David Abel: Adventures & Misadventures - Cuba to Cape Cod (To in the Whale!)

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Adventure Diaries Season 2 Episode 6 with David Abel, award-winning journalist and filmmaker

Episode Summary:

In this episode of Adventure Diaries, host Chris Watson interviews David Abel, a celebrated journalist and filmmaker known for his in-depth storytelling. David shares his journey from studying philosophy and political science to becoming an award-winning journalist. He discusses his early career covering protests in Mexico City, his dramatic experiences in Cuba, and his impactful work on the Boston Marathon bombing. David also delves into his environmental documentaries, including the award-winning "Entangled," and his latest projects, "In the Whale" and "Inundation District." This episode offers a deep dive into the world of storytelling, journalism, and environmental advocacy.

Key Takeaways:

• David Abel is an award-winning journalist and filmmaker with a diverse body of work.
• He began his journalism career after a pivotal moment inspired by a journalist's incisive questioning.
• Abel's early career included covering major protests in Mexico City and reporting under challenging conditions in Cuba, which led to his deportation.
• One of his significant works includes covering the Boston Marathon bombing, focusing on the Richard family, which earned him the Ernie Pyle Award.
• Abel is known for his environmental advocacy through his films, particularly "Entangled," which highlights the plight of the North Atlantic right whales.
• His latest projects include "In the Whale," about a lobster diver swallowed by a humpback whale, and "Inundation District," addressing climate change impacts on Boston.

Call to Adventure:

• "One of my favorite things in the world to do is to swim in waterfalls. And I love whenever I'm traveling to find a hike that ends with a waterfall and a pool and just hang out with the cold water, sort of giving you a nice shower. It's the best way to end the hike."
• "There's one that I guess I'm thinking of, which is in the Dominican Republic... there was this waterfall called Salto Baiguate... it was just this green, tropical green water, and the water was really warm."
• "I also remember going to one in Thailand, where there was like a series, it was a hike near Chiang Mai... there's like a series of seven or so waterfalls."

Pay It Forward:

• "My wife runs this wonderful organization where she brings together kids from all over Boston and gets them to do something that they never thought they could do, which is to complete this race. And in a couple of weeks, her annual 5K is coming up."
• "Not become complacent and recognize that our... many, many years now of pumping fossil fuels into our atmosphere is radically changing our environment.

Transcript

Chris Watson (00:03.86)
So that is us live now.

Chris Watson (00:10.332)
David Abel, welcome to the Adventure Diaries. How are you?

David Abel (00:15.19)
Great. Thank you for having me.

Chris Watson (00:17.548)
Excellent, thank you. It's a pleasure and I've been really glad to secure your time today. I've been really excited about this conversation and some of the environmental and natural world content which we'll come on to. Before we do just a quick introduction for those that may not know who you are. You're an award-winning journalist. You've been a long-standing member of the Boston Globe.

and you've done some really incredible documentary work as well, which I want to come on to later in the show, particularly around some of your filmmaking and the production of the film Entangled, the Plight of the Right Whales in the North Atlantic. And a fascinating story, which I couldn't believe was real in The Whale, the Michael Packard story about being swallowed up by a whale.

But some of your human interest stories as well that have been covered in the Boston Globe, particularly the Richard family and the terrible things that happened around the Boston Bollings. But probably a lot to unpack there, but before we do, do you want to just maybe give us a bit of an intro on your own words and how you go into the world of journalism and documentary filmmaking?

David Abel (01:38.638)
Sure. So let's see how I got into the world of telling stories for a living. First of all, it's a privilege and And a great honor to be able to tell stories for a living and I Wasn't quite sure exactly what I wanted to do when I was in college

And I studied philosophy and political science. And I like to say that it left me with a hunger to repair the world, but no actual skills to do that. And I moved from the Midwest in the United States after college to San Francisco, where I started writing.

writing poetry and working on a novel. And after a while of doing that, it felt like I needed to reach beyond myself and really learn how to tell stories in a non-Solephistic way. And there were kind of this confluence of events that came together.

uh one day um, there was a visit to san francisco by this uh, russian ultra nationalist by the name of vladimir zhirinovsky and uh, and some people at that point thought he might be the next leader of russia uh, I think this was before vladimir putin took power and um And to make a long story short

He gave this speech that was filled with all this racist, bombastic language. And at the end, there was this guy that went to the microphone to ask a question, and he had shaggy hair, and he was wearing an old blazer with elbow patches, and he proceeded to ask the most piercing questions that—

David Abel (04:02.49)
that it really impressed me and left a mark on my mind and made me think, I want to do that. And he of course was a reporter for the local newspaper. And and then around the same time I was reading a novel by the late, recently late Czech novelist

