Let's Talk The Solar Site Audit

Join us as we demystify all the nitty-gritty details involved in the solar site audit with our guest Lucas Coombs, a seasoned site audit supervisor. Lucas, with his years of experience and invaluable expertise, guides us through the significant role of site audits in the solar installation process explaining why it's essential to capture even the most minute details. The conversation also raises potential red flags and highlights the repercussions of overlooking certain factors during the audit process. The emphasis on the importance of the solar audit as the foundation for the rest of the installation process remains in the spotlight throughout. All said this episode is a treasure trove of insights and advice, not just for those considering solar power, but for anyone curious about the process. So, get ready to harness the power of the sun with Lucas Coombs on the Harmon and Solar podcast!

Chapters

• 6:41 Importance of in-Person Site Audits
• 16:48 Electrical Panel Clearance Safety and Regulations
• 21:47 Load Calcs
• 32:32 Safety Concerns
• 39:11 Utility Input
• 46:12 The Importance of the Solar Audit

Transcript

Speaker 2 0:24

Welcome to another edition of the Harmon and Solar podcast. I'm your host, ralph Romano, vp of Sales and Marketing at Harmon and Solar. With me my co-host, as always, ben Wulschlager. You all know him as Mr Everything Good to be back again.

Speaker 1 0:39

I didn't even ask you how you're doing, I'm just telling everyone it's good to be back, okay well, I see, because he enjoys coming here. He likes to see me. Yeah.

Speaker 2 0:46

Well, I like the food. We do have food here every time, so we won't talk about that. So my question you know the question's coming, it always comes. I'm going to go back now. So we had pamphlet, business card, pamphlet, right, we started pamphlet, then we had a scroll, then we had an adventure book, which was odd.

Speaker 1 1:08

Where are we today? Pretty much like a reader's digest, now. We're reader's digest Everything. Things get added to it all the time Because you just Mr Everything. So yeah, added new things last week, so maybe we'll let our guests know what the hell we're talking about in a second.

Speaker 2 1:21

So, okay, no, we'll just leave it.

Speaker 1 1:22

We'll just leave it. We can just refuse the whole show.

Speaker 2 1:25

Yeah, that's perfect. So today, ben, we're going to talk the site audit. We don't like audits, you don't like audits.

Speaker 1 1:30

This is an IRS audit. Okay, it doesn't say it, never mind, because this guest is not from the IRS. I pay my taxes.

Speaker 2 1:36

I do too, but today we're going to keep down the path. We've gone through all these different stages and now we've hit the point of where we have the site audit. So we're going to talk about the timing of that and everything around that. And today we get another guy. We always got a guy or gal. Today is another guy. This guy's been around again a long time I've been doing it a long time and I would consider him an expert in the site audits right, which I understand somewhat.

Speaker 1 2:01

Yeah.

Speaker 2 2:01

Not. I don't know what you're feeling is on that.

Speaker 1 2:03

I mean, yeah, he knows what he's doing. He's been around for a while, so I hope so, you know, we keep him here, he's employed.

Speaker 2 2:08

He knows what he's doing. Good.

Speaker 1 2:10

All right, well, let's bring him on.

Speaker 2 2:12

Should we bring him on?

Speaker 1 2:13

Sure, all right, push the button.

Speaker 2 2:14

What's that? Push the button. I don't know what I want to. All right, okay, so we're gonna bring on Lucas.

Speaker 1 2:20

There he is. Thanks for having me today. Look at that guy.

Speaker 2 2:24

Welcome Lucas. So Lucas, coombs, coombs. Coombs all right, so you are our site manager, supervisor, oh.

Speaker 3 2:35

I kind of supervisor, I guess, is what we're called.

Speaker 2 2:38

Yeah, okay, all right, so you're a site audit supervisor.

Speaker 1 2:41

Should we have a made up tile for him, like we do? Daniel?

Speaker 2 2:44

We won't talk about Daniel Simon. We never talk about that. So how long have you been at Harmon?

Speaker 3 2:49

Well, I started at Harmon in 2013. I went back to college for a little while and came back, but this last eight years, Eight years, there you go.

Speaker 2 2:59

That's pretty good. That's just your last stint, but you're actually working with us.

Speaker 3 3:01

I probably got almost 10 years with Harmon all together. So 10 years Commercial. I worked on the commercial side, then the commercial, the commercial electric, commercial, solar, and then I came into a resident auditing in the office.

Speaker 1 3:18

Which is better, you can tell I like the air conditioning.

Speaker 3 3:22

So, anyways, I like being inside. All right, it was really hot out there on it was really hot out there. I still get on the roof every once in a while, but anyways. Okay, I'm an old goat and I like to be in the air conditioning.

Speaker 1 3:35

He's bougie now.

Speaker 2 3:37

What did you do before Harmon?

Speaker 3 3:39

Last paying job I had. I actually worked law enforcement out in Georgia. So anyways, I'm from Georgia. I was born in Montana, grew up in California and moved to Georgia.

Speaker 1 3:50

Where'd you grow up? In California?

Speaker 3 3:52

Vacaville, California Is that north. Right next to Travis Air Force Base.

Speaker 2 3:55

Oh okay.

Speaker 1 3:56

So it's a Sacramento 45 minutes from Sacramento. Okay, ralph likes to pretend he's from California.

Speaker 2 4:01

I am from Southern California. He's a North California guy.

Speaker 3 4:04

I was stationed at Pendleton when I was in the Marine Corps. First rule of being a Marine is you have to tell everybody that you're a Marine. So anybody, any jar heads out there in podcast land.

Speaker 1 4:14

Okay, mission accomplished, mission accomplished, we'll put that in the hashtag. Hashtag Marine.

Speaker 2 4:18

We will, actually we will do that.

Speaker 1 4:19

Anyways.

Speaker 2 4:20

Okay, so let's talk about what you do at Harmon currently.

Speaker 3 4:24

I supervise pretty much. I supervise all of the information that we gather when we audit. That gets pushed through to sales operation and the design department. I kind of make sure I oversee the process of collecting all the information and making sure that all the information that needs to be passed gets passed to everybody. So if that, I'm trying to encapsulate it in a nutshell.

Speaker 2 4:49

No, that's good. So you have an auditor or auditor. Does that work for you?

Speaker 3 4:52

Yeah, I have one auditor right now. He's a handsome young strapping lad that comes and trips around on people's rooftops like Santa Claus.

Speaker 2 5:02

Nice, all right, does he wear a little?

Speaker 1 5:05

red suit, white beard, if we ask him nicely, if we ask him nicely, we should do that the month of December make him dress up as Santa for all audits.

Speaker 2 5:13

All right, so let's talk about the site audit. So we're going to educate people on what exactly that is. So once you buy a system from Harmon and we've gone through their contract process and all that, the next thing that's going to happen, the logical next step, would be to us to come out and do a site audit.

Speaker 1 5:30

So you can't just look at the proposal and be like, oh, panels are going here, let's go ahead and install them.

