Can wisdom and service deepen with age? Join us as we sit down with Bill Bridgeford, a passionate Peace Corps recruiter who found his true calling after 35 years in the private sector. Bill shares his inspiring story of lifelong admiration for the Peace Corps, which he saw as a beacon of heroism since childhood, and how he finally realized his dream of serving with the organization later in life.
Curious about the true essence of the Peace Corps experience? Listen as Bill unpacks the profound impact of the Peace Corps' commitment, stressing the importance of cultural adaptation and community-driven projects. He shares insightful anecdotes from his service in North Macedonia, highlighting both the extraordinary and ordinary moments that make the volunteer journey unforgettable.
Is it ever too late to make a difference? We challenge the notion that aging limits one's potential for impactful work, showcasing inspiring stories of older volunteers carving out new horizons into their 60s and beyond. Bill outlines the various volunteering options within the Peace Corps, from traditional 27-month commitments to shorter, specialized response roles. Discover how the Peace Corps ensures volunteers' medical needs are met 100% of the time and gain insight into the application process designed to match volunteers with roles that align with their skills and passions. This episode is a testament to the lifelong gifts and sense of purpose that come from meaningful service, proving that it's never too late to contribute to global communities.
Bill came to international humanitarian service after spending almost 35 years in the private sector as an entrepreneur, consultant and corporate manager. He served as a World Teach Volunteer in the Republic of the Marshall Islands (2009-11), and as an Organizational Capacity Development Advisor in Myanmar (2013-15) prior to serving as a Peace Corps Volunteer in North Macedonia (2016-19). His overseas work has spanned education, youth empowerment, entrepreneurship and sustainable livelihoods, and building communities’ engagement capacities.
Bill’s 30 months of Peace Corps service was spent at a high school in the North Macedonian city of Ohrid (pronounced “OAK”-rid), a UN Cultural Heritage site on the shores of Lake Ohrid. He and his colleagues developed the “Student Resource Center”, which offered student-centered skills development curriculum in IT, Business, Community Leadership, Conversational English, and Personal and Life Skills. He launched the GLOW/YMLP Youth Leadership Club and mentored its members through community service projects, many of which focused on raising community awareness of the need for environmental stewardship. He supported a consortium of diverse community organizations for a community garden which brought the generations together for knowledge exchange, taught leadership skills through community service, and raised awareness of food insecurity issues affecting neighbors in the Ohrid community. He also mentored his fellow Volunteers in grant development and management skills and served as a resource to new Volunteers in North Macedonia after his return to the United States.
In his present role as a Peace Corps Senior Recruiter, Bill brings his passion for diversity, equity and inclusion to audiences as he carries the message of service to college and university campuses, veterans’ groups, seniors, and other civil society organizations.
He holds a BA in Political Science from the University of Connecticut, and an MA in Applied Community Development from Future Generations University.
Can wisdom and service deepen with age? Join us as we sit down with Bill Bridgeford, a passionate Peace Corps recruiter who found his true calling after 35 years in the private sector. Bill shares his inspiring story of lifelong admiration for the Peace Corps, which he saw as a beacon of heroism since childhood, and how he finally realized his dream of serving with the organization later in life.
Curious about the true essence of the Peace Corps experience? Listen as Bill unpacks the profound impact of the Peace Corps' commitment, stressing the importance of cultural adaptation and community-driven projects. He shares insightful anecdotes from his service in North Macedonia, highlighting both the extraordinary and ordinary moments that make the volunteer journey unforgettable.
Is it ever too late to make a difference? We challenge the notion that aging limits one's potential for impactful work, showcasing inspiring stories of older volunteers carving out new horizons into their 60s and beyond. Bill outlines the various volunteering options within the Peace Corps, from traditional 27-month commitments to shorter, specialized response roles. Discover how the Peace Corps ensures volunteers' medical needs are met 100% of the time and gain insight into the application process designed to match volunteers with roles that align with their skills and passions. This episode is a testament to the lifelong gifts and sense of purpose that come from meaningful service, proving that it's never too late to contribute to global communities.
Bill came to international humanitarian service after spending almost 35 years in the private sector as an entrepreneur, consultant and corporate manager. He served as a World Teach Volunteer in the Republic of the Marshall Islands (2009-11), and as an Organizational Capacity Development Advisor in Myanmar (2013-15) prior to serving as a Peace Corps Volunteer in North Macedonia (2016-19). His overseas work has spanned education, youth empowerment, entrepreneurship and sustainable livelihoods, and building communities’ engagement capacities.
Bill’s 30 months of Peace Corps service was spent at a high school in the North Macedonian city of Ohrid (pronounced “OAK”-rid), a UN Cultural Heritage site on the shores of Lake Ohrid. He and his colleagues developed the “Student Resource Center”, which offered student-centered skills development curriculum in IT, Business, Community Leadership, Conversational English, and Personal and Life Skills. He launched the GLOW/YMLP Youth Leadership Club and mentored its members through community service projects, many of which focused on raising community awareness of the need for environmental stewardship. He supported a consortium of diverse community organizations for a community garden which brought the generations together for knowledge exchange, taught leadership skills through community service, and raised awareness of food insecurity issues affecting neighbors in the Ohrid community. He also mentored his fellow Volunteers in grant development and management skills and served as a resource to new Volunteers in North Macedonia after his return to the United States.
In his present role as a Peace Corps Senior Recruiter, Bill brings his passion for diversity, equity and inclusion to audiences as he carries the message of service to college and university campuses, veterans’ groups, seniors, and other civil society organizations.
