The Beauty of Saying "Yes" to Life and Leaving the Cubicle Behind | with Kayla Ihrig

Key Takeaways:

-  What is your excuse for not being who you want to be?

- Big dreams are possible, when you take small bites at a time.

- “If you want to slow the rate at which sand slips through life’s hourglass, have as many new experiences as possible”- How To Be A Digital Nomad..., Kayla Ihrig

Have you ever looked around you and realized that the path you're on isn't the one you dreamed of? It's a moment that can shake up your world, and it did just that for our latest guest, Kayla Ihrig, a digital nomad and author who traded the predictability of a traditional career for the open road and remote work. Together, we peel back the veneer of societal expectations, sharing the raw emotions and fears that come with making such a profound life shift.

Journeys aren't just about the miles traveled, but the internal distances we cover as we seek purpose and passion in our lives. Whether it's navigating healthcare in a foreign tongue or finding joy in the simplicity of the moment, Kayla and I explore what it means to truly live with intention. Kayla's  anecdotes from the Netherlands to Guatemala and beyond are a testament to the richness of experiences that shapes her existence.

If the call of the horizon tugs at you or the thought of a cubicle feels like a cage, let this conversation be your nudge towards a world of possibilities. Learn from our insights on how to take the first steps on your journey, overcome the paralysis of fear, and invite adventure into your life with open arms. There's a childlike wonder in embracing life's tapestry of experiences, and in this episode, we share the beauty of saying "yes" to life's invitations. Join us and maybe, just maybe, you'll find the courage to reach for the stars in your own universe of dreams.

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Transcript

Kertia: 0:00

I know we often cover some heavy stuff on this podcast, but today we're keeping it light and easy. I'm , author of how to Be a Digital Nomad, which was just released a few days ago on January 30th and we're talking about, of course, her journey as a digital nomad and, as you know, we often say that the possibilities on the other side of fear are limitless. And although, as humans, we have that negativity bias that often hinders us when we think about all the things that could go wrong, this conversation is a reminder that the unknown element that often scares us into doing nothing or sends us running in the opposite direction could also unfold into something beautiful. So if you've ever wondered what it would be like to have the freedom to travel the world while still being able to pay your bills and not just pay your bills but truly live and really experience everything else that life has to offer and, at the same time, provide a comfortable lifestyle for yourself and your family Grab a copy of Kayla's book, as she provides such great advice and insight through telling her own story and, who knows, maybe it will give you a shift in perspective.

Kertia: 1:18

But before I begin, I want to personally, shout out my sister from another. Mr Leia, in your pursuit of living your best life, may your journey unfold in the most beautiful way as you create a life that is truly authentic to you. All right, let's get into it. Oh, so excited about this conversation because I can relate. So first question that I have for you you left the United States in 2017 on a one-way ticket, determined to fully embrace this new, awaiting experience as a digital nomad. Yeah, can you think back to the moment when you made that decision and describe what that was like, your thought process and what emotions came up for you?

Kayla: 2:11

Oh my gosh, I can remember it vividly. I was thinking about becoming a digital nomad. I saw people on Instagram doing it and I was really fascinated. I was kind of toying with the idea and telling people I'm thinking about doing this, but I wasn't committed and my job actually sent me to a training on the other side of the country and I was there with all these other people from the company, from other branches, that I had never met, and we were at a dinner and everyone is getting to know each other, and I didn't really want to talk about work because I was thinking about quitting, and so instead I asked everyone if you could have a do-over, would you pick the same career? And only one person said that they would. And to me that was like, oh, there was such a light bulb moment.

Kayla: 3:01

I thought I'm so worried about regretting something down the road. I was in my early 20s thinking like what path am I putting myself on? Am I going to regret it? And to me that just said, statistically speaking, this path does not have great odds of me feeling really good down the road. And these people are like mid-level, and it's not like everybody hated their job. They just said, yeah, I would try something else. I'm not in love with it. Enough, pretty much. So I thought that's it. I was weighing do I work on my career, do I go traveling? And I couldn't find anyone who regretted traveling, so to me it just seemed like a numbers game. I thought traveling seems like the right choice. It seems like a wise investment in my time.

Kertia: 3:45

What were the fears that came up for you? Because I know I've had so many fears around traveling, getting on a plane, going somewhere that is totally unknown albeit, I've always wanted to travel the world and I still do kind of jumpstarted that this year. So this is a little bit different, when you're kind of not just traveling knowing that you're coming back right away, right after a week or two weeks, like you were planning on just leaving it all behind and just going somewhere completely new, hopping around different areas of the world until you finally settled on where you wanted to be. What fears came up for you during that process, when you were thinking about all of this and all the variables that you had to play around with?

Kayla: 4:31

Oh my gosh, we could talk for the rest of the podcast. I was afraid of career consequences. I was afraid that my career, if I came home in three months, my career would be set back. I was afraid of the things that people would say and think. Not enough for it to stop me. But I was sensitive to what people thought because I was aware that people had perspectives.

Kayla: 4:54

I didn't, you know, like if I had one colleague tell me well, you are really going to regret that whenever you go to retire and your retirement fund is really not, as you know, there's not as much money in there as there could have been. And that didn't scare me. I thought, gosh, am I shooting myself in the foot? And then I came to the conclusion no, no, no, that's. He was like 55 and I was 23. We had different concerns about our retirement funds, but I was thinking I was taking in all this information.

Kayla: 5:23

I was afraid of what would go wrong. What if something really bad happens? I've been in an accident and I'm alone and I can't communicate? What if something like? I'm a victim of crime and I think I should have never done this, I should have never left home. Then, having that regret, I was afraid of the language barrier I'd never really experienced a language barrier before and not and then all the things that did happen that were, let's say, negative I wasn't afraid of any of them because they weren't even on my radar. It's funny how, I don't know. I think that's life sometimes. It's like all the things you were worried about, nothing happened, but then you get clobbered with a wave that you didn't see coming. So none of those things happened, but it was still scary and the fears were still very real.