Speaker 2 5:34

We trust satellites and Google and we know it's going to fit and hope it fits Right. So we're better than that and plus, there's a lot of things that we've got to look at that we're going to talk about. So a site audit, what is a site audit?

Speaker 1 5:44

So I'm going to ask our guest, let the expert do it.

Speaker 2 5:47

So I'm going to come to you and say what's a site audit? What is a site audit?

Speaker 3 5:52

Basically, what I tell people a site audit is is whenever we come out there and we take pictures of everything that you got and see what it's going to take to put solar on your house. We're taking a bunch of pictures around the house, on top of the house, of the electrical service and basically gathering all the information that we need In order to see what it's going to take to put solar on.

Speaker 2 6:12

So you've met Dennis right, and we trust Dennis. Sometimes, no, we trust Dennis, we do, but when you Dennis is good people.

Speaker 1 6:20

He's good people.

Speaker 2 6:20

But when he sells something, he's selling it based on whatever Daniel. We all met Daniel. What Daniel?

Importance of in-Person Site Audits

Speaker 2 6:24

put together for him based on what a satellite tells us, and we need to be able to now validate that we can actually put that system on that roof. And we're not only going to look at the roof, but we're going to look at other things too to help us validate that. So that's why you and your team are there. So that's what's good. Now there's two types of site audits, I mean. So we've been playing with one type and that's where we have. Basically, we take pictures out of the site without an auditor going out. Maybe a salesperson will take pictures of everything that we need them to take pictures of.

Speaker 3 6:56

We'll give them a listen, and say, hey, we need to see. All this stuff Gives you guys a good preliminary idea of what's going on Gives us a good idea, and we typically do this with stuff that's like maybe in Yuma or in Tucson or farther away, because we don't want to have to really roll a truck out there and if we can gather enough information then we think we're good.

Speaker 2 7:14

Then we're going to stamp it and move forward. It's newer, harman. We've probably been doing that six months to a year. A lot of companies do that all the time. We don't like to do it all the time. We'd rather get our boots on the ground, our boots on the roof, whatever, and do it that way. So that's one of the types of site audits. So that's called. It's basically a non-truck roll audit. We're going to focus on the truck roll audit, which is what you and your team take care of. And obviously the big issue with why you want to roll a truck is, if we miss something, the repercussions of missing that. So, like you were talking about in the last podcast, you can see the roof and maybe get some measurements and stuff, but you can't see underneath the roof. You can't lift a tile and say how's the recondition of that roof. So that's where it gets tricky.

Speaker 1 8:01

Or the side of the house or backyard.

Speaker 2 8:03

There's a lot of things that you can't see, we don't know, so that's why we rely on it, and the worst thing that can happen is we don't catch that stuff and then we get down to where we're getting ready to install. Oh look what, we just found that we were up on your roof, Mr Customer. Yeah, that's going to cost time and money.

Speaker 2 8:18

Customer doesn't want to hear that, so that's why we always try to roll a truck most of the time unless it's way out there and we just can't do it, for whatever I have a recent site audit story, so sold the system.

Speaker 1 8:29

It looked great on the roof and everything. We won't mention names, Keep the person secret. I guess Everything looked great. But then after the site audit we realized there was a giant AC unit in front of the service panel. Oh wow, remember that one. I don't know if you knew.

Speaker 3 8:44

We were involved in that one. You probably know that one. Yeah, I know all about that one.

Speaker 1 8:47

Yeah, so I didn't know, we didn't know doing the sale. But when we came out to the site audit we go this is a big issue, this is going to cost some delays and things like that, so we have to take care of it as soon as possible. So customer took care of it. They moved the AC unit from the site service panel. Everything went smoothly. But if we went ahead and did the permitting and the install and all that stuff, then they came out and failed inspection, that would not look good on us.

Speaker 3 9:13

Yeah, all the electrical equipment they have to maintain a walk-up clearance, a 3 by 3 clearance from front of all the new electrical equipment. People don't realize that, and anyway. So that's another reason why we go out there.

Speaker 1 9:22

Yeah, so it's important to do the in-person site audit to make sure that we got everything that we need to before we move on.

Speaker 2 9:28

And one of the things that your auditor does when he's out there, besides looking at everything, I know they get a checklist of a million things that they have to look at. I know because I helped build that in one of our software pieces and I was like man, this is a lot of stuff, but I get it right. But one of the things I noticed was they take a million pictures.

Speaker 3 9:44

I mean like Right now we've got it narrowed down to between 60 and 150 because we have more. The easy ones are about 60. But then we have battery installs and stuff like that where we need more information. We've got to get in the garages. It's just a lot of pictures.

Speaker 1 10:01

Let's do a video next time On the pictures. No, just like a full cinematic, two-hour video of the entire house.

Speaker 2 10:07

I didn't realize. I mean, I knew it was a lot.

Speaker 1 10:09

Yeah.

Speaker 3 10:10

That's a lot. There's a lot of people don't realize that there are a lot of little things that we have to capture, like where are the fences, where are the gates? All those things, where is the water? Where is the gas? Those things have to be captured for the design plan in order to pass permitting and stuff like that.

Speaker 2 10:25

So we're going to kind of go down the list of some of those things just to give people kind of an understanding, because I think that's a really good point is, they don't understand. There's so much involved here and there's code violations, there's this, there's that and you can get to the point where if something's done in the house and it's not permitted, and now we go to put solar somewhere and then the inspector comes out. Guess what? Yeah, I have an issue with the city.

Speaker 3 10:45

Yep, we just ran into one of those other day.

Speaker 1 10:47

I've had homeowners who've taken a look at you know I've asked them a question. I can look at the side out of photos and they they're like I didn't even. I don't know what that is. I didn't how long you lived in your home, but ten years. You've been living here for ten years. You know, you know, no, that this is on the side of your house. Nope, all right.

Speaker 2 11:02

Good thing we got those pictures so, and we're opening up a can of worms potentially.

Speaker 1 11:05

Yeah, sometimes yeah, so well, we have to right now.

Speaker 2 11:08

So let's talk about the things that we're looking for. So I know the main. I'll start at the very first one. We're looking to see if the design of the panels will fit right. I mean, so how, how does our auditor, what does he do?

Speaker 3 11:21

So we we like to think that that's Responsibility number one for the auditors make sure, first and foremost, that the modules are gonna fit on top of the right. So what he's gonna do is he's gonna drag his stuff on top of the roof there's ladder out, there, safety, all that stuff Climb up on the roof and start off Chalking stuff out three foot clip fire clearances. He's gonna start there. He's gonna start with this corner module on one particular roof plane and then he's gonna go from there. He's gonna start making his.

Speaker 2 11:51

He literally chocks it out, yeah, literally chocks it out, yeah. So he's saying well, will this fit? Yep, and if it won't?

Speaker 3 11:59

For obstructions like vans, or we just we have less room than we anticipated, or something like that. He's gonna start, you know move, trying to see where we can put modules if they won't fit for one particular reason or another.

Speaker 2 12:11

So and we've talked about in our last episode was why, you know why we design the way we design, with panels and all the obstructions and everything. So this kind of ties right into that. And now we have a person on the roof that's actually looking for this stuff.

