#3 - Riot MMO BIG BADS | The Holy Trinity | Runterra Lore

Send us a Text Message.

Entgrove and Kong Quest welcome you to the Brazen Hydra, a podcast coming straight to you from a pub in the Heart of Bilgewater.
This episode and more at www.TheBrazenHydra.com

Support the Show.

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@TheBrazenHydra
Twitter: https://twitter.com/TheBrazenHydra
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thebrazenhydra/

1:00:00

Hello and welcome to the Creaking SaltSoak Tables at the BrazenHydro Pub in those water.We're your hosts, Ant Groven.Conquest!And today we'll be sharing a pint andtalking all things Runeterra and beyond.Okay, so last time we did not finish thebig beds of Runeterra.But I think we...Yeah, I think we startoff, we just close that off.Let's close the book on thatand get a couple more done.Because we talked about Irelian Soul.Mm-hmm.Right? Big cosmic dragon.Big threat.Course. Big threat.We talked about the Watchers.Mm-hmm.I think that's where we stopped.I don't know if we talked about anyone.Did we talk about anyone?We didn't really talk about anyone else.I mean, like,sorry, the two obvious ones, right?And I guess Runeterra even, like, is notthe most obvious, but...Ah, yeah, I guess we really...I mean, we tried focusing on some, like,smaller beds here and there.But even then, yeah, like, there's not...Yeah, I guess we onlytalked about those two, huh?We only talked about...I think we only talked about those two,but there are other big beds.So we have...So there's a character, a lot of peopleare familiar with him.Don't actually know his backstory.It's Mordekaiser, the Iron Revenant.Oh, I don't knowMordekaiser. Who the heck is that?So we have DeathThreat in the Shadow Isles.We'll talk about him later.There's death in the Shadow Isles.That's not the only deaththreat that we have on Runeterra.So Mordekaiser, the Iron Revenant, was...He's from the land thatwe now know today as Noxus.Mm-hmm.That was back when they were called Noxi.And he was the king.Like, this guy was the ruler.Picture Genghis Khan.That's the kind of guy he was.Like, completelydominated the entire area.Oh, jeez. Okay.Eventually he dies and he'sunhappy with the afterlife.He's like, "Well, this is stupid.Like, I'm just kind ofin this nothing space."And I expected more.Yeah.This guy wanted, like,Valhalla for himself.That's what he thought he deserved.And so he gets pissed andbasically he refuses to pass on.Just from his sheer willpoweralone, he refuses to pass on.And eventually these witchesget together and they're like,"Okay, we're going to resummon this guy."And so he basically persuades them,he kind of, like, manipulates them intoresummoning him into this world.But not just as himself,but much more powerful.And that's where he comes back asMordekaiser, like, with this armor.And, like, his will is almost holdingtogether his armor and his form.Oh, that sounds cool.Yeah.And that's when hetakes over all of the Noxus.Like, he takes over the whole area.It's not called Noxus yet.And he's the one whobuilds up the Immortal Bastion,which is like the main city in Noxus.Oh, wow.And that's where he rules.He dominates over all.Eventually, all the other people in Noxuswho are called Noxi at this time,mm-hmm, they take, they band together,all the other Noxi, band together,and they take back the Immortal Bastion.They don't take it back.They take it over andkill him, basically.Oh, wow.Yeah, we don't, I don't know if they takeit over, butbasically they overthrow him.He dies.Yeah, he dies.They probably don't exactly have a nextin line to the throne, but he's dead.They don't want him, is what's important.Yeah, exactly.So they take it back, they kill him.They inherit the Immortal Bastion, whichis still the maincapital city of Noxus today.But this was actuallyall part of his plan.To die?Yes.His second death wasliterally a part of his plan,because when he goes back to theafterlife, which waspretty empty when he got there,is now populated with all the people thathe killed while on the throne.And he dominates all of them, and heraises an Immortal dead army of like,Immortal army.Yeah.And now he's, he used them tobuild up his own Afterworld.Like he basicallyruns the Afterworld now.What the heck?Which we don't know much about, but he's,he basically built it up and he has an,his whole Immortal army there.And to this day, people fear his return.He'll find another way to come backpermanently with hisarmies and just take over again.This seems just a natural born conqueror.You got to respect his, you know, hiswillingness to just constantly feel theurge to enslave people.Yeah.I think his name was like Shen, ShenZu'al or something like that.I got to look up the exactname, but now he is Mord Kaisen.But man, I feel like Noxus or Noxi, like,you know, like whatever was back then,even back then weren't people stillpretty open about like,yeah, you're the strongest.You're in charge.Yeah.People must have really hated him.Yeah.Like if, of all people out of all thelands in Runeterra, if,if Noxus is a place wherepeople are uprising against you, youknow, like you, likeuniformly, that's, that's on you.That's a problem.You're carrying.Yeah.Like, wow.He's, he must be hated.I don't really think about it, but yeah.Yeah.People just really like living under him.Yeah, which is wild.Yeah.They were, so they were called Noxibefore all the way up until the Runewars.When the Runewars happened, they tookshelter in the immortal Bastion.And then when they emerged in the room,they all survived inthe immortal Bastion,took shelter there.That's when they calledthemselves Noxus, like the eye to us.Yeah.Yeah.And so that, so before that,they're always called Noxi.Oh, okay.That's the big threat.That's the big threat there.My God.All right.So we don't know muchabout the afterlife, huh?But we do know there is an afterlife.It's weird.Like in Ionia, we do see, um, Yone die.Well, he's, yeah, we see him die and himgo to the afterlife.He almost goes, he goesto like the spirit realm.There's like demons there and stuff.And is that like different from where?I think so because this guy went to theafterlife and he justdidn't see anything.That's true.But I think maybe like hewas almost in purgatory.Like he wasn't a good person.Oh, yeah.But then why everyone else that hekilled, but it seemed likehe almost went to this placeand then everyone that hekilled went to this place.Yeah.It's like, it's morelike the every man place.Maybe like if you're attuned with thespirits in that way, you know, you end upwherever they went in Ionia.Maybe.Maybe Ionia is like its own little thing.Yeah.Or just like, yeah, depending on howclose you are to like spirits, I guess.You know, I think theafterlife always stays a mystery.Yeah, me too.That's very important.There are some things in theworld that should never be.They should be there, but never explored.I completely agree.Yep.And that's that's aharp about MMOs, right?Is that like eventually you're going torun out of places toexplore without making new ones.And you're going to look at places like,you know, like theafterlife and you're going to think,oh, well, that's an obvious place to go.Right.We haven't gone there yet.It's no.Don't do it, especially the afterlife,because then all of asudden you're seeing all thesecharacters who had emotional deathsthroughout the course of the MMO.And it's just like, oh,well, that all meant nothing.You can just go see them now.Not really dead.They're just there.They just moved.There's something to be said about everysingle time there's an expansion,you feel like youhave to go somewhere new.Yeah.Why is that always the case?Why can't we?Why can't we go to like places wherelet's say that they start withDemacia, Noxus and Frolljord, right?And they everywhere else is an expansion,which isn't what I thought.But yeah, let's say that they do that.They just do all ofValor on maybe Piltover.And then we go to all the other places.We never go back therefor another expansion.I feel like you can 100%do another expansion there.Like maybe that's when Mordekaiser comesout and they justrevamped Noxus like crazy.It's all dated.Like everything's brand new and that'sthat like revitalizes the world.And then you couldput something in there.I think World of Warcraft has like thoselittle characters thatwhatever you can teleport backinto the old.Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.I think that's perfectly fine being ableto like go into a different like phasewhere you're in the older Noxus if youwant to quest through there.Yeah.Because the storytechnically follows that path.So that old Noxus is still there, youknow, like for people thatare just starting the game.Yeah.But then when you go back to the updatedversion, because that's when theexpansion hits, you know,you follow the story just like you can goin Darnassus right now, eventhough it burns down later.Yeah, absolutely.Because then also nice thing about thatis that it makes thingsthat are already establishedcan continue to like grow and change.Yes.I think that's withoutdeleting the old world.It's not that I'm like,you don't just delete it.Like you don't take it over.Like, yeah, I know we don't do that.It's all gone.Mulgore is completely fucked up.No, yeah, no, that was a big issue withcataclysm is thatlike, like, technically,things didn't change becausethe people there are changing.It changed because freaking big dragonshowed up and you'd fireeverywhere on the Earth.Yeah, I didn't like that.There's a big difference, I think.Compared to this, what I'm saying, like,okay, you have the stuff like that.If you're starting as a Noxus person,that that even though thatexpansion later completelyrevamped Noxus, it's still your that'sthe same starting area and that same.Yeah, yeah, that doesn't change.They don't have to.Yeah, they don't have to like rewriteeverything to fit this new this newprogression in the story.Exactly.The second layer on top that you explorelater and that's makesthe world feel alive.Agreed. That's so insanely important.I mean, I feel like everyMMO is guilty of that, right?Even like Final Fantasy 14, those firstthree, like, factionbased zones that you're in,like, you know, they'rereally never going to change.I'm not expecting those those big threefactions, those bigthree zones to ever changein Final Fantasy 14 because guess what?You got to go to this new place.And now it's time for these completelynew characters to have the spotlight.And it's like, OK, soeverything's just kind of gone.Yeah, everything's just kind of in aglass frozen state everywhere else.So it's like, OK, we're going to need ifyou're going to spend allthis time writing out thiswhole world, make it change.Keep it dynamic.Keep it interesting.I don't know why you have to completelystop everything so wecan focus on Freljord.No, dude.Everything should be moving.Even if it obviously like even if like wehave like a Freljord expansion,the focus should be Freljord.But like still, that doesn't mean youcan't have other thingsgoing on in response toFreljord in response to like thewatchers, you know, starting to like moveand shake the earth.Yeah, like that.We should have some quests in like theMasia of people freaking out.You know, armies shouldbe moving around bonding.Yeah.Of our armies responding, we should bethere helping outpreparing for what's to come.Yeah, like that.You just keep everything alive, keepeverything moving because that'ssomething that most ofthe Mo's are guilty of.It's a problem.Yeah, it's all the waydown to like Bilgewater.People are talking like we heard stuffgoing on in the north.Yeah.And like, how do Iwant to profit off of it?You know, yeah, exactly.Yeah, like how am I going to sell arms toDemacia to defend themselves?Yeah, it should be fun.Little like quests anddungeons and all that stuff.They should be cropping up everywhere,not just consolidated in one place.That's like the onlyplace that's moving with time.Yeah, that's really this is that's like areally big point for me inthe MMO that I want to makesure that there was a there's that onegame, Ashes of CreateAshes of Creation, right?Where they have like the node system andthe world's always changing.And this thing with the Amazon MMO, NewWorld, New World, theworld's always changing.Yeah, I think that they may have gone inlike a bit too far and abit too much focused on theactual. That's not like enough.I feel like the whole there are changeslike node system, right?And this node was controlled by thisgroup and then it'll becontrolled by another group.Yeah, I know.They're more like just likea structural professional.Yeah, high level.Very like just plain old.There was a house here.Now it's a different house.Yeah, they had that back in Crusade withthat little place in thebeginning and how far is it?Oh, yeah, the conquer.Yeah, conquer that that main tower, it'sAlliance or Word Flags.But I'm talking about like actual change,like the world isevolving and changing over time.And you're not you're not taking awayanything from the pastbecause the past is still there.Yeah, I completely agree.Like the all right, themain character is the world.All right. Not the expansion of the week.Yes, exactly.Everything should tosome extent stay relevant.Does that mean every single zone needs tobe updated every time a new patch drops?No, but anytime something importanthappens, there should beresponses where you are in thesein these older zones, having things youhave to do because then guess what, too?That means you're going tohave people all over Runeterra.You're not just going to have people allstuck in freaking Ioniawhen the Ionia expansion drops.Yep.You're going to have new players walkingout of Noxus and it's notgoing to be an empty freakingfield. Yeah, I think that'sespecially for new players.Keeping these original zones relevant isgoing to be insanely important.And they have no reason not to becausethese zones rock andthere's so much they can dowith them for years.Man, this is making me want to tangentreally hard into the leveling experience.But I feel like let's save that's goingto be that's going to be a video.Yeah, yeah, that'sgoing to be a whole episode.Hunter, let's let's try to really finishthese big beds ofRuneterra because I don't want itto bleed over into like, oh, my God, thisis why beds of Runeterra.This is why we onlycovered two big beds last time.This could have kept going.Yeah, easily.Okay, so the next big bed, I will say, ishere heard of the Darken.The Darken.Sounds familiar.Okay, so in Shurima, in Shurima.Shurima.Is it Shurima?No, I'm pretty sure it's Shurima becausewe both said Shurima.No, it's Shurima.Right.Oh, no.Shurima, Shurima.We're good.Okay.Okay.In Shurima, you have the ascended, right,who rise up from the Sun Disk.Yeah. Which is the power of Aurelion's soulbeing stolen, and hehas to shoot him off.They're stealing his power via the SunDisk to raise up ascended God Warriors.Yeah.Now, at this time back in the past, youhave the Shurima andIshtal, their allies.They work together to build the Sun Disk,and there's ascendedGod Warriors in both.Ecathea, bottom area, doesnot like being ruled by Shurima.They eventually revolt.They're getting their butts kickedbecause there's Shurimaand Ishtal God Warriors.So it's kind of tough to win there.Yeah.So they try to release thesecret weapon known as the Void.Oh, wow.And that backfire is pretty bad becausethe Void comes out, it starts killing,it kills everyone pretty well.Undiscriminately.Yeah.I don't think the Voidcares very much for either side.Yep.Zilean actually...So we may actually go back toEcathea one day because Zileanwent in an attempt to save as manycivilians as he could,innocent people as he could.He tells everyone to come to his tower,and then he removes his tower from time.And so it's stuck in a stasis.The Void that was getting into the tower,as well as the people,it's just frozen in time,that whole tower.But back in the regulartimeline, time is falling normally,and Shurima and Ishtal arestruggling to fight the Void.And eventually they win, right?By understanding that the Void, you can'treally fight it, you justhave to let it stagnate.Without any organic matter or magic, theVoid just kind of fallsinto a stasis and eventuallyfalls dormant.Oh wow.And so that's the strategy.That's why Shurima literally removesEcathea from the map,because they don't want anyone to go nearEcathea, they want itto just be forgotten,never to be explored again,and just like this dead zone.No one go near it because if you go nearit, you'll wake up the Void.Oh man, okay.Wow.That's terrifying.Yeah, we're gonna have to go thereeventually, we'regonna have to wake him up.And then back in Shurima a little bitafter that, Azir tries toascend, the Sun Disk falls,and at this point, like the...I can go into a lot of details there, butregardless, the SunDisk eventually falls,and the people of Shurima