Mindful Onboarding for Small Businesses

In this one, I'm delighted to be joined by @Wenceslyne Ong, the Founder of @Elite LVL, a business operations consulting firm with a world-class customer onboarding and continuous improvement framework, helping cost conscious businesses scale. 

In this broad ranging conversation, Wenceslyne and I cover all that you need to know about having a strategic and mindful approach to staff onboarding in small and growing businesses.

🌟 Some of my favourite parts were:

✅ How the experience at companies such as Google and Fed Ex inspired Elite’s onboarding mindset;

✅ Why small companies should focus on experience to compete with the larger multinationals;

✅ How onboarding is part of an holistic approach to treating employees in the right way;

✅ How the employee’s individual culture should be considered when onboarding;

✅ Why having a great onboarding program increases staff retention by 82%.

Transcript

Adam (00:01.747)

Okay, so today I'm here with Wenceslyne Ong, who's the founder of Elite, a business operations consulting firm with a world -class customer onboarding and continuous improvement framework, helping cost -conscious businesses scale. Wenceslyne, welcome to the Fractional CFO Show, how are you?

Wenceslyne (00:21.23)

Hi, Adam. Good afternoon. Yeah, I'm doing absolutely fantastic. I'm really excited to be here at your podcast.

Adam (00:28.147)

Great, well great to have you, great to have you. And so today we're gonna dive into some of the benefits of a strategic and mindful approach to onboarding staff and onboarding systems and software as well. And so to start with, would you mind giving us a bit of an overview of your career so far? How did you end up going from, I think I saw you worked in FedEx in Canada and then across to Goot.

Wenceslyne (00:53.613)

Hehehehe

Adam (00:54.963)

Google, you were the product lead for Google in the Europe, in EMEA, and subsequently starting your business. So it'd be great to hear a little bit about that.

Wenceslyne (01:04.205)

Yeah, sure. So, you know, like I, as you can probably tell, I've had a varied career. I'm from the Philippines originally. And I think, you know, from that culture, I would say that I was born to be in customer service. So that's kind of like the first track or the first phase of my career really in customer service with FedEx, the logistics firm. Of course, I've had a couple of other.

jobs in high school, but that was more like my serious job. So the first one being at FedEx, I was there for quite a while, really focused on customer service. I worked at a contact center and I was minding over 300 people there. So that was quite an experience for a young lady, I would say. But from there, so that was in Canada.

And from that experience, somehow I managed to make a jump into the tech sector. So that started in Vancouver as well. And I was invited to actually be part of a startup in the UK, which then brought me over. That was now about 15 years ago, I would say. So yes, I've lived quite in three different continents in those varied careers as well with different roles.

but yes, mostly in a customer facing role.

Adam (02:29.075)

Okay, perfect, perfect. That's a very varied background, as you say, and I guess, you know, we're talking here about onboarding team members predominantly, and I guess having lived in three different continents, has that helped you, would you say, in terms of that approach to how you onboard people from different cultures?

Wenceslyne (02:50.156)

That is a really good question. When I do reflect on it, yes, absolutely. Because I feel that, you know, I've had the opportunity to be, you know, a little bit more relatable to different cultures and being open to all of that as well. And, you know, it gave me the opportunity to sort of have like an experience with

different ways of going about things. So culturally, things are very different the way that we do things in the Philippines, for example, in terms of, you know, like management style and leadership style. It's usually, almost usually like, you know, a top down type of style. And then of course we get into the, you know, being in Canada, as well as in the UK, whereby the way that management styles and, you know, leadership style work is, you know,

that it allows you to be a little bit, to have a little bit more freedom in terms of being creative in solutions, having been able to have an open dialogue with management and things like that. So yes, I think it did help quite a bit and it made me a lot more empathetic as well with the different, you know, with the way that people work differently.

Adam (04:14.995)

Okay, perfect. And I guess to start with, when we're talking about onboarding, it would be great to sort of define for the audience what or how you consider effective onboarding to be. So what does it entail? Could you describe perhaps what constitutes effective onboarding for team members from your perspective?

Wenceslyne (04:37.675)

Sure, loaded question already. Right, let's get on it. I would say, an effective onboarding, the way that I would define it is that it's a process, right, of integrating new employees or new team members to become empowered and effective contributors to the organization's success. Now, I know that that's a loaded answer as well.