He holds a BA in Political Science from the University of Connecticut, and an MA in Applied Community Development from Future Generations University.
Speaker 1:
So are you looking for more inspiration and possibility in midlife and beyond? Join me, leslie Maloney, proud wife, mom, author, teacher and podcast host, as I talk with people finding meaning in Moxie in their life after 50. Interviews that will energize you and give you some ideas to implement in your own life. I so appreciate you being here Now. Let's get started. All right, everybody, welcome back to another Meaning in Moxie After 50 episode, and we have such a cool episode for you today.
Speaker 1:
In particular, I've been very curious about this topic myself for a long, long time. I have Mr Bill Bridgeford with me and he has a back really interesting story in general, but he has very much connections to, and works for, the Peace Corps. Before the interview, before we started recording here, and we were saying that most people have the idea that the Peace Corps is for young people and that is not true. He himself has been a volunteer with the Peace Corps all over the world some really, really cool stories and he now works for them and he is a recruiter. So welcome, bill. First of all, glad you could be here.
Speaker 2:
Thank you, Leslie. I really have been looking forward to this.
Speaker 1:
Me too, me too, so I guess I want to start out with you. Were 35 years in the private sector, entrepreneur, consultant, corporate manager. How?
Speaker 2:
did you find yourself getting involved with the Peace Corps? Oh, we're cutting right to the chase here aren't we Always always.
Speaker 2:
Okay, well, this is my little secret is that I am, in fact, older than the Peace Corps. Peace Corps was founded in 61. The first mission went out in 62. And at that time I was four and a half, five years old when the first group of volunteers got on the plane to go. It has always been part of my life and back then Peace Corps volunteers were seen as heroic, as heroic as, like the Mercury and Gemini astronauts. You know right, we're little kids. You know here's these guys going into space and then there's these other guys going to change the world, and that that has always stayed with me. And uh, and also uh, as a, as an american of color, uh, back in the early 60s, to see people who looked like me getting on the plane as equals to go change the world was also very powerful. And 55, 55 years later, I was sitting in the plane at Reagan International getting ready to go with my group and all of a sudden I realized that I was one of those people who have been my hero.
Speaker 2:
So, yeah, the other volunteers. Like what's going on with Bill? Why is he sniffling, you know? But really it just all of a sudden hit me. You know that here I was, yeah powerful feeling.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, so another full circle moment. So you were a little guy, of course. President John F Kennedy created Peace Corps for those who don't know, and how. So it was just something you saw in the media. Did you know somebody? I mean how you were a little guy. So how did that?
Speaker 2:
enter your awareness. It never left my awareness from childhood. It was always one of those things that was one day, one day.
Speaker 1:
Okay.
Speaker 2:
And I thought about applying fresh out of undergraduate way back in the late 70s, but, frankly, I wasn't ready. And then, as is with the case with so many uh people who are considering serving later in life, uh, life intervened and uh, as it did for me, and but the thought never went away and, um, in my early 50s, um, I found myself in a position where I could decide pretty much without restriction how I wanted to live the second half. And the little voice in me said maybe it's time. And uh, and I looked around and said you know, uh, maybe it is. So I started preparing and actually I wasn't quite sure if I was good enough to be a Peace Corps volunteer again, because the little kid was still looking at the heroes, sure.
Speaker 2:
So I went abroad to work for two other organizations, spent a couple of years 2009 to 2011, as a World Teach volunteer in the Marshall Islands and came home for a bit. And then I went out with ActionAid Myanmar and spent two years and a bit in Southeast Asia. The Marshalls taught me that I could live and flourish in an environment and culture that were not my own. Flourish in an environment and culture that were not my own, and the Myanmar experience taught me that the private skills I had developed were transferable to international development. Well, and once I settled those two questions with myself, I said okay, I'm ready to apply to Peace Corps. Yeah, to apply to.
Speaker 1:
Peace Corps.
Speaker 2:
And I did and, yeah, I went out. I went out in 2016 to North Macedonia. I stayed there for as a volunteer for over for two and a half years. I was there a total 33 months because I extended my service by an additional six months. Okay, and that brought me. I came home in June of 2019, went to work for the agency October same year and I still am with the agency.
Speaker 1:
So you hit on so many things there. I think somebody considering this sort of experience, somebody considering this sort of experience, would have many questions like can I thrive in a culture that is very different, maybe, from my own? The language barriers, et cetera Pretty typical, right? Is there some training or pre-training when you go into those cultures, like that for the volunteers?
Speaker 2:
Oh, yes, you know it really.
Speaker 2:
The preparation starts with the application process. My title again is recruiter, but my job is not to get people to press the submit button, it is to make sure that they are fully informed when they do so. I am really a mentor, a facilitator and a guide, but because I have an obligation to the mission and the legacy to make sure that who I send is ready and has a high probability of seeing it through. This is a fact that in our history, almost a quarter million American men and women from all walks of life have done this and Peace Corps volunteers have served, and we actually may have passed 145 countries by now. I mean, if you look at the map of all of the places countries have invited Peace Corps volunteers or Peace Corps mission to come, that is an impressive legacy and the Peace Corps is one of the most respected development agencies on the planet. So you know, again, I have an obligation to the people who served before me to make sure I'm passing the torch to people who know what they're getting themselves into.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, so it sounds like there's a lot of support number one for that person, or you know that there is a great deal of support.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, there's a great deal of support and that's it Again. I was just talking about before before. The way the program works is that you are abroad, in your country of service, for 27 months. The first three months you are in training. We don't even call ourselves Peace Corps volunteers, we're Peace Corps trainees. The training is rigorous. Okay, because there's a great deal that we need to know. Half of the training is devoted to language acquisition. Because in an 11 or 12 week to language acquisition, because in an 11 or 12 week program you are going to become functionally fluent in whatever language is being spoken in your community. We have some excellent immersion programs and it works. If I could learn Macedonian in 12 weeks okay.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, if they can teach me another language in 12 weeks, they can teach anybody, Wow. The other half of the training is everything else. There's very deep and involved country background briefings history, culture, social mores you know how things work in your new playground, if you will. There's a lot of technical skills training associated with the sector that you have been invited to serve in. There are safety and security briefings, because the safety and security and welfare of the volunteers that is the primary mission of a post. All right, it's not the project work that we do, it's making sure that we're safe and well and healthy. So all of these things, uh, are included in the other half of the training. And at three months, uh, you know we are, hopefully we are ready.