look to theascended for guidance,but the ascended arestarting to get like real effed up.Because they justfought a war with the Void.They're almost like they're corrupted bywhat they've seen, fighting the Void.They start losing their minds and goingcrazy, and they become darkened.In darkened, they start raising likemortal armies tobasically conquer the world.Oh wow.And if they darkenour aspects, that are...They're ascended, yeah, they're ascended.Oh okay.They became corrupted.Oh wow, okay.Gotcha.Wow.Oh jeez.That's problematic.How long have they beenwriting this kind of stuff?Where just all these problems arecropping up and wehave yet to solve them.Oh no, there's more.We're not even done yet.There's a lot of problems.So these darken, right?They eventually, the aspects of Targon,who are the ones thathelped raise up these immortalgod warriors in Shurima, because they'rethe ones that imprisoned Aurelion's souland started siphoning hispower for this future unknown war.Yeah.They got involved and basicallyimprisoned all thesedarken in their weapons.Oh.And that's why you have guys like Caineand Ionia are wielding the site.That site contains the souls of one ofthe darken and thedarkens hold other ladies.Or look at that new character.What's her name?The dog one.Oh, I know what you're talking about.Anyways, yeah.She's like...It's a dog that literally ate the dagger.Oh.That had imprisoned the darken.The darken.Wow.Yeah.And so you have all these darken bladesrunning around and they're like...Basically their wholegoal is to kind of...Some of them at least, their goal is tobasically come back togetherand reconquer the world.Oh my lord.Okay.Wow.They're trying to find vessels.Like Ains' guy, the guythat's in his weapon is...He's trying to take over Caine andthat'll be his vessel.Oh wow.There's a lot ofpossession going on these days.Tyrantara, I've noticed.Just...Geez.It has to do a lot with whenever you getto the ascended stuff.Yeah.Yeah, as we startseeing a lot of possession.Whenever you start getting closer toTargum, there tends tobe some possession stuff.Oh man.So like, this stuff has been written outfor a long time now, I think, right?Like all this darken stuff.Oh yeah.Which is crazy to me that they'redefinitely setting up forthese kind of like status andresolution eventually.Yep.A great way to resolute them.Yeah.An MMO faction.It's great.Yep.It's crazy that it just feels likeeverything is culminating to this game.It's so insane to methat they've been really...It feels like they've been thinking aboutthis for a long time now.Yeah.It's just like, "Oh,good. Honestly. Good."That's how you do it.You gotta have your story, your world allset up way before you'reeven thinking about MMO.That's the crazy thing.That's why I think everyone's went crazywhen they announced the right MMOs,because the world's already there.The strawberries are already there.The conflicts are already there.Like these unresolved massive threats.Yeah.Are already there.Yeah.At least the ones that we know about.I'm not even mentioning all of them.These are just like the really...Yeah, the major.The biggest ones that I can think of.Yeah.But there's definitely others.Oh, absolutely.Yeah.So let's move away fromthe dark and we got one more.And he's the one that probably mostpeople are familiar with.And that's a Viego.Oh, absolutely.Saddle-biles.Yeah.Yeah, Viego's the...He may not be the mostpowerful, but he's the shining star.That's for sure.Yeah.He's the coolest.His whole story is so well-written.It's very fleshed out.There is clearly a lot of focus and loveput into Viego's character in Rupaira.And I like Viego becausehe's not really morally gray.Yeah.By the same...Yeah, he's evil, buthe's not really like...He's not really evil for himself.No.At the same time, he's pretty evil.He just has a goal and he doesn't carewho gets in his way.And sometimes those arethe coolest characters.Yeah, it feels more like...There's no questioning that the world'sbetter off if we kill this dude.Yeah, like Batman.The Joker's definitely the good guy andhe's trying to save Gotham.When you have this guy who's juststopping him at every turnbecause of the collateral damage.Yeah.It's like, okay, Batman's definitely notgood, but at the same time,seeing someone so determined to...And they don't carewho gets in their way.Like, "We'll go stopall crime in Gotham."Yeah.But there's a better way todo it, but his method, right?It's just, he's so committed to it thatit's a nice look, eventhough he's not the good guy.Yeah.You can't help but like, tosome extent, like, root for him.You can't like root for the villain.Yeah.You know?Exactly.Exactly.Just because he's so interesting.Yeah.And it feels like Diego, more thananything, he's just desperate.You know?You feel that sense of like, "Oh my God,like this guy has goneabsolutely insane trying toachieve this goal thatfeels absolutely impossible."Yeah.And I think we assume too much of the...Like, I always assume that the problemwith me is I assumetoo much that people knowwhat I'm talking about.And I realized, because I make Runeterralore videos, how nichethe community is right noware people that actuallyknow about Runeterra lore.So we're saying all this stuff and peoplemight not even know who Diego is.That's true.So, Diego came from Camivore, which is anisland continent off to the side.Doesn't exist on the map today, which isa very blatant show thatthis map is not complete.It's a completely different continent.It's a part of it.It's not even the complete continent.He lived in Camivore.He was the king there.He had a wife named Essold.Essold, an assassincomes to try to kill Diego.They throw a dagger at him.It hits Essold.Essold gets poisoned.She's dying.Diego loses his mind.All right.Starts sacrificing the entire kingdom totry to find a cure for Essoldbecause he loves her so much.Eventually, he discovers the BlessedIsles, which has a waterthat can cure any ailment.So he takes his army there, goes to theBlessed Isles, and then hiswife is dead at this pointin his arms.And they're like, "We wanted to help you,but we literally can'tbecause we don't know whatwill happen if you put your wife into theBlessed Waters because she's dead."And that should not be messed with.She's dead.It's over.Yeah, yeah.You're not about to cure death and wesure as hell are about to try.If she was just poisoned, she was stillalive 100%, we would let you.Especially because they saw it as almostlike a strategic thing.They wanted to help him because to havean ally like Camivore is very good.They felt like if they helped the king ofCamivore save his wife, they would have apermanent ally.Oh, yeah.And Camivore would be hard to beat that.Yeah.They were powerful at the time.Camivore was the power in the world.Really?Yeah.They were the Lordaeron.Yes.Lordaeron being the Old Kingdom ofWarcraft that fell at somepoint long before the MMOever came out.Exactly.That's cool.And then so, but then they were like,"Still, we can't risk itbecause his wife is dead andif they put in the Blessed Waters, wedon't know what's going to happen."So he gets pissed.He says, "Nothing's going tostop me from saving us all."Kills everyone.Carries his wife, kills all these guys inhis way, drops herinto the Blessed Waters.Something crazy happens.She comes up as a spectral spirit,basically, instead of as herself.Mm-hmm.He was dead.In confusion, rage, and bang, from beingripped from death, shetakes up Viego's sword andjust plunges it through his chest.And Viego's sword is a unique sword.It siphons the soul out of someone.Oh.Not like a regular sword.That's why he is summoning it, eventhough he summons in death.That's the same thing thathappened when he was in life.Oh, he was able to just summon it?Yeah.It's attached to his soul.It's crazy.Sword.Yeah.But so the sword is tryingto suck Viego's soul out.At the same time, the Waters are tryingto heal Viego at the same time.Oh, God.That causes the ruination.It just freaks out, explodes out all thisdeath magic, and freezeseveryone on the Shadow Islesin this undeath version.And that's why you had this mist aroundthe Blessed Isles, whichno one could enter unlessyou had this particular item.Mm-hmm.Thresh was the one that gave that to thepeople who found theBlessed Isles to take back toViego so he can comeinto the Blessed Isles.Ah.This mist became, instead of the BlessedMist, became the ShadowIsles mist that we see today,which is the Shadow Isles covered in thisdark, malevolent