Kertia: 6:12

Yeah, because you actually didn't have any experience traveling internationally by yourself.

Kayla: 6:20

No, I'd been to Canada and the Bahamas, but that was it, and I wasn't alone and I didn't deal with a language barrier. So to me it wasn't that different than traveling in the US.

Kertia: 6:31

Oh, my goodness, when you were telling me about your coworker and what he said about your retirement, I was just like this is how people keep themselves trapped. Yes, you know what I mean the excuses that we come up with to like we hinder ourselves so much. We literally stagnate ourselves and stagnate our lives so much.

Kayla: 6:53

And these really weird ideas sometimes like really that's one of my rules for everyone Don't tell your plans to anyone unless they will be excited for you or they can help you. And if they don't fit into one of those categories, then you don't tell them your travel plans until you need to. You have to protect your dreams.

Kertia: 7:16

Yeah, I think most of the times people are well-meaning, but they're projecting so much of their own fears and their own insecurities onto you that it comes off the wrong way. Now it sounds like they're not happy for me or, you know, they wish something bad might happen with my plans. There are some people who think like that, but for the most part I feel people just project their stuff. The kind of excuses that they use to hold themselves back is the kind of excuses that they just put onto you.

Kayla: 7:53

Yeah, that was messy and you know I find that people have a lot to say before you do something. But if I were to and I actually came back to my place of work after a few months after traveling, I came back and visited because I was back in Chicago for something and everyone told me wow, you're living the dream, I can't, I'm so happy for you. And they I think they legitimately don't didn't remember the little comments that they made to me, these passing remarks, because once you're doing it, people are all people applaud you. But whenever you're talking about doing it, it's all oh gosh, well, don't do that. And I think there's kind of like a saying you're never criticized by people doing more than you. And I think that that's what people that kind of comes from that insecurity of well if they're doing that is it wrong that I'm not doing that, or I wouldn't, so they shouldn't.

Kayla: 8:51

It's not about you, it's very much about them.

Kertia: 8:54

Exactly their insecurities and fares, and when they see you do it, then they're like mind blown. That was. That was just a quick reminder of something that I've recently experienced as well. In your book, you said no huge spoilers. I just wanted to highlight a couple of things that I saw In your book. You said that at some point you wondered if you were making a big mistake and that maybe some dreams are too big to actually achieve, and that really, that really stood out to me, because I know so many of us can relate to that, you know, but many of us would never actually say it or admit it out loud, and I've even thought that way before, and even this podcast is one of those things that I'm working through, using to work through my own fears and my own insecurities. Right, just like you took that huge leap, this has also been a huge leap for me in my journey. So what did that mean to you in that moment when you were having those thoughts? Maybe some dreams are too big to actually achieve.

Kayla: 10:04

I feel like I wanted everything out of life and I kind of was getting the feeling from I don't know society or I don't know where it came from specifically, but I had this feeling that people kind of thought it was naive to think that you can get everything that you want.

Kayla: 10:22

And I and I sometimes even in business, because I've now had my own business for a few years I've had people tell me I'm naive in business and I think, well, what's naive about wanting? You know, I think if someone, an athlete, wants to become a professional athlete or musician, wants to, like you know, make it when a Grammy, you think, oh, that's just the natural path to the top of your field. And I Don't know, I guess I felt, yeah, am I being naive? Am I being a classic, you know, recent college grad who's just not adjusting to the world? Well, I was unhappy, working in a cubicle all day and my colleagues kept saying, yeah, you'll just get used to it, like you're just young, you know. And I I wondered is it true? Am I supposed to get used to being bored and unhappy and unstimulated?

Kayla: 11:15

And it's not that I'm not saying that just about that job I had right before I left. I worked full-time for two years before I Left the traditional workforce and, yeah, one of those jobs was a cubicle job where it was like fluorescent lights and it was just a great cubicle alone all day, and People kept telling me that I would just get used to it, and I still don't understand that mentality. But I started to internalize it, is it true? I want to have a good career, I want to be fulfilled and I want to have fun and I want to see the world. And is that too big and my Asking for too much in life? And I did wonder that I mean and I'm glad that it resonated with you, because I, whenever I was writing that, I didn't know if anyone could relate to that feeling, so it means a lot. You're one of the first people to have read the book actually, so you had it on the pre-release, so you, it's really nice feedback.

Kertia: 12:03

Yeah, I really truly relate to it and you know, in line with what you're just saying, I think the problem is that so many of us, we get so used to squashing our dreams, you know, and that's why they felt okay telling you that you'll get used to cubicle life, right, that is something that I don't think I could ever get used to. I you know, I've lived that life, I've worked corporate for so many years and I never got used to it. It was never me, never aligned with anything having to do with my identity, my true identity.

Kayla: 12:36

So and that takes a lot of guts to leave it behind Whenever Everyone keeps telling you that it's the right thing to do, it's the good career move, you know? Yeah, it's hard to know what's real whenever you're looking at all the data.

Kertia: 12:50

Yeah, because everyone, a lot of people, not everyone, but too many of us we are so afraid to kind of go against the grain. You know, we've been taught to want these things and to value certain things and to achieve certain things by a certain time. And when you achieve something then it means something and then we absorb all these things into our Identity and our makeup of who we are as people and so now we become this thing and it's far away from who we truly are and who we actually want. So it's hard when you're so disconnected from yourself and that inner child and that inner wanton and that authentic version of yourself, right? So when you see someone else is kind of just like shed in all of that number one, I think for some people they don't recognize the value in what's in in your process and to Some people might just have a hard time, like witnessing someone else do what they want so badly but are unable to do because they put so much of that external stuff under cells and it just keeps them stuck.

