Last Thing You Think About Until You Don't Have It/Brian Sheng - Aquaria, Mexico, Sacrifice ~ Spark of Ages Ep17
Jun 14, 2024Season 1Episode 17
Rajiv Parikh
Email us with any feedback for the show: spark@postion2.com Find more great content like this at: https://www.position2.com/ If you like what you here, please drop us a comment!
Episode Description: Can atmospheric water generators be the answer to the global water crisis?
Join us for an inspiring conversation with Brian Sheng, CEO and co-founder of Aquaria, as he takes us through his remarkable journey from a teenage VC to a trailblazer in water innovation. Discover how Brian’s experiences in China and California shaped his mission to tackle water scarcity through cutting-edge technology. We explore the pressing need for decentralized, flexible, and cost-effective water solutions.
Get an inside look at how these generators, capture water efficiently using high thermoconductive materials and advanced heat exchange systems. You'll learn about the economic and market potential of this game-changing solution, particularly in regions where water scarcity is a significant issue.
Brian also reveals the unique dynamics and challenges of running a business with his brother Eric. Hear about his personal motivations, including the sacrifices made by his immigrant family, and how they inspire his mission-driven approach to innovation.
We wrap up with a fun segment called Spark Tank, where Brian and Rajiv Parikh play two truths and a lie about off-grid living, leading to fascinating insights and plenty of laughs. Don't miss this episode packed with innovation, entrepreneurial spirit, and a vision for a sustainable future.
Brian Sheng LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brian-sheng/
Aquaria: https://aquaria.world/
UN Report on Water Risks: https://www.unesco.org/en/articles/imminent-risk-global-water-crisis-warns-un-world-water-development-report-2023
Mexico City Crisis: https://www.npr.org/2024/03/08/1234928040/mexico-city-water-problems
Producer: Anand Shah & Sandeep Parikh Technical Director & Sound Designer: Sandeep Parikh, Omar Najam Executive Producers: Sandeep Parikh & Anand Shah Associate Producers: Taryn Talley Editor: Sean Meagher & Aidan McGarvey
Email us with any feedback for the show: spark@postion2.com Find more great content like this at: https://www.position2.com/ If you like what you here, please drop us a comment!
Episode Description: Can atmospheric water generators be the answer to the global water crisis?
Join us for an inspiring conversation with Brian Sheng, CEO and co-founder of Aquaria, as he takes us through his remarkable journey from a teenage VC to a trailblazer in water innovation. Discover how Brian’s experiences in China and California shaped his mission to tackle water scarcity through cutting-edge technology. We explore the pressing need for decentralized, flexible, and cost-effective water solutions.
Get an inside look at how these generators, capture water efficiently using high thermoconductive materials and advanced heat exchange systems. You'll learn about the economic and market potential of this game-changing solution, particularly in regions where water scarcity is a significant issue.
Brian also reveals the unique dynamics and challenges of running a business with his brother Eric. Hear about his personal motivations, including the sacrifices made by his immigrant family, and how they inspire his mission-driven approach to innovation.
We wrap up with a fun segment called Spark Tank, where Brian and Rajiv Parikh play two truths and a lie about off-grid living, leading to fascinating insights and plenty of laughs. Don't miss this episode packed with innovation, entrepreneurial spirit, and a vision for a sustainable future.
Brian Sheng LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brian-sheng/
Aquaria: https://aquaria.world/
UN Report on Water Risks: https://www.unesco.org/en/articles/imminent-risk-global-water-crisis-warns-un-world-water-development-report-2023
Mexico City Crisis: https://www.npr.org/2024/03/08/1234928040/mexico-city-water-problems
Producer: Anand Shah & Sandeep Parikh Technical Director & Sound Designer: Sandeep Parikh, Omar Najam Executive Producers: Sandeep Parikh & Anand Shah Associate Producers: Taryn Talley Editor: Sean Meagher & Aidan McGarvey
Hello and welcome to the Spark of Ages podcast. I'm your host, R rajiv Parikh. I'm the CEO and founder of Position Squared, an awesome growth marketing company based in Silicon Valley. So, yes, I'm a Silicon Valley entrepreneur, but I'm also a business news junkie and a history nerd. I'm fascinated by how big, world-changing movements go from the spark of an idea to an innovation that reshapes our lives. If you like what you hear, please take a moment to rate it. Your feedback is what drives our show, so take 30 seconds and say hello. This is the Spark of Ages podcast. In addition to myself, we have our producer, Sa sundeep, who's occasionally going to chime in to make sure we don't get too in the weeds with tech charts.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yes, the fact that I am easily confused is to your benefit, listener. So I'm very excited to ask the dumb questions that hopefully lead to smart answers.
Rajiv Parikh:
That's right. We get to greater insight by working together, so let's get our conversation going with Brian Sheng. For everyone listening. Today's guest is Brian Sheng, CEO and co-founder of Aquaria. Brian's accomplishments are impressive, especially for someone in their 20s Wait, what 20s? Oh, come on At 19,. He founded Fresh VC while he was still at Princeton, graduated in three years while running it. All that fund's investments resulted in companies with a total net worth of $3 billion, including two IPOs and five other companies worth $250 million. Always passionate about climate change, B brian actually wrote his Princeton thesis on renewable energy and water infrastructure and during the pandemic, he and his brother Eric founded Aquaria, developing atmospheric water generators for commercial and residential use. It's clearly an area Brian believes in, as he's invested several million dollars of his own, practically boot strapping the company, and we're going to learn a lot more about that. And as water crises threaten cities worldwide, innovative solutions like Aquaria's are crucial. The UN's latest report paints a grim picture of billions of people lacking safe drinking water, with the situation worsening due to climate change and growing demand. This crisis not only threatens basic needs and health, but also fuels conflict over scarce resources. Brian, welcome to the Spark of.
