Milana Vayntrub is a Creative Force for Good -Art, Collaboration, Authenticity ~ Spark of Ages Ep 15
May 11, 2024Season 1Episode 15
Rajiv Parikh
Email us with any feedback for the show: spark@postion2.com
Episode Description: Have you ever wondered about the moral compass guiding the hands that craft the stories we love, or how humor can be a beacon through the fog of the creative process? Prepare to embark on an enchanting odyssey with the inimitably talented Milana Vayntrub. As an actor/director, her candid tales of navigating marketing campaigns and the director's chair are as enlightening as they are entertaining. Milana opens the door to her world, revealing how embracing both gratitude and resilience paves the way for success in the arts, and why a good laugh might just be the most underrated tool in a creative's kit.
Dive headfirst into the transformative power of collaborative leadership, a theme that resonates throughout our chat with Milana. She unravels her experiences managing teams on ad campaigns, allowing us to appreciate the finesse required to marry brand identity with captivating narratives. But it’s not just about the nuts and bolts of production—there's an art to maintaining humanity in this digital age. As we confront the rise of AI and its potential impact on the authenticity of human-made art, we’ll explore the legal quagmires and ethical debates that are currently shaping the future of storytelling.
The journey to Hollywood fame is seldom a straight path, especially for a bright-eyed immigrant with stars in her eyes and a dream in her heart. Milana shares her own path from Uzbekistan to the bright lights, discussing her earliest acting memories, the values instilled by a supportive family, and a relentless drive that sees failure as merely a detour. This episode isn't just about the glamour of the industry; it's about finding the courage to forge your own path and honor your creative urges, regardless of the pressures and expectations that might attempt to steer you off course. Join us for an episode that's as much a map for the heart as it is a behind-the-scenes tour of the entertainment world.
Email us with any feedback for the show: spark@postion2.com
Episode Description: Have you ever wondered about the moral compass guiding the hands that craft the stories we love, or how humor can be a beacon through the fog of the creative process? Prepare to embark on an enchanting odyssey with the inimitably talented Milana Vayntrub. As an actor/director, her candid tales of navigating marketing campaigns and the director's chair are as enlightening as they are entertaining. Milana opens the door to her world, revealing how embracing both gratitude and resilience paves the way for success in the arts, and why a good laugh might just be the most underrated tool in a creative's kit.
Dive headfirst into the transformative power of collaborative leadership, a theme that resonates throughout our chat with Milana. She unravels her experiences managing teams on ad campaigns, allowing us to appreciate the finesse required to marry brand identity with captivating narratives. But it’s not just about the nuts and bolts of production—there's an art to maintaining humanity in this digital age. As we confront the rise of AI and its potential impact on the authenticity of human-made art, we’ll explore the legal quagmires and ethical debates that are currently shaping the future of storytelling.
The journey to Hollywood fame is seldom a straight path, especially for a bright-eyed immigrant with stars in her eyes and a dream in her heart. Milana shares her own path from Uzbekistan to the bright lights, discussing her earliest acting memories, the values instilled by a supportive family, and a relentless drive that sees failure as merely a detour. This episode isn't just about the glamour of the industry; it's about finding the courage to forge your own path and honor your creative urges, regardless of the pressures and expectations that might attempt to steer you off course. Join us for an episode that's as much a map for the heart as it is a behind-the-scenes tour of the entertainment world.
Hello and welcome to the Spark of Ages podcast, where we're going to talk to founders, innovators, ceos, investors, designers and artists I'm talking game changers about their big, world-shaping ideas and what sparked them. I'm your host, Rajiv Parikh. I'm the CEO and founder of Position Squared, an incredible growth marketing company based in Palo Alto. It is incredible. Damn right, it is, but I'm also a business news junkie and a history nerd.
Rajiv Parikh:
I'm fascinated by how big world-changing movements go from the spark of an idea to an innovation that reshapes our lives. In every episode, and especially this one, we're going to go to a deep dive with our guests about what led them to their own eureka moments, how they're going about executing it and, perhaps most importantly, how they get other people to believe in them so that their idea can also someday become a spark for the ages. If you like what you hear, please take a moment to rate it and comment. Feedback is what drives our show, so take the 30 seconds and say hello. This is the Spark of Ages podcast. In addition to myself, we have our producer and, today, co-host, Sandeep, who will occasionally chime in to make sure we don't get too in the weeds with tech jargon.
Sandeep Parikh:
That's not a problem. For this episode coming up. We have my good friend Milana Vayntrub on this, so yeah, this is going to be a fun one. I'm excited, excited.
Rajiv Parikh:
So let's get into our conversation with Milana Vayntrub. Our guest today is director, actor and improviser Milana Vayntrub. Milana's story is a narrative of resilience and determination. As a refugee who faced religious persecution, she has a deep understanding of overcoming adversity and breaking barriers. Her journey from Uzbekistan to a working director and performer in Hollywood is a testament to her talent and her versatility as an artist. As an actor, she appeared on shows like Silicon Valley, This Is Us, and Love.
Rajiv Parikh:
You may, however, know her best as Lily Adams, the principal spokesperson of AT&T's US marketing campaigns from 2013 to 2016 and 2020 to 2023. After appearing in way too many ads for AT&T, Milana took over directing the ads herself. In addition to directing campaigns for companies like the Make-A-Wish Foundation, Voya Financial and Cracker Barrel Cheese. Most recently, she completed a short film called Pickled Herring, based on her relationship with her old world Soviet dad. Milana, welcome to Spark of Ages.
Milana Vayntrub:
This is very nice.
Rajiv Parikh:
I'm very happy to be here. Oh, that's awesome. So one of the interesting things that we get to talk about today is a creative force in Milana, which is a lot of the people I bring on the show tend to be more on the pure entrepreneurial side or starting a business, but Milana's a real artist and, frankly, that's what I do at Position Squared. What we do in our company is we drive growth marketing for businesses, so we take our creative capability and turn that into ads and media that we place and the infrastructure behind it. So this is really super fun. So let's start off with the basics. Milana, First of all. As a director, how do you evaluate what you want to work on when you weigh your choices? Is it based on brand, the creative brief? What gets you into it other than that you're going to get a good check?
Milana Vayntrub:
Yeah, the check is pretty much the same almost all around. I mean, the check doesn't vary enough for that to be a deciding factor. Yes, the first veto would be am I morally aligned with this? If this is for ExxonMobil, it's probably a pass. For me. Yeah, there are certain brands that I'm more excited to work with than others. And if it aligns morally, then that's the first check, and I think the production company I work with knows me and has similarly aligned morals that we just don't take on certain projects. So there's that. The second is is it funny? Because really my thing is just comedy. And so if it's already funny and if I think I can make it funnier, if I believe I will be a value add, and is it going to be fun to make Like, are the people I'm working with lovely? Are they all sticks in the mud? Usually it's. Actually. It could go either way.
