Colorado's Centennial Airport is the nation's busiest general aviation airport--and the 18th-busiest airport of any kind in the nation. Which means that as both the airport and the area around it has grown over the years, aviation noise has become a bigger problem. In this episode, we talk to members of the Centennial Airport Community Noise Roundtable to learn more about best practices they've learned over the years to collaborate successfully with the airport and the FAA.
Noisy Skies is a periodic podcast. Subscribe or follow on your favorite podcast app to be alerted about our newest episodes! Got questions or comments? Drop us a line at info@noisyskies.org. We'd love to hear your feedback.
This episode was written and edited by Carolyn McCulley.
Music is by Adam Saban, Falls, and Lunareh.
Noisy Skies was selected by Feedspot as one of the Top 100 Aviation Podcasts on the web.
Noisy Skies is brought to you by The Aloft Group. The Aloft Group draws on decades of aviation experience to help communities navigate the complexity of aviation noise. To learn more about how Aloft can help your community, visit TheAloftGroup.com and read The Forgotten People in Aviation's Matrix.
Noisy Skies is a production of Citygate Films
© 2024 Citygate Films LLC
Colorado's Centennial Airport is the nation's busiest general aviation airport--and the 18th-busiest airport of any kind in the nation. Which means that as both the airport and the area around it has grown over the years, aviation noise has become a bigger problem. In this episode, we talk to members of the Centennial Airport Community Noise Roundtable to learn more about best practices they've learned over the years to collaborate successfully with the airport and the FAA.
Noisy Skies is a periodic podcast. Subscribe or follow on your favorite podcast app to be alerted about our newest episodes! Got questions or comments? Drop us a line at info@noisyskies.org. We'd love to hear your feedback.
This episode was written and edited by Carolyn McCulley.
Music is by Adam Saban, Falls, and Lunareh.
Noisy Skies was selected by Feedspot as one of the Top 100 Aviation Podcasts on the web.
Noisy Skies is brought to you by The Aloft Group. The Aloft Group draws on decades of aviation experience to help communities navigate the complexity of aviation noise. To learn more about how Aloft can help your community, visit TheAloftGroup.com and read The Forgotten People in Aviation's Matrix.
Noisy Skies is a production of Citygate Films
© 2024 Citygate Films LLC
Episode 5: The Centennial Airport Community Noise Roundtable
[00:00:00] Carolyn McCulley: On May 12th, 2021, ABC World News Tonight reported a mid-air collision at Centennial Airport, a general aviation airport just south of Denver. A collision in which amazingly no one was injured or killed.
[00:00:14] News Anchor: We turn next tonight here to the remarkable scene near Denver playing out. Two planes involved in a mid-air collision. One plane deploying its emergency parachute while going down. The other plane, the fuselage ripped wide open. Here's ABC's Kaylee Hartung tonight.
[00:00:28] Reporter Kaylee Hartung: Both planes had been cleared for landing on parallel runways at Centennial Airport, but one plane overshot his final approach. And then, the mid-air collision.
[00:00:37] The single engine Cirrus, the only company with its own revolutionary parachute system for an aircraft, successfully deploying it and preventing an almost certain tragedy. And David, tonight the NTSB will begin its investigation. Both pilots will face intense interviews with investigators to figure out how this happened at one of America's busiest airports for private pilots and non-commercial flights.
[00:01:00] Carolyn McCulley: The news footage showing the Cirrus parachute crash and the ripped open fuselage on the Key Lime Air Metroliner aircraft is incredible to see. A student pilot on his first solo flight witnessed the collision and almost captured it on his dashboard GoPro camera. Unfortunately, the GoPro's battery died just moments before the crash.
[00:01:21] New Reporter: A communication issue may have been at the center of yesterday's mid-air plane crash. Student pilot Shrivan Patel saw it unfold right in front of him. He was in the middle of his first solo flight when two planes collided in mid-air right in front of him near the Centennial Airport yesterday.
[00:01:35] Carolyn McCulley: Juan Browne, a pilot and host of the popular aviation YouTube channel BlancoLirio, posted his analysis the same day, describing the layout of the airport and the concentration of development around it.
[00:01:48] Juan Browne: This collision occurred on final for the runway 17, the parallel runways at Centennial Airport. The two occupants walked away from the crash without injuries. Debris from the crash was spread across Bellevue Avenue, into the park, and the plane was significantly damaged.
[00:02:03] Carolyn McCulley: Then he praised the student pilot for his help in identifying the crash for the airport tower.