David Abel (04:32.366)
uh, um Uh called the 11th commandment and it was all about how Uh in his words thou shalt answer the journalist's question Uh, and there was this notion, uh, at least in this in the novel that he wrote that in a democracy there There's this sort of privileged and special cast of people the journalists Who have this rare position?

to ask very personal and exacting and difficult questions of people from all walks of life, whether public officials or the homeless. And it was a way of learning about the world to me that didn't make you seem creepy, because you were expected to ask.

questions and Milan Kundera considered a question like a bridge to understanding and that really resonated with me and so I ended up deciding to apply to a few journalism programs and I did a master's in journalism and then started working at a newspaper my first newspaper in Mexico City where I spent about a year learning the ropes of

of journalism, where I often spent the day writing about all kinds of major protests and written about so many protests at that point against the authoritarian, then very authoritarian government in Mexico, that I was almost ready to join the Zapatistas, this sort of indigenous rebel group that

was rising up at that point. But I can keep going, but maybe I'll stop there.

Chris Watson (06:45.329)
So on the study of journalism, how did that... because journalism and storytelling, do they go hand in hand or are they very distinct disciplines? Because there are some journalists that don't tell great stories at all, they just report the facts, but I think your work really tells the story, especially the human interest story, so where did storytelling angle come from?

David Abel (07:08.182)
Yeah, um we I guess journalists come at the profession from different, uh for different reasons and Telling stories was always a big uh a big source of Different stories serve different purposes and there's no question that

David Abel (07:38.018)
Some stories require deep Narrative threads and arcs and other stories are just the facts other stories are about holding the government to account Casting light in dark places. So so for me What makes a story compelling is often in the detail and

many stories to really rise above require us to understand the characters that we're writing about deeply.

Chris Watson (08:22.568)
Rolling back again to your time in Central America, did I read something about you were almost deported from Cuba or you did get deported from Cuba for some of your storytelling?

David Abel (08:37.194)
Yes, so I stopped at Mexico, but after I left Mexico, I ended up moving to the central highlands of the Dominican Republic because there was a kind of coup d'etat on my family's then pepper farm. But that's a really long story. And I spent about six months trying to take care.

put down the coup and helped my father out, even though I knew nothing about farming. And then ended up going back to journalism, although there was a brief moment where I had to make a decision. I was like 22 or 23. I had just left my first journalism job and suddenly found myself running this pepper farm in...

this very beautiful mountainous area in the Dominican Republic where I had a star fruit tree in my front yard. I had access to horses. I had a shiny red motorcycle. And every morning this woman, uh, brought me a freshly, uh, brewed smoothie with a kiss on my cheek. And, uh, and it was not a bad deal. And I, and I gave some serious thought to maybe staying on continuing to do that.

But I had just started off this career as a reporter and a writer and this was this felt like my path and so when things got in order I ended up leaving and going to work for my first newspaper in the States in South Florida where covered a small community on the edge of the Everglades and

And that was a really instructive experience where I got to see how.

David Abel (10:34.102)
excuse me, I got to see how we as human beings could radically transform such a wild landscape. And after about a year of doing that and covering the police beat, I sort of was yearning to go back to Latin America. And it seemed at that point, this was in the late 90s, that there was an opening in Cuba. And I went with a girlfriend.

for a week to Cuba where Americans typically are not allowed at that point. But there's a gray zone because if you're a reporter, the US government at that point was happy for you to go and it was easy for you to get authorization to go or you didn't actually need authorization. You just had to show you were a journalist. But from the Cuban point of view, they were eager to have American tourists but not necessarily American journalists. So

I went to Cuba as a writer and my girlfriend at the time and I hatched a plan to quit our jobs in South Florida and moved to Cuba. She chickened out and I went. And I spent about six months doing all the kinds of things that I think a lot of reporters dream about, which is essentially casting light on a place where...

Chris Watson (11:43.766)
Thank you.

David Abel (11:59.498)
There was no freedom of speech where people would go to prison for, uh, for saying things that violated government ideology or offended, uh, government officials. And, uh, and I, uh, did that, uh, until I succeeded in pissing off the government officials to the point that, uh, they, they had enough of me. In fact, uh, what happened was

Chris Watson (12:22.52)
I'm sorry.

David Abel (12:28.59)
I left and come back and I come back to write about the first legal celebration of Christmas and the 40th, I think what was then going to be the 40th anniversary of the revolution. And I was in the country for less than 24 hours. And it seemed that the person that I felt really badly actually, the woman who stamped my passport and allowed me into the country was with the police who came to find me.

And I'm not sure exactly how they found me, but they found me the next morning and took me away on their old Soviet style Lada and drove me back to the airport and detained me until I left. But I was still able to file my story, the main stories that I came there for, because I did a lot of interviews that night. I was able to write about this one family and their celebration of...