Brian Sheng:
Ages. I'm super excited to be here and also it's great to see that it's a brother duo on this podcast as well.
Rajiv Parikh:
So I'm super excited to dive in Brother to brother. We're going to have a whole bunch of brothers into it.
Sandeep Parikh:
B2B that's what that stands for.
Rajiv Parikh:
It's also bot to bot. If you're in the AI world, that's right, so really happy to have you here. I got to know about you from a person named Sammy Hassan and while I was at South by Southwest and I was just chatting with her, we were at one of those events talking about climate solutions, and she said you, you got to talk to this guy. He has a really innovative solution that can make the world a greater place. And then she actually has done an analysis on your company and found it to be the leader amongst 20 plus companies in it. So let's start off with the basics for the audience. What are the big problems with water that you and Aquaria are trying to solve?
Brian Sheng:
Yeah, absolutely. Well, before I jump into that, in case Sam is listening to this podcast, I want to give her a big shout out for connecting us. But for Aquaria, I think our mission is very straightforward we are safeguarding access to clean water against droughts and the effects of climate change. More specifically, I think as we talk about the effects of climate change, as we think about a sustainable transition, most of that conversation is focused around energy or carbon footprint. A lot fewer people think about our access to clean water, even though it's one of the main ways that we actually suffer from the negative effects of climate change. So that's what we're trying to do at Aquaria is that we want to use technology to offer a faster and more affordable way to provide water in a time where we're just running out of clean water everywhere of it, and one of it is it's just going to be much more difficult to deal with getting access to clean water.
Rajiv Parikh:
right, you think it's everywhere, but it's not really everywhere. Were there particular events that caught your attention? That helps highlight why this is such a crisis, maybe even beyond what happened at Flint, or even describing what happened at Flint or what's happening in Chennai right.
Brian Sheng:
Yeah, actually I'm a first generation immigrant from China and actually where my grandparents grew up is a place called Jinan in northern China, and it's also named as the city of a thousand springs. So, growing up in America, you know, I used to go back to China at times and one of the major sources of attraction were these springs, and I noticed that over the years, those springs started drying up and nowadays if you go there it's unfortunate but 20, 20, some odd year later that it's no longer for sure that you can still visit those places. And so, growing up, you know, I remember my grandparents telling me like this is the history and culture of you know where they grew up and they used to go play over there like that's, that's no longer available. Combine that with the fact that, you know, as I was doing my own research, I I was thinking about okay, well, where are some of the areas that I can make most of the impact?
Brian Sheng:
And where, you know, people are not paying as much attention to, and it occurred to me one, you know, one day when I was I mean, I've been living in San Francisco and around California for a great part of the past decade and it's like, oh wow, actually for a great part of the past decade. And it's like, oh wow, actually we have a couple million people just in California alone that don't have access to clean water. This is not just a problem around the world, in developing countries or places that you know are farther away from us. It's a huge problem right here back at home. And so you know, kind of these couple of data points led me to understand and start digging deeper that, wow, this is a problem that is much more pervasive and also accelerating at a much faster pace than we imagine right here in backyards.
Rajiv Parikh:
So this is something that I can contribute to, and this is something that I want to do something about. Yeah, so what do you think are the main causes? Because of climate change, or is it because of urbanization? Or is it that lakes and reservoirs are disappearing faster? Or is it just poor water infrastructure? What do you? What do you think this is?
Brian Sheng:
well, I think all of those things you mentioned are causes, but I think one of the worst things about water is that it's it's not valued like.
Brian Sheng:
We value every single commodity and there's a market for every commodity and you know everything that has a price to it, whether it's more or less efficient, and then you have which is completely worthless, which makes no sense. It supports life, so it should be like the life's most precious resource, while, on the other hand, water is like the cheapest commodity and nobody cares about the price of water. And you know, because it's heavily subsidized by government utilities, as something that must be provided for, you know, almost as like a right of life. You know we don't think of water as its actual value to what we need it for, and now, for the first time, it's catching up to us. Or we understand that some of the places where water is most necessary, like here in america, would be like texas, it would be places like arizona, but if you actually look at the water prices, they're some of the cheapest nationally, which makes, again, no sense whatsoever.
Rajiv Parikh:
So it's not even economically driven right. I used to take my son to the Central Valley to play soccer. Why, when you live in Palo Alto, would you take your kid to Central Valley to play soccer? Because they had 25 wonderful grass fields in the middle of Central Valley. Why did they have 25 grass fields and 100 degree heat, which is super dry? Because water was subsidized there, because that's where all the farmland is. So there's definitely a mispricing in the market. We would go far away because that's where water was cheap, but it was actually being used, sometimes in inefficient ways, because it wasn't being priced well.
Sandeep Parikh:
So, brian, are you trying to take away my 40 minute shower?
Brian Sheng:
Rinse and repeat is an important part of the shampoo bottle, so I try to do that as much as possible. A lot of the water usage behaviors, you know I think it all combines together. Uh, 40 minute shower. Well, if people.
Brian Sheng:
Well, someday, if you install a water recycling, you know system on your house that 40 minute shower is okay. You know that 40 minute shower might only use two percent of what you think you might use, because that water will then recycle itself, then goes back into your house and then you can keep on using that. Your 40-minute shower is reduced to now one minute equivalent, two-minute equivalent worth of shower usage. And that would be totally fine, right? But tying that with the economic piece is that you know it's not just about the mismatch of pricing. It's because of the mismatch in pricing that you sort of have a cascading chain of events where you know there's not as many investments into improving the efficiency of water, there's not as much investment into the opportunities in water, because if it doesn't make profit or it doesn't save you as much cost, there's not as much efficient dynamics at play to make the whole system better.
