Success Secrets and Stories
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Success Secrets and Stories
Elevating Leadership Through Effective Conflict Engagement
Unlock the secrets of leadership and conflict resolution with Dr. Durst's groundbreaking MBR approach—your roadmap to navigating the complex maze of confrontations and crucial conversations. As we reveal the five distinct leadership levels in conflict scenarios, you'll learn how to elevate from avoidance to a problem-solving mindset, transforming challenges into opportunities for growth. This episode is a treasure trove for leaders who are looking to build their skills in managing difficult discussions, fostering a culture of open communication, and leading teams through the stormiest of workplace debates.
We dissect the art of turning heated exchanges into actionable solutions, making sure your newfound strategies don't just end as talk. You'll get an inside look at how these principles play out in real-world situations, with examples that bring theory into practice. Underpinned by insights from the critical read "Crucial Conversations Tools for Talking when Stakes Are High," this episode is not just a lesson in theory but an interactive guide, equipping you with the communication tools needed when the pressure is on. Join us for a session that promises to hone your leadership finesse and conflict resolution prowess.
Presented by John Wandolowski and Greg Powell
Welcome everyone to Success in Secrets and Stories. I'm your host, john Wondolowski, and I'm here with my co-host and friend, greg Powell. Greg hey, everybody, yeah. Lasky. And I'm here with my co-host and friend, greg Powell. Greg, hey, everybody, yeah.
Speaker 1:And today our podcast is going to be about conflict resolutions. Now we're going to be talking about it in a format that Dr Durst talks about for his MBR approach of unconscious, self-protective, conformist achievement and responsible levels, and I found that as a very good starting point. And Dr Durst describes it in detail. When we're talking about the unconscious, it's management by default. So the category of conflict resolution is avoiding, which is like that lose or leave kind of environment, hopeless in terms of avoidance, withdrawn, detached approach. So, as the name describes it, the unconscious is basically avoiding anything associated with leadership. When it comes to conflict resolution, now, the exact opposite is the gorilla in the room, the self protective management by a dictatorship, and conflict resolution is the win lose environment, the competing environment, personal goals and and you know, are their prime importance that individual that's leading that department. Their goals are what everybody should be working on. Social survival is at stake in terms of conflict resolution. To lose is a sign of weakness. Their aggressive, dogmatic approach is really the bottom line aggressive. And the next category in Dr Durst's description is conformist. That's management by status quo, and conflict resolution is more the accommodating the yield or lose. The relationships are primary importance. Conflict is viewed as destructive to relationships. They're hesitant and timid in terms of approach. The best term that I can think of when you're talking about conflict resolution from people who are in this category is let's not rock the boat. Everything's going along fine. Let's not make waves, let's try to stay in the background. That's not really leadership, that's conformity.
Speaker 1:The next category is achievement. Management by crisis and conflict resolution is really you know what's that line from the movies greed is good. It's a win-lose, compromising kind of environment. It's very, very, very competitive. Attempts to soften the effects of losing by limiting the gains. They're persuasive, manipulative. When you're dealing with somebody who's in this environment, they take the praise. They're not interested in taking any of the blame. Conflict resolution is where there's winners and losers and they're always trying to make sure that they're on the winning side. The conversation can be manipulated in order to give them the advantage, but that's the essence of working within a crisis management mentality. And then there's the approach in terms of being a responsible leader. Management by responsibility is more like a developer, synergistic, win-win kind of environments. If the relationships are to last, all the goals must be met Candid, creative, problem-solving approach, basically engaged and that's the difference between really the achievement is a lot of people that are in leadership can be in that category too and the responsible level and you can tell pretty quickly whether they can actually demonstrate those skills.
