"What If No One Listens To My Podcast?!" | Ep 19

When you first start a podcast, it's the dreaded fear of every entrepreneur turned podcast host - what if nobody listens to my podcast? And from there, the overthinking begins... 

Are my messages landing with the right people? 

Maybe I'm not "expert" enough.

Why would anyone listen to me?

The numbers are low and you don't know what's working yet - and in this episode, I'll be sharing how we can use that to our advantage. 

And I say this as someone that has started over with their podcast, going from hundreds of guaranteed weekly downloads, down to single and double digits as I first start a new podcast again. 

Want to start a podcast? Download the FREE Podcast Starter Checklist, a 15-point guide created specifically for entrepreneurs, life coaches and course creators.

Music by Kadien: Instagram | Spotify | SoundCloud

Transcript

Chantelle Dyson: 0:00

Even when you're getting 8, 9, 10, 11 views, you never know who those people are, because it's not about how many people that listen to your podcast. It's whose listening to your podcast that matters. It's not about trying to get everybody to listen to you, but trying to get the right people to listen to you at the right time for them. Hello and welcome to the Big Vision Business Owners Podcast. This is the place for business owners that have a message that they want to share with the world, and we'll be talking on this podcast about how to get seen online, how to raise your visibility and actually get your message out there so that you can have that impact on the world. We are all about creating a true connection with your audience, building a community around your podcast, what you do that feeds into your business. That can lead to growth leads and more sales. And, finally, we're all about changing the world changing the way the world thinks, by helping you to share your message so you could have that impact, leave that lasting legacy and be part of greater change in the future. And I'm your host, shontell Dyson, who's here to do it. With you. Along the way, I'll be sharing my expertise and experiences with being a Big Vision Business Owner, with being able to create content online the clever way, which means not having to spend hours on your phone, and together we'll be looking at how we can raise your profile online to get your message seen and heard. And with that let's get on with today's episode. Hello and welcome back. We are gonna be talking about the concept of the worry that might creep in for you if you're thinking about starting a podcast and you get this little voice coming into your head saying it's all well and good, I'm gonna get in front of a camera, I'm gonna get a microphone, I'm gonna start spreading my message. But what if, shontell, no one listens to my podcast? And this is a very real worry that we can have, because we see already on social media that it's quite hard to get attention online at the best of times. And then we think, well, all of this effort that I'm gonna put into a podcast, all the time it takes launching it, what if I do all of that and nobody listens? And it might even be that you're already at that stage where you have your podcast and you've got to a point where the listener numbers are stagnant. They might even just be in the single digits. Maybe you're lucky enough to be in the double digits or super lucky to be in the triple digits, but even so, I just don't feel like I'm getting engagement fee from people. People aren't gonna listen to what I'm actually saying. They might tune in but not say a lot, and really we're looking at that point of I just want people to actually listen. I don't wanna turn up into my hosting platform and see the numbers zero on there, and it's tough when it happens and we all have to start at zero.

Chantelle Dyson: 2:57

I did a podcast episode before which is what to do when you've got no followers. How do you grow that audience? And that spoke about the fact that we all start at zero. Go have a listen to that one before you come and listen to this one if you like, and I'm back in that position with you. I was four, five months ago thinking who's gonna listen to this? How do I do this podcast? Because it's very different to the single girls guide to life, my first podcast, which has been running for two years 100,000 downloads.

Chantelle Dyson: 3:24

Going back to zero and thinking, all right, we're gonna get three or four downloads on this this week is much more difficult to cope with when you're first starting a new podcast again, a lot of people worry about what that means, because you see other people doing well, you see other people charting. You see people commenting on their podcast as devout listeners, loyal listeners, commenting that this has helped them so much and that they're gonna gain so much from listening and can't wait for the next episode. You're like I want some of that excitement. I want my podcast to be listened to in that way, because I have something to share. What I'm saying is valuable and I wanna get it out there in the world and have an impact and change people's lives. But how do I do that if nobody's actually listening?