Rajiv Parikh:
Are many of them truly sticks in the mud? Is that a thing?
Milana Vayntrub:
No, I think they're just with collaborating with people. Some people are more attached to their vision and some people are more down to collaborate and, honestly, it's worth it for me to learn how to work with all sorts of different people and I'm down for it. So it can still be fun most of the time, because I actually really enjoy being on a crew and I like learning about the marketing elements of different brands. That's one of the gifts in terms of thinking about marketing as a director of campaigns is that you get to dabble in like what's Tide's whole model versus what's Downey's whole model, what's McDonald's going for that Pepsi would never do and what's Pepsi doing that McDonald's would poo-poo. So you really get to learn the ends, the jargon that people use and everyone takes what they do very seriously. In this business, which I think you know for better or worse, we're probably all digging ourselves early graves, but it's what makes it so fun to collaborate with people is that they really care about the final product.
Rajiv Parikh:
I like your point about how different companies see themselves, and one of the reasons I got into marketing and why I'm still at it for 20 plus years is because I love figuring out what gets people to buy. So there's that magical moment where you take someone from potentially being skeptical to their brain flips into buying, and then you can even take them further into becoming an influencer and a promoter. And that's what you're doing as a spokesperson and then later on working with actors as a director. Any thoughts there?
Milana Vayntrub:
Yeah, I've thought about this a lot and I think sometimes the most we can do in an ad is make people feel good about the brand. I think we'd put in a lot of energy and effort into transferring information and making sure people remember the deal or the way these special bubbles work in this kind of soap or whatever. But actually the best we could hope for is people saying oh, that made me feel good, I kind of like that place, I don't know why, I just kind of like that place and then when they're at the store, they feel an affinity towards that and they move. I think that's the best we're hoping for in terms of TV ads and if there's a bit of new information you only have 30 seconds, right?
Rajiv Parikh:
I mean you really have like 22 seconds.
Milana Vayntrub:
Yeah, you have like 22 seconds if you're going to have an end card with the brand, and so the goal is can you make it memorable and can you make it likable brand, and so the goal is can you make it memorable and can you make it likable? And I often remember the quote that people don't remember what you said. They remember how you made them feel, and that's that's all I'm trying to do is just trying to make people feel good.
Sandeep Parikh:
And I think I think, mixed in all that right Is like you also can't make them feel like they're being sold to, because that's like a turnoff, it's like a magic trick. You got to do all this stuff without making them feel like, hey, I'm trying to get your money.
Milana Vayntrub:
Yeah, and I think that that's almost part of like the moral question that I brought up at the beginning is like, is this something I would feel okay recommending to a friend? I would feel fine recommending any iPhone to a friend, or any Samsung phone, galaxy, whatever, s, whatever to any friend, so like that doesn't feel like I'm like tricking anybody into anything. It feels aligned. I'm like, yeah, you should check this out. If this is what you're interested in, feel good about it, check it out. So yeah, those are always fun for me.
Sandeep Parikh:
Authenticity and Right If they met you on the street and you talked to them.
Rajiv Parikh:
Would you be willing to promote it? Also, talk about some of that creative process. When you're on set, you hit it from two dimensions right. First, at least for AT&T, you were doing this as the spokesperson. It was the actor. And then later on, you were doing it as the actor and the director. So how do you run that creative process?
Milana Vayntrub:
You know, it's just practice. I think I started my career making stuff for myself and for my friends and then I would edit it myself and with friends, and so it feels very natural for me to direct myself. First things first with any project is a good script, and so the way I still try to start things, when I'm even just acting in them, is can we make sure the script is as strong as it can possibly be? And sometimes that script needs a lot of work and sometimes it's perfect and from there everything else flows or doesn't. So it all starts with text. Is Rex, as my eighth grade English teacher used to say?
Rajiv Parikh:
Text is Rex. Text is Rex.
Milana Vayntrub:
Yeah, text is rex. As my eighth grade english teacher used to say text is rex, text is rex. Yeah, text is king, like whatever the copy matters. Um, if it's funny in there, if you can sense the charm in there, I think casting can only do so much, and I think that's that's another thing that I've learned in auditions for dozens and dozens of commercials.
Milana Vayntrub:
I can tell tell that if you're not, if for some reason when someone's reading it you can't find somebody who makes it sound natural or charming or real, then it's probably the text and that's what needs reworking. So if the text is there, I have no problem acting and directing myself. Sometimes I can be in my body and like, let the creativity flow, and then I can also turn that off and be outside of my body and watching all of the many factors. Also, the good news about commercials, which is very different than TV, is that there's a lot of playback in commercials, meaning we'll film it and then we'll all play it back and we'll all talk about it ad nauseum and then we'll go back and do it again.
Rajiv Parikh:
So I get to watch myself and it's it's all good, keep honing it as you go, right.
Milana Vayntrub:
For sure.
Rajiv Parikh:
I mean, one of the fun things about being on set with Sandeep was he would have them do their multiple takes and then he'd say, okay, now go improv this one.
Milana Vayntrub:
Yeah, do you do something similar. For sure. We do that pretty much after like two takes and a lot of the gold comes from that. And we'll have somebody the script supervisor, who's often sitting right next to the director will be writing down every single version so that when the camera moves we can get it in different angles. But it's always so fun to hire actors who are improvisers and writers. I mean, it's like such an added bonus. They should everyone, every improviser should get a writer's fee. It's such a special skill.
Sandeep Parikh:
For real. Another way to ask it would be like what role does failure play in your creative journey? Like.
Milana Vayntrub:
I don't experience failure.
Sandeep Parikh:
I haven't had any keep going.
Rajiv Parikh:
You never had, never happened, never happened.
Sandeep Parikh:
Don't know what that is Practically perfect in every way, right Like our audience, like the audience of this podcast is mostly wanting to start their own or spark their own sort of entrepreneurial journey, and I think one of the things that going through the rigors of Hollywood does, I want to say, make us immune to failure, but it certainly-.
Milana Vayntrub:
No, it toughens us up. Yes, toughens us up.
Sandeep Parikh:
So I wonder if you could speak to that, because you didn't just come out landing this huge AT&T contract and you had to go through some stuff to get there. So maybe just speak to that journey a little bit.
Milana Vayntrub:
Well, I think what the failure does is make you appreciate the wins. I am in so much gratitude when I am working, and particularly when I'm in, when I'm working with people. I love so when I feel like I'm making something good, something that is a value add to people's lives, or when I can just'm making something good, something that is a value add to people's lives, or when I can just you know, if there's a, if I can make the boom, the person holding the boom mic, laugh, I'm like that's a value add. And I remember, you know, years and years and years ago, I was making like a silly video for Funny or Die and I was complaining about something and Johnny Pemberton, who's a also a really funny comedic actor, I was complaining about something and he said, don't forget, there's nowhere else you'd rather be If you weren't here.
