When Dr. Eva Yacobi candidly shares the narrative of her journey, it's clear that the path to healing is as personal as it is profound. In our intimate conversation, we traverse the terrain of Hormonal Alchemy, her innovative program that weaves together naturopathic practices and trauma recovery. Prepare to be enlightened on the symbiotic relationship between gut health and mental wellness, and how sexual intimacy can bolster a deep connection with ourselves and others. With Dr. Yacobi's guidance, we uncover the importance of emotional awareness in our dietary habits and the invaluable insights men can gain from women's experiences.
Shifting gears, I recount my own pivot from a rigidly mental approach to the dynamic realm of somatic experiences. My decision to forgo traditional medical school in favor of naturopathic medicine was a leap fueled by a desire for holistic practice, deeply entangled with my personal evolution. This episode peels back the layers on the struggle for legitimacy in the absence of conventional credentials, the ongoing journey to self-assurance, and the courage required for unapologetic discourse on differing health ideologies. Join us as we navigate the murky waters of authenticity, emotional intelligence, and the innate knowledge of our true paths.
To cap off this episode, we wade into the complexities involved in the treatment of mental health. The narrative extends beyond the reach of medication to the very roots of self-expression and individual biochemistry. As we explore the undercurrents of copper toxicity and gut health on our psychological state, I offer a glimpse into my own medication and dietary challenges. The chapter culminates in a raw examination of self-intimate sexuality, discussing the transformational power of reconnecting with our bodies through breath and energy work. Our guest, Dr. Yacobi, and I sketch out the landscape where sexual healing paves the way to self-discovery and, ultimately, profound healing.
Start Here to Unlock Your Hormonal Balance
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IG: @matthewpaetz
Start Here to Find Out - What's Blocking You From Making Your First $100k?
When Dr. Eva Yacobi candidly shares the narrative of her journey, it's clear that the path to healing is as personal as it is profound. In our intimate conversation, we traverse the terrain of Hormonal Alchemy, her innovative program that weaves together naturopathic practices and trauma recovery. Prepare to be enlightened on the symbiotic relationship between gut health and mental wellness, and how sexual intimacy can bolster a deep connection with ourselves and others. With Dr. Yacobi's guidance, we uncover the importance of emotional awareness in our dietary habits and the invaluable insights men can gain from women's experiences.
Shifting gears, I recount my own pivot from a rigidly mental approach to the dynamic realm of somatic experiences. My decision to forgo traditional medical school in favor of naturopathic medicine was a leap fueled by a desire for holistic practice, deeply entangled with my personal evolution. This episode peels back the layers on the struggle for legitimacy in the absence of conventional credentials, the ongoing journey to self-assurance, and the courage required for unapologetic discourse on differing health ideologies. Join us as we navigate the murky waters of authenticity, emotional intelligence, and the innate knowledge of our true paths.
To cap off this episode, we wade into the complexities involved in the treatment of mental health. The narrative extends beyond the reach of medication to the very roots of self-expression and individual biochemistry. As we explore the undercurrents of copper toxicity and gut health on our psychological state, I offer a glimpse into my own medication and dietary challenges. The chapter culminates in a raw examination of self-intimate sexuality, discussing the transformational power of reconnecting with our bodies through breath and energy work. Our guest, Dr. Yacobi, and I sketch out the landscape where sexual healing paves the way to self-discovery and, ultimately, profound healing.
Start Here to Unlock Your Hormonal Balance
Connect with Me
IG: @matthewpaetz
Start Here to Find Out - What's Blocking You From Making Your First $100k?
In this episode, I'm speaking with Dr Eva Yacobi. She shares how she uses naturopathic medicine and her understanding of trauma healing in her new program, Hormonal Alchemy. We also dive into the emotional connection to food and how your dietary choices, the impact of authentic self-expression and gut health impact your mental well-being, and how sex is a gateway to healthy intimacy and connection. This conversation is for anyone who is struggling with a healthy relationship to their authentic self. What you're going to learn is how struggles and challenges can be the source of purpose and fulfillment, how your dietary choices have a direct impact on your mental health, and why men should seek knowledge about women from women themselves. This is so important because Dr Yacobi and I open the doors on topics that many find taboo and are often the root cause of our personal suffering. All right, doctor, what is going on, my friend?
Speaker 2:How in the hell are you? I'm good, I was thinking about it because the last I lost your video but, I was thinking about it because the last I lost your video, but last time we spoke I was living in Tulum and it was. It was a long time ago. It was maybe two years ago, at least a year and a half ago.
Speaker 1:Has it been that long, at least a year and a half ago. Has it been that long, at least a year?
Speaker 2:and a half probably. Yeah, because I've been in Bali just over a year now and we spoke well before I left the room.
Speaker 1:All right, so I get to hear about all the things I'm excited. So, yeah, yeah, talk me.
Speaker 2:I lost your video, by the way. Go ahead what?
Speaker 1:were you saying I don't see me, I lost your video, by the way.
Speaker 2:Go ahead. What were you saying? I don't see you.
Speaker 1:I don't see you, okay. So this is one of those moments where it's recording mine.
Speaker 2:Okay, okay, I got it. So just keep going.
Speaker 1:It's back. Yeah so this is one of those weird moments, so if this is ever happening, it's recording both of ours separately, exactly as it looks to you like in a good way.
Speaker 2:Okay, cool.
Speaker 1:So I'll just mark this Perfect. So any who so catch me up. So you're now in Bali. You've been there for a year. What I mean? I could fill in some blanks, knowing you know what I know, but talk to me about what got you to Bali. You left Tulum. You're there for a year Now.
Speaker 2:You're just sitting there cheesing because there's a story behind it and I got to know it. Yes, well, you know, my intention was to always be back in Bali. I mean, when we met, I was in Miami and that was never part of the plan. Like, my plan was always to be back in Bali and um, but because of COVID, I got stuck outside of Bali for three years. I left Bali. I was living here.
Speaker 2:I left just before COVID hit, because I had to go take my medical boards in California and then I couldn't get back, and so when we met, I was in Miami and then I left, went to Tulum, and it was just a matter of a finding Well, a, there was a little bit of courage because I wasn't sure how it was going to work with working living in Bali but working on US time zone, and I also had just built a life in Tulum and it was hard for me to kind of step out of it until I kind of burnt out in Tulum.
Speaker 2:And. I said I have to go, it's time to go back to Bali.
Speaker 1:It's time.
Speaker 2:It's time, and so I arrived. I left Tulum the end of November 2022. Went back to the States for a little bit and by December 15th I arrived back here, 22. December 15th I love it.
Speaker 1:So you just brought up something I think is very interesting, especially for anyone that may have the desire to take off and go live somewhere else for a while, and you know what that might mean for them. You know, with their work and all the schedules. That's one of those things I don't think people recognize until they do it. So I would be very curious to know. Like you said, it took a little courage to to move yourself to a completely different time zone and you already had this business Like how have you navigated that sense?
