030: Milestones // Lauren and Frank Make Progress

In this episode, Lauren and Frank interview each other to check in on our progress of intuitive development. Our chat navigates through shadow work and inner child trauma healing, highlighting the transformative power of addressing internal issues to connect with our higher selves. Through this vulnerable conversation, we aim to provide hope and insight into the often rocky path of self-discovery and spiritual evolution.

Balancing a creative passion with a conventional career can feel like living two separate lives, but it doesn't have to be that way. We explore the struggle of feeling out of place in traditional roles while harboring artistic dreams, and how self-limiting beliefs can be reprogrammed through shadow work. By fostering self-compassion and stepping out of comfort zones, we invite you to join us on this collective journey towards emotional agility and spiritual growth. 

Transcript

Lauren: 0:01

Hello friends, In today's episode, Frank and I are interviewing each other and checking in on our progress of intuitive development, From shadow work to inner child trauma healing. We are on a boat and this is our voyage, our Claire voyage. I'm your host. I'm your host, Lauren Leon.

Frank: 0:23

And I grunt.

Lauren: 0:25

That's Frank. We are a married couple learning how to develop our own intuition, and this is episode 30 of Clairvoyaging. Wayfeather Media presents Claire Voyaging.

Frank: 0:50

Elevate, elevate.

Lauren: 0:53

Elevate. Frank just hit himself on the drum set and grabbed a crystal. To make everything better.

Frank: 1:02

I hit my funny bone. No one's laughing. Well, the love of my life is laughing at my pain.

Lauren: 1:16

I sure am Welcome to Claire Voyaging guys. This episode is going to be an update. We're interviewing each other Right? Frank, Kind of yeah, but first guess what, Frank? What? We got some coffees.

Frank: 1:23

No, we didn't.

Lauren: 1:24

Yeah, it's true, who Tamara, we got some coffees. No, we didn't. Yeah, it's true, who Tamara bought us some coffees.

Frank: 1:28

What if it's Tamara?

Lauren: 1:29

It might be Tamara. It might be Tamara. I'm sorry if I pronounced it wrong. Well, but thank you Big.

Frank: 1:35

T. Thank you.

Lauren: 1:36

Bought us some coffees. If you guys, if you want to be cool, buy us some coffees.

Frank: 1:42

Lauren's always threatening. How cool you are.

Lauren: 1:46

My level of my measurement for cool is whether you give us a review or give us coffees.

Frank: 1:52

Listeners, I'm offended on your behalf.

Lauren: 1:55

I am too. I am just offensive in every direction. So be cool. Wow, that's a way to treat your listener right. Yeah, um, buy me a coffeecom this isa shakedown slash claire voyaging. Okay, I'll stop now, but also thank you thank you all for your support. Thank you, what a blast so you currently have your hand on a crystal. What's going on?

Frank: 2:23

I'm having a day today.

Lauren: 2:23

Okay, that's fine so I'm touching a crystal. What's going on? I'm having a day today, okay, that's fine, so I'm touching a crystal.

Frank: 2:27

Yeah, and if you must know, it is a quite clear Brazilian quartz. I mean, it's called a Brazilian quartz, brazilian quartz and a Brazilian is not how many of them I have. It's from Brazil.

Lauren: 2:40

Oh no, oh no.

Frank: 2:45

Listeners. Here's what's going on so far. Lauren drafted questions to ask me and I have drafted diddly squat.

Lauren: 2:50

You have a blank notepad here, with your pen at the ready.

Frank: 2:55

In case I get bored, I'm going to be drawing bananas.

Lauren: 3:00

Okay, so the reason for this entire podcast is that we wanted to document our journey of intuitive development. So you know it started because it was like, if you can enhance your intuition and potentially develop psychic abilities, we want to see how true is that?

Frank: 3:24

Yeah, and, as you've heard us talk about along the way, we have discovered that, in order to do so, part of the journey is actually working out some of your own internal issues so that you are unclouded enough the veil is clear between your current self and your higher self. So, yeah, we didn't know this when we started this podcast. We lunged ourself into the world of getting over our traumas and our junk.

Lauren: 3:54

Yeah, I didn't know that this would be a journey of, like self-help, self-discovery and undoing some layers that still needed to be unsheathed, sheathed Is that a word?

Frank: 4:11

I wouldn't go for that.

Lauren: 4:12

I was a lit major, I should know. Anyway, I'd like to know, frank, what's been going on with your journey lately.

Frank: 4:22

Okay, for those of you who have been paying attention, some of this might sound repetitive. I apologize, but I'll give the quick version. When we first started this podcast, our niece Gwen had a psychic event that kind of made Lauren and I really jump into this stuff and want to know more about it so that we can help in her intuitive development. And after talking to a bunch of really cool people, we said, well, what the hell we should do this too. So what? A few months after, maybe even a month after we started this podcast, I lost my job, which, in retrospect, um, I had nothing to do with the podcast, maybe it did.