Milana Vayntrub:
You would wish you were here, and I think about that all the time whenever I'm complaining. And then one time I worked with a another super established actor and I was directing him and he had to do the same line 50 times and step back and do it again and land on his mark in a certain way and do this really what could have been perceived as an annoying thing to do and I am like it was Danny Trejo. I'm like oh, I'm so sorry, mr Trejo, can you do it again? Can you do it again? He goes oh, don't apologize, we're not pouring cement. And I loved that attitude and I really try to have cement.
Milana Vayntrub:
But he said cement and that's why it was funny, but I loved it Did a double take. We're not pouring semen all over ourselves. Calm down, lady. You ever been to war? You ever been in jail?
Rajiv Parikh:
I could do this again, oh yeah.
Sandeep Parikh:
He talks about his experience in jail and stuff. Right, that's like his, he's like.
Milana Vayntrub:
I'm not in jail. I'm sure that will make you, yeah, grateful for stepping on a mark 50 times in a row. So so, yes, I think the failure makes me appreciate the wins. And then I think you know, once you get a taste of something really working, you know when it's not, when you're in an environment where you're, like this, got shitshow vibes. I don't know what it is about this, but this does not feel like smooth sailing. So I think it sharpens your intuition in that way. And again, when you get a taste of something that's really good, you want to get back there. So the work ethic is different.
Sandeep Parikh:
I'm excited to do it again. Do you reframe the failures After going through so many auditions just by virtue of the process and the pigeonhole principle, like how it just works, there's only gonna be one actor for the thousands that are coming in and there's going to be a lot of people that are highly, highly qualified. Do you do something to reframe the concept of failure?
Milana Vayntrub:
Because I've been in so many casting rooms on the other side as the director, I really know that sometimes it just doesn't have that much to do with the actor, the director. I really know that sometimes it just doesn't have that much to do with the actor. Sometimes we're casting a certain ethnicity or a certain height or whatever, somebody who could just say this line in some other way, somebody who improvised something and that improv was so good. There's so many factors, and they're not always about me, and that makes me feel better as an auditioning person, yeah. And then I think also I'm sorry to do this on a business podcast, but also from a spiritual perspective, I'm like the universe has my back and things are going to work out in the way that they're supposed to work out and I'll be okay.
Rajiv Parikh:
Business- people do have Souls, do they? We do? Sometimes we believe that the universe is behind our backs in selling this wonderful technology widget. So you talked about how you love working with people in a collaborative environment. So how do you think about how you would manage that team? Is there a framework? You have to handle just creative disagreements within your team.
Milana Vayntrub:
Um, I try to make everyone feel heard, which is maybe obvious. But sometimes you know, in some environments you're like okay, if you really insist that this is the way it has to go, let's try it that way, and then you will see that you're wrong. Um so, so that's possible.
Sandeep Parikh:
Give them a shot. Right, Give them a shot.
Rajiv Parikh:
And then I'm also open to being wrong.
Milana Vayntrub:
That's also incredibly possible that the vision that I have for something is not right. I mean, that's part of being a great collaborator is that it's like the best idea wins and I'm fine with it not being mine. That's kind of one perspective of running a team, and then the other again, again is to remember that everyone is human and everyone has a mom that they're thinking about, or a kid that they're thinking about, or like figuring out how they're going to pay their rent, and so I try not to operate in too much of a hierarchy.
Rajiv Parikh:
Um, even when I'm directing as humans. Yeah, yes.
Milana Vayntrub:
Even when I'm directing um, even though you know there is a, there's literally on call sheets, people are listed in hierarchical fashion. I still believe the best idea wins and sometimes everyone can bring an idea and I make the final decision. But I very much hope that no one is not saying something because of a belief in a hierarchy. I really encourage genuine collaboration.
Milana Vayntrub:
Because I also think that some people know better than me. Can you believe it? I know it's crazy to say it happens. Some people know how to do other things better than I know how to do all things.
Rajiv Parikh:
So, as a director, you're working with all these corporate brands in advertising, and so you're taking emotions, the atmosphere, the brand. You're creating compelling visuals, you're working on the sound, the motion, and each job requires a unique approach for each band brand. So now, how would you think about that challenge? Where do you start with these brands? Do you go and play with them? Do you create mood boards? Do you get immersed in the material? Does the team send you things? How do you?
Milana Vayntrub:
think about all this so often. I will get a script that will have a little bit of a mood board attached or will give me a sense of what they're thinking, and I will go through and look at their previous work at least their previous recent work and see how they want this to be similar or different. And yeah, brands have tones and just by absorbing that work you can kind of intuit, you can say, oh, this brand is okay, kind of pushing this line of being raunchy. This brand is really conservative. This brand is really family oriented. This brand is really about having an absurd kind of comedy and that informs my writing when I'm writing my treatment or my pitch of how I'm going to handle it. Some of the best advice I got early on is don't try to write it to sound like anything other than what you sound like.
Rajiv Parikh:
Yeah, that really helps. I mean we've worked with the brand and then the director of brand and then the firm that brings in the director. A lot of this is we're trying to hone from the client what story they're trying to tell. What story they're trying to tell.
Rajiv Parikh:
And many times we go through, even before we get to the point of hiring the team that puts together the ad itself or the commercial or the short video series. We go back, sometimes for months and trying to hone the theme down and even get the three or four words that the campaign's about down. It goes through many, many iterations and so then it comes to the director and then the director's special, because the director's actually putting it all together working with the team creating the visuals, creating the story.
Rajiv Parikh:
The director wants to bring his or her own artistic impression in. And then the client has a certain point of view and we're trying to represent the intersection for both, because we want the campaign to succeed. So that's where you're talking about your artistic freedom.
Milana Vayntrub:
You're trying to bring some of your artistic freedom and bring that voice to it, yeah, and I think there's a lot to respect in that work that was done before I even see anything. There has been so much tweaking and sculpting before I see it to make it something that to me is like, oh, this is so easily digestible, whereas there have been 50 iterations of it before it got to be so. And that's part of being able to interpret it as a director is I see this, I see what you want and here let me blow up these three words to be a whole world.
Rajiv Parikh:
Yeah, one of the ones that we did was for a large computer company, and they were trying to talk about how technology enables you to be not just more productive but express yourself and do the things you love to do. And we went through months and months of iteration. It originally was just supposed to be like a shutter stock set of videos that we put together no acting at all, no director, nothing and over time it morphed with them until it actually became something that we need to hire a firm cast, find the right director. And I'll tell you, the amazing part about it was that at first we were going to hire actors to speak according to our script. In the end, the director found great businesses where they basically cast the owner of the business and they literally blew us away. So there are times where you come in with certain expectations and then the person that you work with just blows you away with something going way beyond what you originally thought. And it's just. It's a great thing when that happens.
