Natalie Cioffi - Mom of Four Leaves Corporate Career & Builds a Multi-State Cleaning Company

Summary

Natalie Cioffi, owner and president of CDJ Genie Services, shares her journey of starting and growing her residential and commercial cleaning company. She started the business 10 years ago while working full-time and wanting to create something that allowed her to be present for her family. Natalie emphasizes the importance of having the right mentality and being mentally tough as a business owner. She believes that a business degree is not necessary, but having a sales background and a certain personality are crucial. Natalie also discusses the challenges of hiring and trusting employees, as well as the importance of delegating and letting go of control. In this conversation, Natalie Cioffi, owner of CDJ Genie Services, and Branden Sewell discuss the challenges and rewards of running a small business. They emphasize the importance of knowing what you want and defining success on your own terms. They also discuss the significance of work-life balance and the freedom that entrepreneurship can provide. Natalie shares her marketing strategies, including leveraging social media and building trust through personal connections. They conclude by encouraging business owners to give themselves grace and to persevere through challenges.

Keywords

business owner, cleaning company, mentality, mental toughness, sales background, hiring, trust, delegation, control, small business, entrepreneurship, success, work-life balance, marketing, trust, community involvement

Takeaways

Being a business owner requires a certain mentality and mental toughness.
A business degree is not necessary, but having a sales background and the right personality are important.
Delegating and letting go of control are crucial for business growth.
Challenges in hiring and trusting employees are common, but it's important to keep moving forward.
Taking care of employees and building a strong company culture are essential for success. Know what you want and define success on your own terms
Building personal connections and trust is crucial for business growth
Marketing strategies can include leveraging social media and community involvement
Give yourself grace and persevere through challenges

Chapters

00:00 Introduction and Background
02:20 Starting the Business and Growing
08:06 The Importance of Mentality and Mental Toughness
13:10 Hiring, Trust, and Delegation
27:11 Taking Care of Employees and Building a Strong Company Culture
33:03 Defining Success on Your Own Terms

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Transcript

Branden Sewell (00:01.949)
Hi everybody, I am Brandon Sewell, owner of Seal Pro Painting and also now Seal Pro Seal and Wash in Central Florida. I'm also the host of the Off the Ladder podcast where we exist to help home service business owners learn so that they can lead well and ultimately live life off of the ladder. Today's guest is Natalie Choffee, she is the owner.

Natalie Cioffi (00:18.728)
Thanks.

Branden Sewell (00:25.373)
and president of CDJ Genie Services. They are a residential, commercial, post -construction cleaning company. And I'm really excited to dive into the story of Natalie's company. So Natalie, welcome to the show. Thank you so much for being willing to get on here.

Natalie Cioffi (00:41.8)
Yeah, thank you so much for having me Brandon. I'm glad we could finally find the time and make this work. So yeah, a little bit about me. I started this business about 10 years ago. Actually it'll be 10 years this August. And I was working full time for Marriott at the time. I've always been in sales pretty much my entire life.

I do have a business degree as well, so I knew that I wanted to do something along those lines. But, you know, I was young. I had a young kid and then I found out I was pregnant with twins and I had my twins. And then I was like, I don't want to really travel two hours commuting -wise back and forth to work anymore. I want to create something where I can still financially contribute to my family while being home, you know, being there for my kids. So...

I love to clean. It's in my blood. And I said, looked at my husband, I said, hey, are you cool if I quit my job and just start cleaning houses and see what happens? And he was like, absolutely. So I was very fortunate that my husband is a police officer and we had all of our health insurance through him. So that was huge, right? I wasn't taking a huge risk by losing that and taking a crazy leap. So I did have that comfort.

Branden Sewell (01:45.977)
the end.

Natalie Cioffi (02:04.904)
So I did start cleaning houses and before I knew it, I was able to hire my first employee. And then before I knew that, I was able to not clean them anymore at all. And here we are now today with an office in Maryland and in Florida.

Branden Sewell (02:20.093)
Yeah, that's awesome. So I got introduced to you and your business through Kelly, who is down here running the Florida location. And Kelly's awesome. She's a part of our local BNI down here. And from my perspective, I think she's doing a really great job. And I think she represents you guys really well here. And it, you know, when I...

started to learn more about your business. I was like, wow, like it takes a lot to be able to go from, you know, one location to another and just the everything that's entailed there. So I was like, man, I really want to talk to Natalie and find out more about the story. But really quick, I think this is a pretty controversial topic. And, you know, just I'm interested to hear your thoughts on it. You said you have a business degree. Do you think?

that your business degree was needed to do what you do as a business owner.

Natalie Cioffi (03:21.288)
No, no, and actually we were just talking about this last night with our neighbors. You know, it is so hard being a business owner. And I truly, truly believe that it takes a certain personality to be able to not only be a business owner, but to be, like you said, an off the ladder business owner. I think there's a huge difference between an owner and an operator, obviously. And some people, you know, our counter,

Branden Sewell (03:30.909)
Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (03:49.896)
another cleaning company here in Maryland that I work very closely with if I need something, she is an operator. She wants to be an operator. She loves being an operator. That's just not what I wanted for myself. So to kind of answer your question, no, I don't think that the degree helped me at all because my sales background, I think, is what helped me, honestly. But again, not everyone can be in sales. It's just it takes a certain type of

Branden Sewell (04:12.189)
sure.

Natalie Cioffi (04:19.432)
You know, you hear a lot of nos. You gotta be really, really mentally strong to be able to push through and see the bigger, bigger picture. You know, that's kind of what Kelly's going through right now with Florida, but she's done what took me years to do in the matter of eight months. You know, I mean, I did set her up with kind of my lessons learned type stuff, but she really hit the ground running because she also has that tenacious,

Branden Sewell (04:37.597)
Right.

Branden Sewell (04:42.781)
Mm -hmm.

Natalie Cioffi (04:48.968)
go -getter attitude that just can't be taught at the University of Maryland.

Branden Sewell (04:53.725)
Yeah, no, and you know, it does, it takes a lot of grit. And I think that being a business owner is more about your mentality than it is about anything else because, you know, you're going to make mistakes, you're going to fall, you're going to fail, you're going to try to put your best foot forward and still make mistakes. And so I think what I've learned just in my journey, I'm not 10 years in, I'm going into my eighth year in business.

And I've just learned that, you know, I'm not going to be perfect at it. I'm going to make mistakes constantly, but it's just having a mentality of like, okay, well, I just keep learning and I keep improving and I keep getting better and make myself better so that my business can be better. And I think there's some people when they face those challenges, it's like they just, I think it's really knowing what you want to, it's like, do you want that?