But in terms of elements of what an effective onboarding for me entails is that, you know, it needs to have a very good structure as well as a mechanism to get from point A to point B. And so when I think about effective onboarding, I think about the different stages. And for me, there's four main stages of onboarding. It actually starts from recruitment. And I see it as a pre -boarding stage.

whereby you show your culture, you align them with your ethos, and you kind of like introduce what's really important to you or to the organization as a whole. And I think of it as every interaction matters. So the moment that you do interact with potential candidates, for me, onboarding starts there, really. And then of course we have the...

Adam (05:54.867)

Mm -hmm.

Wenceslyne (05:57.098)

The more transactional piece of that in terms of orientation and initial training, ensuring that you have a really good plan on how to go about doing that. And then it continues on to integrating them into the business, making sure that they are aligned with the company's goals, the expectations, and of course, ensuring that they're also supported by their team members.

and that they feel that they belong in the business. And then finally is the continuous development part. So for me, onboarding isn't just one stage of the employee journey. I think it's part of a much larger and holistic approach to treating employees in the right way.

Adam (06:49.939)

Wow, that's a great answer and lots there to dive into. I guess to start with, on the recruitment side of things, could you talk a little bit about how onboarding starts at that stage? Typically, how would you ensure the smoothest recruitment process so that someone comes along on day one and they're fully sort of up to speed with where they should be?

Wenceslyne (06:51.625)

...

Wenceslyne (07:17.129)

as I have, I have quite a novel approach to it. I think sometimes I overthink things, but I feel that, things do connect later on. But when I think of recruitment, so part of the first thing about recruitment is attracting talent, right? and when we think about, integrating employees into the company sort of culture and making sure that they understand what the values and ethos are,

As I said earlier, as I mentioned, it starts from the word go. So when we attract candidates, we make sure that we're very honest in terms of what it is that we're looking for. And we have an initial sort of conversation where we get to know what their motivations are and we get to know them as a person, not just a candidate for a particular role. And so that's kind of like the way that I approach

approach recruitment and then of course as we go along and you know if they are the right or at least have the right skill set to be successful in a particular role for example. Part of the whole experience with us is that I provide an opportunity for them to also be coached or mentored in terms of ensuring that they can. So let me just maybe back up a little bit.

When we say outsourcing, I'm specifically working with Filipino talent. So I guess when we think about recruitment, it's just important for me to provide a little bit of context that when we think about those candidates being in the Philippines, sometimes a lot of them are quite shy to begin with. And they're not very confident at times and things like that. And they also have a different approach when they're being interviewed in the Philippines. I want to make sure that...

Adam (09:02.707)

Mm -hmm.

Wenceslyne (09:10.855)

They have the best experience and the best chance as well when they're interviewing for a UK business, for example, and make sure that they can articulate their strengths and make sure that they do prepare well as well for the interview. So that's also part of that. Interestingly, Google actually gave me that idea because that's exactly what I experienced, you know, and I was just floored when I, you know, when I was going through this like really rigorous recruitment process.

Whilst it was long, I really thoroughly enjoyed it. And that really set the scene for me. And from that experience, I thought, you know what, that's fantastic. That's great. You know, that's really how you feel. Wow, like this company is amazing. They care about the people. And I do want to have that same response and that same, you know, invitation to candidates for ALS.

Adam (10:04.915)

Excellent. Okay, very interesting and you mentioned Google there and I'd be interested to hear and obviously now you've gone from one end of the spectrum to the other in terms of a huge multinational to a startup. How are you able to integrate those same approaches when you're hiring for a startup, when you're hiring for much smaller businesses? And the audience for this podcast is typically small business owners. So it'd be interesting to hear how you've managed that transition.

Wenceslyne (10:35.142)

Great question. I think because of my varied roles, I've actually worked with several startups and I've also been part of building new practices in an incubated manner. So, you know, like I understand that there are different requirements and different ways of managing small businesses as opposed to bigger ones. That being said, what's not different is how you recruit for the right candidates.

for the business. In terms of differences, I think it's more on the practical side of things. MNCs or multinational corporations have more funding and have better ability to actually get candidates and small businesses sometimes can't really compete. Not sometimes, but it's challenging to compete depending on what they're looking for and supply and demand, right?

the bigger ones always win in that race sometimes. But we're trying to change that and we're trying to then say, you know what, it's not just the money, but the whole experience matters.