Chantelle Dyson: 4:10

Now, this episode is not gonna be about the strategies to get people listening. That was on a couple of episodes ago episode 16, where I went into the two things that you need to focus on, aside from social media. Social media plays a massive part in podcasting, in getting it out there to the unknown, and so did the two other things that I mentioned in terms of making blooming great content and making sure that it's shareable and that people actively do, by word of mouth, go out there and share it. What we're gonna address today is the approach that you can have when the time gets tough, when those numbers are stagnating, when you're stuck opening up your podcast platform and seeing that you've got the same eight downloads that you had every single week probably because that's just the ones that are followers and it automatically downloads onto and you actually think did anyone even really listen to this? Did anything happen or not?

Chantelle Dyson: 5:02

Now I wanna jump back to a story that I heard on another podcast, and this was about another creator. They were at the time. This is Paul Brunson. You may or may not have heard of him and he is a certified life coach, but he specialized in dating and went into that and started to create a YouTube series. So not quite a podcast, but it is putting content out there online very similarly to a podcast, and he was talking about modern day dating. He was called the modern day matchmaker at the time and he would post these videos week in, week out and he describes it as getting something like 11 or 12 views. And that is hard going. When you're doing it, you're passionate, like yes, I'm gonna keep driving this, it's gonna feed my business, gonna be part of it, and he was like 11 or 12 views. That was what it was getting, but it turned out that for him, those 11 or 12 views included one very special, useful viewer. That was Oprah Winfrey, who ultimately, further down the line, helped Paul Brunson to get seen by other people, gave him a platform, collaborated with him, and I tell you that story because even when you're getting eight, nine, 10, 11 views, you never know who those people are that are listening. Now I'm not saying that in your 10, 11, 12 views that Oprah Winfrey is paying attention to your podcast right now. The point is that you never know if someone like Oprah Winfrey is having a listen.

Chantelle Dyson: 6:36

They're checking you out behind the scenes. They're not letting you know that that's what's going on, but they're doing it even so, and this goes for the same as your clients. People that are interested in you are going to be checking you out online, and it only takes one of them to be interested in you enough to come to your Instagram page to see that you've got a podcast. They've binged a little bit of what's on your feed and they've gone. I kind of like these clips. I want to listen to a full episode. I've heard a bit. I'm intrigued by what this person has to say I'm going to go listen to the full episodes. So they jump in to the podcast. They might binge one, two or three episodes there and then, because they've watched that on Instagram and they've watched that on podcasting, then they decide you know what I really want to find out, how I can learn from this person, and they go to your freebie. They find that freebie and then suddenly they're in your world properly and you've got some details that you can start being in touch with them and developing an actual relationship where you know they exist.

Chantelle Dyson: 7:30

It's not just a one sided impact, and this is what we have to understand about podcasting is that when you first start, by all means, if you want to do the launches that get you in the charts early on, then go for it. But this is why I don't necessarily jump to that as the main strategy to be building a podcast as part of your business, because all we need is one or two of the right people coming through initially, going through that pathway, finding you deciding to listen to your podcast and, because of what you say in your podcast, maybe trying a few things out and then coming back and going. I would love to find out more from this person. I would love to work with this person. That's all we need. And those 11 or 12 views? You don't know who they are and I would much rather have 11 or 12 listens from people that are potential clients than I would 112 listens from people that are friends, that are supportive and give accolades but are never going to buy from me because I'm just not the right product or service for them. I don't offer what they need help with. Don't get me wrong. It's lovely to have support, it's lovely to experience that have a community behind you cheering you on. But when we come to business and sales unless they're going to go out there and then recommend the podcast to other people at the same time that's not what we're focused on.