If you don't want those to take on those challenges and to be faced with that constantly and face the reality of like, that's what being a business owner takes. If you don't want that, then you'll probably quit. But if you're up for the challenge and you can have a long -term mindset... Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (06:13.256)
You're frozen, I don't know if you can hear me, Brandon.

Yeah.

Branden Sewell (06:17.725)
So really quick, I'll share like the this might pause or like freeze on your end, but it uploads locally for both of us. So yeah, if it happens, just try to like catch where I'm at and then Yeah, so Yeah, yeah. Yeah. It's funny how that works. But yeah, it does that but

Natalie Cioffi (06:26.472)
Okay, awesome.

Natalie Cioffi (06:34.056)
Okay, jump back in, got it.

Branden Sewell (06:43.453)
The the way this software works is it uploads on it like locally on your end and locally on my end so that those Glitches aren't live on the recording. So like when I finalize this it'll upload my mind perfect and yours perfect because even sometimes you'll cut out or like freeze, but it doesn't actually in the live Turn out that way but but yeah, so anyway, like I was saying is it's just a

Natalie Cioffi (07:00.2)
Okay.

Natalie Cioffi (07:08.072)
Got it.

Branden Sewell (07:12.925)
It's really just taking those challenges head on and just having that mentality of like, this is what I want. This is what I signed up for. And the. The enjoyment is in the journey, right? It's it's not like the quicker I realized that it's not about like some end goal, it's about this journey and my personal growth along the way, the journey and the lessons of.

Natalie Cioffi (07:26.36)
Yeah.

Branden Sewell (07:42.781)
learning about running a business, it's like learning to find joy in that and and realizing like, it's it's just a process. And instead of trying to look at everything is like, and how do I get to like, you know, when everything is perfect, it's like, well, it's probably not gonna be or ever going to be perfect, you know. So

Natalie Cioffi (08:03.336)
Great. Yeah. Yeah.

Branden Sewell (08:06.781)
But I really appreciate that because I think so many people think that it's like to run a business that it's like a intellectual thing or it's a, you know, it's a, you know, someone who can take a test well doesn't mean that they're going to end up being a good business owner or have what it takes to be a business owner. It's like you could be a great student.

at a university and try to start your own business and it just not be what you're good at. You're, you know, suited as being an employee at an organization. So, and I think in it, yeah, yeah, it's, it's not right or wrong, but I think it's like just encouraging people because there's, there's people out there who will be, would be amazing business owners, but they disqualify themselves.

Natalie Cioffi (08:41.224)
Yeah, and that's okay too. That's okay too.

Branden Sewell (08:59.997)
before they ever get started because they're like, I don't have a degree in finance or I don't have a business degree. I don't have this. I don't have that. And it's like, no, like it's really more about your mentality and being mentally tough than probably anything else. And just being a learner, like be willing to learn, be humble, be willing to grow, be able to take criticism and, you know.

Natalie Cioffi (09:16.616)
Yeah.

Branden Sewell (09:26.077)
be able to be rejected and still pick yourself up and keep moving forward. So yeah, I think there's a lot to that, but I really appreciate you sharing that feedback because even myself, I dropped out of business school. So I went for like a semester and a half and decided it wasn't for me.

Natalie Cioffi (09:43.272)
Yeah, I mean, yeah. Yeah. And look at you now.

Branden Sewell (09:51.581)
Yeah, yeah. So just an encouragement. So if you're listening to this and maybe you're wondering like, man, do I have what it takes to start a business? I dropped out of college or I never went to college or maybe you're even a high school dropout. You know, you can still be successful in business. It's it's a completely different skill set. So that's good. And then so it.

Natalie Cioffi (09:52.84)
Yeah.

Branden Sewell (10:15.069)
Another thing that we had in common was that I'm from Maryland as well. Like all of my family is from Maryland. So I was really intrigued by that. I used to work for a painting company up there who serviced like the area that you live in. So I was out like doing sales in that area a lot. All my family lives in Northeast Baltimore. So that's really cool. What is your service area? So you service all of Maryland and then?

Natalie Cioffi (10:19.72)
Yeah.

Branden Sewell (10:43.389)
or what areas of Maryland do you service?

Natalie Cioffi (10:45.64)
Yeah. So when I started this business, I wanted my team to... I left what I was doing because I didn't want to be commuting all over the place, right, for work. So we're different from other cleaning companies where our girls drive their own vehicles. So they're leaving right from their homes. So we typically try to make them... The floor is different, but for Maryland, we try to keep them within, I would say, a 30 -minute radius.

Branden Sewell (10:56.637)
Sure.

Natalie Cioffi (11:14.216)
of where they live. So to answer your question, you have Frederick County, Montgomery County, Carroll County, and then for construction, that will go an hour plus out because obviously it's larger work and I have a whole different team that we work with for that. I have women that I employ directly and then I have another contractor that I work with and I think we texted about that a little bit.

Branden Sewell (11:41.117)
Yeah, yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (11:41.256)
Cause I'm trying to find something like that in Florida too, where I can call them and be like, I know they're going to show up. I know they're going to do work. I know they're good people. Hey, I need 10 people XYZ. They're like, okay, got it. See you at seven. So, so we'll go a little further for construction, but for residential, we keep it more local. And just like you, I mean, you know, you gotta, it's not just being good in sales and stuff like that. I mean, people need to get to know you. We're really involved in the community here.

Branden Sewell (11:54.013)
Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (12:09.864)
So when I first started off, I would donate a lot of cleanings. I would work with the schools and for their raffle baskets and things like that just to get my name out there because who am I? I'm just another cleaning company that's not gonna show up or that's not gonna do a good job or that's not gonna whatever they've already been mentally conditioned to think about companies versus just one individual. I wanted to break that cycle and have a different approach. And I think that that's really what helped propel me.

Branden Sewell (12:22.013)
Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (12:37.928)
here in Maryland and that's also again what we're trying to do in Florida.

Branden Sewell (12:41.437)
Yeah, that's great. So let's jump into kind of like the mentality that you took on starting your business. Obviously, you know, you left your full time job, that security, and you started this business. And, you know, how long did it take for you to grow? What were some of your strategies early on? And then how did you go from like growing it to getting out of the field and not doing the cleaning yourself? Could you talk about like what that looked like and what that time frame was like?

Natalie Cioffi (13:09.672)
Yeah, I mean, honestly, when I started this business, I never imagined that I would be where I am right now. That wasn't even a thought in my brain. I just wanted to get out of what I was doing and make some good money and hire a few people and work alongside them until maybe we would do a few houses a day. So that big picture mentality was not really there in the beginning. But it took me about, I would say, a year to learn. I got very lucky.

I got very lucky with the employees that I got right off the bat. Of course, there was a few that were a hot mess. That's just how it goes. But I got very, very blessed early on. I had a specific employee, actually. It's actually a heartbreaking story because she ended up stealing from us. But she worked with me almost my entire time that I've had CDJ. She really, really was an integral part of helping me get to where.