mist.Oh, jeez.Yeah.And if you want to know anything aboutthe Shadow Isles, I gotplenty of short stories on it.And then there's also, like, you canwatch any of my videos on Viego,but that's the gist of Viego.And his whole goal is to rescue his soul.And every time he's come back before, hebasically starts the ruination,releasing all the dead across Runeterra.And his goal is to collect all the soulsof his soul, bring themtogether, and to resurrect her,which eventually he does in the war withthe Sentinels of Light,which is a group that just, like, theirwhole goal is to fight the Shadow Isles.Oh, yeah.And then he does, and thenthey basically kill his soul.Oh.And they trap him in camivore.Oh, my god.Yes.At this point, I feel just as bad for hissoul as I do, Viego.Yeah, she wanted to die.Like, in the scene, you know, he finallygets all her pieces of her soul together.That's the ruination thatgoes across all of Runeterra.You can see cinematics of that.He puts her into the lockbox,resurrects her together again.And then she's looking at the Sentinelsof Light and basically tells them,like, they can't killViego but to kill her.Wow.And so they do it.And he just starts raging.At this point, he's back in camivorebecause he went through a portal.I know this is a lot of that.He's back.Viego is a lot of story.More story than most characters inRuneterra, like, by far.Yeah, it's hard to eventell all that very quickly.That I want to take a whole hour.Yeah, but he he's back in camivore andhe's frozen in basically a stasisby the scissor girlfrom the Shadow Isles.And so basically right now he's trappedin camivore with the one person that heliterally risked his wholelife for and this undeath for.Didn't care what happened to it killed bythe Sentinels of Light.Who are kind of like the protectors ofRuneterra against the Shadow Isles.They come back to the Shadow Isles andthe Shadow Isles isn't isn't actuallygone and Thresh is there and he'sbasically like his whole plan was toculminate all this power from Viego thathe was culminating in the Ruination.And that's what allows him to go free.And now he's basicallyfree across Runeterra.Viego is trapped in camivore and theShadow Isles are still the Shadow Islesdespite Viego being gone.Oh my God.Well then.Yeah, that was a lot.I'm sorry.What's especially sad is that his souldoes not want to be resurrected.And Viego is just in complete denial.At this point.Do we worry?Yeah, like.God, Viego is pure like evil at thispoint straight up and you just pity him.Yeah, because he's just insane.He is just a king who has gone mad.The loss of his wife.That was a very long tangent and did notexpect to go on for that long.But Viego jumped itup really, really well.Yeah, you left out the stuff that can beleft out and still understand the story.So yeah, very good.I had to get you from Viego as a king.Yeah.All the way to himbeing trapped in camivore.And the shadow isle isstill being the shadow isles.There's so many turns in that I didn'teven cover like onetenth of the actual story.Oh yeah, I mean, like you could talkabout the whole like, I like,Viego and Thresh have a relationshipleading up to Thresh's, you know,plan being revealed in his betrayal ofViego just using him.Yeah.And all that stuff.If you want to see a lot of Viego,there's a game like Riot Forge, man.You know my love for Riot Forge.Oh yeah.I love Riot Forge.I love every singletitle they've come out with.I can play every single game twice.There's only one game that I haven'tplayed twice because ittakes forever on my secondplaythrough.And that's the Rune King,but it's such a good game.If you have not played the Rune King fromRiot Forge and youwant to learn more aboutViego and a lot of other characters inBilgewater and actually the Frowjordbecause Braum is there.I recommend that Rune King is so good.You'll see Viego.It's a great game.Not sponsored.Riot, sponsor us please.Do you think that atsome point in the MMO,Imagine they don't, why wouldthey even have to sponsor us?As though we would do anything different.It's like a Ziploc podcast.Why are we going tobe sponsored by Ziploc?Why are we talking aboutZiploc bags the whole day?Yeah, exactly.Like we're doing this for free.They don't have to pay us.But do you think that at some point inthe MMO, I think obviouslyat some point Viego will befreed from his.I'm scared of when he's freed because nowhis, before it was like, you know Thanos?Yeah.I know I snapped right when I said.Yeah, I know. You just know. Yeah.That's what you do.Thanos' originalintentions was pure, right?He wanted to like save the universe andlike only wanted to kill half the people.Almost like Viego, hisintention was pure free sold.Yeah.But then when Thanoscomes back the second time,he just wants to destroy all everythingbecause he's like pissed off.Yeah.And that makes him even more dangerous.Yeah, he's even further off the deep end.Yeah.Yeah.I think Viego is goingto be the same thing.I worry about it.Viego ever comes back, he's going to belike Mordekaiser level.Geez. Yeah.I believe it.But do you think he's going to wantrevenge against Thresh?Oh yeah.He never liked Thresh.He hated Thresh from like early onbecause he felt like Thresh was,he failed him at one point.He was supposed to gather something.I forgot what it was.But yeah, he didn't like Thresh.His right hand personwas Vex who was a Yordle.Wow.And then bothered Thresh.But Thresh was really outfor himself the whole time.Thresh doesn't care about Viego.Never cared about his wife as sold.Like he let her in for his own means.I skipped all that during the story, butthere's a lot there.Yeah, there's a lotbetween Viego and Thresh.Yeah, they're not buddies.Yeah.So I'm wondering, all right, Viego neverbe, he better never be redeemed.I'll be pissed if he doeshave like a redemption arc.Yeah, I know.But I would love if we have some very,very unsteady alliancewith Viego to take out Thresh.Yeah, see, that'd be cool.Yeah.Where you are mostly likescared of Viego because you know,this guy's unhinged and hewants to kill you right now.Even better.Even better.Unhinged unsteady alliance with him tofight against Mordekaiser.Two armies of deathflashing against each other.That sounds crazy.Like I love that he's there in stasis andit's like almost feels likewhy would we ever release him and likeabsolutely need him for something?Yeah, like we know it's like, okay, hewants to kill us, but hewants to kill this guy even more.Yeah.Let's we're going to have to do thisbecause if we don't, we're dead anyways.Might as well try.And we go to Camivore.Oh my God.See, see that.Camivore is also aninevitable zone, right?That's an inevitable expansion.That way into Camivore.Yeah, we do a Camivore expansion thatleads to the release of Viego,which leads into either, you know,Mordekaiser or Rush.Like, yeah, we go to Camivore now we knowwhere Viego is and we endup having to release himfor the next expansion.Because how do we not think of him?Amivore is an inevitable expansion.It has to be.And right.There's no way itdoesn't become an expansion.100%.100%.Dude.Oh, so yeah, either way,they better not just make Viego.I don't think they will because they'reobviously putting waytoo much effort into Viegoto make him just a one off like a villainof the expansion type deal.You know, we better not just kill himwithin an expansion.We better have some very interestinginteractions going out with Viego formultiple expansions.That's what I want out of Viego.They've invested way too much into him.He's such a well written character.Like, oh, I can't wait tosee what they do with him.Yeah, exactly.I think there's a lot ofpotential there for sure.He's one of the characters I'm mostexcited for to see in the right MMO,like easily.R9, he's one of thecharacters I'm most excited to see.I agree.Because like we said,they're setting up a lot right now.There's going to be so many threads thatare going to be, you know,undone very aggressively anddramatically throughout the MMO.Because that's whatthe MMO is going to be.It feels like MMO is going to beconclusive to a lot of this stuff.Which will also, you know, lead to thesebig climactic thingslike Viego being freed.And us fighting Threshand us fighting Mordkai.Like all this stuff isgoing to happen in the MMO.I'm fully expecting it at this point.Yeah, I'm just talkingabout it gets me excited.But then, okay, so what we're talkingabout the big bads,which we've completed.I think the list is pretty complete.We