[00:02:09] Juan Browne: Good job Cessna 251, especially if this is truly your first solo. You are pressed into service as a SAR CAP mission, search and air rescue mission on your first solo to identify where the Cirrus is and in the field there.
[00:02:21] Carolyn McCulley: Two years later, the NTSB, the National Transportation Safety Board, released its accident investigation report.
[00:02:29] News Anchor: A mid-air collision over Centennial Airport forced a plane to parachute to the ground. And now, two years later, we know what went wrong. The NTSB blames one of the pilots involved, but our Cole Sullivan reports they also say air traffic controllers at Centennial share the responsibility.
[00:02:47] News reporter Cole Sullivan: The NTSB says one pilot was going too fast and overshot a turn as he tried to land at the Centennial Airport. The plane he hit never knew he was coming. But buried in its report, the controllers themselves acknowledge concerns about planes hitting each other on the parallel runways. The runways are so close, one controller told investigators, the alarm warning of planes in the same area becomes, quote, white noise.
[00:03:13] The airport itself told me it believes the FAA has made a change in how planes approach those parallel runways since this crash. But that's caused another problem. People in Greenwood Village, Centennial, and Englewood say they don't like hearing the planes fly lower and louder over their houses.
[00:03:45] I'm Carolyn McCulley, and this is the Noisy Skies podcast brought to you by The Aloft Group. In the first four episodes of Noisy Skies, we looked at some of the essential issues of aviation noise. But now, we are shifting gears to look at solutions. How does change happen for communities that are negatively affected by aviation noise?
[00:04:06] In this episode, we're talking to some members of the Centennial Airport Community Noise Roundtable about how this process has worked for them.
[00:04:24] By 2023, Centennial Airport had become the busiest general aviation airport in the nation. And it's also one of the top 20 busiest airports of any kind. Centennial's users include corporate businesses, charter operations, several large flight schools, medevac and air ambulance service, cargo, and more. The airport is also publicly committed to being a good neighbor to its community and has been actively involved in noise mitigation and related efforts.
[00:04:54] But this mid-air collision had a significant effect on the airport and its flight paths, as well as on the Centennial Airport Community Noise Roundtable.
[00:05:02] Chris Eubanks: My name is Chris Eubanks. I'm a current council member for the city of Castle Pines. I'm also a newly elected chair of the Roundtable. So the, the way that that Centennial Airport fits into Colorado as the busiest general aviation airport is two things.
[00:05:18] One is we have a lot of corporations here, so there's a lot of commercial traffic. But more importantly, I would say from a number of flights perspective is, we have a lot of flight school training here as well. So, when we have noise complaints, it's typically not the jet traffic from the corporations. It's typically the piston-engine aircraft that are used for training flights.
[00:05:39] Carolyn McCulley: The Centennial Roundtable started in 2009 after the airport conducted its first FAA Part 150 noise study. There are 12 local municipalities represented on the Roundtable, as well as two government agencies, two aviation industry groups, the airport itself, and one private entity, a local air and space museum.
[00:06:00] Not every airport has a roundtable. The FAA defines a roundtable as an organization that brings together airport, community, and airline industry representatives to collaboratively identify and discuss issues of concern and possible resolutions at the same time. The FAA looks to the community roundtable to make recommendations, ideally in coordination with the airport, that recognize the impacts to the airspace and all potentially affected communities before making them to the applicable entity, which is generally the FAA or the airport. For example, this could be recommending potential airspace operation changes to the FAA or flight schedule concerns to the airlines for consideration.
[00:06:44] Brad Pierce: My name is Brad Pierce. I live in Aurora, Colorado, which is probably about five miles northeast of the airport. I'm the former chair of the Centennial Airport's Community Noise Roundtable, and a former Aurora Council member, also a member of the study group committee.
[00:07:01] Carolyn McCulley: The study group that Brad references here is important to note, but we'll get into that later on.
[00:07:07] Brad Pierce: Centennial Airport is over 50 years old now, and when it was built, it was really in the middle of nowhere. There was no surrounding development. And now fast forward 50 or more years, there's development all around the airport. And it is a draw for large companies to be near the airport so they can fly in and out without going to the Denver International Airport. And because of developments surrounding the airport, there are increasing numbers of residents in the area that are complaining about the flight school traffic.