I mean, I considered her a friend, a sister, a partner to where we were. So I really do thank her for that. It was unfortunate at the end what happened. But you know, you have to recover. That's business. I mean, things happen and that's a big learning lesson that I learned too that, you know, no matter how much you trust someone or you bring them in, you think that they might be doing the right things, you just really never know. You got to...

not let your guard down and stay protective of what you've grown, right? So that's something that I learned late in the game, but nonetheless, I learned it. So I hope others out there too, just remember that. I know it's exciting to start a business. I know you wanna have a business partner. You still have to be very mindful of people. People get greedy. People get, they start looking at you like, well, I'm doing all this work and like, what are they doing now? And they don't realize how much work that you put in.

to getting to where this is now. You're not just sitting back pretty. You've really, really, I mean, blood, sweat, and tears. And even to this day, I mean, I manage all of our commercial stuff. You know, if something, I do all the bidding for our commercial stuff, all the contract stuff, and obviously it costs a lot of money to run a business, the insurance, the liability. So, you know, people don't always really realize that. They just see you as the owner and they're the workhorse and,

Branden Sewell (15:29.149)
Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (15:38.504)
And people do things that are out of their character sometimes because they start to feel a certain kind of way. So you have to be careful too as a business owner, how you portray yourself and carry yourself as well.

Branden Sewell (15:45.757)
Yeah.

Branden Sewell (15:52.573)
Yeah, that's super challenging. I mean, I think about it all the time. Your employees, they see this big number that comes in, right? Let's say we bid a job and my guys see, they got this project and it's five grand, 10 grand, and they're seeing that big number, but they don't realize like, okay, but as a business owner, I've got insurance premiums in the thousands of dollars I've got.

Natalie Cioffi (16:20.104)
Yeah.

Branden Sewell (16:21.021)
workers comp, I've got payroll taxes. Yeah, just everything that it takes to run a business, material cost, insurance, and I have my own vehicle, so insurance on vehicles. And the list goes on, maintenance to equipment, and all of these expenses add up. And so, they can see that big number and they see their check and they're like, wow, like a

Natalie Cioffi (16:25.384)
quarterly taxes.

Branden Sewell (16:49.341)
mine's only a portion of that. Well, it's like, okay, but you have to realize it takes a lot to run a business. And so trying to manage those expectations with employees is really important. And it's definitely challenging because on one hand, as a business owner, you wanna be rewarded for your hard work, right? And you do wanna make good money because...

You're taking a lot of risk. You're putting in a lot of effort to grow a business and it's taxing mentally, emotionally. It takes a lot of time and effort. And so you want to be paid well, but you also don't want these employees who are working hard and sweat their labor, their hard labor to feel any type of way. But it's definitely very, very challenging to balance that of like, okay, well,

you know, they can start to feel maybe entitled or feel a certain way about what they're doing. And that's, that's definitely challenging to handle. So now let's kind of backtrack really quick. So yes, it's hard, it's challenging when you hire employees. You said it took you a year to learn. So does that mean after a year, you are kind of moving yourself out of the field and kind of delegating to employees?

Natalie Cioffi (18:16.264)
Yeah, yeah, I would say about after a year. I mean, I would still show up. We were still small at that point. So if someone called out or something like that, I would still go work side by side. I mean, to this day, if I really need to do something, I'll be on the construction site or do what I need to do. I mean, obviously, I'm not going to say no, someone else figure it out. This is still my baby. I still take care of it. But yes, it took me about a year to...

Branden Sewell (18:18.109)
Okay.

Branden Sewell (18:36.541)
Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (18:43.016)
to get a little more hands off, which is hard too, because things aren't always done the way that I want them to be done. So that was another thing that I had to learn to just let go a little bit and know that the people working for me are human beings. They're not machines, like, you know. So they're gonna make mistakes. They're gonna, so, you know, we always have them check on each other too. Cause I tell, same, if I work with someone, I'm like, check my work. We're all human beings. You're gonna.

forget something, you're moving quick, you're moving fast, you know. So that's just a really, really big reminder too, when you start your own business, it's easy to be like, why couldn't they just do this or why didn't they do that? They're human, you know. You don't know what's going on in their day. You don't know what's going on mentally. So you have to have some grace with that too. And that's why a lot of people end up staying operators versus owners because...

Branden Sewell (19:27.357)
Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (19:40.456)
They can't let go. And again, that's okay. Some of them want to do that. That's just not what I want.

Branden Sewell (19:44.349)
Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And like we said, that's important for you to know what you want. So obviously, as we're talking, one of the biggest challenges that any business owner is going to face is hiring. So you brought up one of the points that I really talk about all the time, which is when you're delegating to employees, you have to realize...

you have to be willing to let go of control. You have to be willing to recognize like you're not the only one that can do the work. You're not, you know, we say there's a lot of owners out there, operators who say like, if it doesn't get done by me, it's not going to get done right. And that's not true. Like it can still get done right. You know, and I like to think of really,

big organizations, right? Like I'm a small business and I try to think of really, really, really big organizations who like their CEO is like sitting on a yacht in the middle of the Caribbean, while this massive billion dollar company, let's say is operating. It's like, well, if that CEO and founder had this mentality of like, well, if it's not going to get, if I don't do it, it's not going to be done right. Well,

He wouldn't have that business. He wouldn't have that size of a business, right? You know, if you have that mentality, it just holds you back. So you have to be willing to let go of control. You have to be willing to trust others. And I want to get into that really quick. And you just have to be willing to delegate. And what I say is delegate authority. Don't delegate tasks. You want to...

Delegate no sense that you're giving people the autonomy to make decisions. You're teaching them your culture. You're teaching them what is important to you, the mission of the business, and then delegating the authority for them to go and operate within those confines of those values and the mission of the company. And I think that's really important. Now you brought up trust. I've had employees steal from me.

Branden Sewell (22:02.749)
I've had employees tell me they're going to do one thing and they do the other and just completely, you know, just walk all over me as a business owner. And that can be really challenging. So what advice would you have after facing those challenges yourself for business owners out there who are worried about that, worried about being taken advantage of, worried about being stolen from? How do you face that?

mentally and when it happens, pick yourself up and keep moving forward and keep putting the future in front of you.

Natalie Cioffi (22:41.864)
Yeah, you know, I'm not gonna lie. When the girl who I mentioned earlier, you know, was by my side the whole time and it ended the way it did, I mean, I was, I couldn't sleep, I couldn't eat. I mean, I just could not believe that someone could do something like that. I mean, we were friends, I mean, I had a baby shower at my house, birthday parties, family events. Like, it just was so hard.