Lauren: 5:02

Who knows your spirit? Guys might be like duh dummy yeah.

Frank: 5:06

But anyway, I lost my job and in retrospect I do feel like that was more divine timing than anything, because while I did enjoy my job to a certain extent, it definitely wasn't my particular calling.

Frank: 5:20

I was making content, videography and stuff for, like, a travel wellness company and they're great, great folks over there but also, like it didn't, quite certain elements of it didn't align with my authentic self. And if we you know, if we were going to be serious about this project and serious about our own intuitive development you can't do things that aren't in line with your authentic self, and I'd be lying to myself if I told myself that it was going to be an easy transition going from my old way of thinking, my old way of living, into the mold and what I expected society expected from me and transitioning into this new version of like, trying to live authentically, do things that speak to me. That's not an easy transition to make, but it's an important transition to make. And, lauren, you started the day today asking me or telling everybody that I'm having a day and yeah, I'm having a day.

Lauren: 6:16

No, no, wait, wait, wait. You started the day saying you're having a day. Okay, did I say that? I said you're holding a crystal and you said I'm having a day.

Frank: 6:23

I'm having a day. I'm having a day. I'm not holding a crystal just for fun. I'm trying to elevate a little bit, and I'm not the most elevated person right now. You can't have good days all the time, no. So today specifically, what I'm personally going through is what I just said.

Frank: 6:44

It's not going to be an easy transition. I'm worried about all the normal human stuff. I have been working in the corporate world since I was in my 20s and during my travelogue where I talked about going to New Orleans. In that episode I went over how I was basically instructed through Tarot, through my spirit guides, that I am going to make a difficult transition but I would be supported. Now I do feel very supported, but I'm worried about those earthly things that I always have been paying bills, all that stuff because I haven't quite figured out how to monetize this stuff. And, as a former punk rocker, how to monetize this stuff and as a former punk rocker, I don't like bringing the earning of money into my art. I don't know if it's like I don't like it or if it's just that.

Lauren: 7:32

It's always been separated for you.

Frank: 7:34

It's always been separated. I've been a full-time corporate employee and a part-time creative, and I was talking to Lauren. She's heard me say this a few times. I'm realizing now that I am a full-time creative and a part-time employee, or I will be a part-time employee. I gotta find some work. I've applied to a couple of things, you know, but legitimately part-time stuff.

Lauren: 8:01

But you're shifting the way that you classify day job because I think you know we have like as creative people, we've been like that's just my day job, but it takes up so much of our time.

Frank: 8:17

Yeah.

Lauren: 8:18

And you, you have kind of been forced or allowed yourself to accept that like wait, it doesn't have to be that way, just because we've conditioned ourselves to think that you have to have.

Frank: 8:35

We are conditioned.

Lauren: 8:36

Yeah.

Frank: 8:37

And and and even unknowingly so people condition you and tell you, tell you what's acceptable and what's not.

Lauren: 8:42

Yeah.

Frank: 8:43

And I am trying to unlearn what I've been told is unacceptable.

Lauren: 8:48

Yeah, it's really interesting too, like anyone asking because everyone else is also conditioned a lot of people like just in part of their day-to-day asking, you know getting updates like what about Frank, what's Frank doing for work, what's frank doing for work, what's frank doing for work or what's did frank find a job. And it's so funny how it's just a normal question and I don't know if it's out of like expectation or concern or judgment or like I don't know where it comes from, but we, we do that as a people.

Frank: 9:27

I don't blame anybody who has a corporate job. I don't think that just because you work for a corporation, I don't think it means that you aren't living into your life's purpose. For me, in particular, I've always been something of of, you know, an outlier. Um, I do a lot of things. I have a lot of weird skills. It's really hard when I'm applying for a job, I look through the job lists and I can, and I'm like, or the job boards and I'm like I can do all of these things.

Frank: 9:55

I have to choose what I'm going to do in this capacity and that's really helpful if you are like an entrepreneur. But, um, that comes with some some issues also in that, like, if you're going to be an entrepreneur, what are you going to be an entrepreneur in? I can. I have started a, an audio book company, uh, with my friend Ksenia Hi, ksenia, if you're listening. Um, uh, we didn't get that far because, you know, life got hard. Starting a business doesn't mean you're going to succeed in it, but I could start a media company. I could make music videos I could like dive into it.

Lauren: 10:28

We did start a media company.

Frank: 10:30

Oh yeah, way feather, way feather media. Way, feather media is official Way feather LLC. Way. Feather is official.

Lauren: 10:36

We just made it official.