Chris Watson (12:58.996)
Thanks for watching!

David Abel (13:27.374)
uh of Christmas Eve and unfortunately I had started writing the story late that night and they put my computer through some machine that pretty much erased all the content on my screen so I had to rewrite it furiously to make the deadline for Christmas uh but anyway that's the story of my deportation from Cuba.

Chris Watson (13:54.16)
It didn't sound like it was anything particularly spicy, the story, just... were they just so paranoid about the American viewpoint? I suppose it was very difficult times there, the relationships between the US and Cuba. I think being American alone probably led to that.

David Abel (14:15.586)
Well, yeah, I don't know if it was so much a problem that I was an American. I think the problem was that I was writing stories that were not flattering to the government. And I know that because once I was, I'd written a story, I'd written a bunch of stories that were increasingly more critical of the government.

And for example, I wrote a story about this elderly couple that had the first independent library where they circulated books that the government didn't approve of in Santiago de Cuba, which is the second largest city in Cuba in the East. And a bunch of other stories, including farmers, independent farmers that

Chris Watson (14:56.645)
Mm.

David Abel (15:11.946)
refused to sell their produce to the government cooperatives. And so that was considered illegal at the time, I think. And to make a long story short, I was once hauled into state security headquarters. I was left a note telling me I had to be somewhere at a certain time. And when I got there,

after making me wait in front of their office for like three hours, there was a lot of important looking large men with epaulettes on their shoulders and green military uniforms who described who told me that they were like, what we would say what we would describe in our country is the FBI. And so I was like, Oh, mucho gusto.

And they had stories I'd written that were translated from English into Spanish. And they, I'll never forget the guy behind the desk as he was smoking a cigar and blowing the smoke in my face, would pound on his desk and say, son mentiras, these are lies. And as he would read back some of my stories and he asked me why I wasn't visiting their beautiful beaches.

And I assured him I would be happy to visit their beautiful beaches. Anyway, it went it went south from there.

Chris Watson (16:42.312)
So.

Chris Watson (16:45.529)
Were these published in papers in Cuba or was this back in the States that you were publishing?

David Abel (16:51.622)
It was back in the States. So it's actually where I started writing from Boston Globe and I think what actually Initially sparked what got the attention of the Cuban authorities? Was I was writing for newspapers all over the United States as a freelancer One of the newspapers I was writing for was the Miami Herald and the Miami Herald, which is a great Pulitzer Prize winning newspaper Is also considered like an enemy of the revolution

Chris Watson (16:53.574)
Yeah.

Yeah.

David Abel (17:19.438)
particularly during the days of Fidel Castro. And my agreement with the Miami Herald was that they wouldn't publish my byline in the stories, but one day, I think somehow they made a mistake and they published my byline. And after that, I started to notice some strange things like the place where I was staying, someone clearly had been searching through my...

Chris Watson (17:31.066)
Ugh.

Chris Watson (17:39.689)
Skillboy era.

David Abel (17:50.058)
my stuff and books that I had were not in the same place. I had left them, all kinds of crazy stuff.

Chris Watson (17:58.917)
It's mad that becomes a story in its own right. It seems like a scene from a James Bond movie. Like that whole at Heskett.

David Abel (18:06.23)
Yeah, not quite as glamorous. I wasn't wearing Armani suits or drinking martinis every half hour. But there were a lot of beautiful women.

Chris Watson (18:12.375)
I'm out.

Chris Watson (18:20.968)
Okay.

Chris Watson (18:24.654)
Have you been back to Cuba since?

David Abel (18:27.154)
Unfortunately, no. I was essentially told I couldn't come back. Although, I hope the statute of limitations now has expired because my wife and I have sometimes talked about going and maybe taking our kids. I think things have eased up a bit now compared to how they were some years ago. But my-

Chris Watson (18:35.134)
Ha ha.

David Abel (18:56.426)
My chief concern is that I get there, and especially if I go with my family. And they basically send me away. So I don't know how to really test the waters without losing a trip, essentially.

Chris Watson (19:13.348)
but it's probably not worth it. But I think there's always that, should I test it. I think I would be tempted to go just to see what happens. But anyway.

David Abel (19:23.262)
Yeah, I will. I likely will at some point.

Chris Watson (19:27.04)
Yeah, good, good. So, how long have you been with the Boston Globe then, David?

David Abel (19:33.954)
So I started writing for the Globe in the late 90s and then moved to Boston full time in 1999. And started and have been a staff writer there for years. But just last year I actually took a job as a professor of journalism at Boston University. So I'm still writing for the paper, but now essentially have three jobs, which is.

teaching and writing for the paper and making films.