Branden Sewell (23:03.069)
Mm -hmm.

Natalie Cioffi (23:09.96)
To answer that question, my advice is just keep going. I mean, people are, again, they're human beings and you can't control other people. You can only control what you can control and that's your emotions, that's your mindset. And if you're gonna let someone else affect you, you're not gonna survive. And it's easier said than done. Like I said, I was a hot mess. I was a hot mess. We actually just had a girl in Florida quit recently. She was awesome.

Branden Sewell (23:29.661)
Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (23:38.792)
We took care of her. I even paid off a huge debt she had. I had her pay me back so that she didn't have to pay interest on it. Just so she could just live. Because I saw something in her and today she just texted and was like, sorry, done. Not coming in today. Not working anymore. You know, again. And that was Kelly's first kind of experience with something like that. And it was, she feels devastated because...

Branden Sewell (23:56.733)
Wow.

Natalie Cioffi (24:05.096)
You feel like you put so much and we really, really care for employees. So for someone to have that much disregard for not only the company, but for like us as human, we're human beings too, you know, that was, it's hard, but you must just say, next play. It's the same thing I tell my kids. You strike out, next play. You're gonna be a hot mess on the field and not make the play, cause you struck out, no, next play. That's all you can do.

Branden Sewell (24:18.781)
Yeah.

Branden Sewell (24:31.677)
Yeah, that's good. Yeah. And I think, you know, I faced a lot of challenges as a business owner and it can be very mentally exhausting. You know, I've definitely faced those nights where it's like, you know, you're so anxious, so like just overwhelmed. It's like you can't eat, you know, it's like food doesn't even sound good. You know, you're like, my, you have so much stress on you. Like I've had times where my wife is just like, babe, do you want to eat dinner? I'm like, I can't.

Like I literally just can't even like eating would feel even more exhausting. It's like it's you know, and that's just real. Like that's so real. And I think I've faced some days in my business where I was just like, I don't know if I can keep doing this. But what you said is so key is it's saying like, I'm just going to keep moving forward. And I think there's two things that is like one.

Natalie Cioffi (25:01.863)
Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (25:08.488)
Yeah. Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (25:19.752)
Yep.

Branden Sewell (25:30.781)
recognize that it's okay, like recognize your emotion, recognize the way you feel and just say like, okay, it's okay to feel this way, but I'm not going to let it control what I do moving forward. So it's like, okay, yes, this is a stressful situation. It's okay to not feel okay right now, but I'm going to not let this win. If that makes sense. I'm not going to let this feeling win.

Natalie Cioffi (25:57.864)
Yeah.

Branden Sewell (25:59.485)
And then, yeah, it's just when I face my hardest time that I ever faced in my business in 2022, I just sat down and kind of had a conversation with myself and I was like, can I just make it through the next day? Right? I don't, like mentally, I can't even fathom it, but if I can just get through tomorrow to where I lay my head on the pillow and go to sleep and wake up another day,

I okay, that's a win. Okay, survived that day. And then it's like, okay, that was day one. Now let's tackle day two, you know, you take the challenges as they come, you do the absolute best that you can. All right, we won day two. And then, you know, next thing you know, you're overcoming the challenges, you're facing them head on.

Natalie Cioffi (26:32.104)
Yeah.

Branden Sewell (26:53.181)
You're just doing the best that you can and then next thing you know, you're four months down the road, six months down the road and things are completely different and you're like, I'm so glad I didn't give up in the valley because I wouldn't get to experience where I am right now.

Natalie Cioffi (27:05.864)
Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (27:10.728)
And that's what I tell our managers too. That's what I tell Kelly. That's what I tell our manager in Maryland too because they get down on themselves. We receive a complaint or they forgot to follow up with someone and we lost the client or whatever. Granted, if things are consistently happening that way, we got to see what's going on there. But this is just a job. I tell them, this is just take a deep breath. Let's work together. This is just a job. Nothing is worth you.

feeling so like nothing's gonna get better. I mean, that's in life too, right? I mean, we all get in dark places sometimes, obviously. And you just need to remind yourself, like, just a job. Next play, just a job. So.

Branden Sewell (27:44.733)
Mm -hmm.

Branden Sewell (27:53.117)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that's good. Well, you know, I think that it's important to like talk about these things and the challenges that business owners face because I think a lot of times we can feel alone in those struggles because, you know, not everybody knows what it's like to be a business owner and to feel that kind of weight and responsibility.

You know, it's like sometimes I'll have this conversation with my guys. They're like, you know, I'm just stressed out. Like I've I've got to, you know, put food on the table for my family. And I'm like, I was like, I understand completely. I was like, when I at the end of my day, I don't just think I've got to put food on the table for my family. I'm thinking about every employee, every contractor that relies on me to put food on the table.

their kids, their wives, their husbands. And that weight is like, wow. So it's definitely, I think that maybe adds some perspective that it's not a small thing. It's a pretty big thing that business owners carry. And I think when you're a business owner that cares and has a heart and you have compassion,

Sometimes I think it's even harder. You know, and I think as a business owner, like think about why, like the comparison of corporate America to like a small business, right? I think corporate America, you're just a number, right? Like, you know, I don't want to say they don't care at all, but there's just a, I don't think there's the same care that is available in a small business.

Natalie Cioffi (29:19.812)
Yeah.

Branden Sewell (29:47.741)
Right. And, you know, so I think that that can be challenging because sometimes I look back on situations that I've been in as a business owner and I was like, wow, if I just handled this like corporate America would, I probably wouldn't be as stressed, but I care. So.

Natalie Cioffi (30:08.872)
Yeah, I could have been like, you're not doing what I need you to do. You're fired. A million times over with people who I feel like are taking advantage with, you know, the wiggle room that I give them or the flexibility that I give them and stuff like that. You know, but I truly, maybe that's a fault of mine too. Maybe that's something I always say, I'm gonna work on it, I'm gonna work on it. But I do, I care so freaking much. And you know, I...

I fall in love with them, I fall in love with their families, their kids, and I want to make this work for them. And it's hard to sometimes to set that boundary of, you know, I've had to have hard conversations being like, look, like, I know we're like friends too, but like, you can't speak to me like that. Like I'm your boss or hey, like, you know, these mistakes shouldn't be happening. I know you're at home and I know you're working, but like, I need you to at least do this so that we can keep functioning. And then I don't care if you're working from the beach or where.

what you're doing, I just need the bare minimums done. And then we have a project obviously going above and beyond, but it gets hard. It gets really, really dicey. And Kelly's, I've known Kelly who's in Florida forever, my entire life. And the reason I knew she'd be a great fit there is because Kelly and I are cut from the same cloth. I mean, our families...

Branden Sewell (31:23.869)
Mm -hmm.