Speaker 1:One of the things that I can tell you that effective leadership really has to have the ability to do what you can to develop people and people's relationships in terms of how you can do the task and perform. If you can't do one, if you can do only one or the other, you're really not going to be an effective leader. Leader, you're going to find that whole idea of building trust and feedback and having hard conversations with people hard to do if that's the only thing that you're interested in is actually performing the task and getting the matrix and getting your sales volumes. If you're not working with the people involved in that environment, you're not really a leader and it shows in time you're not really a leader and it shows in time.
Speaker 1:We've talked about the five different kind of characteristics, but really they're all interconnected and this connection is pretty straightforward. If you avoid conflict resolution, it's basically burying your head in the sand. Everybody knows it. It isn't like those other conditions aren't obvious, knows it. It isn't like those other conditions aren't obvious, they're fairly obvious. Conflict is probably where your characteristics as a leader flash to the front in a heartbeat. You'll know whether somebody is really capable of being a leader when there's conflict resolution. That's required. Those hard conversations are something that really makes a point on whether you understand leadership or not. So, greg, maybe you can pick us up on that concept of conversations.
Speaker 2:Thanks, John. When we think about crucial conversations, maybe think about it at a pyramid or a triangle. Pyramid or a triangle On the bottom left is kind of the corner of the high stakes. On the top is opposing opinions, On the far right bottom corner strong emotions and in the middle. That's how you get your crucial conversation. So it's a combination of those pieces. So there are seven crucial conversation principles. This comes from a group called Reading Graphics. It's a guide for crucial conversations and it's a third edition tool for talking when stakes are high.
Speaker 2:So the first one is start with the heart. So think about it this way it's easy to give in to our emotional impulses and make poor choices in the heat of the moment. Right, we just get all fired up and we just say, maybe the wrong thing at the wrong time, we get an impulse. So if you get the right focus, that involves knowing and focusing on what you truly want to do and refuse what they call the fool's choice. So that's when we mistakenly think there are only two options. Okay, let's start with the heart. Principle number two is learn to look, Become aware of nonverbal conversation cues, including your own personal cues, things that suggest a dialogue that's breaking down so that way you can put it back on track. So be conscious, be learning to look at the situation that discussion make it safe. Make sure that conditions for the conversation are appropriate, whether it's a closed door, a conference room, maybe it's breakfast with the employee off-site. What's going to make them feel safe? Harbor?
Speaker 1:that you can really have conversations that are critical and job and I think that piece of it was one of the best advice I got from some of the HR people that were training me is making sure that I took the time where they felt not only safe but special because I wanted to concentrate on them so that the eye contact and the communication was paramount and for that time that there was no distractions. I think nowadays you would say, leave your phone off. Ask them to turn their phone off, concentrate on the words that they're going to share, because that input is what you're really looking for in a good conversation and good leadership. Sorry, greg, oh, that's good.
Speaker 2:Thank you, thank you. Principle number four master your stories. So the first thing you want to do is stay in constructive dialogue, and that requires us to manage our emotions that we talked about before and understand the stories we tell ourselves. These stories also explain why people react emotionally and why the same circumstances may trigger different responses in different people. Principle number five state your path. Share your views, but do it in a persuasive way, and state your path. Principle number six explore the other person's path, the other side's path.
Speaker 2:By the time the conversation turns crucial, the other party is already moving through their emotions. That whole cycle of emotions are all fired up. So, besides managing your own emotions, we've got to help others try to retrace their path, and in order to do that, we can use the following listening tools Ask questions, mirror what you're seeing and hearing, paraphrase and we do a lot of that in really good, constructive conversations and courageous conversations Paraphrase what you're hearing. You're repeating what you heard to make sure that both parties are hearing it the same way, and make sure that you understand that prime story that the conversation's about. John, what would you add to that?
Speaker 1:Well, I think, if you're going to be engaged in that conversation, you're going to be able to make sure that there's something that you don't understand, or they're trying to be able to make sure that there's something that you don't understand, or they're trying to highlight. Take the time, because you're asking to get a complete picture of what you're trying to learn for that, for that crucial conversation, there is a problem and you want to make sure that it's all on the table. So you take the time and you, you make sure that you're engaging the person. And I can tell you a little tidbit of being in these conversations the tone, the pace, those pauses Try to make it as calm as you can so that the person has the ability to communicate. If there's arguments or a high voice or stern look, if you're not being receptive, you're losing opportunity to communicate. That's the key.
