Darcey: An After-Hours Chat -- The State of Mental Health

In this episode of Sage in Time, we meet Darcey, a Licensed Clinical Social Worker and one of Derek’s former colleagues.  Our time with clients had ended for the day and we decided to simply catch up on various topics that affect a variety of our current and potential clients.  We moved quickly through the topics of:

substance abuse credentials
telemed vs. in-office or “shared space” therapy
why we both opted to increase our licensure to multiple states
working with teens and younger children
college preparation in modern times 
building and maintaining social support networks as adults
and how we keep up with what’s new in the world of offering the best care to our clients.

We also revisited the topic of what therapy might look like when you have a therapist that is a good “fit” for your treatment needs.  

We've already decided we'll be chatting again from time to time.  Subscribe to keep up with Darcey or any of my guests.

Transcript

Darcey Simmons
But you know, we're here for mental health. Nobody's mental health is great.

Derek (00:38.32)
It's hard to watch. It's really hard to watch.

Derek (00:45.776)
⁓ Let's talk about Mental Health."

Darcey Simmons (00:49.723)
We can talk about whatever you want to talk about. I got out of early of work for this.

Derek (00:56.304)
Wait a minute, you're giving up money for this? That's the important question. You're giving up money for this? So to our listeners, this is a former colleague, still a friend, but former colleague of mine, Darcey Simmons. Darcey works locally in the Syracuse area. Most of your, is all of your work in person now?

Darcey Simmons (00:58.915)
Yeah, it was fun. It was something different.

Darcey Simmons (01:23.675)
a good 90%. yeah, I've stopped, actually kind of stopped last year taking referrals for folks who are doing telemed just because there are so many providers who are doing telemed and I have an appreciation for telemed. I don't want to, I don't want it to come off like I hate telemed. but pandemic taught me a lot in that I am, I am not a full -time telemed provider.

Derek (01:26.544)
Good 90%.

Derek (01:52.368)
I learned during pandemic that.

Darcey Simmons (01:55.035)
You are.

Derek (01:57.264)
No, I mean, I'm still working from home. I absolutely love it. But I know I've actually turned my CASAC back in last year. I returned my CASAC act to the state. I said I'm not using it.

I think it would be a disservice to anybody who is struggling with earlier, even mid recovery from drugs and alcohol addiction. If I can't be in the space with them and see what's going on off camera and smell alcohol or be able to see or notice those things that you kind of need to be like in some, you know, in somebody's face for,

And, you know, in 2020, you know, even when we could go back to the office, there was like social distancing. So doors are closed and we're still six to eight feet away from each other. Still not the best environment for working in recovery circles. So rather than let it just die, my CASAC I said, no, I'm going voluntarily inactive. And I may pick it up later, but for now, not so much.

Darcey Simmons (03:12.699)
I think there's a lot of people doing that with the CASAC in the CASAC world.

Derek (03:17.104)
turning them in.

Darcey Simmons (03:18.459)
Yeah, going inactive. I think, you know, the CASAC holds a really good spot in New York, particularly for those who have a really good skill set. For the world who doesn't know, CASAC, Certified Alcohol and Substance Abuse Counselor. It's a certification. It's not a licensure. But I think as you move on in licensure, like early on, I thought having my CASAC was like, it was the shit.

I've moved on to bigger and better things, but I think a lot of people have. And there's been so much more education in other avenues. I think back like 20 years ago, if you had substance abuse issues, you were looking for a CASAC. That was the person to go to. Because social workers, so I'm a social worker, I can only speak on behalf of social work, but.

Derek (04:02.576)
Absolutely.

Darcey Simmons (04:10.683)
When I was in grad school, there was one class, it was an elective if you wanted to take it, that was focused on substance abuse. It otherwise was not talked about. And that has greatly changed.

Derek (04:22.384)
absolutely has.

Darcey Simmons (04:23.515)
And kind of a couple episodes back and you're like, how do you find the right therapist? I think it's harder now. It's easier in some ways and it's harder in others because you're not necessarily looking for a set of letters that you were maybe even 10 years ago because skill sets have merged so much that we have so much more flexibility to be able to learn and branch out.

Derek (04:32.24)
Well...

Derek (04:35.856)
No.

Derek (04:45.488)
You bring up a great point. We all have different letters. I'm working on another set of letters. I'm working on my ATSIP That's the assessment and treatment for sexual issues in psychotherapy. That's Martha Kauppi's course a Prior podcast guest actually mentioned her to me. I was like

course opened up for the year and it's it's quasi live 24 23 and a half credits something like that 15 weeks i love the material and i love the presentation i you know need to focus on it more that's that's more my more my time keeping opening up the private practice but another guest of mine earlier this year we talked about dating rachel

Rachel is the name of the podcast guest, but she's she's come up with this proposal or she's actually doing it. It's not just a proposal where she's integrating coaches and other professionals and advocating for more community involvement in dating as the old school way back before we had 25 million apps. But.

I think that one of the biggest challenges of finding the right therapist is we have more choices by virtue of the internet. And my license is New York and Pennsylvania and you are licensed where?

Darcey Simmons (06:17.531)
Okay.

Derek (06:17.776)
I know exactly.

Darcey Simmons (06:20.219)
New York, New Hampshire, Vermont, Massachusetts, Rhode Island, Pennsylvania, North Carolina, Florida. Why do I feel like I'm forgetting something in there? Looking into Maryland, ironically, Maryland has had a high influx lately of referrals for me.

Derek (06:40.752)
How are you getting referrals from Maryland when you don't even have a license in the state?

Darcey Simmons (06:46.107)
cause I have people that know people that know people.

Derek (06:50.832)
So when people say, I've got a girl, I've got a person, you're the, I have just the right one, right?

Darcey Simmons (06:54.971)
Get a girl. I know the girl for you. Yeah, so when did I start really working in the field? 2006, 2007? And obviously not seeing any of those patients from my very first job. But as I've grown and moved, and particularly I think in my current role,

I've done a lot of work with teenagers and then they go off to college. And if they go off to college and they happen to be in a state where I'm licensed in, we can continue our work remotely. And this is where I will say, telemed, I'm a, okay, telemed works great for me in these occasions. And so we do telemed while they're away at college. They come back on breaks. We're back in the office in person. But then word kind of gets out because there's a huge problem still on college campuses.

they cannot get in to campus mental health services or if they can you get two to three visits a semester and you're referred out and same thing like up here you can't find providers and so friend of a friend of a friend eventually winds back up even to the point a referral came in last week and I'm like I haven't seen this person like three years and they're still referring to me they still have my name somewhere in the back of their head yeah like

Derek (08:16.656)
That's amazing. Yep. Yep.

Darcey Simmons (08:19.803)
It's this realization of how small the world actually is, because I'm like, you're from where? How did you hear about? OK.

Derek (08:27.216)
Well, I can either confirm or deny that I know that person.

Darcey Simmons (08:30.459)
Yep, but in my head I'm just like, how did we get from point A to point B, but okay.

Derek (08:37.136)
Well, and one of the other problems with the college counseling centers is they get those two visits, they find a therapist, the therapist is local, now they go back to their home state and that therapist is not licensed in their home state. We're back to, I am not located in the same jurisdiction as my therapist is.

