker 1: 21:04

Well, this is where we get into. How do we do it? And so the Warriors way is my company. That's what we do. I actually train men, just like you do, and one of the things that we do is to challenge everything, everything. It's a round table in my groups. While I may have wisdom and experience and skills and competency, you should challenge me, and actually that's the same thing. It's like your motorcycle guys. I have soldiers, ufc fighters, strongmen, police officers, you name it. I've got them because I gather warriors and you gather warriors because we go and do battles and there are tactics and together we are stronger.

Speaker 1: 21:43

When I look at men like you, I know people who are weak in their faith or weak in their purpose. See competition. I see camaraderie. I'm like this is the brother. Even you and I can't reach enough. There are billions who need help.

Speaker 1: 21:59

I can really only because I do deep work, transformation. I can really only deep work help about 400 guys a year. It's barely a drop in the bucket. Man. I can't get. I just can't. I can't get enough Now.

Speaker 1: 22:11

Over years, that'll leave a legacy of thousands and thousands and the ripple will go out way beyond anything I've ever known for. But how much can I directly impact? Is this much? So I need more men like you that I can go. You need to plug into all these other guys. We all bring a piece, and so the battlefield of the mind is I'm gonna bring in tactics and actions that you can use to lean in on spirit and heart side things that you use, and together we're stronger.

Speaker 1: 22:38

When they say who's the strongest coach or warrior or author or mentor or pastor, I'm like together, all of us Right, we can create a phalanx, we can create a shield wall and you can send whatever you want. You wanna go doubt? I'm like I'll show you guys doubt. I got this guy. You know like my worth, my worthiness, and I'm like what. I'm gonna show you how you kill this one, sh, sh, sh. And I'm like the weak spot on doubt. Is this guy here, sh and you're gonna go? Did you just drop doubt in one hit? I'm like I do it every morning, man.

Speaker 2: 23:09

You know how did you do it, and then I had coffee with doubt this morning.

Speaker 1: 23:13

no problem, he cracks me up now that I know how he works. But you said your worthiness, I'm like well, let's go ahead and challenge doubt. Let's see which one it is, Cause I don't think it's the devil. Do you know why? I know it's not the devil. The devil comes in through pleasure. That's why I don't think it's. I think if you met the devil, he'd be the coolest motherfucker you ever met.

Speaker 2: 23:36

It was like Brian said, the devil would be he'd be cool. He's offering you all the just like that video. We were talking about Brian saying he offers you all this stuff and then when you offer it back to him, it's like no man, that's cool, you do your thing. I'm gonna just sit over here, that's for you bud and abundance for you.

Speaker 1: 23:55

All that you want. You want drugs, you want drinks, you want women, you want money, you want power, you want fame. It's all for you. As much as you want in abundance.

Speaker 2: 24:08

I'll just sit over here and watch you destroy yourself.

Speaker 1: 24:11

I really do believe this is where I think people try and like. They try and make the devil out Like he's in his, like red Spanx, you know Spanx and he's trying to get pitchfork everybody and give him your soul. I think the devil would be the most smooth dude. He knows the Bible like the back of his hand. He could connect with you on any level. He knows all the people you want to know. He's going to be hanging out and he's going to go hey, steve, hey, later on I'm going to be hanging out Like pick your favorite singer, your favorite sports guy or your favorite speaker, it doesn't matter, your favorite, your top. Like your number one guy you'd ever want to meet. Right, and he's like dude, I'm going to go hang out with him later. You want to come with us? I want to introduce you. You're like oh, dude, I know, but I got my wife at home and I got my. I got.

Speaker 2: 24:56

Backstage passes. I got backstage.

Speaker 1: 24:58

He's like no backstage, steve, I'll get you in. I'll get you in, man, no problem. You're like, oh, this is a once in a lifetime man. Like all right, this guy's cool, he's smart, he's offering me backstage with my favorite thing ever. It could be speaker, author, singer, you name it whatever. Backstage to the fucking Lakers, or you pick a sport, it doesn't matter, you get in. You're like all right, I'll come for a little bit. I'll come for a little bit. Right, I'm going to hang out for a little while and then, while you're back there, you got your favorite, your meeting with a dude. Like pick, pick somebody who you like. If you had a bucket list person, maybe we can manifest it Like pick your person, who would you want to meet?

Speaker 2: 25:38

Who would I want to meet? Oh man, Pick anybody anybody, any category, I honestly, man, there's so many people that I have met, there's so many people that I've had the pleasure of meeting some really cool cats, but I think for me it would be someone that's already passed away. I think it would be Charles Haddon Spurgeon. I would love to meet Charles Haddon Spurgeon.

Speaker 1: 26:07

Okay, there you go. So he's like actually he came back. He actually never died, bro, I can introduce you, he's like.

Speaker 1: 26:13

Elvis. He's Elvis. He's underground right now, but I can get you a hangout. You're like really, okay, so let's just make believe we're in fantasy anyways. So let's just make believe this is the option. You're like I'm going to hang out with Charles, you can come hang out. You're like really. You're like dude, come on.

Speaker 1: 26:28

Now you're hanging out with Charles and Charles is like hey, man, have some drinks with me. And you're like I don't know, man, I got a busy weekend, I got to get my kids, I got my girl at home, I don't know. He's like it's Charles, though Now Charles will drink your ass onto the table now. And so now you're doing round for round with Charles. He's like you're my dude, steve. And you're hanging out. Now you got some girls there too, like some dimes tans hanging out, and they're giving you attention. You're like no, no, no, no, no. I don't want to play with any of that stuff. But now you've been drinking a ton and the devil's like just have him, say hi, come over and say hey, steve. And they're sitting with you and you're like no, no, no, no, no. I don't, I don't, please, don't, please, don't. I'm good, I'm good, I'm good. And they're just hanging out, hanging out and you're still just running shots with Charles and then the girls are just touching you Like it's ladies, please, please, please.

Speaker 1: 27:15

But then you start not noticing it. And now you're drinking and you're hanging with your boys and the music's good and everyone's having fun and more people are getting around and it's getting more exciting and it's getting a little crazier. And now you didn't realize it's like 3 30 in the morning. Really. You're already going through the night and you're already in it. And now the girls are being way more handsy and the guys are having way more fun and everything's really fast and wild. You're drunk off your ass and your whole life has fallen apart. Your phone has been blown up all night because your girl's worried. Everything's going so quickly.

Speaker 1: 27:48

And what is it? It's a room filled with an abundance of pleasure, temptation. It's an. It's an overload, it's as much as you can handle. And there may be offers of stuff like you've never done drugs like this before, but it's with Charles. And so now I'm in this weird thing. I don't smoke weed, but if Bob Marley was like dude, take a hit with me, man, I'd be like it's Bob fucking Marley. So I'll do it this time. I'm doing so much Jamaican Kush now because it's Bob Marley. What a bucket list thing to say. I don't need a lot of bacon cheeseburgers, but if Elvis made me one I would eat it.

Speaker 2: 28:25

Yeah, no I get it, that's how. That's how he works. That's exactly how he works. One thing I love about Charles Spurgeon he was an evangelist, by the way, back in the he was an alcoholic who hung with the devil.

Speaker 1: 28:43

I'm just kidding.

Speaker 2: 28:47

He didn't speak like most preachers do. I mean? This guy had a pair on him right this lady one time. He preached for over two hours one time and this lady came up to him after his service and said I thought I think you preach too long, you need to trim those back a little bit. And he asked her if he had any scissors on her and she said no, why do I need scissors? He said so I can trim your tongue the way I like it. That's the kind of dude Charles Spurgeon was.

Speaker 1: 29:17

Troll patrol. He's got a sense of the trolls. I also believe that what that lady did is today's attacks. These are the attacks on your ministry. It's the attacks on your warriors, it's attacks on people. Today is judgment, yes, shame judgment yes. These are the attacks today and you're watching how a lady feels entitled to give her judgments of what is too long. That's too long. Well, fucking leave, once you got your message, like you can choose that. Free will is the game, not control everyone around you with judgment. And again, these are the attack or armor up against.

Speaker 2: 29:55

And you asked me about my story and once again, I was called to the ministry when I was 19 years old. I used to be a youth minister for about 350 high school kids, right At 19,. Right, I was a pup back then. I didn't have everything figured out, I didn't know everything, but these kids loved me because I spent time with them and I encouraged them in things that I just went through as a high schooler, right. And then the church had a meeting one time and wanted to bring in a youth minister that had been to college and, of course, remember my background.

Speaker 2: 30:30

As I grew up as a preacher's kid, I knew more about the Bible than most preachers did, but my pride got in the way and my feelings were hurt because they voted me out and somebody else came in. So I was like you know what, forget this, I'm not doing this. And that's when I started into the metal industry and I became really good at it. Like I said, I worked with designers all across the world. I've been on the cover of Architectural Matter of fact. Let me tell you a story about that. I built this rain hood, a vent hood for this really high profile house up in Massachusetts. I won't tell you who's it was, but it was high profile and it was a patina black with brass straps on it and everything was polished. It was immaculate. And the GC for this job told me it was a piece of crap and it looked like crap and all this stuff and I'm like whatever. I got another one to build right, I got to keep going. So it really bothered me at first. But then about two years later someone handed me the cover of Architectural Digest and my hood was on the cover of it. So I just wanted to.

Speaker 2: 31:45

You know, at that time, before I was a changed man, I just wanted to be a director. Before I was a changed man, I just wanted to be like FU, fu, fu. You know it's someone's opinion and you got to just roll with it. You know what your capabilities are and one man may call you trash and say you're not good enough, and then the 80 million people think that it's the best thing since sliced bread. So it really does play an effect on you. But I don't know, I don't know. There are people out there that are just like we were talking about with this lady. They're just going to judge you. That's why I don't preach religion. I preach a relationship. I believe that religion is manmade. It's a way for man to control, and it usually starts with different rituals and they become routine and now, all of a sudden, you think, if I don't do this, I'm not going to heaven. Right, it has nothing to do with that. What it has to do with is your relationship with Christ and who you put your trust and belief in.