Kertia: 14:03

Absolutely yeah, there's just so much going on there. So, even though it comes off, it rubs you the wrong way when people say things like that, when you're, when you're trying to do something for yourself. But I've learned to kind of have empathy because I'm just like. I know within my hearts of hearts that if they were given the chance To just do what they really wanted to do and not have to worry about bills, and you know, if, if someone said here and say here, I'll give you five million dollars and you could just do whatever you wanted to do, I don't think they would be saying what they were saying to you when you told them about your dreams. Right, I think they would want to. Maybe in this economy, five million is a little bit low. Maybe a few more million.

Kayla: 15:00

Double it maybe.

Kertia: 15:02

Triple it, maybe, in this economy. But if they had, the thing is, if they had nothing to worry about, if all their concerns were taken care of. Let's say that if all your concerns were taken about the bills, the children, the family, their retirement they didn't have to worry about any of that what would they choose to do? Would they still choose to stay in that cubicle or would? They go out and chase that dream that they've always had.

Kayla: 15:28

Yeah, yeah, you nailed that. You never really know whenever you just sharing your life, sharing your plans or your hopes. You never really know when you're stepping on someone else's regrets. And Sometimes I do think people say things from a nice place, like that man that I worked with telling me about his retirement, telling me about my retirement. Maybe he didn't plan for his retirement and he was not in a you know, he was. That was like a genuine thing that he wished someone had told him when he was 23. I try to always have an open mind for that, but remind myself that the other people's concerns are not my concerns and I have my concerns, I understand them and that's all you need to worry about Mm-hmm.

Kertia: 16:12

It reminds me as well Of what you also said. You said see yourself in your book that I don't have Excuses for not being who I want to be. And girl, let me tell you that thing. Just, I was just like, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, tell me all about that. Can you just flash that out for me? Because that thing touched me, because that has been my journey. It has, like I, I know like, for yours is different from mine, but those words, those thoughts are the same. Those emotions, those feelings, they're the same. I've felt that, I've thought the same things when it came to Going against the grain and Paving my own way. I think anyone who has had to Find their own way and kind of go against the system and the constructs, the societal constructs, they have these moments where they have these thoughts, and for me that was one of the things that really I could completely identify with. So I kind of want you to flesh this out for me.

Kayla: 17:33

You know I'd love for you to tell me about this thought that you had.

Kayla: 17:38

I wrote that in my journal in 2016 and I was kind of still new at my job and Someone actually a higher up in the company gave me a ticket to a conference that was happening. It was called the Chicago ideas week and it's a big like Kind of it's a festival in Chicago that happens every year and it's full of really, really passionate people on these panels. And I went alone and I was sitting there watching people who were so Passionate about what they were talking about and I just thought about my work and I liked it.

Kayla: 18:15

I liked the company, I liked my colleagues, I liked the work I did day to day. Genuinely I felt like life was passing me by and I was kind of sleepwalking through life. But it wasn't bad, like it wasn't like a horrible situation, and I saw these people who felt like to me. They were like radiating with passion for what they did and I thought I wish I had that, you know. And then I had to be honest with myself. There's no reason that I don't have that. And I came home and I was journaling and I actually pulled that out of like I'd like had that Pete, that journal still as I was writing my book, which is actually I can't believe I had it still. It's kind of just dumb luck. And I was so like maybe emotional to find it years later I've been abroad for six years and knowing that I could have still very well been there celebrating a new milestone with the company, accepting that I didn't need to have it all in life, and I just I don't know. I guess it was like a kind of a healthy envy that I had of other people who were really passionate. And then I started seeing it everywhere I looked. I remember then the next day, I went to a it's called a Piano bar, like a piano duel. There's this bar in Chicago where these two piano players like Duel and they play back and forth, and there was like no one in this bar. I think there were three of us in the bartender and these people were ripping it on piano and it like almost moved me to tears, thinking this is people's call things they. I'm like seeing passion on display. I started seeing it everywhere once I had that realization and, yeah, I wrote that down One day.

Kayla: 19:50

I said it was one side of one page of my journal. It was this was in 2016. I wrote maybe it's not such a crisis About my career, about what I'm doing. Maybe it's just relax and enjoy the fact that I have this nice new job, I'm living alone for the first time. Maybe I'm like not being appreciative. And I wrote maybe it's not such a crisis.

Kayla: 20:11

And then the next day or a few days later, on the opposite page, I wrote but maybe it is. And then I wrote that I have no excuse for not being the person I want to be and that was like it just hit me. That was a realization that hit me like a piano falling on my head and everything I started looking then what's next? That was in October and I didn't have that kind of light bulb moment at the dinner I was thinking is travel. The answer is that it that wasn't until, I think, march. So it's. I'm all this over for months. I didn't act quickly. I'm not someone who acts quickly. I think about everything. For a very long time it was slow, and I say that because if anyone else feels like they don't, it's they can't just make a bold change. You don't have to. You can think about it for a year, just be working on it inside, you know, be mulling it over.

Kertia: 21:00

Yeah, bit by bit. I like that. You spoke about passion, talking about passion, and that's just right, in line with purpose and a lot of us you know we have maybe Well, I can only speak for myself really Having experienced having a comfortable job, you know, making a decent income whereby I could live comfortably and I didn't have too much to worry about. You know, my kids were taken care of, the bills were taken care of. You being in that situation where you had a good job, you're making decent money, you were living on your own, you could care for yourself, you were quite okay. When you think about that and then compare that to what you wanted to leave that to do, I can see where people would be like that is so irrational.

Kertia: 21:52

You know people would be thinking like. That's irrational, it doesn't make sense. Why would you do that? You have everything, yeah and ungrateful.