Natalie Cioffi (31:30.696)
are very similar. Her and I used to clean houses just when we were young for extra cash here and there. She's a go -getter like I mentioned before. So that is the tenacity that you need in order. I envision Kelly to be the me of Florida and I will keep Maryland type thing. Like that's where I'm trying to get her so that I don't have to worry about Florida at all. It is her, you know? So, and she will get there. It's just hard.

Branden Sewell (31:48.189)
Right, right.

Branden Sewell (31:54.173)
bright.

Natalie Cioffi (31:57.896)
It's so hard. Like I said, that person quit today. People don't show up for work or they don't do a good job. She can't be everywhere at once. It's tough. It's tough. But like for everyone listening out there, please know, you know, we're getting deep and we're getting dark and saying how hard it is, but it is also so beautiful. You know, majority of the time that I am being able to spend with my family and my kids trumps everything of the sleepless nights, the stress, the...

Branden Sewell (32:17.885)
Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (32:28.008)
trying to appease everyone. It really truly does, but you've got to put in the work to get there, obviously. And then you do have to trust people. You got to put your trust in people and you also have to know that if they burn you, that's on you. And you have to be able to bounce back and next play it. So always be still present so that if you know what's going on in your business, obviously. Like I tell my managers, I'm like, I need to know X, Y, and Z because if you get hit by a bus tomorrow, I don't know how you contact this client. I don't know how you do.

Branden Sewell (32:44.573)
Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (32:57.192)
X, Y, and Z, so I still try to stay in the game. I wish I could be the guy on the yacht, but not yet. Not quite yet.

Branden Sewell (33:03.934)
Not quite yet. Yeah. Yeah. Well, you know, small businesses, like you said, it's challenging, but it's definitely 100 % rewarding. I read a post by this other entrepreneur the other day and it said, if you have the freedom to take your kids to school whenever you want, and if you have the freedom to like show up,

you know, to your spouse's work and like take them to lunch whenever you want. And you just have those like simple freedoms. You're successful as an entrepreneur because, you know, like for me, that's I do have that freedom, right? If I want to, you know, I take my kids to school every single day. I pick them up every day. I can go to all of their doctor's appointments with my one my wife.

has been pregnant with the two of our kids. I've gone to every single appointment. I've been able to be there to support her. And that's the freedom that my business has given me. And I think there's seasons where you determine what is it in your business. How do I phrase this? Success looks different in different seasons of your business and life. So,

I know that right now, success for me is not a monetary number or figure. Right now. Right now, success for me in my business is exactly what I just said. It's that freedom of being able to make time for my spouse, of being able to make time for my kids, to be present. And I believe that there will be a season in my life where...

you know, I am able to grow the business and scale it to another level that I don't necessarily want to or can right now because it's just not my priority. So I think it's, you know, we talked about knowing what you want. I think you have to know, like, what do you really want out of your business? Do you want to be, does success for you look like? I wouldn't, I don't think many people would say this. Does success look like neglecting your family for the sake of monetary gain?

Natalie Cioffi (35:06.056)
Yes.

Branden Sewell (35:27.389)
I don't think many people would say that, but maybe a single guy who has no family says, my business is everything and the money is all that matters. And I'm going to work seven days a week to be super successful. Maybe that's what it looks like for them. But...

Natalie Cioffi (35:45.512)
So there's a book, sorry, I have to chime in on this. So there's a book called Winning and it's written by Kobe Bryant and Michael Jordan's mental trainer. And his name is escaping me right now. It is a dark book about what it takes to win, to be a winner. I'm getting goosebumps just thinking about it because the book is that good. And...

Branden Sewell (35:48.797)
Yeah, yeah, for sure. Mm -hmm.

Branden Sewell (35:58.749)
Mm -hmm.

Natalie Cioffi (36:12.264)
And what winning looks like, like you just said, what winning looks like to you, what winning looked like for Kobe, what winning looked like, you know, you've gotta be able to make those sacrifices. You've gotta be able to put yourself through pain, mentally, physically, whatever it is, to get to where you need to be to do it. And it's not easy. I mean, it's a great book. I recommend it to anyone who is looking to, I mean, the things that they go through, the things that they have to tell themselves is,

is unbelievable. I could never be a Kobe Bryant. I could never be a Michael Jordan just because I, that's not how I operate. I'm very much like you where I want to be, that's why I quit my job. I wanted to be there for my kids. I wanted to be present. Yes, I wanted to still make money too. We took a risk, you know? And right now money is a big driver for me, especially for Florida, because I'm not there doing all the work.

Branden Sewell (37:02.045)
Mm -hmm.

Natalie Cioffi (37:10.76)
You know, here I was, I was a revenue generator. There, Kelly's more of me right off the bat and not necessarily working and bringing in income. She's bringing in income and other people are, are working. she'll, she'll do things herself too, but it's, it's just different. It looks different. So it's, it's kind of scary. but you know, we're getting there, you know.

Branden Sewell (37:11.645)
share.

Branden Sewell (37:16.029)
Yeah.

Branden Sewell (37:29.181)
Mm -hmm.

Branden Sewell (37:39.805)
Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (37:40.2)
We're getting there, we're chipping away, so. But again, it's just a job, right? We're doing the best we can. If we need to change gears and do something else, we can, but yeah. Check out that book, it's really good.

Branden Sewell (37:44.701)
Yeah. Yeah.

Branden Sewell (37:52.125)
Yeah, that's, yeah, I definitely will. And, you know, I think that something, it's very, we live in a culture that compares so often. You know, we have social media, you're comparing your success to everybody on social media and, you know, what is their success, you look at it and maybe you find yourself, you know, coveting what somebody else has, you know, it's like, man, like just if I had that, you know, house or that.

car or just if I had that family or whatever. And then you lose sight of what actually makes you happy. And you know, something that I and I think pain and sacrifice don't look the same for everybody, right? So like, for six years of my life, pain and sacrifice looked like living in a house that I didn't love. But it's what I chose to do because I

being there for my family was more important than having like, now we just kind of moved up, we sold our house, we bought another one, but for that six years, I can't tell you how many conversations my wife and I had of like, man, like this house, we just like, you know, it needs so much work, it's not what we really love, we're running out of space. But what was more important to us was like, being present with the kids and, you know, having other freedoms. And so,

And that took pain and some sacrifice, right? But it's all about like knowing like yourself, what do you really want and what's going to really fulfill you. And having a nicer house right now, it's great. But having a nicer house, newer house will never replace like spending time with my son and daughter. It'll never take the place of like, you know,

Natalie Cioffi (39:41.479)
Thank you.