Speaker 2: 32:59

The thief on the cross the thief on the cross didn't have to go get baptized to be in heaven, did he?

Speaker 1: 33:05

Well, I love the term Christian. Like I like it, because who are you supposed to follow if you're a Christian, christ-like?

Speaker 1: 33:11

Right, you're supposed to follow Christ? Right, all right. Well, what church did Jesus go to? Jesus go to? Or Yeshua, or however you want to do it Like. What church did he go to? None, okay, that's weird, right? He just said close the door behind you and pray to God. He knows what you need before you do. Or he says I'm going to go out in the woods, I'm going to pray to the Father. He didn't have to go to church. He wasn't like I got to be at that church or else I'm a bad person. No, no, he's like. No, the relationship is where it is. He said a gathering of more than what, too Right. He's like that's no, you're already doing congregation right now. We don't have to have a building for that, that's just. We're together.

Speaker 2: 33:48

Well, you know what?

Speaker 1: 33:49

Jesus was an outlaw, oh yeah.

Speaker 2: 33:51

He was an outlaw.

Speaker 1: 33:54

Jesus was a he pissed off everyone. Jesus pissed off everybody. He was like he was going into the church and breaking all the rules.

Speaker 2: 34:04

Right. Well, most of the teachings that he did were outside the church, on a synagogue steps or up on the mountain or in a boat Sermon on the mount. He was being relatable with people of his time.

Speaker 1: 34:22

Bro, just Matthew seven, Just that one Sermon on the mount, just that one spot right there, smashing most of today's bullshit. Yeah, if I just say it, let's be Christ like and just start with don't judge people unless you want to be judged, the golden rule and false prophets, just that, right there. We're already. Like man, most people are fucked.

Speaker 2: 34:44

Yeah, I have a, you know, in a. I have a big problem with false teachers, the false narratives, the prosperity gospel. Look the way I look at it, rick. If I can't preach, preach God's to love the world. That, he said, has only begotten son in a tin hut on with dirt floors. That same message resonates with a $2 million condo if I'm in the same place, right. But if I say, if I say, well, you're, the only way that God's going to bless you is if you give to me, if you, if you send me all your money so I can live in this $2 million condo or drive this, fly this plane, or you talk about the wrong motives, I think John's three 16 sums it up. That's his message, that was the message that Jesus came for and it rings true in in a hut or condo.

Speaker 1: 35:45

Well, you're giving people confusing.

Speaker 1: 35:48

The false context is very confusing, like the three 16 God gave his only begotten son. It's it gives an idea of love that I don't think people can grasp and that makes it seem unrelated. Like it's it's almost too big to understand. It's almost like there's billions of galaxies. You're like I can't even quantify the size of that. Like it's almost too big to grasp. And so if you can't understand it, it means nothing. If you want to, does it make sense? I just one of my, one of my guys is one of the strongest men on earth and he was saying people don't understand if I say I picked up 900 pounds.

Speaker 1: 36:25

Well, if you because it's outside their capabilities if it's anything over 300, it's all the same. It means nothing at that point, you know. And so it doesn't matter how big it is, it still doesn't. I don't get it. So God gave his son for you. He died on a cross. And people are like why the hell? I don't, what the? I don't get it. Why would that even happen? What are you talking about? It's too big to get, and so that makes it tough for John three, 16, because if I just go, you should get it. It's like Steve, I don't get something I get, I get into the Socratic method. I don't understand. Can you tell me if he loves us this much and that's what love is then can you explain what love is? Should I be like killing my kid or something Like what the fuck is love Like.

Speaker 1: 37:10

I don't understand what it means. If that's love, can you explain love?

Speaker 2: 37:15

I explain to people Love is so big Right.

Speaker 1: 37:18

It's too big, love is too big.

Speaker 2: 37:20

I explain to people like this and I don't know if you have children, I do. I have a daughter who just turned 17 and the son is 14. My daughter is my million dollar baby. She has autism. She had open heart surgery at six weeks old. So the Lord taught me a lot about patience with my daughter, but she's going to be a senior in high school this year.

Speaker 2: 37:42

There's not a person on this planet that I would give any one of my children for. I think that that's for me to say, hey, I'm going to give my child up so that you can live, so that you can have eternal life. I don't understand that because of the love I have for my child. So for me that shows how love, like you said, how big it is, how uncomprehensible it is for me because I can't imagine doing that. But that's how much he says he loves us.

Speaker 2: 38:16

Romans 5, 8 says a guy commended his love toward us and while we were yet sinners, christ died for us. He had to pay the price. Now it's up to us to accept that gift. We say he died for the whole world and he did. But until you actually accept that reality and say you know what, I'm going to put my trust in him, I'm going to believe what he says, that I am the way, the truth in the life. Then you still have it major your peace with God. So I think there's a lot of. I had a lady ask me one time where did God come from? And you got to think about it. We can't comprehend those things in our mind, rick, like we think that every he is the beginning. He's always been. So it's a hard question to answer because we as people, human beings, we can't grasp, just like the 900 pound lift. I can't imagine doing that.

Speaker 1: 39:25

I think that's where faith lies, though, and so I'm going to go a little hard on this one. So, like, role with me, play tennis with me on this one, okay, so I'm going to go logic side.

Speaker 1: 39:33

Now I want you to hit the ball back. Okay, I had a hard time with this before I went into like it's not for me to understand. Just the surrender, the leap of faith, if you will. It's illogical, it doesn't make any sense. The stuff you're saying right now doesn't make sense.

Speaker 1: 39:46

You're like all right, so the rules were Jesus came down, or Yeshua came down and he died for our sins. Okay, why did he have to do that? Well, because Adam and Eve did a thing. And I'm like yeah, but God set up that thing. And so when Adam and Eve got kicked out, who made the rule that like, everyone's a sinner now, Whose rule was that? You're like well, that was God. God said like no, everybody's a sinner now from this point on. And I'm like okay, I'm going to do that. So if God made a rule, why does he have to send his son to get killed to change his own rule? Didn't he just make the rule? Why didn't he just make a different rule? Because he just made it in the first place. It's his own rule. So why does his son got to come down and get killed to change his own rule? Right, he made the rule. Why didn't he just go like hey, new rules, why do I got a, why do you got to sacrifice your million dollar baby daughter for a rule you made up?

Speaker 2: 40:42

Right, I'll put it to you I'm going to say, hey, new rules. Right here comes the tennis ball, back you ready. Yeah, I'll put it to you this way have you ever stole anything in your entire life?

Speaker 1: 40:58

So we are on crime sprees bro.

Speaker 2: 41:01

Exactly? Did anybody teach you that you needed to do that? Or what about tell a lot?

Speaker 1: 41:07

Oh man, they taught me. They taught me. I was taught how to do it and not get caught.

Speaker 2: 41:11

Okay, so that's a simple.

Speaker 1: 41:13

So no, no, no.

Speaker 2: 41:14

That's a sinful nature, right? Somebody taught you that, just like Adam and Eve, just like, from then on, somebody taught the other person how to lie, steal, commit all these different sins. There's none of us that are perfect, right? There's, none of us are perfect. And so the only way that we could reestablish a relationship? Because in the garden, god walked with Adam and Eve, right, and I'll put it to you this way when they ate of the fruit, they were ashamed. Well, nobody told them they were ashamed, nobody told them they were naked.

Speaker 2: 41:49

But because of that revelation of I disobeyed God or I disobeyed what he has established, god starts looking for Adam and goes Adam, where are you? Well, we were hiding. Well, why were you ashamed? Well, we were naked. Well, who told you you were naked? So a lot of times, that's what happens is a man in a hole, is a sinful creature. And the only way to reestablish that relationship, that personal relationship with God, was there had to be an atonement for it. You've paid for your crimes, right? Most of them, except the sprees that you have.

Speaker 1: 42:28

I've had to go, I've gone through my atonement and I think this is also a thing for atonement, which is a different part. It wasn't confession, right, it was. I didn't have to go and talk to somebody about it. It was being able to come get right with God, because I think God will give forgiveness, as the harder part is accepting it Right.

Speaker 2: 42:47

And once you, once you make that atonement with God, that does not mean that you still don't have to pay for your consequences, right?

Speaker 1: 42:54

I don't know, what that means.

Speaker 2: 42:56

Well, let's say, let's say I'll take something really stupid. Like you get a speeding ticket, right, and you were going 10 over the speed limit According to the law, you're still wrong, right, you could go, man, I shouldn't have been doing that, but guess what, you still got to go pay for that ticket. So, even though I think a lot of people I think a lot of people even though they go God forgive me for this, God forgive me for cheating on my wife or doing these things, Guess what the results of your sin or the result of you doing that is probably going to end and you're going to go through a very lengthy divorce, Sure. So I think people think well, I made my peace with God. Why isn't everything working out the way I wanted?

Speaker 1: 43:43

to, because you still, oh, that's, that's great yeah.

Speaker 2: 43:46

I see you still have to, you still have to take care of business.

Speaker 1: 43:50

Right, because I said sorry, then everything should just go my way, that's very different. I don't believe God works like that, but it still doesn't make sense to me because that still doesn't get to the point for like, why did Jesus have to die then for a rule God made?

Speaker 2: 44:59

God didn't make the rule. God gave us free will.

Speaker 1: 45:02

All he says- why are we all sinners then? Because I didn't. I didn't eat the fruit.

Speaker 2: 45:08

I didn't even get the chance to be the choice. Well, you didn't eat the fruit, but you didn't eat the fruit, but you still went on the crime spree, right?

Speaker 1: 45:14

Oh hell yeah, dude no that was very different. I didn't get a chance to do the Garden of Eden, though I didn't get a chance.

Speaker 2: 45:19

So that's the sin nature that was passed on from Adam. Adam's Adam was a little to me, it's a little crime, right. And we put labels on sin when God does it. The sin was disobedience, the sin was obeyed. I did this.