Darcey Simmons (08:52.475)
Right, so we're back to square one.

Darcey Simmons (09:01.275)
And, you know, continuity of care, good luck once college campuses close of trying to get records, trying to talk to that provider. Because a lot of times they're off on vacation. Rightfully so. They've earned it, but it just, it makes it very difficult. It makes it hard for people. You know, a lot of us have all of the same kind of pre -start of therapy paperwork. I mean, some of it you have to do. Legally, we have to do it. But the questions, and I'm like,

Derek (09:09.296)
Yeah.

Darcey Simmons (09:31.899)
Okay, sorry I'm like the third person in six months, but I need you to retell me why you're here and what you hope to do and how did we get here? Can be incredibly frustrating. So yeah, I work with a lot of folks with trauma if they're moving and I can stay with them. That's more of a best practice.

Derek (09:44.4)
Yeah.

Derek (09:52.272)
I mean continuity of care with wait lists these days it makes more sense.

Darcey Simmons (09:53.947)
depending on where they are and which group.

Darcey Simmons (10:01.403)
Yeah.

Derek (10:03.408)
I mean, I'm running into so when I left the organization that we worked with, we worked together and I was told, you know, we're not going to get in the way if any of your clients do want to follow you. If they asked, I told them what I was doing. So I had several come with me and, you know, time and time again, apologizing for filling those forms back out. And, you know, we've got to go through.

But for those that have been with me for years, it was good to be able to sit down and have a refresher on, you know, we're still working on the treatment plans every quarter, but we're still helpful to go through the, you know, so why are we still doing therapy? Because your insurance company wants to know this. You know, make sure that they're still at that. Absolutely.

Darcey Simmons (10:56.963)
I need to know what they're paying for.

Derek (11:04.336)
So you mentioned teenagers. Why are you... Teenagers are challenging. I worked with them for a while. I'm currently not. I have a consultant. I meet with him every couple of weeks. He's mostly from Thailand. So like midnight, one o 'clock in the morning, I'll meet with him. And he's like, you should work with kids. And...

Darcey Simmons (11:31.867)
no Teenagers.

Derek (11:33.264)
Well, so hang on, hang on. And I've talked this over with some other folks and they're like, yeah, kids are fine. And my heart kind of races at both of them.

Darcey Simmons (11:52.315)
You're muted. Muted. Take two, take three, take four.

Derek (11:56.56)
I'm we're fine. Thank you, Darcey. I hate coughing in people's ears. It just bugs me to no end. But I accept it freely. Was that?

Darcey Simmons (12:05.211)
I hope that doesn't get edited. I hope that doesn't get edited.

Derek (12:09.808)
We'll be able to, we can leave it in.

But he's like, work with children. And I was like, you understand I'm remote. And he said, that's fine. Parents can still be there. You know, they can guide the activity with the child, maybe play therapy with it. I was like, David, are you crazy? And we've got some kid therapists in our group. There's like 20 of us or so. We're there for support. We're there for...

you know, hey, I've got this thing going on just in general, you know, want to run an idea by you. I want to try that kind of stuff. Nothing ever directly case related. But one of the things that I'm like, I'm hesitant to work. The parents are challenging because you're working with the kid, you're working with a teenager in particular.

And the teen is working on that individuation stage that parents often find really challenging. And the teen does, how do you navigate that dynamic?

Darcey Simmons (13:27.739)
So first off, I'll say like, you know, when I started working with kids, I don't think I was really pushed into it. It was more a little bit of free will. There was a curiosity there. And I actually, I went through a phase. I worked with some like six, seven, eight year olds. And I was like, definitely not. So I think if you either enjoy it, the work or you don't, I feel like it's very clear cut, right?

Kind of just like you separate out by diagnoses. So I do feel like it does sometimes take, you know, people ask like, why out of like everybody would you work with a teenager? And I respond back and I'm like, the more attitude and the more like in your face that they are, the more I love them. I like the rebellious teenager. There's something about it that works.

Derek (14:18.672)
You like the energy. Yes you do.

Darcey Simmons (14:24.923)
and so I have, I have a different take to treatment with teenagers and, you know, there's, there's varying degrees to this rule. for a session, parents are always present, not necessarily through the whole entire session. I give the teenager the option right off the bat. you know, some of the session is for mom, dad, grandparents, whoever's there, with the family, the guardian.

Derek (14:51.696)
I did too, yeah.

Darcey Simmons (14:54.683)
because I want them to know like this is their treatment right off the bat. This is for you. And I let parents know, of course I wanna hear from you. I want to check in with you, but this is their treatment, even at 13, 14 years old. Because what I have found is that over...

attendance of parents, it becomes the parents treatment. And that's not what it started as. And as soon as I can kind of hint towards a parent that, you know, we'll do a check -in every three to four months. If there's anything that's happening, you can always call me. And I let the kid know, the teenager know right in front of the parent. They call me, even if we've talked about it, I'm going to maintain your confidentiality around it.

The only exceptions to that, harm to self, harm to others, putting a kid in danger, another minor in danger, right? You're kind of big ones that we are all mandated to report. And there are some parents who are really kind of like, but this is my kid. I have had parents of 17 year olds who insist on staying through the whole entire session. And the answer to that is no, because they're creating an environment and a dynamic where,

Derek (15:53.968)
Absolutely.

Darcey Simmons (16:17.083)
your teenager is now going to grow up to be an adult and they're never going to want to come back to therapy because it's been such a poor experience.

Derek (16:25.808)
Right, and if there's 17, that is...

It's so close to 18 that like, you know, if they start therapy the week before they turn 18.

Darcey Simmons (16:40.923)
Yeah, you're on your own. Yeah.

Derek (16:42.608)
 You know, you you you know, mom and dad can get out.

Darcey Simmons (16:48.091)
Yeah. You know, usually nine times out of ten I see a lot of individuals. I don't do a lot of family work. But the parents will come in and a lot of times it's the kid who is saying, I wanted to be here. I've been asking and asking and asking. And finally, I talked to somebody at school and they convinced my parents that I can have therapy, which is really a leader. Like this is for the teenager. This isn't for you.

Derek (17:14.)
Yeah.

Darcey Simmons (17:18.975)
Yeah, but no, teenagers, if you truly enjoy the work, teenagers can be a lot of fun to work with.

Derek (17:31.6)
You had mentioned college campuses and you're already pretty full. I'm sure you have a wait list. You do.

Darcey Simmons (17:40.443)
No, I do. But it doesn't mean it, you know, my boyfriend will always say, he's like, does it really matter that you have a wait list? Because I'm a pushover. I will say yes anyways.

Derek (17:54.256)
Yeah, that's my dinner hour, but it's not anymore.

Darcey Simmons (17:59.259)
you know, so I'm like, what's just another hour? which is funny. I was in a meeting today and everyone's like, you know, if you pulled Darcey's leg hard enough, a spot may appear. I'm like for the right person, for the right person who may be in crisis, who has tried therapy a lot and hasn't found the right fit. Yeah, I'm probably going to open up a spot and work an extra hour later. If that means.

this is the point that creates some change towards getting better. And overall, I tell everybody that my goal of therapy, anybody who walks into my office, no matter the age, no matter the presenting problem, my goal of therapy is that at the end that you are the best badass version of yourself and able to go out into a world and function because the world is very dysfunctional in the best way possible.