didn't cover everyone.I'm sure someone'sgoing to say this character.There's character that we missed.I know that like, I'm sure there areplenty of stuff that we missed.But now that we covered the big bads, wetalk about how we're going to fight them.And I always feel like I don't want tosee Riot reinvent the wheeltoo much when it comes to this.I know a lot of people arelooking for innovation, right?I don't want to see a VR MMO.I don't want to cut or not be.I mean, like, will I buy theOculus Quest 3 for this game?Yeah.Will I be happy?No, probably not.I'll find a way to like,hook it up to my computer,display the Oculus Quest screen on mycomputer and then play it with a mouse.It'll be day one add-ons.Yeah, for mouse and keyboard support.100%.I'm fine with there beingan option, like VR support.That'd be cool.Yeah, sure.Why not?I would do that for like aday and I'm like, that's fun.Yeah.Yeah.But there's other things too that I don'tI want to see them kind of keep.One of those things tome is the Holy Trinity.I think that should be maintained.I don't like games where it's like youjust you're whatever you wantbecause whatever weaponyou're holding, I'm holding.Oh, yeah.No, I don't like that either.I like when yourcharacter is strictly one thing.Yeah.You know, like,you you are a shaman of the early work.Yes.That's who you are.That's your character.You know, I really like that.I don't know.I like the feeling of being specialized.Yeah.So then that way, when I am standing infront of a mage of likethe Masiya or something,I'm like, oh, yeah, likewe are different peoples.Yeah.Different worlds coming together for acommon enemy or the same character.When everyone's the same, you do feellike, okay, we're alljust the same character.Yeah.I agree very much where it's like,especially if like there's like somebodywho's like maxed outand like every single weapon skill, everysingle class on this character.Suddenly, I feel way less special.And I'm like, oh, I'm like, oh, I thoughtI was being helpful, but no,I'm just like a littlepet for this guy, I guess.You know, I want I want youto pick a class and a race.I think that's important.It helps offer RP too, right?Like then you're notjust an everything person.You're a specific typeof person in this world.I think that's really cool.There's two ways they could go.Or there's okay, there's humans, there'sVistaya and there are Yordles.Those are the races in Runeterra.They could definitely go where like youpick your Yordle and then okay,your class is decided later and by whatyou do and how you pick.And I can see like, you know, there is afantasy to that where you're justyou're entering this world.You're just a person and you find yourway towards your class.But I do feel like you need to have aclass and you shouldn't be able to justhot swap between them.So I kind of like it where you're pickingyour class up front whereyou're choosing what youare and that's a big decision.Yeah, definitely.And I promise that the more fluidity youhave between like the morechoice you have in an MMO,one thing everyone has this issue, themore choice you have,the less choice you have.Right.If everyone can be everything in anycombination of things,everyone's going to be the same thing.Everyone's going to be whatever the heckthe guide told them.Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's true.That's true.Homogenization is a big issue in MMOs andit's just the truth of itthat the more freedom you have,the less likely you're actually going touse that freedom and morelikely you're going to dowhatever everyone else is doing becauseyou're not going to getinvited to the raid otherwise.That's just something Ido not want to see happen.Yeah, that makes perfect sense.I didn't even think about that.If you can choose whatever you want tobe, there's going to beone healer that's optimaland everyone's going tohave to be that healer.One DPS is optimal and everyone's goingto be that DPS, one tank.I would see this issue like, "Oh yeah,but on a casual level,that's not going to matter.You're talking about like 1% stuff."It's like, "Yeah, buteveryone thinks they're the 1%."All right.That completelyregular easy level dungeon,people are still going to invite theperson that has theoptimal setup for a healer.Yeah, aren't you going to try to do it?There's a level of like, "Okay, I want tohave fun, but I also want to do my best."Yeah, because at the end of the day, youhave to respecteveryone else's time to do.Yeah, like I may like--... the else's experience.Like you're in an MMO, so you're going tobe interacting with other people,so you need to kind of pull your weight.Exactly.For example, let's say I want to RP apirate and I reallylike the idea of a peg leg,but if a peg legreduces my run speed by 50%,Yeah, don't do it.they'd be stupid like,"Okay, we're going to get kicked.I'm not going to invite you."Like, "Bro, you could barely avoidmechanics because you're too slow."Yeah.That's like that.That's obviously an extreme example, butit's really the same thing.Yeah, it's a very goodstraightforward way of putting it.Something also like in apug group or a pickup group,is what they're called, where you justget random peopletogether that you don't know.I don't know how goodyou are at the game.So, like I can't base you off of skill.I'm just going to base you off of,"Oh, this guy, if this guy's runningoptimal healer, he knows how to heal."Probably.Right?At least he's a-He cared enough to look up a guide.Yeah.Compared to the guy who was just runningwhatever the heck they think is fun.So, like, yeah, you need to avoidhomogenization with your classes,just by walling them off, you know?Like, okay, I mean, as long as they'resomewhat balanced, it should be fine.That's the way most ofmy moves have done it.That's the way I thinkit's always worked best.And then there's also-Okay, so I definitely think that you haveyour class picking at the front,but then there's the- Ididn't really say it right.I did say the Holy Trinity,which what this is means that when you gointo a dungeon orwhen you go into a raid,there's three types of people.You have your tankswho are soaking damage,you have your DPS who are doing damage,and you have your healerswho are keeping everyone alive.I like that.Me too.I don't like whereeveryone's like kind of hybrid,everyone's DPS-ing,or there's literally no healers becauseeveryone heals themselves,or there's no tank because it justspread- keeps swapping damage.I feel like I reallylike the Holy Trinity,where it's those three, and I think thatshould also be carriedforward into the right MMO.I completely agree.It's the reason why I do not-It's literally the only reason why Idon't like Guild Wars 2, is because-I've never played Guild Wars 2.Well, in that game,there's like maybe one tank,and you have to specifically spec all ofyour talents and everythinginto becoming a tank,if you want to tank.And even then, you're not really tanking,you don't have aggro.You're just using a lot of defensivestuff to keep everyonearound you more defensive,take less damage.And then you-You just have the head DPSwith some defensive buffs.Everyone in the game has a DPS.Yeah, I don't know.And then you have likeyour sword of healers,just like I have your sword of tank, youhave your sword of healers,you can very closely spec into healingthroughout your time playing the game.But even at the beginning,if you want to play a healer,you're starting off as a DPS characterthat you spec into healing.So it's just like, yeah, and I'm like,but now I feel likewe're not working together.We're all just pushing our buttons.Yeah, you are.That's what the Holy Trinity does.The Holy Trinity makes youfeel like you are cooperating,and you all need each other to succeed.Otherwise, it's just like,well, we need these many people,because bigger number ofpeople means bigger damage.Yeah.That's not fun, because then that'sliterally like, why notjust have a bunch of NPCs?It's going to be the same.It's going to be the same experience.And it's not even just a tank healer DPS.Like, there's also, it's basically almostsupport, defensive support healer.Yeah.Yeah, I think is a supporttank should be a support.Right.I don't like to think it'sjust a DPS with more health.Yeah.That support role wasmore what I'm talking about.It's the role I like to fill.And that's the role you like to fill too.Yeah, I love tanking.You like tanking is so much fun.Yeah, I like healing.So I feel like those rolesare