Brian Sheng:
I'll give you a crazy fact here Right now Mexico City is on the verge of a huge water crisis and that's been making the news a lot. But if you look at the data, mexico City loses up to 40% of its water supply just from leaking infrastructure. It just leaks away and that's the same thing here in the US. Same thing here in the US. Most of our pipes are almost 100 years old and just leaks.
Rajiv Parikh:
So they're losing their water just because of poor infrastructure. I know in Chennai and in Bangalore they've been told they can't build apartments or flats or condos, homes, because there's just not enough water supply to guarantee it. So over there they use gasoline to bring water to you. They have water trucks that go and bring these things to you. Incredible and as the trucks drive by they're leaking water the whole time, so it's oh yeah.
Sandeep Parikh:
I feel like it's also an issue with feedback in terms of, like our water usage. It's not in front of your face all the time that you're, you know, leaking water. You have to take some sort of extra steps to like to determine whether or not you have leaky pipes and stuff like that. If we had sort of more systems that allowed you to see visibly that, hey, you are using this much water all the time and that you are currently leaking water, then wouldn't we be more responsive into solving that problem.
Brian Sheng:
I agree. Again, I would say that partially, this has to do with the perverse incentives here. Actually, if you go to Bolinas, you drive into Bolinas, bolinas, at the front of town there's actually this meter that tells you like, hey, this is where our water supply stands today, and you know, green, yellow, orange, red, and, and that's because, for bolinas, water has become such a huge problem that it's like, hey guys, we gotta look at this or we're really, really, really screwed. But that's not the case for lots of other places. This incentives just aren't there. You know, like sandy, if I would ask you like would you notice if your water bill went up by like I don't know 200? Right, yeah, that's probably. Yes, you're right, right, but but by the time you notice that thing going up by 200, it probably should have went up by like two thousand dollars. You know, the equivalent for that much energy leakage for your bill would have been an order of magnitude higher.
Rajiv Parikh:
So the economics don't work. It's a broken infrastructure. But then, with all that, the water not being valued as much you saw an opportunity right, and that's why you started Aquaria. Tell us about the company and what it's doing, why it's special, why it's interesting.
Brian Sheng:
What I am looking to build with Aquaria is unlocking a completely new source of water.
Brian Sheng:
If we look at history since Mesopotamia, all civilization have always been built around physical bodies of water and then, as we advanced civilization and had additional abilities, then we built systems and networks of transportation that allowed us to move water from standing bodies to now have a network of distributed water which, I think, again, we are sitting on one of the biggest networks here, right here in california, right.
Brian Sheng:
But now that, as we have done that, which allowed us to massively expand geographically and, you know, build all across, all over a number of places, the problem is that, with the types of water problems and the frequency of water problems arising, this model no longer works. This model is based off of this big central infrastructure that is CapEx, heavy, and then you kind of build this big system outwards of transportation. So with Aquaria, we want to skip all over that, because we think that model is not flexible enough, takes too long and takes too much capital as well. That's not to say that that model doesn't have this use case, it's just that we need more options and by using atmosphere water generator where air is omnipresent, we are providing a totally new option that skips over the time and capital needs and just directly place them almost anywhere anytime. It's almost like a decentralized or distributed model of water, and that's where I see a huge opportunity.
Sandeep Parikh:
Can you take me through what this thing looks like that converts air into water? What does that look like? How do I get?
Brian Sheng:
one. Well, if some of you like one, I'll send you one. All you got to do is host a podcast oh my gosh, we solved it.
Rajiv Parikh:
Just get Brian on your podcast. We're going to do that for everything we want.
Sandeep Parikh:
I'm going to have a.
Brian Sheng:
Porsche podcast. That's a great question for all our audience members. You can go on our website right now. We're live. This is something we're deploying today and helping people across America get access to water. You can think of us like as the tesla battery packs of water. Like we have small units, we have big units. Our smallest unit is like an indoor unit that you just plug into the wall in your garage, on your balcony, and that unit can produce up to 24 gallons of water a day, so enough to supply all your cooking drinking, whether it's your, your home or you know office and whatnot. And then we have a larger unit that can link together, like the mega packs or the power packs, and create way larger amounts of water in the hundreds, thousands and tens of thousands of gallons per unit. They're just boxes, large boxes, small boxes connected to the other.
Rajiv Parikh:
Use them standalone and so you can get one of these units today off their website.
Sandeep Parikh:
Or by hosting a podcast.
Rajiv Parikh:
Or by hosting a podcast.
Sandeep Parikh:
There's zero options.
Rajiv Parikh:
But I think what's interesting about it is that there's some interesting technology that you've put into this. There's 20 other companies doing atmospheric water generation, doing something where they're using a desiccant right, which is, you know, like those little packs you get inside your you know when you get a new suitcase a briefcase, those little silica packs, yep, or you're doing kind of like a dehumidifier, like an air conditioner, but is that, is it that? Or is it something even more interesting or even special about how it all comes together?
Brian Sheng:
I think it's all of the above and even more. You know there's many different techniques to get water out of the air. The analogy I like to make is like you're building a high-performance car and there's a variety of different ways that you can do that. At least the first step, just the first step alone, requires you to do all of the above, such as reducing the weight of the car, building a more powerful engine, designing the shape of the car so that it's aerodynamically sound. And that encompasses what our core technology is composed of is.
Brian Sheng:
We've built special high thermoconductive materials, We've built heat exchange and recovery systems and we've designed the airflow and the fluid dynamics of how we actually capture and condense the air in the machine as it flows through the internal workings of the machine, so that all of it is for the purpose of maximizing active or passive heat exchange, which results in maximum water capture. And so that's just in step one of what we have built. And in that first step it's already involved material science, it's already involved condensation, heat exchange. It's already involved mechanical design for aerodynamic water capture. So all of that encompasses step one. And as we think about furthering along, it's like again, keep on pushing additional techniques that allows us to build this for higher performance car coolant.