Derek (18:55.44)
and you're already setting the stage for those boundaries. No, mom and dad can't be in here. So when the teenager turns 18, things magically change by law in the US.

Derek (19:14.224)
they have a voice as far as, at least as far as their therapy goes. And you honor that autonomy in your clients anyway.

Darcey Simmons (19:22.939)
Yeah, yeah. And it's really, you know, I find it a struggle to be a good fit. You know, even with 13 year olds, there's been some debates, like can a 13 year old really conceptualize therapy? Well, yes, they're in therapy. There are therapists who work with 13 year olds. So that debacle's already, we don't have to debate that. But if you look at, I'm...

a life of a 13 year old now versus when I was 13, which was not that long ago. I would like to say it's not that long ago. It was, is totally different. And if there's an expectation that at 15 kids are working 20, 30 hours summer jobs, they're coming home, cooking dinner for their siblings. They are getting themselves back and forth to school, getting themselves up when parents are already gone in the morning.

you're starting to live the life of an adult. So in my office, you get the privilege of confidentiality of an adult. You are doing those tasks, you are having those responsibilities, you are having to navigate so much more than when I think back when I was in like middle school or early high school. So much has changed.

Derek (20:21.552)
Mm -hmm.

Derek (20:40.272)
But yet it really hasn't. I'm Gen X.

Darcey Simmons (20:45.595)
I'm a millennial.

Derek (20:46.096)
don't I know you are. I'm a Gen X. We get home from school, you know, have a list of chores we had to do. There's always at least in my family, there was always a list. Some other kids in the neighborhood were making their meals. Nowadays, that's a CPS call. You know, if you're eight, nine years old cooking, no. That 20, 30 hour a week summer job. That was a thing.

Darcey Simmons (20:58.555)
haha

Derek (21:15.984)
You don't go to summer camp or?

Darcey Simmons (21:16.635)
It was a thing for me too. It was called volunteer work. I don't know. I remember summer, like summers were relaxing. Summers were hanging out with friends. There's not a lot of that. I have to do this. I have to do that. This idea of we go to summer school to get ahead to take college classes. I'm like...

somewhere's the time to rest your brain.

Derek (21:49.008)
So I know you keep up with social media stuff. Because I mean, the world keeps up with social media stuff and we have to stay aware. So you're probably on mental health, TikTok, all that good stuff. I saw it. Same. It finds me too. But I saw somebody last night.

Darcey Simmons (21:54.155)
I sure do.

Darcey Simmons (22:06.043)
I don't want to be. It finds me.

Derek (22:15.152)
who it was a it was a stitch of some sort i think that's what you kids call it it was a it was a two -parter and it was about all of these AP courses you know and and all the kids being told you you got to do the AP you got to do the AP courses again and a a former teacher i think it was a former teacher is like no

Darcey Simmons (22:41.371)
They don't.

Derek (22:41.616)
You're not a well -rounded individual. And what are you going to do? Get done with college faster so you can work faster? You're going to miss out on all of the other facets of the wheel of college.

Darcey Simmons (22:58.139)
Yeah. And sometimes that's where, okay, so if we're gonna talk about, you know, hard work with parents, there's where some of the difficulty comes in because parents, as you take a drink, are fed the Kool -Aid and they drink the Kool -Aid from, well, my kid has to do X, Y, and Z and my kid has to keep up with what their siblings did or what their friends are doing or their peers are doing or, you know, little Johnny and Susie down the street are doing these things. That it's really difficult to sit and I was a,

I was a high motivated kid. I'm a high motivated adult. I was definitely lazier as a teenager than I am now. And people who knew me back then will definitely say that is true. I did not work up to my potential. But to sit and take the demands and, you know, I took, you know, 10 AP classes, I took three or four SUPA classes plus a couple classes from OCC for those who don't know SUPA classes in our area are

agreements with our local high schools and Syracuse University. And we did all these things, but I'm getting denied from colleges. And I'm like, sure are, sure are, but I got all A's. No, you didn't, you didn't go and live life. And college is gonna recognize that now you're gonna show up, you're gonna be an 18 year old.

Derek (24:14.576)
Not the point.

Darcey Simmons (24:24.507)
probably junior at this point, which, okay, I advanced through school too. I needed to save money. That was the only way I was going to do it. But you've missed out on proms. You've missed out on sports. You've missed out on theater. Like all of these things that as a human being, particularly in those developmental ages, still being a teenager are important. You're finding your interests. You're finding your loves. You're finding your things that as you go through college,

Those are the things that are going to help balance your mental health because it's not all about academics.

Colleges have clubs for a purpose. Colleges have all of these things and want you to get exposed because it's healthy. If you grind through high school, you're not doing any of that. Like, you basically have now programmed yourself. You are a robot that only knows how to work.

Derek (25:19.952)
I mean, without waxing too philosophical, but isn't that kind of the point of our education system?

Darcey Simmons (25:27.835)
It is now. I'm not saying it's good.

Derek (25:29.68)
Yeah.

I mean.

I run into clients and I do work with couples and I do work with families on occasion. And one of the things that keeps coming up is, so I'm in a new city or I'm in this new situation and I'm trying to establish some friendships.

Derek (25:55.248)
And I think, I mean, college is the last time that we will have proximity and shared interests to the level of proximity and shared interests are possible for human connection. Before we go and start paying off the student loans.

we don't know how to make friends unless friends are brought to us.

Darcey Simmons (26:23.469)
Or you have some of those interests that still carry out into the adult world.

Derek (26:28.944)
if you're lucky and if you've had the time and exposure to those interests at a younger age.

Darcey Simmons (26:36.283)
Yep, which is why I think it's important.

Derek (26:41.376)
When you turn 50, because I'm 50, you look back on a lot of things. And one of the things that I remember, and this keeps coming up, so I'm going to just actively bring it up today, is what's your schedule? What classes are we in together? When's your lunch? When are we going to get to hang out? You know.

And you could see the progression or experienced it, but nowadays you can see the progression and now the kids are going to college and poof.

stops and you and I both worked in recovery circles back in the day and we got I get to say that I'm 50 I'm gonna play that card well I can a couple more months but you know who's going to be there in the next phase of your life

Darcey Simmons (27:25.339)
back in the day.

Derek (27:40.432)
What are the constants?

Derek (27:45.648)
as maybe family. Maybe you've established friendships in the neighborhood. I don't know if people do that too much anymore, but you know, it's still possible.

Darcey Simmons (27:45.659)
Maybe family, maybe relationships.

Darcey Simmons (28:01.275)
I don't know, you know, okay, so this is, I tell this story quite a bit. So we got our house, gosh, 2013. Shortly within the first year, one of our neighbors moved, but we knew who each other were, we knew each other's names. And the person who moved into the house, we know each other to the extent of, we know each other's names.

you know, if we do something dumb, like leave the top up on our hot tub and we leave, we can, you know, message and say, Hey, can you run into my yard and like put the top down on my hot tub so I don't have to come back? Our other neighbor. And people think this is like completely normal, and I think it's like bizarre. You could put whoever's in that house literally on my front yard with three other people, and I'm going to have no idea who they are.