Speaker 1: 45:35

And if you listen to my last podcast, I did it. My dad actually wanted to have a debate with me. I'm excited for it. So I actually argued, I argued a little bit. I said be a little compassionate. You know, old Testament God has got compassion, understanding, forgiveness. And Old Testament God was fucking flood the earth, sodom and Gomorrah, turnbitches, assault, punished. Like go ahead and put Job through the trials, like wiping out armies for David. Old Testament God would give Samson super strength and all kinds of stuff. Like Old Testament God was kicking ass, if you will. New Testament God is forgiveness and grace and understanding and love.

Speaker 2: 46:12

I think you're seeing the characteristics of God, just like if somebody come up to me and said oh man, I'm going to judge Rick because Rick is very voiceless. Rick is, he has a certain characteristics. I think a lot of times in the Old Testament you saw different character God, just like a man. You will see different sides of his characteristics and I think in the New Testament you see that his love. I did a video not too long ago where every book in the Old Testament is a revelation of Jesus. Like judges, he is our mighty judge, the creator, and Genesis. Every book. People say well, jesus wasn't even in the Old Testament, no, but every book is a representation of Jesus's characteristics. So there has to be an atonement for sin and that came in the form of Jesus, who did no sin.

Speaker 1: 47:10

I'm with you. I'm with you, okay, but atonement, I think they were looking for some sort of external validation and I don't know if God works that way. And this is where it gets into the question of understanding things. God works through us now, fair or not fair? Fair Like does God work through you?

Speaker 2: 47:30

Absolutely.

Speaker 1: 47:31

You ever done some shit where you're like I don't think that was me. You ever say some stuff that you have to write down because you never said that shit before.

Speaker 1: 47:37

Right oh yeah You're like oh, that's good, I got to write my own thing down there. I've never even thought of that before. I get stuff in the middle of the night. Even this tool right here this came at three in the morning, where it's the map. This is how I built how human beings work and I've sent this to PhDs authors. People have written six psychology books. They're like this is the breakdown. That came at three in the morning. When I'm half asleep, god says make circles.

Speaker 2: 48:04

Right.

Speaker 1: 48:05

I put this thing out there and I sent this out to the biggest brains I got. I said beat it. And they came back and they said this is the best tool I've seen so far. What is that? What is that thing? So God works through us now, well, why can't that atonement work through the same way?

Speaker 1: 48:25

If I'm like God, it's you and me. Man, I learned my lesson, the mistake and the reason I made the mistake and the way you built me was to learn from mistakes. You didn't build me to be perfect. You build me to grow. You built me to choose free wills, the game. I'm with you. You built me to choose you. I can choose all these other things. I can choose magic rocks for my confidence. I can choose tarot cards or angel cards. I can choose even chance cards. Today, I'm supposed to think of serenity, like I can choose whatever. I can choose to worship me. I can choose to worship social media. I can choose today to pray for my frequency of money and I'm praying to the money to give me the monies of the money I can make. Whatever I want my God and he's like I'm going to give you opportunity. Are you going to choose me or not, I don't need a building, like you said. It can be dirt floor or a million dollar mansion, doesn't matter.

Speaker 2: 49:22

Right.

Speaker 1: 49:22

Do you choose God, and I don't think atonement necessarily requires another person's validation, and I think that if you can go like man I've learned that lesson the hard way. I think that God gets it. There's been millions of us, billions of us. We're not doing new shit.

Speaker 2: 49:39

Right and you said it best and I'm going to here comes that tennis ball again. If God is all omnipresent, he's omniscient, he's everywhere and Jesus is God as well, because he makes up part of the Trinity, and I know a lot of people go well, I explain that to them. I've done this many times. I don't get it.

Speaker 1: 50:02

We're not doing Trinity talk today, we're not doing faith, but here's the thing.

Speaker 2: 50:06

What you said was you said you don't have to make atonement to other people to validate what you did with God. Well, jesus is in other people. He's still God. So that atonement is that relationship that you build with him. That atonement is the fact that you're recognizing you can't do this on your own and you needed him to do this for you. So you're not making an atonement.

Speaker 2: 50:34

I tell people all the time Jesus says that I am the great mediator that goes between you and God. He doesn't say you got to go confess to a priest. I had a guy the other day said Steve, in my shed out back a couple of months ago, I accepted Christ as my savior. He said do I need to go tell a pastor? Do I need to go tell somebody? I said no, just go tell the world. You don't need to go make a confession to another human being. Your confession is based off of your fruit, like those apple trees. Right your confession? I always tell people this all the time. I'd rather my actions speak so loud you can't hear what I say.

Speaker 1: 51:17

Exactly. And again you're the warrior. I shall show you, don't? It's a Marcus Aurelius. Don't argue about what a good man is.

Speaker 2: 51:26

Just be what you called me out of my Socrates quote the other day, by the way.

Speaker 1: 51:31

I saw that. Yeah, I saw you did your three things. I'm like that was Socrates' civs. I'm like well done, dude, Well played, oh man.

Speaker 2: 51:42

But, yeah, I truly believe that that is one of the reasons that he had to do that is, to take on not just what I've done wrong, but what everybody's done wrong, and it's up to us to make that atonement with him.

Speaker 1: 51:56

Well, again, even the terminology done wrong. Jesus says don't judge. We have to pay attention to what things are. But it's not my place to say good, bad, right and wrong. And this is where I think people are goofed up, you know, especially when it gets into social identity, it gets into this gender stuff, it gets into faith and religions, it gets into control and power, blame and shame. We got all these weapons of destruction to hurt each other. But if you just, like I said, if you just take Matthew 7, if that was a fucking, that was a book, just a sermon on the mound, it kind of fucks up everybody's stuff. Oh, he gets all the points.

Speaker 1: 52:33

Yeah. I'm like are you judging people? They're like, yeah, I think they're bad. They did the bad thing, they're bad people. I'm like that's shame and judgment. I'm like Jesus says don't do that. Do you want people to do that for your stuff? Well, no, I don't like that. Well, that's the golden rule then. So now you're treating people the way you wouldn't like to be treated, and so, and then you're judging people, and that's just. That's just. That's still in the same speech, right? And so if we just remove judgment, shame and blame and go into accountability, authenticity, even empathy, well, now, none of this shit happens. You can't. I'm not going to tell you. You're talking too long, steve, you're going to be like too long, too long, is your judgment.

Speaker 2: 53:11

Where's my assistant's judgment?

Speaker 1: 53:14

You're too preachy. That's just another judgment. You just made up shit. You're just making it up. I am preaching exactly as I'm intended, right, you just aren't able to work through acceptance. And so even with Carl Jung, one of my favorite quotes, especially with people in the psychology world, because they think they're the fucking masters of the universe the psychology is so funny because one of his quotes is that thinking is hard and that's why people judge instead. And I'm like it's so funny that people come out going like, well, I think I'm good and you're bad, and I'm right and you're wrong, and I'm like, oh, the just judgments are thrown around, and you go wait a second, like I would actually want to. I've improved it because today's society doesn't have empathy, especially women to men is a real big gap right now. And so I say thinking and empathy are hard and that's why people judge instead.

Speaker 2: 54:09

Right, I've often, I've often told people look, if you're going to talk about chief of centers or somebody's done something, guess what I kind of wrote the book on it, right, I look, there's two types of preachers kids. There's the kind that are sneaky, that don't want everybody to know because you think you're going to ruin your dad's good name. And then there's the there's the kind that go out and they don't care what everybody thinks, they're going to do it anyway, right, well, I was number one, my brother was number two. Right, my brother served 17 years at the Texas Penitentiary. I, you know, I learned. But you know, I I'll put it to you this way.

Speaker 2: 54:51

Let's say, I think where a lot of Christians, or so called Christians, get it so wrong is they. They go up to people and they want to judge them for where they're at, not where they can, where they can be. Because we were all, we've all gone through some stuff. Right, that's like me and you going out on a walk or a hike and you're telling me all this stuff that you experienced or what you're going through at the moment, maybe it's, it's something dramatic in your life, and I looked, I turned around to you and I go, start poking you in a chest going. Why would you ever think that you could do it that way? Why would that even be a thought process? And that's me judging you right. Those are questions those are questions.

Speaker 1: 55:37

Those weren't judgments. Those are questions. But the poking, the chest this is fine, but it may be insinuated to be rhetorical, but if you actually ask why to understand, you may actually find Right. And this is where I think the your sins that you've done makes you qualified.

Speaker 2: 55:57

Right, exactly.

Speaker 1: 55:58

But the sins are a qualifier the tone the tone I'm just excited.

Speaker 2: 56:03

Right, the tone that I used was not very empathetic. Right, it was more of a judgment tone because I poked you in the chest or I was pushing you and I think a lot of I try to teach my guys this. You've got to look everybody would is only going to listen to what you say if they or care about what you say, if they know how much you care about them. And you have to be empathetic. You have to say, man, I know exactly what you're going through. Let me tell you what happened in my life and let me tell you what tools I use to to get through that in my point in my life. And when you approach things like that, you're going to probably hang around and listen to what I have to say, because I took time to approach you. Listen, the message may be great, but if your tone's off, nobody's going to listen to that. If your tone comes off, judge you. That is a thing.

Speaker 1: 56:59

Well, I think that I'm going to lean a little different. While people want to try and use tone as an excuse and I say that deliberately, right While they'll use your tone as an excuse to miss your message, I really think that competency is more important. You work with metal. I don't give a shit if a guy's an idiot. If he's fucking good, he's fucking good. If, like you're like, he just makes stuff with metal, where you're like dude, how did you do that? Like, your competency, your skill level, supersedes your tone and, since you've been there, it's very different.