Speaker 1:How have you made that work?
Speaker 2:So I realized when I got here I kind of split my day. I've got my morning right, so it's evening east coast, like early evening on the west coast, later evening in the east coast, and then for my morning, now right, it's 8 am here, and so I'll work morning and I'll work evening, um, and then I've had some clients in europe and then that goes more at like four or five o'clock, but otherwise it's kind of 7, 8 am until like 10, 11 am, 12 am, oh, 12 pm, and then 7 pm, 8 pm, 9 pm, 10 pm, on the other, oh wow so you'll work well into the evening, if need be.
Speaker 2:If need be, yeah.
Speaker 1:Got it, but it's doable.
Speaker 2:It's doable and I know there's people here that will work all through the night and I'm like no, I won't do that, For my own health, my own sake, I'm not going to be working at 2am. Right right 2 am, but I know people do it. But that's what I was able to find for myself Work in the morning, work in the evening, and then my day is. You know, I work on my marketing, or I'll go to the gym, or I'll do other things during the day.
Speaker 1:Right, I love that. So talk to me. I read in the notes that you put that you are I'm assuming it's launched or you're getting ready to launch a brand new program.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so it's called Hormonal Alchemy and this has been interesting talking to you, because you were like kind of at the very beginning of my launching of programs and this is like what I've been wanting to do for years and finally. I am arriving at and where it's the combination of naturopathic medicine and really deep coaching. I spent the last year in a certification in sex, love and relationships, all based on Tantra and Taoism.
Speaker 1:I thought that was our 20s, isn't that when we got certified and all those things?
Speaker 2:Totally so funny and trauma-informed work and all these elements, and so what? So we? I can now get to the deeper layers with my clients, because for me I love naturopathic medicine, but what I know I've always been really after is like deep transformation.
Speaker 2:So not only are you feeling better physically, like your life is changing. Who you are in the world is something more of who you are, who you were put here to be, and so I've created this program called hormonal alchemy, which is a combination of the two, where it's a four-month program. Eight weeks of it is really naturopathic medicine. We're going through your labs, we're going through your diet, we're going through your stressors. If you're on medication, what's going on with that? What's going on with supplementation, stuff like that. But then we're doing more of the inner work, where it's like your inner child work, your shadow work, which I know you're deeply connected to, and but based on child work, your shadow work, your, which I know you're deeply connected to um and, but based on the methodologies of tantra and daoism, and really it's a desire-based coaching versus problem-based coaching, and like what is it?
Speaker 2:oh, wow yeah, what are you really desiring? And then, what is that bringing up in the body and how are we? It's very somatic in nature.
Speaker 1:Oh, I absolutely love this. So there's two, two questions I have that are kind of different, but I'm going to start with what came up first. So you made reference to the journey that you've been on to get to this point with a program that I think you said it you know fine is what you wanted to do for so long. So, in your words and I can relate to this like I'm literally in the same boat like the intersection of the work that I'm, I'm the program that I just launched, which this podcast is, uh, yeah, this podcast is an extension of this, this new thing that I'm doing, and it's, like you, it's the intersection between the deep work, and in my case it's the deep work and entrepreneurship, and but I, and it's it finally feels like the thing I've always wanted to do, and it just took, like you, years for it to click.
Speaker 1:You know, for whatever reason, you know, I don't think it took longer than it needed to. I think it, whatever was needed, has now come to pass and we can bring these things to fruition. So I would love to hear what your journey kind of has been like as you look back from, you know, the the two, three, four years ago, whatever it was, when we first met and you were really starting to step into the. I think at the time, like you were really starting to step into the. Uh, I think at the time, like you were just stepping into the idea of creating a program such as as these, and now you're you've been doing it.
Speaker 2:So what's that been from from then till now? Yeah, um well, it hasn't been easy, I'll tell you that much. It hasn't been easy, I'll tell you that.
Speaker 1:And everyone's bubble just bursted Right.
Speaker 2:It still isn't really, but um, you're like didn't we mention shadow work already?
Speaker 1:Um?
Speaker 2:but I'm just curious Can you hear the drilling in the background, cause I can close my door.
Speaker 1:I can. But it's fine, you're in Bali, just say it's like a weird animal.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it is weird because I got some noises coming out from that side. Noises coming out from that side, okay.
Speaker 1:It's just a jungle creature and, by the way, this cancels background noise, so it shouldn't be an issue on. You know, when people are, other people are listening to this okay, um.
Speaker 2:So yeah, I mean it really starts way earlier. Right when I was 25 is when I first got into personal development and coaching and in that realm is what I really wanted to do. But I didn't have the confidence and it's been a major journey right when it was. You know, personal development, strictly mental, strictly head up, nothing, nothing in the body. But it got me. It got me to leave us, it got me to travel the world, it helped me go to medical school, get through medical school, all those things. But it was not until I stepped more into the somatic pieces while I was in medical school that I didn't even realize I went to tony robbins. Right, you did upw.
Speaker 2:I Date With Destiny and all of a sudden I'm like feeling my body and I'm like freaking out and but it's this work, all this personal development work, this deeper work, that has really what supported me, getting me to where I am. The medicine is I've loved, I love medicine. I wanted to be a doctor. You know, in undergrad I my intention was to go become a doctor, go to conventional medical school, but when I was literally had interviews I then canceled them and said I'm not doing this For many reasons.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, part of it was fear, part of it is I was like the system really doesn't land with me, like I'm not gonna go. I knew I was gonna get destroyed in conventional medical school, mine being soul and I wasn't um and um. So if I fast forward, it's like finally the intersection, like you said, naturopathic medicine with now this deeper, somatic work that I've been doing, that I've been with the personal development, all the mindset work that I've done over since I was 25. It's been like 18 years I don't know if I'm doing the math right. It's a long time right.
Speaker 2:At a certain point we stopped doing the math. So it's fine. 18 years, I don't know if I'm doing the math right At a certain point we stopped doing the math, so it's fine. And so it's finally bringing the two worlds together. And it's been a long journey because of my own personal journey and then figuring out how to bring the two worlds together my own personal journey and then figuring out how to bring the two worlds together.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's, I had the same experience in pursuing psychology that you referenced. In pursuing Western medicine. Um, you know, I, I was pursuing my marriage and family therapy license and I didn't go back to school until I was late twenties, nearing 30. Um, and it was. You know, there's like two very specific reasons. Um, you know, like you, that it wasn't that the experience I was having was wrong, or I, I didn't necessarily think what they were doing was correct or appropriate, but rather it was more of this intuitive, like undeniable, like hard stop, like voice in my body saying like this isn't, it's not that it's wrong, but this isn't your path. And, um, and but with that, you know, choosing to not complete the schooling and become a licensed therapist.