Rajiv Parikh:
One of the interesting parts about what you're doing at Aquaria right is that it's a system dynamics solution, as you talked about right, where you're combining multiple technologies together, multiple techniques, so there's a lot more to it that enables you to get, I think a 25% is a minimum level of humidity which is actually well suited to most locations around the world, except for maybe, the Phoenix Desert in the summer locations around the world, except for maybe the Phoenix desert in the summer, but everywhere else in the world is possible. You have units that can produce either small or at scale, and the cool part about it is you can move those units around, which a lot of systems can't do. They're usually just fixed in one place, whereas you guys can move it around, which has a tremendous potential.
Brian Sheng:
Yeah, absolutely.
Brian Sheng:
When we first started looking at developing the Aquarius system, I took a very practical approach in thinking through well, what are the different approaches, what are the pros and cons of each approach?
Brian Sheng:
Like, for example, there are great research teams at many universities around the world that are doing some type of atmosphere or water capture research, like Berkeley with Professor Yagi or Camp Julie University in the Middle East, and there are pros and cons to each approach.
Brian Sheng:
For example, with desiccant materials, while you can make, let's say, x gallons of water per cubic meter, there are some scaling factors that doesn't allow it to scale infinitely or as high volume as possible. So when we think about what Aquaria is trying to do, there are two key metrics. So when we think about what Aquaria is trying to do, there are two key metrics, and our guiding North Star KPIs are you know, what is the highest water production density we can achieve and what is the highest energy efficiency that we can produce at, so that you know ultimately, as we continue to build out of the company and scale our technology, one day that we can power entire cities with energy from the sun and then water from the sky, and that's how we think about combining these different techniques so that we can achieve those results.
Sandeep Parikh:
Okay, this sounds awesome and right at my. I mean I want to wear like a backpack at this point and hike around. I'm just curious about so right now, who is like your customer profile, like who's buying this? How much does it cost? What's your sort of cost analysis for Aquarius solution?
Rajiv Parikh:
It's. It sounds really expensive. I'm running like this really efficient air conditioner all the time. I'm going to be spending a lot of money.
Brian Sheng:
Yeah, so right now our product starts at $3,000.
Rajiv Parikh:
Wow, that's actually pretty reasonable.
Brian Sheng:
I think $3,000 right now. We can pay back our unit anywhere from I guess it depends on how many people drink water from it For one of my investors who put it in their office, I would assume depending on what you're consuming. So then you can pay back that calculation just because our water is produced at a couple pennies per gallon, depending on where you're at line, depending on where you're at. And then for our larger units, our customers for our systems are primarily builders, developers, homeowners, like building owners, because the building owners, rajiv, like you mentioned that in Chennai I think you mentioned that apartments and condos and buildings and all can be built. Actually those are our same customers in the US. It's developers and builders that need to secure a water supply and we're providing the option.
Rajiv Parikh:
It's interesting. I mean, I think one of the points of it. By the way, I'm being playful about the expensive costs, so I did a little bit of math. So here's a math lesson. From what I read, the average person uses between 60 to 100 gallons a day. Not with standing sunbeams, 40 minute showers.
Sandeep Parikh:
It takes a while to look this. Good is all I'm saying. It takes a lot of time.
Rajiv Parikh:
They buy one of your 250 gallon units. I think that uses 11 kilowatts. From what I understand, looking at your site and at the Palo Alto energy rate, which is higher than most of the nation, that's 22 cents per kilowatt hour. That cost me $2.42. That's my math.
Sandeep Parikh:
Okay. So it's kind of like you're doing it's almost like a solar panel calculation, you know when, like people are deciding should I get solar or not, and it's like, oh, this will pay itself off in 15 months, kind of a thing.
Brian Sheng:
Actually, I would say that it's not quite the same yet, because I would say that you know it's going to be dependent on where you are in the country Because, for example, if you currently already have a stable and clean tap water connection, like if you live in New York or San Francisco that water is actually quite cheap. It's actually quite cheap. Where we really make economic sense is in areas of the country which could be at just one hour north of San Francisco where there's actually significant water problems. It could be contamination, it could be other types of problems, and so you're spending money on things like digging a well or other things. That is apart from your municipal water, and that's where our calculations come in, that we could justify that I think the San Francisco and New York City world do have pretty good and clean and cheap water, and so in these places it's just probably that the calculation will be against bottled water or mineral water, but that cost makes sense.
Rajiv Parikh:
I think this is part of your go-to-market right and your market targeting, which I'd love to learn more about.
Rajiv Parikh:
So if you're in, San Francisco and you have, you know, hetch, hetchy water, right Stuff that comes from the Sierras. We've already piped it, created it, created all these reservoirs. We've already paid all the upfront costs. We're getting it at fairly low cost. So you probably aren't going to pay for watering your lawn or growing your crops using your technology. But you are in maybe some places in Central Valley where the water is not clean. You know, there's lead pipes or contaminated water sources or all these places where you can't build, where this is really interesting, or maybe there's just places like I think you guys have one in Hawaii, where it's too difficult to put up a plant.
Brian Sheng:
I think of it as like a you know, like a pyramid of value proposition. Right, like? Everybody needs water, people need water, you know, animals need water, plants need water, everything needs water. So then, but then the water being supplied to different people or targets, at different areas, at their respective order of value. And so we're starting off with the highest value areas and the highest value problems, especially in a world where renewable energy is getting cheaper and cheaper, if not super, super affordable. Then we start off there, and as we continue to decrease the cost of this technology, then we're able to move down the chain and offer it to more and more people, starting with, today, bottled water. Anywhere that uses packaged water, we are already cheaper than, and then anywhere that's trying to build infrastructure, we're also faster and cheaper than those alternative infrastructure.