Speaker 2:
And one of the, you know you mentioned support before and the way that I phrased it when I was telling my friends back home what it was like was that, you know, failure is not an option. Okay, Again, I have to be honest. I struggled with my language acquisition. I do just don't have the gift of language, and every Monday through Friday, we were in language lessons from 8 am to 12 noon every Monday through Friday, Homework every night, homework on the weekends. Every Monday, I'd be caught up with my little group by Friday. That's like Bill Yana, who was my language facilitator. Bill, you didn't make any plans for Saturday, did you?
Speaker 2:
No, Bill Yana, Okay, See you here tomorrow for some extra tutoring, and if I hadn't picked it up on Saturday, then there would have been tutoring on Sunday because they were not going to let me fail.
Speaker 1:
Wow.
Speaker 2:
And, and I was not going to fail.
Speaker 1:
So you know, really impressive, yeah. So I've always wondered why the Peace Corps has chosen that two-year mark. I've talked to a few people that have been in the Peace Corps over over the years and they always, you know, and I've read a little bit and they always talk about that two year. It's a two year commitment basically.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, the three months of training, then another 24 months of service in your community.
Speaker 1:
Yes, yeah, and so what is it about? Why? Why the two year commitment? Is there a shorter experience for somebody that wants to dip their toe in the water? Is there a shorter experience?
Speaker 2:
for somebody that wants to dip their toe in the water, there is response volunteering, which is a separate way to serve. But to just be a Peace Corps volunteer or, for clarity's purposes, a regular volunteer, the 24 months is is really enough. It's, it's, it's. It allows the volunteer to actually make a meaningful contribution along with their, you know, alongside their, their host country colleagues. And, honestly, a lot of us don't think two years is enough.
Speaker 2:
There's many of us who, all of a sudden, it's like, oh my goodness, we're going to the mid-service conference, we're halfway through, and I know I felt that way. It's just I'm just getting started, you know, and that is one of the reasons why I ended up extending my service. You know, I'm not sure what the percentage is of volunteers who extend, but it's pretty significant because we start things and we want to see them through. You know, two years again, is anything less, would not be enough, would not be enough. And and two years is a lot to ask of a person, particularly since 95% of our volunteers are usually just out of an undergraduate or graduate program. You know, when you're that age, two years is a is a lot of your life. You know, when you're an oldster like myself, it's not so much.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, and so is there. Are the volunteers flying home at all? I mean, what is the? Because I know there must be culture shock. It probably depends on where you end up Some more a stronger culture shock than others. But is there if for somebody who just says, wow, I'm really homesick, and, and maybe you get that more with the younger ones, the younger volunteers, uh, how do you handle that? Or what are, what are the requirement or not requirements, but the rules as far as going home and that sort of thing and then coming back for breaks uh, well, you know, first off, y'all get homesick, all of us, and even so-called seasoned travelers like myself who had done it twice before.
Speaker 2:
Um, yes, you can go home, of course you can, uh, but it's, it's the same thing. It's like, okay, you've gotta, you've got to have, uh, leave time. You have to have approved time off that you can use. You have to schedule your travel in accordance with, you know, professional conduct and the standards of the organization that you are assigned to. There's obviously limits on, you know, the duration that you can be away. Yeah, so all of those things are there. But again, it goes back to the very beginning. That's part of my job as a recruiter to make sure that people understand you are going to get homesick, and part of your preparation to interview for this is to have thought about how you're going to handle when it happens, because, again, we really want people to think it through.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, yeah. So it would be like any other, any other job where you would have some leave time.
Speaker 2:
But you know, yeah, you know all those considerations. Absolutely. It just happens that you're probably on the other side of the world.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, but. But something very interesting is part of it is well, instead of you going home to that, have people come and visit you instead, because you're going back to what you already know, but they would be coming out to a brand new experience and they will see you in it.
Speaker 2:
And you know, and especially when you're talking with younger people, because, as you can imagine, parents are concerned about the welfare of their child and such and you know but I, of their child and such and you know, but I, I do say, like you know, if your parents come over to see you, they are going to see you differently because they are going to see what you've chosen to do and it's going to add a new dimension to the relationship that you have with your parents, did you?
Speaker 1:
find? Did you find in your experience when you were traveling you know, macedonia, marshall Islands, myanmar did people, did you have that happen? People came over to see you more than you coming back.
Speaker 2:
Well, the Marshalls in Myanmar were a little bit too far for people to come out, but this was something that I thought about before I said the probability is extraordinarily high that you will not see anyone for the time you are gone, and it's just part of my temperament that I'm not a two-week vacation guy. I want to go for an extended period of time. I did have one of my closest dearest friends come visit me in Macedonia and you know we road tripped Greece, so you know, for a few weeks. Yeah, it was lovely.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, yeah, when you think about those experiences, do you have any favorite stories that come to mind? Yeah, I'm sure there's some, yeah.