[00:07:39] Carolyn McCulley: Centennial is one of more than 5,100 public airports in the nation, and only 500 are actually commercial service airports. Amazingly, there are actually more private airports than public airports in the U. S. More than 14,000 private airports, and the number is growing. The distinction between public and private use airports refers to usage, not ownership. A public use airport is defined by the FAA as an airport available for use by the general public, without a requirement for prior approval of the airport owner or operator. Whereas private approval is required for private use airports. More importantly, any airport taking federal grant money to improve its runways or facilities automatically becomes a public airport. The term airport also includes heliports, seaplane bases, and facilities for other aerial hobbies.
[00:08:32] Now, the term general aviation means the type of regulations that the aircraft and the pilots are operating under. In this case, 14 Code of Federal Regulations, Part 91, General Operating and Flight Rules, hence the term general aviation. So general aviation can mean anything from an old Piper Cub aircraft to a corporate jet, and also include operations like flight schools.
[00:09:00] But wait, there's more! As a general aviation airport, Centennial is also called a reliever airport, an airport designated to relieve congestion at a nearby commercial service airport, in this case Denver International Airport. Finally, Centennial Airport also provides 24/7 customs services for international flights.
[00:09:22] All of which means that those who volunteer to serve on the Centennial Roundtable have a lot to learn about this airport and how it operates within the National Airspace System.
[00:09:32] Alison Biggs: My name is Allison Biggs, and I'm one of the two county representatives on the Roundtable. My community was here almost as long as the airport, and there was no noise over my community. I was way out in the boondocks, horse property, big lots, no noise. We never had a plane over here.
[00:09:53] When I quit work, it was a whole different world, because the airport had grown so much. My horses were stampeding down in the corral, because they were so terrified of the planes that were flying over so low and so frequently. And that's where I got started in this.
[00:10:10] The learning curve was huge initially. There was a lot of educational process that needed to go on, because we all came from different backgrounds and different knowledge bases. The people who serve on the Roundtable really do care about the communities and they're dedicated to trying to help the communities.
[00:10:30] But we also need to work with the airport because we can't affect change by ourselves. So the cooperation between the Roundtable and the airport and the FAA and the other groups that are based at the airport is really essential. And we play a key role in bringing those groups together, or trying to at least.
[00:10:52] Carolyn McCulley: Chris Eubanks also had a learning curve about the roundtable, its authority, and its purpose. It's something he wants communities living near the airport to understand as well.
[00:11:02] Chris Eubanks: I was very excited when I joined the Roundtable. My predecessor on the city council termed out, so she was out of the Roundtable, so I replaced her. And I was very gung ho. And then, after several months, I'm like, okay. I'm questioning myself and questioning the Roundtable, going, I've been here for many months. Nothing's changing. What is the purpose? Why doesn't anything change? So after I realized, and after we collectively all realized that there is zero authority of the roundtable, it started to make more sense.
[00:11:34] So I would like the community to understand that while we do not have authority, we do have decision-making and we do have recommendations that we make to both the FAA and the airport. We are advocates and we do what we are enabled to do for them. And I think that we are fortunate to have an executive director of the airport, Mike Fronapfel, who is fantastic. He is absolutely committed to doing whatever collectively we can to help mitigate the noise. So I would say our relationship is very strong, not only with the airport director, but with also staff.
[00:12:14] Carolyn McCulley: In 2014, the FAA began a six-year process of implementing its NextGen procedures within the Denver Metroplex, an airspace that includes not only Denver International and Centennial Airports, but also five other airports. As the new performance-based navigation procedures were put in place by the FAA, residents in various communities in the area noticed the change.
[00:12:40] A side note here, if NextGen is not a familiar term to you, check out episode one where we get into it.
[00:12:51] Pam Thompson: My name is Pam Thompson. I'm with the town of Foxfield. I live about 2.8 miles due east of the Centennial Airport, and I am just newly elected vice-chair of the roundtable. And why I got started in the first place was because there was a representative from my town and I would turn to him and say, you know, the traffic above our heads is really picking up. Oh, that's your imagination. I said, no, I've lived here for 30 plus years. Something's changing up there. And no, your imagination, nothing's changed. Okay, well then, you're on that noise roundtable, what are you doing with it? Well, I don't attend. That was his first answer. I don't attend, because we just kind of talk about the same thing, oh yes, noisy skies and it's the end of the conversation, there's no results. And I said, huh, would you like to be replaced? Because I'll sit in your position. And that's how I got started.