Chantelle Dyson: 8:46

And the biggest mistake I see from entrepreneurs who start a podcast is that they're all about the download numbers. They're all about trying to get it as high as possible, to try and rank as high as possible and to have this status of having a number one podcast. Now, that is an accolade. That can sometimes be useful. It's great for a bit of press, but if we're talking about actually taking people on a journey, are potential perspective customers and clients, then I'm not so fussed about the numbers. I'm actually more fussed about the experience they have from the podcast from the first time that they encounter you and what happens with their journey.

Chantelle Dyson: 9:25

And you should be looking at your podcast not as something to suddenly get a number of downloads and feed your ego, get you famous or make you become an influencer. You should be looking at your podcast as an experience for the audience, something that then to journey through, to use as a back catalog so that they can find their way through the path. Enough of the stuff that you have shared has made them think about things, has made them seen things differently and made them go. This person knows what they're talking about. This person understands me and I want them to help me. There are plenty of other people out there just like me life coach, therapist, whatever it might be. There are other people out there that could help me, but this person is the right version of that thing for me, and the reason that I've decided that as a listener is because of the content and the way that you made me feel and the experience I had when I found your content.

Chantelle Dyson: 10:21

And so, when it comes to worrying about whether someone's going to listen to your podcast or not. It's realizing that it's not how many people listen to your podcast, but the experience that you give them, the journey that they're able to go through. Now you might be a fair few episodes through your podcast, much like I was for the single girls guides to life, and I've already mentioned that the single girls guides to life got 100,000 downloads and you could be like Chantel you're talking like this but you did actually do the numbers thing and I did do the numbers thing, and it is a fantastic flex to have that I can generate that amount of views by the different strategies that I can create. So if someone is chasing numbers, then so be it. That's cool, and I do think a majority of them were good listeners of the podcast. When I look at the stats on Spotify, there were some high numbers in the category of female in the 25 to 34 age range, but I had no business acumen when I started two years ago.

Chantelle Dyson: 11:20

I was learning all the ropes all at the same time and I happened to be well aligned with marketing, hence what I do now. I actually was missing a big gap and that was sales, and it's why, for the past year, I have focused pretty much entirely on sales, and that is a whole mixture of things, because sales doesn't just sit on its own. It's a very big diagram with marketing and your product and service, but sales has its own section of making sure that you understand customer journeys, which is where you can see how I've now brought in more of the podcast in terms of the customer journey experience, and it also means having conversations, knowing how to manage them, knowing when to set boundaries, etc. And that was one thing that, whilst I had the marketing bit, I didn't have the sales process bit, the sales technique to understand buyers fully, and that was something that I have worked a lot on and it is showing, because I might have had 100,000 downloads on that podcast and 2000 odd followers on Instagram and 38,000 followers on TikTok, but I've made just as much money in the time I was spending over there with all of those followers as I have in this business so far, with 500, less than 500 followers on any social media platform and less than 300 downloads on the podcast, because no longer am I focused on the numbers on social media to bring in the business to my business. Now there is a point at which you need to start leveraging it more.

Chantelle Dyson: 12:52

The point I missed was that I didn't have a sales process to follow up with the rest. So if you're thinking like people aren't going to listen to my podcast, that's cool, because ultimately we need to work out what we're going to do with those two, three, four, five listeners. If we can't get their attention and move them through the system, then what do you think you're going to do with 200, 300, 400, 500 listeners? I can tell you now, if you cannot move those people through your pipeline when you've only got five downloads, you're not going to be able to do it when you've got 500 downloads and when we start with low numbers, we're in an easy point to make a lot more tests. We're able to get it right better, we're able to refine the process better, so long as we put some attention on it, which is what I do now in my own process, something I totally missed for the first one.

Chantelle Dyson: 13:44

So I don't want you thinking that just by getting more followers, by getting more listeners, that you're going to generate more income and sales in your business, because the journey is what matters for people the experience, the opportunity to know, like and trust you and to decide that you are the right person for them. So, when it comes to thinking what if no one listens to my podcast Already, there's some value that we see. First off, you never know who's going to be listening. Second off, it gives you a chance to actually work out what you're doing with these people. Now, this is a little bit different. If you have that kind of funnel already fleshed out and it works for you Ultimately, then it is a case of being able to leverage that massively, and that's where we will use all of the techniques and strategies that I used before.