Frank: 10:37

Yeah, so we are. I hear I am ragging on corporations. And what does LLC stand for, Lauren?

Lauren: 10:43

Limited Liability Company.

Frank: 10:45

No, I think it stands for Limited Liability. Cool People.

Lauren: 10:48

Hey.

Frank: 10:50

Anyway, when I say corporations, I mean like corporate culture and that stuff. You know, when I join a company to assist them in my mutual, providing a service for their money giving, I don't want to be a part of the family. I'm not a part of the family. I'll be your friend and stuff like we'll be cool, but I don't. I, I don't want to identify as a part of your company. I want to identify as the skill set that I'm bringing, what I am providing, to that group yeah, right, you know I'm being like a cog in someone else's wheel.

Frank: 11:22

Right, right right.

Lauren: 11:24

But how does your spiritual journey relate to this realization?

Frank: 11:34

Yeah, so I recently so you might have heard on one of our episodes I talked about that we had been doing some shadow work. I'm not going to get into details because that is so very specifically personal.

Lauren: 11:49

But you went into a memory.

Frank: 11:52

Yeah, I went into a memory. That's a good way to put it. I went into a memory and it was a moment in my life when I, really unknowingly, was given a belief system that shaped like how I, how I, interacted with the world. Moving forward from that point, the point is.

Lauren: 12:09

you went into a moment and talked to yourself at a specific age and and like, basically realigned and told yourself, hey, it's not this, it's not this way it's okay.

Frank: 12:25

And like it's a little bit of shadow work and a little bit of inner child work yeah, I basically like went back and I was able to isolate a point in time when I had told myself that it was unreasonable or even stupid to try and make a living through the arts, which is so funny because I always lived with that in the background of my life. I lived watching people starting to come up on like YouTube and be content creators and like I you know, I'm, I was, I played in music, so I'm watching people I know like be in bands and stuff like that and I'm like, oh, at some point, I like decided to get into human resources. What was I doing? That is the wrong thing, yeah. And was I doing? That is the wrong thing, yeah. And I've been living as a, as a fish out of water for the last 20 something years, yeah, and the all the artistic stuff was just was the side hustle, the struggle, the struggle the guarantee of struggle.

Lauren: 13:17

You told yourself at some point that it had to be that way, because either you weren't good enough, or you weren't smart enough, or you weren't worthy or talented enough to have it be the other way around.

Frank: 13:31

Right and, as you all know, the world is not a meritocracy. So, no matter how much effort you put into it, if you're still putting effort into something on a part-time basis, you're not giving yourself a fair shot. You have to take that risk and believe in yourself and believe in your abilities. So I'm how does this relate to my spiritual journey? I've been talking for 15 minutes straight.

Lauren: 13:54

You I mean you started saying you did some of the shadow work.

Frank: 13:57

Yeah, but also it's more than that. It's shadow work. That is, has what I keep calling like a quantum effect on reality right now my reality, yeah, that has what I keep calling like a quantum effect on reality right now my reality, yeah. And so I'm doing reprogramming. I'm reprogramming, yeah, and it's a little rocky. If it was easy, everybody would do it.

Lauren: 14:14

Yeah, if it was easy, we would all just well, we wouldn't have traumas to discuss, we'd all just be dealing with them all the time and healing them and moving on and not have limiting beliefs or anything that keeps us in our own way.

Frank: 14:32

Yeah. So that's the big thing. Right now that I'm personally going through, I'm at a point where I have to figure out what I can take on without it being detrimental to like what I want to be and what I want to do and living into my authentic creativity. But there's another thing that goes along with this. I was told by our family therapist, our psychic family therapist, who we lovingly call Dr Claire, that he sees me as really doing well, moving into the future, eventually becoming some kind of like creative coach, helping people maybe work through some of their self-limiting beliefs so that they can then move on and be the version, the artist that they want to be in any field, which now, hindsight, is 2020. I think we discussed this with I want to say it was Courtney Dawson. But like all of the things that I've been working on and like I've acquired a bunch of experience in a bunch of different fields related to business and also related to the arts, I can do just about anything with. I'm not and I'm not bragging, that's just circumstance.

Lauren: 15:34

No, no, you. Have you used to say what? Why did I, why did I develop all of these stupid skills? And now, like it is a real skillset, you. And now, like it is a real skill set, you're. At first it was like why am I learning how to do design and also editing and also I mean so many things? And now it's like whoa, look what you've, look what you've created. Well, yeah, I mean monster but it's always been helpful.

Frank: 16:02

But part of that is also, as I've explained before, my reluctance to ask for help, which is also a self-limiting thing. We're a tribe. If nothing us us creative people.

Lauren: 16:13

Yeah. So, but I think is so bad at asking for help.

Frank: 16:18

I'm so bad at asking for help.