Speaker 1 12:24

Yeah, because sometimes on those preliminary designs there might be like a little blurry thing on the roof that we don't know it is, but is it a van, or you know, is this dead squirrel right, you know pigeon that just sat there or something for the photo? But then we get on the roof. Oh, it was this, and now we can move things around around it so right.

Speaker 2 12:39

And then, once you've done that, I mean remember back in the day we used to have the little tool to check the Sun. Do you remember that? The Sun, sun, I actually I have that at my house.

Speaker 1 12:48

Yeah you should have brought us and brought it.

Speaker 3 12:50

We still use it every once in a while. I have one particular laptop that I can't update because if I do, it won't work with the old Sun I machine.

Speaker 2 12:58

And that would just measure the actual Sun and shading and stuff for those further the so much of machine actually.

Speaker 3 13:04

You know you pointed at 180 degrees, you put it where the models are gonna go, you say what azimuth, what tilt, and it tells you how much Sun's gonna remember that we got away from using that now because the Software's are so advanced, they can actually do that for us now.

Speaker 2 13:15

Yep, but that was back in the day and we were talking like, wow, remember guys getting up there doing that with their advocates Once you've done that stuff, now you're looking at roof condition what? What do you do To determine the roof is good or bad?

Speaker 3 13:32

well, it's Arizona. Everything's usually Concrete tile has tiles, flat tiles, stuff like that. There's underlayment underneath those tiles. We flip up the tiles when we get out there and we take a look at especially where the overlap is. There are things that we look for a Weathering drying moisture. There's moisture stains Curling whenever it's been Exposed to the elements for too long.

Speaker 3 14:00

Actually, the paper where the overlap is, we'll start Well, curl it up, yeah and then we look for other things like ridge seal, plastic Ridge seal and stuff like that. We flip those tiles up. What we want, the plastic Ridge seal, therefore, is to Basically weatherproof the solar plane.

Speaker 1 14:17

So right nice kind of the stuff, david, went into going into this episode. Yeah, it's starting to be like a full-on doctor's checkup, you know. Yeah, that's exactly kind of what it is.

Speaker 3 14:27

Yeah, we look, we look underneath the tiles, we we see what kind of shape the underlayment is in the. Just looking at the, just looking from the ground up to the roof and looking at the tiles and the flat tiles on the s-tiles, you can't tell what conditional roof? Right, so anyway. So we get up there and we do a little investigating.

Speaker 1 14:44

So, yeah, it's good information for the homeowner too, because you know they could think everything's right, honky-dory in their home, and then we go out and take a look at the roof and then go by the way. This is, you know, a couple days away from a leak.

Speaker 3 14:54

So just so you know.

Speaker 2 14:55

We definitely want to capture that stuff in the beginning, rather than right and right sure what percentage, and I'm just gonna fill us out there what percentage of roofs actually fail in your mind that you look at.

Speaker 3 15:07

I would like to say 55%. Maybe it's not that bad, but no, it's not that bad. Five you guys have had Dave Coleman on, here is your roofing manager and Me and Dave have had a million conversations. People don't realize that out here in the heat, you know they think 20 year roofs, 25 year roofs in their shingles. It's just not the case right.

Speaker 1 15:29

It's just like buying a car battery. You know you buy a car battery and has that three-year warranty, but everyone who's selling you that car party battery goes. It's not, it's three-year warranty but it's probably gonna die in about a year and a half because we eat right around. We know this 12 years.

Speaker 3 15:41

Yeah, so anything with roof, Yep, so, um, that's what. That's what I've been told, and I wasn't a subject matter expert on roofs in the beginning, but I've talked to roofers and talking to Dave and stuff like that. I'm kind of forced into it, forced into it. Yeah anyways, and we're pretty good at making a good initial assessment and then, if we need to, for him to look in depth into it because he's a subject matter expert he will right. So Cool, I love how we're getting full circle here.

Speaker 1 16:07

Yeah, it's kind of cool, right? We should have a podcast with everyone one day. Oh my gosh.

Speaker 2 16:14

Oh, I'll put them on top of each other. A lot of microphones.

Speaker 1 16:17

No.

Speaker 2 16:18

All right, so let's talk about the heart. I think this, this is where the heart of them ever talking about being a doctor, going to the office and physical. The heart to me is the Electrical panel. Right, because that's where everything's gonna centralize in, and I know there's so many things without a panel. It's, and I'll try to keep it understandable. Yeah, so I mean, let's just talk about that. You'd be mentioned briefly. Codes the code issues, so what it? What is the general rule for panels as far as like clearance, stuff like that?

Electrical Panel Clearance Safety and Regulations

Speaker 3 16:45

Okay for all the electrical equipment there's. Basically, you got to look at it like a three by three box in front of your service panel. That goes all the way to the sky, Anyways nothing, nothing in that thing in front of it. No, nothing, you know just nothing can encroach upon that area, right? So, anyways, when? And that's just um, that's a utility requirement.

Speaker 3 17:05

Yeah, it's a safety thing and it's safety utility If something, something catastrophic were to happen. They need to be able to make sure that they don't have to try to get around a tree, right or foliage in order to get to your panel to cut it off so that nobody gets electrocuted or something like that, so you have clearance rules. No it?

Speaker 2 17:23

how about by walls? It can't be behind a wall or there's I know APS has rules about walls.

Speaker 3 17:29

No, we can put stuff behind walls, it's iffy, it's.

Speaker 1 17:33

They have to have Like 24-hour access to it, so it's like gates, just anything anything like a service disconnect that it's.

Speaker 3 17:43

It all boils down to safety. So, in order to turn something off, do firemen have to go into the backyard in order to turn it off, before they can get on the roof and poke a hole to let Heat out?

Speaker 1 17:53

whenever there's a fire right.

Speaker 3 17:54

So anyways, they want it all when it's accessible right, so everything has to be accessible.

Speaker 1 17:59

Yes, right, you can't have it in your podcast room, in your upstairs house.

Speaker 2 18:04

Which you see a lot in the Midwest, where they have those inside the house. Yeah, yeah a lot of them at those services are actually in the house and a closet. Oh wow, yeah. As we opened up in Oklahoma, we started finding services in the closet. Oh, they're my sweater, there's my jacket, there's my service. Different jurisdictions.

Speaker 1 18:18

Yeah, it's just different. Right in Arizona is very different.

Speaker 2 18:21

And then you know it's funny. I see I see pictures all the time and I know you guys are looking at pictures all the time, but there could be like a gas pipe running right under, right under an electric panel or a water pipe.

Speaker 3 18:31

You see all kinds of stuff with Unpermitted additions and stuff like that, people doing stuff that they're not really supposed to do, anyways, and we run into stuff like that. But there's, there's rules for everything. So anyways, yeah, gas and water. Putting weird places right next to the service panel which right you know you don't want gas right in front of a, something that could spark.

Speaker 1 18:54

You don't want water, like just water, really good friends waters waters a conductor.