Adam (11:45.683)

Yeah, of course. And I guess you can still have a well -structured onboarding process, you know, which sets the tone for the employee, regardless of the size, right? So you can still adapt, you know, those multinational processes to a smaller business, but, you know, tweak it and make it sort of right for that element and that funding that that business has, right?

Wenceslyne (12:09.893)

Absolutely. So the beauty of having a framework is that it's not a strict methodology. It's not saying that you must do step one, two, three, four, five, six, but a framework is then able to tailor as to how the business works and you figure out the best way of onboarding them. That being said, there's obviously the stages are set. It's just the way that you execute.

Adam (12:17.491)

show.

Wenceslyne (12:37.06)

And some of those things will be tailored and customized to the client. Yes.

Adam (12:42.675)

Okay great and would you say are there any anecdotes or you know stories that you can tell around the sort of correlation between a positive onboarding experience and increased job satisfaction or perhaps the other way around a negative onboarding experience and a negative job satisfaction are there any correlation between job satisfaction and onboarding in your experience?

Wenceslyne (13:10.424)

Yes, absolutely. I think there's two ways of answering that. Maybe not all of it will be anecdotes, but when we think about studies, and there are many, many of them, there's actually a particularly good one. I've reread Gallup's article, and they published this in 2019. Specifically, it's...

The article is about having a perspective on creating an exceptional onboarding experience to new employees. And one of the things that is super interesting on this article is that one of it said, employees strongly agree that their onboarding process was exceptional. It's nearly either two and a half or three times. I can't remember specifically more, but it's to say that they have the best possible job.

Adam (14:07.347)

Mm -hmm.

Wenceslyne (14:07.651)

And as we all know, you know, happy people and engaged people will perform better. Right. And I think, you know, just from those studies and things like that, it is super important. There's also another book actually that just came to mind. It's called Happy Manifest. So have you heard of it?

Adam (14:23.315)

I have not, no.

Wenceslyne (14:24.548)

Okay, it was written a long time ago by this, by this, Chad called Henry Stuart and he's fairly well known here in the UK. He's actually from London. it's quite a small book. I found this today actually, because I was thinking, you know, when I became the, you know, when I first did, had my first management role, this was one of the books, that was, was given to me as a very short read. and when you look at the, the core principles, it's really about,

engaging with the people from like, you know, trusting them, making them feel good, you know, celebrating mistakes and all the good stuff, right, that you keep hearing on and on about. But actually, the book is there. It's all good things. And I guess, just going back to your question, which was,

Adam (15:14.099)

the correlation between positive and negative onboarding and positive negative experience of the job. Yes.

Wenceslyne (15:16.771)

Yes. So there's so many like thoughts that's coming through my mind as to like why, you know, what the correlation is. And now, you know, now that we're back in the question, I'm just thinking of like an anecdote. yes. You know what? Here's a couple. I don't know if it's, if you can tie it to onboarding, but I think you can because it was part of the whole process. So at FedEx.

logistics firms. I don't know if, you know, if everybody knows who FedEx is, I hope so. But I've worked with them for seven years and they are a delivery company, essentially, or a courier company, and one of the best companies I've ever worked for. Otherwise, I wouldn't have been there for seven years. Now, when I think about onboarding with them, I was this 19 year old, very sort of naive and very new into my career path. And one of the things that really

you know, made an impression on me is having that opportunity to speak with our, you know, with our top boss of the business and actually having a conversation with me and also knowing my name in full and knowing what was my experience before that, what high school I went to. And so this person actually took the time to get to know who I was and have a conversation. And that was part of our first week.

of onboarding at FedEx. And I thought, how great is that? Somebody who's actually already invested in you as a person, thinking that we want you here, we value your presence, and that just sets the tone for the experience long after that. Sorry.

Adam (17:04.147)

That's very impressive, as you say. Having that experience in your first few days with someone of such a senior level in such a large company, it really makes you feel special, feel wanted, feel like you're part of a, not a family, but part of a team that wants you there and that you can sort of contribute to, right?

Wenceslyne (17:23.969)

Exactly. And I think there's like, I think many of us will have those snippets, but we probably wouldn't even connect it to an onboarding program because if I think about it, I've not really heard the word onboarding much until the last, you know, five years when my first role as an onboarding manager actually came about, which was I think seven years ago with Rack's Race, but yeah.

Adam (17:34.867)

show.