Kertia: 22:02

Yeah, yeah, you're so comfortable. Like, what are you doing? Do you know what you want? And it's just like sometimes, sometimes, or a purpose well, not sometimes when it comes to your purpose, your purpose is bigger than all of that. It's bigger than. It's bigger than the job, it's bigger than the house, it's bigger than the car, it's bigger than the status. It's bigger than your comfort, because most of the times, when it comes to our purpose, it takes us out of our comfort zone.

Kertia: 22:40

And for you, experiencing other people living in their purpose, doing something that it was so in line with them that they oozed that passion, right, that you could feel it. You know, you could feel that energetic pull from them, just oozing that passion because they were so in alignment with who they are. That, to me, is just like so huge. It's a big moment, I think, for you to even experience that. I think that when you can feel that from someone else who is living in alignment with their own authenticity, it's such a crucial moment of inspiration. And although you may not jump on that plane on the next day, you could jump on that plane the next year or the next two years. But, as you said, bit by bit right. It doesn't mean that you throw your life out the window and then. You know what I mean.

Kertia: 23:41

Of course you need to plan, of course you need to put things in place. It doesn't mean that you just throw things out the window and get running, but at least you can begin to work on it, begin to take those tiny steps that will slowly but surely get you there at some point in time.

Kayla: 24:01

Yeah, you said that beautifully and I almost think it's like a part of the I don't know a passion economy that you see someone who's, you see their passion and you're inspired and then it makes you find a more aligned, passionate life and then someone in your life seems you make those changes and then they make those changes.

Kayla: 24:20

To me it's like a very it's like a current kind of flowing through, and I've had people tell me things that I would have never known, like somebody told me that they moved to a new country with their partner for their partner. Because I moved to a new country. They said, well, I kind of thought, well, I saw Kayla do that and you know this isn't even as hard as that because you know I don't have to move as far away as she did because I moved to the Netherlands whenever I met my husband and you never know who is watching you. I think as a mother it's very easy for you to feel that. I think any parent knows that effect within their home, but you have no idea about that effect in everyone who sees you either. It's really special.

Kertia: 25:06

It is. It is, and anytime you are being authentic to yourself, anytime you are living in your purpose, people are inspired by that You're, even if it's one person, you are inspiring someone because what you're doing is that you're showing them that what they think is impossible, that it's possible. And, as I said earlier, so many people were used to squashing our dreams, squashing our inner child, squashing the things that we desire most, but when they see someone step out of that, it shows that they too can step out of that. They're like, oh, maybe maybe it's not so bad after all, maybe it's not so scary after all. Like, sure, it looks risky, but maybe, if I do these things to help to mitigate the risk, maybe I can do it Right. So, yeah, it's just like it really puts that seed in your mind.

Kertia: 26:07

So I just love what you did and it's such an inspiration even for me, because what you're doing is something that I'd like to do at some point as well. We think about all the things that are standing in our way all the time and the opinions of others, people not being happy or people not thinking that what we're doing makes sense. So you haven't experienced in that and being able to kind of just shed. That it's really huge, because I think most people aren't able to do what you did. So, yeah, that's, that's pretty cool, thanks, yeah. So I want to ask you, because I know you left in 2017 and then COVID happened in 2019.

Kertia: 26:54

Yeah, tell me all about that, because it was crazy enough in.

Kayla: 26:59

North.

Kertia: 27:00

America? Were you somewhere across international waters during this time, and what happened? What was that like? What were the challenges you faced with that?

Kayla: 27:13

I was living in the Netherlands. I will just a little kind of timeline of how I got there. I was, I left the US in 2017 and I traveled for six months in Latin America and I met my husband and then we moved to his country, which is the Netherlands, and we were just going to stay for a little while, but COVID made it longer than we expected. Covid changed everyone's plans, of course, but we were using the Netherlands as a bit of a home base to build our business and to travel in Europe. I had never been to Europe and it was really intense. I mean, it was as weird, I think, as it was for everyone. Everything was shut down. There were all the regulations, the fear.

Kayla: 27:55

In the Netherlands, they had these very funny, like little mini kind of cars, like super, like, kind of like a smart car, but smaller, that drove around with an electronic billboard on the back that said coronavirus, stay away, and you would see them drive down. And then there's like a little guy sitting inside with a mask on by himself and just driving around town and I think they got. I don't know, I could be wrong, but I think they got them for the pandemic and now they just use them for everything. So you'll see, like a festival this weekend in the little billboard car I'm not kidding you, it's like smaller, it could like fit, almost fit in your shower, like your bathtub. It's this tiny, it's like a it's. It looks like something out of the Jetsons. It's so small, with it's all. It's literally a billboard with wheels and a little seat and somebody drives it around and yes, see that, go away.

Kayla: 28:53

Coronavirus. Stay away from each other. You think what happened? Where am I? Oh my God, we, yeah, we were bunkered down like everyone else, but my husband was still teaching at the time. He was a high school English teacher and he was sent home to teach remotely and we had such a nice time. I mean, I think that a lot of couples experienced this that it was nice to be home together more. Some couples, some couples, not everyone. I think we all had a few friends who got divorced from the pandemic. I know I have at least one friend who will tell you that she's divorced now because of Corona it. It shined a light, let's say it that way all that time at home.

Kertia: 29:42

Yeah.

Kayla: 29:47

I'm so sorry. You have the nicest laugh, it's okay.

Kertia: 29:52

Oh my goodness, I'm just thinking back to all the mess that happened.

Kayla: 29:58

See if you had kids, you had a very different experience with lockdown.

Kertia: 30:03

Very different. Yeah, it was a mess. What would you say is what was your scariest experience being away? Like you know, I know you've been traveling around a lot. I know you went to Latin America first Was it Mexico.

Kayla: 30:24

I started in Mexico and then I traveled overland south to Peru, south Central America and part of South America, and then Europe.

Kertia: 30:34

Wow, that is really cool, yeah, so in all of that, what would you say is maybe the scariest or if not scariest, maybe challenging experience that you had to navigate?