Chantelle Dyson: 14:32

What I'm talking about is that you're using podcasting as alternative to Instagram or LinkedIn and you haven't been able to get leverage there because your email list isn't growing either, and therefore we're just in the same position in podcasting and we still have to grow that. But we also have to think about the journey and have it mapped out, because if you're not getting Instagram people to sign up to your leads, if you're not getting people in Facebook groups to sign up to your lead list, then what do you think a podcast is going to do? Because if you haven't sussed it, we need to work that out. I'm usually pretty interested in anybody that I work with. If you have a sales process sorted already, do you know how you're taking customers through, from when they first meet you to them becoming a client? And are your packages suitably priced? Because if they're not, then we have an issue. A podcast is not going to save your ass, it's just not. There's a lot of things to worry about there. Exactly what I thought about this Going into a podcast is just moving the problem along, thinking that it's the marketing when it's a sales issue, when you need all of that there.

Chantelle Dyson: 15:33

But if you have that to hand, having next to no listeners is Not the end of the world. Because there are four things that having Few listens when you first start podcast is valuable for now. The first one is that it's valuable for you. You are able to practice your craft to getting in front of camera talking on podcast, talking at length as an expert in your field, without many people paying attention, and it can take a lot to put content out there in the first place. I remember my own first episodes where I'm practically whispering at the camera and it's terrible now If I was doing that now. I still feel cringe about it to be fair, I still feel a god what you doing. But we all feel like that. When we're first on camera and it's, we're very, very confident because we worry what people are gonna Think and we don't want our friends to think of us as think talking as an expert, when they might not feel that we're an expert. But Getting on camera talking long form gives you practice at that, and not only that, but you actually get brilliant at your messaging so long as you're working on it. So I have to think about the words I use after you. Think about how much Technical language do I use compared to not and I'm already slightly versed at this, being a teacher Simplifying maths for children, but not simplifying it so much that you've dumbed it down, but making it accessible and then pushing them on. In that sense, all of that gives you the chance to practice.

Chantelle Dyson: 17:06

And so the second purpose of having a podcast, regardless of how many down as you get, is that this will Streamline your social media strategy. If you have put a proper strategy behind your podcast so you have different reasons for different episodes and you know why then you will have almost an endless Library of content to be able to go through and repurpose to put out on your social media platforms. It is the single reason Alongside wanting to share the message, because I always wanted to share the message. I want to share the message with it on Instagram, facebook, whatever it might be. I always want to share the message. But the reason I went for a podcast was because it made all the others so much easier, because once I had one Long piece of content, it could be made into hundreds of other pieces and it could start to build my brand. It would get me seen online and no matter what, if I only get five listens on the podcast, that could be five potential customers. That doesn't matter, because I can leverage that over time and get attention using that same podcast. So whilst you might go, oh what if I waste all this time and energy in making a podcast and money if I put investment behind it, you go.

Chantelle Dyson: 18:15

But wait, this isn't just about one single podcast and getting five, ten, fifteen downloads. This is actually. This is, instead of a social media manager having to come up with ideas every single week, I can take this long piece of content and turn it into small pieces of content. It's actually two to three to four birds with one stone, because guess what? It can go on multiple Platforms, be it Instagram, facebook, tiktok, linkedin, and it can become a blog and an email for your email list. It might not be that straightforward to repurpose them all the time. It takes a little bit of work, but the thinking is coming out of it, so it's a blinder for that. Even if, from there, we are only channeling down those five to ten downloads initially, then we've got to focus on okay, we've got five to ten people coming in, what we're gonna do with them after that, and that's where that whole process of nurturing through marketing is important, plus then having a sales process as and when is necessary. So there already is two points, but there are two more purposes to a podcast beyond just counting those downloads.