Chris Watson (20:08.972)
Yes, excellent. It's a fantastic trifecta. So in terms of the stories that you go after and you hunt out, have you naturally drifted towards some of the natural, you know, world stuff? So, you know, the things to do with like the fishing scene and stuff, or has that just been fortunate there's been a story there? Or is it something that you're genuinely interested in?

David Abel (20:34.498)
So I've covered all sorts of things over the years. Obviously, I started my career in Latin America. And after my deportation, I moved to Washington and began covering national security issues and covered the Pentagon for a while, covered the war over the former renegade Yugoslavian province Kosovo.

And then when I moved to Boston, I started covering, I've covered all different kinds of beats, including academia and poverty issues, terrorism at the Boston Marathon, and I also covered 9-11, the attacks in New York City and Washington, and then eventually,

As we began to notice our climate started changing in a very marked way, I began covering the environment. And for more than a decade now, I have covered all kinds of environmental issues for the Boston Globe. And the through line of that coverage has been climate change.

Chris Watson (21:56.852)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, some of your short films are fantastic. I think, what can I come on to that? So, because I'm not going to jump too far ahead. If I could roll back and maybe ask you to maybe tell us a little bit about the Boston Marathons and the work you've done with the Richard family and their story. I think that is that the one that you won the Ernie Pyle Award for the coverage on that? Could you tell us a little bit about that if you don't mind?

David Abel (22:20.311)
Yes.

David Abel (22:25.346)
Sure. So about now 10 years ago, I was on leave from the globe doing something called a fellowship, a Nieman Fellowship at Harvard University, where you get to study anything that you want at Harvard, essentially. And it was around that time that I was starting to be encouraged at the globe to experiment.

using video with my stories. And I was fortunate enough to be able to take a class learning the grammar of filmmaking. And for the final project for that class, I was making a short film about the first little person to run the Boston Marathon. I'd run the Boston Marathon several times and had written stories because I was just really drawn to the marathon.

For years, I would write sort of a setup story for the paper about the upcoming marathon. And so I spent a few months filming this amazing young woman as she aspired to be the first little person to complete the Boston Marathon. And then on the day of the marathon, I was with her from very early in the morning as she was getting up and getting ready. And then I...

traveled with her on the bus out to the starting line and then uh got a ride to the halfway point where I tried to film her and then to the finish line where I was uh waiting for her to cross and have this historic triumphant ending of this short film project that I was working on and as I was standing on the finish line, uh waiting for that moment, uh

all of a sudden a bomb exploded about 15 to 20 steps from where I was standing. And then a second bomb exploded. And if you've ever seen any of the footage of the aftermath of the bombings, you've probably seen some of my footage from that day. And I wrote a story about an eyewitness account for the paper and decided to spend the next year essentially

David Abel (24:49.934)
covering the aftermath of that very terrible moment and how it affected so many people in our city. And there was one family that was likely affected more than just about any other family in our city. And it was this family, the Richards, and they lost their eight-year-old son to one of the bombs.

their seven-year-old daughter at the time, who I recently actually just had a Zoom call with and I'm helping her with her college essay. As you know, I'm applying for college and we've kept in touch all these years. The seven-year-old daughter lost her leg. The older brother who was 11 at the time, physically was fine, but has had to live with what he witnessed. The mother lost an eye.

Chris Watson (25:29.546)
That's fantastic.

David Abel (25:49.687)
and or is blinded in one eye and the father lost some of his hearing. And so I spent about six months following with them, following them leading up to the first anniversary and wrote a long moving narrative about their experience, their journey throughout that year. And

and back essentially to the marathon, where they decided to essentially try to turn this horrible experience into something good by giving back to the community. That gave a lot to them.

Chris Watson (26:37.076)
I mean, that's a fantastic piece of work, not just for the fact as a journalist and it's a piece of content, but I think the emotional side to it and the fact that it has kind of paid stuff forward and just to hear that you're still in touch with the daughter and helping all these years later is really something, David. Yeah, I mean, how was that? I mean, that must have been fairly emotional for everybody involved in that throughout that year.

David Abel (26:57.858)
Thank you.

Chris Watson (27:07.993)
I mean, how did that take its toll on you as a journalist? Because you obviously must have had to navigate some tough boundaries and stuff throughout that. How was it?

David Abel (27:20.246)
Yeah, I know it was an incredibly difficult story to cover. I often, when I recount that story, still have to fight back tears. It left a deep imprint on me and on our city. And for me, it also led to my first films and I made a short film initially.

called 25.7 in Twice the Steps, which was about the subject of my stories, of my short class project, it was sort of what became of her experience. And then I continued to follow her because that story, that film didn't quite have the right ending. And that led to my first feature film.

when I actually ran the marathon the next year with the subject of the film and nearly collapsed at the end after carrying a camera the entire way. And that film was about her experience, but also about the city coming back, and that was called Undaunted. And the short answer to your question is that

It was an incredibly difficult year, but for me, telling stories and telling the stories of how people came together, how people were coping with their injuries, how people, you know, the investigation and the arrests of at least one of the, and the trial of one of the suspects, all of those things came together for me as a way of

Chris Watson (29:04.648)
Hmm.