Derek (28:37.904)
Right.

Darcey Simmons (28:57.755)
Which is, like, it's so odd to me. I'm like, I have lived here and they have not moved. They've been the same people. Like, I have lived here this whole entire time. I can't tell you the car they drive. I can't tell you what they look like, their names, like nothing. And people are like, well, when you moved into the house, didn't they like come introduce themselves? I'm like, no.

Darcey Simmons (29:19.131)
Right? The neighbor, the neighbor who we did know brought us cookies. They did the traditional, welcome. Like this is who we are. You know, if you need anything, let us know. And we kind of, you know, did the same when, when the new neighbors moved in. But there isn't that sense of community and we're actually looking to build. I'm like, one, get me away from people. You know, and we, we look at like, we've looked at some really gorgeous developments and I'm like,

Derek (29:25.136)
Welcome to the neighborhood yep.

Darcey Simmons (29:49.435)
That used to be the thing. You moved into a development, you had like your little group of people and you became your own little subculture of the world. And you know, all these things that I'm like, but is it really like that anymore? In a positive way, I don't think it is.

Derek (30:05.744)
So yeah, so back in the 20 aughts, I think, I think it was, particularly in the cities, there would be groups of folks who had lived in the suburbs and decided that they wanted to help clean up their nearest city. So they would...

actually find neighborhood, you know, they didn't have to know anybody. It wasn't like they were moving in and just saying, Nope, we're going to replace the neighborhood with all of people like us. But they would find, you know, I like this little neighborhood. It's got some charm to it. You know, sure, I don't necessarily fit into their demographic, whatever that demo might have been. And they would start connecting with people in a way that, you know, when we were kids, hey,

know, somebody's knocking at the door, what do you need? Can we borrow a hammer today? We're working on a power tool or, you know, can we borrow who borrows eggs? But, you know, can we borrow some eggs or flour? Right? Right. You know, you remember that time.

Darcey Simmons (31:10.139)
Yeah, the eggs, the cup of sugar. Yeah, whatever you needed. It's not that long ago, because that's how it was when I was a kid.

Derek (31:20.944)
That doesn't happen here anymore.

Darcey Simmons (31:22.907)
No. No. And I feel like to have the... This is gonna be really bad, but as we're going through this process and we're looking at different places, I'm like, okay, can I have this place in a development or can I have the same thing on like 20 acres of land? Give me the 20 acres of land because if I'm gonna be by myself, I might as well be by myself.

If we're gonna be isolated, like, I want the space, I want my bubble, if that's what we're gonna be in.

Derek (31:52.72)
but don't make me mow it.

Darcey Simmons (31:55.099)
No, it's not my job. Fun fact, for everyone, it's a fun fact. I have no idea how to run a lawnmower and I have no idea how to use our snowblower and I have no desire to learn.

Derek (31:58.128)
That's my job.

Darcey Simmons (32:09.083)
Just, it saves me.

Derek (32:13.136)
So we moved into this house in 2011 and wonderful family lived kitty corner across the street came over and they're like, we would love to have dinner with you. But there was an issue with the wife, the mother, of the wife.

was concerned about the condition of her home. She was she was not in her mind the tidiest, the homemaker kind of personality. And she had three small children. So you can imagine the state of the house. So they literally said, we're going to order some pizza and wings. You decide when you want to do dinner. We'll bring them over. Lovely. Wonderful. He's still my lawyer, by the way.

I hit him up to start the company, you know, get some things rolling. I've consulted with him on some other stuff, but, and the next door neighbor to us, her husband passed away a few years ago in the hospital. I was mowing the lawn. She came over. We weren't overly, we're still not overly close, but she came over and just wanted to let you know that he passed away and this is what happened. You know, I know you guys chat a lot, you know, as you're both mowing the lawns here and there, but.

yeah, that stuff doesn't happen anymore.

Darcey Simmons (33:36.891)
No. No. As much as I'm very much an introvert, but as much as I'm an introvert, there are those little moments where I'm like, I am an extrovert and I do kind of want these things that used to be. They're not there.

Derek (33:56.784)
Well, you see, I never saw you as an extrovert... or as an introvert. I never, never.

Darcey Simmons (34:02.747)
I am so socially I'm the introvert. Work is different because I'm in my element at work, but outside of that, outside of that, I'm like, no, no, just everybody leave me alone.

Derek (34:05.616)
But...

I know you are. Yeah.

No, no. But, you know, when I talk to people and I'm sure you experienced this in the first few months of 2020 with a pandemic.

For a while, the introverts are like, yay, we don't have to go out. And then after a few more months, me too, me too. But after a while, the introverts are like, it's no fun if we don't have a choice.

Darcey Simmons (34:32.187)
I was one of them. Get me out.

Derek (34:45.136)
I want the freedom to live and breathe and have my being to go out and grab a pint or grab some ribs or whatever it is. As Memorial Day is coming up, people are going to want to socialize, whether it's family or friends or what have you.

Darcey Simmons (35:07.739)
So I think for the both of, Jason and I, I think we got very lucky in this regard. Definitely work, having to isolate away from work. I mean, I was the first one that was like, we need to come back, I think within a couple months. Just because as we talked about earlier, that meaning to see people face to face, being able to be in that space. And particularly in working with teenagers who,

Derek (35:22.256)
I know you were.

Darcey Simmons (35:35.195)
we're going through this transition. Like they needed out of their house, they needed spaces to be able to talk freely without feeling like people can hear me through walls and vents and all the crazy things that were happening.

Derek (35:45.872)
Exactly.

Darcey Simmons (35:50.747)
But they were also, you know, going through a sense, I worked with a lot of seniors who didn't get graduations, didn't get senior balls and the grief that was there. And they're like, whatever, like you're behind a computer screen. Like, what are you going to do? There's there's something that changes in the dynamic with that screen versus being in person. But we, you know, when I think back, like the biggest social loss, volleyball, I mean, we had to get an underground.

Derek (36:08.048)
Yeah.

Darcey Simmons (36:19.195)
volleyball group that met. We secretly rented out gym space and it was super late at night. Nobody knew about it, but we were playing volleyball in secret on Sunday nights from 10 at night, 10 p to 1 a because we knew people weren't going to be driving by, people weren't going to be seeing the cars. You know, we were lucky that we were able to get the space and eventually that became two nights a week. But there was like

14 or 15 of us. So we could always assure a six on six or four on four game. Nobody else was ever invited in and there was kind of the set rule. This gets out and it gets ruined. We have nothing and so it became very sacred. See, rebel. But, you know, outside of that, like pretty much everything that Jason and I did was outdoors and pretty like secluded. So we didn't have...

a lot, I mean we just spent a lot of time together. For better or for worse, but...

Derek (37:22.768)
and if you're listening and not watching this, Darcey just cringed. Like awkwardly.

Darcey Simmons (37:28.763)
I sure did. You know, and I, well, okay, and so there was a running joke, Jason is aware of this, when we all had to pack up and go home, even my family was like, who's gonna survive in the household? Who is gonna survive, Darcey or Jason? Because we are both very work focused.