Chantelle Dyson: 19:19

Now, the third one is all to do with the free trainings that you can offer people. This is your way of building a relationship with your audience. So when you're having a conversation, when you're out and about at networking in person, or you're in the DMs chatting to someone and they're Explaining that they want to start a podcast, but they're a bit worried about Starting because they're worried about that not getting any downloads, guess what I can do when they say that oh, really interesting that you say that I've got a podcast episode on that or I've got a free training that I can send through to you. Where should I send the email? Where should I send the link to you? Just use the podcast as your backlog, as something to help people, even if they're not working with you yet, because you can still help people with their problems through your podcast, and that's the beauty of the podcast.

Chantelle Dyson: 20:10

You might think, well, I'm doing this to try and get seen, I'm doing this to build my presence online, yeah, and we're gonna leverage that and get it all across social media and we're gonna use that to continue relationships with other people when they come into our DMs. It's gonna be something that, once you've got 15 to 20 episodes behind you, you should have covered most of the problems that people experience. You must have heard them by now when they say I'm worried about the tech, or I'm worried about getting no downloads, or how do I do it and say it confidently on camera? How can I be like you? You do it so naturally and you could sit there and explain it, which is obviously gonna be valid if you've got time.

Chantelle Dyson: 20:48

But if you're at networking, if you're at an event you might be talking in a coffee break you're gonna wanna get round the room to meet other people. Then go. You know what it's all about practice, and actually I spoke about this on my podcast episode only the other week. Let me send you the link, because I know we haven't got much time here right now and I know you like me when I get round to other people and have a good chat. But if I send you the link then you can listen to it in your own time on the journey back home. How does that sound? And you go from there and suddenly you're directing people to listen to your podcast, which will inevitably make the numbers go up. But if you get into that routine then you're used to treating your podcast like that backlog, like those free trainings that you've got to give to people and offer value. And, lastly, I know that the majority of you listening are what I would describe as purpose-driven entrepreneurs. That's how I like to think of myself, and often it's the people that I attract into working with me because they realize that, yes, there is totally a business side to having a podcast and having a business I am not averse to or opposed to earning money.

Chantelle Dyson: 21:57

I have good reason for wanting to earn money, both personal reasons and for reasons wider than myself. If you follow me on Instagram, you know every single month I will sponsor an animal. I currently am choosing an animal from Danaher Animal Rescue Center. It's an RSPCA division local to where I live I believe it's in Braintree in Essex and I sponsor an animal every single month because, if you wanna know the truth, I deeply, deeply want a dog and it's just not right for me to have one at now, as much as that pains me to say that it's not right. I don't have the space. I'm not in the same place all the time. I'm moving around left, right and center. It's not right, it's not fair and instead what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna support a local animal charity. It just so happens to be Danaher, so I share each month what animal it is that I'm sharing, do a little poll and ask people to guess which type of animal it's gonna be. So far I have sponsored a chinchilla, a dog, two rabbits, and what did I sponsor this month? Another dog. So there is a skew towards the dogs, but if I had more money, then it would go into things like that more and it would continue to feed other things.

Chantelle Dyson: 23:10

My intention whenever I earn any money is to spend it and not in a way that's like I'm gonna spend it on design. So I don't know if you've noticed, but if you look around, I don't have an uncomfortable life, but I also don't have a lavish lifestyle. I'm not jetting off left, right and center. I don't believe I own much designer stuff Any designer stuff. I don't even know what was designer. If you ask me to, I like a little bit of Oliver Bonus. That's a preference, but again, I love a good sale at Oliver Bonus too. I'm all about value for money.

