S1,E34: Chef/ Pretty Bird, Founder - Viet & Alexis Pham

As the sizzle of Viet Pham's signature fried chicken fills the air, my taste buds tingle in anticipation of the story behind his journey from a Malaysian refugee camp to the heights of culinary fame. Alongside his wife Alexis, Viet unfurls the tapestry of his life, from early days flavored by Vietnamese home cooking to the heat of competition on Iron Chef America. Their tale is a delectable blend of cultural identity, love, and the relentless drive to perfect a classic American dish, leaving listeners with a hunger for more than just a bite of that crispy, golden goodness.

Viet's story is one of transformation, from a stable finance career to the adrenaline rush of the kitchen. He and Alexis share their personal and professional milestones, including the birth of Pretty Bird and the creation of a positive work culture that sets a new standard in the culinary world. As they recount the evolution of Salt Lake City's dining scene and the meaningful connections made along the way, it's clear that their commitment to innovation and community is as important as the celebrated flavors they bring to the table.

Join us as we celebrate not only the savory success but also the everyday moments that make life rich and full, like finding joy in the chaos of moving or sharing milestones with someone special, all against the backdrop of a shared love for food and wine. With Viet and Alexis guiding the way, we explore the keys to their success and their infectious enthusiasm for the journey ahead, promising that the adventure is never far from the next delicious discovery.

Please be sure to like, review, follow, subscribe and share the podcast with your friends and family! See you next time 

https://smalllakecity.buzzsprout.com

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:10

We ended up on this island. I was literally born in a treehouse that my dad built. For the first time in my life, I got fired and I didn't know until five minutes before we started filming that we were going to go against Bobby Flay. That to me at that moment was the American dream, you know, being an Iron Chef, america. But I remember eating this fried chicken and then, like it blew my mind, you know. So I had told myself, like man, one day when I get out of fine dining, I remember eating this fried chicken and then it blew my mind. So I had told myself, like man, one day when I get out of fine dining I'm going to do fried chicken.

Speaker 2: 0:40

There'll be seeing something fun soon. Ooh, that's exciting yeah.

Speaker 3: 0:45

What is up everybody and welcome back to another episode of the Small Lake City Podcast. I'm your host, eric Nilsson. And do you ever wondered what it would be like to be born as a refugee in another country? Find yourself, the United States of America and somehow find yourself as a champion on Iron Chef America, defeating Bobby Flay not only once but twice and founding not only one successful restaurant but also starting your own fried chicken chain.

Speaker 3: 1:13

And if you haven't guessed by now, our guest this week is a man by the name of Viet Pham, who has developed a very successful career in competitive cooking reality TV cooking shows, but also founded his own restaurant with his now fiance, alexis, and they are slowly taking over the world with Pretty Bird.

Speaker 3: 1:32

Not only is Pretty Bird an amazing place to grab a fried chicken sandwich on any given day or reason, but his story is equally as inspiring and amazing as well. So buckle up and let's hear from me and Viet's conversation, along with Alexis, to hear more about how Pretty Bird came to be and how Viet Pham became one of our favorite celebrity chefs. Enjoy. And obviously I want to get into the story of how that all came to be and the idea behind it, and I know kind of like high level but just curious about kind of the motivation behind it all. But want to start from the beginning because I know that, not born in the US but raised from the very beginning, I mean walk me through how you got, I mean exposed to, I mean the culinary world, whether that's through your upbringing or kind of where you were at that time.

Speaker 1: 2:20

Cool. So for those of you that are listening that you know that don't know about my backstory. So I'm Vietnamese, american and I came to the United States by way of my parents, fleeing Vietnam by boat. So during the war 1975, after the fall of Saigon there's a couple years where things were kind of in limbo but also a lot of Southern Vietnamese or people that were fighting the war against the Northern Vietnamese. They had to figure out a way out, otherwise, once the communists took over Saigon, those that opposed would have either been thrown in jail, killed or had to go to re-education camps and all that stuff. So my dad fighting in the Southern Army, he had no choice but to flee.

Speaker 1: 3:08

So it was October of 1978 when he and my mom and their siblings and friends and other people decided to get on a boat and sail south in the China Sea. They ended up on an island off the eastern coast of Malaysia called Pulau Bidau and my mom was eight months pregnant with me at that time. So we ended up on this island. I was literally born in the treehouse that my dad built. So you know, like on this island. It was never meant to be at this refugee camp. It belonged to the government of Malaysia. It was in the state of Tringano, and this is just a small little island, I don't know, I want to say probably 25 to 30 kilometers off the coast of Tringanu, and at that time you know a lot of Vietnamese people. They either ended up in the ones that fled by boat, either ended up in, I believe, in Malaysia, thailand or the Philippines, I believe. But yeah, so we ended up in Malaysia and my parents were there for eight months. I was born in January and then we left Malaysia in August and ended up in the suburbs of Chicago. So my dad had a sibling brother that was living out there prior to our arrival. So, with my dad fighting the army, they were able to get expedited and you know, so it was streamlined for us to get into the United States.

Speaker 1: 4:48

So you know, early on, you know my memories of food were, you know just a lot of different things. You know my memories of food were, you know just a lot of different things. You know, obviously, a lot of it is Vietnamese food. Growing up, that's all my parents cooked, that's all they knew. And then, as my uncles got older, you know like they were like teenagers at that time when they came to the United States and I was still a kid, as they got older, everybody kind of had to chip in to help out.

Speaker 1: 5:14

So, you know, when we first ended up in the suburbs of Chicago, there was, like, I think, there's three families living in this little townhouse in a town called Carroll Stream and, you know, everybody had to kind of pitch in and make things work out. You know, so, my uncle at that time his name is Hien, I call him Giao Jin, meaning that he's, like, I think, the youngest, he's like uncle number nine. Oh, okay, yeah, uncle number nine. Yeah, so he, behind our house is this plaza, this kind of like strip mall, and in the strip mall there's this restaurant called Brown's Chicken. It's a it's a fried chicken joint and you know, honestly, I, I'm gonna make a mental note of it, I'm gonna look it up, see if it's still around. But one of like my earliest, you know, like food memories is him working there and he would bring leftovers home and those leftovers were really special to us because it wasn't that we were starving or hungry, it was our opportunity to taste something that was uniquely not Vietnamese but American. So I remember eating that fried chicken and just being amazed by how good it was outside of like, just like as a kid eating rice and soups and all like these other dishes that my mom made Not to say that it wasn't good, you know, but it was just like. It was uniquely different. So, you know, fried chicken has always been in my blood. I guess you could say, you know, it's something that I've always loved, it's something that is, you know, I don't want to say strangely comforting, but it's, it's, it's deeply comforting because it brings back so many different memories and, as little as I was, you know, like, those are the some of the things that I actually vividly remember.

Speaker 1: 7:10

So, you know, fast forward, my parents ended up moving us to California in the late 80s. Okay, my parents ended up taking on a new role business owners running food trucks, you know. So they were part of like during the dot-com boom. So they had a food truck and you know they sold all sorts of different, uh, varieties of food, everything from vietnamese, chinese, american, mexican food. They did it all out of their truck. Wow and um.

Speaker 1: 7:44

I just remember, you know, when they started this business, that it was long, grueling hours. So you know they would have to wake up like at 3 30 in the morning, leave the house by four o'clock, they get to the commissary where the truck is parked and then they have to get the truck ready. So they have to start prepping the food. My dad would have to go into the warehouse shop for food and then get ready to leave the commissary around 5.30 to get to the first company that they cater to around six o'clock. So they basically served breakfast, late breakfast and then lunch, so that was their day, and then they would end their day by, I want to say by two o'clock. They get back to the commissary, they clean up the whole truck, they start prepping some more for the next day and then they leave the commissary probably around 4.30, five o'clock in the evening and then they end up going to the grocery stores to shop additional products for the next day and by the time they get home it's probably a 6, 6.30. And then you know like they don't get to go home and put their feet up because they got to go home and cook for the kids. So they come home, they cook for us and then you know the day starts again. They go to sleep at nine o'clock and then they did that for over almost 30 years, you know, and they basically taught us that by studying hard, going to school, that we're not going to have to work these hours. That they did, you know. So they use it as an example.

Speaker 1: 9:10

Yeah, you know, and I never really had like any, I never had any like desire to be in the industry. I was just very fascinated by the act of cooking, the act of putting simple ingredients together and creating something that's unique. You know so as early as I can remember. You know, saturdays are a big deal for kids because they like to watch cartoons. Usually the best cartoons are on Saturdays. For me it was about watching, you know, pbs, you know public television and watching Jacques Pepin, watching Julia Child, you know, watching Martin Yan, ken Cook. You know those were the shows that really like excited me. You know those were the shows that really like excited me, you know. And um it just, you know, I I don't know what it was. I I think I think what it was is that you know now that I think back at it, um, it was a life that I yearned for long for growing up you know, because?

Speaker 3: 10:10

do you feel like you knew that now? Or looking back? Is it one of those things? You look back at your childhood? You're like, oh, the signs were always there, I just didn't know until now.

Speaker 1: 10:18

You know maybe it's something that I just realized right now, but you know like I was. You know like we grew up very poor and you know it's not like we were scraping by. You know like we got our clothes from the DIY and you know like people donated stuff, got our clothes from the DIY and you know like people donated stuff and you know the first couple years we had, my parents had government assistance and they provided food and all that other stuff. But I think, because you know, growing up Asian American and going like being like, you know, like growing up in the suburbs of Chicago, you know I was definitely a minority that stuck out, you know, and one of the things that I wanted more than anything growing up was to be American, was to be white, because by being American and being white I wouldn't be picked on, you know.

Speaker 1: 11:10

So my brother and I, we were picked on a lot. So, as you know, my name is Viet, my brother's name is Nam. We got made fun of a lot. So I've always like kind of fantasized about being this type of family looking at magazines, watching these cooking shows and imagining like this is how people eat at home, and that's what I wanted to experience, and that's what I wanted to live. So I think that's one of the reasons why it attracted me, and then, at the end of the day, it's food.

Speaker 2: 11:39

you know he doesn't like food.

Speaker 1: 11:40

So you know, I think that's what drew me into cooking, and then, and I was so like one second.