Milana Vayntrub:
Yeah, that's the dream.
Sandeep Parikh:
Milana, can you take us through like a time where you had a different vision on something, or a time where you took like kind of a bolder creative risk because you really saw something that maybe wasn't in those actual documents or anything the the audience would like to kind of like get behind the sausage making there, like how do you, you know, tackle those moments?
Milana Vayntrub:
I think again it goes back to the collaboration where they give me a script and the first job that everyone has is to make it the best text possible. And so improv can do that a lot, where I take something and then I'm like, well, we'll just see what comes out in the moment. We'll see if when I'm saying it, it feels good saying it, because that's again there is some kind of intuition, and I think it comes with practice of doing improv for a decade now, where I can say that sounds fake coming out of my mouth. How can we make that sound more human? And this isn't.
Milana Vayntrub:
I do this on spots that I'm not acting in, where I will walk through it as the person performing it and say like, does this feel like a good thing to say, does this feel helpful and kind and warm and all the things, and ultimately have the goal of being funny. But yeah, I think I I push back a lot on the AT&T sets because that's just the creative relationship is like I push and someone else pushes and someone else pushes, and it doesn't ever feel aggressive. I hope it always just feels like we all have a hand in making this the best it can be. And because it was specifically my face saying it, I felt a lot of responsibility in it this the best it can be. And because it was specifically my face saying it, I felt a lot of responsibility in it being the best it could be.
Rajiv Parikh:
That's awesome. It sounds like it must be an incredible process, and you guys did so many commercials and campaigns. I doubt they first. I bet you they must have had a certain run for you and then they saw what happened and they extended it.
Rajiv Parikh:
Let's talk about entertainment and the ad industry. There's a ton of disruption in both areas. There's a bit of consolidation occurring. I mean a lot of times when you're streaming you're not really watching ads, although the streamers are trying to re-release the shows but give it to you for lower costs in exchange for showing more ads. They're giving the option to come in and out Netflix is talking about adding ads and stuff like that.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yeah, I mean because brands still want to come out.
Rajiv Parikh:
Yeah, they have freebie. Or nowadays they charge you an extra three bucks not to see the ad. Right Before, it used to all come without ads. Or last night, when I was watching a show on Peacock, they give me the minute ad, kind of like Hulu-ish. What do you think about this consolidation and the way it's coming together? There's different forms of entertainment. There's the whole streaming movement. There's the Apple Vision Pro, immersive experiences. How do you see these changing and coming together?
Milana Vayntrub:
I mean, I think the coming together of tech and entertainment was really cool at the beginning and then really disruptive and now chaotic and detrimental and super damaging.
Sandeep Parikh:
Look, I think it's an honest conversation to have, because people are not going to not use these tools right, they're not going to, just especially in places where there isn't an established entertainment industry. This is going to allow folks in remote parts of the world to be able to create stuff, make anything. Yeah, you go on Instagram and you just have a filter that gives you makeup. Essentially Like, what are folks to do? I'm just, I'm kind of playing the other side of it, devil's advocating a little bit, like when the competition in the marketplace is going to be making utilization of these tools. And, yeah, you're in a position to be like yeah, well, I'm not going to, because I think that's moralistically not helpful to my community. But how do you evaluate folks that are just trying to compete and survive and utilizing these tools to keep them competitive in the marketplace?
Milana Vayntrub:
Sorry to be a broken record, but I think I go back to the best work is made through collaboration, to the best work is made through collaboration, and if you're not collaborating, then you are what playing God, in a way, and saying you and this computer know better than the other six people you could have hired, who have access to the infinite as well, which is their imagination. I would much rather have a meeting with makeup artists, for example, special effects artists, who can bring their ideas and expertise, than to just paste it on later with AI. Again. I understand the industry is changing. It's always going to be changing. I am not expecting it to slow down at any pace. I know it's exponentially going to change. Singularity is happening in our industry too, but I am also grieving the loss of work for my friends and holding onto this idea that I think human creativity has a lot to offer. The other thing I will say is that a lot of AI work writing and art is borrowed work from human skill.
Rajiv Parikh:
That's right.
Milana Vayntrub:
So who are we paying for that work that they are accessing? They're pulling from a well of knowledge that is not being credited.
Rajiv Parikh:
I think that's one of the issues. The New York Times sued OpenAI because a lot of the training sets for OpenAI were trained on New York Times articles and I'm sure that in the terms and conditions of the New York Times, it's meant for personal purposes, it's not meant for you to use it and build a business off of, and so they're suing it on that basis. Right, that's a copyright violation and there's not an economic system Like there should be, an economic system whereby if you use my content, there's a way for the original source creator to get paid. I know that in some of the tools that we use like we use Adobe tools right For constructing images like Photoshop and some of their more later tools they're taking on the liability of getting legal liability, but they've also created an economic system by which the creators get paid. So for the better advertisers, for the more brand name advertisers, more brand conscious advertisers there's a path.
Rajiv Parikh:
I'm not saying it's a great path or a good path, because I don't know the actual system in detail, but at least there should be a path for those who create content or are the source image should get paid.
Milana Vayntrub:
You know it makes me think about what art looks like down the line, and can anyone? First of all, I will say that if I see a piece of art, this is just personal. No offense to AI artists, whatever you are, if you even want to call yourself that. Like when I see a piece of art that is made by a human, even if it's made by a human in Photoshop, which I think is also a legitimate form of art, I feel differently about it than when I know it's an AI piece of art. When I see models constructed in AI faces, constructed in AI actors that are not human, I can sense the lack of heart in it and I do not put it past the robots to figure out how to trick us into thinking that there's humanity behind their eyes.
Milana Vayntrub:
That's what's going to happen, but right now it's just not working for me.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yeah, right now.
Milana Vayntrub:
I think it's the question is that when they come? Side by side.
Sandeep Parikh:
will it always be doing that, yeah?
Milana Vayntrub:
That's the fear is, what is it going to do? To art down the line and writing.
Rajiv Parikh:
That's a hot topic for your next podcast and maybe even more of mine Cause.
Sandeep Parikh:
I think it's a super hot topic all the way.
Rajiv Parikh:
No, it is a hot topic and it's actually really interesting to talk about what technology can do, and I'm playing a lot. We're playing a lot with AI and we definitely see the productivity benefits, but we also see the potential issues in it, so it's legitimate. But I want to take you back, milana, to what got you into the entertainment industry. What got you down the path?
Milana Vayntrub:
I'm a fool and I figured out a way to make money off of it.
Rajiv Parikh:
You could be a clown and you can play.
Milana Vayntrub:
Yeah, I was, I don't know. My mom like saw that in me really young and put me into acting classes and that's how it all happened.