Adam (17:54.003)

And I think it's something that I definitely noticed earlier on in my career was the amount of times we'd have people in our teams who were not, you know, you'd hire them, they'd come on board day one, there wouldn't be anything around, you know, bringing them into the team, training them, anything formal, it would be very much done on a, on an individual manager basis. And so if you were lucky enough to have a manager who cared and

considered these things, then you'd have a great experience. But on the flip side, there was nothing, you know, and these were in reasonably large companies. So, you know, particularly where you're talking about smaller startups and scale ups where, you know, this is something that's not a science that's been around for an incredibly long time. It was very hit and miss, right?

Wenceslyne (18:40.448)

I would say so. I think not having a full onboarding program sometimes is okay. It depends on how small the company is because sometimes all you need is a buddy system. So if we're talking about a small business that's maybe 10 people or less, that's absolutely possible. But at the same time, you should have at least a plan as to how to go about doing things and ensuring that you also manage.

the new highest expectations, because it's a two -way street, right? In order for them to ramp up, in order for them to feel confident and contribute, they first need to know what it is that you want from them. How are they going to do it? When should they do it? Does it align with the company's goals? How best to contribute? Do they have the support system that will make it possible for them to add more value?

Adam (19:09.683)

Yeah.

Adam (19:18.931)

Mm -hmm.

Adam (19:36.595)

Yeah, absolutely. As you say, it has to be flexible for the size of company. And as long as it's been considered, right, as long as it's been thought about strategically from whatever company size, you're not going to go too far wrong. But it's not having that thought process in place.

Wenceslyne (19:51.615)

Exactly. And you know what, there, I can't remember. I'll send there some resources later, but here's some, you know, like really interesting data points, right? Having a great onboarding program increases staff retention by 82%. I think I got this from FHCB actually. What a large number that is, right? And then, so when you then reflect on the many teams or businesses that you've been employed in, how many of them did, you know, actually had,

Adam (20:06.323)

Wow.

Adam (20:10.643)

Yeah, 100%. Yeah.

Wenceslyne (20:21.695)

an onboarding program whereby once you've finished it, sometimes it's a week, sometimes it's a month or whatever it is, whereby you should have this feeling of, wow, okay, now what's next? Now, you know, it's great. I can do this. I can go on and then you have this, this, you know, this feeling of I'm definitely, you know, feeling supported. I know exactly what's, you know, what's being asked of me and I look forward to contributing.

So it's that feeling, right, that you want to get after an onboarding thing. How many of those could you honestly say you had that feeling after an onboarding stage?

Adam (20:57.459)

Absolutely. That's an amazing statistic. And yeah, we'll put some links in the show notes for any resources that like that one that really stand out. And I think if you think about it from the company point of view as well, the amount of money that companies spend on recruitment, whether that be through recruit, headhunters, recruitment consultants, time of management to interview and to not have that onboarding process in place, it just feels like a real missed opportunity, right?

Wenceslyne (21:26.014)

Absolutely. I think there's another statistic from the same data points from FSB. And, no, I think this was this, this one is from Gallup and it stated that it takes about 12 months for a new hire to completely ramp up. So imagine how much you're then paying on a monthly basis. And if you actually are not, so there's a huge, huge opportunity here, you know, for businesses to,

Adam (21:43.635)

Hmm.

Adam (21:47.699)

Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Wenceslyne (21:56.19)

for businesses to ensure that they're being effective and efficient when onboarding a new hire. Because your time to ramp really means that you can be a lot more productive very, very quickly and you get your return on investment much faster.

Adam (22:15.027)

Now you're talking my language, you see. This is the Fractional CFO show. When you're talking return on investment, you've got me, you've got me. I know you've obviously got a lot of experience onboarding remote and offshore colleagues. And this is obviously very relevant to the world we now live in post pandemic where everyone's working remotely a lot more. So what are some of those unique challenges that you find?

Wenceslyne (22:17.057)

There you go.

Adam (22:40.979)

and I guess opportunities when you're onboarding offshore and remote team members.