Speaker 2:
I'm sure there are. You know it's. I've sort of gotten past the, the snapshot phase of this. Whenever I think of my service in North Macedonia, it's the film that always comes up to carry the metaphor. There were so many moments there, that many moments there that I will treasure, and they were so normal.
Speaker 2:
I remember meeting my primary counterpart. Every Peace Corps volunteer has two host country support networks waiting for them in their community when they get there. The first is the primary counterpart, and that is your, the individual in the organization that has volunteered to be your partner for the entire time you are there, and the other one is your host family, because in every community there is a host family who has volunteered to look out for you, who has volunteered to look out for you whether you live with them or not. So and I was so fortunate in both of those because Maria and I hit it off the minute I stepped off the bus for the very first time and my host family, the Jovanovskis. I actually rented an apartment from them and, as you can imagine, at the age of 60, I did not need another mom and dad, but Jovay and Luka looked out for me.
Speaker 2:
And we are still Maria and I talk on the phone several times a month and we don't talk about the past, we talk about the present and the future. You know she gets on me. She's like have you lost any weight yet? I'm like, well, I'm working on it, maria, and I get on her because she hasn't told Boris, her son, to do his own laundry yet. And the Jovanovskis their son, who was one of my students, was here in the US on an exchange program and we hung out together and I know that I could go to Macedonia right now. I could knock on the Jovanovskis' door and within 10 minutes Luca would have a table full of food in front of me and Jovan would be toasting me with a small glass of rakia, saying welcome back. There'll always be a seat at their table for me and that is an incredibly warming thing to know.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, it's heartwarming to hear it and it's beautiful because really I think that when we travel and this is, of course, more than traveling but when we find ourselves in new communities and we spend some time there, it's the relationships, right. That's really, that's really the good stuff.
Speaker 2:
It's all about it. Yeah, I'm sorry, it's all about relationships. Again, it's not about. It's not about the project work it's about. It's about working together to achieve something.
Speaker 1:
Yeah.
Speaker 2:
And, as a volunteer, we are going home every day. We know this and no matter how attached we get, we know we are going home that day. So really our mission as volunteers is to work ourselves out of the job, and it is my belief that the highest compliment that we can be paid at the end of our service is when your colleagues look at you and say we are so glad you came, but we don't need you anymore, we've got this.
Speaker 1:
Right right.
Speaker 2:
And that means, if they say this to you, it means that you kept faith with the mission and why you were there.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, how does the organization choose communities to go into for these different projects?
Speaker 2:
The communities actually volunteer themselves. All right Now. And this, that dynamic exists through the, from the negotiations that take place at the national level to bring a Peace Corps mission to a country, all the way down to the individual volunteers. So Peace Corps doesn't just show up in a country, the country has to ask us to come there. And then there's the negotiation that goes on between two national level organizations, if you will, and at every step of the way everybody involved has to demonstrate their, not only their capacity to handle it but their commitment to handle it. So that was negotiated with Peace Corps.
Speaker 2:
It's now North Macedonia and the national government at the time and I believe we are on our 26th year in North Macedonia you know our missions go. We are still in the first countries we went to, like Ghana. We've been in Ghana since 1962. We just started a mission to Vietnam, like two years ago. All right. So, as I said, there's that long history. Okay, but that's initially a host country invites us and then organizations within the country request a volunteer and the organizations have to demonstrate capacity and commitment. Someone in that organization who is going to be the primary counterpart, the volunteer's partner, has to demonstrate capacity and commitment. The host family in the community has to demonstrate capacity and commitment, and not until all of those things are in place. Does a volunteer show up there?
Speaker 1:
Okay, okay. Yeah, I didn't realize some of those programs were that ongoing.
Speaker 2:
That's a long time. Well, that's one of the validations that we again. We are a highly respected development organization. We have an amazing history.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, how do you and maybe you don't encounter it as much in the more ongoing long-term projects, but how, when you're? I would think when there are new projects with the Peace Corps going into newer communities, there's probably a lot of just one culture coming up against another culture in terms of how we see the project, how we're going to interact and all of that. Did you ever have experience where you had a cultural difference that you had to work through, that you weren't necessarily anticipating?
Speaker 2:
you had to work through that you weren't necessarily anticipating Constantly, but not, not for, not for the reasons that you might think. All right, peace Corps does not come in and say at any level, we, this is what we are going to do here. The projects that are undertaken in a community were decided by the community. My responsibility to my organization in North Macedonia, which was a high school in a Macedonian city called Oak Ridge. I did not come into the school saying, okay, we're going to do this, this, this and this.
Speaker 2:
I was there for two months listening, talking to everybody in that school the administrators and staff, the teachers, the kids, even speaking with the maintenance staff, because everybody in that school knew more about what was going on than I did. And it wasn't until I had gathered everyone's perspectives on pretty much every issue at that school that the dots started to connect for me in my head and I started to see ways that I could apply my particular mix of skills to helping to find ways to resolve the issues that were important to them, and it was I described. I described not only Peace Corps volunteers, but really any volunteer and development work. We are servants with expertise. We can have the most incredible skill sets there are. We can be top of our field in a particular subject area. We can be top of our field in a particular subject area because they knew how to, how I could best apply things.