more their support roles.And that's what I like about them is thatthey're purely like a,like you really can't domuch on your own as a healer.No, really can't domuch on your own as a tank.You're there for the help the group.Yeah, you are therepurely for everyone else.You are not there for you, you know?It's, it's really,really cool in that sense.You're forced to rely on other people.Yeah.And I like that in any MMO, becausethat's why I'm there.I'm there for other people.That's why I'm playing an MMO.It just feels very cool to have thatcomplete unit, you know?It's very satisfying tosee all the gears turning,everything working togetheras one big, powerful thing.Because you're a team.Yeah, you're a team.Like the whole of Trinity is basicallysaying you need three different,three different people to get this done.They can't be all the same.You have different people andeveryone has their own task,own their role during the fight thateveryone's worried about.Like I'm doing my thing.Yeah, I'm doing my part.Even though that part's different thanyour part, you need both to complete.I don't know.It makes me feel like,like, okay, that's a group.Yeah, I completely agree.But speaking of that too, sonow you have this group, right?Everyone's there.Everyone's in the dungeon.Everyone's in the raid.I understand that, like, you havedifferent communication tools.Like, sure, you can geta group together and say,"Hey, come on my Discord."Probably not going to happen.Scream in general chat.Yeah, there's, you can type.But if you're playing the game and it'slike a high key or something,or high, doing something intense, likereally high level content,you're probably not going to be able totype your messages while doing it.Yeah.Then there's the voice chat in the game.Okay, not everyone's going to join thevoice chat because people are just,maybe someone's playing intheir freaking living room,or they just don't like, they don't have,they don't want to talk on the mic.They're just playing a game.Yeah, very true.They're playing on the couch.Not everyone wants to join voice chat,even if you have voicechat implemented in the game.That's why you actuallysuggested this a while ago.You were saying that they need to havesome kind of system in place.Yes, we need emotes.Emotes are very importantbecause you'd be surprisedhow many people don'twant to talk in an MMO.This is how they communicate with you.The number of times I have ran around inliterally any MMO, FinalFantasy 14, World of Warcraft,Final Fantasy 11, every time you're goingto see people who talkpurely through emotes,such as their character is going to wavewhen they see you, theircharacter is going to bowas a thank you, stuff likethat is insanely important.I would like to see this taken to thenext level in an MMO,and I think Grint Eric can do it.I think World of Warcraft has a sort oflike voice line thing.I'm sure you know oflike how your character.Yeah, if you do like slash charge slashfor the Alliance like for the Horde,that kind of stuff.I'd like to see that taken to the nextlevel to where in adungeon I can just click a buttonand my character willsay a voice line, you know.I really like the way they do it inOverwatch, to be honest.Overwatch is a really good example.A lot of because yeah,you got the emote wheel.I hope they do that.I hope Apex Legendsdoes it very well too.This you communicate with your team byyour character is talkingand you're like it's a kind of a wheellike you ping enemy here.Or resources here.Pinging is insanely important.Yeah, that kind of stuff too.I think emotes are even more importantfor RP a little bit.Yeah, absolutely.Yeah, you need some good emotes for RP.Yeah, and then there's also like this.I want to be able to communicate witheveryone without having tocommunicate with everyone.I think the ping system and like thatkind of thing whereyou're able to kind of scrollwheel and your character they hear itinstead of just seeing it.Yeah, as long as like you know your likedefault chat message ofyeah, like attack hereor whatever the heck.Yeah, yeah.Moving in three, two, one.Oh man, no add-ons.No add-ons.Oh boy.I mean, hey, that's that's where stufflike pinging andeverything like that comes in.World War II just recently added pinging.Yeah, by the way, like I feel like youonly give you like play too many likecompetitive games.You know, pinging is just like you canput like a marker on the map,telling people what to look at, where tolook at, especially for likeenemies and things like that.If you want someone to like attack acertain enemy first becausethey're the most dangerous,just ping that enemy.Yeah.Or put a skull symbol over their head.Yeah, that kind of stuff.That's insanely important.There's so many forms of communication inMMO and all of it needs tobe really fast and obviousto just like visuallytell what's going on.Exactly.To communicate with other people.Especially if you're in the middle ofdoing your rotation andyou're just watching yourhealth drop and you'relike, dear God, someone save me.You can't just start typing.Heal me.Yeah.Then there's the point where I can getannoying and she would have obviouslycommuted like someone says, heal me.Heal me.Heal me.Yeah.Yeah.I guys always spam pinging the tankbecause theyaccidentally pulled an extra pack.Yeah.That kind of stuff.Maybe I don't know.They could figure outlike the time gaming.But the important thing is that thesystem needs to beimplemented with the pinging,with the emotes for like, I don't know,like the high five one.You said in Final Fantasy.Oh, that's an Sky Children of the Light.That's a bit of a Anishamemo, but I love it so much.Oh, that's what it is.Yeah.Yeah.So I love the idea of like co-op bird,like multi-person emotes,which I think is especiallyimportant for things like like RP or whenyou just like accomplish little things.So one thing I brought up is that like inSky, you have a high fiveemote, which when you use it,your character just freezes in a positionwith their hand up in the air.And then if you walk up to them, there'sa little button prompt over their head.If you push that button, you and theother person high five.I love that kind of stuff.Yeah.That's cool.Like accomplishing little things becomesso much more exciting whensomeone raises their hand up.You're like, yeah, dude.Yeah.And then you high five or youlike hug that kind of stuff.I'm surprised how much itdoes for feels personal.It feels like personal communicationcompared to just your average like waveemote or your bow emotefor just like thank you and high orjumping a billion times tosay a billion different things.Yeah.Because you're actuallyinteracting with the other player.Yeah.It feels like you aretalking to that person.You're even with that person specificallyand you see that interaction happen.I never realized how much of a differenceit made till I played Sky.But like I, we need those.I wanted to go far.Like I wanted to be like, if someonesitting at a campfireand they're cooking,yeah, you go sit at the campfire and thenthe other person will literally grab somesoup and put it inthere and offer it to you.And you could literally say no or yes.Take the soup, dude.Yeah, that's a littlethat's a guy who doesn't love it.Yeah.Little stuff like that is you.I want full interaction trees.Yeah, exactly.How the interaction plays out.Maybe I might be asking for too much.I don't think that's too much.Okay.I don't think it is.I'm not asking too much.I mean, it's mostly just like on theanimation side ofthings, especially with.All right.One thing I freaking love is that thecharacters are going to bethe races are going to be sodifferent in Runeterra.I think most of them have an issue wherea lot of their characters look verysimilar races look very similar forobvious reasons, right?The rig is going to be the same.The skeleton is going to be the same.So when they're animating, there's onlyone animation for all the races.But World of Warcraft is the only examplewhere they beat thatstatus quo and I love it.Yeah, it's my literally one of if not myfavorite thing about World of Warcraftfor as an MMO.So the races are varied.They're going to have that same thinggoing on in Runeterratoo, with obviously like yourworlds better be playable, right?No way they're not going to be playable.I refuse to believe that yourworlds will not be playable.There's skeleton will be very differentfrom the average race in Runeterra,which means the animations for thingslike emotes