Kayla: 30:47

It was definitely. It was very scary. My scariest experience has been always been getting sick in another country. Some people never get sick. My husband's one of those people, but me I've been to the hospital or the doctor and I think five countries now and it's the worst. It's so scary and it's like terrifying because you don't know what to do. And then even once you get help like I had to go to the hospital in the Netherlands and even once you're there and you're with the doctor and you think, okay, I'm getting care, I'm taking care of, then you just it's like incredibly challenging because you don't know what's normal, like in the Netherlands, in the US and I think I thought everywhere if you are like getting a test and you need to like be naked, they'll give you a gown. That is not everywhere.

Kayla: 31:38

In the Netherlands they literally like the one woman. She's like I take off your I don't know what your listener base is, this is like a little. She's like you need to have like no bottoms and take it off. And I'm like what? I'm not understanding. I'm thinking we're having a language barrier and she said bottom naked and go down the hall Like no, it's a joke, it has to be a joke. And then you talk to a few other people and they're like oh yeah, they just parade you around naked Really, yeah, so it goes from scary to confusing and challenging. Yeah, so being sick every time.

Kertia: 32:19

Just imagine, like you know, going to the hospital and then you have, maybe, the cultural barrier, the language barrier, trying to even explain what your issue is. Oh, my goodness.

Kayla: 32:31

Yeah, it's funny that even if you are able to communicate which is not always the case I've done doctors appointments. I did a doctor's appointment at the hospital once through Google Translate completely through Google Translate whole appointment and that's fine if you're able to get what you need. But, yeah, then just the confusion of not knowing what you're supposed to do and not knowing what's normal, and then people being frustrated with you because you don't know what to do and you're doing the wrong thing. They think you're going to go left and you go right and they're like what's wrong with you? Just do it. And oh, it's very. And also just learning about the different health care options. I've had to get health care like either getting medicine or going to a doctor or the hospital in the US, guatemala, colombia, the Netherlands and Portugal, mexico did I say Mexico In Mexico and it's never the same. It's always very different and super intimidating.

Kertia: 33:32

I can only imagine and I'm one of those people who are really health conscious and I think I would just freak out because I'm so health conscious and even going to the doctor. I am clear on how I describe my symptoms and how this affects my daily functioning. I'm so detailed because for me.

Kertia: 33:54

I know there are humans too and if they miss one thing they could completely make a huge life-changing mistake. So I am so detailed and precise when I have an issue, when I am describing this issue to the doctor, I'm giving him a full breakdown of everything and how it affects my functioning, my life, my thinking, my this, my that. So I can only imagine having to do that somewhere where you're just completely unfamiliar with the system, the culture. I know things can get lost in translation. I know a lot of professionals in these countries.

Kertia: 34:33

They also do communicate with a lot of tourists and they also learn English in school, but because it's not their first language, things can always get lost in translation.

Kayla: 34:44

And I think it's easy, if you're for listeners, to think well, I don't know how to do that, so I couldn't travel and I don't know how to do it either. I don't know how to go. I didn't know how to go to the doctor in Portugal. I had to Google it. Portugal tourist doctor Didn't know how to do it. Really, I didn't know going to Facebook groups asking people.

Kayla: 35:05

Whenever I was sick in Guatemala, I asked my Spanish teacher if he would help me and he was really nice and he did, and he took me to the pharmacy and helped me get medicine. You just find a way. I actually interviewed someone in my book who told me a story about being in the Philippines, I think, and she got really bad food poisoning and she went in like a tuk-tuk it's like a little kind of open taxi for anyone who's not familiar and she took a tuk-tuk to the hospital and then here they wouldn't admit she needed to be admitted, she was so sick but they wouldn't admit her without a contact. And her tuk-tuk driver became her hospital contact and he sat with her and she didn't know how to do that, but she figured it out. You just figure it out. It's amazing what you're capable of and you don't know.

Kayla: 35:55

I think parents can probably relate to that a lot. You don't know how to handle situations until you do it and you've done it. Everyone has done it so many times in their life and you could do it again abroad. You would be fine. You're not going to, you will figure it out because you have to. You just do.

Kertia: 36:13

Yeah, that is so true. The best way to learn is to actually do right. You can always study things and read things and have things in theory, but the best way to learn anything is to just do the best way to learn how to survive is to actually try to survive.

Kertia: 36:31

So I love that, just putting that out there, knowing that you need to be ready to be resourceful, asking questions, not being afraid to ask questions, as you said, there's Facebook. There's also groups. There's so many groups now online the people who travel. There are apps as well and, of course, just be careful and be safe, be very you know, because there are people who have really weird intentions, but otherwise just being resourceful. So that was a good tip.

Kayla: 37:03

Yeah, and educating yourself on the specific risks. If you're nervous, like, let's say, you're listening and you also want to go to, let's say, mexico that's where I started Get a guidebook and listen to what the guidebook says, because there's so many tips that are going, and then you can feel confident because you feel like you have all the information. You can build yourself up with confidence in ways you know before you leave for your trip. But you don't have to kind of get on the plane. You'll still be afraid we are all afraid whenever we go on a new trip but you can build yourself up in other ways in advance.

Kertia: 37:38

Yeah, love it. Now, going from a scary experience, let's talk about a beautiful, the best defining experience you've had while on your travels.

Kayla: 37:53

There's so many that come to mind. One of the most precious memories I was in Mexico. This is now six years later. I was just in Mexico a few months ago and we were staying on the water. It was like crystal clear blue waters, white sand beaches, coconuts. We were just in this little Airbnb that we found and it was so peaceful and my parents came to visit my husband and I and we were out swimming at sunset and just sitting in the water watching the sun go down and watching all the people go by, and it was just, I don't know, I kind of feel like a complete piece, you know, just feeling like this is beautiful, this is so, I don't know, like complete contentment. I don't know if that's an exciting story, but it's special to find those moments in life where you just feel like you're somewhere beautiful and you feel like you're noticing all of it, all the beauty.