Speaker 3: 11:47

I want to interject there quick because I've talked to some of my friends who are immigrants from other countries, especially refugees from other countries, and I feel like there's this amazing relationship with food Because, again, if you're a refugee, you didn't necessarily choose to leave. It was usually under some forced circumstance. You're forced to this place, you don't really. I mean, it's a good place. I bet your parents are excited to at least land in America, compared to other options, but at the same time, different people, different culture, different faces, different everything, but there's that one common denominator that they can have in control in their own home, which is their food, and it's the thing that brings everybody together and reminds them of everything that's going on. And so I'm almost like jealous of that experience with food that people like, especially you, get to have with that.

Speaker 1: 12:29

You know, I actually didn't have that experience with the food because when it came to Vietnamese food, I didn't really care for it.

Speaker 3: 12:34

Interesting Okay.

Speaker 1: 12:34

Yeah, I, you know, I, I remember gatherings, I remember my mom cooking in the kitchen. But, like, when I think back about like certain dishes, you know I don't have like a dish that brings me back to like me as a child. The dishes that brought me back to as a child were fried chicken, big Macs, hamburgers from McDonald's, portillo's. You know those are the dishes that really brought me back, you know. But you know, fast forward, you know becoming a cook and then ultimately a chef. You know, like, when you start early on in your career or as a student, you know you try to emulate other cooks, other chefs. You're emulating, you're copying recipes, you're copying dishes. You're hungry for perspective. You go out to eat. You try to recreate these dishes. You read up on magazines and books and cookbooks on, you know, blogs, all that stuff, whatever you can put your hands on. You know you soak it all up. And then you know, when you further your career, you know, like you have a restaurant, you're at the head. You're like, either the head of a restaurant, you're a chef, a restaurant, whatever it is, you open your own restaurant. You start to go to places that are unique to chefs, that are really cool, like farmer's market and then you go see all these great ingredients and you see other chefs and other cooks that are buying those same ingredients and at the end of the day you know like we're all doing the same thing. You have to ask yourself what makes your cuisine different from everybody else. That's when you kind of fall down. You know that rabbit hole. You start to dig deep and figure out who you are, where you're from and what your cuisine means. So here I am with this very complicated upbringing and this complicated relationship with my identity as a Vietnamese American and trying to figure out and get inspiration from my culture, from my upbringing, and try to use that in a medium of food and try to figure that out. And you know it was a really hard time because you know, like in my 20s to my early 30s I'm trying to define cuisine and what cuisine meant to me. But what cuisine meant to me was like doing and emulating what other chefs were doing.

Speaker 1: 14:52

You know there's techniques that you can really work on, like cooking over fire. I love cooking over fire. I love being able to manipulate the embers and the ashes and coax out flavors and textures that you can't achieve through traditional methods of cooking, like cooking on your stovetop or cooking roasting things in the oven. There's just something that's very primal, something that's very unique when you cook over fire. But if you're, if you can understand how to tame that fire, you coax out things that you can't normally get through traditional methods. So you know like, you know like, those are the techniques that I really lived for and I really loved, but still it was still lacking soul. You know it was lacking, it was lacking um, depth, you know, Um. So you know there's there, there there's been a uh, uh, you know uh, a huge um void in me, um, trying to figure out who I am, my identity as a chef, and you know what that means.

Speaker 3: 15:49

And I'm curious cause, like obviously there was part of this story where you had your childhood and your upbringing and then you eventually went to school, found yourself in finance and then fell out of finance. I jumped a lot.

Speaker 1: 15:58

Oh no, you're good no.

Speaker 3: 15:59

I, and I'm just curious Cause, like I love that you're able to take that risk in that decision, because there's so many people who it's so easy just to keep doing what everyone expects. What's in front of you 10, 15 years later be like hold on. I don't like any of this. I don't know how I got here, I'm not even happy and I don't know what to do, and so I mean walk me through.

Speaker 1: 16:18

I mean I can understand how you get into finance but also like that decision where you're like I'm done.

Speaker 1: 16:24

So you know, like you know we, we, you know myself and my family. We came from very little. And then I'm going to come back to something we all are very familiar with or have heard of, and that's the American dream. What does the American dream mean to you? For somebody that has grown up here, lived here, have generations of living in the United States, the American dream may be just like I want a nice car, I want a nice house, I want a successful you know job, I want a family and all that stuff. For us, purely, the American dream is like to survive and to make it in a foreign place. You know, and my parents you know, I would imagine anybody out there, whether you're white, black, mexican, asian, whatever you are, you know the American dream is to be successful, right.

Speaker 1: 17:13

So you know my parents, you know they didn't want us to work growing up. They didn't want us to do, you know, have side jobs. They wanted us just to focus on school and, unfortunately for me, school is something that I was never really good at. As much as I tried to apply myself, I was just never good at school. The format of school just never really worked with how I wanted to learn. So I went through from elementary school to high school I just barely kind of hovered by.

Speaker 1: 17:46

And then, going into college, I got on academic probation, I got kicked out, had to go to junior college, went back to college and then just totally felt like it wasn't for me. Yeah, you know and all during that time I had a part-time job in my after I was 18, I had a part-time job working in a bank and I ended up working for different banks for a span of almost 10 years, wow, and I did everything from being a teller to opening new accounts and then ultimately doing mortgage loans being a teller to opening new accounts and then ultimately doing mortgage loans, and then, when that market crashed, I ended up working for a software company in the Bay Area called VMware and I did a lot of support and I did a lot of just like general finance working with the sales team, forecasting and all that and it was exciting getting into it.

Speaker 1: 18:34

but then I quickly got very bored very fast. I just needed something that would keep my mind constantly like busy, you know, and the creativity in creating spreadsheets is not the same as the creativity of putting together a couple of ingredients and then making a dish out of it. You know what I mean. It's very similar.

Speaker 3: 18:57

As someone who spends a lot of time in spreadsheets, I understand that.

Speaker 1: 19:01

For me. But like, I mean, like I admire, I have friends, you know, like she's really good in spreadsheets, but you know, I have friends that can create amazing, amazing documents. You know, for me, I, you know, I'd rather just put some ingredients together and cook some good, some delicious food, you know so. So through that, you know, I, I, I realized early on that that wasn't for me. So I took on the opportunity to enroll myself into culinary school in the early 2000s, I think it was like 2001. So I attended the California Culinary Academy in San Francisco and you know, I had the fantasy of going to the school and then really learning all of these amazing techniques and being like, you know, the people that I watched on TV, you know. But unfortunately it wasn't like that at all. It was actually really hard. You know, I wasn't motivated either in culinary school. I hated culinary school, to be honest. Shit, this is just like school. Yeah, you know, it was just like. You know, I don't know what it was. I just I was never a really good student. So I ended up cutting a lot, I surfed a lot, you know. I ended up having to make up a lot of the time that I missed in summer school. So I don't think anybody's ever not graduate culinary school because they failed. I think they automatically pass you because you're paying. I actually held back because I had to or I actually had to go to summer school to make up for all the classes that I missed, summer school, to make up for all the classes that I missed. But through that, you know, one of the things that you have to do as a culinary student a student that's part of the curriculum is you have to get an internship. You have to do an internship with somebody. So you know, prior to culinary school, I had a lot of cookbooks. You know, I watched a lot of cooking shows and I told myself myself you know, if I work at restaurants, I'm gonna work at these badass restaurants, you know.

Speaker 1: 20:58

So in culinary school, when these students had to apply their color to, uh, when they had to apply to internships, a lot of them applied to like whole foods, costco, like their culinary program, the local grocery stores, some of the local like restaurants. I'm like why? And I'm like why? Why wouldn't you like that's your dream. Why wouldn't you like go work for, like the best restaurant, you know? I mean like I was a nobody. I didn't know anything, but in my mind I'm like why would you want to work for, like Whole Foods in the baking department? Yeah, you know, like working in a cafeteria, like do something else. But I think a lot of people were just kind of burnt out by then. They realized that this is not what they wanted to do.

Speaker 1: 21:44

So I ended up landing an internship with a young French chef named Laurent Gras. So he just came to San Francisco fresh out of New York. He worked at the Waldorf Astoria at a restaurant called Peacock Alley or something like that. But he worked for some of the best chefs in the world and he worked for Mission Star restaurants. And I learned about him through my counselor. She told me that he's looking. There's this new chef in town, he's just got Food Wine Magazine's best new chef and he's looking for interns. So I'm like all right, I'll check it out. So I walked over to the restaurant and I sat down with him and the first thing that he told me he's like hey, I just want you to know your culinary school. Like he told me this in a very thick French accent your culinary school means shit to me. You know. You're like cool. I didn't really like it.

Speaker 1: 22:26

You know everything that you're going to learn in this kitchen. You're going to learn and it's going to help you for the rest of your life. I'm like, okay, whatever, yes, chef, you know so. Not even, yes, chef. I'm like, okay, whatever, I was just excited to be there.

Speaker 1: 22:38

So, you know, the very next week I started my internship, you know. So I had to commute from San Jose to San Francisco every day for school and this restaurant was in. You know, it was just right off Market Street, market and Shoot, I forget what the street was, but anyways, my shift started every day at 6 pm or 6 am. So I had to leave around 4.30, 5 o'clock, drive to San Francisco park, walk a mile to the job where I didn't get paid, and then work until about 5 pm, 6 pm, and then drive home. Sometimes I would work the whole entire evening shift too, you know.

Speaker 1: 23:19

So I did this for three months and I got my ass kicked. You know, it was one of the hardest things that I ever did. It was hard because I was treated very poorly. This is in 2001. Keep in mind that it was 2001.

Speaker 1: 23:35

So, you know, the kitchens and restaurants were the Wild, wild West. You know, up until the Me Too movement, when people spoke out about, you know, kitchen culture. That's when things changed. But prior to that it was the Wild Wild West. I had pots, pans thrown at me, I was kicked in my shins, I was made fun of, I cried, you know a lot, but at the end of the day I was doing something that I thought for the first time in my life was meaningful. There was never anything in my life that I've actually really tried hard to. You know, in school I didn't really try hard. Culinary school, I didn't try hard. You know, my life kind of just like, I was just kind of floating along and all of a sudden, bam, I wanted to be a cook. There's nothing more in my life at that time than wanting to be like a cook and wanting to get approval from my chef and from my peers, you know. And the first two months were killer man. It was literally grit every single day.