So we see each other at night, we have rules, we always eat dinner together. No matter what, it may be 11 o 'clock at night, but we are having dinner together. And the weekends are pretty much always ours as a result of very busy work weeks.

but working together, you know, yeah, poor Jason. He had this great idea of like, my gosh, we can have like lunch dates, like see you downstairs in the kitchen at 12, I'll like make us lunch. And I'm like, I don't take a lunch. Like I'm gonna come down and grab food, but I'm in a session, I'm in a meeting, I'm doing something like I will eat to fuel the soul and the body, but I'm gonna eat lunch with you. And I'm like five days a week, like.

Derek (38:31.888)
No, you don't. Mm -mm.

Darcey Simmons (38:47.995)
No. No. But yeah, all of our activities were outdoors and we could do them because we didn't have to rely and we were very fortunate in that sense. We didn't have to rely on people being open for rentals of equipment and getting things that it was more like, where is the safe part of the world to be in? Well, that's where we're going to go. And that's this is what we're going to do while we're there.

which definitely, I know we were definitely lucky and privileged to have that. And yeah.

Derek (39:26.)
So you mentioned lunch. We did do lunches together. We made it a point. The Christmas prior to that, might have been a Christmas a year and a half before -ish, we got a magnetic dartboard because we made the mistake years ago of having a dartboard and darts make holes in walls.

Darcey Simmons (39:49.339)
They sure do.

Derek (39:49.488)
especially early on when you're not an expert. So we got a magnetic dart board and quite literally we played darts for like the first four months of the pandemic every day at lunchtime. As one of, you know, take a bite, you're up, that kind of thing, just standing in the kitchen and do what you do.

Darcey Simmons (39:58.715)
for your love.

Darcey Simmons (40:17.116)
perfected my cribbage game during the pandemic. I can I'm a badass at cribbage now. We go play with other people and she's like, I want you on my team only because you are you are brass enough to like just call people out be like two points for me.

Derek (40:21.328)
You're dead.

Darcey Simmons (40:38.843)
So we work really well together. I'm good at calling people out and paying attention to what everybody else is doing. I can't make a great hand, but he can. So when we team up and we're like, sweeping house. But yeah, he's like, seriously, I wasn't done yet. You're stealing my point. I'm like, you had 15 seconds. Like, it's my point now.

Derek (40:57.072)
So you're an observer. You're a watcher.

Darcey Simmons (41:00.027)
I'm a watcher.

And I remember every end to a fault. Even in school, grad school, people are like, you don't take notes. And I'm like, nah, I just have to sit here and listen and trust me, I'm not gonna forget. So you wanna go back 10 years and ask me what you said on February, whatever, 2004, I don't even remember it.

But yeah, there's pros and cons to that, but.

Derek (41:30.512)
See, I used to take notes all the time, but my, just my thought patterns, and I take notes, if I'm taking notes on something, I'm gonna miss the next thing that was said. Horrible note taker.

Darcey Simmons (41:43.131)
One of the questions patients always ask me. So I'm not a believer of having a desk in my office. It's a thing. It's my thing. I don't want a desk. I don't want a desk chair. I sit on couches. I sit on chairs. I curl up. My feet are usually never on the floor. They're not right now. It's who I am.

Derek (42:03.504)
You say your feet are not on the floor.

Derek (42:08.88)
called it called it. I know. I know.

Darcey Simmons (42:12.987)
So, you know, people are always like, well, you write, did you just write what I just said? And I'm like, no, it's 11 o 'clock. I'm writing what the 7 a person just said, not what you just said. Because if I take notes, it, there's so much that I don't need to know that I end up writing down.

Derek (42:33.456)
Right. That's my problem.

Darcey Simmons (42:35.675)
And I've trained my brain. If I take notes, I don't need to keep it up here. And the reality is I need it up here. I'm not opening that notebook back up. I'm not that person.

Derek (42:51.984)
I have drawers and drawers of old conference notes, things like that, that I've been to. No, not at all.

Darcey Simmons (42:59.579)
Yeah. Yeah. No.

Not necessary.

Derek (43:09.2)
So trainings, I know changing gears, trainings.

Darcey Simmons (43:11.515)
Yeah, I know.

Derek (43:15.632)
Live classes or self -paced?

Darcey Simmons (43:19.963)
like work wise, like if I'm doing like trainings for work.

Derek (43:24.944)
Yeah, we're talking CE. no, we're talking CEs. These are professional trainings. This isn't like fire safety stuff. You know what I'm talking about.

Darcey Simmons (43:33.979)
Okay, like work, work real life, not like my outside world.

Derek (43:40.44)
Right. Not volleyball meetings.

Darcey Simmons (43:44.124)
in person.

Derek (43:51.344)
Why? Me too, but why?

Darcey Simmons (43:52.443)
in person. Right? So here's what's interesting. I'm very introverted. Although, okay, so here's what's interesting. The past year, where have I been? I've been San Francisco, Detroit, New York City, Boston, and Charleston for trainings. I come back and everybody's first question, my God, did you meet people? Like, I was around people.

I was around people, I was with people. And they're like, why are you spending all this money? Like you could stay home and for a third of the price, you know, do the training virtually. And here, here's my kind of two takeaways from that. One, when you do the trainings virtually, particularly if it's a really large conference, they're only streaming certain presentations. So.

You know, some of those smaller breakouts that if you would want to go to them, you may not go to. And I skim ahead of time schedules, but I usually don't make up my mind until about 10 minutes before things start where I'm going. I'm a very in the moment. I'm going to decide there's four choices, which ones I'm taking, unless there's something that's like super stellar that stands out that I'm like, I have to go to this. This is a requirement.

Derek (45:04.192)
Yeah.

Darcey Simmons (45:16.987)
you know, every conference that I've come to this year, people are like, I'm looking for somebody to share a room. I'm like, no, no. My own, my own space. I need to decompress because I'm going to be around like 5 ,000 of you all day. I go to dinner by myself. I sight see by myself. some of the ones that I've been in have offered like day after conference, we go and kind of do a group tour of the city.

Derek (45:27.44)
Nope.

Derek (45:45.84)
Yeah.

Darcey Simmons (45:47.163)
Nope, I'd rather do it by myself and kind of be by myself. But I want to be there in person. Selection, because I can't make up my mind. Being able to feel like I have the full choice and not a limited condensed version. And it's like therapy. There's something different about being in the room.

Derek (46:14.16)
There is. And there's, for me, it's about that separation. I can attend a conference virtually here, still not the same thing. And it's live. And still not the same thing as being in the space. Because here, got the phone, got the dog, got the energy of the house, so to speak. And if it's self -paced?

I'm not getting around to it.

I mean, I still have like 40 credits worth of material that I paid for. I'll get to it when I need it.

Darcey Simmons (46:50.715)
I'm

Darcey Simmons (46:57.615)
I signed up for one of the new required trainings yesterday actually, and I'm like, well, thank God this is like open to me until January 1st, because what am I gonna do it December like 28th, even though I'm starting it now. Yeah, if it's not there in my face, yeah, I mean.

What's interesting though, I did take some online classes in undergrad and I really appreciated them. And they were not formatted the way online classes are today. They were all self -paced. But I think I only liked that because, well, I have my degree now so I can say it. The syllabus would come out a week before class would start. I would go buy the books. I would read the books typically during that week and that class became my focus for that week.