Speaker 1:I, like you, and I have talked, you know, quite a bit. I struggled for years in self-doubt and who am I? Am I smart enough? Am I good enough? Will I ever be, you know, credible or worthy of respect from, from those that have, you know, the, the degrees and the licenses and all these things that, uh, you know, I was so deeply insecure about not having, and it's taken me many years, uh, in many different healing journeys, different modalities, combinations of modalities, um, and then, just quite frankly, getting my ass whooped in the streets of this thing we call life and work and relationship and family and experience and grief and all these kind of things that finally I was like it, like I know enough to be a valuable piece to this conversation, and I started, slowly but surely, like you, leaning into courage and becoming a little bit more apologetic and unapologetic, rather to just start having a conversation and being okay when someone was like I don't agree, instead of taking that like oh shit, that means I'm wrong, I'm stupid, I shouldn't be having this conversation.
Speaker 1:Instead, it becomes like interesting, you know, help me understand your perspective or, you know, talk to me about why that doesn't land with you. I'm curious, um so, uh, but with that, um, the, the other thing, you know, you saying that, um, uh, this is what you've always wanted to be doing. This is what you've always wanted to be doing Right?
Speaker 1:So talk to me a little bit about the. Always like this it sounds like there was a deeper knowing, probably long before you had the language to you know to, to explain it or articulate it. But what was this thing that you always knew, if you could put it into words that you wanted to be doing, that took you so long to, to connect the dots?
Speaker 2:I think part of it is you know you mentioned credibility Like there's been this coming from where I come from, it's like needing to be credible, feeling credible and just belief in myself. I want to close the door because now it's driving me crazy. So give me one, Do it. It got louder.
Speaker 1:You're good.
Speaker 2:Okay, okay, so part of it is you know, I come from a very, a highly academic family. I um, and it's been there was the need a for me to feel credible. That was real and I, I own it. At this point I'm like there's a reality that I needed to go, or part of the reason I chose to go to medical school is I did need to feel credible and I didn't have the confidence in myself. But what I was really also kind of obsessed with because it saves me, like I've got sick at 16. I can't say medicine really healed me, you know, and so it was these deeper pieces. Without wanting to go and becoming a psychologist or becoming a therapist or any of that, it was this coaching piece. But I never had felt like I had the tools or I had the, really the I wouldn't be taken seriously, I wouldn't. It didn't feel credible enough for me, and so in that it was like, okay, I'm going to continue to pursue medicine.
Speaker 2:Once I found naturopathic medicine, which was a 10 year gap from when I walked to a finished medical undergrad has spent 10 years found naturopathic medicine and then at 31, yeah, 31, I went to medical school.
Speaker 2:Wow, yeah. So, but it's always been this deeper work that I've been obsessed with, like I've been you know let's and this is part of what I would see with the women that I would work with. It's like we're getting them 70% better Roughly, they're feeling better physically, but I can see they're hitting a wall. They're hitting a wall, hitting a wall, and not until we go to the deeper parts are they feeling this real sense of aliveness in the world and finding their worth and that is what I'm deeply committed to, like women who, really like in their aliveness, finding their voice, and like being fully who they are beyond.
Speaker 2:just okay, now I have the energy to work out. I'm not bloated, I don't have mental fog, right, so what?
Speaker 1:what drew you to that specifically Like, why wasn't the medicine and just getting them to feel better physically enough for you? Why did you want to go deeper?
Speaker 2:I think it is because of my own journey. Like I said, I at 16, I was anorexic, 17,. I ended up in the hospital and, yes, like was I. I was there eight weeks, three weeks inpatient, five weeks outpatient. Was I fed and like re? You know, from a nutrient standpoint and a caloric standpoint, yes, was I in a much better position eight weeks later, but did it help me heal on the inner from really healed? No, like. That was a much longer journey.
Speaker 2:Journey and and because I know the work that I did within personal development, it is what changed my life. It did give me the courage, like I said, to quit corporate America and go travel, and I mean now I'm living in Asia. Right, I'm living in Bali. It is that that gave me the ability to do these things. It wasn't okay. I went to a series of doctors and now my gut works and my liver function is good and I can be productive. It's like what is the experience of life? And, um, that's, that's a big piece of it, because people have said, oh, wow, look at the life you've lived and I'm like, yeah, but it didn't just come from nothing, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1:And I asked that for a reason because, as you know, I am a firm believer that you know, not our passions, not all that. You know. Yes, those things are important, but I do not believe that's where things like purpose stem from. Personally, and, uh, you know as many people, as you know, I've been honored to, to connect with in a coaching capacity and beyond, uh, who were willing to share their story and discuss, you know, intimate parts of their life and what they wanted versus where they were, et cetera. I began to see very clearly parallels that I was also experiencing, which is, you know that it's the very thing that we believe disqualifies us right, whatever the experience, whatever the circumstance, whatever the mistake we made or, you know, whatever it may be, I find that it's the thing that we often feel disqualifies us from you know, what we feel led to or called to, like we were talking about that knowing earlier, that's actually the very thing that makes you highly qualified to do that work, so much so that I think you wouldn't be able to do that work unless you have had those experiences personally. And you know, as I was dealing with the imposter syndrome of not being licensed and all this kind of stuff. I remember a very specific moment where I was leading my first class here here in Los Angeles at the time, and it was my very first one. So there's like this combination of public speaking fear, right, and you know, the topic in which I'm, you know, supposed to be cultivating and holding space for is one that I feel deeply, you know, insecure about if I'm capable. So you combine those two things and literally on the way to the studio where I was holding the class and at the time I was working with someone we both know who was Reggie he was my, my one-on-one coach and, you know, on my drive to the, to the studio where I'm supposed to host this class, I'm dead serious when I I tell you I was deeply, deeply considering getting into a fender bender on purpose. And I say fender bender because I want to, like, really fuck up my car. But I wanted, I wanted an excuse that I could be of integrity and say, like I got in a car wreck and I can't make it, because I couldn't just say that, because I know if I just said that and went home I would probably get in a car wreck and be destroyed, cause I know, if I just said that and went home I would probably get in a car wreck and destroyed, like I believe in that shit. So I was like what if I just do it? And like that'll keep me from going. But you know, I ended up obviously going and I remember I called Reggie cause I was in a panic and I didn't think I could do it. And I to this day I'll never remember what he asked me, but I will forever remember how I responded because it was visceral, like you said, it was in the, it was somatic.
Speaker 1:This experience, and you know, what I said in response to reggie at the time was um, you may be able to outsmart me, you meaning anyone in the class that I was afraid of. I said you may be able to outsmart me, but you'll never be able to out, feel me, because I'm never going to talk about something that I haven't actually experienced. And that was a moment that started to like shift that narrative for me in the beginning. That was the seed. It took years to cultivate, but that was the seed where I was like, oh yeah, you might be, you might know the terminology you might I might mispronounce something.
Speaker 1:I might, you know say something that's really surface level and try to make it sound like it's super deep.