Branden Sewell (39:44.509)
having a great marriage and being able to spend time with my wife. So yeah, I think that it's just really getting down into like the nitty gritty of like, what do I really want? And what's really going to make me happy? And so I think that's important as a business owner to keep that kind of in mind. And I think that's why like, getting off the ladder, like it's choosing your heart, like being in the field and being the one who's doing all the work like that's hard.

Natalie Cioffi (39:57.288)
Yeah.

Branden Sewell (40:12.541)
being off the ladder, out of the field, whatever you want to say, that's hard too. And it's like choosing which one, but knowing why you're making that decision. If working in the field is what brings you joy and makes you happy, like don't get off the ladder. But if you know that freedom and being able to spend time with your family and...

Natalie Cioffi (40:35.88)
Thank you.

Branden Sewell (40:36.573)
be like at all your kids sporting events and doing all of these different things, knowing that that's important to you, then choose the heart of getting off the ladder because it's going to give you what you really want and the ability to like accomplish that if that makes sense.

Natalie Cioffi (40:51.976)
No, it does. And I think just piggybacking off of that, it's finding your significance, right? Like I always look at people and I'm like, they complain about not having money, but then they're driving a 2024 whatever, but that's their significance. A nice car, it is. Having a nice car is what makes them happy that fills their bucket. My husband drives a 2000 Bonneville. It has vintage tags. He has no air conditioning. You know, we bought our van. I've never owned a brand new car in my life because that's not...

Branden Sewell (41:03.645)
No.

Branden Sewell (41:09.725)
Yeah, sure.

Natalie Cioffi (41:22.12)
what fills our bucket. I like to travel. So I'd rather drive his, I don't drive that Bonneville actually, I'm gonna take that back, cause that thing scares me to death. But my, the van, you know, I pull up to construction sites and my little mom van, you know, you don't have to have, you don't have to have the big old truck pulling up to sites cause you have your business owner now. Take a deep breath, take it slow, grow yourself and then you can buy the truck. Or again, A, I'm not throwing shade.

If that's what fills your bucket, fill your bucket. But for me, I'd rather take my kids to Disney or go to Ocean's Sit or whatever, you know, with the money that we would have spent on a $20 ,000 car to replace Bonnie. He's had her forever. I'm wondering where she's going. I call it his mistress because she just will not die or go away. my god, see, it's just, yeah, it's old. Pontiac.

Branden Sewell (42:04.221)
Yeah.

I don't even know what that is. I'm gonna have to look at it. What's the maker of it? Pontiac, okay, I'll have to check it out. Yeah, no, it's such a good point. I mean, I went through a season, I've done both. Like I went through a season where, you know, would not finance a vehicle to save my life. And then I had like,

Natalie Cioffi (42:17.8)
Yeah, that's nice.

Branden Sewell (42:31.805)
Both me and my wife, we both had finance vehicles, plus the business had multiple finance vehicles, and then 2022, really, really rough year, I sold everything. And now, my wife's vehicle's paid for, my vehicle's paid for, I do still have one vehicle out of the four that I had in the business that's financed, but then the rest are paid for.

And so yeah, it's just, you're 100 % spot on there. And just, you know, financing vehicles, that's a whole nother story. But yeah, I think you it comes down to deciding like, what's more important to you. And like, I just realized I was like, you know what, like, and actually, to my surprise, by getting a used vehicle and paying cash for it, I was actually able to getting

get an older vehicle that was nicer than my newer vehicle. Like my newer vehicle, like it wasn't like a top of the line edition or whatever, you know, didn't have leather seats, didn't have all the bells and whistles. Got rid of that and I got a 2000, what is it, a 2013 and it's fully loaded. And you know, it's so it's actually.

Natalie Cioffi (43:50.28)
Yeah, exactly like us.

Branden Sewell (43:52.893)
It's actually nicer. My wife's fan. It's a really nice older Honda Odyssey. But yeah, 2009 Honda Odyssey. So yeah, I mean, it's... So that just goes into stating like you have to choose what's more important to you and what you want.

Natalie Cioffi (43:58.056)
That's what I have. Yeah, see? I knew I liked you. Yep.

Natalie Cioffi (44:10.92)
And you don't have to have all the things, you know, you don't have to have all the things to be successful business owner. Just cause you see a guy driving a brand new truck with this business name on the side does not mean that his bucket is being filled with his financially, his family and all the things that might fill your bucket. So you really just need to be, you know, not blinded by that. Yeah.

Branden Sewell (44:16.925)
Yeah, for sure.

Branden Sewell (44:29.925)
Yeah. Self -aware, I think is important. Be self -aware. And, you know, I think a lot of people would call what we're talking about a lifestyle business. You know, so you're creating a business to create the lifestyle that you want, right? So a lifestyle of freedom, a lifestyle of, you know, that gives you the ability to focus on things that are more important, like your family, traveling, having fun, experiences.

Natalie Cioffi (44:46.696)
us.

Branden Sewell (44:59.677)
And so, I mean, I'll be honest, I don't really like that people classify it as a lifestyle business because I even hear some people kind of throw shade on it like, well, like you could be more successful, but you just want a lifestyle business. It's like, well, are you really successful? I don't, I mean, just because you make more money, are you really successful? So anyway.

Natalie Cioffi (45:22.184)
Right.

Branden Sewell (45:24.253)
Let's kind of shift that conversation. We've talked a lot about the hiring, trusting employees and all of that. I want to jump into what it takes to grow a business on the sales side of things to experience that freedom because obviously, you have to know how to market your business. You have to know how to sell. Otherwise, you're not going to be able to support.

you know, having other people and employing other people, having employees because you have to bring the money in to support that. So, can you talk about some of the ways that you've marketed your business? How do you approach sales? How do you approach like the brand of CDJ, Genie services and, you know, sell that to the market?

Natalie Cioffi (46:18.184)
Yeah. So I never paid a penny for any marketing. I always did everything completely on social media through Facebook, through local neighborhood websites, not websites, local yard sale pages, stuff like that. I would just post about myself and that's what I did in Florida too. I posted a picture of myself, my husband, my kids, just talking about who I was, some background. You know,

As a business owner, it's really important that you differentiate yourself because like I said, there's a million different cleaning companies, there's a million different painting companies. How are you different? What do you bring to the table that's different? Right? So I really harp on that we show up when we're supposed to. We're police family owned. All of our employees are background checked. We're trustworthy. So that is something that I, which can be controversial too because some people don't like the police. So, you know, I realized that.

Some people, one thing that I do that's very controversial too for business owners, and you probably don't agree with me on this, I don't allow reviews on our page. I don't allow, if someone wants to say something nice in a message to us, I will copy and paste and put on there, but I do not allow the crazy people to go on there and bash me, my employees, or my business without merit.