Speaker 2 18:58

So, we just saw one last week. Brad showed me and Brad's our director of operations. He showed me a picture of somebody that had like a water spout that was running for some kind of a washer in the house Mm-hmm, right underneath.

Speaker 1 19:09

Yeah, yes, yes, like someone just did it that way. Yeah, you can't do that in. Homeowners don't know. They know they just have some guy come out and do it and they think it's everything's up to code and you know and they they find out later.

Speaker 3 19:21

On storm rolls over the lake and you're in the water. You get out. It should make sense that you don't want water near electricity. Yeah yeah, you don't want gas. You know, spark big boom right.

Speaker 2 19:34

And then I know that you know we have our operations meeting and it's it's a constant conversation about breakers, like there's a main breaker which, whatever that is, it's gonna be a 200, 250, 175, 200 amp.

Speaker 3 19:47

It's the main service disconnect. So when you flip the main breaker and then all your circuit breakers after that, mm-hmm don't work.

Speaker 2 19:54

So, so that main breaker sometimes has to be, you know, it cuts all the power. It cuts all the power and we, sometimes we do a thing called derating Mm-hmm, what's that this is one of the hot.

Speaker 3 20:08

Yes, this is one of the hardest concepts to explain um.

Speaker 2 20:12

And I don't have my head around it. I'm gonna.

Speaker 3 20:15

I'm gonna try to make it.

Speaker 2 20:17

That's me, but it's anyways.

Speaker 3 20:19

So there's national electric code has rules for solar back feed and the electrical service. So basically, your, your back feed breaker plus your main breaker cannot exceed 120% of the bus rating which is usually out here in Arizona 200 amps. So you have there's a number that you have to look for 240. You can usually 120% of the 200 amp, bus rating is 240. So a 60 amp breaker Plus a hundred and seventy five amp main breaker. So solar 60 amps Main breakers, 175 amps. When you add them together it equals 235 and you're gets under 240, which is 120% of the bus rating.

Speaker 3 21:02

So as long as you're below the 240, You're right but anyway. But there's. And then to on a 225 amp bus you have, a 270 is 120%.

Speaker 2 21:13

So now there's different rules, that's just I don't want to get too far, I don't want to get in the weeds. That I understand. We'll do something like a whole podcast on D-rate. Yeah, we'll talk about because that actually we do do. I think they did in my house.

Speaker 1 21:23

Yeah, it was a 200 amp.

Speaker 3 21:24

Now it's 175 mine too right.

Speaker 2 21:26

So they did that in order, so it works. So we'll get, we'll get into that. But there's a whole yeah, there's a probably a whole conversation just about that and it's very technical and it might kill people to listen to, because I've been listening to it for 10 years and I still kind of get it.

Speaker 1 21:37

Yeah, so you can exclude you from that.

Speaker 3 21:39

Yeah, you just when, when you add the solar breakers, sometimes you have to make the main breaker smaller in order to not exceed limitations. Anyways, I'm not gonna now.

Load Calcs

Speaker 2 21:46

So it's okay. But now I know one of the things you guys do is you get into load calcs, so that's probably not as complicated. That's all me, that's all you right. We're boring. So what is a low? What is load calc? We talk customers yeah, we have to do a load calc to see if it's gonna work. They're like what right? I even say what what's a load calc.

Speaker 3 22:03

So the load calculation is a sum of all your All, the sum of all the circuits that you have on your house. So so you add them all up, add them all up and that tells you down and it tells me whether I can do the D-ray that we just talked about. Okay, so you have. So I have to make sure that the load calculations, if I D-ray to main breaker 275 amps, have to make sure the load calculations stay on 175 amps, or else It'll just pop and pop, okay.

Speaker 1 22:29

All information we can't get from an aerial view.

Speaker 2 22:32

I got my whole point of having this conversation right there's just a million things that it's just little things.

Speaker 3 22:39

I'm sure you guys have talked about it before, but Arizona is so unique in that you know all the jurisdictions go by. You know it's not a uniform policy different codes, different building codes, different electric codes, so anyways, and we have to make sure that we get grab all this information that will please all of the jurisdiction. Yeah so anyways. So we have to get something specific for this place and we have to get something right, but we have to do it every single time.

Speaker 1 23:03

So it's an all-encompassing thing that we have to get a lot of those homeowners will mind it. You know, my friend didn't have to do that like well, there they're in Glendale and your imperial.

Speaker 2 23:10

That's the difference, yeah, and people don't get that right and they don't understand that you're where you live. It really drives all the rules right. Peoria is different from Phoenix. Phoenix is different from Maricopa.

Speaker 3 23:22

County.

Speaker 2 23:23

All these different rules and we have to, and that it goes for setbacks, that goes for the electrical side, it's everything yeah, and then you know you live in Scottsdale but it's actually a Phoenix jurisdiction.

Speaker 1 23:31

Yeah, we have to go out for this and that, and so it's absolutely very unique.

Speaker 2 23:34

It's very unique and we talk about customization. That's just another form of it's, customized to the utility and what they want so, geez, that's true. And then I know, I know one of the things we talked about is dead fronts, because I guess what you guys do is when you, when you, look at the panel, the guy goes in there and takes the front off. It takes a picture of the boss and all the it's just the cover over the breakers right anyways take it off and.

Speaker 2 23:57

We've got customers go, I can just take that off. Well, no, because if you take it off and touch the wrong thing, you're gonna die.

Speaker 1 24:02

Let us do it.

Speaker 2 24:03

Yeah, because you can right. I mean, there's enough power back there it can kill you. Yeah, it's, you know her show. So is that how we pick our auditors? We kind of like him, but we don't we say you're the dead front auditor.

Speaker 1 24:12

No kidding.

Speaker 3 24:15

So initiation we don't have many looking at all of that stuff, all that stuff yeah, not only that. You know, once we pull the dead front off, we see what's connected, what's not connected was turned off, was turned on anyways.

Speaker 2 24:28

So and then I know that the the little tube on the bottom of. So you have your, you have your panel, and then there's a tube that comes from the ground and goes into that and that's called a riser, riser, and I always see that we replace those a lot. Why would we replace the riser?

Speaker 3 24:44

In order to pass inspection. We can't have anything that's cracked, so sometimes we have their rigid metal conduit risers, their PVC risers anyways, and PVC is just plastic on steroids and Anyways so it it breaks in the heat. Yeah anyways, and not only that.

Speaker 3 25:02

Whenever our house is first built, you know the risers put in, and then there's Settling and stuff like that so you know, a couple months after it's the risers put in there and the electrical services on the house, you know, and things start shifting and heat and cold and rain and all that stuff and it could crack it. Right at the base of the Hub there's a little hub that connects the riser to the service entrance section. So yeah.

Speaker 1 25:29

So all good info yeah.

Speaker 2 25:30

I know that and we replaced a lot of those, but it has to be intact before it'll pass inspection.

Speaker 3 25:34

So if we go out there and it's cracked, it's got to be fixed before we finish all of our stuff and we're doing a lot of this stuff.