Speaker 1:I don't know, in the eyes of someone that that you know is an expert on that stuff. But what I know for a fact is, if you challenge me on the, the lesson that I'm attempting to convey, I may figure out how to like say it differently so maybe it resonates a little better with someone. But if you're trying to challenge me on the root of the lesson, I will stand there strong because I'm speaking about something I've experienced, right and. But yeah, that's it's so funny and I find that a lot, cause, you know, I work with coaches specifically, and mission driven entrepreneurs. Most of the time it's a coach, a consultant, a service provider of some sort, a healer, and without fail in the very beginning, you know they're phenomenal, they have the knowledge, they have the skill, they have this experience, but they, you know, they're wrapped up in this belief that, because they're not insert whatever their thing is, know they're not blank enough of something that that disqualifies them. Just like I felt, just like I know you described, you felt when in fact, that's the secret sauce.
Speaker 2:It is totally the secret sauce yeah. Yeah. Yeah, and it's cultivating the confidence.
Speaker 1:Oh I love that cultivatingating yeah you just don't wake up confident huh you just don't manifest confidence. Is that not the thing? You got to actually cultivate it. You gotta work. Okay, damn it instagram.
Speaker 2:You have to believe in something else totally totally, totally, and I think we all come at it at different levels. But, like, for me, it's this, it's this constant journey, it's this constant cultivation, and I know the days that I don't sit with it and I don't create it in my physical being. I'm not, I'm not operating or vibrating at the same level by any means, and so, yeah, that's why I say it's a cultivation. I love this, yeah.
Speaker 1:So I got a question and I'm really curious about your thoughts on this.
Speaker 1:And you know, because you're you obviously have this deep understanding of medicine, you know holistic practices and you know a much deeper understanding of Western practices than the mass majority of all of us, maybe even some that hold a license, I don't know, but but I'd be very curious about this idea that I that I have around you know the difference to do, because it absolutely blows my mind, by the way that so many in one position or the other like just completely poo-poos the other as if they're completely wrong and shouldn't exist, like it baffles my mind.
Speaker 1:But the question I have is I see a lot of the Western practices, the typical medical solutions, the pills, the surgeries, the you know, those kind of drastic approaches as being very necessary in an acute situation, right, almost like an intervention of sorts, like they're very, very effective in like an intervention style or type of circumstance, whereas the more eastern, you know, holistic, uh approaches are far more and I mean, in my opinion, far more uh superior to, you know, a living, a well rounded, healthier, sustainable life, in alignment with how this thing pointing at our bodies right connects to and aligns with these things, and what I'm talking about outside is nature, like the real shit, right, the stuff that's been here long before we, we were, and long after us, I'm certain, um, you know.
Speaker 1:So I'd love to know your thoughts on that, given your, your depth of understanding of both. Like, how do you see it when someone says that one's wrong or this one's wrong and and they, for whatever reason, they're saying no to one or the other and in some sort of like absolute, yeah, well, you know I'll never forget it, but one of the other and some sort of like absolute.
Speaker 2:Yeah Well, you know I'll never forget it. One of the things that always stood out for me for medical school is there's never an always, it's not always one way, ever Right, and so it's not 100 percent this way or 100 percent that way, and you know it is my belief. And there is always a place, like um for medication, or there is all. There is a place for. You know, like you said, in acute state, in acute situations, we absolutely need western medicine, like for me, like you'll never see me in an emergency, in an emergency situation, or like we need that, like hands down, like there is no replacement for for that yeah there just isn't I'm so I I'm sitting there like, oh yeah, because when I have a migraine, like, fuck your lemon water I need.
Speaker 1:You better give me that shit.
Speaker 2:You better give me the real stuff now I mean if I was, because I remember writing in like the form like nothing's, nothing's off limits, and I, I really want to lean into that myself because part of it is I still know I, I hold back and I don't want to hold back as much as I do and like when I was in medical school and I have was going to major anxiety and I don't want to hold back as much as I do.
Speaker 2:And, like, when I was in medical school and I was going through major anxiety and panic, I did go to a doctor and they did give me Xanax. Now I was exceptionally afraid of it. I went to two MDs in the same day. One gave me Xanax, one gave me homeopathy. I took them both, but I was very afraid of the Xanax. I didn't want to touch it, to be honest.
Speaker 2:But I was in such a bad state and I had to take exams and like, what do I do? And I'm like, like not functioning like a human person. I'm grateful and always passed my test, I got through school, but, like there is always a time and a place, now you're talking about ongoing anxiety, ongoing chronic illness, ongoing, like you've been through every channel. Nothing's working right, like there's something bigger at play. Another medication added to your list of 10 medications is not going to do it. It's just not going to do it. It's just not going to do it. And you know I've had a number of clients over the last year that landed on my doorstep right with major chronic illness, complex disease, and they were on the list of meds and the problem is is that some of them were okay, helping them get by, but some of them were also making things worse, making it harder for them to heal. And then it's like how do you pull all of that apart once it's been years? Right?
Speaker 2:It's really challenging, it's really challenging.
Speaker 1:Well, this is one of the issues that I had as I was beginning to develop relationships inside of the kind of the psychology communities. And you know, I would often hear psychologists you know obviously a very different approach with their study and area of expertise being, you know, medications and whatnot. But I would hear many of them that I was in conversation with make reference to how they were trained to prescribe, not heal. And to me, again, there's always a need, right, like it's very necessary for for people in moments and in seasons where you know they just need that life vest you know they're drowning otherwise and I've been there, you know, as a man who's nearly committed suicide I get it Right and you know. But even in sharing that little tidbit there, like the, what I found was often the issue, like the thing that we saw.
Speaker 1:There are symptom, right, it's not, it's not the source.
Speaker 1:So just trying to come at the symptom and ease the symptom might be necessary to get you through the day or through that season.
Speaker 1:But if you believe, or you you've bought into this idea, that the deeper work is some sort of woo, woo, some sort of like voodoo thing, that's not appropriate or whatever you know some people can say about this stuff. It baffles me because it makes like it stems from something so much deeper. Right, like I heard one of the best definitions I've ever heard of on, uh, around the idea of depression. When I say idea, I don't mean to to to minimize it, but you know, around depression and this is with respect to those that you know do have a, you know, a legit diagnosis of severe depression right, they do exist, but I think it's far and few between, based on how often you know this is discussed and and you know people prescribe antidepressants and this kind of stuff. But what the best definition I ever heard was, uh, depression is nothing more than denied expression, and with that I would love to given your expertise on understanding both. Right.
Speaker 2:Just like a wave through me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, right, so how would you like, in your line of work, both in your personal life as well as you supporting others, like, how often do you find that you know the medical, the physical approach is very necessary, because I think that's also what the world of psychology gets wrong. Right Is, they don't include or they don't have a counterpart that understands you know the hormones and the nutrition and how that affects someone's mental wellbeing. Instead, they're just saying like, by the way, this is the most funny thing about psychologists. Like you walk into a psychologist's office and essentially it's no different than taking your car to a mechanic and saying like, uh, I, I have a noise coming from the front of the car. And the mechanics like I know what that is, because in a psychology's office you're literally leaning on the patient themselves to articulate whatever it is they're experiencing, based on their, the words and the ways in which they describe their circumstance. You're sitting there just being like oh, I know what that is how.