Rajiv Parikh:
Now, of course, you're talking to a marketer and I really care about go-to-market. So when you're thinking about, you put your own money right and you're also raising capital. What do you think about as your go-to-market strategy? Like, who are you focusing on? First, you have home units, you have bigger size residential units, you have much larger ones for commercial. Where do you put your energy and how do you sell?
Brian Sheng:
Yeah. So right now, our primary focus is on actually working with residential builders. So right now, our primary focus is on actually working with residential builders. They have they're either building new communities or they have existing communities that they manage, where these are folks that have both the budget and the desire to change something about their water supply.
Brian Sheng:
What I've learned is that I will never I can't say never, but it's just like an impossible task to convince somebody who doesn't think they have a water problem that they need water, like you should know that you have a water problem. If you don't, then this is not somebody that we want to be selling to, so we're not ever out. Um, you know instagram and linkedin where we're saying hey, you experience water challenges of these types, and perhaps these are some of the solutions you're looking at. Here's what it might look like with aquarius generators instead, and that's also something that we want to expand upon and be even more detailed in our go-to-market with these residential communities. And so you know, rajiv, I would love to you know I was looking at your website as well. You know I would love to like maybe explore that further how we can get better with our messaging.
Rajiv Parikh:
Great. Apparently, the podcast has a demand generation capability.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yes.
Rajiv Parikh:
I think that's what you're doing, Brian, right? You're basically by putting content out there about you folks. People are finding you and then they reach out to you. Do you actually create lists of different home builders that are going to various communities and reach out to them via, maybe, email or phone calls or that kind of thing? Is that how you get people in?
Brian Sheng:
You know it's funny. We're just starting to do that now. Like up until maybe a month ago, where we have been in the process of closing our latest round of financing, the entire company has been engineers and product folks, us making sure we can build a technology deck and do what we say we'll do. So since we launched the company in public and started selling to customers, everything has been inbound. We have not done any outbound, we've barely done marketing. You know, in fact, our website barely ranks on Google. You know, and, like you know, we just didn't do much at all. We were just building products. And so now we're like in the secondary phase where, you know, this summer is essentially the hottest summer since I started this company, and so there's like droughts everywhere and it's like the right time for us now to do that. Like that's what we're trying to do now is be public, be out there and get in front of the builders as well.
Rajiv Parikh:
That's really smart. Great to hear that you're actually pulling demand and you're getting these proof of concept projects like the one in Hawaii, a thousand person units I could definitely see. If I'm putting up a warehouse in the middle of nowhere and I don't have the initial infrastructure there, I'd probably bring that with my construction crew. I can see lots of really interesting uses for your product and technology. Let's talk about background and where you came from and what drives you. You decided to take on climate change and you decided to focus on water security and resiliency right.
Rajiv Parikh:
And so if you're successful, you'll be able to make a big impact on the world. So was there a day when this just totally clicked to you that said, oh, I'm gonna commit to this.
Brian Sheng:
There was, although I think the tie-in isn't exactly to climate change specifically. You know like I started Aquaria four years ago but I was running another company fresh before that that was focused on impact related or, you know, venture investment. So I guess there are ties in there, but it's not as if one day I in my whole life I was passionate about water. I think what really is the driving motivation for me is more of, like my growing up experience. I think I mentioned earlier I grew up in New York as a first generation, you know, american, and my parents immigrated here essentially to give my family a better life, to build a better future for us, and so you know my parents went through a lot to be able to do that, and so I won't go into the details, but it's a little crazy, pretty crazy story.
Sandeep Parikh:
We feel your first-gen love over here. We love the first-gen love.
Rajiv Parikh:
My dad came to America with negative $11,000 in his pocket. He had to take loans from his family, from other family members, to be able to come to the US and go to college. So yeah, and I know in talking with you earlier, your family had its own situation, but help me with the connection of.
Sandeep Parikh:
I mean, I hear that you know the parental struggle right Coming across the world to a whole new universe to then raise your kids away, entirely away from the culture that you know. How does that connect to your desire for wanting to make sure that nobody goes thirsty? Help me connect the dots on that.
Brian Sheng:
Yeah, so to me, you know, I in a way if I look at, my own, you know, growing up experience from a third party angle I almost think that perhaps money would have been the motivation, given that we came from an immigrant family. But the thing was I never felt that I wasn't taken care of, and the reason that happened was because my father and my parents gave up so much of their own well-being to ensure that I grew up without having the burden of anything really. I felt that I was the luckiest kid growing up. I felt like I was well taken care of. I did not feel like I was different from many of the kids I grew up with, which was a relatively wealthy part of Long Island.
Brian Sheng:
It was only later on in life, I realized, like just truly, how much that you know that sacrifice happened in order to make sure that we had a better life, and that really drove me to understand that, like, okay, I'm not here to just get a job, I'm not here to like just do some. You know, normal nine to to five. I want to do something that channels that same energy for the people around me, whether that's my friends or the people I love, or my parents, or whoever it is that I can build a better future that I can be proud of for everyone else, for myself, and continue to do that. And so that has, I think, reflected itself in whatever it is that I have done, whether it's investment, whether it's building this company, and I think it's that purpose, that motivation, that I saw in building my first company and now also in building Aquaria as well.
Rajiv Parikh:
I can definitely see that with, like I was thinking before even this call, I was sitting there going why, as a VC, would you start a company that does hardware right? Because, as you know, right hardware's you got to make stuff, you got distribution, you got supplies, you got to put it into place, you got to send it out where software you could. Just you know you have a high, super high gross margins. It's all your code and maybe it's is it your background from fresh, from looking at impact, that kind of drove you to do something as complicated as this or as complex as this and interesting.
Brian Sheng:
I'm a mission driven founder. To me, the specific, I don't think. I think it's difficult to build any kind of business, you know, whether it's software or hardware. I would turn it up, turn it around and say that if you're building a climate company and you don't have differentiated hardware, you know whether it's software or hardware. I would turn it around and say that if you're building a climate company and you don't have differentiated hardware, you know software is kind of useless.