Speaker 2 25:40

For that we have to pass an inspection. We don't want to fail the inspection. That's just gonna anger us, anger you. Right, we have to do safety behind it. We got to make sure this thing's not gonna explode or catch fire, so we got to follow all those different rules and so that the service panel is the heart of the solar installation.

Speaker 1 25:55

Yeah, we joke about that. But there's yeah, there's a lot of homeowners like, well, why are you doing this? I don't want this. Like, well, your home could catch on fire if we don't do that. So this is why we're doing it.

Speaker 2 26:05

I mean, we have a classic example that we've been talking with this customer for probably two months, where somebody went out there and did something on this guy's panel, where it's just it's oh yeah, it's not right, it's it's. We're afraid it's gonna catch on fire and we don't want to put our name on this thing and start touching this and just leave it the way it is right. We got the manufacturer involved, we got a bunch of people involved in this and said is this right? And they're like absolutely not, this needs to be fixed. Yeah, and the customer was hearing from the electricians that they were talking to is oh no, it's fine.

Speaker 1 26:34

It's not.

Speaker 2 26:35

It's not fine, and we're not gonna touch this. We're actually gonna cancel this project unless you do it the right way. Right, right. And so that one of the reasons sometimes Harman gets a bad rap is because we're not willing to just do anything. Yeah right, and we just can. We're gonna do what's right for you and, I forgot, for us as well, because it's our liability and People don't like that. But I think they finally decided to go with it. I think we're actually gonna replace that. I'm no.

Speaker 3 26:55

I'm the one that found that discrepancy, yeah, and anyways, and I was like whoa, that's not right, anyways, and I'm not gonna bore you with the details or anything like that, but they will. Another electrician wired it wrong, right, and it has a serious potential for overheating or possibly fire or damage because they got too much electricity go into one spot. Yeah, so yeah.

Speaker 1 27:23

I know you're homeowner potential electricity going to one spot. Yeah, a homeowner is going okay, well, I have my electrician saying it was done right, harman saying is done wrong, who's right? So then that's why we okay, we're gonna get the manufacturer involved right, other entities involved, and go here's all the facts. Now you make the decision of who's right or wrong.

Speaker 2 27:40

And this took almost two months, turns out right, yeah to actually make the decision, but it was, yeah, we had to come down. We finally just said, hey, either we do it this way or we just walk away. Right, we're not doing this right, so, and that's I agree, that's exactly what we should do, okay, so we're talking about the heart. We'll get away from the heart for a second. You guys are also when you're doing audits. If we sell batteries, you're looking at, you're looking at the location for batteries. I know there's a lot involved in that, even more involved in that right so.

Speaker 2 28:06

I mean, I guess, if I tone it down a little bit that you're looking for a certain distance from the actual service. We try to keep it close, like within 20 feet, 30 feet.

Speaker 3 28:15

We'd like to keep it within 20 feet, is you know? We're looking at minimizing conduit runs and wire length and stuff like that. Anyways, but there's. There's other things that go into it. If you put it on the outside of the house, we can't be more than, or we can't be more than Closer than five feet to doors and windows. There's other things, there's a lot of rules.

Speaker 1 28:38

Yeah.

Speaker 2 28:38

Yeah, and some some of them are a Jurisdiction rules and some are like Tesla rules. For instance, tesla has Tesla Tesla has.

Speaker 3 28:45

One of the Installation rules is uh, you know, if we put it on the outside of the house, they don't want it on the backside of Living or living area. So it let's say right outside of a bedroom. Outside of a bedroom.

Speaker 2 28:58

They wanted outside your kitchen.

Speaker 3 29:00

Yeah, so we have to. We have to know what's on the other side of the wall too, wow that's what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 29:05

So this is the smartest guy in the room, right? All this should. I leave smarter than you really all this stuff he has to remember, have to remember. Yeah, that's a lot of rules. It's insane right and that this is your job on a daily basis, to know all this? I have to figure out what's good and what's bad and Figure out how to make it work and and utilize the experts around you to kind of get them together. Yeah, there's, hey and there, go through this stuff.

Speaker 3 29:25

I don't. I'm not the most intelligent person, that's for sure, but anyways. But if I don't know the answer, I, I know, know how to find it again All right.

Speaker 2 29:35

So we talked about getting on the roof, making sure the modules fit. We talked about looking at shading. We talked a lot about the SES. I don't think I want to talk much more about it. I mean it's just. The bottom line is it's either gonna work or it's not. If it's not gonna work, we're gonna try to do a D-rate. If that's not gonna work, then we have to replace the panel. We get into a lot of our panel replacements and there's obviously a cost to that. Sometimes somebody's going to a system size so big it requires going from a 200 amp to a 400 amp, right?

Speaker 2 30:00

I mean so and God help us. It takes a year to get a 400 amp because of the back, the backlogs from the pandemic and everything else Are they?

Speaker 3 30:06

getting so much better. Now us through the utility company, we're gonna talk about that, yeah.

Speaker 2 30:10

So that's something we'll talk about, but there's a lot involved in all that stuff. So man and you and we're halfway through the audit. Well, we're a good part through of it and then like if we're doing any kind of a trenching I mean it's a lot of times maybe it's a detached garage, yeah, and there's patent those modules on the detached and then you have to go take a look at the trenching issue of it, right, you know?

Speaker 1 30:30

and we do get those people like yeah, I put panels on my you know detached garage, my barn in the back, like everybody sees a separated structure and they think it's.

Speaker 3 30:37

Oh, you just throw them on there.

Speaker 1 30:40

Right, so wait, the electricity doesn't just magically jump from there to your house. No, interesting.

Speaker 2 30:44

I think about that. So let's say we have to do trenching. What things are you looking for when you have to do that?

Speaker 3 30:49

What's in the way, what's in the path, or what's the, the path of least resistance between that structure and this structure? You know, these trenches, we, we have to send a private locator out to find out where gas and water is. That's another thing. The, the, the path to, from the, from the, from the other structure to the house. These trenches have our 18 to 24 inches deep. So, yeah, and they have to be they, we have to trench and the inspectors have to come out and look at the trench.

Speaker 3 31:17

Right and make sure that everything's good and it's a certain depth, and then we can backfill and do all that stuff. So I mean the distances, we look at the distances, we look at what's in the way, um so wait a second.

Speaker 2 31:30

When I talk to, people are like, well, I just go hire some guys from Home Depot and they're gonna come and dig a hole for me. Yeah, that won't work. Is that what you're saying?

Speaker 3 31:38

Because you have to then then if it gets inspected and you say, hey, here's the here's where the conduit is under the ground, and then you have to go out there and and dig a little hole so that somebody can come out and inspect and verify that it's 18 to 24 inches deep, anyways, it's just a big, there's, it's a, it's a lot of stuff.

Speaker 1 31:55

Let's do it the right way, Anyways but it's yeah, there's a lot we do even more that goes into that. We do have those homeowners like I'll just trench it myself myself. I'm like okay.

Speaker 2 32:06

We have, but it's got to meet the requirements.

Speaker 3 32:08

So you know coming out of the garage with a garden trowel and I get it done in three weeks.