Speaker 1: 57:42

And so this is where. Why, in the Warriors way, when the men come in and I think, if I'm reading you right, you do the same thing If the men come in, I need them. It's not a question. I need them to challenge me. Are you worth listening to, are you worth following? Have you been there? That's why you listen to Danny Morel, where he's like holy shit, you're one of the three people that I've known who have gone in and done it. I'm like challenge me directly, ask me hard questions. Have I gone to hell or did I just read a book about it? And I'm telling you what you should do, but I've never done. And this is where your competency comes into play. The reason I can tell you about how to gain forgiveness for deep, dark, nasty sins is because I did it, because I read about it, not because I preach about it, because I did it Right. It makes me qualified. I am a competent.

Speaker 1: 58:49

So this is where I think God didn't fuck up when he made us fuck up. You can quote me on that. God didn't fuck up when he made us fuck up. We're supposed to, so we can learn, because the further you go, the more you find him. I think that sin is a qualifier. I think we have to fail to find, and this is why people want to judge everyone's journey. I'm gonna judge your journey. I'm gonna judge your journey. You're too good, you're too bad, you're fat, you're skinny, you're tall, you're short. I'm gonna judge everybody. Stop, you are no longer being Christian. Because he says don't judge people. You're not supposed to do that shit. It's not your job. Everyone's doing their part to find, and that's how you get God. Go, fuck shit up and you'll find them.

Speaker 2: 59:39

You know what and I've said this before to people I think what goes on in religion Not not true Christianity or Christ followers, but I'll say this Charles had this burden. One of my favorite quotes that he he says is Is there are two types of Christians. There's missionaries and there's imposters. And I think what happens a lot of time in the church is we got people that are judging the world for being the world. You got people that are in there judging instead of going.

Speaker 2: 1:00:13

Look at me. What do I need to fix? How do I need to go out and be an example to other people and I tell people this all time I'd rather wear the soles of my shoes out, walking through the, the Back alleys and hanging out in bars, and I've led. I've led people to the Lord in a bar before. It's a great story, I'll tell you about it one day, one day, but I think I'd rather wear my soles of my shoes out than put splinters in my the, the backside of my jeans, because I'm sitting there going. I'm here, they're out there, you know I'm doing something, right? No, that's not what. That's not the attitude to have. Yeah, you got to be a missionary yourself, right?

Speaker 1: 1:01:01

It's not in books, it's you're found on the battlefield, you're gonna find you when you're doing and when you're out there in it and it's dirty and it's messy and it doesn't go according to the script and it doesn't always make sense. But one of my, one of my tools I use is I call it the epic tea, this compass it was a quote from epic tea, this that I've altered a little bit. It's that your circumstances, you know what is happening. That does not define you right. It reveals you to yourself. And we're in a time, right now, we're denial and truths are just.

Speaker 1: 1:01:36

It's an interesting battle. It's an interesting fight because the truth has become subjective. It's become my truth, hmm, it's turned into blame. Shame and judgment are the weapons to control the strong and break down the mighty. It has made it so that we will cancel, we will censor and we will teach you to self-censor by using you are bad shame. You should feel bad guilt. It's pride, you know you, it's pride, yeah, well, hmm, maybe I don't know if it's pride and maybe it's the definition for pride I have, maybe different than yours, and that's again the subjectivity of terminology, which is exactly language, also becomes part of the weaponry. Because if I say you're being disrespectful, well, my first question is is will please tell me what respect is, so I can know? And everyone gets stumped with that one right, because it's all different answers.

Speaker 2: 1:02:32

My definition of pride. Like you said, it's subjective, but I think what I what? When I say pride, I'm looking at it from a biblical standpoint, and in Proverbs it says these, these seven things the Lord hates, and, and eight is an abomination to him. And the very first one is a proud look when you think that you are so much better than somebody else and you're critiquing and judging them. I Think pride is underlying a sin of most sins that we commit is our own selfish pride.

Speaker 1: 1:03:05

That's an interesting terminology, because I'm fucking proud of you for the work you've done.

Speaker 2: 1:03:09

Well, that's, that's different. Now I will tell you what I tell everybody else. I got to give him all the glory. I'm just a best you see, that.

Speaker 1: 1:03:17

But you see, what I did is I used the same terminology to praise, not be ecotistical. I give, I give. I give appreciation and admiration to like the, the dedication that you've done, even in the name of God, absolutely, and many people. I'm proud. I'm proud of you, steve, like you go into the fray, I see another warrior in front of me and I'm honored and proud to stand next to you and say let's go ahead and work out these Difficult conversations for people who haven't gone this far yet. Right, maybe we can. We can help put a couple pieces that make the leap of faith not so fucking crazy for one person out there. Maybe that's what this conversation is and I'm proud. I'm proud to be able to stand next to you and protect your left as you protect my right, as I do Protect my right as we go through this conversation. I don't see that as necessarily the the nastiest of sins. That's why the terminology.

Speaker 1: 1:04:08

The terminology is important, because one word can mean something very different to another person. That's why I say I don't know if it's just that word. You would love the stuff that I do with my warriors. Last week we spent two hours trying to figure out what peace means. It's one word. We couldn't figure it out because I've got guys who have found absolute tranquility in the middle of combat and battle, like firefights, and they're like in the middle of bullets flying by my head and bombs going off. I was at total peace.

Speaker 2: 1:04:42

Things slow down, things slow down.

Speaker 1: 1:04:45

I was like the most peace I've ever felt was in combat. I've got cage fighters that were like when I was in there, I was at peace. I'm like well as peace only when the adrenaline dump is going crazy. Hmm, it seems like it was there, but then you also have that. I was in a meadow with sunflowers in the Near the woods and the breeze gave me in the in a butterfly, landed on my finger and I was at peace. You know like which one is it. Is it peace as the the we're not at war, or as peace within myself in the perspective of what it is around me? Right, you know. And so we got into a big conversation. That's just one word. I do this with multiple words respect, leadership, love, happiness. I'll let's break it down. These are this is why Me connecting my spirit and heart to you is complicated, because we are bigger than our bodies give us credit for.

Speaker 1: 1:05:36

This is this container bigger than this little head? Yeah, it's just to contain the emotions, the love, the connection, the camaraderie is bigger than like my frame and 510, but the way that I care about my warriors is bigger than a 510 dude right exactly, and you have to be that way when you say you got a prize.

Speaker 2: 1:05:57

I use this all the time you got to lead by example. That's the only way to lead. Um. You have to to put into work, you have to train your your own thought process, your own. You have to work on your own inner peace, whatever that may be, whatever brings you that piece. But then you go out and you lead Uh by example and that means you're not just running your mouth. I mean, there's a lot of people that come out here and they run their mouth, but they go and do something totally different when the camera's off. I had one of my, one of my admin guys. Uh has a motorcycle ministry as well and uh he has. He's become a great friend of mine. But before that guy joined uh my ministry, he watched me for six months, watched me for six months to see what I said and to see how I acted Before he came on. Now he calls me daily and says steve, is there's something I can do for you today? Tell me what you need to do.

Speaker 1: 1:06:59

You have been challenged for competency and found worthy right again, and while that technically would fall under judgment, this is required for men to have respect. I have judged that you are good. I have judged I can follow this leader. It is judgment, still again. These are why the terms for english or for language is. The problem is because it's the same thing. If I say like that's a good man, steve is a good man, that's a judgment. And yet we think judgment is only negative. It's not right. This is why pride you say pride is one of the. It's one of the deadly sins, if you will, if you go Dante's inferno or purgatory's and you get into like you know, the Seven deadly sins pride is one and you like, yeah, there's that.

Speaker 1: 1:07:46

But I'm proud of my family, I'm proud of you, I'm proud of my men, I'm proud of my daughters. I'm proud, and it's not because of ego, you know, or even to even say the ego element of me saying I've gone this far in my journey. You have gone through like areas of hell and have found the way through. You have traveled through darkness and found the path. You have done work. You're like oh, you think you're better. No, it is not ego, it's location. I just have gone further and this is why people will judge your journey. They'll say oh, you think you're better, steve, you think you're better. I'm like why are you? Why are you making that up for me? I'm just geographically in a different location.

Speaker 1: 1:08:29

Absolutely, and I've already been at your crossroads, so I know where you are.

Speaker 2: 1:08:32

That's not ego, that's understanding, right um, I tell you, I'm gonna tell you, a proud moment for me personally is, uh, I had someone reach out to me about a guy that was going through some uh, uh, some depression and everything, and I typically don't give my phone number out to people, because if I gave my phone number out to everybody it would shut down because of all the phone calls, right?

Speaker 2: 1:08:56

And so, uh, I, I said, fine, I'll give him my phone number, he calls me, and I started talking to him. And, and, rick, when I said, I heard the, the gun click on the phone. I heard him cock it and I and I had my kids with me that weekend and I was supposed to be taking them out to dinner. And I'm on the phone with this guy and um, he was an enforcer for, uh, an mc group I don't know if I should say exactly which one, but he'd been doing that for 30 years. And he kept saying how could god love me for all the things that I've done? Um, and I spent two hours with him and my son kept.

Speaker 2: 1:09:36

When I'm on the phone, I pace a lot, so I'm walking back and forth. You know I'm anxious, especially when you hear that, that kind of noise on the other end. And, um, my son kept coming in the kitchen, I kept putting my finger up going one more minute, buddy, just one more minute. And uh, two hours later I, I led this man to the lord and um, I just had this, this feeling of Finally, you know, uh, I'm sure we've all experienced it in some form or fashion. And I went up and hugged my son and, um, I'm gonna try not to get emotional about it.

Speaker 1: 1:10:16

Now you could do that here. We do that together, man um, I told him.

Speaker 2: 1:10:20

I said, um, thank you for being patient. And he said, dad, he says that man gonna be okay. And I said, I think so. I think he's gonna be all right. So we went to dinner and everything and I took him back to houston and, um, um, my ex, uh, their mother called me and we don't usually have this Really awesome relationship. Never have right, but you called me she said for a reason right.