Speaker 1:There's no scan of the brain, there's no understanding of the nervous system, there's no you know deep dive into you, know the root cause, you know traumas that could have been childhood related, like all these kinds of things like to assume that you know a four minute conversation, a 40 minute conversation. Somebody would be like I know what's going on there. Like what? Are you a coach who has been struggling to do everything yourself? I mean all of the content, the emails, the marketing, not to mention, every time you open your phone, there's a new social media strategy that someone is pitching. That just makes you feel like you'll never be able to keep up, when all you really care about is helping people in a meaningful way while building the kind of coaching business your family can depend on.
Speaker 2:I'm Matthew.
Speaker 1:Pates, the founder of Momentum, a growth agency that specializes in helping coaches, just like you, break through your first 100K If you're a coach who is tired of trying to figure it all out themselves and you just want to build a business that works then I'm going to encourage you to click the link in our show notes to take your 100K coaching assessment to find out if you're ready to unlock your six-figure potential today. No, you don't.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:It is so complex because there is the biochemistry of it all. Right.
Speaker 2:And there are. There are tests to do to look at are you able what's called to methylate? And if you're not able to methylate, you're going to have and you're put on a medication that then drives the processes, like that's why some people are put on SSRIs and they're made worse. It's because biochemically they're they're not processing to be keep it really simple they're not processing the medication in a way that's actually beneficial. It's actually harming them, right. So there's labs, there's, there are ways of looking, and they're not looked at. So then there is the biochemical piece. Yeah, then maybe there's copper toxicity right, which is going to drive metal illness. Right, it's a metal and it's like you have high levels of metals. You're going to be like, right, if you think of metal pipes, like in electricity right, like there, you're going to be operating at a height and left right on a very basic level I never.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's never been. That analogy's never been made. That's amazing yeah, um.
Speaker 2:so there is the biochemical piece, but then there is the what's really a what led you there and what is underneath it. Like for me, again, from a personal level, I was put on medication at 16, 42. I have not been able to successfully get off the medication and it is a thing that drives me bonkers, and I have some people that say, well, if you are good on it, then why do you even care? Just keep taking it Because, like you said, it's like the lack of expression, it wasn't coming. Do I think? Maybe something biochemically?
Speaker 2:Yeah, my gut was always off as a child. But why was my gut always off? Because I couldn't express myself Like right. Like if I was in a dynamic where it was, I felt safe to express myself, would my gut been so such a mess that would have maybe not have impacted me or mentally, emotionally or the whole dynamic, right, right. So, like you said, to go through, someone sits down for 40 minutes, you don't look at blood work, you don't know what's going on on the level of your minerals, your, your, your nutrients, your hormones, your basic chemistry, blood chemistry, and to say, okay, I'm going to pick this one. It's very surface level, and then you don't know how that medication is going to impact the person, right it's?
Speaker 1:so funny how we'll we, you know, disregard the importance of nutrition when it comes to how our body functions. Right, and in many conversations, in many circles. But yet it's very obvious to us that if we put shitty gas in our cars for a long time, it's just going to ruin the motor. It's like, okay, hold on Right.
Speaker 2:Let me make this make sense. You don't put what is it? I don't. I don't even know the type of gasoline anymore Regular and a Ferrari, right?
Speaker 1:Like regular, I love that regular. And Ferrari, I'm with it. Yeah, right, and, by the way, if anyone that understands a Ferrari or has ever driven one or owns one, they know you would not put, they would freak the fuck out if you put regular gas in that car. Right, so putting you know regular gas inside of this Ferrari, you know this body is, you know that, could you know that is designed to perform at a very high level. Uh, is the same thing.
Speaker 1:And, by the way, this is coming from a guy that still has a diet like a 12 year old. That's where I'll talk daddy issues all day long. I'll I'll fire, I'll give you my deepest and darkest secrets and I don't give a shit where we are. But if you had like, my challenge has been I've gotten much better. But my challenge is diet Like I very salty stuff I'm drawn to. I'm not really. I've never really been interested in sugars, it's not been my vice, but salt definitely is. And then, but looking back, I also recognize that so much of my dietary choices are they stem from childhood, right, but, the connection to that is that's home, right?
Speaker 1:So when I'm, when I'm sitting down and I'm crushing pizza and everyone's making fun of me about it, to me I'm like, yeah, I get it. But like underneath, subconsciously and it's took me a long time to connect these dots I'm like, oh, every time I eat these types of foods I'm getting a sense of comfort, I'm getting a sense of home, because this is what I used to eat growing up, right? So eating a salad although I feel fucking better, I feel it's like I feel lonely, right. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Versus this pizza. Feels like I'm getting a hug from a familiar friend Right, mostly because I can't move after.
Speaker 2:I'm just going to stay on the couch.
Speaker 1:Right, I'm being cuddled real tight by this, but yeah, I think it's. You know it's so important to understand, like, what are the emotional connections that we have to to these things? And until we do, I mean, call it impossible to, to, to change, you know? You know this being the beginning of the year for many, you know there's a lot of conversations around resolutions. And why do people either a not reach their goals Because that's what a resolution is right, it's just a goal. They either don't reach it or they do, and then they quickly fall off. It's unsustainable for them, has nothing to do with the willpower or the want or anything. In my opinion, I believe, has everything to do with the willpower or the want or anything. In my opinion, I believe, has everything to do with the identity. Yeah, right, who do they believe themselves to be? And until you understand that most of our goals that we have in life, they live they live outside of our current identities, right, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:And they live in our nervous system, right. And that's partly why I've done like, why I segued into the direction that I've gone in the realm of the somatics and the Tantra and the Taoist Taoism methodologies. I mean there's like somatic experiencing. And then I also went. I wasn't going to go to school for another three years. I was just like not about that, not doing it.
Speaker 1:I've hit my quota.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I just can't. But I found this other path and because it's in the nervous system, like there's the identity outside, but it's also, why is that identity so far away from me, like I can't even feel it or connect to it, other than connecting to fear, and like one of the interesting things I got from my teacher is like there's always like the spiritual, like go up and out. You want to go up and out, but it's like keep knowing is from down, going down and in. It's not going up and out, right, it's going down and in. It's not going up and out, right, it's like down and in and anchor and finding the anchor within yourself.