Brian Sheng:
I can dig into the business and I can, you know, kind of turn the business logic different ways that we can debate about it. But starting this business has always been about the mission part for me and what I can do there and the intricacies of building that business is difficult, no matter how you look at it. And so starting this business is really coming from somewhere, more internally driven, and it just also lined up that when I thought about the opportunities here, whether from an impact angle or just from the absolute need for innovating and water all of those things aligned and I couldn't think of anything else. I would rather be spending my time on.
Rajiv Parikh:
That's amazing. And you decided to bootstrap this instead of going to your early investors or maybe folks that you knew in the industry. Is it because were you trying to prove it first before you went out and took investment? Is that kind of the thinking behind it?
Brian Sheng:
I started this company at the beginning of the pandemic. Slightly before the beginning of the pandemic I was on this global tour and then the pandemic happened, so the whole world kind of went upside down. It was kind of like, okay, well, let's wait for things to settle and call my friends and see all the VCs I know and see which I did. But the reception was like everyone was chaotic and it was a mess.
Brian Sheng:
It was a total mess. It was total mess. So somewhere along the way I was like, well, it's me, or wait it out and depend on somebody else, and of course you know that's basically the route I settled on is you know? Well, I think the most efficient way for you to do this is to build this in a time where a 100-year, once in a 100-year event has just happened. Maybe the world will be locked down for five years, who the hell knows? Otherwise, let's do this.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yeah, you wanted to push the chips in, it sounds like, rather than waiting for the world to unmask itself before you can get VC funding.
Rajiv Parikh:
you're like, like, let's go build the thing that I want to build. That's awesome. Apparently, apparently, brian, you have a lot of impatience. I mean, you finished college in three years. You started a business while you were in college.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yeah, I noticed before when he was like you know. I noticed later in life when and later in life, I was like what was that when you were like 17? Is that later in life for you, brian?
Rajiv Parikh:
He's in a rush to make great things happen.
Brian Sheng:
I don't know what to say Now. I'm stumped.
Sandeep Parikh:
I'm glad you're stumped because I'm going to attempt to stump you even more, because what's going to happen next? This next segment is called the Spark Tank and you are going to go into my gaming arena. Two CEOs enter and one gets the golden parachute. Today's challenge is going to be all about off the grid living. I thought that was kind of a cool sort of semi-tangential thing to Aquaria. Here We've got a thrilling matchup today, folks in the audience, between Brian Shang, the man who can turn air into water he's a real-life waterbender for all my avatar friends out there against my very own brother, rajiv Parikh, the CEO of a marketing company who, let's be honest, the closest he's come to roughing it is losing cell phone service at the Ritz in Bali. No yeah, it was a rough couple hours for him.
Rajiv Parikh:
It hurts just thinking about it.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yeah, all right. Here's how this is going to work, brian. We're going to do three rounds of two truths and a lie, where I'm going to list off three interesting factoids about off-the-grid living and you must determine which one is a lie. All right, so both of you are going to lock in your answers. I'm going to try this new style here I'm going to count down three, two, one and you're going to raise your fingers one, two or three to lock you in to your answer as to to which one to lock.
Rajiv Parikh:
Oh, I got it, so we can't cheat.
Sandeep Parikh:
Exactly None of this. Listening to what the last guy said, here's round one. If you're going to go living off the grid, you're going to need some means to make energy and food right. So round one is all about that, okay. Number one you can create a battery using soil and living plants. You can create a battery using soil and living plants, specifically using what a plant secretes during photosynthesis for off-grid energy.
Sandeep Parikh:
Number two some off-grid communities use giant hamster wheels as a fun way for children and or pets to generate electricity. Number three some survivalists are able to grow their own mushrooms of all varieties using old paperback books and coffee grounds. Okay, so that's one, two and three. Number one is the battery from soiled plants. Number two is the giant hamster wheel. Number three is mushrooms in a book. On the count of three, I want to see your fingers. One, two, three, oh boy, three, two, one, let's go All right. So, brian, you said number one, the battery from soil and living plants is malarkey. Rajiv, you said the giant hamster wheel is no-go. Well, guess what my brother in fact gets the point here? It turns out yes, I don't think giant hamster wheels do the job. Yeah, I know, this battery from leveling soil and plants was a surprise to me. It's called plant microbial fuel cell. Okay, this is plant MFC. It's a bioenergy technology that was demonstrated at Wageningen University in the Netherlands in 2014.
Rajiv Parikh:
Of all places.
Sandeep Parikh:
And it's pretty wild. It generates electricity by capturing electrons released by soil microbes as they break down organic matter. Pretty incredible. I was thinking that exactly. Yeah, I'm sure you were. Yeah, I'm pretty sure that's how you power your Tesla.
Brian Sheng:
Keep it so cheap.
Sandeep Parikh:
Very cool um yeah, all right, pretty wild, and yes, you can also grow mushrooms. And paperback books, preferably old daniel steel novels have to be they have to be cheesy romance novels fabio.
Brian Sheng:
It has to have fabio on the cover there was actually a really cool coffee company mushroom company that I remember that did that they like grew mushrooms in coffee. They like they were like an organic mushroom company or something where they grew like high end mushrooms using the waste coffee grinds from like as a from from just random coffee company. But I actually thought the hamster wheel thing was was was real, you know, like people just doing that's a pet project or something like that.
Sandeep Parikh:
Um I know, I know, I, I was tempted I was tempted, I was tempted.
Sandeep Parikh:
Let's see if you can make it up in round two. Let's try to tie the game here, all right. Number two this is all about people that have successfully lived off the grid. Number one a man from sweden has lived off the grid. Number one a man from Sweden has lived off the grid for over 30 years in a home that he built inside a giant rock, using natural spring for water and solar panels for electricity. Number two a woman in New Zealand lives in a tree house powered entirely by a bicycle generator, which she pedals for two hours daily to meet all of her energy needs.