Speaker 2: 1:10:49

She said uh, your son is so proud of you, he won't stop talking about it. I had to pull over Because I couldn't see anything, because that was a proud moment for me, um, that my son got to witness the compassion I have In the reason that I do what I do. Um, that was a proud, proud moment for me. Um, my dad always told me um, all it takes is one. All it takes is one to make it worth it. It's just like that ripple effect, that that you were talking about earlier. You and I may just be the rock thrown in, and who are we, man, what we do, and if we keep, uh, if we stay the course, that ripple effect is going to reach so many people. Um, I think it's a beautiful thing. We just got it. We just got to be the one to do it. You know what I mean.

Speaker 1: 1:11:47

Oh, I, I, I understand legacy, yes, and well, well done, man, way to go. I do those calls. I don't. None of my, I don't have any of my guys. Do those calls, right, um, and so those are difficult conversations.

Speaker 1: 1:12:00

I've had those three in the morning phone calls with you know, with, with my guy, with you know Smith and wesson, and with fucking jack daniels. We said we have those calls and, like I know what you're talking about, um, I want to give you a success story and I want you to be able to use it, hopefully in your own ministry, if you can. Okay, um, we, with those calls, I'm the only one who took them, too much liability, and so you can relate, too much liability, I want no other warrior to take that call. And, uh, I would have those calls, like maybe every week to two weeks. There'd be a guy who's like in because there's a lot of guys and you know, suicide is one of the biggest issues for our men because there's no hope, no purpose and I would have those calls.

Speaker 1: 1:12:46

One of my guys, one of the guys I, I pulled in, one of my guys who I every, just so you know, uh, my program it's it's a little expensive. But every single group or unit that I run, I do what I call skin in the game. Every guy has to put in. Well, some guys will fight like hell but don't have the money Right. So every single unit that I put together I pay for one.

Speaker 2: 1:13:09

Gotcha.

Speaker 1: 1:13:10

I say are you willing to fight? I'll pay your way. This is one guy's name is phil. Phil was injured. He's on disability. He had a, an accident that crushed the whole right side of his body, is right hand is immobile. It's just kind of flipper. We call it as flipper. Like his whole arm is just massive nerve damage. His leg was crushed. He was he's half his body is just rocked and he's permanently injured from this. He's damaged. Well, he was just on disability and tons of drugs, all kinds of medication. He just started liking our lives like crazy. He just kept showing up and kept being there for everybody and being a positive support. Couldn't afford shit.

Speaker 1: 1:13:45

So I put in for phil and phil, he's, he's his superpower, if you will, is he's just likeable. Doesn't seem like a, an ability that people would go like. Man, what a cool superpower, will ask any introvert. They'll fucking take that one. Yeah, just like you, I would like that like. So, all introvert so like please give me fills a bill, right? Phil's just likeable.

Speaker 1: 1:14:08

Well, phil, after, after my guys go through training with me, they're like how can I serve, how can I be of service? And I said, brother, it's time for you to do some work too. He's like I have an idea, can I just make a good nighttime group where the guy's like we don't have to train as hard as you train with us, we can just hang out and just have camaraderie and hang out Right? I said yeah, sounds good. And so what he did was whenever he was going to do a hey, who wants to hang out group, there was a gif of Elmo with the fire behind him, like I'm doing the Elmo like, and that means like come hang out as just boys hanging out Right, and it became known as the fellowship of the flaming Elmo Like. It became like this thing that like just went off the rails and it's where the guys come in and I don't care what they talk about. I'm we call trucks talking about fishing, talk about chicks, I don't care, just boys go, be boys together, and these sometimes go late. They hang out. They just hang and be two in the morning, three in the morning, that we hang in all night. Hmm, it's been over a year since Phil started doing that and I've got multiple guys now who run in there.

Speaker 1: 1:15:17

Since he started doing that, all of those suicide calls stopped. Hmm, because there's a place they belong, there's a place that they have purpose. There's a place they are loved. It's a place that they can work through. There's things with guys who have gone into battle with me, so they are proficient, right. It's a place where they, you know, somebody cares enough to listen, somebody like, believes in me. It's enough to create purpose, it's enough to create value, it's enough to create camaraderie. And now there's a reason for you to live. Since we created that group, these guys who are struggling. Even last night we had an emergency and there was four guys that showed up for this dude middle of the night. No, and since then we have had, I've had no need to do those calls with the guy next to the gun, because there is a Place he belongs, even in the middle of the night. Now, I don't know if you can use that for your ministry or your people, but it's not always me who has to be there. You guys, be there for your guys.

Speaker 2: 1:16:21

She's telling me how man and I assign responsibilities to some of the guys. I've got guys that Make the phone calls. They're good at talking to people and I'm not talking about those calls. I'm talking about when a guy says, hey, I'm going through something. Or or, hey, a guy's interested in joining the ministry. Those are my guys that are good with talking about people, getting to know people, and then they report back. Okay, um, I've had too many times that people just wanted to attach their name to you and and you've probably done the same, um, but they're not there for the right motives. They just think it's cool to, to hang out with you, you know. Or or say, oh, I'm a part of the band of outlaws or the warriors way or whatever, Um they weed themselves out.

Speaker 2: 1:17:05

They do, they do, but we, we, uh, we have started setting up a time of fellowship with guys and you're right, I've seen less and less of guys approaching me directly Um about certain situations, because they know they can rely on their brothers to help them out too. Um. But you want to go back to suicide, um, and you said you take those phone calls. Um, I have, I have been successful on a lot of phone calls, but what keeps me going, what I do? And and you brought up suicide rates among men. Guys, my age, your age, um 80 percent um Suicide rate, and I think a lot of it comes down to men have lost their purpose. They've lost this um Ability to feel like they are um Giving to a society. You see it, with the way the women treat us and I'm not saying us, I'm saying as a whole I have a beautiful lady I don't but uh, you're

Speaker 2: 1:18:14

right, but as a society, right. So, and I think I read, um May, I can't remember the book, but one thing I read was the best way to defeat a nation is take away its uh most uh valuable um Protection, which is men. Let's just face it. Uh, if we don't have strong men with strong values, then we're just going to be shifting around in the wind and not really know what we should do, instead of staying in firm and what we do. So that's why I see, I believe, suicide rates are as high as they are, because we've lost our purpose.

Speaker 1: 1:18:48

Um, I agree, but like you, just me going what keeps me going is um.

Speaker 2: 1:18:53

41 times over the last three years I was not successful on one of those phone calls and I know each and every one of us know at least one or two. I've dealt with rick. I've dealt with 41 Um. There's been times I could do nothing but look out a window and cry. I couldn't move.

Speaker 2: 1:19:12

And at that point you start blaming yourself. But it's not your fault, it's. It's, it's just that you give in everything you can and it really, it really just uh and uh, sarah, my beautiful lady, uh, she called me and she said what are you doing? And I said well, I'm, I'm sitting here looking out the window and I went and to explain him why she goes. I want you to do me a favor. I said what's that? She goes, go outside, take your shoes off and just go, sit outside and and put your feet in the grass and just sit down. Yeah and uh, it really. It really helped ease my soul because those are never Hard phone or easy phone calls to take, um, and so that's what keeps me going, because I do think about that every day. Every day I think about man, I salute you.

Speaker 1: 1:20:02

Warrior to warrior man, those are heavy. It's a heavy toll to carry and it's a tough burden of leadership that most will never understand. And even though technically, technically, logically, it's not your fault, it's difficult to carry the burden of like I was the last call and I couldn't do it. You know, like I wasn't, I wasn't able to save that one and we feel responsible, even though it took, you know, 30, 40 years for that decision to come into fruition and you were there for only you know a blip of the entire uh, you know Creation of that outcome. Right, it's tough because you feel like it should have been able.

Speaker 1: 1:20:40

I should have, I should have, and this is again where, um, learning how to Tactically grieve is a skill and I teach it because people talk about it and they give answers but not solutions, and I say it deliberately that way. What you have to go through is fucking heavy and people want to tell you how you should do things. It's like don't disregard the warrior, he's in a fray and you and you try to grab a guy and like it's those parts in the movie where you're you try to help Women, his glove slips off and he falls and you're like no, if only my grip was stronger.

Speaker 1: 1:21:16

It's like no, it was the glove it was the circumstances, he was over the cliff before you got there, right, you know. And so we try to hold ourselves accountable for things that are, and learning radical acceptance through grief, especially denial bargaining is probably a really big one. You have the bargaining element of if I could have done this, and if only this, and if only I would have known, and if only I could have been more available. If only I, if only, if only. It's a heavy one, and then the guilt and the doubt and the shame, the depression element, the anger and the, the injustice and the unfairness to it all. There's, um, there's a lot that we have to carry as men and in a world right now where there is a low empathy for a guy who's in the fray, it makes it an even heavier burden to carry because they can't look at you and go like, well, whatever, not your problem, you're like you don't get it.

Speaker 1: 1:22:14

You've never had to hold the burden. It's atlas is burden. You don't understand. The world is on my shoulders. And who do you work with? Who can understand, except for those who have actually gone into that level of hell?

Speaker 2: 1:22:25

I see you bro, you're fucking awesome man you know, in in society, society does put a lot of shame on you too. Um, you I'm sure you get this a lot too, where you feel like people want you to be, uh, readily available for whenever they need you and you never hear from I'll try until, yes, they try until they need something. Um, just the other day I had a guy that sent me a message and all it said was hello. And because I didn't respond, in 10 minutes I get another message that says that's okay, I've given up on myself too. So what is he trying to do to me? He's trying to make me feel guilty, because I'm dealing with a million things, but I didn't take the time to spend it.

Speaker 1: 1:23:14

No, it has nothing to do with you at all With him. It has nothing to do with even one thing you're doing. What he's trying to do is allocate accountability for his decisions onto you.

Speaker 2: 1:23:26

Yes.