Rajiv Parikh:
she uh, you want me to keep keep going on it because I can give you more specifics uh yeah, when I was like five, what was your, what was your first, what was your first commercial?
Milana Vayntrub:
I think my first commercial was for MCI, which ironically was maybe bought by AT&T, so maybe my first and last commercial, I don't know if it was MCI?
Sandeep Parikh:
Oh my gosh, Do you remember that?
Rajiv Parikh:
That's bringing me back. Yeah, I do MCI, then it was WorldCom.
Milana Vayntrub:
My first and my last commercial were both phone commercials.
Sandeep Parikh:
Wow, oh, your last eh.
Milana Vayntrub:
Well, I mean, I don't think after at&t I'm gonna be acting in any more commercials, but we'll see.
Rajiv Parikh:
Oh wow, okay, we'll see. So you, you got in.
Milana Vayntrub:
Your mom saw this talent in you yeah, she put me in acting classes, you put me in, you lived in hollywood or you lived in. You lived in beverly hills my, no, my family immigrated to West Hollywood corner of. Santa Monica and Fairfax. And so, uh, yeah, started taking acting classes and, uh, gymnastics and all sorts of things that are going to make me a good little obedient clown. And then I uh, and then I uh, yeah, auditioned for things, got an agent, got a manager or maybe just an agent at the time?
Sandeep Parikh:
when was it your call? Because when I'm four and five, I'm not oh, I loved it now you're, you're, no, you're a mom now. Yeah, I couldn't wait, so excited to go on auditions.
Milana Vayntrub:
So excited to get a call back, so excited to be on set. My mom couldn't call me down when we were on set.
Rajiv Parikh:
I was bouncing off the walls, so from you love showing out, you loved being that show person. You loved being in the limelight playing.
Milana Vayntrub:
I love a set. I mean, if you have not been on a set, rajiv, I know you have. But like, if for for the listeners, the experience of being on a set is I don't. I mean, for me it feels like a great dessert after a great meal. It's like so energizing Everyone there and again, maybe not everyone, but just go with me on these exaggerations, will you?
Milana Vayntrub:
But like, everyone there is in their element. They're doing something they love, they're taking it really seriously, and yet there is an element of playfulness. People are. Everyone. There is a team player. They're used to either working with the same group of people for as long as the show has been on the air or they're, if it's a commercial. They're bouncing around from crew to crew. So, like, the people don't get to work for that long. And there's a ton of snacks. There's snacks everywhere. So it's for a kid especially. And I was treated so well, you know, um, I loved getting. I loved as a little girl sitting down in hair and makeup and trying on different outfits and then sitting under the lights and having people look at me like it was. It was my calling from day one, but even now when I'm on a set no, no I still don't really.
Rajiv Parikh:
You didn't have like that hesitancy. Oh, am I gonna look stupid or am I gonna make a mistake? And I just think it's amazing that you can memorize lines. I'm terrible at it, so I'm just four and five.
Milana Vayntrub:
You're not even are you, you're not aware yet, you're not self-aware in that way yet though I remember times where I did get nervous, um, if I felt like the stakes were high, but often I just I really loved it and then I would go to. You know, I'd go to auditions frequently enough that I got to see friends like I made friends at them. It was just. It was just like an after-school, especially when I was younger, just like anything is for kids, and is that how your mom kind of treated it Like?
Sandeep Parikh:
how did your mom deal with the stakes of it? Cause I'm sure part of it is like hey look, this is going to support the family If you book this gig, right?
Milana Vayntrub:
No, no, no. My mom never took any of the money, never, ever, ever, not once. All of that money was used for my college account. Wow, she would do all of that for fun and for free, and I didn't see any of that money until I started college.
Rajiv Parikh:
It's true labor of love, right, mom taking? You to all these auditions and taking you out there. It's just amazing.
Milana Vayntrub:
And then I graduated without any college debt because of the work that I did when I was a kid.
Rajiv Parikh:
I have here in your background that you went to high school but then you left high school.
Milana Vayntrub:
Yeah, I dropped out after 10th grade. Well, dropped out. I mean, I took a test and I went to community college, which was really great for me because I got to take philosophy and political science and psychology and kind of figure out who I am and what matters to me. And for years I didn't take theater or even think that was going to be my path. I was really hoping for it to be something more practical, like philosophy.
Milana Vayntrub:
And then I, and then when I got, when I transferred to a university which I again, because, like the universe works in mysterious ways I ended up, totally by accident, going to a school with one of the top three grad programs for theater in the country, which was UCSD Amazing.
Milana Vayntrub:
And I went there only because it was the closest school I got into and was close to the beach school I got into and was close to the beach and because I was bored and sad and depressed, was like I have to do something creative or I might die. And I auditioned for a play and that's how I made all my friends. And then we would constantly put on our own shows and we were all writing and acting and directing in each other's shows. And then after college, I knew that this was my path and didn't like the idea of asking for permission to do all of those things, because I'd just been doing them without permission and it was the light of my life. So that's why I started a YouTube channel and, nice, that was my ticket. And then I also worked for Sandeep, who was your first guest.
Sandeep Parikh:
Who's your? Who's your first guest? Who was your?
Milana Vayntrub:
first guest. I think it was Sandeep Parikh. Oh, I remember that guy, I know that guy Sandeep was actually a huge influence for me early on, because he was making Legend of Neil Come on. And I was his intern Free labor, by the way, which should be illegal, sending out t-shirts and we had no money.
Sandeep Parikh:
You think companies, I chose pay guys.
Milana Vayntrub:
Yeah, I was like you know I was designing posters and filling out forums for actors and doing all sorts of office work for him, but I did find the you being around.
Sandeep Parikh:
You asked me.
Milana Vayntrub:
Oh yes, and I was so grateful too, because really being in the, in the creative environment, was really the inspiration I needed to go and do my own thing.
Rajiv Parikh:
So you created your own videos. You got to, you got a chance to work with this this person named Sandeep. You created these videos you. You basically decided you're going to take it on yourself to to highlight who you are and do your own creative production, and then that then led to more theater and then advertising.
Milana Vayntrub:
Oh, good question. So I, um, we made this web series called let's talk about something more interesting. Uh, that was kind of my my little film school. Um, just worked with friends who taught me how to do things and shout out Sammy Cohen, adam Coutinho, and then we ended up selling that show as a pilot to MTV and that show also got me representation. So it got me an agent and a manager and that is how I got my commercial auditions. So for the AT&T job it was just another commercial, one of the hundred commercial auditions I went on that year.
Rajiv Parikh:
So sometimes people see commercial work as a way of getting paid that gives them the opportunity to do the creative work that they really love to do. Or some people see it as an art form in and of itself I think I saw it as both I really enjoyed.
Milana Vayntrub:
Again, I was an improviser and I thought of commercial auditions as an opportunity to play and see my friends in the waiting room and and and again, kind of like I do. I feel like I understood the tone of this spot and what they wanted and went in pretending to be that.