Brian Sheng:
Okay.
Sandeep Parikh:
Number three a couple in Canada lives off-grid in a floating home made of recycled materials, using a wood stove for heating and growing vegetables in a rooftop garden. All right, so is it one, the Swedish man in the rock, number two, the New Zealander in the treehouse, or number three?
Rajiv Parikh:
the.
Sandeep Parikh:
Canadians floating on a boat, here we go. What's the last one he's floating on the boat. Floating on a boat made of recycled materials, using a wood stove for heating and growing vegetables in a rooftop garden. Wow, this is a close one, ready, yeah, here we go. Three, two, one, okay. Great, I love that you both have different answers. That's really helpful. All right Turns out. So, rajiv, you said number two, correct, correct. Oh, you said number three, okay. And Brian, you said number two, and guess what? Brian is correct. So you have tied the game up. That's right. The woman in the tree house is not. There's no Ewoks in New Zealand that live off of pedal bikes. It turns out, sadly.
Rajiv Parikh:
That should have been easy.
Sandeep Parikh:
You thought it was three. No, there is actually a couple in Canada. In fact, their floating home is anchored in a remote lake and they commute to a nearest town by canoe. Isn't that very lovely?
Brian Sheng:
Very romantic. That's crazy Wow.
Sandeep Parikh:
It is romantic, it is romantic.
Rajiv Parikh:
But that doesn't count, because they go back to the island. They go to the island, they cheat every day. They don't live totally on the water.
Sandeep Parikh:
That's what I was counting on Well but they, okay, we'll get into the definition of off the grid later.
Rajiv Parikh:
He's full off the grid. He's going back and having a beer.
Sandeep Parikh:
The home is off the grid. Okay, anyway, all right round. Number three it doesn't mean they're like, they're not hermits, they can still visit town.
Rajiv Parikh:
That's what. Off the grid is they?
Sandeep Parikh:
get their own power and their own water and their own sources of food and stuff. Okay, all right, round. Number three here. Okay, all right, round, number three, here we go. These are about the structures themselves. There's some interesting structures out there that people live in. All right, so, number one there is an off-the-grid home that can be folded up and moved like a suitcase. These are foldable homes, or tiny portable houses. They're a modern innovation. So is that true? Let's find out. Number two some off-grid homes are built entirely from recycled airplane fuselages, offering both durability and a unique aesthetic, to say the least. Number three an off-grid community in New Mexico lives in homes made entirely of discarded glass, bottles and concrete, creating colorful and insulating walls. All right, lock in your answers mentally and I'll count down. Here we go. Three, two, one, let's see it. Guess what Rajiv guessed? Number one the foldable home is false. And Brian said number three the off-grid community in New Mexico is false. I'm so sorry, but you're both wrong. Neither of you gets the golden parachute. You guys are stuck in the arena.
Rajiv Parikh:
We failed together, oh man.
Sandeep Parikh:
It turns out, the airplane fuselages were full of it. Yeah, yeah, so yeah, you can get a suitcase home, it turns out. So, yeah, I could see that.
Brian Sheng:
I thought, glass would be non-insulating, so I thought that would be false.
Rajiv Parikh:
I figured doing the toilet and the sink would be tough in that home. But I guess not.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yeah, it's just a box the home is just a box. Yeah, as a consolation prize, I'll be sending both of you a foldable home that you must live in now.
Rajiv Parikh:
I just want to do that.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yeah, you're getting kicked out of your actual houses, backyard, backyard. All right, so we end in a kissing your sister or kissing your brother, ty here. Still well played, though. Well played guys. You know, sometimes it's it's best to be unequal footing there you go.
Rajiv Parikh:
It happens usually. Usually we give the tie to the guest, but not today, so anyway well, we'll give the tie to the guest.
Sandeep Parikh:
Okay, all right, we give the time again. Congratulations, you're the winner.
Rajiv Parikh:
You get both portable homes you're so kind, you're so kind to come here, brian. You founded this company with your brother, eric right, and it's always interesting to start a company with their family member.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yeah, really worked out. It's very interesting to start anything. A podcast, a company, I mean, yeah, really interesting. Has it worked out? It's very interesting to start anything a podcast, a company, a podcast, it could be anything. Good Lord, is it interesting?
Rajiv Parikh:
But I mean you're really tied together, like I only have to do this. I only have to see somebody once every week or two, but you actually have to see him possibly every other day and your financial fortunes are tied together.
Brian Sheng:
What is it like? Any any interesting stories? I think the most interesting story that I can think of is actually, um, when, uh, my co-founder and brother, eric, and I went on this, um, you know those like, uh, silicon valley type of like meditation retreats for founders, you go deep into the mountains and you back kind of like talk about a lot of different problems and you know like they do this a lot and you know it's probably on an episode of no mushrooms, but actually it was solar powered in the mountains of mendocino.
Brian Sheng:
We were in the mountains and we had this exercise that was guided by a like a founder coach.
Brian Sheng:
And we weren't the only ones there, there were a bunch of other early stage founding teams and the topic of discussion was okay, well, like um, one of the biggest problems for early stage startups is that they just simply die because the co-founders fight with each other, there's disagreements, and you know that's like a huge problem for earlier stage companies. And so we had this exercise where our coach essentially said hey, all of you go and talk with each other and kind of discover, you know, and talk through like what happened if you guys have arguments, or what happened, you know, if things don't work out, and kind of talk to that situation. And for that exercise and only that exercise, because we've been there for like three days doing all these intense exercise, my brother and I we kind of just looked at each other. We're like I don't think there's anything for us to talk about. Like we've fought our entire lives, we've like done so many things together and it's kind of like yeah, that won't happen.