are going to be alittle more varied for sure.They're probably going to have toreanimate entire emotes.Like they're not all going to be doingthe same exact wave.They better have someflavor to each rate.Yeah, yeah.So I think stuff like that obviously isgoing to take up a littlebit more development timefor each emote, especially if you'redoing those interactions.But God, do I hope they do it?Add so much.Like you don't believe it until you seeit until you're in gameand you're doing that kind ofthing.It's so much fun.And it just makes every connection thatmuch more special when you're playing.I do wonder when the races come.So your tools are easy.Yeah, I think there arevariations of the yordle shape.Same thing with humans.You know, you have some taller humanshorter humans, maybesome pudgy humans, whatever.Yeah, humans and your tools, I feel likeare very straightforward.Vistaya are a verywide breadth of people.Like they're very different.You have people like give Vistaya tribewith wings that can flyall the way down to Vistayatribe with fins thatswim deep under the ocean.I did not know that.I know they're flying Vistaya.What the heck?I always assumed theywere just the fish people.No.Yeah.So the Vistaya all come from VistayaShirei, which is like theytook this is like the history.We don't actually know this stuff, butthis is like thehistory that we think is true.After the Runewars, pretty much allhistory got wiped off theface of the earth becauseof like nuclear fallout.But the history that we have right now,supposedly they came from Vistaya Shirei,which they were during the Titan war.They're fighting Titans from the sky andthey took in the spirit Rome into them,these enlightened mortals, and theybecame Vistaya Shirei after the war.They, you know, theystarted living their lives.They let's say they made it with a humanor some othercreature that is every singleVistaya tribe today can lead its originsto like a Vistaya Shirei.For example, one of the Vistaya Shireihad wings and so thateventually branched off intothese tribes.All these four different tribes havewings and they alloriginate from this single VistayaShirei that happened to have wings.Oh, man.Yeah.And so like the one of them swam.And so all the swimming Vistaya tribestoday in the oceans or wherever,they all can link their origin back tothat single VistayaShirei that happened to be likea swimming Vistaya Shirei.Oh, wow.I don't even think I've seena picture of a Vistaya yet.Do they have like namis of a style?Oh, okay.Yeah.So she's like the mermaidperson in the Mariah territory.Yeah.Oh, okay.Yeah.There's like a chameleon Vistaya inIschow in Bilgewater orwe're not really in Bilgewater,but from Camivore in that book.It's like an otter Vistaya.Yeah.There's Vistaya everywhere.Oh, I see.They're all over the world and they'redifferent kind of in different tribes.So that's why I'm saying like, I don'tknow how they're going to do it.Yeah.So like if I had to guess, they probablywouldn't vary them too crazy.Like obviously you're not going to belike a mermaid for style.I don't think, you know, that'd be tough.Yeah.I don't know whatthey're going to do with that.Well, you're going to be your mermaid andthere's a little bit around.You have two people that character.You're a giant fishbowl.Yeah.Yeah.Fishbowl.I mean, like, yeah, they could just dolike, you know, they'regoing to have that onedefault Vistaya rig.Yeah.And then they just add, you know, likethe chameleon look to itor they add the wings to itand kind of choose your option.Yeah.And you hopefully you can't do both.So I'll just beimmersion breaking as all.I better not be a flying chameleon.Yeah.You know, unless that's a possible thing.Yeah.But I definitely see that happening.Works kind of just like customization.You just decide whattribe you want to be.Rp.I like that.Yeah.I like that.So you kind of like you can customizeyour Vistaya a littlebit to be from the tribethat you wanted to be a part of.Yeah.I mean, that's how I do with the Magarorcs and World of Warcraft.That's where.Magar orcs have all sorts of differentskin colors and tattoos and stuff.And you just pick a skin color thatmatches that type of lookthat you want or what tribeyou want to be part of.Man, I'm so excited for this.I'm a mole.Yeah.I've never been soexcited for a game in my life.I hate to ride the copium this hard, butI'm like hot on copium at this point.Just I'm too excited for it.I mean, obviously I care a lot about thelore and so that maybeis contributing to it.But I played World of Warcraft for a longtime and I never knewas much as I know alreadyabout like Runeterra.Oh yeah, I bet.After your catalog of videos.Yeah.One thing about it.So I really like to read.And so that's really what initially gotme into Runeterra is Ijust like reading personally.I like reading books.I worked in a library for a long time.Yeah.Yeah.That's like my way to absorb content.My favorite way toabsorb content is reading.Yeah, I agree.In terms of like long stories, like longformat, likeoverarching events and thingslike that.Yeah, I agree.I think reading is a reallygood way to get a story across.The thing is, so that's what initiallygot me into Runeterralore because I just startedreading stuff on their website andreading the zones and the stories.Then I got like realms of Runeterra thebook and then I was like,oh, there's another bookcalled Ruination.So I got that and I started reading it.And that's what got me intothe Runeterra lore was reading.But a lot of people don't want to read.Yeah.That's not like they even said that's notthe best way to distribute content to theplayer base.And so they're trying to look for otherforms of ways to get that content out.I've tried to make itpretty digestible on my channel.I think making videos for short storiesand stuff and animatingit and doing voice voicesfor like different characters.I really liked in Battle for Azeroth.The one good thing that I thought was inthat expansion was like the cinematics.Oh, yeah.And I think that may be a way thatthey're going to go about doing it.But I don't feel like you can docinematics for everything.Like I feel like cinematics tend to bevery disjointed when you because they'refor a specific scene.So you can't tell the whole story aboutthe game through cinematics.And so I think they might even do like Ireally like Arcane, the Netflix series.But that's an amazingway to tell the story.Riot, Riot Forge is agreat way to tell the story.Yeah.But I'm wondering likewhat's our strategy here?Like if you're not going to do thesethese stories and these books,because even the Blizzard team does abook for every expansion almost.So what ways can they introduce newplayers to the lorewho have no experienceto the lore whatsoever?I'm going to do a video that's likeintroducing new playersto the lore from scratch.But what's what's the best strategy forRiot going forward for this?Yeah.Producing new players to lore.It's tough.That's a very good question.Because I mean, obviously, the nice thingabout short stories andbooks and stuff is thatit's way less like expensive in terms oftime and money for them,which means they can put out more.Yeah.Right.That means more lower, more set up forbig events, more setup for everything that'swe have in the MMO.But yeah, at the end of the day, peopleare going to enjoy that compared to aRiot Forge gamers cinematic.But then those things are just going tobe way more expensive.I mean, obviously, they can't telleverything that'sgoing to happen in the MMO.You know, you got to leave some stuffthere for the MMO to happen at its own,like inside the game.So yeah, that's tough.They definitely can't do like cinematics.I don't think it's too hard.Like can you just check the whole story?Yeah, exactly.Like a battle forAzeroth the way they did.It was like they told one character'sstory and they reallyonly told the major eventsof that character's storyof that character's arc.Sarfang.Yeah.Right.If you watch them all, you can get likean idea of where thestory was, but you won'tget the full story.You'll just understand like, OK, thishappened and this happened, thishappened, this happened.But yeah, that's exactly what you'remissing so much in themiddle that you're kind of likethose just they'redisjointed at the end of the day.Yeah, you're missing what leads him tothese places and thesehow he is like emotionally,you know, you're missing thosetransitionary periods.Yeah, you can kind ofsee the big moments.And you