And then as soon as the class opened up, I literally was in every module making my posts. My papers were already halfway written that I was like, okay, I just took the 16 week class. I think it was usually like US history, astronomy I took online. And I'm like, condense it down because I was taking so many other courses that I was like, if I can go and do this in three weeks and get a B plus or an A.

Derek (48:06.224)
in a week.

Darcey Simmons (48:23.707)
Yep, get it done, get it over with, cross it off the list. And ironically, I picked the classes that were not interesting to me and that I didn't care about to do online.

The ones I was like, no, this is gonna be a really cool class, I was in person.

Derek (48:42.544)
I told you this? So without going into detail I'm going through some assessments at a local agency in town that their waitlist is somewhere between 12 and 15 months. You know which one I'm talking about. And I got an email from them today. It was...

I want to say it was last February or March that I got on their wait list. I saw them in March this year. So there was a 12 month wait for that. Filled out the forms, went in for the evaluation, did a couple of days of assessments and they're like, well, we have another, you know, your next set of assessments is coming up in June. So, okay. And they gave me three or four online assessments to go through.

Darcey Simmons (49:35.035)
haven't done them yet have you?

Derek (49:36.464)
Well, no, they called me today this morning and they said, so we understand, you know, we know you've had concerns with insurance because when you go to work for yourself, you give up that wonderful insurance that we both enjoyed working at the place. And they said, we really need them done so we can start working on your materials. So I did them today and I said,

There's this one, it's a 344 item assessment questionnaire. I don't even know the name of it. But so I was like, well, I don't even have the link to that anymore. You gave me that two months ago. What do you expect? So but it's done and I'm all set. So.

Derek (50:34.064)
But clinically, I can focus. I can remember stuff. And people are like, how do you remember that thing that I told you like six months ago? I said, I don't remember when you told me it. That's not really relevant right now. But I do know this is, so we're coming back to this. OK, switching gears, and we're good.

Derek (50:59.952)
But yeah, the trainings, the self -paced stuff, yeah, I'll do them when I look at when my renewals are due and crank out a few of them. You know that feeling.

Darcey Simmons (51:12.763)
downfall of the CASAC. All the trainings are free for the CEUs. When do I, hi New York state, when do I do them? Two weeks before my renewal. A weekend. I sit and crank out a week of training.

Derek (51:17.648)
Yeah.

Derek (51:29.616)
And that's 60, that's not even 36.

Darcey Simmons (51:34.939)
Yeah. So it becomes, I have a cancellation. Get in a one hour training. Somebody no showed. Get in a one hour training. we have nothing to do on Saturday. Luckily, my renewal is in the winter. And OK, maybe this is what not helping me. it's a snowstorm. Can crank out 10 hours of training today.

Derek (51:35.888)
60 credits.

Derek (51:41.232)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Derek (51:54.896)
because you're not out on the boat fishing.

Darcey Simmons (51:57.691)
I'm not out on the boat.

Derek (52:02.448)
I do admit, speaking of the boat, I admit I am disappointed you didn't join me to go down to Washington DC. I am. And I'm putting on blast here for the 250 people that listen.

Darcey Simmons (52:12.443)
 was talking with a colleague who is out in the Seattle area and I was like, yeah, I could have went down last weekend to see a certain they're like, like this dead like, and I'm like, for shame me like, I was putting money on weather. There's something else going on that weekend to was April 7, there was like a whole bunch of stuff happening and I'm like,

But yeah, the boat gets priority. Boat weather gets priority. And we have made a decision. So the irony is there's a marina right across the street from our house. They tend to do a lot of transient docking. So for folks who are doing the great loop and coming around and a lot of bigger boats, I mean, they're really a marina for the bigger yachts that you see crossing Oneida Lake.

Derek (52:47.344)
I know it does.

Darcey Simmons (53:11.963)
but they do have a few smaller small boat spots. And we've been on a waiting list ever since we got the boat. So four years, cause we're like, it's just convenient. We can literally just walk across the street and be on our boat. Which negates the facts. This is how like weird we are. Negates the fact that we bought our boat so we can keep it in the garage and go anywhere at any time. So.

Conditions on our lake are horrible. We can go Lake Ontario, we can go Skaneateles we can go to Otisco we can go to Cayuga, we can go way up and hit St. Lawrence River. But we made a rule for this year. So last year we put our boat away first week of December.

And we're kind of shooting ourselves in the foot end of December into January because the weather was so warm. And we also ice fish. We have great gear, by the way, for ice fishing. And I just want the universe to know we bought it. And now there is no ice on the middle lake ever since we've we've purchased it. So thank you, universe, for taking all my money. But so we've made a rule. If. The boat is going to stay in, we are not going to winterize the boat.

and keep it in the garage until we can go out and utilize ice fishing gear on our own lake, which is Oneida. And then we've made another rule that if we do that two years in a row, global warming is not going to reverse itself and we are just going to sell all the ice fishing gear. So I'm, you know, it's weird. It's weird to think we've had friends who they never put their boat away this year.

And my soul was really jealous of that. I'm like, I want to be on my boat. I want to be on my boat.

Darcey Simmons (55:06.075)
We have a really great year. It's not cold on our boat in the middle of February.

Derek (55:14.192)
getting on a boat in the middle of February. It's not happening. Nope. Nope.

Darcey Simmons (55:15.131)
Derek's like, I don't care. I don't care how warm or cold it is. You know, so we've, it's our fun thing to do. It's our thing.

Derek (55:25.36)
I'm surprised but nobody went with me. I'm like

I had a wonderful time.

Darcey Simmons (55:37.915)
I don't know.

I don't, like I know a few other providers in the area, but I'm not exposed to a lot of people. I feel like I know more doctors in the area than I know other therapists in the area, which is kind of weird, but it is what it is. Yeah, it's also interesting going to trainings and like the bigger conferences and a lot of these conferences that are my first time going.

have been around for well over 20, 30 years. And it's definitely like weird walking into the room being like, okay, I'm the new kid who knows nobody. And there are tables full of people from all across the country who know each other because they've been going to the same conference year after year after year and getting to know each other. You know, that there's like the table of us millennials that are just like.

Yep, let's eat our breakfast and play on our phone and hi, yep, you can sit there and back on our phones. And here we go, we come full circle going to the conferences like living in your house. You may know who your neighbor is and you may not.

Derek (56:54.032)
God, you just did that. You totally did that.

Derek (57:01.584)
That was magic.

Darcey Simmons (57:03.131)
Boom.

Yeah, it's sad, but it is, it's the way it is.

Derek (57:12.496)
Did you, early in the pandemic, did you ever do one of those happy hour Zoom, happy hour Zoom calls with anybody?

Darcey Simmons (57:21.243)
I think I did one. I think there was one that I could go to. I think because I had a no show, ironically. I think I was like a party crasher to the group. But other than that, no, because they were always during the week and they were always at like five or six or seven o 'clock. And I'm like, dude, that's my prime time. Although at this point, everything is my prime time. Huh?

Derek (57:39.184)
right.

That's when all the teenagers show up to therapy. Right. That's when all the teenagers show up to therapy.