Speaker 1: 24:43

And one day I remember vividly, I was doing a task for Chef Laurent and he's asking me some stuff. And you know like I opposed because I thought that this way was better and it was going to be faster. And then he looked at me and he's like oh, finally, you're using your mind. You know your brain, you know he's just like this, you're finally using your brain. Huh, like with this disgusted look at his face, and I took that as the biggest compliment. Yes, and from that day on, you know, I told myself like each day I would walk to work and I would pump myself up. Today I'm not going to get yelled at, I'm not going to get in trouble. But then I get yelled at and in trouble all the time and then, slowly, the line cooks would be like they'll look at me. They'll nod like what's up? I'm getting approval. They'll nod like what's up, like you know, like I'm getting approval. And then I think like, uh, you know, the one moment that really said that like I was cool and these guys actually liked me was at the end of service. They actually invited me to the bars with them. That was huge, you know. Um, so you know I, I ended up landing a job there and then I worked with, uh, chef, worked with Chef Laurent for just a little bit and then, a year and a half or two years in, he left the fifth floor, which is the restaurant that I worked at, to move to Chicago to open up a restaurant called El Tua, where he earned three mission stars.

Speaker 1: 26:09

And then at that point in my career, I was probably 22, almost 23. I was burnt out. You know, I was really burnt out. I worked six days a week. I was working I don't know 16 hours a day 15, 16 hours a day, and for the first three months I didn't get paid. I didn't get paid anything. You know, I've actually probably just broke. Even so, being that young, I wanted to have fun, I wanted to hang out with my friends and my family, and I didn't get to do any of that while working in the restaurant. So this is my time. So I decided not to go to Chicago or work for his buddy, I wanted to just take a break and I left the industry.

Speaker 1: 26:56

And then I went back into working in the bank and at this time, you know, interest rates were low. Um, the banks were giving out home loans left and right, and I got into the industry at the right time because I was making more money than I was ever making in my whole life. You know, at that time, everyone's approved, everybody gets money, exactly, you know. Um. So you know, I thought that, with all this wealth that I was earning, that it would bring happiness, but it wasn't. It wasn't bringing me any happiness. You know, my brother and I, you know we bought lots of different things. We bought boats, bought a house, we spent a lot of money on our friends going out on stupid stuff, you know, but it never made us happy. It never made me happy, at least you know.

Speaker 1: 27:39

And then I started to get really sad. I wasn't depressed, but I was just really sad because I was young at that time and I knew, and I knew what I was passionate about. And a lot of people, I feel like, spend their whole entire lives trying to figure out what they're passionate about. And here I was, this mid-20-year-old kid who knew what he was passionate about, but he decided to not chase it, and that was cooking. I ended up landing a job for a software company and then, you know, that's when I really realized that, like I can't do this, I have to find a way back into cooking. Cooking was what made me happy, it was what was exhilarating, it was what allowed me to, you know, like be free, you know, and being free was to do what I loved. So, long story short, I met this gentleman from Utah. He learned about my past, invited me to move to Utah to help him open up a restaurant down in Utah County and that restaurant was called Spark. So it was end of April 2008. So I'm coming up on almost 16 years here in Utah. So the end of this month, april 30th, will be my 16th year here in Utah.

Speaker 1: 29:02

I moved out here April of 2008 and opened up a restaurant called Spark Restaurant Lounge in Provo. I believe it was in September. Spark Restaurant and Lounge in Provo I believe it was in September and then got fired in January of 2009. So I was there for about eight months. We won't get into that because it's a long story, but you know I came out. I wanted. You know this is a fresh start, one. It allowed me to break free from the Bay Area bubble. Two get back into the food industry, of course. Get back into the food space, and you know one of my first jobs was to open up a restaurant and I've never ran a restaurant before Like I can run a kitchen, but I don't know how the rest of this works.

Speaker 1: 29:49

Yeah, I don't know how the rest of it, which was good because I didn't have to be in charge of all that stuff. So you know, like, as a young chef who worked in a very high level kitchen, you know the focus was on the quality of food, the experience and just making people happy. You know, the guest's experience, you know, and the individual that brought me out there was very bottom line driven. We bumped heads a lot and just, you know, like we just had, we had different priorities and in the end it didn't work out, you know, and like it's totally fine. You know. So, for the first time in my life, I got fired and um, you know, um, I was only in utah for eight months. It was a big deal. It's a big move because this is the first time that I've moved outside of my family's house my parents' house.

Speaker 1: 30:37

You know, I was 29 years old and I was still living at home, so it was about time. But at the same time, you know whether you're 29, 39, 49, moving out of something that you've been familiar with for so long.

Speaker 1: 30:48

It's really scary. So you know I couldn't go back to California. You know, um, I didn't want to come back as a coward because it was a big deal for me to leave my home for the first time. You know, my mom cried, my brother cried, my dad cried. You know my all of my friends threw me a big party. They, they didn't believe me up until the day that I left and I was actually leaving.

Speaker 1: 31:24

Well, you want to be like yeah, I can make this work, I can stay here for 16 years. Okay, mom, it didn't work, I'm coming back. It wasn't so much Provo, you know. So it allowed me this ability to kind of like shift my mind and make myself feel like as if I'm in the Bay Area and you know, going from the Bay Area to Provo it's the first place that you've lived has got to be a wake up call.

Speaker 3: 31:50

So I would have done the same thing like all right, let me just go find the closest that I can. Somehow recognize.

Speaker 1: 31:56

It was definitely a culture shock, you know, but I don't want to say that I hate Provo. I enjoyed my time there. But there was also a lot of dark memories that I associate Provo to, and it wasn't because of Provo, it was just my job and that stuff, you know. So while I was up in Salt Lake City, you know, I would kind of fantasize about if I would have my own restaurant. Where it would be, you know what it would be, where it would be, you know. And it led me to going on Craigslist. I don't even know if Craigslist is still around.

Speaker 3: 32:29

Someone's got to be on there. I don't know what they're on there for.

Speaker 1: 32:31

I would look at like restaurant listings you know availability and I would drive up and check out different spaces and I'm sure your mind's just running with like, well, you know it'd be fun to do this concept.

Speaker 1: 32:48

It got my mind out of being in Provo and working for this. You know this horrible boss, you know. So you know it was this weekend, it was actually a Friday that I that was on Craigslist. It was in January. I saw this space. It was on 9th South and 4th East and, um, it was a grocery. It was a house that was converted to a grocery store and then the grocery store, the owner moved out and then this was like an empty, empty space. It was recently remodeled over and the owner wanted a restaurant to come in.

Speaker 1: 33:19

So I saw it Friday, arranged for my cooks to get in Saturday to take care of all the prep so that I can drive up to Salt Lake City to take a look at it. So I drove up, looked at it, I was like, oh man, this is awesome. This reminds me of all of the restaurants that I am in love with and emulate in the Bay Area, like the French Laundry, Manresa, some of those great restaurants. And you have all the charm of a house and it has its own little parking lot and I could build a greenhouse and planter boxes in the back and grow my own vegetables and all that stuff. So I came up there. I drove up to Salt Lake City, looked at it and then drove back to Provo and didn't really think anything of it because, again, it was just kind of like a fantasy. So worked that Saturday had Sunday off.

Speaker 1: 34:08

And then around 9 pm on Sunday I get a text from my boss and he's like hey, can you come in early tomorrow Because I want to meet with you. So I come in early and he fires me, you know. And then I mean that was basically it, you know. So what do I do now? You know, I've been here eight months and I literally shifted my whole world around to help this guy open this restaurant. And now I'm jobless. What am I going to do? So I go home and then, you know, I kind of think about it and like man, I just saw this restaurant space, you know, like I should open up my own restaurant. So I called my parents, told them what happened and then, long story short, six and a half months later, July of 2009, my restaurant opens Forge.

Speaker 1: 34:52

Yeah, and it was one of the first set menu restaurants in Salt Lake City. I opened it up with a co-chef and it was very invigorating. We got to do our own thing, but it was also one of the scariest things that I've ever did, because this is right after the market crashed and here we are, two young guys trying to sell a set menu to people for 89 bucks. So, if you could imagine, the first three months was very, very slow. No one really knew who we were. You know, three months was very, very slow. No one really knew who we were. Actually, one of the first individuals that interviewed us was Mary Maloof, and God bless her, she's passed away now, but you know, she interviewed us numerous times and wrote about us in Salt Lake Magazine and some writers wrote about us in the tribune and then, from then on, um, we got really, really popular, we got really busy.

Speaker 3: 36:31

You know, um, because I feel like this is like because I was too young to have appreciated it, even if I would have gone. How old are you? 33? 33 because of the yeah I was.

Speaker 3: 36:42

If it was july 2009, I was getting ready to go on my mission, which was a whole. That alone is a whole different part of my life. But because I feel like that's almost at that time, because, like I fast can I get out of here and how cheap can I do this, I've got to pay for a babysitter back home too. And so the thought of, to your point, like opening up a set menu restaurant, emulating something like the French Laundry in San Francisco, people wouldn't. They'd be like why are they doing laundry in a French way in San Francisco? Like it would just be so such a miss. But in and be like okay, like we're going to run, roll this out, people start to appreciate it and have success. I mean that that alone is going against so much of the friction of what Salt Lake was back then and it's proven to be. I mean a successful, and now there's so many people doing it now.

Speaker 1: 37:34

It was a, it was, it was a crazy time. You know, uh, with that restaurant, with our popularity, um, we gained the attention of, you know, national attention from you know, like Bon Appetit magazine, food and Wine magazine and all that stuff, and you know, from there on it, you know, it put us on the map and I was able to do a lot of different things outside the kitchen besides cooking, like television shows and all that.

Speaker 3: 37:59

Yeah, so walk me through that Because, like, I can understand how and I love your story of being like okay, here's the thing I want to do, I do it, I like it. I'm going to go back to this thing Cause it's easy, Did really and honestly timed it well, um of going back into finance, and then that all happens you go work for the shitty restaurant owner and then you go and do your own thing.