David Abel (29:13.546)
really dealing with the trauma that I experienced. And I think by being able to tell other people's stories, by being able to serve some role in our community was a way for me to deal with that experience and help me heal, I think.

Chris Watson (29:35.56)
Fantastic. How has the community and how has it been received? So that piece of work and considering what, you know, what, 10, 11 years on or whatever, 10 years on from it now. So how is the city first of all, when it comes to the anniversary of the of the marathon, is it seen as a bit of a. You know, it must be difficult, especially how is the city really?

David Abel (30:04.37)
I think the city is strong and time heals a lot of wounds. There are obviously things that will never heal, including the very real physical wounds that many people have to live with from that day. But things change and relationships really...

grew in a lot of ways out of that experience. And I think it's a different city than it was that day. But it also, for me, I don't know what it's like in Scotland when you go to a different city, but in the States, sometimes there are cities that are very accepting. I grew up in New York and you're in New York for five minutes and you're a New Yorker.

in Boston you can live here for a decade and never be a Bostonian and It wasn't in some ways until that day that I really felt like this was my city that this was my home that this was You know a place I belong

Chris Watson (31:20.329)
Amazing. So just closing this out, then on reflection, if there's one thing you would like people to take away from your work on that day and what you've done with the Richards family and stuff, what would that be?

David Abel (31:36.31)
Oh, I don't know how to reduce it to just one thing. I mean, I think, yeah, I mean, I just say that, you know, there are a lot of people who are living with that day as people all over the world, unfortunately, live with the...

Chris Watson (31:42.972)
And that's fine, yeah. That's fine.

David Abel (32:04.238)
the impacts of terrorism or violence. And for me, I had an upfront seat to how some of the bravest people have dealt with some of the most searing pain. And that's probably what I'm most impressed by and what I'm in awe of in some ways.

Chris Watson (32:33.628)
Well, yeah, thank you. I think, you know, it's an incredible, incredible story, some incredible work. You've done it justice, and obviously the recognition and validation through the industry and the Ernie Perle Award speaks volumes for that. And I recommend that people check it out if they haven't already.

David Abel (32:54.606)
Thank you.

Chris Watson (32:56.016)
So, moving on, so some of the other work that you've done, I wanted to kind of touch on the entangled movie, which actually won the Jackson Weld Award. And for those that again may not appreciate that, it's deemed the Oscars for the kind of natural world really. So it's quite a prestigious recognition for that.

Do you want to talk us through what inspired you to delve into that story about the plight of the North Atlantic right wheels?

David Abel (33:33.774)
Sure. So a few years ago, the United Nations released this report that was really mind-blowing. It suggested that by the end of this century, we are likely to lose more than a million species. And I wrote a front-page story at The Globe about this report.

the words on the page didn't seem to somehow match the enormity of its findings. And I began to think how in the world do you tell a story about that magnitude of loss? And I started to think, well, maybe you can tell that story through one species, one species that...

people, human beings seem to identify with the so-called charismatic mega fauna like a great whale. And I also around that time was writing quite a bit about the plight of the North Atlantic right whale which inhabits the waters off of the coast of New England and where I live and the numbers were plummeting.

and a lot of scientists have feared and still fear that this great whale was on a path toward extinction if we did not do something to change that. And I started to learn a lot about the causes of the premature deaths of these whales and...

And one of the leading causes of that was entanglement in fishing lines, and particularly the fishing lines that come from one of our country's most valuable fisheries, the lobster industry. And there are literally millions of these vertical buoy lines, the lines that go from the traps at the bottom of the sea to the buoys at the surface.

David Abel (35:59.222)
and these lines were entangling lots of these whales and other marine mammals, either seriously injuring them or killing them. And so I started to learn more about this conflict and thought this would be a good way to tell a story that we're likely to see more of, which is

conflict between a vital conservation concern and a vital commercial interest, and how our federal government and state governments are trying to navigate that tricky balance.

I'm just gonna be right back.

David Abel (37:07.798)
Sorry, I just had to blow my nose.

Chris Watson (37:10.489)
No problem.