Darcey Simmons (57:51.035)
Used to be, used to be, but I've had like referrals coming in. I'm like, yeah, I have like every other Thursday at nine o 'clock available and parents are like, we'll take it. Okay, you're gonna have to pull your kid out of school every other Thursday.

Derek (58:06.352)
It's fine.

Darcey Simmons (58:07.611)
It's fine.

Derek (58:10.16)
Yeah, because so -and -so said, they've got a therapist, here's my girl.

Darcey Simmons (58:15.131)
Yeah, I know my girl, call my girl. But you know what's interesting? So I jokingly, see, I jokingly started back in the pandemic. I was like, I don't know, I can get you in at 7 a Like kind of joking.

Derek (58:32.784)
Okay.

Darcey Simmons (58:34.427)
It's one of my most requested spots. I've done 6 a .m.'s, ironically for teenagers, not for adults, my teenage patients. They're like, six o 'clock works great. I don't have to navigate around practice, finding rides after school, I don't have to miss school, and I'm like, hey, you are very type A. You would get up early. Yeah, let's explore that.

Derek (58:36.784)
Mm -hmm.

You know.

Derek (58:56.272)
Let's explore that too.

Darcey Simmons (59:01.691)
And literally I had one kid, this was years ago, who literally was like, here are all the reasons, it basically made a PowerPoint, here are all the reasons 6 a would work for me. And I'm like.

Okay, we'll try it. I don't know how well this is gonna work for me, but we'll try it. But it worked because that kid brought so much energy into the session.

And I have to be very careful with those 7 a .s of who goes into what appointment because if I get somebody who's just like, so.

what to talk about today. I'm like, 7 a we can't do this. My 10 a brain, we can do that. 7 a not so much. You know, my eight o 'clock, eight p .s have become more consistent. Nine p .s not as consistent. But then I'm like, people showed up for therapy at 10 o 'clock at night. Because I had nothing to do during the pandemic. So.

We all needed help. The world needed help. So, yep, 10 p Let's go. I, in some ways, loved those late nights. I'm a night owl. I loved those late nights.

Derek (01:00:18.896)
See, I'm not a late night owl. I mean, I am happy. I'm happy seeing a client at seven in the morning. I've done it. I've also been the client at seven in the morning. No problem. Evenings are easier to fill. They're, you know, anywhere from three o 'clock. I run two schedules. I run a morning seven to two lunch at noon. We're not playing darts anymore, but still lunch at noon.

Darcey Simmons (01:00:31.235)
Yeah.

Derek (01:00:47.568)
And I run a 3 to 9 or 3 to 10 even.

and Wednesdays, like today, I'm off. Gives me a little bit of a kickstart to my week.

Darcey Simmons (01:01:03.419)
at the end of the day for all the people listening, if you find the right therapist you make the time work.

Darcey Simmons (01:01:15.707)
If it's a fit, you make it work. Just like I, you know, I jokingly say there are some of my own providers that I'm like, you moved to Russia, I'm moving with you. Like, we're like this, this, I, you're part of my care team. Like we're, we're not, we're not parting ways. You make it work.

Derek (01:01:38.992)
I will change cell carriers. If GPS can't even get me to you, I will still make it happen. But back decades ago, when folks were looking for mentors, the mentor might say, I have a slot at 4 in the morning. Do you want to study what I'm doing? Because I'm doing it at 4 in the morning.

Darcey Simmons (01:01:42.235)
whatever we have to do.

Darcey Simmons (01:01:46.715)
whatever it needs to happen happens. But that's important.

Derek (01:02:06.768)
No? How serious are you? How motivated are you? Your 6 a clients or 7 a clients are going to be motivated. Mine are.

Darcey Simmons (01:02:18.459)
Yep, and they never miss. No. And people ask, they're like, your no-show rate is so low. And I'm like, cause I have the right fit. I have the right fit of folks who are working with me.

Derek (01:02:37.904)
And I tell folks all the time, the fit, the interpersonal fit that we have, you get to decide if I fit.

Darcey Simmons (01:02:49.435)
PFFT

Derek (01:02:51.6)
you fit when you show up.

skeleton key.

Darcey Simmons (01:02:55.707)
I had this conversation a couple of weeks ago.

Darcey Simmons (01:03:02.011)
group of people that we've stayed connected since grad school. And we don't talk all that often, but when we do, it's a long conversation. And somebody brought up the idea of kind of like the mental health TikTok. And none of us, I mean, I started to make a few TikToks just kind of more focused on the fishing stuff, because we've got some stuff off our sleeves that we're going to do later this year. So I had to learn TikTok.

but you know, instead of focusing on neurodivergence, which is important, but I'm going to put it out there. We are all neurodivergent in our own way. No two brains are the same. we're all neurodivergent. So let's end that trend. and can we normalize the trend of therapy that it is okay as a therapist to have discussions with patients and as.

More than okay if you are on the patient side to have the discussion with your therapist about fit. And it is okay to fire each other because it is not personal.

Derek (01:04:14.192)
Yeah, we've both been fired.

Darcey Simmons (01:04:15.419)
 take off and people are like, go for it, Darcey And I'm like, I don't have followers. I still don't know how to make TikToks.

Derek (01:04:24.528)
I'll help you. I have a few.

Darcey Simmons (01:04:26.715)
I don't know how invested I am, but this idea of, when I get that referral of, I'm a friend of a friend of so -and -so, is a conversation of, I'm honored that you were referred to me. I'm glad that you feel like I could be a fit. I'm a therapist, not a miracle worker.

and I may be a fit for a lot of people and I may not be a fit for a lot of people and that is completely okay.

And I will force, I usually force that conversation like fourth or fifth session in, how's our fit doing? Well, I haven't, I haven't read off the get -go, but I follow up with it. with, you know, where, where are we at? And, you know, here's some honest feedback. Here's some honest feedback as to, you know, sitting in my chair where I think that we are. And also, you know, sitting in your chair, where do we think we are?

Derek (01:05:11.984)
You wait. Well, I do the check -in. Yeah, I do the check -in usually after about a month.

Derek (01:05:36.592)
And of course, we refer back to the treatment plan. We said we were going to work on XYZ. I'm more patient -centered, so they drive. And we're off track. Do you want to come back to it? Are we changing the plan? I'm OK either way. Just help me to understand here.

Darcey Simmons (01:05:56.251)
Just don't crash the car while I'm in it. Thanks.

Derek (01:06:00.752)
Well, that's a whole thing for mandated reporters. So no, let's not talk about crashing cars today.

Darcey Simmons (01:06:03.955)
Yep, let's not crash the car today.

Derek (01:06:09.264)
I'm looking at the time. We've gone well over an hour by now. Do you have any sessions tonight or are you done?

Darcey Simmons (01:06:17.371)
No, I was done early today. Self -care Wednesdays, I'm done early. Every Wednesday, May, June, July, August, and I believe September.

Derek (01:06:32.016)
Wednesday is my non -clinical day. Wednesday is my media. All the other business -y stuff, including going to the gym for myself. So, a little self -care there.

Darcey Simmons (01:06:42.907)
Self -care Wednesdays.

Derek (01:06:45.424)
I've enjoyed this time. We haven't talked in a while, aside from like Facebook Messenger here and there.