Speaker 2:
And you know and that's one of the interesting evolutions that happens with us when I first arrived there, I mean I'd done my homework, but the reality is I was probably thinking like a Macedonian about 5% of the time, and and. But by the time I left Macedonia, maria said you know, bill, you're about 85% Macedonian.
Speaker 1:
Wow, what a compliment.
Speaker 2:
It really was, I mean, but I was inspired to to make the journey because I had such great support.
Speaker 1:
I would imagine that's at the center, that's that for for any volunteer coming in like that and doesn't matter where that is. The real inner work is to switch that mindset from, because we're all, we're ethnocentric, right. I mean, we come in, this is our perspective, and I think sometimes Americans come in, maybe more so than others. This is how maybe you know, culturally, we tend to be leading with. You know, this is how we, you know, culturally, we tend to be leading with you know, this is how we do it kind of thing. Um and so to shed, to shed.
Speaker 2:
that is really the inner work yeah, and it is always a work in progress that you can always improve on it. And you know, this is actually one of the challenges I feel of being an older volunteer is because we are typically because of our life and professional experience, we are used to stepping up and taking charge. It's not that we, it's not an arrogance, it's not a, you know everybody stand back. You know I'm here to save the day, we're just used, we're just used to it and it takes, uh, you have those moments when you're like, okay, I really, I really need to step back, I really need to slow down, I really need to again take the time to just really absorb where I'm at you.
Speaker 2:
You know, again, my first two months I didn't do anything except really listen. Drank a lot of Turkish coffee as well, you know, just sitting in the in the teacher's lounge, you know, talking shop, you know, and it takes time for people to open up to you as well. You know, initially everybody was on their best behavior, and no one's going to tell you the truth when they're on their best behavior. But after a while they're just like, oh yeah, it's just built, you know, and they started just telling me what they really felt, and that's when the thing started to coalesce.
Speaker 1:
Yeah.
Speaker 1:
So, and I think the other piece of that which we, we talk a lot about on this podcast is allowing yourself to not be perfect because you're, you know, stepping back, you're not the one in charge, we, because when we're older, we have become very, we become experts, or we have a lot of expertise because we've had more time to practice right, and so stepping back and being the newbie, that can be really uncomfortable and I'm sure the language and language barriers and all of that that that really is you want to talk about stepping out of your comfort zone.
Speaker 2:
Well, you know, yes, absolutely. But this is. This is again going back, and I actually learned this from my country director in North Macedonia, mark had. He had a couple of kind of stock sayings, and one of them was a Peace Corps volunteer becomes comfortable with being slightly uncomfortable, all right, and it's very, very true. Because, uh, you are always, you know, you get comfortable at a certain point and then you're it's like okay, well, okay, got this. Now I gotta step out a little bit more, you know, and and go through the process again and, uh, but that is part of the fun of it, you know, and and I'm not, I'm, I am definitely not going to try to tell anybody that every day is a good day, you know, and I, I am the first person to acknowledge that my service was extraordinary.
Speaker 2:
It was a moment where it all came together in the moment. For me, that is not unusual. It happens, and I would like to think that, because we started off on such a good foot, in a way the universe smiled on us when we needed it to. There were a lot of what I call headbanging days, leslie, but there was never a moment where I looked in the mirror and said I made a mistake in coming here. You know, you always are just like, okay, today didn't go well, what can I do tomorrow, you know, to get it back on track, or to improve it a little bit, or just to restore enough equilibrium where I can start to sort things out. Yeah, yeah, but that's, that's out.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, yeah, but that's that's, that's part of it. So I would imagine that whole experience has really made you, you know, stepping outside your comfort zone, slowing down, changing your perspective, realizing that there's other perspectives out there. It's really made you in more in the present moment than ever before. When you came back and you got around people who knew you before that experience, did they notice the changes or is it just more of an inner thing?
Speaker 2:
They certainly did, but I don't think I can use the language that they used. It's something a little like. Otherwise, it's like you know something, richard, you're still the same blank blank blank. You've always been, but you're a kinder gentler, more thoughtful, blank blank blank. So that was pretty much the nature of uh, several conversations with uh and these are friends that I have had since junior high school. Okay, they have been part of my life for decades. Yeah, um, and I feel different um as well, and you know, and and this is something that's interesting again for older volunteers this is one of the. The things that's special just to us is that there is still learning that we do, but there's also unlearning that we do, and you realize that, you know, even if you are a broad and open-minded person, you kind of realize oh, my goodness, I'm more insular than I thought.
Speaker 2:
And insular than I thought and and you open up and you know one of the. I was given two gifts during my service. The first was what I said before about everything to coming together in the moment, and I was able to use everything I have ever learned in service to my school and my community, even, you know, including the wisdom from the mistakes made. The second gift was that in doing so, new doors to learning were opened for me, and to be in your 60s and to look up one day and see a brand new horizon, that is a gift.
Speaker 1:
Yeah.
Speaker 2:
All right. So yeah, those were the two things.
Speaker 1:
When you say, was it? It was a new interest, or a new. When you say a new horizon, that sort of thing was something you hadn't considered before.
Speaker 2:
Horizon in the sense of you know I am, I am. You know I'm on the other side of the hill, but I am still. I can still live a life of meaning. There are still opportunities for me to continue to contribute to the betterment of the world absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 1:
That never ends. That never ends.
Speaker 2:
There's always new horizons you know, you know never too late but there's too many of us.