Chris Watson (37:16.112)
I'm just taking a drink as well, I've got a tickly throat myself. Yeah, so, you're kind of picking up, they are, I mean, the short film, I think the stats at the time were something like 400 whales in terms of the population expecting, I think the projection that they would be potentially extinct.

within 20 years. I think in my research in prepping for the show that looks like that is actually happening already. I think it's dropped down to just over 300. There's about 70 presumed reproductive females in the waters at the minute so I think that documentary is actually unfortunately coming to bear. What's your views on that? How was the documentary being...

Sorry, let me back up. I know that there was some conflict between the fisheries and the conservationists and stuff. What was your experience of that in creating the film?

David Abel (38:24.662)
Oh, there's no question that there's very heated conflict. And since the film was broadcast, I have felt that tension as well. I have had death threats sent to me and lots of anger. There was the lobster industry tried to create this repost to...

the film entangled, which they titled The Weaponization of the Right Whale, and suggesting that our film was unfairly sullying the lobstermen when I think our film went out of its way to be fair-minded and reflect on the potential dangers of over-regulation or the potential

dangers of any regulation and impact on fishermen. It's tricky because I don't think anybody here wants to see the demise of this vital part of our economy, this very long historic tradition of fathers, sons, and now daughters and mothers lobstering. It's a part of our culture here, and I certainly don't wanna see that end.

the issue is how do you how do you stop the damage um from these vertical buoy lines to our uh um our great whales that you know we they're on our license plates here in Massachusetts uh and uh it's just you know this species that i don't think anybody including the lobstermen

want to see disappear.

Chris Watson (40:25.008)
Yeah, the impact in the wider ecosystem should not be misunderstood, you know, what these animals contribute to the ecosystem in terms of that cycle. You know, who knows, if they go extinct, what would happen in the next five to ten years, what would that do to the lobster population potentially? So there's got to be an open line of communication and it just seems that both sides, unfortunately, because this is the same in fishing waters across the world, isn't it?

David Abel (40:36.959)
Absolutely.

Chris Watson (40:55.04)
I think you also done a piece on the conflict between the US and Canada over the waters. I think there's always an argument on both sides, but it's trying to find a middle ground to have these parties have a constructive dialogue to find a way forward. And all the while, since you're a film, it looks like that isn't really happening. And unfortunately, those white whales are at greater risk of extinction.

David Abel (41:26.291)
Absolutely right.

Chris Watson (41:32.912)
So from that, I mean again a similar question, what would you, if you had an ask for people that have watched that or are interested in the conservation, without getting into conflict, is there anything that people can do to help that plight somehow or are we just at the mercy of nature?

David Abel (41:56.486)
Yeah, I mean, just today as it happens, you know, I think a lot of public pressure on the federal government to do to take action has led to led to new efforts to try to protect the right whale and I just wrote a little something on Twitter about how the federal government today just announced an historic amount of money 82 million dollars That they have set aside

to try to promote the protection of North Atlantic right whales. And that is, I think, partly from all the pressure and the reporting on the plight of the North Atlantic right whales population. When I first started making the film in 2019, there was an estimated, I think, 419 right whales. The last estimate was...

fewer than 340 will get an updated estimate in the next few weeks as to the ultimate, what the population is today. But there are, as you said, I think fewer than 70 breeding females. So there's a lot of significant dangers to the species, but this massive amount of funding will hopefully help and create, lead to new technologies that will make it

unnecessary to use vertical buoy lines. And that's the hope.

Chris Watson (43:31.516)
Excellent. Do you feel that you've contributed towards that? That you've left a mark on how the government have responded?

David Abel (43:39.123)
I hope so.

Chris Watson (43:41.412)
Yeah, yeah, it looks like it, it looks like it. So along the same theme with whales, in the whale, the film, the story of Michael Packard, I mean, I can't believe that actually happened, because there's many a fables and old tales about this happening, but this actually happened, and you've created a short film around it. Do you want to give us a quick synopsis?

and tell us about that.

David Abel (44:13.346)
Sure, sure, no, it's actually a feature film, feature length film, I think you might have seen, yeah, Sizzle for the film. But yeah, in a couple of weeks, we're gonna be releasing a film, two films actually, that I've been working on for the past two years. And one of them is this amazing story about the last remaining Cape Cod lobster diver, who, commercial lobster diver, who,

Chris Watson (44:17.136)
I fit for a yes, Oli. You took the A.

Yeah.

David Abel (44:42.102)
Two summers ago, on his third dive up the morning, was heading down to search the bottom of the sea for lobsters that he grabs with his hands and puts in a lobster bag, when all of a sudden his world went completely black and he was swallowed or engulfed in the mouth of a humpback whale and was inside this

humpback whale for nearly a minute and saw his life pass before his eyes. And then he was spat out, literally sort of thrown out at the surface and because of all the air pressure that expanded in his dry suit, literally shot out fins first into the air according to the eyewitnesses.