Wenceslyne (22:48.029)

That's a great question. I'm probably going to start by saying there's a little bit of a negative feeling sometimes or connotation with offshoring or outsourcing in particular. But I think the tide is changing quite a bit because we're now in a space where technology is at the forefront.

everybody needs to be efficient and effective in the way that they do things and they need to streamline processes in order for, you know, for business to become more productive and to get the most out of their current investments. Right. And, and when we also think about larger corporations and larger businesses, they're the first one to actually leverage that and then have economies of scale.

which means that not only are they competing from a technological point of view, but they're also competing in terms of having, you know, the least or at least, you know, they have the best way of managing their operational expenses. Now what happens with small businesses? And I wanted to put that context or that point across first, because I think, you know, right now we need to think about business as a whole, right? It just doesn't mean.

staffing or resource or anything like that, but you need to think about the longevity of the business and whether or not the business has the right strategy to ensure that they remain competitive and to have longevity. And when you think of it that way, then in terms of offshore resources, that then becomes a lot more attractive. And it becomes even more attractive when we say like that doesn't need to be permanent.

It just means that that could be part of your current strategy. And the thing about saying current strategy is that everything moves so quickly. It's moving so quickly, quicker than it ever was, especially with the advent of AI or commercialism of, you know, gen AI and such, right? So we have to be a little bit more open to the idea that, okay, in order for us to compete, let's try different solutions and let's figure out a way of leveraging, you know, the global talent that we have. And I think.

Wenceslyne (25:04.091)

One of the things that gets forgotten is that when a business then becomes more profitable and they have more revenue, then they have more opportunity to hire locally. So, yeah.

Adam (25:14.899)

Yeah, no, that's a great point. And as you say, the profitability will drive the hiring, but often what you can...

lose sight of, particularly if you're driving profitability more quickly and you're ramping up more quickly, is those the techniques, the tactics, the strategies that ensure that those hires are properly looked after, are properly on boarded, are properly trained and mentored. You touched on mentoring before. How do you sort of ensure, you know, post that actual recruitment and initial stage, how do you ensure that that mentoring works if it's done fully remotely? You know, because I've not

seen that so much. I've seen mentoring done, you know, on a hybrid basis, but when it's fully remote, how do you make sure that that works effectively?

Wenceslyne (26:02.394)

Well, let's think during, and I know we want to forget this, you know, part of, you know, part of our lives, right? But COVID happened. And yeah, need I say more? So you can't say that mentorship had stopped or coaching or improvement or, you know, making things efficient. And in fact, we really challenged ourselves to think outside the box. So what does that mean? Right.

Adam (26:14.579)

It's difficult to forget it. Yeah, yeah.

Adam (26:21.843)

Yeah.

Wenceslyne (26:32.442)

And I think for me, it's all very much, it's all very, very similar. It's just the way that, you know, your mindset needs to approach it. So when we have offshore remote team members, well, number one, I have a little, I'm a bit biased because I am Filipino, right? I know how, you know, I know the culture and things like that. So it's easier for me to actually relate to them. That being said,

I'm a conduit to my clients as well because I do workshops as well to kind of, especially if they haven't done any or they've not worked with remote staff before. So I do a little presentation around it as to how communication can be more effective with respect to their culture and their experience and so on. And so at least with my staff, open dialogue.

Adam (27:05.203)

Mm -hmm.

Adam (27:16.819)

Cut it.

Wenceslyne (27:26.681)

and communication is super, super important and very consistent in that regard. And I take the time to really do one and once making sure that we're still aligned, they're happy with things. I also challenge them to fail. I know that sounds interesting. Right, so when we define failure, it's really just making minor mistakes, right? So we're not talking about,

Adam (27:43.859)

What does that mean? How do you define failure? How do you do that?

Wenceslyne (27:54.873)

repetitive issues or challenges that become a pattern. So that's a bit more toxic and that's not what we want. What we want are a team that challenges the status quo, who's not afraid to actually do something different because they think it could be better. So when you're doing it for the right reasons and when we say failure, sometimes it's not the most effective, but it's great that you're trying. And so I have a very...

Adam (28:07.699)

Mm -hmm.

Adam (28:19.859)

Got it. And it said to your point, it's about communication, right? And how you communicate back to them following that failure, right?

Wenceslyne (28:24.537)

You

Wenceslyne (28:28.089)

Exactly. And I get excited actually when somebody says, I've got an oopsie. We call it an oopsie. Every now and again, we reflect on our week or a month or a quarter and we think about, okay, what are the wins? What were our oopsies? Were the quotations there? What did we learn from each other? And so on. And part of mentorship is creating a safe space for the team.

for them to feel confident that, you know what, I can actually think about things. My thoughts, my ideas are valued. And that's a great way of becoming a really, really good leader or manager. And I ask this of everybody. I want them to challenge each other as well and challenge the way that we do things because we have to follow our own ethos. Right?

if we're providing exceptional service to our clients, then we must do that for ourselves as well, which means that how do we make things better for us? Yeah. Thanks.