Speaker 1: 1:23:29

It is now. My problem is your fault, because you didn't do what I wanted you to do, and this is most likely a sin of the mother. Usually, when I'm working with those curses, it's a very emotional thing. It's very manipulative, very starts falling into narcissism and I don't use that lightly. It goes into I shall allocate all of the shame, blame and judgment onto you. You should feel bad. You should give me all your time, your energy, and I will make you feel terrible if you don't do it, and so I shall bleed you dry. I shall take everything from you that I can. It will never be good enough, and then, once you're completely depleted, I'll tell you how you never could have helped me in the first place, and then I'll put the rest on somebody else. That's the type of behavior that you start seeing and you go hold on man Like I have an armor and a defense against these types of behavior, because I understand those aren't mine Right.

Speaker 1: 1:24:27

And if you use blame, shame judgment or even guilt.

Speaker 2: 1:24:31

Or they call you up and they say I love you, but you're doing this, this, this and this and this wrong because it isn't what I wanted. How are you gonna tell me you love me and support me and then tell me how I've let you down?

Speaker 1: 1:24:47

I'll accept. I'll accept. This may be how you love, but it doesn't mean that I agree with how you love.

Speaker 2: 1:24:52

Yeah, there's been times that I and I don't know if you've ever experienced this, but because of the conversation you've had with somebody, your attitude towards the people around you after you get off that phone call has shifted, and now you're not giving them a part of what they need from you.

Speaker 1: 1:25:15

Yes, I mean this is because, this is why when I say I see you, it's not like avatar, like I see you, like you know, like this is where, like no, I know what you're doing. I go in there too, and it's not common to find a guy who really does it. There's people who say they do, especially in the religion world. They say they do it but they don't do it. And so, no, I see you. And yes, remember when I said I take on the mountain. That when you talk about purpose and this is just for any guy who's listening I need my purpose. I need my purpose when I talk to another man who has found his purpose. God does not ask easy things. That's how I know you found it, as you have a job that you're like. I didn't necessarily want that job. When God tells you and I to go in, for me it's gather mountains, because to God, my mountains are a grain of sand to him. So give them to God. He's happy to take those.

Speaker 1: 1:26:11

Well, what do we have to do? I have to go into your nightmares. I have to go into your suicidal thoughts. I have to go into your traumas. I have to go into your PTSD. I have to go into your molestation. I have to go into your rapes. I have to go into your abuse. I have to go into your abandonment. I have to go into the neglect. I have to go into all of the things that created the defenses that you have now, which is a defense created as a child. So here you are with your cast iron. You know, skillet duct tape to a piece of fucking driftwood, and this is an armor you created when you were eight years old. And now you're a grown ass man still wearing your armor from when you were an eight year old.

Speaker 2: 1:26:48

And it doesn't fit anymore. It doesn't fit anymore.

Speaker 1: 1:26:50

It doesn't fit anymore it doesn't even work, you know, and so we call it protection, but it starts to mimic more of a prison where you block out all emotion, block out all pain, block out all sorrow. I bar the window so I can't be hurt ever again. And if you ever want to get close to me, steve, if you ever want to say something nice to me, you got to go through the metal detectors, the lie detector test. You got to get the pat down. We got to, we got to. You know, put you in the waiting room. You're going to talk to me through the glass window, through the phone, and then you can tell me something nice, then you can tell me you love me and I'm like it's kind of weird that this protection system sounds a lot like prison man.

Speaker 2: 1:27:28

It is, it is.

Speaker 1: 1:27:31

And yet we call ourselves safe and secure.

Speaker 2: 1:27:34

It's the fear of being vulnerable. It's weird a lot.

Speaker 1: 1:27:37

Of course, but that's how you find camaraderie and you find strength and you find love and you find yourself, you reveal yourself to you and so I see you, I see you warrior, I see you go into the fray and I see you. And I don't think a lot of people will get it, even listening to this. It's nice to hear, but they don't understand, they know of but don't know Right. And there's people who think they are this, but they they aren't. And that's not a judgment, it's an observation, it's location.

Speaker 2: 1:28:08

You don't go in there.

Speaker 1: 1:28:09

Well, I read the book, I'm like that's not the same thing. It's not the same.

Speaker 2: 1:28:16

You read the book, but did you apply the, the, the practice? Did you apply the principle?

Speaker 1: 1:28:21

Yeah, I read all about Dallas and so I know all the facts. I'm like have you ever been there? I'm like, no, I'm like then you don't get it.

Speaker 2: 1:28:28

Dallas is. I may get a lot of hate for this, but I worked in Dallas in the design district for five years I I would rather drive through Fort Worth any day than Dallas ever get.

Speaker 1: 1:28:42

And you get it yes.

Speaker 2: 1:28:47

Oh man, dallas is. It can be very pretentious at times.

Speaker 1: 1:28:53

And places just as they are. And so, man, I'm with you. I think that I see what you're doing. There's a the God. The God element of things is very lost today on church and religion. And on my, my, my spirit side group, I have a guy who's a doctorate in theology and a guy who was a pastor with of dead sea squirrels, hebrews seas, he was a minister of. So I have very qualified guys and both of them have church wounds and they're both like no, we are the church. A congregation of brothers is the church. We don't need a building for this, because people will use God, and this is one of the things I've talked about. Is men of God or are you a man of God or are you a man who uses God? And people will use God to say you should tithe to me, you should give me more, you should act this way, you should, you should, you should, you should watch the shoulds, because it's like it's not about the shoulds.

Speaker 2: 1:29:50

You know it's funny. You say that because and this leads to my point here the only time Jesus ever showed his anger was when his father's house wasn't being used properly and he called it in things because they were selling things in the church. Kind of reminds me today, when you go into these big mega churches, and they got a Starbucks in the front, they got a bookstore over here. What's the difference between between that and what Jesus was upset about?

Speaker 1: 1:30:19

That's a good question.

Speaker 2: 1:30:20

I don't want to answer that.

Speaker 1: 1:30:21

I like the coffee.

Speaker 2: 1:30:26

I do too but you know a lot of people ask me that question all the time, steve, how can we, can we give to your ministry? And why don't you ever preach on tithing? Well, here's the way I look at it. I think Old Testament law was done away in the New Testament. It was a fulfillment from Christ on of Old Testament law.

Speaker 2: 1:30:51

But the Bible says that the Lord loves a fearful giver, right? He didn't say what percentage you have to give, right, and I tell them all the time it is my responsibility as a leader to pray that God supplies my needs. That's what he commands me to do. It is not my responsibility to do and come out and say I need this much, this much. No, it's your responsibility to listen to God, to listen to the conviction and the Holy Spirit. Because if I'm doing what I'm supposed to be doing, whether you give me money or not, it's not my job to ask you. My job is to ask God to supply my needs and he will do it. If you listen, if you felt led to do that, you will do that. But it's not my job to go out here and go. Hey, I'm going to go do some battles on TikTok, because I've got this going on and I never done that Sorry, was that too soon.

Speaker 1: 1:31:52

Listen, I've seen it one time my baby. She showed me she's like here's what a battle is. I didn't know what it was. And these people are just yelling at people and they send them money for screaming Like come on, come on. And you're like, what is baby, what's going on? Because we just went live and did deep work, psychology to help people out of hell and I got like fucking 10 bucks. That person just got like $10,000 for just going. Come on, come on, come on. I am missing something here. What is it?

Speaker 2: 1:32:24

Bro, I've been so sweaty after one of my, one of my devotion series or something like that, where I just felt like I was on fire and I'd need to go take a shower and I got $2.54. I'm like what's going on, yay. But you know I don't put my faith in that anymore and I don't look to that anymore. I'll tell you a story one time and it may sound insignificant but it really played a huge role in my faith. I told you I gave up a lot to go into the ministry and if you're doing it for the right reasons, it is not a very financially successful thing and I used my dad's. I made more money than my dad did when I was 12 years old. My dad wasn't in it for the money, right, but I needed about $200 one time to pay these bills by the end of the week. And here we are, friday, right.

Speaker 2: 1:33:22

And I remember I was about to go live and I went down to the store to get a coffee and I was in my vehicle and I said, god, you promise me, you promise me, if I did this, you would take care of me. You promise me. And I didn't say another word, I just drove back and I and I got on my live, did my my whole series in the morning and after I got off my live, my cash app started going ding, ding, ding, ding and it was exactly $206.35. And, mind you, I needed $200. I'd never said anything to anybody else, so to me it's like I didn't have to say that. I just had a conversation with him and he knew exactly where my heart was. I wasn't going to go ahead and do it regardless, and he gave me enough to pay my bills and enough to buy a cheeseburger. So not only do you provide, he also fed me.

Speaker 1: 1:34:23

So I got a water burger.

Speaker 2: 1:34:26

That was a water burger.

Speaker 1: 1:34:29

That's a good story, man, that's a good story and, like, I see a lot of the faith element of things where people think they're using God. No, just gotta, you gotta let them drive a little, and I think God gives opportunities. I don't think he gives deposits.

Speaker 1: 1:34:43

Right, I think he gives you a chance to do the right things. And so people wait for God to answer the prayers the way that they think he should. And I'm like that's not the game. I believe the game's free will. I believe it is. I believe that's the one thing that he created to separate us from other things. And so when you pray, he's going to give you the thing, that gives you the thing. So it'll be in free will, it'll be in choice, it'll be opportunity Right.

Speaker 1: 1:35:07

And so I fucked around last year. I prayed for wisdom. I wanted to be a good leader. I prayed for wisdom. I have an organization that's growing. It's doing very well, the things are doing well. So I prayed for wisdom. God lead me the way. And God's like all right, you want some wisdom, I'll give it to you. And so I hired some guys and I hired some stuff, and I hired some people who were like we're going to do some big things, do some big things, and they, they didn't work out, they didn't, they didn't fulfill their end. It wasn't piecing together, it was kind of not working, and I lost probably close to six figures on trying to get this group to work. I lost a lot of leads. A lot of good men fell to the wayside. A lot of bad, bad stuff happened, poor leadership on my side and I'm like what the heck God he's like.