Lauren: 16:20

He would rather try to like learn how to make a shirt, then borrow a shirt from someone would it surprise you that I know how to screen print?

Frank: 16:29

I've made shirts in my garage not I haven't.

Lauren: 16:33

No, that does surprise me. I didn't know you did that no, like manual screen printing my friend, my friend, and he's like, oh, I could just, I could just build that. And I'm like, can you stop?

Frank: 16:45

Anyway, my point is that, like, if nothing, at the end of all this I I feel good about that concept of maybe coaching people in the future in in like a life coach capacity or something. I don't know. I have to look up what there is yet, Maybe a little extra training moving forward. I want to get to a point where I can overcome this hump and at that point I really feel like I can be so helpful to people who have ever doubted themselves creatively and have, like, put themselves in a position of struggle when they didn't necessarily need to.

Lauren: 17:17

And using your, you use your intuition to know what someone needs, and it's almost like you are quiet and you listen to what comes in. You're like receptive, and I don't know if it comes from someone else's spirit guides or from the universe or what, but a lot of times you're able to tell someone exactly what they need to hear and you see the big picture. So you're able to just kind of distill it into actionable things.

Frank: 17:46

Lauren actually pointed out the other day, like when I was talking to her about something that was kind of difficult. Lauren said you are in a flow state when you are talking about this stuff and I'm like son of a biscuit, I am in a flow state and it's not coming from an ego standpoint or anything like that. Like genuinely wanting to help, yeah, and like just in my mind Pulling from source.

Frank: 18:08

Yeah, and in my mind I'm just saying like I'm taking your fears or I'm taking your desires and concerns or whatever it might be, and I'm just fully baking them so you can see it, cause I really feel like half of the struggle and self doubt stuff it comes from half baked ideas. You don't want to take this fear any further, because what does it look like if you fully think about it all the way to fruition? You it ends up being like unrealistic. Your fear tends to be unrealistic. You know what I mean.

Lauren: 18:36

Yeah.

Frank: 18:39

Like you know what I mean. Yeah, like you know, if your fear, usually our fears, ended and then I'm poor and everybody hates me those are my fears I mean come on, I'm alone and everyone's left me sorry abandonment issues. So like, yeah, anyway, without all of this experience that I've acquired and without the age that I am right now, like coaching would not be possible. I needed this Now. I'm going to be 40 this year and that's that's geezer status for the youngins who need the help.

Lauren: 19:11

Geezer status. So if you need coaching, I'm not coaching yet. Leon.

Frank: 19:18

I'm not coaching yet. Creative empowerment coach. That's I. I did land on that. I think that's I like it. I need to see if that's a thing.

Lauren: 19:26

You know what's fun is that part of this podcast is like we're we are.

Frank: 19:33

Anyone listening and following this journey is like actively hearing us throw things at the wall and seeing what sticks yeah, yeah, and I'm sure some of you say you guys are really cool, and the other half of you say what a bunch of dummies. And you know what. You're both right and I'm okay with it.

Frank: 19:55

So yeah and we'll probably talk about this more with your stuff, Lauren. But like, another thing that I realized is everyone always says we were talking to Megan and Lisa in one of our last episodes, Uh, and she was saying how like you just can't care what people think about you.

Lauren: 20:10

Yeah.

Frank: 20:11

And and I'm, I'm, yes, anding that full improv status. I've never done improv. I've just watched Lauren do it a lot, and I was telling Lauren the other day it's really hard to not care what other people think, but I think it's okay to care what people think, as long as they're the people that you care about thinking things about you. So hold on, that's confusing. What I mean is that, like you can do whatever you want to do and be authentic, someone is always going to judge you. The point is that that's more of a judgment on them than it is on you and what you can do. So once you identify who is judging you for the thing that you're trying to do, you don't have to participate or engage in them anymore yeah, because they'll never like you and they'll never like you or anything that you do.

Lauren: 20:56

There are a lot likely.

Frank: 20:58

There are a lot of people in the world. So once you weed out the people who aren't for you, the rest of the people are yeah, and that's a big deal. That's that's empowering. So it's not about not necessarily caring what people think about you. It's about making sure that you care in the direction of the right people, because once you've established your tribe, once you've established your community, you maybe should care about what they say, because those are your people.

Lauren: 21:22

If you're like looking for affirmation and you start scrolling through YouTube comments like you're in trouble, yeah, because a lot of times it's just a 15 year old with a chip on his shoulder.

Frank: 21:35

Yeah and probably a real literal Frito a chip on his shoulder. Yeah, and probably a real literal Frito-Lay's potato chip. Yeah, you suck. This is the dumbest thing I've ever seen. Psychics aren't real, okay, listen. Psychics aren't real, okay, this is bullshit. Get a career.