Speaker 1: 38:28

I'm just so curious of how it goes from like, let's roll the cameras, let's do this, let's, let's do this, and maybe it's just part of you, but I'm curious how, like those, those two connect. Yeah, so in 2011, um, my partner and I we got food and wine magazines best new chef, which is a huge deal. It's like you know, it's, it's they don't do it anymore, unfortunately, but it's, it's. It's almost as big as a James Beard. So back then, in 2000,. So we were James Beard nominees 2011, 12, 13, 14, 15, for a number of years, and back then, I don't think Utah really wrote about it or really cared what a James Beard was, but it was a big deal outside of Utah.

Speaker 3: 39:08

Probably just Stuart Belling yelling from a rooftop. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: 39:12

So, my partner and I, we were the first people in the state of Utah to get a James Beard nominee. We were only semi-finalists, we never made it to finalists, and now, for the past two years, there's been three individuals here in Utah that are finalists for James Beard. So, um, kudos to them. That's awesome. You know it's a Salt Lake city, or the whole city of Utah has come a long ways and that's something that I'm really proud of. Um, but yeah, so, uh, I got food and wine magazine's best new chef and, um, it was like sure I'm not missing anything important with alexis. Is alexis in the in the picture yet? Oh, no, this is. This is 2011. Alexis isn't getting in the picture until 2015. Chapter what? 2015? Yeah, so a couple years later we'll get there. But yeah, yeah, so I'm. I.

Speaker 3: 39:57

I tend to just babble a lot, but, like you, know, that's great my own period, like we could have headphones on recording that and I'd still just be sitting here bobbleheading.

Speaker 1: 40:06

So you know, like every young cook, you know, like they, I could promise you, if it's not to open up a restaurant, it's to become a Food Wine Magazine's best new chef. So when you think about the best new chef family, who's in there? Thomas Keller from French Laundry, danielle Balloud you know some of the greatest chefs in the world are a part of this family and this family is tiny. You know Food Wine magazine. They pick out 10 chefs, up-and-coming chefs, each year and you think about how many restaurants, how many cooks and how many chefs are there and for them to narrow it down to 10 people and for us to get that.

Speaker 3: 40:41

You know the day that I Especially in like Salt Lake City. You gotta get it. They're like I didn't even know they had food there.

Speaker 1: 40:45

Yeah, exactly, you know. And then I just remember the day getting that phone call. You know I was literally brought to tears because when I first started my career as a cook, I worked at the fifth floor and the chef that I worked for, laurent Gras Food Wine Magazine's Best New Chef. And I remember, you know, I took a break, went in the bathroom, sat on the toilet and I was reading this magazine and I was just like literally telling myself one day, like if it kills, like if it doesn't kill me, I'm gonna become a best new chef. You know, fast forward, being able to get that was a huge feat in my, you know, career. You know all the sacrifices that were made. You know it was totally worth it. But, yeah, so after getting that, you know, like you end up on the radar of all of these different producers of various cooking shows. And at that time, you know, food Network was just becoming really popular and you know something as a cook or a chef which is like a blue collared, you know type of career or job. You know they've literally launched chefs to become like rock stars overnight. So, you know.

Speaker 1: 41:56

So Food Night, so producers from a show called Extreme Chef reached out to me from Food Network. They're like hey, like you know, we're casting. Do you want to do this show? It's going to me from Food Network. They're like hey, like you know, we're casting. Do you want to do this show? It's going to be filming in July. This is like 2011. And I told them I couldn't because I had obligations with Food Wine for the Aspen Food Wine event. So I told them, like well, you know, if you guys are casting next year, I'd consider it. They're like yeah, yeah, whatever. A year later they call me up. They're like hey, we spoke to you last year and we want to see if you're still interested in doing the show this year. It's going to be totally different. It's going to be not just a one-off episode.

Speaker 1: 42:34

It's going to be a whole season. So there'll be 10 of you guys and you're going to be put in some of the most extreme places and you're going to have to cook, you're going to have to forge, you're going to have to build your own tools and you're going to have to, like, cook dishes within a certain amount of time. I'm like, so like, would you be down for that?

Speaker 3: 42:52

I'm like hell yeah, like I've been practicing cooking over fire for years for this moment.

Speaker 1: 42:56

You know I was a boy scout. I loved all that kind of stuff. So the first television show that I did was in 2012. It was filmed in February 2012 and then released that summer, but out of 10 people, I ended up being the runner up. It was filmed in Southern California. We filmed in the Salton Sea in the Mojave Desert. We filmed in the middle of the Pacific Ocean on a US Coast Guard gunship. I was wearing a Mustang suit and I was swimming out to a capsized ship, foraging for food and bringing it back to the ship and having it cooked within a certain amount of time. I rode elephants through the jungle of northern Thailand. I cooked in the middle of a river and then climbed up like a thousand stairs to this Buddhist temple on the top of the mountain and having to cook up there. So it was crazy and I ended up being the runner up and it was like amazing Even win or lose. You know like I was the runner up, it was awesome.

Speaker 1: 43:57

I got to do all these things. You know, through that I learned that I was. You know that I'm very competitive. I can work extremely well under pressure, and those are the things that, like these cooking shows are looking for. You know like you have to be very MacGyver-ish. You know being able to think it's out of the box and just work under pressure. Those are the attributes that successful competition chefs are required to have, you know very different set of skills than other ones.

Speaker 1: 44:29

Yeah, so after that, you know, uh, one of the judges on that show his name is Simon Majumdar he, um, he, just, he loved me and he went back to to LA and told his manager about me. His manager flew out to Utah, met with me and then ultimately signed me on to their agency and from there, you know, he told me he's like hey, have you ever heard of the show called Iron Chef of America? I'm like, of course I've heard of Iron Chef. It's like my favorite show, it's my family's favorite show. We watch Iron Chef Japan. Like every Friday my manager calls me up. He goes hey, I'm going to get you on the show called Iron Chef America. I'm like, yeah, right, that was in May or June. And then July he calls me up. He goes guess what? You're going? You have two weeks.

Speaker 1: 45:13

The producers are going to call you, they're going to give you a list of ingredients and, based on these ingredients, you're going to have to create a menu and send them the ingredients that you need. And then you're going to have to create a menu and send them the ingredients that you need and then you're going to go on to Kitchen Stadium and cook. So they sent me like four different possibilities of ingredients the secret ingredients, Ground meat, jerky, cottage cheese, and I forgot what. The fourth maybe it was only three. It was those three possibilities.

Speaker 1: 45:46

So, those three possibilities, we had to build a menu around it Interesting. So when you go on Iron Chef it isn't totally blind. You already know what you're going to do, but they don't tell you what that secret ingredient is until you walk on the stadium. So in our mind we knew that if it was going to be jerky, we're going to do these courses. If it was going to be jerky, we're going to do these courses. If it was going to be cottage cheese, we're going to do these three courses, or whatever it is.

Speaker 3: 46:09

And I'm sure you have a preferred one in your mind of what you think it's going to be.

Speaker 1: 46:12

Yeah, you know, I mean we try not to have a preference because we want it to be comfortable with whatever ingredient they throw at us. So you know, back then, when, uh, iron chef america first started, uh, you could choose who you go against. You know, um, my choice would have been masahara morimoto. Like the guy is badass. You know, he's very technical and he's just badass. You know, uh, but unfortunately for the season that we were filming, because of all of the iron chefs, their schedules are so busy um, you weren't allowed to choose anymore, so production would choose for you. So I didn't know until five minutes before we started filming that we were going to go against Bobby Flay. So we go against Bobby Flay. And you know now that I think back. You know Bobby Flay is a household name, warren Modo isn't so much. So it actually worked out for us, you know. So being on the show was a huge deal.

Speaker 1: 47:10

I flew my parents out. They were in the audience watching and you know, like, when we walk up to the commissioner or whatever his name is, and they unveil the secret ingredient, just being there already felt like I won. And then when they start the timer, you just put your head down and you go to work. So after an hour putting up I think it was five dishes, we were announced the winners, which was which is totally surreal, it was awesome. Oh yeah, you know my mom was crying in the audience and you know, like this is that to me at that moment was the American dream, you know, being an Iron Chef America. And you know Iron Chef was very intimate to us because you know, like it was the day when our family got together it's like family home evening, right, our family got together, my parents got takeout and we sat together as a family and we watched that show. And to be able to aspire to be on to that show, you know, and winning, you know, against Bobby Flay, that was a huge deal.

Speaker 3: 48:15

Yeah, especially like having I mean not only beating it once, but then twice eventually and then. But like also having that experience with your family where you're sitting in the living room watching it, you're watching you, and I'm sure it was so nostalgic of those times when you'd be sitting around watching everybody else do it and being like full. It's just so funny how you have so many of these like cognizant full circle moments of reading new, being like I want to do that. And then you grew up watching Iron Chef.

Speaker 1: 48:38

You're like that would be cool and I like how it just kind of you know, like you just have to put it out in the universe, you know, and I feel like the universe knows and it always tries to put you on track.

Speaker 1: 48:49

And for the longest time in my career, like when I said, like I knew early on what I was passionate about and I kept on pushing it away because, you know, like living in the Bay Area, like it's all about making money, driving this nice car and having this house, and in a lot of ways it is now too, you know. But at that time I just knew deep down in my heart that there's nothing more than I wanted was to be a cook, you know, and like that's what I wanted to do. And it was something that, like it burned in me, like it was, it was like it was so strong they would make me cry sometimes, you know, and the more that I pushed away from it, the more that I felt like the universe would realign me in my path. And you know, through all of these leaps and bounds, you know, it led me to my own restaurant. And then, you know, awards, accolades, and then television, and then ultimately leading up to one of the best things in my life and that's my wife.

Speaker 3: 49:48

Oh, perfect, segue yeah.

Speaker 2: 49:51

And on Iron Chef, america wasn't, bobby, making Greek food, weren't you?

Speaker 1: 49:56

Yeah, I was making Greek and Vietnamese food.

Speaker 2: 49:58

Yeah, you know yeah.

Speaker 1: 49:59

So it was a sign yeah, because I'm Greek, I'm Greek.

Speaker 2: 50:05

Are you?

Speaker 1: 50:06

from Price. Price no, I do not know.

Speaker 3: 50:07

So she's from Southern California. Okay, that makes way more sense.

Speaker 2: 50:09

I was raised in Southern California.