Darcey Simmons (01:06:48.859)
No, we haven't.

Yeah, I was gonna say texting.

Derek (01:06:55.28)
Well, that too.

Darcey Simmons (01:06:55.699)
And I mean, I'm I'll put it out to the universe. I'm even shitty at responding to that. So like.

It's fine.

Derek (01:07:04.048)
Yeah, me too. But with people... But when you recognize that it's not intentional...

Darcey Simmons (01:07:06.907)
I come back. I always come back to it. I always pick up my phone and be like, what?

Darcey Simmons (01:07:15.835)
is never intentional. Yeah.

Derek (01:07:16.4)
 If Darcey doesn't get back to me, she'll get back to me when she feels like it or notices it or, wow, and then she'll feel, she might feel bad, she might not, or she might say, yeah, she does this sometimes.

Darcey Simmons (01:07:27.931)
Sometimes I do. Sometimes I'm like, what really gets me going? And I'm not getting old. I'm not getting old. But I have moments where I'm like, holy crap, I typed it out and I didn't hit the send button. That was like two days ago. I'm like, well, thank you, Facebook, for at least keeping my thoughts there for me.

Derek (01:07:36.944)
Cool.

Derek (01:07:43.952)
Yeah.

Derek (01:07:52.24)
So Gmail is my problem. I go to Gmail and I'm like, I have 47 drafts right now. What are they? Some of them are, I started a message. Nope. Just didn't. We touch base a different way. But some of them, I've actually got like half typed out messages to people. They're not work related. And they're definitely not the clients. But still, it's like, really?

Darcey Simmons (01:08:22.971)
Let's see you came back to it. How many of those were drafts that you didn't realize you had as a draft but you already sent an email because you started a new one? Because I do that all the time.

Derek (01:08:25.488)
Sometimes.

Derek (01:08:33.232)
That's probably about 25 % to 30%, if I had to guess.

Darcey Simmons (01:08:35.611)
I do that all the time. But yeah, it's interesting. That's like my personal life. I do that work life right on top of it.

Derek (01:08:46.576)
well this is, so I also have the problem of certain clients don't do email. Now I have to check the permissions and stuff like that. And it's like, you do text. So then I pull the phone out and I'm more than happy to send a text. And anytime somebody does text me, they get a, you know, if this is a life, life threatening emergency, you know, please call 911 or go to your nearest emergency center. that's an automatic reply to anybody who texts me on my work phone.

But yeah.

because we don't live on our computers 24 hours a day.

Darcey Simmons (01:09:23.835)
No. Although, you know, old, your old stomping grounds, we did like little superlative type things. And one of them was quickest to respond to emails. And literally in the group, I was like, damn it, Derek's not here. Fuck, it's me.

Derek (01:09:25.808)
Thankfully. Although, no.

Derek (01:09:48.976)
When was this?

Darcey Simmons (01:09:50.939)
a couple of weeks ago.

Derek (01:09:54.864)
wow.

Darcey Simmons (01:09:56.059)
And I'm like, Derek, thanks. Fastest to respond to. And I literally said, I'm like, yeah, a work email? Yep. Right on it. Personal email? you could have emailed me six months ago. Might still be sitting there.

Derek (01:10:05.904)
Yeah, on it.

Derek (01:10:14.736)
Well, I also know that if I don't respond within like the first minute, I'm not gonna.

Darcey Simmons (01:10:20.635)
Mm -hmm.

Derek (01:10:22.928)
Nope.

And that's a whole other conversation.

Darcey Simmons (01:10:26.427)
Yeah.

Derek (01:10:31.472)
But I need to thank you again for your time. We'll try to end the call and the session here. I've had fun. I wasn't sure what we were getting into. Thanks for doing this.

Darcey Simmons (01:10:31.803)
Bye.

Darcey Simmons (01:10:44.603)
Yeah, no problem. Maybe we'll come back in a couple months and we can help. When is your your certification done?

Derek (01:10:55.76)
end of June, middle of the end of June.

Darcey Simmons (01:10:59.707)
I should be done. I think I'm filing in July. So maybe in six months we'll do a sex therapy. We'll do a sex therapy.

Derek (01:11:10.704)
We can do that. We can do that. Look forward to it.

Darcey Simmons (01:11:14.491)
go into all the way dating has changed and relationships are changing and...

Derek (01:11:20.976)
Maybe we can explore when you're gonna go solo. But that's a different day.

Darcey Simmons (01:11:27.259)
I don't know, that's a hard one. You see, I like to be by myself, but I like people. See, it's a whole thing. It's a whole thing. I like my creature comforts.

Derek (01:11:29.04)
Join me.

Derek (01:11:35.408)
know it is. Well, so start a practice and hire people that you hope.

Darcey Simmons (01:11:41.179)
and that's...

No.

Derek (01:11:46.544)
Pay some rent, get some furniture, call it a day.

Darcey Simmons (01:11:50.811)
Yeah, I don't know. We'll see. We'll see where the world takes me. I've thought about Jason didn't take me seriously last night. He's like, come back in like four to six weeks. Let me know about what either of these topics, because I literally went from, I think I want to go to Disney as an adult and he's never been to Disney.

And he's like, and I've only I've been once and I was a little kid. I remember bits and pieces of it, but I'm like, everybody's posting like Disney is an adult and Disney is an adult looks like a like a blast. And so he's like, when do you want to do this? And I go. Huh?

Derek (01:12:33.712)
Can be.

It can be if you go with the right people. Absolutely.

Darcey Simmons (01:12:39.611)
So he's like, when do you want to do this? And I go, early August. Wait, so he's like, he's like, I am like the fairest skin white boy with red hair and you're gonna take me to Florida in the middle of August. And I'm like, it'll be fine. And he's like, so then he goes, well, why not like?

Derek (01:12:44.72)
No. No.

Derek (01:12:53.968)
Yeah.

Derek (01:12:59.792)
No, it won't.

Darcey Simmons (01:13:07.739)
October or November and I'm like, maybe I'll go back to school. Maybe I'll go back to college.

Derek (01:13:14.832)
Look, the last time we went, I went with the kid, 21 now, in September. After they turned 21. No, it was just this last September. Had a blast. I went as Wreck -It Ralph. The kid went as Vanellope Von Schweetz one day. We Disney bounded.

Darcey Simmons (01:13:24.571)
Yeah, it wasn't that long ago, was it?

Derek (01:13:38.704)
The cast members were like, you guys are fantastic. I mean, the kid ordered various pieces of the costume. I just got a nice t -shirt that had the thing on it. It's simple. But all the cast, this is great. People are taking our picture. It was hilarious. But not August. Not August.

Darcey Simmons (01:13:55.835)
Yeah, I wanna do.

Darcey Simmons (01:14:00.859)
So heat.

Derek (01:14:02.192)
we walked 50 miles in less than a week.

Darcey Simmons (01:14:06.043)
Okay, we're out on our boat in 100 degree weather for nine, 10 hours in a day.

Derek (01:14:13.2)
in New York versus Orlando.

Darcey Simmons (01:14:16.891)
It's humid here, dry heat there, it rains in the afternoon. Experience. It will be an experience.

Derek (01:14:17.488)
Trust me.

Derek (01:14:27.44)
You're killing me.