[00:13:50] Carolyn McCulley: Pam's predecessor may not have noticed any changes, but the rest of the community certainly did. In this Denver 7 News report in February 2020, the airport's CEO explained why the airport got involved.
[00:14:04] New Reporter: For years, communities across the Front Range have been sounding the alarm over the Federal Aviation Administration's Metroplex plan, saying the proposed new flight paths would bring more air traffic over their homes.
[00:14:16] Mike Fronapfel: It's pretty frustrating for us and our community.
[00:14:18] New Reporter: Mike Fronapfel with Centennial Airport says after years of telling the FAA why they disagreed with their plan, it's upsetting to hear they're moving forward.
[00:14:27] Mike Fronapfel: We're disappointed that they had moving forward with the Metroplex implementation. We feel that they didn't do an appropriate job of looking at the environmental impacts of some of the changes they're proposing.
[00:14:37] New Reporter: After finding no significant impact to communities, the FAA says the new flight paths will go into effect the end of March. A big difference from what flight paths looked like before. In a statement, the FAA says the decision enables the agency to move forward with the project, which will use cutting-edge satellite navigation to move air traffic more safely and efficiently through the area. The FAA also says the new routes will allow for more direct travel and would reduce fuel costs, as well as flight delays. Fronapfel says, even with the FAA's final decision, they're not giving up.
[00:15:11] Mike Fronapfel: The airport wants to refile a petition for review with the D. C. Circuit Court so that we can hopefully stop them from implementing the Metroplex procedures or slow down the process.
[00:15:21] Carolyn McCulley: Centennial Airport disagreed with the FAA because the two entities see the world in two different ways. The airport wanted the FAA to provide data about environmental impacts for altitudes below 3,000 feet. But the FAA only looked at impacts at altitudes above 3,000 feet. As the airport noted, people don't live at 3,000 feet above the ground. So Centennial Airport said, there's important environmental information missing from the FAA's assessment of no significant impact.
[00:15:53] So why did the FAA come to this conclusion? It's a long and technically complex answer, but it's worth it to pause the story here and find out.
[00:16:05] In a nutshell, when the FAA evaluates the environmental impacts of its work, the agency is subject to the National Environmental Policy Act, or NEPA. But the FAA alone determines the potential for significant environmental impacts under NEPA. And here's where we run into the 65DNL noise metric that we explored in episode 4.
[00:16:28] As a reminder, the FAA uses the 65DNL noise metric as its threshold for noise that's incompatible with residential living. The problem with that 65DNL noise metric is that it's a 24 hour average based on decades old data. Current data shows that people are affected at much lower noise metrics. But still, the 65DNL is the standard that remains.
[00:16:54] So, in a 2004 FAA document explaining environmental impacts under NEPA, the FAA published a chart that showed that for an area with no pre-existing noise exposure to reach the DNL 65 level, it would take 900 new daily flights flying at 3,000 feet above ground level on a single day. 900 flights on a single day!
[00:17:19] Then this report added, in the FAA's experience, the likelihood that changes to air traffic procedure would direct this number of flights over a single noise sensitive area around any airport is remote. Therefore, the FAA decided that any changes to air traffic procedures at or above 3,000 feet above ground level in normal circumstances qualifies for categorical exclusion from NEPA's standards. And if any of this leaves you confused, rest assured you're not alone.
[00:17:49] So, back to the story.
[00:17:51] In January 2020, the FAA issued its finding of no significant impact and a record of decision for the Denver Metroplex project, which stated that the NextGen changes would not significantly affect the quality of the human environment. But the airport, along with Greenwood Village and the counties of Gilpin, Arapahoe, and Douglas, disagreed and sued the FAA over the Denver Metroplex changes in March of 2020.
[00:18:19] More than a year later on June 8th, 2021, and less than a month after the midair collision at Centennial, the appeals court ruled that none of the plaintiffs in the suit had standing to sue. In a Denver Post article, the then-CEO of Centennial Airport said he wasn't sure that the judges and clerks actually understood the case.
[00:18:41] In a phone call with me, current Centennial Airport CEO Mike Fronapfel explained that the timing of the lawsuit was unfortunate. Because that same month, the COVID-19 pandemic began in the U.S., significantly reducing air traffic. That made it challenging to prove any harm because of the extraordinarily low levels of air traffic at the time.