Rajiv Parikh:
But you weren't at five years old or six years old or 10 years old saying I want to be in commercials.
Milana Vayntrub:
I was.
Rajiv Parikh:
I loved it? Did you write that down Like oh, this is my career arc.
Milana Vayntrub:
No, I think I just said I wanted to be an actor, or did you?
Rajiv Parikh:
feel like you kind of fell into it as time went on.
Milana Vayntrub:
No, because I fell out of it for many years. It wasn't until college that I really decided when I was like 12 to college, didn't really do anything, had like maybe one or two jobs. But it was in college that I really figured out that I love it and that I might be good at it and but mostly that I really really, really enjoy it and it just fills me up. So then after college I I'd made the very brave decision and it was a decision, it was a really hard decision of saying I'm going to bet on myself and I'm going to know that this impractical job is what I'm going to at least give a go at. I didn't know if it was going to be my career forever and honestly I'm still kind of open to it not being my career forever, but I'll do it for as long as they have me.
Rajiv Parikh:
So, like you, come from an immigrant background.
Milana Vayntrub:
Yeah.
Rajiv Parikh:
Your parents were from Uzbekistan.
Milana Vayntrub:
Yes.
Rajiv Parikh:
A lot of immigrant families will say no, you must do the practical thing. You must get yourself a normal job and get paid a normal job, because what are? You going to do for money, this thing that I put you through when you were younger. That was just fun for you. Glad you were able to get somewhere. Did you get into a conversation with your mom?
Milana Vayntrub:
My mom was always for it. My was super, super, super for it because she wanted to be an actress when she was younger and was not allowed. So she was incredibly for it. Um, my dad, my grandparents, everyone else thought it was crazy and would give me. You know, with my dad I had like a, a timeline. He was. You know, I was like give me a year, give me a. You know, with my dad I had like a, a timeline. He was. You know, I was like give me a year, give me a year. But then also, like this industry is so nebulous it's hard to say like, and now I've made it a year later, but it was kind of when I started paying my own bills, like comfortably, that he was and I honestly I was, I wasn't asking my parents for money ever in adulthood, so, um, so that was, that was a big, a big part of it.
Rajiv Parikh:
So you went. You went towards your mom's interest. Your interest was towards your mom. Yeah, it was against the practical family, but they seemed to accept it. They seemed to say, oh, you know what she? She's that passionate. This is the way she is.
Milana Vayntrub:
And they, what are they going? They gonna do like make me interview for another job like I wasn't living at home.
Rajiv Parikh:
I wasn't, it's not like the indian parent, where they try to bring girls or boys home. They say here's a job.
Milana Vayntrub:
Oh, no, they did bring boys home interview for you in fact, my parents were more forceful about who I should marry than what job I should have. For sure, that's where their biggest intervention was.
Rajiv Parikh:
Matchmaking, matchmaking.
Milana Vayntrub:
Oh, marry this boy and you'll be happy forever. And I'm like I don't like him.
Sandeep Parikh:
Did that come from a place of wanting financial security for you?
Milana Vayntrub:
Yes.
Sandeep Parikh:
Being like, yeah, you can be an actor. Wanting financial security for you. Yes, being like, yeah, you can be an actor. And I do wonder if there's a gender thing to this, because I know there is in my wife's family. That's like okay well then, if she's not going to get the job, then this is the other way that we can get her.
Milana Vayntrub:
Yeah, they did that up until I was like 18, maybe 19.
Sandeep Parikh:
A good doctor, find a good doctor.
Milana Vayntrub:
Yeah, they wanted me to marry rich when I was like 18 or 19. But you know, it's that Cher quote Cher said that her mom said I want you to marry a rich man. And then Cher said Mom, I am a rich man and so I was just determined to become a rich man on my own.
Rajiv Parikh:
And you did, you did really well.
Sandeep Parikh:
Here I am, I'm a big old fat rich man. I'm a big old fat rich man. Look at that mustache. I mean it's just.
Milana Vayntrub:
It's getting there.
Rajiv Parikh:
I've seen you in a mustache. It looks pretty good. That's true For one of your shows in a mustache when you went from actress to directing. How did that work? Did you propose it to them? Did they propose it to you? Did you pitch an idea?
Milana Vayntrub:
So the.
Rajiv Parikh:
Did you just hang out with Sandeep? And he convinced you, no, I can't think of anything else.
Milana Vayntrub:
No, so when I was making this web series. I had kind of learned to direct and I would direct sketches and made a music video for my friend, made a documentary. Actually, while Sandeep and I were living together, I made a documentary and in that time I was acting in AT&T commercials. This was, like, I want to say, 2014 or 2015. And I showed this documentary that I made to a director that was directing the spots and just as a way of asking for notes. So I was asking many people for notes and he ended up sending that around his production company and they ended up signing me as a director. Then that campaign ended, I want to say in like 2016 or something. That campaign ended and Lily Adams was no more. Then, in 2020, when the world was in shambles, lily Adams resurfaced.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yes, Risen from the ashes.
Rajiv Parikh:
They were desperate. They were desperate for that amazing spokesperson. With the glow and the energy and the vibe.
Milana Vayntrub:
They needed the glow and the vibe man need the glow and the vibe man. So I, uh, me and and my production company, hungry man, uh, we're having a conversation about what we can do and what brands we have relationships with and if there's anything we can come up with to make work happen. At a time when there was no work happening and we pitched to AT&T, I basically wrote up a few scripts and a treatment and cold called them and said what if we bring this character back? And she's working from home, just like everyone else is working from home. And about a month later we heard back that this feels like it's moving up the ladder and people are kind of into this idea. Then it came back.
Milana Vayntrub:
We shot, I don't know maybe 12 commercials in my house with just me and my husband, who is not a filmmaker and has only ever visited me on set twice, but is a really resourceful person, and we were, you know, painting walls and decorating our space with the advice from production designers and, you know, full, full collaboration was everyone on a call sheet, was still on the call sheet, but they were all virtual and my husband and I were doing the actual labor, you know, doing my own hair and makeup, set up four red cameras, you know, hanging our own light, doing all the things and it worked amazing. I mean it worked well enough that when studios started opening back up, we were back in a studio and I continued directing. My husband had less work to do and that was really annoying to him because he's really fell in love with uh playing every part, yeah, and then that went on for for years I love that story.
Sandeep Parikh:
Part of the package deal was hey, I gotta direct these myself, obviously because it was never, uh, it was never an ultimatum.
Milana Vayntrub:
No, it just transitioned and it and it stayed that way. And there have been other directors. There have been other really good and some really bad directors, and I learned from all of them.
Rajiv Parikh:
That's great. So they took you in. They said go ahead and be as part of this, do it your way, be a director, direct it, write it, go ahead and then at different times, I didn't write them.