Kertia: 38:52

Yeah, I think the word is you are being present, being completely present, being completely just. There's nothing better than peace, having peace, being at peace, and I'm really glad that you got to experience that. I wish most of us, most of the rest of us, would get to experience that. That's such a it's unexplainable, almost that feeling. So I can totally relate to that. Yeah, Good stuff, Kayla.

Kayla: 39:31

No regrets. I regret not understanding the nudity hospital expectation. I shouldn't have told that story. That's the real, honest stuff. That's a story I've told very few people.

Kertia: 39:49

That's a good story.

Kayla: 39:51

Nobody tell anyone. Is it in a book? No, I didn't put it in there. No, I don't know. Or maybe I did. It sounds so weird. And then I'm thinking men are going to read this. I don't want to. This is like a everyone feels awkward. I think most women feel awkward getting going to the doctor for certain things, and then it's like how can we make it 10 times more awkward? That's what happened.

Kertia: 40:17

You know what? It's actually a very good story to put in the book, because what it would do is prepare anyone who goes to work. Where was this? In the Netherlands. It was in the Netherlands. Yeah, it will prepare anyone who are thinking about living in the Netherlands for a little bit.

Kayla: 40:36

It's actually quite normal in Europe.

Kertia: 40:39

This is a norm, so don't be alarmed.

Kayla: 40:43

Yeah.

Kertia: 40:44

I think I'll get the stories of what in the book, just saying.

Kayla: 40:47

Next book. Next book, love it. Yeah, it's unexpected. Travel will always be unexpected, and that's a beautiful thing.

Kertia: 41:01

It is, it is. It's just embracing. You know what? It teaches you how to embrace life in and of itself. Like, I think, so many of us, we want the structure and we want the predictability and we want to know. So you know what I mean. It's that, that human condition whereby we are so afraid of the unknown factors that we try to have everything structured so that we can feel secure.

Kayla: 41:33

And that is okay.

Kertia: 41:35

I mean, of course we do need some level of structure in our lives, so like we're not kind of all over the place, but it's just like knowing to have that balance where it's just like you kind of just embrace life as it is and embrace all the things that life comes with, all the different facets of life, and knowing how to just be present and just take things as they come. Because I think a lot of us.

Kertia: 42:03

We get so wound up and you know we talk about this a lot on the podcast whereas it's just like those things that we don't know what the results will be. We don't know what the outcome are, but whether it has to do with our goals or things, we want to try our desires, not knowing that outcome, the fear of that kind of just like hinders us from even taking that step forward. And I think if we would approach life like a child with that curiosity you know you tell a child not to do this thing. You know it's dangerous, it won't be good for you, but they still want to do it right, because they're curious. They want to find out what's next, what's on the other side, what will happen. She says it's not safe, but is that really true?

Kertia: 42:55

I want to find out for myself If we could have a little bit of that approach to life. I think things would be a little bit more simpler for us, because we humans, we tend to make life more difficult than it needs to be.

Kayla: 43:12

Yeah, so yeah.

Kertia: 43:15

I love that, yeah, but I want to know how did you figure out the work situation? Because you know, coming from the cubicle and this predictable job, this structure, you go in, you get it done, you get paid at this time, you know, you know when to expect your paychecks, you know how to plan your expenses based on when your paychecks are coming. How did you figure all of this out?

Kayla: 43:47

I started freelancing, freelance writing, and I found a lot of freedom in that and it was difficult because whenever you're used to having external motivators to do your work, then you're stuck with, you know, internal motivators. It's very different, it's a different way of operating, so it's a huge learning curve. I thought I didn't like it. I started freelance writing and I did that for a while but then.

Kayla: 44:13

I thought, no, I don't like this, I'm going to do something else and I'm not sure why. I'm going to find something new to do. And I was just trying to figure it all out on the go, which is the only way to do it, because you can't have like a five year career plan whenever you are making it up yourself, you know, whenever you're self employed or freelancing which are very similar and I just kind of fumbled my way through it Took on clients I liked, took on clients I didn't like, looked at why I didn't like them, looked at why I did and tried to find the next one that went better. And trying different things. I did freelance graphic design as well and Pinterest management for a while, for years actually. So just trying things.

Kayla: 44:56

I think you nailed it with looking at how kids experience the world with that curiosity, look at life with that same curiosity and look at your ways to make money.

Kayla: 45:05

People are making money doing a lot of things online and if it's ethical, then it's good, it's fine, you know. So, being more open to it and kind of detaching from what I thought like needed to be very purposeful career, I thought my career needs to be super purposeful my work and just thinking, you know it's actually okay to just do something that's easy to me and pays the bills and I do well, you know kind of taking time to explore without putting a lot of pressure on it and saying like I need to find it, like I was kind of seeking my career the way people so I don't know, some people look for the one you know like their soulmate. I was looking for that with every job, every freelance project, and that was a mistake. I needed to have more curiosity and experimentation. It's good for me. I spent years doing that and trying different things, and some beautiful thing about life is that you can try on all the hats and keep looking.

Kertia: 46:07

I love that and it's true like there is no need to put all this pressure on ourselves. You know, I know we all want to be in line with our purpose and whatever, but I think, on the way to finding out what that is, take the pressure off. It's okay to experiment. If something doesn't work for you, it's okay, do away with it and try something else, right? It's never that serious.

Kayla: 46:29

Right and it's not failure. Yeah, it's success to try.

Kertia: 46:34

Yes, it's not failure, you're just trying something. If it doesn't work, put it away and try something else. Just explore, be curious, and I think that when you can do that, at some point that path kind of just aligns you with what you're meant to be doing.