Adam (29:27.955)

Absolutely.

Adam (29:32.243)

That's great. I like that. I like that. How do we make things better for us? And how do you sort of changing tack slightly? You know, obviously this is a financial podcast and we're sort of I'm often interested in how you integrate finance into what you do on a day to day basis. So how do you involve your mentees, your team in the finances of the business? How much visibility do you give them? How do you how do you ensure that they're aware of the

finances and how much or how little transparency.

Wenceslyne (30:06.103)

Yeah, great question. I think because I am a new business and I'm a micro business really, like there's less than 10 of us at the moment. For me, it's super important that I'm very transparent as to how the business is doing. So they have full visibility as to what's going on. Obviously, maybe not to the dollar or not to the pound, right? But we're talking percentages here and things like that.

Adam (30:28.435)

Okay.

Adam (30:32.339)

Yeah.

Wenceslyne (30:32.471)

sort of we have a mechanism where they can look at or where they can see how we're performing from an alignment perspective. So we have four costs in terms of, you know, what do we want to be? What does a bonus scheme looks like by the end of this year? Are we far from it or are we, you know, like are we exceeding expectations and things like that, right? I mean, yes.

Adam (30:46.259)

Okay.

Adam (30:54.483)

And just on that, is that done on a top line basis? So you'll do a forecast, top line revenue forecast and a bonus link to that? Or do you go into profitability at all?

Wenceslyne (31:06.966)

So we were more focused on the profitability aspect of it because we are still a small company with, you know, like with, you know, a small number of clients. It's unnecessary to, you know, to, to deep dive too much in the numbers. There's not much. So wherever, you know, we're really looking at, yeah, we're looking at bottom line. And I think what it is, is that I use.

Adam (31:11.251)

Okay.

Adam (31:20.755)

Mmm.

Adam (31:27.123)

Yeah, growing all the time I'm sure, but yes.

Wenceslyne (31:34.806)

that conversation to inspire them, that whatever they're doing means that it's an opportunity for their clients to succeed in their own strategy. What's great is that since we've started what, nine months or 10 months ago, so it's not even been a year, right? We're growing with our clients. And that's amazing. That's a great use case. And I know I haven't published yet, but you know, like,

Adam (31:59.251)

Great, that's amazing.

Wenceslyne (32:04.758)

These things take time, but we have a good trajectory, certainly with our clients, and we feel validated because of that as well.

Adam (32:13.907)

Perfect. And do you have any, are there any KPIs or metrics that you share with the team on a monthly basis or a weekly basis or is it less formal than that?

Wenceslyne (32:25.078)

The metrics, yes, we do have metrics, but it's more about customer satisfaction and employee satisfaction. So at a minimum, that's what we're focused on because it's really important for us to instill that ethos. It's basically driving how they're performing with their clients, how they're helping them grow in their own way.

Adam (32:31.571)

Okay, great.

Wenceslyne (32:53.878)

And also how happy are they with elite level services? Do we provide enough growth and development and such? And that forms part of the temperature check that we do on, we have a quarterly one and a yearly check in as well.

Adam (33:10.611)

Okay, perfect. That's great. I guess that takes me back slightly to the origins of our conversation and just about how important you feel when it comes to onboarding and mentoring and ensuring team spirit and everyone working in the same direction. If you look at sort of those team building activities and social activities versus...

Wenceslyne (33:17.333)

Hehehe

Adam (33:34.483)

that transparency around the finances and around the growth? I think I know what your answer is going to be, but which is more important? Is it a case of having the two working in tandem or do you prioritise one or the other?

Wenceslyne (33:49.493)

well, they're both a priority. I think you can't do and not the other. Otherwise, our growth trajectory is going to slow down massively because then, you know, there's going to be things that will fall off, you know, like fall off piste, let's just say. But just to reiterate, you know, onboarding really sets the stage for engagement, performance and development. Right. And when you do this right,

Adam (33:52.435)

Mm.

Adam (34:00.051)

Yeah.