Speaker 1:Yep, I like to look. I use the metaphor of a tree often around this conversation because, you know, in our society today, everything is on such display, right? You know, in our society today, everything is on such display, right? So so much of our efforts are intentional, otherwise are committed to the appearances of things, right? So, using the metaphor of a tree, it's like we're spending so much of our time focused on how big our branches are, how big our leaves are getting in the world, right, and very little, if any time, focused on the depth and the strength of the roots beneath the ground. Yeah, right, but again, I think we are parallel to nature because we are nature. So using a tree, I think, is a is, it works. It's a perfect example because, just like in life, when something you know, a tragedy hits or, um, you know, a business goes under, or relationship ends, or one of these big, really significant changes, I don't care how, you know, aligned and attuned, one is. These experiences are going to be traumatic, right, but the difference is is how one can respond, how one withstands those experiences and the ability to not make it worse.
Speaker 1:I used to make shit worse all the time, right, and I could justify it. Right, I justified all the drug use, I justified the promiscuous behavior, I justified, you know, the alcohol and the anger and all those things Like I'd be like. Of course I'm this way. Look at what you know, look at all that I've experienced and the things that it's justifiable, cool, not okay, right, still not cute. So, um, but that idea of like, you know, when the wind blows, a tree that has big leaves, big branches and little roots, it's going to blow over. Yeah, right, versus, how important would it be to, like you say, go in and I know some people might struggle with understanding what we mean, other people know exactly what we're talking about Right, but to go in and identify, like, okay, I'm going to commit to the identity of creating strong roots, becoming someone who insert whatever it is versus. I must achieve that so that I can be that Right.
Speaker 2:Right Right, be that Right Right, right, right, right, right, right, right, right Right.
Speaker 1:Right Very different, not sustainable.
Speaker 2:No, not sustainable at all. At all yeah.
Speaker 1:I love it, I love it so.
Speaker 1:No, I was going to ask because one thing that I find, um, uh, cause you know there's a lot. We all find different teachers, different. You know modalities that really speak to us and you know you, you mentioned the nervous system several times and it's something that you know I too. When I found, you know, the edge of the, the, the line of training that I discovered that really worked for me, um, it opened up so many doors, right, there was no turning back at that point. But I would, instead of just like introducing mine right off the bat, I would love to know, like you know what, what was the line of work or whose work have you found that you really resonated with that? Maybe someone that doesn't have? You know the, the training or the understanding of medical and all that kind of big. You know the, the training or the understanding of medical and all that kind of big. You know the big words kind of stuff. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Whose work have you found to that helps you better understand how to apply that knowledge to your actual life?
Speaker 2:Yes, so, um, the the. So this past year, it's really a year and a half, I was in um studying with Layla Martin and her program. I don't know if you know who Layla Martin is, it's called Vita Coaching and she's in. She's incredible Um. She actually lived for eight in Asia, for 10 years, studying Tantra and all of this and um and and Taoist philosophies, um and and Dow's philosophies, and that's where, um, you know, she really gained and learned her mastery Right. And for me, what drew me there is I've been on this medication for many, many years Now. The world and the people that I circulate in are people that are on medicine journeys all the time Ayahuascadma, ketamine, whatever, right on.
Speaker 2:but I'm talking, I'm not talking party, I'm talking like ceremonial, like therapeutic right, you know my last conversation was with a psychedelic facilitator right so so I'm gonna sit here cheesing right now because I'm like let's go and so I said I can't use those tools, at least right now, currently, because I'm on this medication. I have had a horrendous time. I've had a horrendous like you were there by my side in Miami when I was dealing with the fallout six months later of coming off the medication and what that looked like.
Speaker 2:That was a time of okay, get back on the medication so I can like put myself back together, because I was a giant disaster and thank you, thank you, thank you for being there, because that was, that was rough, but thank you for the trust yeah, but I said I can't go and do these plant medicine journeys and like you guys, I lived in california, in arizona, in tulum, I'm in bali, like the world I live in, are so complicated by plant medicine right in one one way, and I, well, I've got to be able to get there another way, and so that's where the whole Tantra sex get to sex.
Speaker 2:Use that as a gateway to higher and on that?
Speaker 1:yeah, on that, because you know you bring up sex, which obviously is. It can be a taboo, uncomfortable conversation for many, but I'm very curious Cause again. I mean you know some of my story, you know my, my story stems from sexual abuse as a child, from a male more specifically. So I battled a lot of fears and struggles with sexuality as an adult, you know, made many decisions that in the moment didn't feel aligned and it left me battling a lot of shame and and and struggle and and you know, then found cocaine and I was a prostitute for a while, like all the I mean, my resume is shining right.
Speaker 1:So that's when people are like, why do you like what makes you qualified to do, to do the work you do? I'm like, oh, let me show you. You see all these, you see all these bridges that have been burned, right? You see all these bridges that have been burned? Yeah, that's what makes me qualified. But I specifically am very interested in your thoughts on the sexuality piece, or not just sexuality, but the actual finding sex as a how do I want to put this? Like, not necessarily as a tool, because I don't want to make it sound like, you know, just going out and sleeping around is the thing, because, by the way, I've done it and that didn't feel like healing. So when you talk about sex in that way, especially as a woman, like how would you describe what you mean by that for someone that is like wait what?
Speaker 2:would you describe what you mean by that for someone that is like wait what?
Speaker 2:yeah, and that's a great question because for me and I know especially tantra has this whole like taboo right and I'm not talking about temple nights, which is, you know you, basically you're going and you're having I don't want to call it. Well, there's elements that could look like an orgy. It could look like I'm not even talking about. That I'm talking about is actually self-intimacy and using your own sexual self-intimacy, as in its breath work and its meditation and its energy work.
Speaker 2:And it's using these tools to then release. Well, release shame is one, but it's getting into the nervous system, it's rewiring the nervous system, it's rewiring the neural pathways in your brain and it's allowing your body to finally like express what hasn't been expressed. So it's using sex as a first personal, intimate self-pleasure, as a portal, and then you know if it's like can be expanded into a partnership or whatnot. Now if, if your jam is, you know, polyamory or any of that stuff, go for it, that's. But it's using sex very intentionally and starting with self. Well, please continue.
Speaker 2:I recently shared like a reel on Instagram about a client who I I one time suggested that she does breast massage, right, and she like was like no Right, and she's a mother of two, and just the idea of touching herself and then she, in connecting like on a very basic level, I'm not saying doing anything crazy, at least in my mind um and then she comes back of saying I had my mammo, I had my, my yearly, and now I have, you know, benign system my in my breasts and I'm have, you know, benign system in my breasts and I'm like, well, you think about there's so much disconnection, there's so much she was like repelling her own body and right Something comes up on a physical, from a physical point, like of course they're connected.
Speaker 1:Of course they're connected. Yeah, I couldn't agree more. And so I'm curious, you know how would? How would you say one could experience sex? Because I think sex is one of the areas in most of our lives where we carry a lot of wounds, right, whether someone was abused as a child, whether someone was taken advantage of, whether someone feels that that's their only worth is if they, you know, give themselves over to, to others. I mean, for fuck's sake, I literally have tattooed on my chest lust or love, right, quite literally like cross the chest Right.