Speaker 3: 50:12

Yeah, so because I've learned this the an odd way, but so price is like the biggest settlement of like Greek, because of the railroads, yeah. And so there's a lot of people like, oh, I'm Greek, like, oh, is your family from price? Like how did you know that, like everybody who's Greek, has some sort of connection.

Speaker 2: 50:25

Yeah, and when I moved here I didn't realize.

Speaker 3: 50:29

Yeah. So like yeah, let's back up.

Speaker 3: 50:30

Greek people live then you look at like staying in like food and then you start to be like, oh, like crown burger, that's about like a lot. There's so many greek families that are so intertwined in it all, so it's fun to like peel that apart, awesome, so yeah, so let's. Let's go back to you, alexis, like as now that you've been sitting here listening to the story, you've probably heard at least. Yeah, it's just like rolling with her eyes. I'm like, oh my god, like now he's gonna say this, now he's gonna say say that.

Speaker 3: 50:54

But Alexis walk me through how you got to this place, where you were passionate, and I mean Utah.

Speaker 2: 50:59

So I was born and raised in Southern California, I went to college in Northern California and I studied wine business. So my background's in the wine industry. So I was working in the industry for about 12 years, living in Napa Valley, california, and I worked for high-end wine brands and I did direct to consumer wine marketing, wine clubs, all of it, like you name it.

Speaker 3: 51:26

I did it Every sort of wine, anything you had your hand in the pot.

Speaker 2: 51:29

Totally, and I don't know what year was that? 2015. This is how Viet and I met. I was invited to go work at Beaver Creek Food and Wine, which was part of the Food and Wine magazine, and that's where I met Viet. We were sitting at.

Speaker 1: 51:48

Yeah, so it was 2015 and it was the Beaver Creek Food and Wine Festival and I was out there as a guest chef and she was out there pouring wines for I forget which brand. And it was this particular night where there was this restaurant that was hosting all of the guest chefs and certain vintners at this like big table, you know. So she said I want to end of the table. I said I'm gonna end the table and I had invited some of my friends, um, and then some of my chefs. So we're at this big dinner table and you know like we're, you know we're eating this multi-course dinner and like all the chefs come out and talk and everybody's clapping, and then at the end of dinner, end of the night, everybody kind of gets up and like starts walking around.

Speaker 1: 52:33

You know like they're mingling, talking, and then she comes up and she's wearing, like I remember vividly, she's wearing like this, this fur, like this white fur vest. I'm like. And then I just kind of like reached out and touched it, like what is this? Like it feels really good. She goes, oh, it's beaver. And then you know, just, I'm like just being the cook and chef and the guy that I am, I'm like, oh, I love beaver, you know so yeah, my, my grandpa was a furrier, so that's how I got this.

Speaker 2: 52:59

Yeah, so that's so.

Speaker 1: 53:00

Peter, don't come after it, yeah yeah, so that's how we met and you know, at that time I was dating somebody, she was dating somebody, and it wasn't like, oh, like I was love at first it wasn't like love at first sight.

Speaker 1: 53:13

You just saw a nice texture of a vest and you know it was like, like we were young and like we were just kind of like flirting and like you know, we enjoyed each other's company and we'd run into each other at some of the events. And then the main event that I did was like the tasting event, and she would kind of just come out and hang out at my table, we would just talk and after that weekend, it was it we kind of like, just like said bye and that was it. And I think it was one of her colleagues that had sent out a group message and just following up with chefs and what they thought about, you know, the event and then their wines and all that and how he get his wines in our restaurants and all that, and she was in that thread. So you know, I'm going through all these phone numbers like, oh, who's this, who's this? And then it's 310.

Speaker 2: 53:54

And I'm like, oh, it's Beaver.

Speaker 1: 53:55

And they're like no, it's. Alexis. So we would just text each other here and there. And then it just so happened. It was like in the summertime. Both of us were single and I had convinced her to come out to Utah and she ended up coming out. It was Labor Day weekend and she came out with a friend and I had planned this whole weekend. I took her up to Deer Valley.

Speaker 2: 54:18

We went to the concert.

Speaker 1: 54:19

We went to a concert up there. It was a jewel concert and then we went hiking and all that other stuff and yeah, and then the rest was history. So we started dating and you know, this is way before Pretty Bird opened. This is like 2015,. You know.

Speaker 2: 54:33

And then we dated for a good two years long distance. I was living in California and he was here in Utah. Yeah, we'd go back and forth, back and forth, back and forth, yeah.

Speaker 3: 54:42

The best and the worst.

Speaker 2: 54:43

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 54:44

So, you know, the good thing is that. You know it's only an hour and a half flight, it wasn't that bad, you know. So during this time, you know, as Forge was going, it was reaching its tail end. You know, in 2012, after Iron Chef America, I was filming Food Network's biggest franchise, their biggest show, which is called Food Network Star. So when you think of Food Network Star, guy Fieri, that's where he got his start. He was on Food Network Star. So the premise of the show is that there's again 10 contestants. You go on the show and it's not just about cooking, it's about presenting, it's about doing all these things that TV people do, and if you win, you get your own show.

Speaker 1: 55:30

So I made it only halfway through out of 12 people, and after you get kicked out you don't get sent home, you get sent to another hotel and you stay there until the show's done. So this was like a month, you know. So during that time you had a lot more freedom, while everyone else that was still on the show they were like sequestered to their hotel room. So I got to explore like a bunch of different restaurants and lounges around the area and you know, I went to a restaurant in Orange County and one of the chefs he wanted us to try some Memphis hot chicken. And up until then I've had all sorts of fried chicken. I had Popeyes, kfc, church's fried chicken, all of it. I loved it, even the bad ones I loved. But I've never had like Nashville or Memphis hot chicken before. Yeah, very specific yeah.

Speaker 1: 56:17

So he brings out a plate of chicken and, as a young cook, when I eat out I want perspective. Perspective wasn't something that I was going to get from fried chicken. I never thought I would, but I remember eating this fried chicken and then it blew my mind. The flavors, the textures, it's something that I've never had in fried chicken, you know. So I had told myself, like man, one day when I get out of fine dining, I'm going to do fried chicken, you know. So from then on I was just like working on these recipes whenever I was free I would drive around in my Prius with like two turkey fryers cooking up fried chicken for whoever would be willing to try it. You know, I don't know if you're familiar with Bar X Would be willing to try it. You know, I don't know if you're familiar with Bar X. Yep, I would cook for the employees there. You know, for lunch. You know I would cook for anybody.

Speaker 3: 57:03

Who's this guy cooking chicken? I don't know, but it's really good.

Speaker 2: 57:11

And then in 2016, I think you were we went to my parents' house in Southern California and I'm like, oh, you know, you got to meet Viet. He's such a great chef, he's Iron Chef and all this stuff and he wants to open up this restaurant, this hot chicken restaurant. It's called Pretty Bird, and I'm like hyping up his hot chicken and he comes over and he cooks for my whole family and he burns all of the fried chicken in the pot and my parents were like what?

Speaker 1: 57:32

Are you sure? Are you sure about this? Sure, so what she failed to tell you is that the thermometer was broken.

Speaker 2: 57:38

Yeah, it was broken, it broke the thermometer.

Speaker 3: 57:41

It was too hot. Oil's not this hot.

Speaker 1: 57:42

Yeah, yeah, so, yeah, you know. So, fast forward, february 2018, pretty Bird opens the first store down on Regent Street, right next to the Eccles Theater. You know, it's a small, 525 square foot restaurant and you know I just wanted to do something simple, something delicious, something that wasn't pretentious you know, coming out of fine dining, you know, I just got really tired of all the pretentiousness, all the BS, you know, and I got really tired of all the pretentiousness, all the BS, you know, and I just wanted to do straightforward food, apply all of the techniques and skills that I've learned throughout my career and apply it to something that was just like simple, familiar and humble. And that was fried chicken, you know. So, um, leading up to the days, a couple of days before opening, um, all I wanted to do was traditional fried chicken, um, and that was basically it.

Speaker 1: 58:42

Uh, but there was like, uh, you know, a few of my friends was like, oh, you should do a chicken sandwich. I'm like, really, I'm like I'm not a fan of sandwiches, to be honest. I just I like bone in fried chicken and, for some reason, a lot of people are just weird with using their fingers or eating something with a bone on it. So people tend to like tenders or boneless, boneless chicken wings and all that stuff, and I'm like man, the flavor is in the bone, but anyways, we could get into that another time.

Speaker 1: 59:08

So you know, literally just a couple of days, a week or so maybe, before we opening, I decided to do the sandwich and um, the pretty bird sandwich, uh, you know, from the day that we opened all the way till now, has been the number one item on our menu. You know. So, from from our first day of opening, february of 18, you know we had a line from Regent Street we're like kind of center in the Regent Street all the way to Second South. You know we were serving, you know, over 800 people a day. It was crazy.

Speaker 1: 59:40

And it was out of that little tiny 525 square foot spot.

Speaker 3: 59:43

And it was like I want to go back and like it's so fun that you had this idea, because, again, like the thing you learned about food is like creating a quality product and making people happy. And like fine dining like I totally agree, and I've talked with a couple of chefs about this where it's like fine dining is great, it's like kind of what you embody yourself doing, especially as you go to culinary school, because that's like I mean the creme de la creme of I mean all the techniques and experience and knowledge that you have, but at the same time, like you can only serve so many people and have so much freedom with it and scale. And then, once you can have a food that you can nail in the same way, have a kitchen that you can run efficiently so you can have a line of 500 people and then nail that. Like that's I mean so much more appealing to so many more people. You get to see so many more like smiles and make so many people's day.

Speaker 3: 1:00:31

And I remember when Pretty Bird first opened it was, I mean, salt Lake in itself is very trendy about a lot of things and if one person likes something and everybody likes that person, the next thing. You know you're hearing about it from everyone, but I feel like that was like my first actually, no, because I didn't even. I wasn't even living in Salt Lake. Then it wasn't until I came back in 2019 where I was like, oh, let's go get food. Like have you been a pretty bird? And I was like why do I feel like I'm not?

Speaker 3: 1:00:54

My biggest pet peeve of sandwiches are sandwiches that are too big. Like I like being able to eat a sandwich. Otherwise, just give me a fork and a knife. I don't want to look like an idiot. Yeah, yeah and so, but like I was blown away, and especially like when we think about where we are now. I mean fried chicken is almost ubiquitous everywhere. I mean everybody. I mean this was before Chick hot chicken and all these other places that are trying to grab on. But this was a time that was so unique and so Pretty.