I don't allow it. I think it's, I've seen businesses get completely trashed because people are insane. So I don't allow it. I never have. I've never needed to. It's never hurt me to my knowledge to not allow it. No one's ever said, well, why don't you, why can't I see five star ratings on your page? It's never been a thing. So that's something that I just, I don't, not on Yelp. I'm not on, I think Facebook allows you to, to,

Branden Sewell (47:40.093)
Mm -hmm.

Branden Sewell (47:47.357)
Mm -hmm.

Natalie Cioffi (48:09.192)
to start businesses too on your business site. So I have that all turned off. You know, if someone doesn't want to use us because they don't see five stars, that's on them. I'd rather send them referrals if they want to. We've been in business long enough to show our work. So that's just, yeah. Kelly and I actually went to Edge on that because she was like, we really need to have let people, I was like, no, I won't do it. I've seen so many.

Branden Sewell (48:12.573)
Yep.

Branden Sewell (48:33.181)
Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (48:39.88)
horrible things happen. And I don't want to fight for our honor on social media. Social media can take a horrible turn for your business.

Branden Sewell (48:51.389)
Yeah, that's good. I mean, that's super controversial. But I think I think I what I would say to that because I'm definitely on the side of like, I have reviews and I push it and I encourage other people to as well. But I think this goes back to like knowing what you want as a business owner. If you don't want that, then then you don't need it. Right? If you're

Natalie Cioffi (48:55.208)
Yeah.

Branden Sewell (49:19.357)
content with like where your business is at and you feel comfortable with how you're able to grow and scale it without that, then hats off to you. Like that's, you know, that's checking all the boxes for you now. But I know like if somebody came to me and they were like, Hey, how do I grow my business? I want to get more reviews while I tell them how right. But for somebody who doesn't want that, like what's the point, you know,

It does work, but it's not like the end all be all. There's other ways to grow your business. So I like that. Go ahead.

Natalie Cioffi (49:57.576)
I would just say that might be all they have too, right? Like I have, I already have what makes us special. I have that we're police family owned, trustworthy. That just, that puts something in people's head when they hear that, you know, that you don't usually see that when people are marketing themselves. Sometimes you'll see, just like being a vet, right? Veteran owned. People like that type of stuff that makes them different. If you don't have a specific thing, you know, I can't be like Cuban owned, cause I'm a hundred percent Cuban. No one cares about that.

Branden Sewell (50:04.413)
Mm -hmm.

Branden Sewell (50:20.509)
Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (50:27.496)
They care that we're pleased family -owned. So if I didn't have something specific like that, I can see how you would need to differentiate yourself by having those five stars, right? You need something of like, ooh, look at me, which we just play a different way, that's all.

Branden Sewell (50:28.061)
Yeah. Yeah.

Branden Sewell (50:36.637)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's good because at the end of the day, all reviews are is it's helping establish trust, right? So all you're doing is you're establishing that trust another way like when somebody thinks of, you know, or in most cases, like I know this can be kind of controversial in today's culture, but in most cases, when somebody thinks of the police, law enforcement, first responders, they think of like,

trust. This is somebody I can trust. They are going to be law abiding. They're going to be respectful of my home. They're going to be safe. And so it kind of like checks all the boxes. It's like law enforcement family is probably not out hiring felons. Right. So it's like, well, unless you wanted like a new way to like get people locked up. Right. But and I think that...

Natalie Cioffi (51:11.4)
right.

Natalie Cioffi (51:25.256)
Right. Correct.

Branden Sewell (51:37.213)
people like as a law enforcement family, when you're pushing that to as like a person who's hiring, well, chances are people who don't respect and obey the law are probably not going to be lining up at your front door to work for you. Like, hey, let me I like, you know, I showed up to my job interview or to the job site with like, you know, weed in my car and all of this stuff and or drugs like.

Natalie Cioffi (51:52.058)
Correct.

Branden Sewell (52:06.269)
Probably not the best company to do that with, right? So, no, I totally get what you're saying and I think that that's accurate. You have found that you don't need that and that's awesome. But for me, like you said, for me as the business owner, I don't have anything like that that I can establish trust on. So, my reviews help.

Natalie Cioffi (52:09.352)
Right.

You're welcome.

Natalie Cioffi (52:33.476)
Yeah.

Branden Sewell (52:35.677)
to establish that trust. That's really good. So obviously you guys are doing a great job with leveraging that. And I'm sure that I think you mentioned you guys do a lot of like community involvement. Can you speak to like how you get involved in the community to help to facilitate that growth in your company?

Natalie Cioffi (52:59.016)
Sure. Honestly, it's kind of been a while. So in Maryland, especially when I first started off, anytime I would see, let's say, someone on our neighborhood page posted, like a GoFundMe for someone, hey, our neighbor so -and -so recently just lost their husband, you know, feel free to donate here. I would just comment being like, hi, you know, while we can't, you know.

donate this way, we'd be happy to alleviate some stress for them and come in and offer them a free house cleaning. So we would do at least six to eight. And then we would also donate to nonprofits that are having fundraisers and stuff like that for their baskets and things like that. I did some of that in Florida when we first started out too. I just saw someone post like, hey, you know, raising money for such and such school. We're looking for donations. So we would donate in that capacity. So that has served us pretty well.

Branden Sewell (53:30.493)
That's good.

Natalie Cioffi (53:53.832)
So when I first came on too, there's something called Cleaning for a Reason. I became a part of that organization where cancer patients would go online, submit their application, and then Cleaning for a Reason would then in turn reach out to us and we would offer them two free cleanings. But I just cut out the middle man and just started doing it myself when I would see anything that someone just had an urgent need. Someone's kid's been hospitalized for the past week. How can we help them so they can come back to a...

clean safe home, you know that type stuff. So.

Branden Sewell (54:25.821)
Yeah, that's good. And you know, so I think you have two different types of approaches to marketing. Like when I first started out my business, I was very heavy into like paying for leads, paying for advertising. And I spent a lot of money, like six to eight grand a month, sometimes more if we are busy. Meaning like we were busy selling a lot of work and I had a lot of extra money that I could just throw at marketing.

So, I mean, I think there were months where I probably spent 12 grand. And, you know, it worked and I say this all the time, it worked until it didn't. And so we came to kind of ahead in 2022 where it was like it all kind of just wasn't working the way that it used to. And almost caused me to go out of business, but I quickly had to learn how important it is what you're talking about, which is like...

Learning how to build relationships, network, create a solid foundation of being involved in your community and just building those connections organically, right? With people, it's like what Kelly's doing down here with BNI. It's those referral partners, those personal connections that I think are really going to help your business in the long run.

to grow because what happened to me is I didn't have that foundation. I was basically just throwing money out there and then having all these leads come my way. But then when that fell apart, it's like I had nothing else to fall on. I hadn't built relationships in my community. I hadn't built connections and referral partners. And so I had to learn that later on in business and kind of go back and...