Speaker 1:And at the time I, at the time that I got it, the, the conversation in my mind was that, um, and I still believe this that, uh, neither lust or love could survive by it's on its own Right. And I, in relation to being in partnership with someone, right, and but if they were together, right, if those two things coexisted in the relationship, you know, it could survive for eternity. Right, that was my philosophy behind it. But later, in plant medicine journeys, what I came to also learn was that it was a subconscious. Fuck you to those who I was sleeping with, because, again, my relationship to sex was this was the only I believed at a very young age that physical experiences were.
Speaker 1:My purpose on this planet was to be a physical experience for others, right, because, again, my sexual be started at five. So this is what I'm learning experience for others, right, because, again, my sexual abuse started at five, right, so this is what I'm learning. And so this being tattooed on my chest was subconsciously a very candid question for anyone who I was in a physical, you know, experience with to ask themselves what was I to them, am I just love or am I just lust, or do you actually love me? Right, and you know. So all of this to to ask, like you know, how could one who hasn't done a lot of the self-discovery, who hasn't maybe like the client you're kind of describing, where there's still so much shame around their own body, not even what they experiencing with someone you know present, but like in their own time and like how would you say one can begin to shift, to better understand what you're referring to and being able to use their sexual energy, their sexual essence, not just go sleep around with a bunch of people.
Speaker 2:Yeah, um, I think first it's even noticing, because noticing the energy in your body, right, like there is, or just noticing your body, it's so, it's so, it can be so subtle because, yes, um, some people are super connected energetically right, others are not. And it's if you're not, then even feeling slight sensation, like maybe you are, you do know the sensation of orgasm, but maybe you don't. Maybe how many women have never even experienced an orgasm?
Speaker 1:in reality, many, many and, by the way, for every man listening, a lot of them.
Speaker 2:So put your ego down like, yeah, women can fake orgasms, like it's a real. It's real, it's true. And many women don't experience it.
Speaker 1:And because there's not a safety or many women don't experience it and because there's not a safety, or yes, can I, can I pause on this for a second Cause? Something just came to me. I think is would be very important, I think, specifically for men to hear yeah, right. And so the idea of faking an orgasm is often a joke, made to be a joke, this thing, whatever right it's, it's the minima. But let me ask you, as a woman, what is the reason a woman might fake an orgasm when she's with a partner? If you're being, if you're being candid, whatever that means, because obviously I don't know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean it could be a few different things. You could not be enjoying it and you want to just end the experience Like yeah, I mean, it could be a few different things, you could not be enjoying it and you want to just end the experience Like okay, I'm good. I'm good, we can stop now. Right, yeah. Or it could be you want to make or have the man feel like, okay, they've done, they've accomplished their goal, right.
Speaker 1:So it's their goal.
Speaker 2:Their goal, right right. So it could be for the man, or it could. It could be for or it could be. I don't even know how. I've never had it. Like I said, never had an orgasm in my life. So I've got to just kind of act as if and complete the experience because that's what we're supposed to do right Right.
Speaker 1:So, with that being said, and that's exactly why I was asking for and I'm not asking for your personal experiences, but more so of your understanding, understanding how trauma works in the nervous system and somatic experiences, etc.
Speaker 1:Like a lot of people have an idea that trauma means, in using a sexual reference, like they must've been raped or abused or something to that extreme. Obviously very traumatic, right, but how traumatic is it for women to be in such an intimate situation with someone, with a man, and feel as if they have to fake this moment either so they can make it stop because they're not enjoying it, which, when it's that intimate and you're not enjoying it, by the way, it probably feels a lot like rape, even if it was consensual to the bot, and I'm talking about to the body, right, and I know that's a very big claim, right, that sentence in and of itself, it can be it's not all the time but can, yeah, or that they're doing it to perform. Because if they don't, if the guy doesn't reach his goal, then what does that mean about her? What will she have to endure in his response, right, in his shame and his embarrassment and his whatever he may feel, because yeah.
Speaker 1:A man has never been with a woman who's never orgasmed.
Speaker 2:Right, right right.
Speaker 1:Says every guy that's been with women who couldn't orgasm, chasmed, right, right, right. So every guy that's been with women who couldn't work, so.
Speaker 2:But I could keep going with this, but as a woman, how much of what I'm saying is even remotely close. Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of shame that a woman can feel because it is typically very performative. The whole experience is very performative. It's about getting to that place, it's about getting to the orgasm, it's about right and and if a woman doesn't show up in that there there is a letdown or there can feel like shame and again you don't know how the man is going to respond until you get to know them.
Speaker 2:If you, if you even have the chance to right, if it's not, whatever, I just we're having a good time Right but if there isn't even the opportunity, and so it can carry a lot of shame, and it can be, then shame for I've never had an orgasm. I don't even know what it feels like, I don't even know what to do, and then, on top of it, what's going to come back? Come back at me. So, instead of this being like an experience of pleasure and building in connection and energy, and and it becomes this whole dance of playing off each other's shame, potentially yeah, a hundred percent.
Speaker 1:Right, I said it. When Allison and I first started dating, I, the, the people fell in love, the souls fell in love, and then the patterns began to date. The souls fell in love, and then the patterns began to date, the patterns of shame and protection and doubt and fear and all these kinds of things, and naturally they don't play well together, right? So you know, we, I experienced a lot of that and I just think it's so important to that men start to drop their ego in this conversation because and it's not about just having, you know, a healthy sex life which, by the way, biologically speaking, the, the importance of that for your health, is paramount, right, in many ways, um, but I think to to begin removing some of the mystery around this right and a lot of the, the performance equaling masculinity and by performance, and you know how big and strong and long they last, and you know the shit that I've heard before. It's, it's wild.
Speaker 1:And, by the way, men, straight up, don't fucking take your advice from men in the locker room. What are you doing? And by the locker room, I mean that literally and metaphorically, like you're going to go to another man to talk about how to please a woman. Like no, no, no, no, no. Why don't we go to the source and drop our guard and drop our ego and become curious and genuinely just listen to what may or may not be appropriate for each individual? Right like yeah, yeah, yeah, because each person might need or feel safe or drawn to something very different. Right, and that's okay. Matter of fact, that's how this shit works. So, better than it's okay, start being okay with it. For sure.
Speaker 1:You know, and I, and, and again, this is just. It goes back to the idea of the shame on both parts, right, the woman, in this case, as we've described and you know, feeling as if she must perform in a certain way or else you know the I mean the sentence you use so the man can feel like he reached his goal, whoa, and it's not to say his goal isn't important, but if that's why we are both there for his goal, that that might not be a healthy experience, whether one is aware or not, you know, for both parties, not just the woman, but for both parties.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and the trickle-down effect is real, and I say that in the sense of the health piece of it, right, whether it's the health, how vital a man is, how vital a woman is, right, right after these types of experiences. And, um, if I was to go back to like the self, why is it so important in self, like to use this sexually, if you want to say sexual methodologies or these tantric methodologies, it's because finding safety within yourself is so important and it's just so important. Yeah, and when somebody can feel safe sexually within themselves, then it changes how you connect with somebody. How do you connect with a man? How do you connect with a woman? How do you connect with a partner?