Speaker 2:
We end. We start to think, oh, I'm too old, or you know I'm not, I'm not healthy enough, or I'm not. You know, I don't move as good as I used to those. No, I refuse to accept that. You know and there's a number of you know I have never been able to see myself kind of coming into the glide path and like I'm going to go play golf three times a week. Not that there's anything wrong with that, it's just not me. You know, I still. I still feel like I've got a few more decades of mischief to get into. I feel like I've got a few more decades of mischief to get into, if you will. Good, mischief, right, I still I'm not finished yet. Yeah, and if you are feeling that you are not finished yet, then we should probably have a talk after the podcast.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, yeah, no, I mean there's so much good stuff there, yeah, yeah, no, I mean there's so much good stuff there, you know, the new horizons, the emptying the cup so that you can fill it up with new perspective and new knowledge, and such good stuff. That translates it, doesn't? You know, it's not just to the Peace Corps, it translates across anybody's life, depending on what mischief they want to get into.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, you know, I mean I, I have. I have reluctantly come to the understanding that my body is getting older and I don't move. You know, I still feel like I'm in my twenties, but I am clearly not. But my mind is still young, and that is what is important, that is really what makes the difference. As long as my mind stays young.
Speaker 1:
I'm going to keep living. Yeah, yeah, and the wisdom that being around for a while, that you gained, I mean, you shed a lot of the stuff that took up your energy. That wasn't important, and so there's a lot to be gained there.
Speaker 1:
Oh, yes, absolutely up your energy that wasn't important. And so there's, there's a lot to be gained there. Oh, yes, absolutely so. Getting back to some of the nuts and bolts, for somebody who might be interested in this and and pursuing it and you had mentioned that there's a there's the classic two 27 months Peace Corps commitment and then there's, you said, a softer Peace Corps volunteer opportunity. Is that how you phrased it?
Speaker 2:
Well, I wouldn't call it softer, okay, but we have something called response volunteering, and response volunteer positions are you can think of them as shorter term, highly focused, task oriented, essentially technical, advising positions where there's, say, there's an organization in the country it could be a ministry office, it could be a civil society organization but they have a very specific need for a subject matter expert to come in and address an issue and that is what a response volunteer does. Now there were a couple of response volunteers in North Macedonia when I was there as a volunteer. One of them had been recruited by the Ministry of Education to revamp the national testing procedures. They were, you know, outdated they, you know they were, they needed, they needed the work. She came in for a year, took care of it Job over, she goes home. Took care of it, job over, she goes home. Um, another, the other response volunteer, was brought in to work with a civil society organization that had gained some really good traction in partnership, you know, with the government. Uh, you know they were, they had developed that partnership, but they, they needed to organize themselves to build their, their future capacities. So a response volunteer who was a subject matter expert in organizational capacity development was brought in to to address that issue. That was all that they focused on.
Speaker 2:
Now and those positions. They say the ranges are three, six, 10 months, sometimes a year. That's really not my side of the street for recruitment. So you know, when I am looking into responsible positions with somebody, it all depends on what, what the opening is requesting and it's essentially if you are a perfect or almost perfect match with the desired skills and the required. The required skills and the desired skills apply. That's as simple as that, because they are looking for the perfect or almost perfect match.
Speaker 2:
The regular volunteering is, as I said, to distinguish. I'll call it regular volunteering. That is more. We work in six different sectors education, health, community economic development, youth in development For that think, youth leadership development. The environment and agriculture.
Speaker 2:
I was an education sector volunteer, english language instruction at a high school, secondary school in Macedonia, but the project work my colleagues and I did spanned all six sectors. You know it's more fluid, if you will, because volunteers that's part of our mandate which really make yourself as useful as you can in your community, provided you've been asked to do so by the community. What you're doing is in collaboration with community members and that you make sure that you have the capacity to see it through. Because, again, one of the challenges of being a volunteer at any age is that you're going to see things that your little voice says I can do something about that. But then you have to say you know I'm already doing something about five things and if I take on one more I may drop them all. And I think this is probably another one of the challenges that older volunteers need to be aware of.
Speaker 1:
Just the other one of you know, knowing you got to take the second seat sometimes, frequently is don't take on too much yeah um, you know, uh, yeah do they place, uh for, for people that are, you know, a couple that want to go off and do something like that? Is there placement for couples?
Speaker 2:
Many. Yes, absolutely, and there's a number of countries that encourage couples to come. All right, you know, it's really, it's. It's a huge part of the equation is stability. A huge part of the equation is stability, and and it's just a truism that two people what do they say? A burden shared is a burden halved. Well then, as a couple, you know supporting each other. Now, there are, and there are, a number of options.
Speaker 2:
I have worked with couples who served in the same community, uh, but they're always going to be working with a different organization, you know. So one partner was working at a school, the other partner was working at a local NGO. I have seen scenarios where couples were in the same country but in different communities and got together, you know, maybe every two weeks or once a month. I have seen scenarios where two people served, but in different countries. You know, it really all depends on the individuals in the couple, in the partnership, how they want to serve and what they are willing to. The conditions under which they are willing to serve. Yeah, all right, but we don't give them it's like, hey, it's this or that, it's. Let's find something that is the best possible match for your needs, because, again, the more we can make it a win-win for all parties concerned, the higher the probability that the volunteer or volunteers are going to finish.
Speaker 1:
Are you aware of who the oldest volunteer has been in the organization's history?
Speaker 2:
Not their name but my, and currently my understanding is that we have a volunteer out in the field right now who is in their mid eighties.
Speaker 1:
Cool.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, there is a legend of someone, I believe it's something like this they retired at 62 and then they went out as a Peace Corps volunteer. They have gone out like seven times, wow, to be a Peace Corps volunteer and and as far as I know, they may go out again. I am going out again, I'm going to serve again. Absolutely this. I I cannot think of a a better way to finish a well-lived professional life oh yeah then by doing this yeah, this is my, my next tour.