have the nomadicdon't really work in that sense.Yeah. And you have arcane, which is like, OK,that's a full story, though.Yeah, that's also nothing for the rightof a mo like you wantto be able to get somestory in the right of a mo.Yeah, exactly.I mean, it's also why I always come backto Warcraft threebecause that was the mostperfect setup for a memoI've ever seen in my life.Yeah, play as the villain.You see his motives, yousee everything about him.And in the end, it still feels like, youknow, OK, what's next?Like you you love that story ofeverything that happens in it.It ends with a bigclimactic conclusive battle.But then you still know the Lich King isthere, you know, thefinal cinematic is himputting on the crown,becoming the Lich King.And he's just sitting there on his thronewaiting for what's to come.And it's like, oh, dude,stuff like that is so impactful.And that leads to such amazing thingsgoing on in the MMO later on.So like with Raya Forge games, I hopethey do somethinglike that in the future.Like I hope they, you know, they stillhave their own story,but they still leave somesome loose ends to tie up in the MMO.That's what I'm hoping Raya Forge isthere for, honestly.I'm hoping Raya Forge becomes more new,new, new, definitely anopen end on the end of it.The Mage Seeker, definitely an open end.Good.King is definitely openended, even though we do.Oh, yeah, that's right.Ford, yeah, Virgin'sConvergence is kind of like its own.It does have an open end, butit's very much like its own.So I think it's going to be canon.Really?I think it's canon, but only in it's in adifferent timeline because so Convergenceat the end, when you see it was spoiler,spoiler, fast forward a little bit if youdon't want to be there.But at the end of Convergence, Echo'sfuture self flipsthrough a bunch of portals ofdifferent timelines, and one of themshows our cane, and theyalready said our cane is canon.So that's a timeline that we're on forthe ride in my opinion,because I think that'sthe canon timelines.The whole point of it'sfor the ride in the MO.One of the timelines that he sees is thathe sees not histimeline is what you're saying.Yeah, that timeline that Convergence isin is not the sametimeline that we're in.Yeah, so that's notthe Echo that we know.Yeah, exactly.That's kind of cool.Yeah, I really like that actually.Yeah, so I hope it's still canon, butEcho's, he's literallythe boy who shattered time.Yeah.So I hope that in someway, like it's still canon.It's just gonna do it.I mean, yeah, it is canon, but it's notgonna like be asimpactful as the other stories inthe ride in the MO orin Runeterra in general.It's just not as impactful because it'snot the timeline that we see.Exactly.Exactly.So yeah, like it's still canon, just notas impactful to the world as a whole.Yeah.But that's still really cool.I like how they can do that because thatmeans they can make allsorts of crazy stories.Yeah, and that timeline.Yeah.Of course, I'm sure at some point we'regonna meet Echo and Iwouldn't be surprised ifwe can do some timelineshenanigans at some point.Oh, yeah.You know, hopefully nothing too crazy.I don't want to start invalidatingeverything by just being like, "Oh, yeah.In this timeline, everyone that died, theothers still alive, they're still here."That kind of stuff, like don't findexcuses to like, don't belazy with the timeline stuff.Make it interesting.Don't make it like a cop out.I really liked Convergence Echo though.Like an arcane echo, theydon't really explore him enough.So I can't say whether I like him or not.Like he might have parents and stuff.We don't really know his backstory.Yeah, that's right.That explains that alittle bit better, right?Yeah.The parents thing.I liked him.In Convergence, he haslike parents and stuff.Yeah.I don't know.Like Echo is the one person that youcould actually get away with.He's hopping around timelines because wecould actually see this Echo fromConvergence one day.Yeah.In our timeline, which would be cool.Yeah, that'd be neat.And that'll make that Convergence canon.And maybe he can come from our timelineand he'll meet our Echo in our timeline.That sounds cool to me.Just don't take awayConvergence because I loved that game.I thought it was such a good game.The story was great.And I like that version of Echo.Yeah.I hope that that maintains itscommunity.Yeah.Yeah.Cannonacity.Yeah, it's cannonacity.Yeah, I'm fully expecting Riot Forge tobecome their mainavenue for storytelling.I hope that's the case.And I hope it continues.Yeah.Oh, I have to do it.It better continue through the Riot MMO.It better set up futurecontent for the Riot MMO.Exactly.That's what I'm hoping for.That's a single game.You have like, okay,you have the expansion.Then there's a Riot Forge title thatcomes out that kind of hints at the next,that tells you some story that's requiredfor the next expansion.I know that's kind of a dead giveaway.Maybe we could do two expansions earlier,but even that, like maybepeople kept talking to it.But yeah, at the very least, just toestablish things that maybepeople don't know that muchabout yet, just to flesh things outfurther, just the world as a whole.Because I'm like,that's what Warcraft 3 did.Yeah, it did.Not only did it set up the Lich King fortwo expansions, the world of Warcraft,he becomes a villainthat we have to fight off.But it also establisheslike a lot of night elf lore.You know, it establishes the fall ofLordaeron, which is insanelyimportant to set up the undeadand the forsaken.And of course, the orcs moving toKalimdor and recruitingthe Torrin and the trolls.So I think Riot Forge is a really greatway to move Runeterraforward when it needs to.It's a great way to change what's likethe current state of the world, to movethings around in a waythat's not just like, oh, your characteris just kind of standingthere and things are happening.Your character is justthere for it all, I guess.You know, I think the MMO should be thereto lead to these big climactic battlesand things like that.But in terms of like raw storytelling, Ithink the beststorytelling should come from theRiot Forge games, not from the MMO.That's just my opinion.I think, you know, like always say, theworld is the main character.You know, I don't think Echo should bethe main character oflike an entire expansion inthe Riot MMO.Right. It should be Zaun.Zaun should be the maincharacter of that expansion.Yeah, Echo.Exactly.Compared to Convergence, where of courseEcho is the maincharacter and he should be.Yeah, right.Exactly.And then you explore Echoand Riot Forge and that title,say when you get to Zaun, he doesn't needto be fleshed out as much.Yeah, exactly.You don't have to go through all thisexposition and stuff.No, just explore Zaun.Enjoy the characters that are there.Enjoy all that flavor.You already know it.Yeah, exactly.I can just go deeper.Yeah.With the Riot MMO.Precisely.Yeah, the Riot MMO should be, you know,just further fleshingout this world that alreadyhas so much stuff going on in it.That's what I think theRiot Forge games should do.Riot Forge games should be more focusedstorytelling that push the plot along.And then the Riot MMO is where this worldreally gets to see its fullpotential and you really getto explore all the coollittle things about these zones.And I can't wait.I cannot wait.I'm excited.All right.Well, another great episode.We actually did still finish all of ourtopics and so we'll we'lltalk more on those next time.Dude, there's so much we can talk about.Like, see us in episode 172.We'll see you guys there.Yes.So we'll see you guys in that one.But I hope you enjoyed this episode.We'll continue this conversation in thenext one right here in theBrazen Hydra Pub of Bilgewater.You can find me at Engrove on socials andYouTube and conquest.You have any socials you want to go?Oh, yeah, you can now finally find me atconquest 95 on Twitter.Why are you posting allsorts of funny little things?Yep.And you can follow at theBrazen Hydra on Twitter.And if you have any like questions,answers, story suggestions,feel free to throw those atus and DM on there.And you can stay up to date for thegoings on for this podcast by headingover to the website,thebrazenhydra.com.Thanks for stopping by.We'll see you in the next one.

The Brazen Hydra

#3 - Riot MMO BIG BADS | The Holy Trinity | Runterra Lore | New Players

The Brazen Hydra

#3 - Riot MMO BIG BADS | The Holy Trinity | Runterra Lore | New Players

Listen to this podcast on