Milana Vayntrub:
So to be clear, the directors very rarely I would say maybe 1% of the time write the scripts. The scripts are always thought of through an agency or a firm, so I was always given scripts and then improv happened and collaboration happened, but I never wrote a script from scratch.
Rajiv Parikh:
I love how you pitched it. That's great.
Milana Vayntrub:
Thanks.
Rajiv Parikh:
Thanks All right.
Sandeep Parikh:
Well, now it is time. Now that we've dug into the spark of Milana, how she got into this industry. We've talked about AI. We really covered a lot of ground here. It's time to put you to the test in our spark tank. This is just a game.
Milana Vayntrub:
it's just a game oh okay, just silly game, just change it.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yeah, you can do. It's a game, okay. Um, so this is. I decided to invent a little new game for for spark of ages here. Um, that I'm calling spark scale, sunset and this is our version of f mary kill if you're familiar with that Spark sail sunset.
Milana Vayntrub:
Okay, got it. Scale, scale.
Sandeep Parikh:
So which of these three things would spark, like, are a spark of creativity for you, like, oh, that's kind of cool, that's kind of the F right, which is already kind of working as is and you would want to scale it Like maybe, oh, I'd want to invest in that, and which I think this has seen its peak and it's cool. But now, let's, you know, let's let's sunset it, let's, um, let's, let's iterate. Uh, do something, let's do something new. Okay, number one social media platforms tiktok, instagram, x. It's kind of a gimme, I think, think. But let's see, maybe you have a different opinion than I would.
Milana Vayntrub:
And both you guys can answer, I would.
Sandeep Parikh:
Which one would you spark?
Milana Vayntrub:
Honestly, I think I would sunset Instagram and X Okay.
Sandeep Parikh:
They could both go. Okay, really Instagram Okay.
Milana Vayntrub:
I am so yucked by it. I'm deeply yucked by it.
Sandeep Parikh:
However.
Milana Vayntrub:
TikTok, spark and scale. Baby, I love a TikTok.
Sandeep Parikh:
Why is that? What is it about, tiktok, that, besides letting the Chinese spy on us, that you?
Milana Vayntrub:
That's mostly it Go go go.
Milana Vayntrub:
I love a localized content creator. I also, you know, speaking of marketing, like I find influencer marketing to be really interesting and really powerful and it works. On TikTok, I think, part of the randomization I'm, you know, air quotes, I'm using air quotes of the randomization but the way the algorithm feeds you certain influencers, the incentive to remain authentic and yourself weird is there on TikTok, more final product, whereas tiktok shows you more of the process and and, yeah, honestly, ask me in like two months and I'm sure I'm gonna want to sunset it too, because it is hyper addictive and if you are not, on tiktok, don't do it, okay all right.
Sandeep Parikh:
Fair enough is that that where you are Rajiv.
Rajiv Parikh:
I like Milana's opinions of it. I would say I have been urged by the folks on this show to engage more with TikTok, so I will defer that, but it's highly addictive and I don't want to be even more addicted than I am to all these other things that I do in social media Instagram I'm leaning more towards sunset just because I think it's messed up a lot of young girls' lives.
Rajiv Parikh:
And from the thing that the algorithm encourages, and I think Facebook doesn't need that kind of money and Meta doesn't need that kind of money, and I wish they would let it be useful without it being exploitative. Yes, X.
Sandeep Parikh:
I'm going to be a little controversial with X.
Rajiv Parikh:
I actually think it's actually pretty good. I don't get the hate stuff on the ones I follow. Now I don't follow a lot of people. I follow interesting people and if I see something that I don't like, I quickly tell it I don't like it and so I get interesting. So I might spark that. I say spark just because it comes up with things that I don't normally think of.
Sandeep Parikh:
All right, moving on to directors Milana, what would you spark? Scale or sunset? Greta Gerwig, christopher Nolan, jordan Peele.
Milana Vayntrub:
Can I scale them all?
Sandeep Parikh:
You can do whatever you want. So Greta Gerwig, Greta Gerwig, director of Barbie, just to catch people up.
Milana Vayntrub:
And Lady Bird, which I actually think is better than Barbie.
Sandeep Parikh:
No, Lady Bird's amazing.
Milana Vayntrub:
Lady Bird is amazing.
Sandeep Parikh:
They're both amazing. I think personally Christopher Nolan Oppenheimer amongst all the Batmans, and a million other kind of big, high concepts and Inception, right, big sci-fi movies.
Milana Vayntrub:
Inception, which I've seen three times in the movie Tenor. I love Inception, I love Inception. Yeah, love me a Nolan.
Sandeep Parikh:
It's fantastic. And peele, who's a director of, get out. Uh, nope, nope, all the single syllable movies. I hear you on wanting to scale everybody. Is there, anyone that even leans towards spark or sunset?
Milana Vayntrub:
absolutely not fantastic.
Sandeep Parikh:
here's what I here's what I'm gonna do, because I want to be controversial about it. I don't want to sunset Christopher Nolan, I just want to see the next iteration of him, of him as an artist.
Milana Vayntrub:
Oh, I will say that.
Sandeep Parikh:
I wasn't the biggest Oppenheimer fan. I wasn't the biggest Oppenheimer fan either. I dug it but it was long gone. But maybe we weren't the audience for it?
Milana Vayntrub:
I think I'm the audience for it. I think maybe we weren't the audience for it. I think I'm the audience for it.
Sandeep Parikh:
I think I'm very much the I'm very much I would be the audience for it and I really like it oh, you did.
Milana Vayntrub:
No, I I love, I'm a science geek and I and I, so I love, I do and I loved learning about world war ii.
Rajiv Parikh:
It's one of my favorite periods in history to learn about in terms of change and transformation, and uh trouble. My favorite genocides and and I'd say yeah, and edwin teller, actually it helped me understand more about. He was the crazy guy who, who was portrayed as a little bit crazy, but promoted star wars, if you guys remember, during the reagan era, about putting weapons in space and using it to knock down missiles, and actually that happens now missiles can be blocked and stopped.
Sandeep Parikh:
So it's a very interesting way of looking like he was portrayed a particular way, but some of his ideas actually I just love stories about and I'm in kind of I want to produce around the show and my and my business partner he put such a great way which is stories that are about exceptional people during crucial times making hard decisions are the ones that just endlessly fascinate and often get super green light. So the imitation game and like just stuff about, like you know, I love stuff like that. So I, I, I feel like I am the person, the right person. I thought this one, I thought it was good, but I also didn't. I wasn't like in love with it.