Speaker 2:
That's going to be the flag on the summit of my everest you know, yeah, absolutely yeah.
Speaker 1:
Um yeah, this is such good stuff, such good stuff that that that applies across life for everybody.
Speaker 2:
Um well, in fairness again, I'll be the first one to say everyone that's listening, you can tell how powerfully my service affected me. Yeah, take it with a grain of salt, I mean, you know. Again, it's not everybody's story is going to be my story. Yeah, not everybody's story is going to be my story, yeah, you know, but still it really can be an extraordinary experience for a person.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, so the nuts and bolts. As far as you find your own accommodations, peace Corps fly no.
Speaker 2:
How does that all?
Speaker 1:
work.
Speaker 2:
Well, it begins again in the application process. For some time we have been moving towards a zero-cost application process. There were some expenses associated with your application, like getting fingerprints Okay, those things cost. The medical office will say, okay, hey, you've got to go get that wisdom tooth fixed before you can get on the plane. And and we found that some of those, some of those costs were preventing highly qualified candidates from applying because they simply didn't have the $50 to do their fingerprints, because they simply didn't have the $50 to do their fingerprints. So we have been working towards a zero cost application process.
Speaker 2:
Essentially, your Peace Corps covers your expenses, beginning with you traveling to your staging location, because we all come together. The group that is going abroad to a country all comes together somewhere here in the US, philadelphia, depending on where they're going depends on where their staging happens. For me, for instance, my staging was in DC, all right. So the 50 of us came in from all over the country and met in DC on a Friday afternoon. We had, you know, the warm and fuzzies introductions, things like that, and the next morning we were on the plane to go.
Speaker 2:
Peace Corps covers your round trip airfare to and from your country of service. They give you a generous, but not unlimited, baggage allowance. There is, while you're in training, you receive what we call walking around money All of your meals, accommodations, that's everything is covered. All of the training, transportation done. When you serve again, all of the expenses are covered. You receive a living allowance that permits you to live comfortably, not extravagantly, in your communities of service you are. Your housing is subsidized. It could be a yurt in Mongolia. It could be a stilt house on the side of a mountain in Guatemala. It could be a one bedroom apartment in Oak Ridge, north Macedonia. It all depends on where you serve, but all of the housing has been vetted by Peace Corps for security, privacy, comfort and safety. Every volunteer has a private space of their own. It could be a bedroom in someone's house If you're living with your host family again, or it could be that apartment but there's a lock on the door and it's your private space.
Speaker 1:
Okay.
Speaker 2:
Again, safety is of paramount importance to us.
Speaker 1:
Yeah.
Speaker 2:
Our medical care is fully subsidized, and I don't mean medical insurance, I mean medical care. Every Peace Corps post has its own Peace Corps medical team. They are local doctors but they've been vetted to US standards and they have been trained in the United States to be Peace Corps doctors. Okay, we get other benefits Again. There's student loan relief, which well for me. I'm still paying all my student loans, so I'm glad it's there, but there's, you know, pay. There's vacation days that we accrue there, you know, there's all the kind of benefits that you expect in a normal job or regular job.
Speaker 1:
There's an educational benefit too.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, it's called the Coverdell Fellows Program and that is a lifetime benefit conferred on Peace Corps volunteers who successfully complete their service. A Coverdell school is obliged to subsidize a minimum of 25% of your school expenses, up to 100% depending on the school and the program. I just finished a Coverdell fellowship in December of last year and I just went to my school's graduation last weekend to get my diploma and my school. Not only did they subsidize 25% of the grad school expenses, but they also gave me six credits towards the degree because of my Peace Corps service. You know they determined that. You know this, this student, the work he's done in the field that covers the curriculum in two of the classes we teach here, you know. So they gave me the credits for it.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, uh, there is. There's also and this this appeals to the younger volunteers we also have a preferential hiring status with the federal government for the first year after we conclude our service, which is basically will get you into federal employment. And what a lot of people don't realize is that most federal jobs I think it's around 60% of them are not available to the public. You have to be a federal employee, yeah it's internal Right.
Speaker 2:
So you know. So there are those benefits, but for again, oldsters like ourselves, that may not really be. That's not a selling point. It's big of a selling point as it is for someone who is, you know, at the beginning of their professional lives. Sure, sure, I would think, just seeing that, you know, at the beginning of their professional lives.
Speaker 1:
Sure, sure, I would think. Just seeing that, whether you're working for the federal government or not, being able to put that experience on your resume, boy, that would catch my eye. If I was somebody that was hiring somebody younger, I would say, wow, that tells me a lot about them that they would even step into that role.
Speaker 2:
It is not only a testament to your professional skills and experience, it is also a testament to your character and I can tell you this from my private sector life I've hired returned Peace Corps volunteers. Life I've hired returned Peace Corps volunteers and really it was. If you see the initials RPCV for returned Peace Corps volunteer on the resume, that is a resume that I, as the hiring decision maker, I want to read that.
Speaker 1:
Right right.
Speaker 2:
Oh yeah.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, so so it's, it's nice. Not that that's, that's not the reason you do it, but that's a nice penny you get out of the experience as well.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, and it's not, and none of us are out altruists. Ok, there's always going to be. Well, what's in it for me? Can I afford to do this? Is this going to advance my longer term goals? Yeah, all right. So, and that's that's. That's totally legitimate, all right, but I don't think it is the the first reason why people serve and and nothing is given to us. We earn those, we turn those, those benefits.