Speaker 2 32:15

I can tell that, talking about all this stuff, you're probably gonna need a drink. I'm not talking coffee All right.

Speaker 1 32:22

Well, it's good. You think there's coffee in there.

Speaker 3 32:25

I.

Safety Concerns

Speaker 2 32:28

All right, so we've done all that, you've looked at all those things, and then I know that you guys also look at safety concerns.

Speaker 1 32:34

Right, so I know as a sales department.

Speaker 2 32:36

We have to actually kind of try to find them ourselves. Sometimes I know we talk about Well, we talk about their dogs in the in the yard because our auditor has to come and take a look, but then you're looking at safety things like I'm giving a. Give me an example of what kinds of safety issues.

Speaker 3 32:49

I find every once in a while and it's it's the exception, not the rule that there will be Clutter yeah. I've seen a lot of those around the house in places where we had need to be able to get on the roof. Yep, in order to further the guys that they install guys to, you know to put their ladders back there and walk the modules up on top of the roof. And you know right.

Speaker 3 33:09

Clutter Once again. Not only is the the three by three clearance issue that we talked about for the electrical panels, that's considered a safety issue too, yeah, it makes sense.

Speaker 1 33:20

Um, I think I saw an audit notes. There's like a beehive nearby or something, or be like bees or wasp in the backyard, like do you remember that? I mean he's probably seen so many, but I do remember seeing one like they need to take care of the wasp. So I'm like, yeah, well, you got to take care of what we don't want to get stung while we're doing house, so what else?

Speaker 3 33:41

Yeah, most of the time it's some of the some of the two-story houses, in order to get a, you know, get all the way up on top of the two-story house. You know, sometimes there isn't a Structure that you can step up process.

Speaker 2 33:54

So now you know it's 30 feet to the roof, and so we have to get a crane in those situations sometimes right Sometimes because we have those modules up there and we can't just walk them up a ladder.

Speaker 3 34:04

So we like to. We like to point out those kind of things. Yeah, clutter being one one, things, clearance issues being another thing, how we're gonna get the stuff onto the roof. We try to look at all that stuff to make sure it's easy, easier, as easy as it can be for everybody.

Speaker 2 34:19

And then I would think another thing that we have to do, or that you have to do or someone has to do I guess this is a combination of the designers and you is we have to determine the conduit runs right. We have to make sure we can actually Do the conduit runs correctly see how it's gonna get From the modules.

Speaker 3 34:34

The conduit is gonna get from the modules to the service panel.

Speaker 1 34:37

Yeah and not just be ugly. Yeah whether it's on top of the roof or in the attic.

Speaker 3 34:41

Yeah, well, that's one thing. I think that at Harmon, you know, our standards are a little bit higher when it comes to aesthetics and stuff like that. So I agree anyways, just how we're gonna do it. Are we gonna tuck it up under the Eve? Are we gonna run her along a stem wall? How's it how much of it's gonna be exposed to? You know from the street and stuff like that?

Speaker 2 35:01

We try to look at all that stuff, so how much time does an auditor spend at home on average?

Speaker 3 35:09

It just it really depends on the audit, but you know we're looking at a hour, hour and a half usually, if I had to get it.

Speaker 2 35:16

Just varies but now or an hour and a half is probably a good and does a homeowner need to be there?

Speaker 3 35:21

Yes, yes and no, they can, so depends so. I kind of touched on it earlier but I kind of touched on it earlier. But we have to, the designs have to have certain things. So we've got to be able to get in the way we are. We have to show where all the water spigots are and stuff like that, where the fences start, where they end. All that stuff has to be in order to pass. For a design to pass permitting, we have to have all those things. They have to be accurate.

Speaker 2 35:50

So he's measuring all that stuff Sometimes. Sometimes, yeah, and I know that we've done some pretty big system and some really huge homes and I know we've had a team of people go out and do those on it, yourself included when you guys are, go out there and spend hours out there.

Speaker 3 36:07

There's so much information that we have to grab. Sometimes I'll go out there on these big, huge systems just to make sure that we get everything and somebody's double checking somebody else. We don't want to have to go out there a second time. We try to do it in one shot.

Speaker 2 36:21

But there are times now, to be fair. There are times that we're going to have to maybe go out a second time. Maybe we looked at all the information and go we're missing this, we're missing that, or we need to really go back and re-look at this so that can happen. We're not perfect yeah we're not perfect, but also the situation may dictate that also Just has nothing to do with being perfect or not. It's like now we need to go back and validate this or verify this let's get it right, Right get it right, get it right, or sometimes things change.

Speaker 3 36:47

The customer finds out maybe later rather than sooner that there's going to be exposed conduit on the roof and they say, hey, how about running it through the attic, or something like that. Then we got to go back out and take a look in the attic.

Speaker 2 36:58

Yeah, now we got to get in the attic and look at everything there. Okay, so once an auditor has gone out there and done his job and gone all this stuff and it went an hour and a half, whatever it takes for him to do that so then what he does is he's going to upload all that information to our system. So he has pictures 60 to 140 pictures he has to upload. He has to fill out the reporter. If he's done it on the tool, he has everything filled out and he uploads everything.

Speaker 2 37:24

So we usually give an auditor probably 24 hours to do that, after the audit 48, I'm sorry, 48 hours. So we'll get what's like 24 to 40 hours.

Speaker 1 37:33

We'll edit that.

Speaker 2 37:34

So 24 to 48 hours to get that done.

Speaker 3 37:36

Cause he's going to house, to house, to house. No, I'm sorry it's 48 for me to start looking at it.

Speaker 2 37:41

Oh, we're gonna get to you. Start looking at it it is 24 for the audit no need to edit Okay, auditor, you have 24 hours or we're coming after you. Clock starts, right, clock starts now. We're 48 to 72 for us to get in, so then we get into what's called an audit compilation and that's where you kick in, right?

Speaker 1 37:58

I'm like okay, this is what makes me drink. Yeah, so this is where, homeowners, you know you have to have a little patience because, as soon as you know, the first thing is someone coming out to their home, taking all the measurements and right away, like right, when they leave, they'll call me and they go. Okay, now what?

Speaker 3 38:13

Yeah.

Speaker 1 38:13

Now we wait, and so the Lucas can do his job and we'll figure it out from there and find out what's going on.

Speaker 2 38:18

Yeah, and we tell people.

Speaker 2 38:20

I think we tell them to give us about a week to get out there, audit it, get all the information back then take a look at it, and there's things after that we'll talk about. But so now we do what's called an audit compilation, and that's where you've gotten all this information from the auditor. I crunch it. And yeah, you basically crunch it is what you do. You have to go through everything and if you see anything that's questionable, like you may see, I've noticed hey, the roof is questionable. Hey, David, take a look at the roof. And so the David is going to look at pictures. He might even just say I need to go out and take a second look, and he'll go out and look at it.

Speaker 3 38:47

You'll see where he does that. He'll get up on the roof and lift up tiles and take a more stringent.

Speaker 2 38:53

Look at it, he'll put his eye on it, and so that could be something that can delay, or probably the biggest one that I see. That takes time and we have zero control over this Is now. We need a utility input, so we have to go back to the utility and say, hey, this is going on, we need you to help us. What do you want us to do?