Wenceslyne (34:17.268)

you'll have higher job satisfaction and organizational commitment, which means that they will perform better. There will be lower turnover and less stress. We didn't even touch on the stress part of things, right? But there's less stress. And so, you know, and then on the flip side of that, if you have poor experience, that means, you know, lacking structure, you've got no plans, you got poor communication and neglecting company culture and values, you're going to leave within the first six months.

Adam (34:48.307)

Yeah, that's a great point.

Wenceslyne (34:48.756)

So how much is that, right? What does that mean from a financial point of view? All of that effort, all of those recruitment processes, all of these money that you've invested gone within six months.

Adam (35:04.243)

Absolutely. And often you'll have, if you've worked with a recruiter, you'll have a sort of a period of time over which you get their support post someone leaving. But, you know, if it's after six months, you've missed that opportunity as well. So there's the hard cost as well as the soft cost of having to refill that role. And you mentioned company culture and values. And obviously that, again, is something that startups and scale ups are not so not always so good at.

defining and living by because of all the other plates that they've got to spin. So again, in your experience, how important is that to really nail that down and then communicate that to the staff when they're coming on board?

Wenceslyne (35:46.611)

super important. Do you want to know what our values are? It's on LinkedIn. But no, like, it's the first value that we have, there's people first. Right? So, absolutely. It's super important that people first exceptional service, honesty and integrity. Those are our values. and so we'll live and breathe those values. If there was, you know, if there was an instance where we don't put people first, then

Adam (35:47.987)

Hmm. Please.

Wenceslyne (36:15.827)

I feel, I would personally feel that I've failed.

Adam (36:20.947)

That's brilliant.

Wenceslyne (36:21.331)

This is why we're doing what we're doing, exactly.

Adam (36:24.435)

I love it. I love it. That feels like a very good point to wrap up, actually. So I'll I will I will change gears to that to sort of the last part of our of our of our of our podcast, which we call the business book bonus section. And I think you've already mentioned it. But this is where we ask our guests to provide us with a recommendation for the audience of a business book or any business content that's helped you during your business career.

Wenceslyne (36:28.359)

You

Adam (36:49.779)

and you'd like to recommend. So Wenceslyne, what would you like to recommend for the audience?

Wenceslyne (36:55.411)

I would recommend, well, look, I'm an idealist. So I love the happy manifesto because it makes me happy. That's the whole point of it. Love that. You might also notice from Arlington that we were inspired by, or, you know, like we're inspired by this quote and it's from Tim Ferriss, who is well known for the four hour work week. But the quote is focused on being productive instead of being busy. I don't know if he's written any book, but.

you know, I just wanted to mention it because I think, you know, the way that he was just thinking about it outside of the box and, you know, thinking about how to optimize his own time, to carve more room for, you know, things that he also values, thinking about our unique selves, right? And, you know, having this rebalance to, you know, that he's achieved for himself is, for me, I think it's super inspirational. And then I do follow Steve Bartlett, I think.

Some have got a love hate relationship with them, but I quite like, you know, a lot of this learnings. There's a chap called Scott Chisholm as well, actually. I've just found him on LinkedIn. He's, he's, he seems like a serial entrepreneur, but I'm just, I'm just really, you know, happy to see a lot of this in a posts because the marketing side of things, whoever is social media manager, I think they should get a raise, but.

You know, like I can only, I can only have sort of content like in, you know, in small doses. And I just love the way that, you know, that, that, that is doing that. But, I think those are the things, but also there's one last one is Start With A Why by a Simon Sinek. so yeah, I think,

Adam (38:30.583)

Okay. Yes, yes, I know that one. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Those are great. Those are great. So we've got we've got some good ones there. I'll put some links in the show notes to all of those. I think some really valuable ones. I love Steve Bartlett. I know as you say, love hate in some some occasions. And also Tim Ferriss. I haven't heard his name in a long time. So that's that's great to hear hear of him. And I guess before we wrap up, is there anything that we haven't covered that you'd like to say? Or where can people find you if if not?

Wenceslyne (39:00.496)

You can find me on LinkedIn. I am the only Wenceslyne. You can call me Wens or Lyne as you wish.

Adam (39:06.579)

Very good, very good. That's the benefit and beauty of having a unique name. That's excellent, excellent. Well, thank you so much, Wenceslaam, for joining me today. I really appreciate your insight, your perspective and your time. Thank you.

Wenceslyne (39:08.248)

You

Wenceslyne (39:18.544)

Thanks, Adam. Hope that helped. Have a great day.