Speaker 1: 1:01:21

Bird was. The was the very first Nashville style hot chicken restaurant in the state of Utah. Yeah, you know, we didn't invent it, but we were the first ones to bring it here, you know. And then I think now there's probably Probably 30, 30 different hot chicken restaurants, you know. But it's great, you know, like there's, there's, there's, there's a lot of different styles of fried chicken, for sure, yeah. So, yeah, you know, after three months of opening Pretty Bird, you know we were short staff, you know I would talk to Alexis a lot and I would try to get her to come out every weekend. She would come on every weekend and she would work the registers. You know, I don't know if you would have love story. Yeah, I don't know if you've been into, like our sugar house store, I think all of our stores except for downtown, if you look really closely in the walls, there's a saying that says there's a question, actually says how hot is hot, and that has been kind of like been our logo or like not our logo, but kind of like a slogan.

Speaker 2: 1:02:21

It's our slogan.

Speaker 1: 1:02:22

Yeah, and the reason why is because when she was working at the register, every single person that walks up, the first thing they'll ask is how hot is hot? And I imagined answering that question every single time how hot is hot? And a lot of them are just thinking of being clever. You're like, oh, and a lot of them are just thinking of being clever.

Speaker 3: 1:02:37

You're like oh so how hot is hot, you know? And then like, how do you answer that? Like, like this many Scoville, they're like I don't know how to take that. Yeah, it's a dumb question. Yeah, and I was at the register from what?

Speaker 2: 1:02:45

11 am to 9 pm, so I got that question, like so many times.

Speaker 1: 1:02:59

So now I'm like that's just hashtagged everything. How hot is hot, yeah, how hot is hot. So you know, um, yeah, so she would come out on the weekends and work. And then I just realized there is no way that I can do this without her, you know. So, um, you know, we were, we were pretty serious at the time and she is the oldest of three and you know, like I'm just thinking like you know, we, we talked. I'm like, hey, do you like think there's a way for you to move out here? You know, because we're really serious about a relationship. She goes, I don't know, you gotta talk to my dad, you know. So I'm so I'm like checkers close to her mom. You know, her mom and I are like that. I feel like we're like the person.

Speaker 1: 1:03:31

They say like you marry your dad, I married my mom yeah, so you know, like I I call her mom, she goes. Yeah, you know like, you know like we we love you and but you know, like you gotta talk to dean because you know that's dean's first child and you know. So I remember it was like a sunday and we were closed on a sunday. It was like it was like in april, end of april or early may or something like that.

Speaker 1: 1:03:51

And you know like I'm outside pacing back and forth, you know just fiding in my phone, and she's inside the restaurant looking out the window like a hot schedule, but watching Viet, so I call her dad and I was like hey, dean, you know like, um, I just want to call you and say hi and I see if, uh, you know if, if, if, you'd be willing to uh allow Alexis to move here. You know, when the first things he goes well, I don't know. You know like she's got really good, she's got really good health insurance here. Do you provide health insurance? I'm like no, but you know, at the moment I'm paying myself $60,000 and I think I can take care of your daughter.

Speaker 1: 1:04:27

I'm like $60,000 is like nothing. You can't take care of my daughter, but you years, I develop a relationship with her parents and I think her parents, you know, knew that I was a serious guy and I was good for her. So, you know, like, after talking about 15 minutes, he's like, yeah, you know, like, you know, and then I also told him my intentions. You know like I was going to propose to Alexis and I wanted to marry her and you know, I think they felt a lot better about that.

Speaker 2: 1:04:51

So yes, I moved here May of 2018.

Speaker 1: 1:04:54

Yeah, so she's lived here for almost six years. Yeah, six years. In may, um took you 10 years to warm it up for. But enough about me. So, at at the end of the day, um, you know she's gonna give me crap for it, but, like at the, at the end of the day, and this is just between you know, her and I, this is our relationship, this is what we've built together. Um, she is pretty bird, you know, um, she is the backbone of the bird, basically, and I think I told you that in the email. Yeah, you know I, I'm the creative force behind that. She's the one that enforces it, and not only enforces that creativity, but she also manages oversees trains, does pretty much everything that allows this restaurant to be successful and is loved by. You know most of the employees you know, unlike myself, but you know she pretty much runs it, you know, and Pretty Bird wouldn't be where it is now if it wasn't for her. It's not me, so you moved to Utah.

Speaker 2: 1:05:59

Yes.

Speaker 3: 1:06:00

You have this boyfriend who's like hey, I'm starting this fried chicken place. I know I burnt it at your parents' house, but this time I mean it. I mean, what was your first take on? Like moving out here, I mean jumping into this restaurant idea.

Speaker 2: 1:06:11

Yeah, you know, when I moved out here, we rented a house together. You proposed not to yeah, I.

Speaker 1: 1:06:18

So I I proposed inside a pretty bird yeah, you know it was. Uh, it was labor day weekend of. Um, it was labor day weekend of 18 2018 yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:06:28

so I, um, I got all of our friends and family to fly out here without her knowing, uh, she. So I, I told her that my parents and my brother and my friends are going to fly out here to come check out the restaurant and visit. She was kind of jealous. She goes, oh man, how come my family don't come out here? So I worked with my staff it was a Saturday, I told them to give me a call, tell me that there was an issue at the restaurant and we would go to the restaurant. So I got the call, we to the restaurant and, um, we're in the restaurant and you know, all the staff is just kind of like cleaning up the restaurant because we would close between three and five and then he ran out of the restaurant and I'm like, well, I guess we were stamping cup at the time I said I had to go use the restaurant.

Speaker 3: 1:07:11

Oh yeah, you went, yeah like cool, I'll just do this myself thank you like I guess I'll just stamp cups and I'll just wait.

Speaker 1: 1:07:16

So I go down Regent Street around the corner to First South and I met with all of her family members her friends, my family, my friends, and everybody got a rose.

Speaker 1: 1:07:27

And then, slowly, each person would go into the store one by one and give her a rose, and she was totally shocked. And then I would come in, and I was the last person to come in, and and I would come in, and I was the last person to come in, and then I thanked their parents for all being there and asked them for their permission, and then got on a knee and proposed.

Speaker 1: 1:07:42

Yeah, aww. So yeah, you know, pretty Bird is special to us, not because it's just our business, but so many of our big life moments has happened there.

Speaker 3: 1:07:58

No, it's so amazing that you get to share an intimate experience together, where intimate experience together, where you literally working, bumming shoulders together, having all this such an iconic moment of you guys getting engaged there, yeah, but now it's something that's still. I mean, it's such a part of your life and I I mean until what point it isn't much.

Speaker 1: 1:08:09

I mean it's it's 24 7. You know we wake up talking about pretty bird, we go to sleep talking about pretty word and pretty bird and, like you and a lot of people tell you well, sometimes you just have to unplug. You can't when you have close to 100 people depending on you, it's hard, you can't just unplug. The bird requires a level of involvement that is close to 24-7.

Speaker 2: 1:08:33

Yeah, I mean we know all of our employees by name. We know every single one of them by name, like they are kids. We don't have kids yet, but they're basically our children, all of them, you know. So we really create a positive work culture at Pretty Bird, just so everyone has a safe, fun workspace, you know.

Speaker 1: 1:08:53

Yeah, and like that's like one of the things that, like, I feel like I'm most proud of. You know, being a chef working in the kitchens different kitchens it's not a conducive place to like have a healthy lifestyle. No, you know welfare, you know, and early on, um, pretty bird was. You know, in 2018, we're paying everybody over 22, $23 an hour.

Speaker 2: 1:09:23

You know people were making good money and now and the hours weren't grueling it was nine to three and then three to 9. So they weren't, you know, there till 2.00 AM. 1.00 AM.

Speaker 3: 1:09:33

Yeah, not as parents food truck hours.

Speaker 2: 1:09:34

Yeah, they're able to have a life outside of Pretty Bird.

Speaker 1: 1:09:37

And then now we have four stores, but at four stores we offer full benefits, we offer health, vision, dental Did you make sure to tell Dean that, yeah, right, yeah, you know.

Speaker 3: 1:09:50

Dean, you're such a honky-donk. I figured I'd want to see this health insurance.

Speaker 1: 1:09:53

I got the best one I got the best one, the best one in utah now you know, we like, we, we offer all that. We give tuition reimbursement, we give maternity care we offer pay time off yeah, we give paid time off and you know we're still profitable, you know we're not sitting on mounds of cash, but we choose our employees over profits, because it's important to have happy, happy employees, happy team members, happy crew members. Yeah, because that's Because, at the end of the day Pricky Bird isn't because of us, it's because of everybody collectively, you know.

Speaker 1: 1:10:24

So that's one of the things that, like, I think that we're very like, we're most proud of. You know, it is a very stressful industry and there's times where I wouldn't wish it upon my worst enemy, you know. But at the end of the day, you know, this is who we are, this is what we do, and it's not just about fried chicken. It's about, you know, john or Jane being able to come to work, receive a paycheck and be able to accomplish their life, their life plans and, you know, and goals and all that stuff, you know. So it's, it's become so much more than just fried chicken. But you know, at our core we're fried chicken. But you know, I like to think we're elevated hot chicken yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:11:06

I like to think that we're so much. How hot is hot Right? Yeah, so, but yeah, you know, I have. You know, pretty bird, simple Nashville hot chicken. You are always complaining about it. It's so expensive, it's so expensive. But using good quality ingredients is very, very expensive.

Speaker 3: 1:11:26

Go to McDonald's. If you want something cheap, then you can go get something cheap. But if you want something elevated, something better, something special, Everything is made fresh daily in-house.

Speaker 1: 1:11:37

Early on. I didn't want to focus on the narrative, you know, I didn't want to tell people like, oh, this is a restaurant built by, you know, this fine dining chef. I just wanted to provide people with good food and the good food would speak for itself and, you know, it worked. It worked for a while and then, like you know, through different economic times, people are more conscientious with their money and they're like man, it actually is really expensive. But when we first opened up we were paying $1.50.