Utility Input

Speaker 3 39:10

Give me an example of what we need. I do that stuff too.

Speaker 2 39:12

What we need a utility input.

Speaker 3 39:15

Okay, I'm gonna try not to bore everybody again.

Speaker 2 39:17

Well, I'm getting to do detail, just in general.

Speaker 3 39:19

Well, say there's an old service panel on the house that doesn't offer, where they don't manufacture the updated parts that we need that have higher capacities before they interrupt ratings and stuff things of that nature. I have you guys talked about that stuff before? No, 22K rated parts. No, not at all. Not at all Not at all.

Speaker 1 39:43

I like how he whispers out to the side yeah, he does this. Does anyone know about this? So it's okay.

Speaker 2 39:50

No one's watching this. No, it's okay. Okay so.

Speaker 1 39:54

Except for my mom, maybe.

Speaker 3 39:57

Using higher inter-upgraded parts that have a higher capacity before they lose their integrity and stuff like that. They hold up to a little bit more heat current.

Speaker 2 40:07

To a more of an upgraded part, Upgraded part Anyways.

Speaker 3 40:11

So some of the older panels they don't manufacture parts like that for those old panels, so we get up and trying to keep it less complicated. We have to have upgraded parts to put in those panel in order to pass, especially because of newer NEC codes and stuff like that.

Speaker 2 40:31

And if we can't find them or they don't wanna make them, then we have to change the panel.

Speaker 3 40:33

Then we have to change the panel Right so that could be an example.

Speaker 2 40:36

Or maybe, like we talked about with the wall and access, if access doesn't make a whole lot of, if it's not there, we don't think it's there we might ask the utility Yep.

Speaker 3 40:42

Are you okay with that? Hey, this was already here like this. Can we grandfather this? Because it was constructed like this and somebody passed it before.

Speaker 2 40:50

But we wanna make sure it's okay and they have to give us our blessing. They have to give us the blessing, yeah, otherwise we have to move it.

Speaker 3 40:55

This is okay, like, hey, it was built this close to the gas meter Originally we didn't do anything, we just all we did was go out and take pictures. But listen, if you want us to move it, we'll move it. Or if you tell us it's okay to keep there, then it goes through a process. It goes to somebody high enough at APS or SRP or stuff like that, where they say, hey, we can work with this or no, it needs to move.

Speaker 1 41:19

And really they dictate it and we have to buy about whatever they say, right, that's important, they're the boss, not us saying it's them.

Speaker 2 41:25

And unfortunately sometimes that can take a little bit. We put an input request in. It could take a week, it could take two weeks.

Speaker 3 41:30

We gotta change the service panel out for an old one, for a new one. I'm the one that does that too. Anyways, it takes it's five day process for them to respond initially. So, anyhow, sometimes they're better, sometimes they're not so good.

Speaker 2 41:49

It just depends, right, how busy they are with time of year. It is Just like anything else, just like even with us. I mean, things change, things happen, but it takes time.

Speaker 3 41:55

It takes time.

Speaker 1 41:55

I'm gonna get a job there and see if I can speed it up.

Speaker 3 41:58

All right guys, let's get this five days down to two and they give us all sorts of information that tells us what we have to do at install you know, whether new PowerFee wires need to come in, whether the service needs to move, whether the riser needs to be changed out all kinds of things that tell us.

Speaker 2 42:14

My favorite is always when the transformer or the box or whatever you call it, is in my neighbor's yard or it's running through my neighbors and we have to get access to that and that means we might have to trench in their yard or do something in their yard.

Speaker 3 42:27

And now we have to get permission from the neighbors and the utility has to come out and take a look at it, and they have to look at easements and stuff like that. Where's the transformer at? What's the path of lease resistance for Right.

Speaker 2 42:40

I hope you have a good relationship with your neighbor. Because they will now control, they can say, no, we're done, there's not a whole lot we can do about it.

Speaker 1 42:46

Imagine that conversation like talk to a homeowner who doesn't have solar, like why don't you have solar? My neighbor said no, all right.

Speaker 2 42:54

I mean, that happened, yeah. I can think of times where we had to go across the street to do stuff and we had to trench underneath the street.

Speaker 3 43:01

Yeah, concrete work and pavement work.

Speaker 2 43:04

It can get crazy. So I'm not trying to scare people, but I'm just saying there are scenarios where we have to really get a lot of input and a lot of information about people, and that's really what you're and your team's job is is to gather that information.

Speaker 2 43:17

And all the information that you have, and then you put it all together and then you start looking at our experts going hey guys, this is what we have, and we literally meet once a week in a meeting and we talk about this stuff and you come in all frustrated and talk through it.

Speaker 3 43:31

Well, it's just well, I guess. There's a lot that goes into it. Yeah, yeah. And what's frustrating sometimes is not everybody understands, yeah, and I have to be the one that goes in and says, hey, we can't do that. They think it's just as easy. Well, why don't you just do that? I'm like. Well, because of this.

Speaker 2 43:48

And that's the problem with salespeople and us being salespeople is we don't have that knowledge or that understanding. So maybe sometimes we're not as fair to you as we should be, but that's just honestly, I'm just saying it. It's our ignorance, right, we just want to move forward. But you're like I said about Dave and everybody else. You're helping to keep us honest and say, hey, no, we got to do it right for the customer, we got to do it right by the rules and this and that, and so we just can't do it that way.

Speaker 3 44:10

We just can't cut corners it just it ends up being a bad.

Speaker 1 44:14

Yeah, and not every home is the same. You know, you can have those communities where every home looks the same because they're all built the same, but then we go out to the home and find out oh, this is a different issue compared to your neighbor who got sold with us, and compared to the person across the street who got sold with us. All three of you guys were different.

Speaker 3 44:29

And that's where you guys, I know you try to explain to customers. You know, this is what truly sets us apart is you know we do all this other stuff?

Speaker 2 44:36

What I really want to do is give the customers your phone number, but they won't let me.

Speaker 1 44:41

I would love to talk. We flash on the screen.

Speaker 3 44:43

Yeah, we're going to flash on the screen. I'm going to talk to each and every one of them.

Speaker 1 44:47

Go ahead and comment down in the comment section. I'll be honest. Lucas will answer.

Speaker 2 44:52

Sometimes you guys tell us stuff and then I think we have project managers even, and sometimes they'd maybe even struggle with it, but they have a lot more experience than we do. But we say you explain that to the customer because honestly I don't know what to say. Yeah, it no good, it won't work, because that's all I know. But that's where a guy like you. So it's important to show people you know the site auto process that we have and the guys and the girls behind it that really have to do a ton of work in that period of time just to make sure your system's going to work and get it to work. So it's. I hear all the time from other companies or other customers that, oh, you know, they promised me they're going to get this installed in 10 days or 15 days and I'm just going to go. Yeah, I don't think so, and if they do, I'd be really worried.

Speaker 3 45:31

I really want to see it, because I'm going to come out there with a lawn chair and a paint product and I'm just going to sit there and watch.