Speaker 2:Got it. Thanks, john. Principle number seven this is what kind of takes it home. Principle number seven this is what kind of takes it home. Uh, move to action.
Speaker 2:So, finally, we must convert the agreement into results. We've got to translate that things and we said verbally yeah, this sounds good, yeah, that sounds good into something that can actually be actionable. And you do that through a specific designs, I'm sorry, through specific decisions, and, of course, you got to follow up and check on it. So so consider the following Dialogue is not necessarily decision making, right? So you've got to decide how to decide. It sounds like another process, but it is.
Speaker 2:How are you going to make the decision? Who should be involved? Who cares? Who wants to be involved? Who knows? Who actually has the expertise? Who must agree? Who actually holds power? How many people should be involved? Do we have enough people to make a good choice? A lot of questions, but in order to move to definitive action, you've got to answer those questions. Then say it out loud. Say it loud and say it proud, as we used to say, make sure that everybody's hearing the same thing, the same way. Make assignments who, what, when and how will you follow up? And then, very important because there's a lot of talking going on. There's a lot of motion going on. Document your work. Make sure you've captured in print what you have agreed to for action.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and sometimes I can tell you you don't want to write while they're talking, but you, you hold the next 30 minutes to an hour after the meeting to document what was said, so that during that meeting you're not trying to scribe down everything that's being discussed. And and I can tell you that I never brought a recorder into the room you don't want to record these conversations, you want to have a conversation between two people. But when you get out of that meeting, document it. Document it so that it's fresh in your mind, so that you're not paraphrasing those conversations. You're going to paraphrase later, but you want to be as accurate as you can be after that discussion. If you really want to help the individual that you're discussing it with those action items and those things that you had just decided upon. That's what you're going to do, your follow-up on, and that really is the essence of helping someone in terms of conflict. Helping someone in terms of conflict, and understand this. This can also be applied to you and you could be in conflict resolution. It's a two way street. It's how you, how you conduct yourself, and how they conduct themselves. You want to be able to share. It's sure it's productive. So this example that we're talking about came from a book called Crucial Conversations Tools for Taking when Stakes Are High, and the authors of Patterson, greeney, mcmillan and Switzer A very good book, and I just want to share something that they had as part of a description of the book and I found it to be very, very on point, so I'm just going to try to repeat it to the best of my abilities.
Speaker 1:Communication is our first tool, our first technology. It is the very thing that makes us human. It's the kind of power that frequently is misunderstood and poorly applied. Most conversations involve little risk. We go about our days chatting, discussing, working, connecting, agreeing, and then, ever so often, we encounter conflict. Your boss shuts down your idea, your direct report refuses the work assigned, your child disobeys. It is in the face of disagreement where people struggle the most in terms of communicating effectively. It is in the face of disagreement where we have our greatest opportunity to influence the outcomes about what we care about. We can strengthen relationships by getting better results through communication. It largely depends on how you handle crucial conversations.
Speaker 1:Now, I would highly recommend this book because the seven points that we're talking about, that Greg had presented this description in terms of how communication is really the important element of handling bad situations and points in time where you really need to get results, and it's not going to be easy. That's an important tool to have in your toolbox. This really does have an application For me. I do have an example. I'm going to try to make it short and brief. To the point.