Speaker 2: 1:35:50

You wanted wisdom, you're going to learn Nothing teaches you faster than losing You're going to learn, you're going to learn your ass kicked teaches you way faster than winning.

Speaker 1: 1:36:00

So you wanted wisdom, triple XP. I'm going to have your stuff all get screwed up. And you know what? It leveled my leadership quick because I'm like I could never do that again. And so now my, my group runs strong, but I couldn't do what I was doing then. It was very expensive, but I prayed for wisdom.

Speaker 2: 1:36:18

You pray for understanding. That's why I never pray for patience.

Speaker 1: 1:36:22

People, you'll give you what you need, for I want understanding. God, give me understanding. He's like get ready to be in some stuff you don't understand. Then Exactly.

Speaker 1: 1:36:31

Because this will give you a chance to practice. He's like you know what I want, god? I want more money. I want more money. He's like guess what? I'm going to send you a whole bunch of job offers, but you know, your, your greatest ability is going to need to be availability, because you can't keep doing what you used to do to get the new money. So you're going to need to maybe move or you're going to need to get a different job. You're going to need to do something new skill or new ability. But the opportunities will start showing up and you're like no, I wanted to deposit. He's like no, I give you opportunity.

Speaker 1: 1:36:58

Right so he shows up in these weird ways. It's just not the way we want it to be, like we fucking know Like it'll show up in free will, it'll show up in a choice or an opportunity. Now, this is why it's hard is because some of the things that we think that we want from God come in through pleasure and who else plays in pleasure.

Speaker 2: 1:37:24

That smooth looking.

Speaker 1: 1:37:25

George. I mean, who is going to be like hey man, you've been reading the Bible. I me too. I love that thing. You want to come and hang out with Charles?

Speaker 2: 1:37:36

Right, oh man, it goes back to uh.

Speaker 2: 1:37:40

I just thought of something, um, uh, when we were talking about pride. Um, and once again, what I used to do for a career was wrapped up in a lot of my pride. Right, uh, there was. There was no one that was better at metalworks than I was. I could walk in and I could compete with any dude. Right, you'd say I can't build it. I'm going to show you I can build it.

Speaker 2: 1:38:04

Um, and so when I was being led to ministry work, a lot of the jobs that I would normally take on, they started falling away. Right, it wasn't about. It's almost like I said huh, let's see how, how, how much I'm going to be able to do this, how much you believe about this surrender word, right, and um, I built, I make custom knives, um, and, and I do ministry full time. I use the knives now so that I can continue doing full ministry. Um, it's it's a side project and it helps fund me to be able to do this full time.

Speaker 2: 1:38:39

I also take on some, some, uh, different clients, uh, designers that asked me to build, you know, some custom metalwork, but I tell every one of them the ministry comes first. Um, so it may take me a little longer, but you're going to be happy with the product. Um, and I think it was a reverse of of what I was building before to what now I'm building, because it's all to do with the ministry work, it's all to glorify God now versus glorify Steve. And so I think, anytime that we go to do something, uh, if we place, um, the reasoning or motive behind doing a certain thing, he's going to honor it, he's going to glorify it, he's got to have your motive right.

Speaker 1: 1:39:23

I love that dude. You want to hear something cool, to kind of go along with that. What's that? In the Warriors way, as as we train together we do really amazing things. You can see, my code name is the curse breaker, because I'll come in and help you. This Feet like I can still show you how to beat that worthiness and that doubt. I can show you in five minutes.

Speaker 1: 1:39:40

I'll teach you. You can take it to your guys, I'll show you how it works and beat it very quickly. That's how I got my code name. I would code name you blacksmith, why? Because not not just because of the iron work, not because you can build, but you build the tools, you build the weapon, or I'd be like Hephaestus or something. It'd be some sort of like you build the tools, you build the weapons, but not just. That is because you are. You are the, the, the wielder of something solid, something versatile, something useful, something powerful, something stable. You are the one who can and bend metal to your will, but make it so that people's foundations and their armor and their, their strength is capable, solid, useful and competent. You are unique, creative, powerful, and this is something we're being like. You know a code name and what we do is just it's an honor to be able to see another guy skill yeah you be.

Speaker 1: 1:40:37

That'd be code name, or code name like Hephaestus, the armorer of the gods, like you know.

Speaker 2: 1:40:43

You know what's funny is I was commissioned to build a, a lady, the full armor of God, right and Right now I'm building everything Toward period, right where it would look like when the Apostle Paul wrote about the armor of God. He was chained to a Roman soldier right like a gladiator style dude, so everything that the Romans in those days they use short swords for close hand-to-hand combat. So this, I saw it. I saw it. I Could make you one dude.

Speaker 1: 1:41:21

Please, bro, threaten me with a good time. I would be honored.

Speaker 2: 1:41:25

I made it. I made a broadband sword. It was probably the most difficult thing I've ever done, but I had someone reach out and say, steve, I want this, this sword, and it was 36 inches long. It was like Conan the Barbarian dude, this thing had some weight behind it and she, she hung it up on our wall. So I love doing that. I love that creative side of doing things like that. But I want to make it authentic. I want it to repers.

Speaker 2: 1:41:50

I I'm an architecture guy. I like old-school stuff. I like most of the stuff I do is by hand because I sold all my tools, but I Love stuff like that. So as far as the armor got commissioned piece, I've already got the shield. I've already got the helmet. The helmet sick. It actually fits nicely and I'm still finishing up the sword. But I love doing stuff like that. But now it's it's about priorities. Where am I placing the ability, the, the talents that God's given me? Is it? Is it to increase what he's called me to do or is it to Make Steve feel good about himself? I'd rather use it to to keep doing what I'm called to do versus being boastful about it.

Speaker 1: 1:42:47

Well, I think there can still be honor and what it is that you do, but you're building the armor of God for people all the time.

Speaker 2: 1:42:54

Yeah, it's not a commission thing it's.

Speaker 1: 1:42:56

What you're calling is, and here you are helping guys and people who don't have protection against the attacks of anxiety and depression and suicide and fear and Doubt and all of these pieces. You're helping them build a defense that gets them through difficult times so they can sort of their purpose this is.

Speaker 2: 1:43:18

I know this will be relatable to you too, because, look, I can build the armor, I can give you all the tools, but you still got to put it on. I can't, I can't force you to put it on you. I've got. I've got so many people that have said to me before I still feel this way or I'm still having this trouble in my life why I've given you the tools. It's it's not my responsibility to put it on you. You've got to take the initiative to put these tools into practice. I Can just show you the results of what's gonna happen if you use it.

Speaker 1: 1:43:56

Yep, if I'm coming to hell to get you, I'm not carrying you out. Put your shoes on.

Speaker 2: 1:44:01

Exactly.

Speaker 1: 1:44:02

I'll show you. I'll show you the way. I'll show you the way. If you choose to not come, that's you. Yeah, dude, it's cool. You want it? You want to kill something together real quick? Well, I do this often and anybody's heard other shows. We've done it. Okay, like I'll, let's tackle that worthiness for people, that thing. We're like I don't know if I feel qualified or worthy of this thing.

Speaker 2: 1:44:27

You know what I know, I know, I know that I'm worthy. It's just that initial thought of am I, am I prepared to go to the next level?

Speaker 1: 1:44:38

Shut up, steve.

Speaker 1: 1:44:39

All right so let's do it. I'll do that. I might prepare to go to the next level. Am I good enough? Am I whatever? Let's just let's just help people real quick. When you can identify just doubt by itself. Now be aware too, because a lot of the curses that come in are combined, so like doubt plus fear is insecurity, or doubt plus bargaining starts creating some sort of a Compound, complex, not good enough denial protection system. So it gets complex. Let's just stick with what doubt is. I'm not good enough, I'm not worthy, I don't deserve, I'm not tall enough, smart enough, cool enough, talented enough, have enough likes, whatever it is.

Speaker 1: 1:45:16

The definition for doubt is that doubt offers nothing and takes from you everything. That's how it works. Now, this isn't the devil, this is just a seed. It's not the devil. Getting you think is somebody can just cast judgment. You're not good enough. That'll never work. That idea is stupid, steve. You can't do that. That's a dumb, that's a scam. Right like people will throw judgment around and put doubt in. Now, it's just a seed. It doesn't do shit by itself. Sometimes, if it lands on concrete means nothing. If it lands in fertile soil, though, that's you Right. And so doubt offers nothing. It takes from you everything.

Speaker 1: 1:45:53

I'm not good enough. The way that you beat it is you have to catch and challenge the offer. You say I'm not good enough. What's your offer? Is there an improvement? Is there a new opportunity? Is there some better way to do it? Is there you know any any way that I can Make this useful, like teach me, offer right and I'm like well, if the offer is you're not good enough, what? What's? On the one hand, well, if I go for this, I have the ability to connect with another warrior. I have the ability to create fulfillment, help other people out of their difficult times, let people know I exist so I can have their back. There's so much purpose and potential and opportunity. If I go for it, or you're not good enough, well, what's the offer if you're not good enough? Well, there is no offer. Is just you're not good enough. There's nothing. You don't do anything like nothing happens. You just nothing. You're like stagnant water smart enough?

Speaker 1: 1:46:54

You're not. It's not that when nothing happens, well, the free will, is the game right. So you still have to pick one. So you're gonna go with potential and fulfillment and possibility and your purpose, or are you gonna go with nothing? Please choose. Which do you choose, steve? I?

Speaker 2: 1:47:15

I choose to move forward.

Speaker 1: 1:47:18

Right, if I'm gonna fall, I'm gonna fall forward right.