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think it's so important. I find this, you know, in life in general, right, we're hardwired to perform for our needs as children. Right, because we're completely dependent creatures, so we must learn how to. We must observe and understand what is expected of us to be accepted or approved of by our tribes, so that our tribe will protect us and feed us and care for us. Right, because if we don't do what's approved, the chances of rejection are much higher and if we're rejected in the wild we die alone. Yada, yada, right, so we are all hardwired to in the very early stages, which happen to be the stages where we're most susceptible, and we're learning patterns of survival and things that become our identity in the future, you know, et cetera. Um, but we all are learning how to perform so that others will accept and approve of us.
Speaker 1:And when people you know, as I'm listening to you describe, you know the sexual experiences that many women have and I'm sure men as well, but many women have for sure of the performance, right, like we were talking about the man making sure the man feels like he reaches his goal, or you know, this is what you think you're supposed to do.
Speaker 1:Uh, in these experiences with men.
Speaker 1:You're supposed to make these sounds, you're supposed to make these reactions or whatever it looks like, right? But again, what I hear is is really heartbreaking because heartbreaking because it it sounds like there's a lot of not performing just for the man, but also, maybe especially cause you're talking about shame when they're by themselves, right, that there's, there's such a lack of understanding of who they are, their desires, what makes them feel good, what makes them feel comfortable and safe, because the strategies have been for so long programmed that you are supposed to perform in order to receive this love, this connection, this loyalty, by the way, is another thing that we could go into. If your relationship is dependent on sex, you're not in a relationship, you're in a transaction, right, so let's be very clear about that. But it takes a lot of courage and a lot of uh on both parts to say, like you know what, maybe we're not on the same page in that, that area right now, but you're my person, right, right, and that matters. It's the it going back, it's the roots, not the leaves.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, 100%, 100%, yeah, yeah, 100% 100%.
Speaker 1:Yeah, first off, I did not know we were going there with this conversation today, so you said nothing off limits in the notes.
Speaker 2:So I said okay.
Speaker 1:This is a second in two years. Yeah, exactly, welcome to us just catching up you guys. Thank you for listening. No, I just, I really really appreciate it and I would love to continue this conversation because I think, you know, given the work that I've done, and especially because of my experience around sex and sexuality and my level of comfort that I've come to earn, quite frankly, you know, but being a man, being a man that identifies as, as a heterosexual man, you know, but has lived a very bisexual, you know life for a few years and the shame I mean me being able to say that right now.
Speaker 1:Right, and we're like, oh my God, who's going to hear my cousins, my friend's going to give a fuck anymore? Right, because it's the truth. So you know, but the truth is, I believe, more conversations like this, no matter how messy, no matter how many things I may have said or you may have said, that, looking back, we'd be like, fuck, I wish I'd have said that differently. Right, you're like that's not what I meant. They're going to judge that. True, they might, and maybe they should judge some of the things that I said, or maybe some of the things that were said here, but it's it's too important to not have these conversations, even if they're going to be messy, because they need to be had.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, a hundred percent. And and it's funny cause I find myself with trying to explain what I'm doing now it's like I still don't know how to express it, but in a conversation like this it's like all right, let's talk, I got it.
Speaker 1:Try to explain this at Christmas dinner and grandma's just going to be like so you're just fucking everybody. Is that what you're doing? You're like no, I not without consent, grandma. Yeah, grandma, you got 13 children. Maybe you should, right, let's have a conversation about that.
Speaker 2:But, yeah, in the world or online on Instagram or website. I'm like, how do? I even encompass this Because it's a lot, but it's this it's so important. It's that like self intimacy, ultimately self intimacy, self love, and and then I feel like that's the root of health, of true health, true connection, attunement, all of those things and this is why I call this more than a business.
Speaker 1:Yeah, right, because this is just what you happen to do for a living, for for hundreds and thousands of women all over the world. But this conversation is what you're really doing, right for any and all whoever you know are fortunate enough to come in contact with, with you and your work and what you're doing in the world. Um, you know I'm so grateful and you know, on that note, I want to be mindful of our time today, um, but on that note, I would love to, to hear, know, um, your words, your, your world, like, what is it that you're doing? Who is it that you would like to to to send the back signal to? If they're looking for someone like you, what is it that you do? Who do you support and where the hell can they find it so that we can put a link to it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so yeah, I'm working basically with women in this realm, with combining the hormonal, the it's really women's health with this deeper work of like self intimacy, self love, finding your aliveness For the women. You've worked really hard and you continue to work really hard and you've done amazing things in the world, but you know there's a disconnect. You know you don't feel well, whether it's physically you don't feel well, or emotionally, spiritually, sexually, you don't feel well and it's like something's got to give it.
Speaker 2:So you know what I've come to say is you know that women can reclaim their health, radiant self-love and deep aliveness, and that's really, in a nutshell, what it is the good stuff yeah, the good stuff and where the real stuff yeah, the real stuff. And where can you find me? Yes, I live in bali, but you can find me on Instagram. I am, or I have actually just put together a new website and um drevacom, and I love it.
Speaker 1:Well, we'll obviously link this um share it with the world. I can't wait to hear everyone who hears it.
Speaker 2:Give me shit, um, but good I can't say when I started medical school, even when I finished, that I'd be talking about sex and sexuality and all this stuff.
Speaker 1:But here we go, let's go, but that's why so many more need to do it right, because I think it's the avoidance of something so foundational, so so fundamental that has, you know, slowly spiraled out of control and now so many. It's not that it's the one thing, that's the reason for all things, but it is certainly a big, big, big issue in so many people's lives, um, and, you know, not feeling like it's okay to talk about, or, you know, feel that you get it.
Speaker 2:I mean it's yeah, having a safe space, no more yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Absolutely, and that's what I know for a fact. You provide for both women and men, but especially for women. So thank you Seriously, thank you for the work that you do, right? So, and I'm sorry for all the male egos that got offended. Actually, I'm not, I'm not sorry about that at all, actually.
Speaker 2:I have had women come to me and be like can you teach our husbands please? And I'm like well, but they should.
Speaker 1:Again, men should go to women to learn about this shit. Stop going to your best friend, who actually doesn't fucking know. I don't care how much Pornhub you've watched, you don't get it. That's a whole other topic. Anyway, I appreciate you. Thank you. Well, I appreciate you, thank you, thank you, thank you Likewise. Uh, and I'm finding this, this sundown glow, to be quite dramatic at the moment.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it just got dark.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we're on the other side of the world. So well, until next time and I hope that comes much, much sooner than this one did compared to our last conversation but until next time. I hope you're doing very, very, very well. You're clearly doing what you're meant to do and I couldn't be happier for you. You.