Brian Sheng:
Like we're in this, we're committed, we're more committed than anyone and there's no case that this will happen at all. And I think that was the coolest experience for me and like I was just like yep, we're going to chill for 10 minutes because we know the answer to that and that moment was really like a core memory of my founding this company. It's like we got this and nobody else in this room got this like we did, and I think that will be something I remember forever. And, of course, that's built off of years and years of doing other projects, killing each other off, but, like you know, that's something very, very great for me.
Rajiv Parikh:
So you know every bit about each other and you've worked through enough of it so that this business marriage can complement the close personal relationships. That's awesome.
Sandeep Parikh:
So one thing I want to ask doing our digging, we found out that you have ADHD, that you're diagnosed with ADHD. As someone who is undiagnosed ADHD, I am wondering you know, as a CEO you're pulled in so many different directions at a time. How have you managed through that? Any specific tips you maybe would offer to our listeners or me?
Brian Sheng:
I mean, I think a lot of everyone has their own particular version of it. I found that finding a routine that works for me and then finding a person to actually so like I would say like I work very closely with you know a chief of staff to help me manage and help me sit down and think through and complement the gaps in my like lack of focus, but then also finding the type of activities that allows me, in this particular case, like I've really gotten into taking um like walks and and ice baths that helps me calm down my nervous system, but then baking that into like a serious routines you know, plus external help, um, those two things have really helped me.
Sandeep Parikh:
Nice. So it's like an accountability buddy, and then these sort of these sort of nervous system, yeah, calming routines. I love it.
Brian Sheng:
Yeah, Also, Sandeep, I've also found that actually the exact opposite is also really helpful. It's like incredibly, like intensely structured, Like yes, 30 minutes, 15 minutes by 15, to have a so structured that you don't have room to think and you just go one by one and execute, and I found that actually counterintuitive. Also, it helps me stay focused. It's just be doing things the whole time, one by one, one by one.
Rajiv Parikh:
Let it go with whatever flow works for you, as opposed to the perfect structure.
Brian Sheng:
Yeah.
Rajiv Parikh:
One question we love to ask founders of companies is who or what historical event really motivated you, or was it an event or person, or who inspires?
Brian Sheng:
you, I would say my single source of inspiration is definitely my father. He, he was an entrepreneur as well. He was raised during the time of chinese cultural revolution, where, you know, you got beat up and you got, you know, you got negative types of attention for for being entrepreneurial and smart and speaking out, and and then he, he took us all here to america and, and you know, now I think about it just like how crazy it is that I'm able to do this today because of all of the work that you know my father has done to bring me here and all of the adversity to bring me here and to be the person I am today. So, yeah, so I would say you know that that really wraps it as a shout out to my dad, you know, for everything he's done for me and, and you know, that's definitely my and it will continue to be, you know, my source of motivation. That's really awesome.
Rajiv Parikh:
Well, brian, I think with that, that's the best way to end it. I love what you're doing, I love what you're building, I love how you're doing it and I really hope and really want to see you go out there and change the world for everyone and enable us all to live better lives, have safe, clean drinking water, and it affects the health and the lives of so many people, so I really appreciate what you're trying to do and what you're trying to create. So may everybody win, including your customers, you and your investors. I hope everybody wins and I really appreciate you coming on today.
Brian Sheng:
Thank you so much, and I really want to thank you, regina Sunday, for hosting me, giving me this opportunity to be on the podcast, and I hope that you know the audience found this to be an interesting and fun episode. Thank you again.
Sandeep Parikh:
All right, thanks, brian. Yep, next time I see you, we're going to get a drink let's do it Of water.
Rajiv Parikh:
I think the next line extension is a beer making machine. Yeah, brian's such an interesting guy. I mean, he's only in his twenties.
Sandeep Parikh:
Yeah.
Rajiv Parikh:
He's made money.
Sandeep Parikh:
I don't like that On his own.
Rajiv Parikh:
VC fund. He's now using it to create a company that can help millions, maybe billions, of people who don't have access to water or would have a difficult time getting access to clean water.
Sandeep Parikh:
I just love. My takeaway is sort of the mission alignment right. Don't let the perceived obstacles necessarily stand in the way of something that you believe in. Right. And also, hey, he works with his brother you know that's pretty cool with his brother, that's uh maybe a new winning strategy, not a new.
Rajiv Parikh:
Many a brother have worked together since the beginning of time, one is parker brothers uh parker brothers it's really amazing what he's done and I think what inspired him is his father's journey to america and he just felt that if my father is going to go through so much to get me here to america and do so much to sacrifice to provide me a great life, then I gotta pay back to the world, not just, yeah, the pay it forward mentality, yeah, not just make a whole bunch of money but actually make great change. And he's doing it.
Sandeep Parikh:
It's like the opposite of entitlement, this pay it forward attitude, this attitude of, uh I, I am privileged because of the sacrifice. I think that's the beauty of first generation specifically, is that you really do get a visceral sense of the sacrifice because, you see, you can really clearly see the market change between where they came from and where they are, you know, whenever we go back to india and stuff like that, and so you can see, wow, they went many, many degrees all right.
Rajiv Parikh:
Thanks for listening. If you enjoyed this pod, please take a moment to rate it and comment. You can find us on apple, spotify, youtube and everywhere podcasts can be found.
Sandeep Parikh:
Hey, this show is produced by moi, Cindy Parikh and Anand Shah, Production assistance by Taryn Talley and edited by Sean Maher and Aidan McGarvey.
Rajiv Parikh:
I'm your host, Rajiv Parikh from Position Squared, a kick-ass growth marketing company based in Silicon Valley. Come visit us at position2.com. This has been an eff'n Funny Production. We'll catch you next time. Remember, folks, be ever curious.