Lauren: 21:55

Go to a mental hospital. I'm sorry, I read it well, thank you for that update. Also, I gave you a Reiki attunement, a Reiki placement, a couple weeks ago.

Frank: 22:11

Yeah, as for actual as for actual things, that isn't just like internal turmoil and working through that stuff. Lauren raked me. I'm attuned I'm attuned.

Lauren: 22:23

It works at first. We like this doesn't work on does anyone really know?

Frank: 22:26

I mean, I guess, unless you're like super intuitive, you know, uh, the good reverend william meyer, yes, hello will. Friend of the show.

Lauren: 22:33

Friend of the show so is his mom, mary mary.

Frank: 22:35

He said when he got attuned like he was sweating, because like he was feeling a lot of heat an intense experience for some, so I wasn't. But that said, since I've done, I've attempted like a level one reiki, level one reiki on you and you made my headache go away I made a headache go away and my eyes were hurting and what would you say about the heat radiating off my hands?

Lauren: 22:58

Yeah, your hands were very hot on my face.

Frank: 23:04

Guys, I got the steamy biscuits on my mitts Steamy biscuits. Yeah.

Lauren: 23:08

Do you think having a Reiki placement helped to align or unblock or open up any of your chakras? Did you feel any internal healing from it? Or or or no.

Frank: 23:21

I don't know that I felt any internal healing, but it's hard to believe something that you can't see. You know what I mean. Like that's a universal statement, but, um, you know, having seen how much you've helped people, how much Reiki has helped people, how much Reiki through you has helped people, and as I'm a natural skeptic, but like I believe that, I believe that. So, even if I can't, you can't see something or necessarily feel something that you're supposedly, like you know, receiving, I believe in the power of it and because of that, if anything changed, it opened up my mind to being able to believe that I can now do that too.

Lauren: 23:59

Yeah, and you still have yet to do level two.

Frank: 24:03

Yeah, lauren's going to level two, attune me.

Lauren: 24:05

And then you get the symbols.

Frank: 24:07

I get the symbols, I get to basically play Fruit Ninja in the sky, making symbols.

Lauren: 24:14

Doctor Strange.

Frank: 24:15

Oh yeah, I get to Doctor Strange everybody.

Lauren: 24:16

And Fruit Ninja.

Frank: 24:17

So oh yeah, I get to Dr Strange, everybody and Fruit Ninja. So yeah, I'm not saying I don't believe in Reiki, that's not all what I'm saying. But I am saying like, even if you can't believe something, you can utilize it.

Lauren: 24:23

Yeah.

Frank: 24:24

Which is like a concept that I threw in our journal too, talking about how, like you know, but like the knowledge of them, can help you assess yourself. So I think Reiki has helped with some self-assessment, as well as assessment of other people, maybe tapping into some intuitive abilities that I already have. My intuitive abilities, my intuitive abilities, aren't as concrete yet as, like the a lot of the people that we've interviewed on the show.

Lauren: 24:53

That's just practice practice and just. Carolyn Swift Jones says it's just.

Frank: 24:57

It's just practice.

Lauren: 24:59

Some people are more practiced than others.

Frank: 25:01

So yeah, like just being aware of your when I worked at a wellness company, your intero.

Lauren: 25:08

Interoception.

Frank: 25:09

Interoception, that introspection, interoception, aware of your internal operatings, basically so I think, that interoception, aware of your internal operating, basically so I think that Reiki has increased that for me, for sure. What else did?

Lauren: 25:23

we do. I love that.

Frank: 25:24

Megan Alisa told me to stop telling myself that I used to be able to astral project and just go do it already. So I've been. I started attempting it again and, yeah, I actually like got to a vibrational stage which it's been a while I didn't actually project or anything yet but it's like the waiting room for actual popping out of your body. So I think I'm on track to get back on that game, which could be a big deal. This is the way I would meet my spirit guides and stuff like face to face, and I'm trying to think if I have any other big updates.

Lauren: 25:57

I think that's pretty much it well, that's kind of a lot of stuff for eight months of doing this podcast. That's a lot of time to have some pretty significant shifts mentally and internally and all that we're hitting the ground running here.

Frank: 26:15

You know there was a life before Gwen's event and a life after it. It was a significant milestone in our existence.

Lauren: 26:24

Yeah.

Frank: 26:24

And like once you know this kind of thing, once you realize that this kind of thing isn't just in the movies and in the shows, like how do you not engage in it? It's, it's ignorance to a certain extent.

Lauren: 26:35

Yeah.

Frank: 26:39

Or like feels, like fantasy. It's not. So we had some catching up to do and we're taking it seriously. How about you?