Kertia: 46:52

Right because, having all those experiences, you get clearer on what you don't want Absolutely and when you can get clearer on what you don't want and what doesn't work for you, and now you begin to know what makes you feel good, what makes you feel connected, what, what feels authentic for you.

Kertia: 47:14

You can get all of that through having all of these different experiences. Whether you perceive them as good, bad or ugly, you still get this amazing insight at the end of it, because when you can explore and open yourself up to all the possibilities, it truly sets you on that path whereby you get closer to yourself, you get closer to your purpose, you get closer to your authenticity. There is no need to run around looking for purpose in all these different things. You are already on your way to that. We just don't recognize it. But in living and in embracing life and embracing the experiences that life brings to us, that is all a part of our journey. It's all a part of us being in alignment, getting in alignment with our purpose, and I think that a lot of us I wish that a lot of us would recognize that more.

Kayla: 48:12

And just like.

Kertia: 48:13

enjoy the journey. Yeah, enjoy the journey for what it is.

Kayla: 48:18

Yeah, oh, I love that. You said that so beautifully and I think you nailed it whenever you were talking about trying different things, and I forget exactly what you said. It was so beautiful, but there's so many, so much to uncover in life that we will let leave covered about ourselves, about what we like, about what we're good at, getting to know ourselves. I think that's what you said, and there is no shame in picking up turning over a lot of rocks. I think somehow it seems embarrassing to try a lot of different careers or different I don't know ways of life. It's not, it's so. It's amazing, I don't. It's amazing to see what, like you don't even know, you could have this gift that you don't even know about yet, that's just waiting to be found.

Kertia: 49:04

Exactly and, as you said a couple minutes ago, it's not failure. You know, if you try something and you don't like it and it's not working for you and it makes you miserable, it doesn't mean that you failed Right. It doesn't mean that you're feeling that, even if you're not good at it, it's okay. We can't be good at everything.

Kertia: 49:23

It's not a failure, it's just like okay, it just doesn't work for you and that's okay, try something else. And if that doesn't work for you, it's okay, just move on and just embrace what these experiences and the lessons that you learn from that, what these experiences allow you to get from that. So that's like such an important journey that you went on traveling and just having these amazing experiences, the challenges to good, the bad and everything in between. That is just amazing. Do you know anyone personally, do you have any friends or maybe do you have any acquaintances that are doing the same thing that you've done and have been able to create a work quality, make money and kind of just be okay, just like have a decent way of life while doing what you're doing, because it will be so good to kind of like hear what the other possibilities are.

Kayla: 50:22

Oh yeah, I feel like everyone at this point all of my friends almost are living the same, this lifestyle, and that's what we all share. Different countries where we come from different countries were in different countries. We're all doing different things for work, but we all understand the choice to travel as much as possible. I think it's so nice to have these people that you can see Wow, they're doing that.

Kayla: 50:46

I didn't know about that type of you know, I didn't know about that possibility and watching other people like surrounding yourself with people who are also turning over stones.

Kayla: 50:55

You know, seeing what's out there in life and learning from them that's me, is really powerful and that's something I put in the book as well. I found travelers and interviewed them and told their stories so that people could learn much more from just me, but from people who went and moved to China for a few years to make money and make a lot of money teaching English and build up financial stability, and people who found financial stability, starting their own businesses and moving somewhere else, just finding there's like a million success stories out there. But whenever you're alone, you feel like you don't know anyone and I wanted people by the end of the book. I want readers to feel like they know they have a whole host of friends that they know now and they can say well, you know they did it, so I can do it, and I hope that that's a motto that comes through to people. They did, so I can. If they did it, then so can I.

Kayla: 51:51

That's the beautiful thing.

Kertia: 51:53

I love that and I like the language that you use in your book, saying that I'm your friend. You know, if you don't have any friends or anyone that has done this that is currently doing it, well, now you have a friend, I'm your friend and I'm going to help you and take you through all the stuff that you need to know and need to consider when you're doing this.

Kayla: 52:14

so I love the language that you use there, so that people kind of realize okay, I'm not alone, like I was so moved by people in my life who did that for me, like I met people in Facebook groups for travelers and I was telling them I bought this one way ticket to Mexico, but I'm so scared, I'm like almost thinking about backing out and they were like listen, like sending me voice notes. I didn't know these people. They were just there to offer support. It was like the fairy godmother that came out of you know nowhere and encouraged me and I Always feel like I don't know. I will always be that for somebody, if I can be and I hope that readers. I invite the readers to come up to me.

Kayla: 52:59

I describe the way I look at the end of the book and I tell people if you see me, come up and let's have a baked good or cup of coffee or a beer together and I want to hear everything because I really do feel that way. There's not like a club of people who are like cool travelers. I felt like they were people who traveled, were like so cool and worldly, and I'm not and I don't know. You know I don't have anything. I need the experiences that they have and I felt this big gap between where I was and where I wanted to be and I hope that I just gave people a little bridge. You know, like it's not, Don't worry. Like come on, you can. You know I'll be waiting on the other side and you can tell me all about it and you are doing a great job.

Kertia: 53:43

That's amazing. I love that, kayla, love that. So, from your experience traveling the world, experiencing new people, cultures, food, all sorts of wonderful and even challenging things, what key insights can you offer to someone, to anyone who would like to take the plunge as you did, or who just maybe even daydreams about this lifestyle?

Kayla: 54:11

I have steps. Okay For anyone who wants to travel and feels really scared, and I guess I should preface this by saying no one needs to travel. It's not like better than other things, it's not like a pretentious form of enlightenment, but if you want to, then I think you should, because it's so wonderful If it's pulling, if it's calling to you. Answer the call and start by getting as specific as you can. So think about what you, what, what is it that you want? Do you just dream about being anywhere else?