Speaker 1: 1:47:22

Well, they don't catch the offer and that's why people quit. Right, that's why people bail, that's why people think they have to get out is cuz, like you're, that'll never work. Right, what's the offer? I didn't, I didn't make an offer, I just said it's not gonna work. I'm like, so you don't have like an improvement or a better way or anything. It's just you said that won't work. Well, that's a scam. Okay, do you have a better way to do it? Well, no, I just think it's a scam. I'm like so you got nothing. You have no offer. Okay, if you can start catching that judgments and these offers for nothing, what they are, doubt offers you nothing at all, but it wants to take your dreams, your vision, your purpose, your love, your, your compassion, your empathy, everything, everything you have. It wants all of it. But it's not the devil. This can just be a seed. Hmm, he's not around doing this, because once you rip the root out, you're like I declined that offer and then it means nothing, because that's what it was, the whole time Right.

Speaker 1: 1:48:22

and so if someone goes like I don't know if I can do it, I don't know if I'm good enough, steve, you're like well, what's the offer? Well, what do you mean? Well, what are you gonna choose if you believe you can't do it? Well, well, nothing, I'm like okay. Or you can have a whole lot of everything like which one do you want right? Absolutely challenge the offer. If you realize this, it's just it. The simplicity becomes genius when it comes to breaking these curses right.

Speaker 1: 1:48:47

Who cares? Who was on my show before I get time with you today and I salute you as a fellow warrior.

Speaker 2: 1:48:54

Well, I appreciate the opportunity. I Honestly do appreciate the opportunity. This is something that I believe my ministry is leading to. Like I said, more speaking engagements, more podcast, and I've always prayed about that. And then, all of a sudden, I get this message from you and I'm going what? Let me go check this dude out. I see Dwayne Noel on there.

Speaker 2: 1:49:18

I'm like, oh my god, I look up to this guy, you know, but it was, it's, it's something that I'm prepared to do. I think it just it was that initial of okay, you've been asking for this, are you ready? You know, and and I got to tell you before I got on on the live with you or the show with you, I was sitting here going we're gonna smoke this. I know we're gonna smoke this. I don't know what, even what I was worried about. It's gonna be so fun, we're gonna chill and you know it really comes. There's a difference and you can tell me this to be true there's a difference between being confident and being cocky. I Don't I don't have to show it from the outside anymore where my confidence comes from.

Speaker 1: 1:50:02

Well, it's because you're competent.

Speaker 2: 1:50:04

And that's the difference.

Speaker 1: 1:50:05

And when cockiness is a judgment, competency is a skill right, I can do what I say, but you say no, I'm, I'm really fucking good at metal work. That's that's location, that's I'm this good, I know right level right. You know. And so, even with the what, what people will judge, and this is the weapons, these are the weapons. You're cocky, that's a judgment because someone who doesn't understand. But I also know that anything over 225 is going to be impossible to them. So right hundred means nothing right.

Speaker 1: 1:50:39

So it's fine, you can call me any name that you want. What is your offer?

Speaker 2: 1:50:44

Right, exactly, hey. It leads me to a story when I was a young kid and I first learned how to weld. Everybody in this manufacturing plant hated this guy. He was not the coolest dude to hang out with. He was rude to people, he didn't talk nice to people at all. And he came up to me one day and he goes hey, man, I've seen your work ethic. He goes you want to learn a trade? And I said what? And he goes you want to learn how to weld? I Said yeah, and he goes alright, you start on my department on Monday and people told me I would have like a week with this guy before he ran me off and I'm like no watch, I'm gonna change him, you know, cuz I was the clown dude. I was a clown back then. I would just love to making people laugh and do stupid stuff. And so, after working with this guy and he taught me so much of the fundamentals of what I did, I actually took over his department and that department was first articles and prototypes.

Speaker 2: 1:51:41

When the Companies that we built for, which were Peterbilt trucks, nova buses, some military vehicles and stuff like that, I built the very first one and then, once it passed inspection. Then I made jigs for welders to mass produce these. And I'd have these guys that been in welding for years and years. And here I am, a 22 year old punk, right, and I'm their boss and I'm over like 500 welders. And I used to have these guys come up to me, go Well, we used to not do it like that at my own job and blah, blah, blah, just start running their mouth and I'd say you know what, until you can do it better and faster than I can, we're gonna do it my way and I'm all open to suggestions. If you've got a new way for me to put into practice, I'll listen to it. But until then, until you can actually beat me at what I do, this is my job, your job is by the hour. But I was cocky back then. But that also was confidence in my capabilities.

Speaker 1: 1:52:45

What could you? Could you do it?

Speaker 2: 1:52:48

Could I do?

Speaker 1: 1:52:48

it, oh yeah absolutely I. Used and you were competent.

Speaker 2: 1:52:53

I used to. It used to take me I used to build these light fixtures for these a tank truck haulers and I could weld one solid out in three minutes, aluminum Welded out in three minutes. And then later on, a guy that I created a business with. He now has a 50,000 square foot showroom and I go visiting from time to time Because we started out in a dairy barn right and now he has the 50,000 square foot manufacturing facility and we go hang out. He's still got old pictures of me when I was a young punk kid fishing on boats and and all kinds of stuff. But he has a robotic welder now and he I watched one of this this robot weld out the same boxes that I used to weld out in a dairy barn and I said, how long did it take to weld that out?

Speaker 2: 1:53:44

For that robot? He goes about six and a half minutes. And I said, and I used to do it in three and he goes yeah, but I didn't have to pay insurance, I didn't have to put all the other stuff at the manpower like I did with you. But one of our most successful years is we had three guys and we worked and worked and we we made about two million dollars in profit in one year, just three employees and now he has this 50,000 square foot place and he's got a multitude of people and he still goes. That was my most successful year. I mean bottom dollar. That was my most successful year because you can do so much with a guy that can do 10 things, then you can't can with a guy that can only do one thing.

Speaker 1: 1:54:32

That's the way I look at competency I.

Speaker 2: 1:54:35

Would. I'm like you. I want to build. I want to build an army Around me with guys that are like-minded, like myself, like yourself. And I refer back to what DL moody again another Very influential evangelist. He said the world is yet to see what one man can do who is totally on fire for God. And I tell my guys all the time I want 50 of you. I want that. That quote sits on my mirror, I look at it every day. The world is yet to see what one guy can do who is totally on fire for God. I need 50 guys, just like that. I.

Speaker 1: 1:55:14

Think that the legacy we leave behind is going to ripple through generations.

Speaker 2: 1:55:20

Pretty awesome, steve what we do here echoes an eternity right.

Speaker 1: 1:55:26

Yeah, yeah, I see you, maximus.

Speaker 2: 1:55:32

What we do in the life, probably one of the best movies ever made.

Speaker 1: 1:55:37

It's tough movie, man, it's tough movie. It's pretty awesome, man, I'm gonna. I'm gonna concur with you. I do lean, remember I went deep philosophy, so even stoicism, for Marcus Aurelius's memoirs. He was king of Rome at the height of Rome, before you know, the plagues hit and he, he said, even though I may be king, if you can give me better information, I reserve the right to change my mind, and this is something that I do with my men also. My program has gotten nothing but stronger, because I believe a good idea can come from anybody, right, so my ego doesn't get in the way of. That's really good. We can use that right now and make things better, right? I think it shows also competency in your leadership, and I think that you know, when I get to meet guys like you, I find it highly honorable, because people like you are worth following.

Speaker 2: 1:56:27

Well, thank you so much, and I appreciate that I teach my guys some of the same philosophy, that it goes along the same lines. I tell them there's three things a man should live by. One is have a king's mindset, that that that goes to how you Express yourself, how you carry yourself when you walk into a room. You need to command respect. You need to. The most of the most influential kings that I can remember were people are kings that loved the people. They loved taking care of the kingdom and the people. They weren't dictators, they weren't tyrants, they were kings and people loved their king right? The next thing is have a servant's heart. Most kings were servants of the people, but you have to have an attitude of service to other people. You're not too good to take on that responsibility. And then the last thing is leave the judge into God. That's it.

Speaker 1: 1:57:29

I Love them. I concur with those. I can. I can, I can live with those ones. Those ones sound good to me, right? All right, steve, it's an honor we got to get out of here in a second, absolutely, anyway, we can. We can lead people to your ministry. If you had a request from God a 200 dollars that you need for your next level what would the request be and how can people get in touch with you?

Speaker 2: 1:57:53

man. Well, I'm on several different platforms, but most of the things that I do are on a tick tock. At the moment it's just under my name. I didn't make up some fancy name, I just used my regular government name. I wasn't cool enough to come up with something, you know. But if you do a Google search on me, all that's going to pull up as a director of Homeland Security, which we can, and I have the same name, which is a cool thing for me. But, yeah, you can get in touch with me on a tick tock.

Speaker 2: 1:58:28

Oh, it's the band of outlaws ministry. Like I said, we're in the process this year of a turning into a nonprofit outreach ministry of legal, by Legal standards anyway. We've been doing this a while now. It's time to branch out and do more, and to do that we need more participation, right, you, it takes funding that type of thing, but I do a live every Monday through Friday, 10 am In the morning. I had someone fill in for me this morning, which is cool that I've got guys now that will fill in for me, right, so I could be on a podcast with Rick Yee, but I do that money through Friday and Sunday.

Speaker 2: 1:59:13

We do what we call as interview with an outlaw, where my guys get to come up and tell their testimony, tell their story and and we turn the chats off. There's no one that can comment because it's kind of like a one-on-one, like what you and I are doing. And then Tuesday night we do a prayer live where people come in and we pray for their request right on the spot. Wednesday night I do a Question and answer session. So yeah, I go live about 11 times a week.

Speaker 1: 1:59:47

It's busy man. Jumping subscribe to Subscribes. Subscribe to Steve. Jump on, interact, get involved, donate, do whatever you need to do. Well, like, I think they need to plug in with you and so check you out. I like the band of outlaws with a Z.

Speaker 2: 2:00:04

Yeah, what does he cuz? This is reserved with a Z.

Speaker 1: 2:00:08

Yep With the Z ministry like subscribe, jump in, get involved and it's an honor, steve. Thank you so much for the time, brother.

Speaker 2: 2:00:22

Thank you too. I appreciate it right.