[00:19:09] Here, it's probably helpful to point out that speaking of the FAA as one monolithic entity is kind of like speaking of the military. Which branch, which service are you speaking of in the military? Same thing with the FAA. Not only is the agency itself divided into distinct organizations like air traffic, airports, and aviation safety, but, within the world of air traffic control, there are also distinctions between controllers in the airport traffic control tower, controllers in the terminal approach, and area controllers for flights en route.
[00:19:45] So, while Centennial Airport and its nearby communities were not successful in challenging flight path changes of the new Denver Metroplex, this group was successful in working with the local FAA controllers in the airport traffic control tower. Here's Roundtable member Brad Pierce again.
[00:20:02] Brad Pierce: As a result of that midair collision, the FAA changed the way they manage traffic in and out of the airport. And because of the change they made in how they manage it, the community got concerned because more flights were going over their homes in the residential areas north of the airport. So, the public would come to our roundtable meetings and comment about how they're unhappy with the noise, mainly from flight schools.
[00:20:28] And so, there was a group of us kind of decided, what if we were to form a little subgroup of the roundtable to address specifically the flight school pattern traffic north of the airport? And that is the sole mission of the study group committee is to start looking at solutions or mitigations to the flight school noise north of the airport.
[00:20:49] Now the, the roundtable in general has the bigger group of probably 15 or 16 people. And then the study group committee is probably eight to 10 people that are really focused on the extended pattern traffic north of the airport.
[00:21:04] Carolyn McCulley: When the Centennial Roundtable started its study group, it changed the meeting structure. Here, Roundtable Chair Chris Eubanks explains the one key change about who participates and why.
[00:21:16] Chris Eubanks: It's confidential. So we don't release the names of anyone from the FAA or anyone from the flight schools. And that is because when that has happened in the past, they have gotten calls and emails and dare I say threats of sorts. So they're completely confidential. But it's always the tower, air traffic control tower, and there's always at least another controller represented there. And in addition, regional management of the FAA attends either in person or virtually.
[00:21:46] The one thing I'll tell you too is that we've had 22 study group meetings and the FAA has been there at least one person 100% of the time. And there is a flight school that has also been in attendance 100% of the time.
[00:22:00] Our relationship within the study group is fantastic with the FAA and it's fantastic with the flight school.
[00:22:06] Carolyn McCulley: Longtime Roundtable member and secretary, Allison Biggs, looks at the study group as another tool for success.
[00:22:13] Alison Biggs: We have had our historic committees, but in looking at all of the concerns that happened after the midair collision, it sort of evolved into, well, let's see if we can find some way to get the FAA and the flight schools together with us and the airport. And that evolved into this study group. So it was using another tool that was in the toolbox that we hadn't used before. And it's turned out to work quite well because the FAA was really not interested in talking with just us. But when we could pull the whole group together, that certainly improved how things are going.
[00:22:50] Carolyn McCulley: Roundtable member Pam Thompson acknowledged that at first, some in the community were uneasy about these private study group meetings. But the group produces a report every quarter that has actually demonstrated some progress, which has quelled those initial concerns.
[00:23:05] Pam Thompson: A smaller group was able to constrain things and have wonderful conversations. We're actually going for a resolution, mitigation, and compiling ideas together. So we are gaining trust with the community that something is going on, that we are listeners, we are working, and we are trying to resolve an issue.
[00:23:26] Carolyn McCulley: Chris Eubanks says the airport's board receives recommendations from the roundtable too.
[00:23:31] Chris Eubanks: We have a noise roundtable meeting. And typically the next week is the airport authority's board meeting, where we do make some recommendations. One such example is the roundtable and the study group made a recommendation to the board to hire an additional full-time equivalent at the airport to help study noise. So we already had a noise specialist, but this person will have a heightened visibility into that. And we were very pleased that the airport authority board did take our recommendation and did allow that position to be filled. And that was filled earlier this year. So we're very, very excited about that.
[00:24:06] Carolyn McCulley: Brad Pierce says prior to COVID and the midair collision, the roundtable did have some small successes. They worked with the airport to develop a fly quiet program and printed explanation brochures to distribute to all the flight schools and fixed base operators offering aviation services at the airport.
[00:24:24] But the study group opened the door to better working relationships.
[00:24:28] Brad Pierce: I think the community is coming around to see the study group as something that can be beneficial to them because they want to see relief. They've been putting up with noise over their homes for a year, a year and a half now. And so they want action, which is something that the study group is working on.
[00:24:46] Some of these mitigations that we have talked about in the study group are going to take a long time. And we have the approach at the study group to implement things sooner rather than later if possible. So the radar display in the control tower now has noise-sensitive areas on it. That was something the FAA implemented right away.