Lauren: 26:46

well, what's really fun about doing all of this together is that we're kind of encouraging and inspiring each other to do this work, do the like internal healing work, and we had like a breakthrough week a couple of weeks ago where we were like we've removed the blocks, we've removed some mental blocks, because I did some inner child healing and you did the shadow work, and it's like what's that movie with Bradley Cooper where he takes the pill and his brain expands, or whatever?

Frank: 27:25

Limitless. Yeah, that's a killer film, guys.

Lauren: 27:28

So good, but there was like all the ideas came pouring in. You know like wait, it doesn't have to be just one thing that we do. How can we do more things?

Frank: 27:42

You can be more than one thing.

Lauren: 27:44

Yeah, I was just making a video saying be all the things. Be all the things that you want to be I. This is like something that I keep learning, too is that I keep classifying myself as one thing at a time. I've just realized this, like yesterday, oh yeah, I've not heard this.

Frank: 28:01

This is news to me.

Lauren: 28:02

Yeah, I keep. It's almost like I compartmentalize my own labels. Like I had a hard time giving myself the label of filmmaker when we were doing um, when we were writing and producing short films and our pilot, I was like, oh that's, I don't belong in that category. I keep not allowing myself to belong in a group. Like when I was doing improv, I went back into improv and I was like I live far away from LA, I just do, I'm doing this for fun.

Lauren: 28:33

And you know I was doing it with all these actors and I didn't put myself into the category of like actor or performer. I was just like that's for you all. And I also like put myself into a category of like I'm too old. I was like 32, with like a bunch of 26 year olds thinking like I'm so much older than all of you. And all of that is such limiting judgmental belief that only I was thinking about, because no one else was. They'd be like who are you an actor Like, do you do commercials or do you do like you do auditions for TV shows or whatever? And I'd be like no, that's for everyone else in this class. So that's part of this limiting mindset. Just, I can be. We can be more than one thing. I don't know why. This is just something that I'm like really making myself accept.

Frank: 29:27

Well, also, there's no real, there's no real benefit in othering yourself. If you are considering yourself other from a community that you want to belong to, yeah, like, why other yourself?

Lauren: 29:39

I don't know. I mean, I othered myself in so many situations because it's a worthiness thing and that's part of the trauma. The trauma healing that I've been doing is like going back to. Where did that feeling of self-worth come from, or lack of self-worth, and I've just told myself I don't belong in that setting or I'm not worthy to be an equal in this group, and that's just a judgment only from me.

Frank: 30:11

The thing that's gnarly is that it's not just a judgment. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Lauren: 30:16

Oh yeah, for sure.

Frank: 30:18

It's the same thing that I was doing. If you tell yourself that you are a hobbyist creative and you do all the steps to become a hobbyist creative, you're only being creative as a hobby. Yeah, I am. I'm a part-time musician and you're only dedicating part of your time to being a musician. You will only ever be a part-time musician.

Lauren: 30:37

Yeah.

Frank: 30:38

If you're telling yourself you don't belong in a community, you're only going to going to expend the amount of effort that is part-time.

Lauren: 30:44

And it's only allowing like half a foot inside the door instead of just jumping in all the way. So what I'm working on is like just jumping, Betting on yourself. Yeah.

Frank: 30:55

Bet on you.

Lauren: 30:56

Yeah.

Frank: 30:57

And you don't have to do it alone, not in a like destructive American way, you know, like the toxic individualism. You have a community, most likely the community that you're trying to get into once you win.

Lauren: 31:10

Yeah.

Frank: 31:10

And if you are encountering gatekeeper people, back to what people think of you, those aren't the ones you're looking for they're not my people anyway. Those aren't the droids you're looking for.

Lauren: 31:18

And what's crazy is that I didn't. I haven't encountered those types of people.

Frank: 31:23

It's like I am.

Lauren: 31:24

It was self-fulfilling, it's self-fulfilling. I am that person for myself.

Frank: 31:28

You are.

Lauren: 31:29

I am the gatekeeper for me. What a mean thing to do. Guys, if any of you can relate to this feeling, just let's stop all together. Let's stop doing that, because it's not fun and it's the you're not hurting, you're only hurting yourself look, in my case it was risk aversion.

Frank: 31:50

I didn't want to risk being my own version of a loser right this is the same same.

Lauren: 31:56

It's risk aversion.

Frank: 31:57

Well, your risk is being rejected. You don't like. That's your biggest fear is the fear of rejection.

Lauren: 32:03

Yeah. So you put yourself in a position where, if you were rejected for some reason, you wouldn't care that much, cause you're only cause I'm going oh well, this was only, this wasn't a full time thing or this wasn't like my thing, right, yeah, but it's not putting everything on the line or not fully engaging in something, because I'm too afraid that I will be rejected friends.