Speaker 1: 1:12:08

We started with $1.50 per pound for boneless, skinless chicken thighs. There was a premium brand and that was expensive because boneless, skinless chicken thighs you'd get it for 79 cents a pound, you know. And then we moved up to an even better spec, even better quality. We're paying 225. And then the pandemic hit we're paying over $4 a pound for chicken and now we're paying about three and a half and it's for a premium quality chicken called Redbird, based out of Denver. You know they're out of Denver and we're proud of it. You know, like, at the end of the day, I am a fine dining chef and fine dining chefs, or high level chefs, we pride ourselves over using really great quality ingredients, because ingredients, you know, at the end of the day it does speak for itself and of course it requires some manipulation here and there. But, like at the end of the day, when you're feeding your friends, your family, you want to feed good stuff, you know.

Speaker 3: 1:13:02

So going to great value, you're not going to Walmart and getting great value Everything it's going to turn out okay, consumers know what they're putting into their bodies.

Speaker 1: 1:13:08

Now they're totally so now there's like this, this shift within pretty bird. Like you know, we're we're we're trying to um promote and educate people on the different ingredients that we use and why it's more expensive. You know, because I feel like, like you know, like we had mentioned earlier, people um consumers nowadays are more educated, more conscientious about what they put in their bodies and you know, of course, I would love people to visit pretty bird every day, but, you know, I wouldn't want my friends or family to eat Pretty Bird every day.

Speaker 2: 1:13:42

In 2018,. I ate it every day.

Speaker 1: 1:13:45

Yeah, and I think we lost like.

Speaker 2: 1:13:46

I lost seven pounds eating it every day.

Speaker 1: 1:13:49

We were also working like 18 hours a day just sweating it all out. Yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:13:53

Well, and it's like it's interesting.

Speaker 3: 1:13:54

I like what you said about the quality and like the conscientiousness, cause I mean the news in the hot in the fried chicken world, like with Chick-fil-A being like, hey, we're not going to use chicken that's contains hormones, but now it's just nothing that hurts humans and people, like it was like a pretty big uproar where that wouldn't have happened five, six years ago. And it's interesting Cause I remember when I sat down with Mateo and talked to him about when he was coming up with Mateo and cause he's like, well, there's kind of like two directions you can go Generally is like a restaurant is do I go do something classic and I nail it, or do I do something fun and different and nail that? And with him he's like I want to nail the classics, I want to have the best ingredients, I want to have the best dishes and similar to you like, yeah, like I could go get cheaper chicken, I could cut a couple of corners here, but that's not the product that I know is the best and it's going to be the best for my consumers.

Speaker 1: 1:14:41

Exactly. Yeah, I mean, that's how I've always felt from the get-go, you know. There's just, you know it's to me like cooking and feeding. It's very intimate, you know, and if I were to cook and feed somebody, I want to feed them the best. Of course, you know, sometimes we'll waver around there, we'll do some, we'll eat some crappy food or whatever, but when it all comes down to it, I want to feed the people that I care about.

Speaker 1: 1:15:10

High quality food, you know, and that's where it really stems from, you know. So you know Pretty Bird isn't just a pretty sandwich really stems from, you know. So you know Pretty Bird isn't just a pretty sandwich. It's pretty in all aspects, in the sense that we treat our employees great, our ingredients are quality, everything is made in-house and, at the end of the day, we want people to have a great experience, you know, and not have to worry about like why is this so expensive? But understand that you know, with quality comes cost, and it's not because we're trying to make more money. We just want to provide a better product.

Speaker 3: 1:15:43

You know, yeah, I mean, it's like it's that simple, like, yeah, if you want something good, you have to pay for it. I feel like America has kind of developed this like Amazon mindset of like well, if I go somewhere else, I can get something cheaper here. Why can't I do this with food?

Speaker 1: 1:15:56

Yeah, and then, you know, with fried chicken it's different because it falls under fast food and people, when they think of fast food, fast food is cheap. You know, everyone else is increasing their prices. Now there's, like you know, we've tried, we haven't increased our prices for years, but you know, like you see, mcdonald's, you see, like all of these other fast food places that are raising their prices, we consider ourselves, um, fast casual. So you know it's a little bit more elevated, um, but, like with that said, you know it's it's if you want good food, it's going to cost a little bit more. You know, um, we don't ever try to strong arm anybody to come to Pretty Bird. A matter of fact, three out of four of our stores are literally less than a mile away from a Chick-fil-A. If you had something cheaper, it's always a KFC. So it's just like there's a time and a place for Pretty Bird. It's not somewhere that you're going to eat every day and we just want people to have a great experience.

Speaker 3: 1:16:59

Exactly, I think you guys have done an amazing job. Not just I mean the product itself, but I mean the branding, the operations, making sure everything's and I'm not here to just sell.

Speaker 1: 1:17:07

Pretty Bird, obviously, like you know, like I mean, you know, we're starting to shift how we convey the brand and I want people to know.

Speaker 2: 1:17:15

But convey the brand and I want people to know, but you know, you want to hear more about her story talk more about her story, but we are tapping into our whole loyalty program at Pretty Bird and we have a lot of loyal customers. It's crazy.

Speaker 3: 1:17:27

Oh, that's like a cool following for sure.

Speaker 2: 1:17:28

Totally, and so there'll be seeing something fun soon. Ooh, that's exciting.

Speaker 3: 1:17:33

Yeah, cause, yeah, cause. Yeah. It's now downtown sugar house. Is it midvale in park city, correct? Yeah um, which is crazy to think about, of going from the one to four that quickly because I've had enough. Yeah, I've had a lot of. I'm trying to think how we could have had that like some sort of franchising and it's a lot, but they're like nail it first and then grow, and so the fact that this is all there, it's all independently owned.

Speaker 1: 1:17:55

It's not a franchise. And you know we're as local as it gets we're Utah homegrown, but yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:18:07

What else I mean besides? I mean Pretty Bird, any other fun projects you guys are working on. Any new shows around the corner?

Speaker 2: 1:18:13

I guess you're on one right now. Right, yeah, there's. Well, he has. You have like six shows airing, different shows airing this year.

Speaker 1: 1:18:19

Yeah, so I think I have.

Speaker 2: 1:18:21

One just aired.

Speaker 1: 1:18:22

Four or five more shows and just a bunch of different filming and stuff like that. You know, like I, just you know. So what makes her great is that she allows me to work on spaces and areas that I've figured out that I'm actually pretty good at. So television I just end up being able to work well under pressure and I have a knack for it and, thankfully, a lot of the producers and networks like me. So I get to do these shows but at the same time, more importantly, I get to promote the brand and at the end of the day, that's the difference you know like, besides having a proven chef behind the helms of pretty bird like it's, it's a brand that has, like national recognition, yeah, through the shows well, that's what I was gonna say is like um, the end of the day, it's business, you know because, who was it?

Speaker 3: 1:19:11

because I mean, when I found out about like we scheduled, I started following you and following pretty bird, but there's a I can't remember who the comedian was in town, but he went through.

Speaker 1: 1:19:17

He's like oh yeah ronnie, yeah, yeah and so it's like he was a pretty bird and it's like so nice to valid be like.

Speaker 3: 1:19:22

Oh, like people come into town whether they're performing or like whatever, like I have to go to pretty bird oh yeah and so it's nice because, like, obviously, like if you're on all the shows that you are promoting the brand, that helps solidify things, but you also have to have someone that is still ready.

Speaker 2: 1:19:35

When the Jonas Brothers were in town performing, they put in an article this is their pick, yeah. Yeah, the best pick is Pretty Bird. I'm like oh wow, the Jonas Brothers eat a Pretty Bird.

Speaker 3: 1:19:45

You're like, I didn't think this moment would happen in my life, but I'm just going to bask in this for a minute.

Speaker 2: 1:19:49

I just need to get a Pretty Bird sandwich in Kim Kardashian or one of the Kardashians' hands.

Speaker 3: 1:19:55

And then anyone. I mean, yeah, it's so fun to see it grow, not just like in the local realm of things, but I mean nationally, internationally as well. But and then obviously all the shows that you're doing, I mean you keep crushing it and they keep wanting you back and you keep beating everybody, so they keep wanting to have you back.

Speaker 1: 1:20:13

I don't beat everybody. You win some, you lose some, you know.

Speaker 2: 1:20:15

But you're telling me can't come home unless he wins, let me home. I haven't been everybody. You win some, you lose some, you know. But you're telling me.

Speaker 1: 1:20:17

He can't come home unless he wins.

Speaker 3: 1:20:18

You know, Like let me home. I haven't been home in six months.

Speaker 1: 1:20:20

please you know, at the end of the day, like my personal journey through, like you know from you know, a baby being born in, you know, a treehouse in a refugee camp, until now you know there's been a lot of like, just you know. It's just when I think back it's pretty incredible from where I came to where I'm at now. But you know my biggest advice, I guess, like usually people ask me like oh, what's advice would you give to people.

Speaker 2: 1:20:52

You know, like just Marry a Greek woman. Yeah, marry a Greek woman.

Speaker 1: 1:20:55

She Marry a Greek woman, she'll she'll drive you mad. You know um. Just do what you love and like put your heart, a hundred percent of your heart to it.

Speaker 2: 1:21:06

You know Um because at the end of the day, pretty bird is fast casual. But the foundation is based on fine dining. But we're still having fun. You know we're not being snooty about our hot chicken, we're not trying to be pretentious.

Speaker 1: 1:21:23

We're having fun and I think we forget that a lot too, like we just need to have fun so yeah and work, but like you know, like what I'm saying is just like you know, we all have our struggles. There's ups and downs, but if there is that little voice inside you, you know, that tells you to push for something, whether it is for your family, or whether this, for this job, or goals or whatever, do it, listen to that inner voice and don't wait.

Speaker 3: 1:21:50

And don't wait.

Speaker 1: 1:21:51

And you know, I promise you like you know, I promise you, I'm not a religious person, but I do believe in a higher power and I do believe in the universe, and the universe would conspire to make it happen. It sounds like all like cuckoo, but it does, Because through all of my hardships I just kept on pushing and believing what I wanted and the universe ended up panning out for it.

Speaker 1: 1:22:16

So yeah you know, it's that's, that's pretty much. That's pretty much like how I got here. You know, I just kept on pushing, so don't don't stop pushing and and be humble.

Speaker 2: 1:22:27

And don't take life too seriously.