Chantelle Dyson: 23:39

What I would like to do is feed other people's businesses. Now, I love going to events. So if you have a business event for me to go to, as long as the money come into my business, chances are I'll pay for a ticket to come to it and that will feed other people's businesses and light other people up in those particular ways. Now I can't just pigeonhole myself into buying stuff for other people, but my point is that you could have reasons to want to generate income and that's absolutely fine. But people know that the financial drive that I have is also matched by the giving back drive, and that goes far beyond just giving money to things, whether it's a charity or to another business.

Chantelle Dyson: 24:16

But the things that I've made podcasts on are things that I'm passionate about, and the first one was passionate about embracing and encouraging women to embrace single life, and my real drive was to address loneliness. Spoken about it before, I won't go into it today. Go listen to the I haven't made it yet podcast episode on this. And this podcast, whilst it is more businessy because it's B2B in the approach that is, my other company was B2C, so business to customer or consumer, and business to business is this one. There is still a deep passion to make sure I'm helping the right people, and those right to people are people that want to have an impact on other people Big time.

Chantelle Dyson: 25:00

Most people that choose to start a podcast do that, although I don't know if the entertainment podcasts are quite that way they wanna. Maybe they wanna make people laugh, maybe that's how they see it. But I'm looking for the people that are gonna cause social change, are going to create communities with what they do, and I believe that one of the most powerful ways you can start. That is through a podcast, because it gives you the confidence and clarity it helps to build and get you seen and it helps you to help other people with your podcast, even if they never pay you any money at all, because the people that do pay you money, if you've structured your business correctly, will fund all of that. It's like its own mini charity, without registering as a charity, because you will put that podcast out every single week, not behind a payable, and you may have a paid option at some point, but not without having a free option.

Chantelle Dyson: 25:50

You can get this information from me right now. You can go and get started with a podcast, you can listen to it all and you will hear my message about podcasting or if you go to the Singles Guide, so I feel my message about loneliness and loving your life, no matter what your relationship status is. It is there, it exists and it will always be there, and if there's nothing else that your podcast is for, it's to share that message and it only takes one person to hear that for their life to be changed in a result. And I didn't need the emails that I used to get on the Singles Guide to Life which ultimately had more of a direct impact on people's lives. This podcast is more of a ripple effect. Ie I will help other people to create their podcast which will give them the emails I'm not gonna get so many emails like I used to on that one because I wanna empower other people to be getting those emails by putting out their message.

Chantelle Dyson: 26:41

But the power when someone messages you and says that episode has really helped me. Or I've just gone through a breakup and I've just listened to three, four, five, six, seven, all of your episodes and I'm just listening to them all the time it is changing my whole view on it and I don't feel so bad about it. You can't put a value on that and even if it's only one download, you've changed somebody's life and that's what I think the people that I work with and that listen to this kind of podcast are about. And yes, you have to make it work financially in your business. I get it and I agree with it. Please make sure it works, because I weren't so great at that with the Sigurd Girls Guides of Life, got that process nailed down.

Chantelle Dyson: 27:27

Now you need to Remember what you're doing. This all for this isn't just about podcast download numbers. Stop letting your ego get to you and I know it would be lovely to get invited to speak on stage to be known as that person, but remember what you're here for, from your perspective personally and from what you can impact the world with with your podcast. So don't let the idea of getting no podcast download stop you from starting a podcast, because it's not about how many people that listen to your podcast. It's whose listening to your podcast that matters. It's not about trying to get everybody to listen to you, but trying to get the right people to listen to you at the right time for them, and there are ways that you can make that happen.

Chantelle Dyson: 28:17

Back listening to episode 16. But the first thing to address is your ego, your mentality and your fear around that there's no reason you can't start a podcast and start by getting two, three, four, five downloads on each episode and continue to build that with the drive of sharing your message, building your own confidence, getting clarity on your message and using it as a content machine to then leverage as part of having an impact on the world whilst building a business that really makes a difference, and that is what we are all about. So I will leave it there for you today and until next time. Keep changing the way the world thinks, one podcast at a time.