Natalie Cioffi (56:00.232)
Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (56:13.544)
and I'll talk to you guys soon.

Branden Sewell (56:19.837)
kind of start over in that sense. But yeah, so if you're listening to this as a young business owner, you know, you're trying to figure out how to get out of the field. One of the best things that you can do is is network, build relationships in your community, build relationships online, like Natalie, you mentioned those online Facebook groups and things like that.

be very active in those. I tell people that that's like the modern day like door to door, like, you know, you're kind of going into that neighborhood and you're going around and you're introducing yourself and telling people about the services that you offer. And it's like, it's the modern day door to door, people will talk to you on there before they'll talk to you when you knock on their door at their house. So

Natalie Cioffi (57:10.152)
And getting your employees involved too. So like I tell my girls all the time, I'm like, look, if you see someone looking for house cleaning, tag our name. I mean, it's just like a commercial, right? You can't get the jingle out of your head. The more and more, and that's more hours for them. This is not for me, this is for you. You want more? Let's build up so we can give you as much as possible, right? So if someone's looking, just like how you've tagged us and we've tagged you for services. If your employees also see something,

Branden Sewell (57:19.197)
Right.

Natalie Cioffi (57:39.944)
Even if you've already tagged the company name, the more people that tag the name, the better. I mean, that again speaks as a review because people are referring you. So that's another thing that I always encourage our employees to do and go on their Facebook page and invite all their friends to like our page so that way it'll just stay fresh. And content's huge too. You do that as well. Social media content. So.

Branden Sewell (57:50.717)
Right.

Branden Sewell (58:00.413)
Yeah.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I think referrals are like gold. I mean, we probably have our highest conversion rate with any type of referral business because typically, you know, like if we talk about BNI, typically a customer has done business and has built trust with one of our referral partners and they know, like and trust them. So they're going to be more likely to trust their referral.

because they're basing it off of like their character. This person, like I have a relationship with them. I've done business with them. You know, I don't think they would refer me to somebody that they couldn't trust. So yeah, it's definitely very foundational and very healthy for your business to do. Well, I want to be respectful of your time and we're kind of coming down to the end of...

this interview, I want to kind of open up the floor for you really quick to share any final advice that you would give maybe insights, whether it's insights on starting a business, you know, sales, marketing, production, employees, like whatever, how you like how you started the location with Kelly, whatever you would want to share that you feel would bring value to the listeners and help them to to get off the ladder.

Natalie Cioffi (59:29.832)
Yeah, I mean really just like I was saying before, just starting small, you know, I was running this business out of my garage before we bought our office and it's hard, right? Because you want to have the office right away. You want to have the truck. You want to have all these things. But that's why these small businesses don't work out a lot of the times because you leap in right away without building that foundation and it really can hurt you. I mean,

If you're one of the lucky ones where you can go all in and you're successful off the bat, that's awesome. But beautiful things take time and give yourself grace and just go for it. I mean, don't get discouraged after the first year. Don't get discouraged after the second year. You know, we went through a pandemic with our business. I went from, I want to say 32 employees and we're still trying to build that back up. I only have 14 here in Maryland right now. That is really stressful for me.

because the client is coming in and no one wants to work anymore and everyone wants to work from home and or get paid a lot of money to not work or you know, the work ethic has been since COVID. I mean, it's been insane. It's been a complete turnaround. But I'm still plugging away, you know, you still got to push and know that this too shall pass. So, I mean, that's really all.

Branden Sewell (01:00:29.757)
Yeah.

Branden Sewell (01:00:48.541)
Yeah.

Branden Sewell (01:00:55.357)
Yeah.

Natalie Cioffi (01:00:56.488)
That's really all I've got. And also know too, like if you do it and then you realize this isn't for you, that's okay too. You're not a failure. It's not, just because your business doesn't work out doesn't mean that you are not cut out to be a business owner. Sometimes things just don't work out. But you know, give it your all. And like I said, give yourself some grace and you know, Brandon, I mean, it's tough. You just gotta, you gotta push through. How bad do you want it?

Branden Sewell (01:01:14.333)
Mm -hmm.

Natalie Cioffi (01:01:26.152)
You know?

Branden Sewell (01:01:26.265)
Yeah, yeah, that's really good. You know, I like a lot of the things that you said, me, myself, I can definitely relate to, you know, losing the employees. I went from 13 down to none during 2022 and had to rebuild. And then also, you know, at the end of the day, the challenges that you face, it's either going to help like...

build you up and prepare you for what's next, or you're gonna decide like, this isn't what I want, and you're gonna step away. And that's fine. Give yourself grace to keep moving forward, but also give yourself grace to quit if it's not for you. And I think only you can determine that as a business owner, like when have you had enough? And so that's really good. I think that's great advice for the listeners.

I think it would be great to maybe have you on at another time because I think you have a lot of wisdom that you could share. I'd love to jump into like, even what COVID looked like post COVID and how you're handling that as a business owner because I think there's a lot of business owners that are in a very similar place. And just how much how much different things look now. So I think it would be probably good to get you on another date to another episode and

kind of dive into that. But anyway, thank you so much for just being willing to give your time and share some wisdom and insights to my listeners. And, you know, lastly, before we close this out, could you just share if somebody wants to connect with you or reach out and maybe ask questions? Is there a way that somebody could reach out and maybe chat with you?

Natalie Cioffi (01:03:15.495)
Yeah. So I don't know if there's a way to put like my email address or something like that across the podcast. Yep. So it's N and my last name, CIOFFI at CDJGENEServices .com. And obviously feel free to reach out anytime. I mean, we're all in this together, right? It's the same, same, what do they say? Same boat, different ocean or something like that. But, you know.

Branden Sewell (01:03:21.789)
Yeah, sure, I can put that in the notes.

Branden Sewell (01:03:41.981)
something.

Natalie Cioffi (01:03:43.528)
We're all, we all got to go up and down and I'm sure I could learn things from, from you guys too. I mean, I don't know everything. I'm still learning. I'm still making mistakes. I'm still growing. you know, when you think you take a step forward, you could take it five steps back. I mean, that's just the name of the game. So thank you so much for having me on Brandon. I would love to do this again and pick your brain as well, you know, with just cause we're not in the same line of business, being a small business owner is being a small business owner. So I appreciate it.

Branden Sewell (01:03:59.165)
Yeah.

Branden Sewell (01:04:11.645)
Yeah, yeah, for sure. A lot of the same challenges and struggles. So for sure, we'll connect again. And so if you're watching this, I really appreciate you listening to the Author Ladder podcast. If you're watching on YouTube, please subscribe to the channel, like this video, share it, comment, share your feedback, let us know what you think. Also share it with somebody else so that they can learn.

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