[00:25:04] And so because we have all these parties at the table at every meeting, the FAA said to us, we want to make this study group committee a model for other airports that are having problems. And so it's really been great to have the FAA at the table. We have talked about since the beginning of our roundtable, what we call the four-legged stool. So it's the airport users, it's the airport operator, it's the community, and the FAA. For a long time, we only had a three-legged stool because the FAA was reluctant to participate. So, now we have the FAA participating in the study group, we kind of have that four-legged stool back.
[00:25:45] Carolyn McCulley: Now, noise is not the only important topic that the roundtable is concerned about. In the last few years, there has been a nationwide push to eliminate the use of leaded fuel at general aviation airports. Aircraft that operate on leaded aviation gasoline are typically small piston-engine aircraft that carry two to ten passengers. These aircraft are on average 45 years old, depending on the type of aircraft. Jet aircraft used for commercial transport, on the other hand, do not operate on leaded fuel. Though levels of airborne lead in the United States have declined 99 percent since 1980, emissions from aircraft that operate on leaded fuel still pose risks to nearby communities.
[00:26:25] So, in October 2023, the EPA took action.
[00:26:30] New Reporter: EPA says leaded plane fuel is hurting people's health, and it's telling the FAA to do something about it. Two busy airports in the metro area are already phasing it out. Centennial Airport is offering unleaded fuel for the small planes at its airport, starting back in May.
[00:26:44] Rocky Mountain Metro Airport in Broomfield is also speeding up a transition away from the leaded stuff, even before the EPA said it spewed harmful pollution into the air.
[00:26:54] Chris Eubanks: The roundtable is primarily about noise affecting the surrounding communities to Centennial Airport. Over the past year and a half, the effects of lead within the lead of fuel of airplanes became more of a concern. So much that community members are going to get independent tests done on lead and supply of what those results are.
[00:27:17] But I do take pride in the fact that Centennial Airport was the first in the state to offer unleaded fuel. And not only offer it, but the airport also currently subsidizes the cost of the fuel to take away some of that hardship on pilots and flight schools that are buying the unleaded fuel, as well as subsidizing the cost to certify aircraft to be able to use aviation unleaded fuel.
[00:27:41] Alison Biggs: They also subsidized the alteration of the fuel trucks to handle the unleaded fuel. I think the last report we got from the airport, about 20 percent of their fuel sales were unleaded fuel. And that's pretty good in the amount of time that they've been offering the assistance. And they intend to continue that. I think they're hoping to get some federal support as well because it is expensive. But the airport's committed to helping with that, wherever possible.
[00:28:13] Carolyn McCulley: As this episode is released, Centennial is still the only general aviation airport in Colorado offering unleaded aviation gas. But Mike Fronapfel hopes that the state will soon pass a new law to provide grants to help all general aviation airports in the state transition to unleaded gas. That would be a big win.
[00:28:32] For now, Centennial Airport is starting its second Part 150 noise study, which will update its noise map. He hopes, then, that local municipalities will adopt the updated noise map and use standardized zoning requirements and construction standards around the airport. That would also be a big win.
[00:28:50] In the meantime, the study group committee is starting to analyze its mitigations to see how effective they've been.
[00:28:57] Chris Eubanks: We still have more work to do. The study group does not replace the roundtable. The roundtable's purpose is to help the entire community. The study group that we are currently involved with is more for a specific focus. So I don't know if the study group will be around forever. But that does not in any way replace the noise roundtable and the noise roundtable is moving on, continuing doing the work that the noise roundtable does.
[00:29:32] Carolyn McCulley: Noisy Skies is brought to you by The Aloft Group. Aloft draws on decades of aviation experience to help communities navigate the complexity of aviation noise. And when it comes to roundtables, though the FAA views them as experienced advisory groups, there is no in-depth course that prepares volunteer roundtable members for all they need to know to be successful.
[00:29:56] This is where Aloft can help participants better understand the technical, operational, and political factors that are involved, so that trust can be built faster among all parties involved. And with trust comes solutions. To learn more about how The Aloft Group can help your community, visit noisyskies.org.
[00:30:18] This episode was written and edited by me, Carolyn McCulley.
[00:30:23] Do you have any questions or comments for the show? We'd love to hear from you. Drop us a line at info@noisyskies.org. And then join me next time, wherever you get your favorite podcasts. Thank you for listening.