Speaker 2 45:38

Oh, come on.

Speaker 3 45:39

I want to see this. The time frame is a time frame.

Speaker 2 45:42

There's not a whole lot we can do about it. If you're installing a simple one that just goes through it, it's real easy, we're done and we could probably move through it in 45 days. It's very possible. But that's an, you know, that's a clean job and they're not.

Speaker 1 45:55

Yeah, there's a lot that goes on behind the scenes that a lot of people don't, you know, are Unaware of, and we kind of make it that way so homeowners don't have to worry about it. You know there are issues that come up but we don't necessarily have to, you know make it.

Speaker 3 46:08

We can fix this. It's not as easy as just slap and solar.

The Importance of the Solar Audit

Speaker 2 46:11

Yeah, it's just the audit is so important. It's such a big part of this process. Once you've gone, you know, once you've signed on the dotted line, yeah, this is a huge part. This is the next huge hurdle you have to get through. And once you get through this and it's all clean and then we get to the design pros and we're gonna keep. We're gonna be doing more and more podcasts. We're talking about the design process, we're gonna talk about all the things that go on after that up to the install, which is why we're gonna look to bring a project manager on here soon, and probably in the next couple episodes, and kind of talk About how they now have to take that information and how they have to orchestrate this whole thing to make it work.

Speaker 1 46:44

Mm-hmm.

Speaker 2 46:44

It's a it's a process, right yeah, it's an absolute process.

Speaker 1 46:46

I've had so many customers ask me you know, can we do this, can we do that? And I don't know. The audits gonna decide what we can and can't do. So right, you know, and after that, who knows? Right, we'll figure it out later.

Speaker 2 46:56

And we're not trying to make it sound hard to know. No, this is just the reality. This is why you want a company that knows what they're doing yeah, on the back end to take care of you, not just some flabby night guy that's just trying to sell you something.

Speaker 1 47:07

I don't yeah, I would rather know Other than solar, just anything in life. I'd rather have someone tell me I don't know, but we're gonna find out, versus someone just go yeah, we could do that, and then it be disappointed and let down later.

Speaker 2 47:20

Yeah, typical sales guy. We can do that? Yeah, sure, we do anything. I always answer that yeah.

Speaker 3 47:24

I know I'm a pain in the butt sometimes, but like I got to tell everybody the good stuff and the bad stuff and we have to figure out how to make it work, I mean, and that's.

Speaker 2 47:34

No surprises. Yep right, that's the key, that's the goal. We do not want surprises at the end. We want this all up front, taking care of. So when we get to the end, you're happy, we're happy or no surprises. Because surprises are the killer of solar.

Speaker 1 47:46

Mm-hmm.

Speaker 2 47:46

I really want the killer of anything.

Speaker 1 47:47

Yeah, I mean we could go up there and just install panels However we want, do we want, but then the inspection comes out and they go take everything down. This is all wrong.

Speaker 2 47:55

I can't tell you how many times I hear that story where, yeah, a couple things that you know. Oh, it's the end of the year, so I really want to get this up there because of the tax credit in this or that yeah, this solar company comes and we're just experiencing this month.

Speaker 2 48:07

Right, oh, I'm gonna go with this company because they say they can get up there. Yeah, they probably can. They could probably put a stanchion in the panels up there, not even permit it. Yeah, get it all up there and then just do this and pray. It won't be turned on by the end of the year. It'll be turned on five months later, eight months later, because they do it backwards, right and we're just not gonna, we're not gonna do that.

Speaker 3 48:26

Say they put somebody throw solar on top of the root of a bad roof and then a year later they have to tear it all down.

Speaker 2 48:31

Yeah, yeah, new roof and we've talked about the high cost of that. I mean, it's a per panel cost and it's outrageous. Yeah, you don't want to be in that scenario. So we got to do thing right from the get, from the get go, and that's why we have guys like Lucas. That is, he's got a crucial part of this process. It's crucial part of this process. So we appreciate, Thank, everything you do, even though sometimes in meetings it doesn't sound like we appreciate it and we get frustrated. I know, I know that I'm a guy that does that sometimes true story.

Speaker 3 48:54

But the reality is we're glad that there's guys like you there because it helps us this yeah, there's just a lot that goes along, and I think so, thanks, there's just a lot of stuff that goes into it. People don't realize. Anyways, I got to capture all that stuff and and make sure that everybody's aware of everything anyways. So, yeah, anyhow it's important. Sometimes I got to go in the meeting and say your baby's ugly.

Speaker 2 49:16

And he does that. Yeah, and I don't appreciate you calling my baby yet. No, not yours, you thought Ben's, I guess my mind brought an actual baby in the meeting.

Speaker 1 49:25

It's a little silly, kids ugly yeah.

Speaker 2 49:28

So I mean that that's the side audit, that's, that's the process that we go through and it's, it's, you know, it's, there's a lot to it and it takes a little bit of time.

Speaker 3 49:34

But we try to make it quick and painless. But there's a lot of stuff that we got to get right.

Speaker 2 49:39

Thanks for coming and joining us.

Speaker 3 49:41

We hope I gave you guys some useful information. Maybe it's a little bit easier for you guys to learn stuff every day.

Speaker 2 49:46

No, I think it's been great. I mean, I've been learning a lot in these podcasts. This is this is episode seven, I think. Right, seven episodes, yeah, so, and we've learned a lot through these seven episodes and bringing guys like you and stuff I never thought I'd get you in here, really.

Speaker 3 50:01

No, I was. I came to you no.

Speaker 1 50:05

Not not requested to be on here All right so. Ben, what are we doing next? I don't know what are we doing next. We had like a list your suggestion.

Speaker 2 50:12

We had a whole list of told me you wanted to do something and I said you know what? We're gonna take one episode break, oh, no process, and we're gonna do and we're gonna do one solar 101, right?

Speaker 1 50:21

No, just what is solar and how does it work? And we haven't touched that. We've done all these tiny little things, but we haven't talked about big picture and we used to do solar 101 seminars.

Speaker 2 50:29

Yeah, right, so we're gonna basically do a solar 101 seminar on the podcast. Yeah, so that's what we're gonna do next time, so stay tuned for that one. That'll be pretty good. That'll just be me and Ben. Yeah, no guest. No guest knows, maybe slides, but no, guest no slides today.

Speaker 1 50:41

That was really good right? Yeah, it's like today, Don't need them.

Speaker 2 50:43

So me and Ben will come back at you and we'll do solar 101 next Anything good, don't forget to like and subscribe, and that's right, so all the good stuff like us, subscribe, you can go to.

Speaker 2 50:53

You can listen to us on Spotify, on iTunes, on I heart all the little places for audio. We're on YouTube, subscribe and like to that channel. Appreciate all support We've been getting. This is really starting to grow and and we're gonna continue to do this we hope to get another Couple done this year, as we're getting toward the end of the year and getting into Thanksgiving and stuff. So we appreciate support, appreciate you watching and we will see you again soon. Thank you.

Speaker 1 51:18

Thank you.