Sandeep Parikh:
Um, like I I'm I'm really bummed that greta didn't get a best director nom. You know, I feel like that she should have gotten. I mean, what she did with barbie, which is so wholesale, like it was amazing what she did. It was amazing. Never in my wildest did I think I would want to go see barbie. Like if you talked to sandeep five years ago and been like you're gonna go, you're gonna go see barbie and you're gonna love it. I'd be like, come, I'm not gonna go see this like corporate, you know this, this like desperate cash grab movie and she like flipped the whole you know perception of it and she made it fun.
Rajiv Parikh:
She made it fun. She made going back to the movies fun. I wore my fur jacket to it. It was so much fun to go I did.
Milana Vayntrub:
Please let the picture of you wearing that be the icon for this podcast.
Sandeep Parikh:
That is definitely going to be in the tiktok.
Rajiv Parikh:
That's a whole different story of my transformation in the last, in the my post pandemic transformation anyways, let's lightning round this.
Sandeep Parikh:
Uh, the the geico gecko flow from progressive and jake from state farm uh, I would uh scale the Geico Gecko I would uh spark flow and I would uh sunset. Jake.
Milana Vayntrub:
Just cause I find that character to be the less interesting one.
Sandeep Parikh:
I'm with you. I want Jake to take some chances. I think, jake, I believe in that actor.
Milana Vayntrub:
I want Jake to have like a good comedic moment. I want him to like he's got to take some risks.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yeah, yeah.
Milana Vayntrub:
Yeah, he's got to take some risks.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yeah, jake's got to go crazy.
Milana Vayntrub:
I find him annoying, it's not Jake's fault, as we've been talking about this is a multi-tiered Right. It's the text. Text is Rex. Thank you, mr Morrison.
Rajiv Parikh:
But it doesn't get me to buy State Farm.
Milana Vayntrub:
No, whereas the Gecko gets me to buy Geico.
Rajiv Parikh:
Yeah.
Milana Vayntrub:
Flo definitely gets me more interested. He's done amazing things for that brand yeah.
Sandeep Parikh:
Or the Mayhem guy. He's fun, I like that guy.
Rajiv Parikh:
He's genius. I think that's all right, but what brand is he?
Milana Vayntrub:
Allstate, allstate.
Sandeep Parikh:
Allstate. Last one this podcast, the Spark of Ages, our podcast that we have Mil your mom, is a podcast which is coming out soon on all places. That podcast if you're interested in parenting this.
Milana Vayntrub:
Really should have brought that up earlier.
Milana Vayntrub:
But keep going yep, this podcast, our podcast, or tony robbins's podcast oh, I will sunset she loves tony robbins oh okay, I love t Robbins, but I've never really been a huge fan of his podcast. I love his tapes, love. Some of his tapes have been transformational for me and I will scale our podcast because I really believe in it. It's called your Mom. It's a podcast where we interview interesting, inspiring, influential people and their moms to figure out how they got that way. It's a comedy parenting podcast, newlywed show style, gamified because it's in.
Sandeep Parikh:
Puerto Rican. How many podcasts do you hear he has?
Milana Vayntrub:
to gamify everything.
Sandeep Parikh:
Of course. But how many podcasts do you get to hear a cool guest and their mom and their mom? I mean, come on, that's awesome.
Rajiv Parikh:
It's pretty cool, that's awesome.
Milana Vayntrub:
It's pretty cool. That's unique, and then I'd spark this one, this one's fun and inspiring. I'm so grateful to be on here.
Rajiv Parikh:
Milana. If there's one thing you'd like to do in your next life and money's not an object or there's no other constraints, what would it be?
Milana Vayntrub:
Rest.
Sandeep Parikh:
Mom, Spoken like a true mom.
Milana Vayntrub:
I just want to have less things on my calendar and time off to cook, and maybe that's it. Maybe I would just like cook and take long walks.
Sandeep Parikh:
Why don't we let you get to that?
Milana Vayntrub:
Yeah right, I got a kid waiting for me at home. I have four meetings after this. I love you guys. Thank you so much for having me.
Rajiv Parikh:
It's been great to have you on. You're an inspiration, you're an inspiration, so look forward to getting your episode out and off to the world. I think so many people will be inspired by you and excited. Thank you so much.
Milana Vayntrub:
Okay, see you guys soon.
Sandeep Parikh:
All right, that was a fun convo. I mean, listen, she's a sister from another mister for me, so I'm curious, you know, as the brother from my actual mother, how are you feeling? What are your takeaways?
Rajiv Parikh:
I just enjoyed the time with Alana. She has this amazing combination of personal happiness, personal glow, creativity, humor, and you know, I just felt like that conversation we had about how she took all these different risks in her life going into the acting world, how she flowed through life and found things, that she went and had this sense that everything was going to work out. I just found that amazing. I especially love how she came back and decided to pitch AT&T, but as a director and the featured Lily Adams spokesperson.
Rajiv Parikh:
As you know, I love advertising and marketing. I like how businesses present themselves and I could see that she thinks similarly from a highly creative point of view, so I have tremendous respect for that that side of her.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yeah, and you know I've I've known Milana for years and I I you know I co-host this podcast with her. But what's cool about this interview for me and getting kind of your more outside perspective on on her as a human? It reminded me of the value of being shamelessly yourself, like really knowing yourself, like the thing that always strikes me about Milana and I'm reminded by when I hear her story is how much she sort of bet on herself. She was always like you know what, hey, like high school's not working for me, I'm going to just take the GED, I'm going to move on, I'm going to go to community college, I'm going to do my thing there. She always takes that bet on herself in a way that I think is super brave and it carried all the way through, even into this AT&T job where, for folks who don't know her and only know her as Lily Adams, they can see here how very much she is Lily Adams. Her spirit, her spark is in that character and she was unapologetically herself in that role as well, and I think it's part of what made that campaign so successful and so resonant is that she is just so likable. She made that character so likable and she pushed the bounds creatively, you know, stepped out of her place in a way as an actor to be like, hey, I want to have more creative say into these things, pushed into being a director and made the campaign successful yet again a second time around. So it's like if you can find a way to really know yourself, really be unapologetically yourself, you know you'll go really far.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yeah, what do you guys think? Audience at home? Do you enjoy this game? Do you like other games? Let us know in the comments. Let us know how you're feeling about stuff. We want to we, you know we want to evolve and and shape the show. So you know, well, let's hear it. Let's hear it in the comments.
Rajiv Parikh:
That's right, you get, you can find us on Apple, spotify, youtube and everywhere Podcasts can be found. Put those comments in Show your love. If you know me, text me or email me. I love hearing your opinions. That's great.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yeah, all right. Well, that's the show. This show is produced by Sandeep Parikh and Anand Shah, production assistance by Taryn Talley and Jesse Deep, and edited by Sean Marr and Aidan McGarvey.
Rajiv Parikh:
I'm your host, Rajiv Parikh from Position Squared, an awesome growth marketing company based in Silicon Valley. Come visit us at position2.com. This has been an FNFunny production. We'll catch you next time and remember folks, be ever curious, you.