And so I spent the last two years making a film about what happens to a human being who experiences one of the most frightening things that can possibly happen to anyone. And who gets thrust into the international news media. And how he sort of comes back from that and deals with.

that as the limelight fades. And that's just a crazy story. And then another film actually that we're about to release next month is another film about climate change. And this film is about how one city decided, one city that probably has more climate scientists per capita than any other city on the planet.

decided to build an entirely new urban district at sea level, on landfill, hard on the coast, and arguably because of the way gravity works, in the bullseye of rising sea levels. And it was all built.

Chris Watson (46:52.952)
What city is this?

David Abel (46:57.522)
And this city is my city, Boston, which despite having all our scientists at Harvard, MIT, and Boston University and elsewhere, many of these people telling the city it might not be wise to spend billions of dollars building an entirely new urban district. And yet we did. And we're still doing that.

and there are no real defenses against the rising seas at this point. And that still raises the question.

Chris Watson (47:33.776)
That's a follow the money story. Yeah, that's a follow the money story, if ever I've heard it.

David Abel (47:40.498)
Yeah, the film raises the question of, you know, who... It's a film ultimately about environmental justice and who should have to pay to defend this city, this neighborhood that was built well after we all knew about the dangers, and who should eventually have to pay when the ultimate flooding comes.

Chris Watson (48:07.188)
So those two films, David, where? Because I haven't been able to see in the whale yet, so has that not been screened publicly yet? Or is it coming? What's the status on that?

David Abel (48:19.938)
So, In the Whale will be released, so we did have one public screening so far, and that was at the Provincetown Film Festival on Cape Cod, and that was a few months ago, and that was a work in progress screening, but the actual full film will be released at the New Hampshire Film Festival in Portsmouth, New Hampshire,

Chris Watson (48:40.79)
Okay.

David Abel (48:50.774)
in less than a month. And I'll put in the chat here, the link to the, for listeners, they can watch the sizzle and see more about the film. And we'll eventually be bringing both of these films to hopefully an international audience. So if anyone in Scotland wants to fly me over, I'm happy to talk about either.

Chris Watson (48:53.137)
Ah, ah good, okay so, so it's coming.

David Abel (49:19.318)
films.

Chris Watson (49:20.624)
Yeah, excellent. That might be an option. I can think of it. I've got an idea on some cracking venues potentially. Come to the climate change one in a minute, but how did you film the...

David Abel (49:37.354)
I should just say one thing, there is a Scottish part to Indundation District. So I went to Glasgow for the film when COP26 was there. And so spent a good amount of time. And there are two scenes from Glasgow, in Indundation District, which is the name of the film about the impact of rising seas on Boston. The film.

Chris Watson (49:48.509)
That's my home.

David Abel (50:06.49)
that neighborhood was dubbed Innovation District, and we have renamed it the Inundation District.

Chris Watson (50:07.418)
I know.

Chris Watson (50:21.617)
Oh, thanks. Glasgow was my home city. That's where I'm sitting at this moment in time.

Did you spend much time here? Or was it a flying visit?

David Abel (50:32.106)
Um, well, it was, it was, it was quick and it was mostly centered around, uh, covering cop 26. Uh, but I did get around and got to take some, some morning runs through, uh, the, this beautiful park in the center of Glasgow, uh, where there are all these bridges over this river and castles and, uh, I was very impressed.

Chris Watson (50:58.6)
Yeah.

Chris Watson (51:01.828)
Excellent. Good, good, good. The city is full of parks. It's an old Victorian thing. Yeah, it's a very beautiful city. Excellent. So back to what was the name of the film about climate change and the work in Boston?

David Abel (51:20.206)
Did I lose you?

David Abel (51:28.758)
Sorry, I think I lost you there for a minute.

Chris Watson (51:36.28)
and orientation district.

David Abel (51:41.246)
Yeah. Um, do you want to rephrase the question? Cause I don't think I got it.

Chris Watson (51:42.442)
I think this is it.

Chris Watson (51:47.628)
Yeah, I think the signal's breaking up. I was just asking the name of the other movie, but it's Inundation District, is that correct?

David Abel (51:58.734)
Yes, yes.

Chris Watson (52:01.008)
Yeah, good, good. We'll get that linked as well. So conscious of time, David, and want to be respectful of your time. So in terms of what the future holds, have you got any other projects or stories of interest that you're that you're looking forward to working on that you can share?

David Abel (52:23.598)
So right now I'm just trying to get these two films over the finish line. We're close and doing some final work on each of them. And so my project is just bringing these films into the world over the coming months. But I've also been working on two children's books. And one of them is about climate change. And it's all about...