Frank: 32:28

Use your use, your risk aversion or your fear of rejection to identify the people who you should not be participating and engaging in. They they're not your people. Everything comes with inherent risks. Everything gives you the possibility to be rejected. You will be rejected, but you know that that rejection is nothing but a redirection onto the path that you need to be going on anyway.

Lauren: 32:53

Yeah.

Frank: 32:53

It's not always going to be easy.

Lauren: 32:56

Right.

Frank: 32:56

But it will always be the right thing to do. Lauren, we're talking about you, Lauren.

Lauren: 33:03

Yes, I know. So a lot of this realization is coming from a place of inner healing, and the inner healing is coming from doing slowing down Reiki, doing meditations within those Reiki sessions and things like that where I am digging deeper to not only connect with my own trauma, try to connect with my higher self. And in order to do the things that I want to do and thrive, I need to heal the stuff that I've just been like holding on to all the stories. So that's been part of my. It's a spiritual journey, it's a healing journey and it's like you can't grow spiritually without healing internally, and part of that, too, has been, I think, deepening your intuition comes with that.

Lauren: 34:04

So I've been able to help a few clients by being aware of these tools that I've learned because I'm in this mentorship. I'm in an intuitive healing mentorship program and I've learned some new things healing techniques, using Reiki and using, like, tapping into intuition to see what someone's, what someone's aura telling me. Like I just ask, like, what do you need? What do I need to know? And because of this work I've been doing, I've been able to point out trauma and how to heal trauma. Like, hey, here's what worked for me. Write a letter to your. Write a letter to your you know four-year-old self or or an age when you needed some, a different story, a different belief.

Frank: 34:56

But, like, part of the thing I've noticed with your working with clients is that I mean you're on that journey with them.

Lauren: 35:03

Yeah.

Frank: 35:03

Like it's not. Like you are the holder of all the information and you're sharing this with them, Like you are journeying with them, and along the way you learn something about yourself too and you learn some new technique that you need to utilize for your own healing.

Lauren: 35:19

Yeah, and then part of doing that work has helped me impart that wisdom onto other people. It's also helped me become I feel like I have. Part of it, too, is trusting myself, because if I want to do these healing sessions, I have to trust my own intuition, and that's been something that I've had to pay more attention to my intuition and not doubt it. But this goes back to just in general, me not doubting myself so much. I have answers, I just need to believe that.

Frank: 35:56

And even if you don't have the answers, you have the ability to navigate the question until you come up with an answer.

Lauren: 36:03

Yeah.

Frank: 36:04

And that's I think that skill set is. The thing that you're finally building on is you don't need to have the false confidence of like having an answer. Yeah, you know how to get an answer.

Lauren: 36:18

Yeah, yeah.

Frank: 36:20

And and you have, you're developing the tools at your disposal.

Lauren: 36:27

Yes, that's a big deal deal it's been pretty cool.

Frank: 36:28

You've always been afraid of being bad at stuff. Yeah that you've used that as a reason to not start totally I don't like.

Lauren: 36:38

I don't like being new to things and I don't like being bad at things because of the internal judgment.

Frank: 36:43

It it's all the judgment about myself and do you judge people when they're bad at something?

Lauren: 36:48

No.

Frank: 36:50

You only judge yourself.

Lauren: 36:51

I only judge myself.

Frank: 36:52

We're only, we're only mean to ourselves.

Lauren: 36:54

I'm so. I'm so mean to I'm so mean to myself. I'm really trying to be better at it. It's just because I've decided a long time ago that to be small is safer and to keep myself small and not outspoken or not say too much or not try to not risk too much has kept me safe.

Frank: 37:23

But at the expense of what?

Lauren: 37:25

Learning more or being like part of more of a community or a lot of things.

Frank: 37:34

I think, like I genuinely feel like, if you don't, you I'm using the universal. You know, I generally feel like if I'm using, the universal you now. I generally feel like, if people don't engage in, like in softening this rigidity in their belief systems about themselves and how things work, that this is how you get old. You get old, you get stuck in your ways, you don't know how things operate, you become not adaptable you have zero agility, mental agility yeah and it's, and then you pass that forward to your kids yeah and the next generation and they have to deal with that stuff yeah it's dangerous not to take care of yourself yes, I'm.

Lauren: 38:18

I'm glad that I'm learning all of it now. You know, and I, this is the time that I was supposed to learn it all, so that's okay. I had a lot of trauma to work through so, and, you know, still do, obviously, but some of this work has just really helped me not only realize what my limited beliefs are, but dig in to go okay, now it's time to heal them and release them.

Frank: 38:47

Yeah, and we've had the benefit. You and I have had the benefit of having a supportive environment in which to do this, and not everybody has afforded that.

Lauren: 38:57

Yeah.