Speaker 1:
All right.
Speaker 2:
And you know this is one of the myths about Peace Corps is, people hear the word volunteer these days and they think, in this age of volunteerism, they think, oh, do I have to pay to do this? And it's like no, we call ourselves, you know, volunteer means free. Or I'm paying to do it. No, we call ourselves volunteers because we volunteer means free, or I'm paying to do it. No, we call ourselves volunteers because we've chosen to do this. We've chosen our to. You know, pick ourselves up and for two years we've Go away from everything familiar, from family and friends, to go do something of meaning that we're not sure we will be successful at, but we're still going to try.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, yeah, like that. Have I missed anything that as far as some things that you'd want people to know about the Peace Corps, I mean, I know there's so much, but as far as the nuts and bolts as we move into our wrap up mode here, Well, I think there is something I should, a couple of things that I should address again.
Speaker 2:
For us Olsters, all right Is that the first step in the process is to apply, and if you're going to do this, you absolutely want to work with a recruiter who is in proximity to you. And if you are an older volunteer, ask to speak to a recruiter who is also an older volunteer. All right, I constantly have my my recruitment colleagues say hey, Bill, will you talk to someone? Because you can tell them what it's, you can tell them the things that they're going to want to know. Yeah, if you are successful with your application and your interview and you receive an invitation to serve and accept it, you still need to get through the medical and legal clearance processes. They are thorough, they are in depth, and how should I put this? I looked upon my medical clearance process as a test of character, because it was like you want what else from me.
Speaker 2:
Wow, pretty and you know well it is not. Peace Corps needs to be sure that the country we are sending a volunteer to can support their medical needs 100% of the time. We do not put people through the medical clearance process because we're only taking perfect physical candidates. That doesn't exist, all right. We are looking to make sure that the country can support your needs 100% of the time. This is not the kind of deal where it's like, ok, you're going here and all you have to do is bring you know a 30 day backup of all your meds, all right, just in case. Just in case is not good enough. You can get them 100 percent of the time, or we're going to put you somewhere else, all right.
Speaker 2:
There are countries that they will not place you because there's something on your medical history. You know I have some knee issues, so Peace Corps was not going to send me to Nepal. You know, if you have a peanut allergy, they're not going to send you to East Africa. All right, that kind, those kinds of things. It's all about safety, health and welfare. It can be frustrating at times. I'm not going to kid you, but persevere. And because it's the medical office's responsibility, to be sure, sometimes you may have to advocate for yourself. But again, these are kind of the detailed things we talk about when we're in the one-on-one conversations.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, that makes sense, sure.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, but again, I'm sure that many people that are going to listen to the podcast are like well, I never took no for an answer before, I'm not going to take no for an answer now. I'm going to keep going to. I'm going to keep going until I'm absolutely sure I can't go any further.
Speaker 1:
Sure, sure, yeah, yeah. Well, listen, this has been such an enlightening conversation for so many different reasons. And I know you are a busy guy. Bill is actually on leave right now and he's taken time this morning to chat with me anyway, so I so appreciate that and you are just leading a life of meaning and in a very moxie filled way, um, and it just sounds like you continue to look for those new horizons absolutely thank you thank you, can I? Can I share one?
Speaker 2:
more thing do I have?
Speaker 2:
time sure, okay, we are of generations that were raised to do our duty. We have always taken care of business and I think, maybe, perhaps for a lot of us, uh, enjoyment and duty were kind of mutually exclusive things. That's just, that's that those were our circumstances. I was very good at what I did private sector but there was always this little voice that said Bill, you should be somewhere else doing something else. No matter how successful my business was or how well I did in my corporate life, or how happy I made a client, the voice was always there. Since I started doing volunteer work abroad, I've never heard that voice again, which tells me that in the middle of my life, I finally found my true calling. So you know, this is this is what it's meant, this is what why we are supposed to be here, this is why we're here yeah um, to do, to be meaningful.
Speaker 2:
And we certainly I think a lot of us find that, you know, a lot of us get wrapped up oh I gotta. You know, I've got to make money, I've got to support my responsibilities, etc. Etc. And that's honorable. But as we get to a second, a second half, and we start to reflect back on the journey that we've taken so far, I think it becomes more about meaning.
Speaker 1:
Yes, for sure.
Speaker 2:
And I think this is this is why you do this yourself. Yeah, all right, all right To to bring that word out. So I'm I'm very happy that you asked me to be part of this.
Speaker 1:
Yes, I'm very honored. I'm very honored and we will put all the all kinds of links. If people want to dig deeper into this and reach out to Bill, we'll have all that in the show notes so that they can find that information.
Speaker 2:
Great, excellent. Look forward to it.
Speaker 1:
Thank you so much once again, and I really I look forward to chatting with you down the road to see what else you're up to.
Speaker 2:
Thank you. Thank you very much. This has been great.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, you take care. Now Enjoy the rest of your time and get into some fun mischief.
Speaker 2:
I have an agenda.
Speaker 1:
I already have an agenda for the day. I like it. I like it, all right.
Speaker 2:
You take care. Talk soon, thanks, leslie. Bye-bye.
Speaker 1:
Okay, bye. If this podcast was valuable to you, it would mean so much if you could take 30 seconds to do one or all of these three things Follow or subscribe to the podcast and, while there, leave a review and then maybe share this with a friend if you think they'd like it In a world full of lots of distractions. I so appreciate you taking the time to listen in. Until next time, be well and take care.