It's a book based on the true story of my six-year-old son discovering a cold-stun sea turtle on a beach on Cape Cod. And we are increasingly having these endangered sea turtles known as Kemp's Ridley sea turtles wash up on our shores.

around the in late fall, as our summers last longer and the waters stay warmer longer and the turtles don't have the same signals that they used to have to go back when they and head south when they were supposed to and then they essentially get stunned by this sudden

David Abel (53:50.662)
often makes it difficult for them to swim and they get forced onto the beaches. And so I have working on and illustrating a children's book called Lost and Found all about my son's experience rescuing a sea turtle.

Chris Watson (54:12.24)
Interesting, when do you hope to release that?

David Abel (54:18.783)
Uh, I we're about midway through illustrating the book. So, uh hoping next year

Chris Watson (54:25.216)
Good, excellent, good luck with that, keep us posted. Yeah, I've got a little girl as well, and she's a keen avid reader at the moment, so I'll be keen to check that out. Yeah, good, good. Right, so I think Connection is coming back. Are you okay to come back on camera just for the two final closing parts, David, and then we'll be wrapping up.

David Abel (54:27.703)
Thank you.

David Abel (54:37.474)
Sounds great.

David Abel (54:52.01)
Yeah, sure. Thought it would maybe be better for the connection. OK.

Chris Watson (54:57.376)
Yeah, yeah. Good. So as we're coming up on time, David, we've got two closing traditions that we do on the show. One is the call to adventure, and the final one is the pay it forward. So the call to adventure is all about your opportunity to suggest an adventure activity, a place, or a trip.

person, just something for people to get involved in, and disconnect from the screen and do something a bit more adventurous. So what would your call to adventure suggestion be?

David Abel (55:37.538)
So one of my favorite things in the world to do is to swim in waterfalls. And and I love whenever I'm traveling to find a hike that ends with a waterfall and a pool and just hang out with the cold water, sort of giving you a nice shower. It's the it's the best way to end the hike. And

I have seen many, many beautiful places and those are often the most beautiful to me. A place where you can sort of just, not just admire the beauty, but actually feel it. Feel the beauty. That would be my call to adventure, I guess.

Chris Watson (56:28.351)
Do you have a favourite waterfall that comes to mind anywhere in the world?

David Abel (56:33.758)
Well, there's one that I guess I'm thinking of, which is in the Dominican Republic. And I said I had access to horses and motorcycles and we would sometimes take the motorcycle to a horse and there was this waterfall called Salto Baiguate, I think, and it was, there was nobody there. And it was just this,

green, tropical green water, and the water was really warm, and it was just like, it was so easy to swim into, and really, really beautiful. I also remember going to one in Thailand, where there was like a series, it was a hike near Chiang Mai, in the north of Thailand, and it's a national park, and there's like a series of seven or so waterfalls.

and it's just a really beautiful place.

Chris Watson (57:38.24)
Yeah, we've got a plethora of waterfalls and plenty of cold water in Scotland. Phenomenal. Excellent, thank you very much. That's a great suggestion. So finally, the pay it forward. So that's all about anything, any worthy causes, charitable or otherwise, that are important to you, but we want to raise awareness of. So what would your pay it forward suggestion be?

David Abel (57:45.048)
Yes.

David Abel (58:06.239)
um something specific or something general?

Chris Watson (58:11.197)
Whatever that means to you.

David Abel (58:15.943)
So something specific, my wife runs this wonderful organization where she brings together kids from all over Boston and gets them to do something that they never thought they could do, which is to complete this race. And in a couple of weeks, her annual 5K is coming up. And she...

And she just brings together community and she gets people to dream of things that, you know, to do things that they only dreamed of doing and, and or never thought they could do. So that's something specific and wonderful. The other is, is to not become complacent and recognize that our, this summer we have seen how our.

many, many years now of pumping fossil fuels into our atmosphere is radically changing our environment. And we've seen evidence of that for years, but this summer, I think the dangers from the floods, you know, just in the past week in Libya, to the fires in Hawaii, to the wildfires all over Canada, Western Canada.

David Abel (59:46.18)
to the unbelievable deluge of rain in southern Europe, whether in Greece. And the pictures are just absolutely astonishing. The record heat that we've seen throughout Europe, particularly in Spain this summer, the North Atlantic, the waters of the

Ocean have never been warmer, I mean off the charts warm. And it is quite frightening to see and we can't become complacent. We need change.

Chris Watson (01:00:31.336)
very important. Thank you, thank you. So that brings us to the end. That's been a fantastic conversation. We've covered various angles and facets of your life in journalism and film documentaries and stuff. So I really thank you for your time today David. It's been inspirational and phenomenal. Thank you, thank you very much.

David Abel (01:00:59.478)
My pleasure. Thank you. Thank you for taking the time to share my story.

Chris Watson (01:01:04.872)
You're welcome. I will.