Speaker 1:I had a conversation about a person who didn't want to be a farmer, so let me let me explain, to start with the heart. We pulled an employee into the conference room that was away from the actual organization, itself reasonably remote, and asked a simple question of the employee of what's going on. There has to be something wrong that we need to address, because this isn't the way that you've conducted yourself in the past. The look and learn part of this is, as we were having this conversation, you could see that the employee was getting upset. Unfortunately, his face was turning red, so you know there was high blood pressure issues and his physical condition in terms of stress and anger were there and was obvious. Now, when Greg was talking about making it safe, it's where we were basically saying something a little bit different. Rather than environment, we said we're not firing you. That's not the point. So I'm trying to defuse that stress. This isn't a firing meeting. This is a meeting to understand what is happening to a good employee that definitely has some issues and we want to understand what it is. You've been aggressive with your teammates, you've been aggressive with your leader, with your, with your supervisor. We're just trying to find out the why and if there's something that we can address. So it's disarming, it's trying to make it a safe environment for the employee to share. Well, you know, bottom line that's, that's trying to master the story.
Speaker 1:We're trying to direct him to have the conversation and the interesting point that he brought up after a little bit of fishing was he didn't like what he was doing on the weekends, that he was constantly being pulled away from the job. And he said well, what are you doing on the weekends? Well, I'm helping my dad. He just purchased the farm and he needs help. I said, okay, well, um, did you, did you agree to building or helping your dad with the farm? And he said, well, to be honest, no, this wasn't anything that I wanted to do. I kids and I and the wife were helping at the beginning and there was that excitement of helping him and getting them settled. But it didn't take long before I was treated like an employee instead of a son. Okay, so now a path.
Speaker 1:We asked him well, what kind of alternatives? What have you done so far to try to communicate to your dad that this isn't something that is working out well? He said well, I really haven't. I've been avoiding it, so you know. Then we stopped and said the reason we're talking to you is on the job you're not doing. Well, you're definitely playing out your anger with your dad, with other people, and we're the lucky ones that are getting what you should be actually talking to your dad about.
Speaker 1:And I stepped back and said okay, your dad made a decision and you need to tell your dad that you're an adult, you have your own family, you have your own life. That wasn't one of your goals. It's dad, it's your goals, it's not mine. And you have to break it from your dad, even though he's not going to like it. You can only do so much to help someone, even if it is a parent. If they're doing something that affects your family, your job, you have to be able to tell them no, bottom line. Well, to be honest, it was interesting because there was a moment where he actually had a tear in his eye. He realized what was going on. He realized that he was going to have to have this conversation. He was appreciative, but it wasn't until later that he had actually acted on it, that he came back and he was just delighted that he had not only had the conversation with his dad, but his dad understood. His dad accepted his responsibility of hiring somebody instead of finding free labor from his son, and then he would do it when he had time, but not when it would affect the family, not when it would affect the job. It was on his time.
Speaker 1:The reason conflict resolution is important and the fears that are associated with conflict and crucial conversations and fierce conversations, which is another book that you should look into, but that's a different day in a different podcast. It has a lot of merit in terms of trying to improve someone's life and avoiding. It is like all those categories that Dr Durst described. The majority of them are trying to avoid those conversations. It's usually just the responsible level that understands that it has to happen and it can have a positive effect as well as a negative effect. So, greg, I think that covers the conversations about conflict resolution first conversations and critical conversations and all those kind of conversations. What are we going to be talking about next week?
Speaker 2:So, John, we're going to be talking about performance management.
Speaker 1:All right Performance evals and all that kind of good stuff. Yeah, so if you like what you've heard, yeah, my book Building your Leadership Toolbox is available on amazoncom and lulucom. My ebook is available on Barnes and Noble. You're listening to us on your podcast format for secret success and stories. Thank you, it's available on a lot of other popular formats. Dr Durson's books and MBR program is available on SuccessGrowthAcademycom. We also have on our Buzzsprout website a Buy Us a Cup of Coffee. That's kind of fun. You can get a hold of us with a message on that format. My email address is Wando75.JW at gmailcom and Greg, I can be reached at gpowell374 at gmailcom.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and the music has been brought to you by my grandson, so we want to hear from you. Drop us a line, and well, thanks, greg, thanks.
Speaker 2:John, as always Next time.