Frank: 38:58

If any of those people are listening right now. We want I want to make sure that you feel like we are in that community and in that journey with you, cause it can feel at times lonely when, if you've accidentally surrounded yourself by a bunch of people who want you to live into your own mental limitations.

Lauren: 39:17

Or your own, the worst version of yourself, because that's what they're used to.

Frank: 39:21

Some people don't like when you change and it sucks and they have to get over it.

Lauren: 39:26

Cause it threatens them and like, makes them hold up the magnifying glass to themselves, and they don't want to.

Frank: 39:33

Who told us that? Someone told us this.

Lauren: 39:35

Uh, nicole Marie.

Frank: 39:36

Nicole Marie.

Lauren: 39:38

She said sometimes people are triggered by your healing.

Frank: 39:42

Yeah.

Lauren: 39:43

And that's okay. You just don't have to spend as much time with that person or bring them along.

Frank: 39:48

bring them along for the healing if they're willing. If they're willing. But, more importantly, like really, I want to emphasize again what I was saying about if anybody is on this journey and they feel like they are at the precipice of change but are afraid of the repercussions, please know that we're there with you, lauren, and I, like that's what this community is, that's the community that we're trying to build is like a safe place to do that. Yeah, you know it's weird because I'm I am a pretty private person, but here I am like literally talking about like my own insecurities and issues, like for anybody to listen to.

Lauren: 40:21

Yeah.

Frank: 40:26

But it's because, you know, I want to surround myself with the people who are also doing that thing.

Lauren: 40:30

And also, I don't know, sometimes it just shows you. It's a way of letting other people know that it's okay, it's okay to feel that way and that they're not alone in what they're feeling you're not alone.

Frank: 40:45

Yeah, you're not alone.

Lauren: 40:47

We're not alone also, if this, if this does resonate and you feel like you don't have anyone else to talk to about it, send us an email. Yeah, dude, open it. We're like we love hearing from our listeners so clear voyaging. Podcast at gmailcom. What a shill that, that's just literally. That's not a shill.

Frank: 41:06

Okay, fine.

Lauren: 41:07

I don't want anyone to feel like I want to start the process of healing but I don't know how.

Frank: 41:14

Yeah, I know.

Lauren: 41:15

Yeah, so write to us and maybe we're a community like no, there's no judgment.

Frank: 41:21

Yeah, I don't know, and and again, like even if you like want to come on the show or something and like talk about stuff, I think we're going to start interviewing non-psychics just about their journeys to talk about this kind of thing.

Lauren: 41:31

Yeah, people who are beginning their spiritual journeys, or Let me let me fix something.

Frank: 41:36

We're all psychic, I want to say not as practiced.

Lauren: 41:40

Non-professional.

Frank: 41:41

Non-professional yeah. People who are trying to figure it out using the tools at their disposal, like Lauren and I, are.

Lauren: 41:47

Yeah.

Frank: 41:48

We're not going to discontinue like the, the psychic thing. I love talking to these people.

Lauren: 41:53

Yeah, they're awesome. People lined up, people lined up. But.

Frank: 41:56

I also like I want to start. It doesn't have to be ghost stories, nothing like that, it could just be. What are you up to?

Lauren: 42:04

This is, we're normalizing the spiritual journey.

Frank: 42:07

Yeah.

Lauren: 42:08

This is I don't know. This is a super awesome adventure and a journey that I don't want to keep saying journey, but that's what it is.

Frank: 42:19

This is a voyage. This is a different episode. This is a different kind of episode, but, to be honest, I feel better. I feel like I had a therapy session.

Lauren: 42:28

You held your crystal some of the time and then at some point, you let go and you elevated.

Frank: 42:35

I mean I'm still a little grumpy, but yeah, we're good, You're much better.

Lauren: 42:39

I talked it out, man, but also, yeah, like me too.

Frank: 42:41

Yeah.

Lauren: 42:42

Thank you for being here with us. Yeah dudes, yeah dudes, Thank you listeners, Stay tuned for more.

Frank: 42:50

Yeah, we have a lot of episodes lined up. Things are coming. It's going to be cool and yeah, thanks for bringing my dad on for our Father's Day episode.

Lauren: 43:00

Today's his birthday actually.

Frank: 43:01

Happy birthday Mikey. Happy birthday Michael.

Lauren: 43:04

Papa Mike.

Frank: 43:06

Like good parents, we have to go pick up our kid now from school, so we got to go. But we'll catch you soon.

Lauren: 43:13

We love you guys, see ya.

Frank: 43:15

Bye. Thank you for listening. Visit wwwClaireVoyagingcom for show notes, merch, or just to say hi. If you'd like to support our journey, visit wwwbuymeacoffeecom. Backslash clairvoyaging. This has been a production of Wayfeather Media.