Kayla: 54:41

We've all had that dream whenever we're really bored with our lives or are you thinking about being somewhere tropical? Are you thinking Europe? I mean Asia. It can be vague, but somehow label it. So let's say you like, just say that you want to go to Europe I know that's like a very vague thing and that's fine and then start sharing your plans, but only with people who will either encourage you or be able to help you. Start getting your things for people, Even if you share in a Facebook group. Hey, I'm thinking about traveling Europe for you know, let's say, a month or a week, whatever you want.

Kayla: 55:17

What advice do you have? And then listen to ideas and let people kind of inspire. You See what kind of path appears forward for you, and then get a guidebook and let that be the first handbook that you've taken to your trip and then from there you just have to make a plan. For some people it'll be easy. Let's say you just want to go on a road trip and you already own a car and you know where you. You know you're, it's the same country that you already live in. That doesn't take as much planning as someone who wants to go somewhere very different. But I would say, start taking steps today and it feels real very quickly. You know, whenever you have a guidebook, that like butterfly feeling that you get holding it and thinking I'm going to go there, I'm going to make it happen whenever you know. Maybe it won't be next month, Maybe it'll be next year or the year after, but just getting the ball rolling is so cool.

Kertia: 56:07

Yeah, those are really. That's a really good advice that you just gave. I love that Getting a guidebook writing that down too.

Kayla: 56:16

That's a magic moment, the guidebook moment.

Kertia: 56:19

Mm-hmm, definitely, you know. It brought me back to this thing that you said in your book, kind of like sums up everything that we've been talking about, where you said if you want to slow the rate at which sand slips through our glass, have as many new experiences as possible. That is like profound Mm-hmm Thank you.

Kertia: 56:48

Like. It perfectly sums up everything that we've been saying. Right, just embracing life, what comes with it, being open, approaching life with a curiosity, instead of putting all these stringent rules and expectations on ourselves and what we do with ourselves and what we do with our lives, kind of just like it's okay to just go back and to that inner child and just be playful. You know, approach things with a new curiosity, especially the things that seem big and scary. Like children, we tell them.

Kertia: 57:26

I can't tell you how many times I have a five-year-old. I can't tell you how many times she has done some really risky things and have I warned her? Yes, but she does it anyway. And you know what she gets hurt. You know what happens after she gets hurt. She does it again anyway. So have a little bit of that. You'll find that you can discover so many things. Like my daughter, she has found a new way how to do things on the edge of the couch without falling off and breaking an arm. Yeah, you know, because she's fallen so many times after me telling her not to do it, and that's how it is. Sometimes you got to take those risks and do those things that are scary, but open your mind in a way whereby you're approaching these things with a level of curiosity and just taking so much pressure off yourself and off the outcome and approaching it like a child would. Yeah.

Kayla: 58:26

And you don't need to have a reason. I think you said that so well about the way kids experience things. I think with travel, you don't need to be able to justify it. Well, I want to go to this place for this reason and this is why it matters so much. You can just feel drawn to it. You don't need to justify wanting to experience something new. I don't think you need to justify that to anybody, and I almost feel like you have to justify saying no whenever you feel called to do something. Maybe there are real hurdles for reasons that you're not doing things in life. Life comes with very real limitations, of course, but if you haven't done it, or something a woman told me, actually I used to volunteer right before I left for traveling. I was volunteering at a hostel in Chicago, answering like working at the information desk and answering questions.

Kayla: 59:18

And there was a woman there in her seventies and her name was Marcia and she talked to me for like an hour's one day and she said if you say that you want to do something but you keep not doing it, then eventually you become afraid and whether or not you say it or not, we've accept that or not. She said you are almost always afraid to do it alongside any other real difficulties, because these things don't happen on their own. You don't embark on a huge trip by accident. It takes a lot of planning and it's not always fear, but I think it's good to acknowledge the fear that is there.

Kertia: 59:57

Yeah.

Kayla: 59:58

Or it's not only fear that stops us, but accepts it there, yeah.

Kertia: 1:00:03

Like. Of course we take in consideration the real life limitations, as you said, because of course a lot of people might not have the comfortable job and the safety net or even family members that could assist them should anything go wrong, or they might not have like good social contacts and all these different things right. But for the little things that you can do, for the little things that you do want, the little things that you desire, allow yourself to explore, right Sometimes it doesn't have to be like these huge milestones, but you can start somewhere small with what you have.

Kertia: 1:00:46

Yeah, exactly, that's beautiful, awesome. Thank you so much, kayla. Tell the audience where they can find your book, when it's released, and anything else that you'd like them to know about you and what you do, and how they can also reach out to you.

Kayla: 1:01:04

If anybody wants to say hi, they can email me at Kayla at writingfromnowherecom. Writing from Nowhere is my website and my book is available online. It's available on Amazon, barnes, noble Target all the normal retailers On the shelves. I'm not sure yet. I don't have those details on where it's on the shelves, but if you have the option, see if it's at a local independent bookseller, that's always wonderful to support them. I would love to talk to anyone who's interested in hearing more about travel. I hope that people feel like fear, that it's okay to be afraid and still go. I almost think it's like a prerequisite that you have to be afraid. You don't have to overcome it, it comes with you. That's all a part of the experience. If you're feeling that way, then you're just one of us.

Kertia: 1:01:58

Exactly. The only way to overcome fear is to actually face it. Yes, yeah beautiful. Awesome. Thank you so much.

Kayla: 1:02:10

Thanks for having me, it was so fun.

Kertia: 1:02:13

I've included Kayla's website below where you can find out where to buy her book online. And if you're currently feeling like life is life in and your dreams feel so out of touch, let's talk about it. Send us a voice note in our private pot inbox and we'll be happy to have a chat about it. Just a quick note on that Pot inbox has recently been renamed as FanList, but no worries, I've included a link below. Easy peasy.