Speaker 1: 1:22:30

Humility allows you to to learn. Learning is important perspective. You know, um, in this industry of chefs and cooks, you know we all have egos. Egos is a survival mechanism and um that pride, you know, allows us to, to be able to um withstand, um critics, all of these things, um, but also, you know, being humble and having humility. It also allows you to stay open, be open to learning, not just from great cooks, but from average people every day. You know, I could tell you, if I were able to go into a KFC or McDonald's and work for a day, the amount of knowledge that I would be able to gain from that would be immense. You know, a lot of people are like I would never work at McDonald's, but you know, now that we run a fast casual, the systems they have in place, the billions and billions of dollars that they've invested They've done it a couple of times.

Speaker 3: 1:23:26

I know yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:23:27

So you know, like that's kind of like you know what I typically like to end my conversations with.

Speaker 3: 1:23:36

No, I think it's a great thing to advise people.

Speaker 2: 1:23:39

Well, another thing that we do is that we actually hire people that are smarter than us, and that helps the brand grow and that's really easy for me because I really have that To walk outside hey, do you need a job?

Speaker 3: 1:23:49

We got you, come on in. No, and I think it's a good thing to remind you because this is going to sound kind of cliche. But you go on something stupid like LinkedIn and everyone's like here's my morning routine. That made me a millionaire by the time I was 15 years old, or something stupid like that, and everyone's looking for this equation of how it's all going to come together. But I mean, to your point, it's doing what feels right and what that little voice in the back of your head is doing. I mean that's how I mean, like four years ago, there's this voice being like hey, do something else. And I was like, maybe it's start a business.

Speaker 3: 1:24:20

I was like, oh, okay, like, talk with some friends started this idea. I'm like this isn't really scratching that. And it really wasn't until, like, I started painting where I was like, okay, that's one of them. And it's hard for me to separate my ADHD and my fulfillment sometimes Cause like again, like I started painting with acrylic, then I started painting with oil and then now I'm like bought a house in decorating. I'm like, well, let's try to do something like deco, like abstract stuff, so I can hang it on my walls. You and I are like basically the same person.

Speaker 1: 1:24:55

You know, like I, like, I like cooking is one of the few things that allows me to calm my super active mind. It allows me to focus, you know, and I, you know, after a day of service, I like to focus. I like to do, like, things that are very tedious, because it calms my mind and, like I would imagine, like painting intricate things, it's very tedious and it calms your ADHD. Oh, so much, you know, just like like you just got a house and we just we're getting ready to move in, and like we're seeing this house with a totally different perspective, a different palette, and like we want to do this, this and that, and I just feel like I can never like be happy Like things got, like you know, like you know things are constantly moving. So you know things are constantly moving. So, and I think, in the greater scheme of things, that's how, you know, I think, we're able to channel the energy and make what we do work?

Speaker 3: 1:25:48

No, totally, and it's about yeah, so much of it too is like and then like. One principle I like always try to share with people that I believe in, like fundamentally, is not to leave happiness on the horizon Cause there's so many people it's like oh, if I can just get here, if I can do this or I have whatever it might be, then I can be happy and, having experienced that myself and seeing people, they get there, they're like oh, actually I don't like this, and so the and then happiness in its essence is a journey, never a destination, and so the more that you can again like see this house of its news canvas and being able to do this and not being, and having that as a motivator instead of this stress of like nothing's all put together, I don't feel like I'm home and there's a billion things to do Like that'll stress you out.

Speaker 1: 1:26:23

And that's what I have to remind myself every day. There you go. You know, things always have to be perfect and regimented, but yeah, it was. That was probably the single hardest thing that I had to learn to let go. That was probably the single hardest thing that I had to learn to let go and I still struggle with that to this day is walking into a pretty bird and you know, like people doing things differently and like things are laid out, you know, and I have to constantly remind myself, this isn't a fine dining kitchen. You know, this is totally different and it's hard because I get sometimes I get these anxiety attacks, you know, and like I have to leave, you know, but like, um, there's like I needed you, okay.

Speaker 3: 1:27:07

That's why she's there. But you know, there's beauty in imperfection, right? Yeah, yeah, no, I love that fundamentally and like a lot of good things to learn and live by. Um, well, I want to end with two questions I always end with in every episode. Uh, number one for both of you is if you could have someone on the small lake city podcast and hear about their story and what they're up to. Who do you want to hear from?

Speaker 1: 1:27:27

man. You know I, you know I would love so. As restaurateurs, we're working all the time and we find it less and less being able to go out and eat and the dining scene has changed so much in the past few years. There's so many restaurants that we haven't even been to and we feel so out of touch. And it was just a couple of weeks ago, maybe two weeks ago, we went to Bar Gnome. This is just recently, when they merged with the Water Witch Boys and you know like we've been to Bar Gnome before and it's really good, you know, and she wanted to go now and I haven't been since the merger and, dude, we were blown away. It was so awesome.

Speaker 1: 1:28:21

I don't think I've heard a single bad word about Barnum. Barnum is awesome and, more importantly, the individuals behind there. So there's an individual named Scott Gardner and I've known him since gosh, like 2009 or 2010, when we used to see each other at the bar and he's fallen asleep drunk in my couch before and to be able to compare ourselves and see the leaps and bounds that we've gone through in our careers and be where we're at, you know, it's truly like. It's something to be really proud of and I got to speak with him a little bit. We don't see each other all the time, but you know like I was just incredibly proud of him and his team and like what they're doing for this scene. You know like they're bringing in different, like they're bringing in different mixologists or bartenders from different states I just saw on one of their feeds they're bringing somebody from Seattle that's well-known and, by bringing different people from different spaces, bringing that perspective into the state and allowing the people to experience it and you're sharing with them. That's like true hospitality, yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:29:35

It's awesome, awesome thing them like that's, that's like true hospitality. Yeah, you know, it's awesome, awesome thing. Yeah, you know um, you know I, I, I definitely would choose them in, in, in, in, in the food space. Uh, and you know um, you know, when she's not busy, um which she's very busy, and this is my godmother, um, so, uh, for those of you who don't know my, my godmother is Angie. For those of you don't know, my godmother is angie castanevas. She's uh, she's one of the housewives of um salt lake city and she baptized me.

Speaker 1: 1:30:03

Her and her uh husband, sean, baptized me um a couple years ago before we got married, we got married so the only way that I was gonna get married in church was to get baptized so it reminds me of my big factory wedding a little bit. You know they're the most amazing, gracious people that you'll meet, successful, smart. And you know, obviously, when you watch these reality shows, a lot of it's produced very different, a lot of different things are conveyed, but at the end of the day, they're movers and shakers of Salt Lake City. They provide an amazing workspace.

Speaker 1: 1:30:45

They have a school that teaches cosmetology hair and all that other stuff, and they're very much involved in the community and I think it would be interesting because they were always somebody. They were never a nobody. They were always very popular within that space. But they're in this realm right now where they're about to receive monumentous fame. They're going to gain that fame, like monumentous fame you know they're going to. They're going to gain that fame and I think it'd be really interesting to kind of like see them for who they are now and maybe let them talk about, like you know, like what drives them, before things go chaotic.

Speaker 2: 1:31:30

You took the words out of my mouth. I was going to say Angie and Sean, because Angie also comes from the Crown Burger family uh-huh yeah, my favorite families, for obvious reasons, yes so I think they'd be awesome because they have knowledge of everything in this city, right, yeah, that's a good one and you know what.

Speaker 1: 1:31:51

I would love to um, and obviously these are all kind of like food or I would love for you to just pick any taco cart person.

Speaker 3: 1:32:00

Oh, you know um what are you doing after this? Going home? No, you're not.

Speaker 1: 1:32:05

Come on on nine south and state street there's a taco cart called al paisa. That used to be. I don't know they're still there, but like those are some of the hardest working people and like they know food and be able to to, you know, because, like nowadays, like when you read food publications, it's all about the big name restaurants. What about the ones that are really doing it? Man, those are, you know. Like you know, um, it would be cool to like get their perspective.

Speaker 3: 1:32:32

You know, yeah, a lot of those again waking up at 3.30 to go to the commissary to scrub the truck, get everything done, yeah interview some of the food guys and girls from.

Speaker 1: 1:32:40

You know the west side, you know yeah there's a lot of good stuff going on.

Speaker 2: 1:32:44

There's a lot of good people out here, a lot of great restaurants out there, totally.

Speaker 1: 1:32:48

And then, lastly, if people want to find you, you either find us at any of our locations, true, or um, on instagram pretty bird chicken, uh. And then my instagram is just chef viet fam and and I'm at alexis for coyote fam.

Speaker 3: 1:33:06

Yeah no around the fam, fam, awesome well, guys. Thanks so much for coming and chatting. It's such a such a great conversation. I thank you for having us. I knew it was going to be good, but I didn't think I was going to like it this much, so I'm definitely going by Now. I don't think I've ever craved a chicken sandwich more in my life.

Speaker 2: 1:33:24

Oh, we should have brought you some.

Speaker 1: 1:33:27

So just the not that you need to hear, but prior to coming here, I was wearing the same outfit for the past three days because I've been moving oh, I know that very well and I jumped in the shower. She's like you need to get in the shower. It's 420 already. You know like I get in the shower, put on a clean shirt and pants and did my hair and came here.

Speaker 3: 1:33:47

So fooled me. Yeah, the moving grind is never the most fun, but yeah, and then we got to go see Theo most, but yeah our little son our cat.

Speaker 2: 1:33:56

He's a bengal, so you'll see us with him around town too.

Speaker 1: 1:34:00

He's everywhere with us, but thanks for having us because you know like our lives have been very chaotic in the best of ways, and, um, being able to sit here and talk to you, in the beginning my mind was like all over the place and it actually got me to be able to kind of like just sit down and relax and be calm and perfect. I know that I jumped around a little bit, there's a lot of my mind, but, um, thank you for this opportunity I enjoyed. Congrats on your six months.

Speaker 3: 1:34:24

We're coming up in your six. Thank you, yeah, saturday, six months it's weird. Yeah, congrats, no thanks. Yeah, yeah, thankful for you guys being here excited for some more fried chicken, and I mean, probably there's going to be something else along the way that, yeah, so we have all of us coming out soon.

Speaker 2: 1:34:37

So we do.